EVE Search - And there go the Carriers....

All Channels

Ships and Modules

And there go the Carriers....

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page]
Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Ilya Murametz Caldari Cruororis Consors Conlegium Ivy League	Posted - 2007.10.21 18:41:00 - [1] http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=618303 Posting a link here just incase some eve'er don't check test server forum... and I think as many people as possible have to see this... "idea" lol
Ishmael Hansen No Quarter. Vae Victis.	Posted - 2007.10.21 18:46:00 - [2] Go complain to the noobs that camp low sec in carriers, mom's and titans, cos killing cruisers and stuff with 3 capitals must surely be fun.
Ilya Murametz Caldari Cruororis Consors Conlegium Ivy League	Posted - 2007.10.21 18:50:00 - [3] Originally by: Ishmael Hansen Go complain to the noobs that camp low sec in carriers, mom's and titans, cos killing cruisers and stuff with 3 capitals must surely be fun. What in the holly mother of eve does that have to do with this .....lol bitter much? P.S. my personal opinion, capital ship low sec camping, specially in clocked moms = the ghey, but this has nothing to do with this, a mom or carrier can still do that after this nerf, say hello to smartbombs.
Locke Ateid Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2007.10.21 18:50:00 - [4] Originally by: Ilya Murametz Linked Posting a link here just incase some eve'er don't check test server forum... and I think as many people as possible have to see this... "idea" lol Link-ified
Ilya Murametz Caldari Cruororis Consors Conlegium Ivy League	Posted - 2007.10.21 18:55:00 - [5] Originally by: Locke Ateid Originally by: Ilya Murametz Linked Posting a link here just incase some eve'er don't check test server forum... and I think as many people as possible have to see this... "idea" lol Link-ified You the greatest Guess i should of done the same But its 2pm, i just woke up and my head really hurts for some reason
Locke Ateid Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2007.10.21 19:05:00 - [6] Originally by: Ilya Murametz Originally by: Locke Ateid Originally by: Ilya Murametz Linked Posting a link here just incase some eve'er don't check test server forum... and I think as many people as possible have to see this... "idea" lol Link-ified You the greatest Guess i should of done the same Fear not fleshy mortal, you are bound to make mistakes, you are only human after all. Originally by: Ilya Murametz But its 2pm, i just woke up and my head really hurts for some reason You appear to be malfunctioning, carbon life-form. Please be advised to visit your nearest homosapien mechanic.
Mr Friendly That it Should Come to This Derek Knows Us	Posted - 2007.10.21 20:51:00 - [7] Originally by: Ishmael Hansen Go complain to the noobs that camp low sec in carriers, mom's and titans, cos killing cruisers and stuff with 3 capitals must surely be fun. err, 'noobs' don't fly expensive ships that take a year or more to train for... begone troll anyways, the carrier blog is interesting to read... good thing I stopped training for carriers ;) __________________________________________________ FOLD. The Ultimate PVP. It really is Us vs. Them. clicky
Albatron St	Posted - 2007.10.21 20:52:00 - [8] omg .....thats it stop whit the nerfs fix the deam bugs and leave ships as they are ...M.....s if they do this im selling my carrier account and quting eve i had it whit freaking nerfs FIX THE BLOODY bugs - LAG and stop nerfing stuff looks like ccp realy wonts us to leave eve ...
Mr Friendly That it Should Come to This Derek Knows Us	Posted - 2007.10.21 21:02:00 - [9] Originally by: Albatron St omg .....thats it stop whit the nerfs fix the deam bugs and leave ships as they are ...M.....s if they do this im selling my carrier account and quting eve i had it whit freaking nerfs FIX THE BLOODY bugs - LAG and stop nerfing stuff looks like ccp realy wonts us to leave eve ... can I have your stuff? __________________________________________________ FOLD. The Ultimate PVP. It really is Us vs. Them. clicky
Pinky Denmark The Cursed Navy	Posted - 2007.10.21 21:06:00 - [10] Seems fair - bigger and more expensive should NOT mean better in all situations... Carriers are meant as support and not as gankmonsters... - I'm a nice guy!! MOA is NOT UGLY!!! It's A FREAK SHOW!!!!
The Fate Caldari Hammerfall Industries	Posted - 2007.10.21 21:08:00 - [11] Tell me how can they support if they are sensor damped/jammed????
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr Delictum 23216	Posted - 2007.10.21 21:23:00 - [12] Originally by: The Fate Tell me how can they support if they are sensor damped/jammed???? They have a sensor strength of 50+ (over twice the sensor strength of battleships) so they're very resistant to jamming. ...and Damps are supposedly getting nerfed. IMHO this is a good move as it will reduce the power of the capital blob and the people flying around solo in capitals. It won't in any way reduce the power of people using assigned fighters except that it might take a few more seconds to set it up. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Albatron St	Posted - 2007.10.21 21:24:00 - [13] can I have your stuff? what part off selling didnt you get ?
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr Delictum 23216	Posted - 2007.10.21 21:37:00 - [14] Edited by: Nomakai Delateriel on 21/10/2007 21:37:56 Originally by: Albatron St Quote: can I have your stuff? what part off selling didnt you get ? "Can I have your stuff" is the traditional response to people going "ZOMG u nerfed my [Insert item, class or character of your choice]. I'm quitting [insert MMO of your choice]!!!111" ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
DarkFollower Amarr Wreckless Abandon Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.10.21 21:38:00 - [15] Edited by: DarkFollower on 21/10/2007 21:39:58 Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel Originally by: The Fate Tell me how can they support if they are sensor damped/jammed???? They have a sensor strength of 50+ (over twice the sensor strength of battleships) so they're very resistant to jamming. ...and Damps are supposedly getting nerfed. IMHO this is a good move as it will reduce the power of the capital blob and the people flying around solo in capitals. It won't in any way reduce the power of people using assigned fighters except that it might take a few more seconds to set it up. Can u tell me where i can find these solo carriers motherships that u speak of? As it is now , a solo carrier/mom that goes solo will die horribly even to a small gang of 10 people , maybe more for a mom even if they have a high sensor strenght it dosent mean that they cant be jammed , and even with the damp nerf they will still be rendered ussels by 1 or 2 good arazu/lachesis If they would want to remove the capital blob then they should look at the way poses and soverinity works , removing the effects of a problem wont solve the problem as good as if removing the problem alltogether Cap recharges on PvP ships Suxxor monkey ballzorz!!
Albatron St	Posted - 2007.10.21 21:38:00 - [16] and this wont fix the lag from fighter/drones at all it will just make it easy to gank ^solo carriers^ that is to eaasy as it is
NoNah Unseen University	Posted - 2007.10.21 21:42:00 - [17] Indeed, it's good that they acknowledge the problem, but they're doing it all wrong. The problem with supercapitals is that they run vitually no risk in lowsec. Titans is not an issue as they can't do much damage unless they're fielding an obscene fitting - and more importantly, they're to expensive to generally be found on a lowsec gate, when a mothership does the job better. This won't put an end to lowsec camps. This won't even change lowsec camps. The number of carriers i've found solocamping a gate, and surviving, is... ignorable. Dreads are not affected by their solution, and are not very common either. Motherships will still have their power due to smartbombs, they will still be able to eat anything that passes through their gate. And if they were serious about catching everything, they had an intie or some other kind of tackler with a sensor resolution actually able to lock things. This leaves carriers, that never was that much of a problem in the first place, and when they were found solo, they were killed solo. They couldn't stay smartbombing a gate very well, simply because of that fact. They can be killed - in lowsec. So what does this change actually do? Well, it makes carrierpilot do some more micromanagement of their drones, when used right. And it makes them just a tad easier to take down, when they've made a mistake. Only reason I dislike the change is that I see it as pointless. It doesn't solve anything, and it gives drone users even more control issues with drones. It does help those who are organized i tiny tiny bit, then again, thats more or less just a way of forcing even more players to use third party software to compete in EVE... Postcount: 973446 [02:40:22] <elmickers> if you're caldari in a fleet fight, bring a corp
Albatron St	Posted - 2007.10.21 21:51:00 - [18] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel Edited by: Nomakai Delateriel on 21/10/2007 21:37:56 Originally by: Albatron St Quote: can I have your stuff? what part off selling didnt you get ? "Can I have your stuff" is the traditional response to people going "ZOMG u nerfed my [Insert item, class or character of your choice]. I'm quitting [insert MMO of your choice]!!!111" heh your funy, wish the world woud work like eve. I woud love to see your car get nerfed or something you like. Anyway its lame nerf not needed and it wont fix anything and you know it And if ccp wonts to keep all the alts in game they wil leave carriers as they are .... the carrier-pos nerf was needed this one isnt ....
Nomakai Delateriel Amarr Delictum 23216	Posted - 2007.10.21 21:58:00 - [19] Originally by: Albatron St heh your funy, wish the world woud work like eve. I woud love to see your car get nerfed or something you like. Anyway its lame nerf not needed and it wont fix anything and you know it And if ccp wonts to keep all the alts in game they wil leave carriers as they are .... the carrier-pos nerf was needed this one isnt .... In some ways real life does work like EVE, except that you can't switch characters and quitting is not a good idea. The thing is in real life, when the rules change, people adapt and overcome. "Oh sorry, regulation [insert arbitrary number here] changed and we can't run the logistical division like we used to? Oh **** lets just commit suicide instead of restructuring it" is not the way things work in real world business. ______________________________________________ -You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary.
Albatron St	Posted - 2007.10.21 22:22:00 - [20] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel Originally by: Albatron St heh your funy, wish the world woud work like eve. I woud love to see your car get nerfed or something you like. Anyway its lame nerf not needed and it wont fix anything and you know it And if ccp wonts to keep all the alts in game they wil leave carriers as they are .... the carrier-pos nerf was needed this one isnt .... In some ways real life does work like EVE, except that you can't switch characters and quitting is not a good idea. The thing is in real life, when the rules change, people adapt and overcome. "Oh sorry, regulation [insert arbitrary number here] changed and we can't run the logistical division like we used to? Oh **** lets just commit suicide instead of restructuring it" is not the way things work in real world business. anyway ill leave it at that, so we dont get off topic you can ignore me if you wont. im not paying you im paying ccp for now.. maybe eve woud have more players if they woudnt nerf stuff who knows, mayeb worth a try ? afer all you like money dont you ccp ?
Karyuudo Tydraad Caldari Whiskey Pete's Drycleaning Services	Posted - 2007.10.21 23:19:00 - [21] It's a good change. Carriers were never supposed to be the solopwnmobiles they became.
Ishmael Hansen No Quarter. Vae Victis.	Posted - 2007.10.21 23:20:00 - [22] Originally by: Mr Friendly Originally by: Ishmael Hansen Go complain to the noobs that camp low sec in carriers, mom's and titans, cos killing cruisers and stuff with 3 capitals must surely be fun. err, 'noobs' don't fly expensive ships that take a year or more to train for... begone troll anyways, the carrier blog is interesting to read... good thing I stopped training for carriers ;) Well some do tho I should have called them griefers and not noobs, I have never seen a low sec gatecamp with capitals, but I think it's kinda lame.
Shereza	Posted - 2007.10.22 00:40:00 - [23] Quote: err, 'noobs' don't fly expensive ships that take a year or more to train for... They do if they buy a bunch of GTCs and convert them into isk for a carrier and a carrier pilot. At any rate, I'm not a carrier pilot so this doesn't personally affect me. However, based on years of experience with pretty much similar mentalities and reactions towards similar game changes I can say this. #1 This stuff has happened in the past. #2 This stuff is happening right now. #3 It will happen happen again in the future. #4 Life will go on. #5 People will continue using whatever gets changed. #6 People will continue to whine about other things getting changed.
Surius	Posted - 2007.10.22 00:59:00 - [24] I personally hate this idea... It looks like yet another attempt to reduce lag due to "drone" overpopulation as well as a rather nasty nurf to solo carrier piolots. As one who was aiming at a carrier (alt account) and would have no problems aquireing the funds to fly one I will have to say I'd give up on this if the change goes through. However I have no idea what I'll do with the alt I had training for one...probably cancel the account. Too bad too, learning skills were done as well as quite a few prereq's...
Ceramik Black Avatar	Posted - 2007.10.22 01:05:00 - [25] This is how Star Wars Galaxies began to turn into a piece of crap. Everyone was complaining about the equivalent of the carrier/titan of the game(Jedi) being too powerful. The nerfbat started swinging and they didn't stop swinging it until they had killed the game. This is a slippery slope if CCP chooses to take it. This Space for Rent.
bldyannoyed Un4seen Development	Posted - 2007.10.22 01:13:00 - [26] Look at the numbers after this. On its own a carrier can out out a staggering 500 DPS using 5 max skilled fighters. Assuming its targetting a BS. Anything smaller and fighters wont track and it'll will have to use 5 heavies. For a massive 300 DPS. So basically what CCP plan to do is render these ships utterly defenseless. You will now ONLY be able to use them in blobs, because taking them into a fight where you have only a small supoprt gang will be suicidal. If the support ships die you may as well self destruct because you're probably not even going to be able to fight off a single HAC. ******* garbage.
KD.Fluffy The Avalon Foundation Knights Of Syndicate	Posted - 2007.10.22 01:21:00 - [27] yeah this nerf irratates me. I was gonna train for carriers, but I think im gonna go for a moros instead...... Boost The Eagle!
Tar Manis	Posted - 2007.10.22 01:31:00 - [28] Originally by: bldyannoyed Look at the numbers after this. On its own a carrier can out out a staggering 500 DPS using 5 max skilled fighters. Assuming its targetting a BS. Anything smaller and fighters wont track and it'll will have to use 5 heavies. For a massive 300 DPS. So basically what CCP plan to do is render these ships utterly defenseless. You will now ONLY be able to use them in blobs, because taking them into a fight where you have only a small supoprt gang will be suicidal. If the support ships die you may as well self destruct because you're probably not even going to be able to fight off a single HAC. ******* garbage. People won't even use them anymore because Dominixes do it better. 500dps can easily be achieved.
J Valkor Blackguard Brigade	Posted - 2007.10.22 01:37:00 - [29] Edited by: J Valkor on 22/10/2007 01:38:50 Originally by: Tar Manis Originally by: bldyannoyed Look at the numbers after this. On its own a carrier can out out a staggering 500 DPS using 5 max skilled fighters. Assuming its targetting a BS. Anything smaller and fighters wont track and it'll will have to use 5 heavies. For a massive 300 DPS. So basically what CCP plan to do is render these ships utterly defenseless. You will now ONLY be able to use them in blobs, because taking them into a fight where you have only a small supoprt gang will be suicidal. If the support ships die you may as well self destruct because you're probably not even going to be able to fight off a single HAC. ******* garbage. People won't even use them anymore because Dominixes do it better. 500dps can easily be achieved. Unless you are flying with a gang, in which case the carrier becomes instantly better. Which I think was the point of the 'fix'. The bigger concern I would have is just managing assigning fighters in large engagements. I would not have much problem with this change, but the idea of defenders have it all pre-assigned and the attacking fleet needing to manage it... it does not sound like a good idea unless they make other fixes first. There should not be solo-carrier pilots. Period. I am not sure how they exist now, given that a solo carrier is essentially free candy to the first good pvp corp that finds.
bldyannoyed Un4seen Development	Posted - 2007.10.22 01:43:00 - [30] Originally by: J Valkor Edited by: J Valkor on 22/10/2007 01:38:50 Originally by: Tar Manis Originally by: bldyannoyed Look at the numbers after this. On its own a carrier can out out a staggering 500 DPS using 5 max skilled fighters. Assuming its targetting a BS. Anything smaller and fighters wont track and it'll will have to use 5 heavies. For a massive 300 DPS. So basically what CCP plan to do is render these ships utterly defenseless. You will now ONLY be able to use them in blobs, because taking them into a fight where you have only a small supoprt gang will be suicidal. If the support ships die you may as well self destruct because you're probably not even going to be able to fight off a single HAC. ******* garbage. People won't even use them anymore because Dominixes do it better. 500dps can easily be achieved. Unless you are flying with a gang, in which case the carrier becomes instantly better. Which I think was the point of the 'fix'. The bigger concern I would have is just managing assigning fighters in large engagements. I would not have much problem with this change, but the idea of defenders have it all pre-assigned and the attacking fleet needing to manage it... it does not sound like a good idea unless they make other fixes first. There should not be solo-carrier pilots. Period. I am not sure how they exist now, given that a solo carrier is essentially free candy to the first good pvp corp that finds. As the game stands now in a small gang a carrier can be used as an offensive frontline weapon. With skills and a drone control mod you can run 10 drones, for a respectable 600 DPS with heavys, 750- 1000 with fighters. That leaves top slots free for a couple of remote arrays, and possibly a neut or 2. Now bear in mind that even pushing 1000 dps,.which, incidentally, requires a thanatos with carrier 5 and fighters 5, you still arent out dpsing a well setup BS. You can at least defend yourself while giving aid to your gang mates. Take away that self defense ability and you'd be mad to do anything other than fit as mony drone control units as you have skill for and remotely assign as many fighters as possible while hiding somehwere safe. I can see that enriching everyones gaming experience.
Mourn Navarre	Posted - 2007.10.22 01:55:00 - [31] Originally by: The Fate Tell me how can they support if they are sensor damped/jammed???? Tell me how that stops you from assigning fighters
Ilya Murametz Caldari Cruororis Consors Conlegium Ivy League	Posted - 2007.10.22 02:03:00 - [32] You know, i've been thinking about this while siting here and crying .... You know, this would be ok if the carriers were actually a good support logistic ships, but lets be real, one of the main roles of it is to support your fleet in combat by shield/armor/cap boosting it. But in reality that can rarely happen (unless you doing it to another capital ship) It takes how long to target your gang mate???? and then can you even target your gang mate while you being dampened by a 1 mill frig....? Well there goes the "we want carriers to be in their support role" argument....
Ilya Murametz Caldari Cruororis Consors Conlegium Ivy League	Posted - 2007.10.22 02:04:00 - [33] Originally by: Mourn Navarre Originally by: The Fate Tell me how can they support if they are sensor damped/jammed???? Tell me how that stops you from assigning fighters Tell me how assigning fighters is relevant to fixing to the current problem, and please don't use Dev Blog for response, cause that Dev already done failed at that once.
Mourn Navarre Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.10.22 02:15:00 - [34] Originally by: Ilya Murametz Originally by: Mourn Navarre Originally by: The Fate Tell me how can they support if they are sensor damped/jammed???? Tell me how that stops you from assigning fighters Tell me how assigning fighters is relevant to fixing to the current problem, and please don't use Dev Blog for response, cause that Dev already done failed at that once. Answer my question first and I'll answer yours.
Elaina Marie	Posted - 2007.10.22 02:29:00 - [35] Originally by: Ilya Murametz Edited by: Ilya Murametz on 22/10/2007 02:08:28 You know, i've been thinking about this while siting here and crying .... You know, this would be ok if the carriers were actually a good support logistic ships, but lets be real, one of the main roles of it is to support your fleet in combat by shield/armor/cap boosting it. But in reality that can rarely happen (unless you doing it to another capital ship) It takes how long to target your gang mate???? and then can you even target your gang mate while you being dampened by a 1 mill frig....? and if you do manage to target your gang made..he/she probably dead by then. Well there goes the "we want carriers to be in their support role" argument.... If you deploy a carrier without proper support to deal with that "1 mill frig" the carrier deserves to die. If you "need" to have all of your fighters assigned to you, where the hell is your support? You are most likely already dead. I support this change to carriers. All too often when small to medium gangs engage each other, one side drops a carrier in an effort to win the battle, instead of trying to use tactics to defeat the other gang. It seems to me that people whining about the new changes to carriers are just whining because they stand to loose their "I Win" button.
Eclip SUBLIME L.L.C. SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.22 02:50:00 - [36] Carriers have never been an i win button. They have horrific lock times and well really for a ship that costs that much are easy to disable. Jamming and damping are stragetic ways of removing the carrier from the fight which is valid. To be effective logistically in the current way it stands u bascially need to devote almost all of ur slots to cap to feed the reppers which seriously diminishes ur tank and makes the carrier tank like a BS :S Seriously i have used carriers in their support role in adn out of triage and have seen them used very effectivly but currently triage mode (the be all and end all of frint line logistics) needs a cap reduction on remote reppers coz u cap urself out in 10-20 reps which takes a whole minute to cap urself out if ur not watching. Also u wouldnt go into triage if u didnt know it was a close fight in which case ur support dies if u were always going to die and u get to sit there and wait till u die while all ur support is dead. ie u cant rep and a heavy neut will stop ur recharge enough. Cap reduction to capital reppers will solve everything yes we have remote cap transfer but u need 2 carriers for a start. and they dont work on a triaged carrier. if not a capreduction on the carrier skill itself then for the triage module like as in a 50% reduction or soemthing it fires twice as fast in triage module so u use twice as much cap. if they fix this or hell even make the skill the logistical reconfig chage that to a cap reduction on remote reppers and give the triage mod a standard stont usage like 10 per cycle or hell even 200 per cycle, they have ample room to store the stuff. The fact that u need too much cap for cap remote reppers forces ppl to concentrate on the the offensive of their carriers and with the curretn way logistics for carries is atm i dont blame them. its so much easier to pump out a few more fighters and protect urself from drone swarm with smart bombs. If they fix the cap usage then hell i would love to run a defensive setup again there is nothing like watching a fleet try and try to kill ur ships only to watch them in structure and be full to health again amost instantly. -------------------------------------------------- It is not what u are underneath, but what you do that defines you
Solant Minmatar Ventis Secundis R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.10.22 02:57:00 - [37] Originally by: Mr Friendly Originally by: Ishmael Hansen Go complain to the noobs that camp low sec in carriers, mom's and titans, cos killing cruisers and stuff with 3 capitals must surely be fun. err, 'noobs' don't fly expensive ships that take a year or more to train for... begone troll anyways, the carrier blog is interesting to read... good thing I stopped training for carriers ;) Yeah they do. Its called 'buy a character and carrier with GTC's (ie money) and have fun in your new carrier'. Its becoming an increasingly common trend.
Captain Schmungles Caldari Freelancing Corp Confederation of Independent Corporations	Posted - 2007.10.22 03:17:00 - [38] Go get your free noobships now, 'cause soon a 10 man noobship gang with damps and a warp scrambler will be able to take down a cap ship. Hooray?
Albatron St	Posted - 2007.10.22 09:20:00 - [39] Originally by: Elaina Marie Originally by: Ilya Murametz Edited by: Ilya Murametz on 22/10/2007 02:08:28 You know, i've been thinking about this while siting here and crying .... You know, this would be ok if the carriers were actually a good support logistic ships, but lets be real, one of the main roles of it is to support your fleet in combat by shield/armor/cap boosting it. But in reality that can rarely happen (unless you doing it to another capital ship) It takes how long to target your gang mate???? and then can you even target your gang mate while you being dampened by a 1 mill frig....? and if you do manage to target your gang made..he/she probably dead by then. Well there goes the "we want carriers to be in their support role" argument.... If you deploy a carrier without proper support to deal with that "1 mill frig" the carrier deserves to die. If you "need" to have all of your fighters assigned to you, where the hell is your support? You are most likely already dead. I support this change to carriers. All too often when small to medium gangs engage each other, one side drops a carrier in an effort to win the battle, instead of trying to use tactics to defeat the other gang. It seems to me that people whining about the new changes to carriers are just whining because they stand to loose their "I Win" button. Come on carriers arnt even close to your so called "I Win" button. How many carreirs get ganked by small gangs, ****s loads and you know it. Dps from a carrier isnt huge you can get more whit a bs that cost alot less then a carrier and thats whit 10 fighters.... and whit 5 fighters, it will be a joke... Its bad as it is, that i need to have a alt just to move my ship from system to system. And now ill need an alt just to have a normal dps for my 1 bill ship no thanks. Caps ships will be like a car that wont work if you dont have 10 m8s around you all the time to push it down the road. why dont you just give us ships that need 10 pilotes to fly them... by the looks off things at the end we will fight in shuttels well you will as ill buger off before that
Rudy Metallo Brutor tribe	Posted - 2007.10.22 10:28:00 - [40] Carriers are supposed to be logistics platforms anyway, not damage dealers. -- We are the revolutionaries. We are the usurpers of the heavenly throne. We are the enemies of the Gods.
Zyrla Bladestorm Minmatar Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.10.22 10:46:00 - [41] Its a lot easier to manage delegating fighters from a different grid and gains a whole new level of awkwardness if you are trying to use them against enemies with fighters delegated in the same grid - thus delegation is usually an all or nothing deal. Capital logistics are potent but difficult to use well and relatively easy to counter (You don't need to successfully jam very often if every time you do jam, it will take him three minutes to re-lock anything because you've damped his lock time too) So much as bldyannoyed said above, the average setup after this change would probably go from your choice of carrier with 0-1 drone control units plus combat and logistics mods in a fight attempting to deal a bit of damage while also attempting to help friendlies to a thanatos with 4-5 drone control units, sat at a POS bored stiff. . ----- Apologies for any rambling that may have just occurred.
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0	Posted - 2007.10.22 11:21:00 - [42] I can see why they want to make their firepower more gang-dependent, but while they're at it they should get more defensive / repping bonuses to at least make them remotely useful still. Paradox V2.0 is recruiting!
Michelson Morley	Posted - 2007.10.22 11:58:00 - [43] Above the question of whether this nerf is required or not is the question of how workable the solution will be. There are times when certain tactics involve jumping a bunch of carriers into a system to ambush an enemy fleet. Time is of the essence in attacks like this. So now, the carrier fleet jumps in, then has to pause and get organized while they deploy all of their fighters to the associated support fleet. Meanwhile, the enemy sees local lighting up and runs off. Not saying this is the most important aspect of this change - but it is an element. Anything that adds to the administrative overhead of the game slows the already slow pace of gang organization. MM
Roger Albany Koshaku Interstellar Starbase Syndicate	Posted - 2007.10.22 11:59:00 - [44] Every other carrier change that have been up until now, have been to get the carriers out of the pos'es and onto the frontline. With this nerf they suddenly reverse course - no point in frontlining the carrier, if you have to give out the fighters to other ships anyway. So all this will accomplish is that the carriers will return to be a pos hugger that gives out fighters.
burning raven omen. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.10.22 13:44:00 - [45] hm i have a new generic carrier setup 4 drone control units / 1 remote repairer (armour/shield) 3 sensor booster II's / cap rechargers 4 inertia stabs / cap relays rigs im not sure, between ccc's and ones that will help you get back in the bubble quickly what do you think? :)
Haniblecter Teg F.R.E.E. Explorer Atrum Tempestas Foedus	Posted - 2007.10.22 14:16:00 - [46] Its a change to make carriers the support ships they're supposed to be. I fully endorse the change and realize alot of pirates are going to be bummed out...those of us in 00 fighting eachother could care less....though MC might be miffed a bit. May actually have ot bring a support fleet with you 40+ carriers now. ----------------- Friends Forever Kill. BoB. Dead.
Albatron St	Posted - 2007.10.22 14:19:00 - [47] Originally by: Rudy Metallo Carriers are supposed to be logistics platforms anyway, not damage dealers. what part off carrier definition dont you get? Let me ask you this way, do fighters on a real carrier shoot donats, instead of bullets and missiles ? and are they used to damage other ships or fighters By the looks off things ccp wants new ships, strange way off making them thow. I reckon they are runing low on good ideas or geting to layze to make new models. They coud make the new engine shine even better, whit new intresting models thow thats a new topic...
Haniblecter Teg F.R.E.E. Explorer Atrum Tempestas Foedus	Posted - 2007.10.22 14:22:00 - [48] Originally by: Michelson Morley Above the question of whether this nerf is required or not is the question of how workable the solution will be. There are times when certain tactics involve jumping a bunch of carriers into a system to ambush an enemy fleet. Time is of the essence in attacks like this. So now, the carrier fleet jumps in, then has to pause and get organized while they deploy all of their fighters to the associated support fleet. Meanwhile, the enemy sees local lighting up and runs off. Not saying this is the most important aspect of this change - but it is an element. Anything that adds to the administrative overhead of the game slows the already slow pace of gang organization. MM I fail to see the effectiveness of using a ton of carriers for a quick strike. A quick strike on what? Smaller ships? Caps outside the POS? What targets can carriers possibly attack quickly enough to make them useful, but not risk them unnecesarily to some lone **ty tackler. I do agree with the one poster who says this is a regression to getting carriers out of the POS. To counter that effct, they should strengthen the defense of carreirs, repper/resis boni, AND boost their remote bonuses to non-cap ships. IF they make carriers capable of giving BS's the ability to tank 1000+ dps--with the carrier being even better--than you may see small gangs utilizing a carrier more. Hell, making the triage mode shorter + allow the use of fighters will prolly accomplish this effect. ----------------- Friends Forever** Kill. BoB. Dead.
P0etank	Posted - 2007.10.22 15:33:00 - [49] i was in alpurute or however you spell it and a typhoon jumped through the stacmon gate and we attacked it because it was BS agents our 3 command ships and 3 BC then he dropped a cyno field and boom a mother ship pilot soloing killed 2 of our command ships and 1 BC. I think a nerf is needed.... because that was just wrongà
Nian Banks Minmatar Berserkers of Aesir	Posted - 2007.10.22 16:57:00 - [50] Originally by: Roger Albany Every other carrier change that have been up until now, have been to get the carriers out of the pos'es and onto the frontline. With this nerf they suddenly reverse course - no point in frontlining the carrier, if you have to give out the fighters to other ships anyway. So all this will accomplish is that the carriers will return to be a pos hugger that gives out fighters. That my friend is exactly what I was thinking when I read the blog. Basically they want carriers on the front line and did that nerf to stop you sitting in pos, then they did a half assed attempt at giving carriers a siege like ability for logistics but killed their dps when in that mode. Now they want to stop a carrier from deploying under its own control all its fighters. So what are the devs trying to do? Seems they do half assed buffs and then use nerfs to force people into direct combat, then they make it that they can't fight when in direct combat... CCP clearly have no clue as to what they are doing, if anything I would allow a carrier to deploy fighters even in logistics mode and not do this nerf. Just to make carrier pilots want to fight in direct combat. Then I would remove fighters ability to warp after a target and probably only allow fighters to be assigned to a pilot within 1000Km.
Hyakuchan Earth Federation Space Force	Posted - 2007.10.22 17:25:00 - [51] Edited by: Hyakuchan on 22/10/2007 17:28:43 Originally by: J Valkor There should not be solo-carrier pilots. Period. I am not sure how they exist now, given that a solo carrier is essentially free candy to the first good pvp corp that finds. 1. It's not carriers that are the problem, it's moms. 2. Moms are not free ANYTHING. It takes serious planning plus a fair amount of incompetence on the target's part to take one down in lowsec. 3. There are very few good pvp corps relative to the number of corps who claim to be such. The "fix all" solution to the mom problem is to not let them be immune to ewar except in 0.0. -------------------------------------------------- FRIGATS Coalition FREGE-Red-IAC-Goon-AAA-Tau-Southerncross "We gonna beat you with frigats."
J'ghathii Caldari 54th Knights Templar Dark Matter Coalition	Posted - 2007.10.22 17:58:00 - [52] Originally by: Hyakuchan 1. It's not carriers that are the problem, it's moms. 2. Moms are not free ANYTHING. It takes serious planning plus a fair amount of incompetence on the target's part to take one down in lowsec. 3. There are very few good pvp corps relative to the number of corps who claim to be such. The "fix all" solution to the mom problem is to not let them be immune to ewar except in 0.0. And that is the truth of this argument. Carriers aren't the problem, its the moms camping in low-sec that are.
Sokratesz Paradox v2.0	Posted - 2007.10.22 18:12:00 - [53] 1) disallow supercaps from lowsec 2) ?? 3) profit! Paradox V2.0 is recruiting!
Elles D Caldari Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2007.10.22 20:08:00 - [54] I don't even fly mom's/carriers and this sounds ****. CCP sort it out tbh.
kessah Blood Corsair's	Posted - 2007.10.22 20:24:00 - [55] Two thumbs up from me, top notch idea. -------------------------------------------------------- [Video] Forever Pirate 3
Molly Neuro	Posted - 2007.10.22 20:28:00 - [56] Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad It's a good change. Carriers were never supposed to be the solopwnmobiles they became. You've obviously never flown a carrier - have you actually seen one??
Kruel Blunt Force Syndicate	Posted - 2007.10.22 20:32:00 - [57] Why change carriers? Was anyone asking for this change? What about all the drone bugs, what about Amarr laserboats? And how about that Factional Warfare we were promised so long ago?
Brady	Posted - 2007.10.22 20:44:00 - [58] I agree with the change. Think its been needed for some time, but please fix the triage before nerfing. Triage = insta cap death, and with this change can a carrier have active fighters?
FT Diomedes Gallente Ductus Exemplo	Posted - 2007.10.22 20:44:00 - [59] Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad It's a good change. Carriers were never supposed to be the solopwnmobiles they became. Personals Ad: Small roaming gang seeks solo carrier for a fun night of *****fantasy simulation. You get to pretend you are a sexy beast of a ship that can take on anyone. We get to gangbang you. Oh, and when we're done, we'll do unspeakable things with your frozen corpse. Seriously, anyone who thinks carriers are solopwnmobiles doesn't have a clue. A carrier by itself might as well be dead already if there is a small gang around. ------------ Improvize. Adapt. Overcome.
Mourn Navarre Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.10.22 20:49:00 - [60] Originally by: Molly Neuro Originally by: Karyuudo Tydraad It's a good change. Carriers were never supposed to be the solopwnmobiles they became. You've obviously never flown a carrier - have you actually seen one?? I have with my original character. After spending so much time training for them just to try them (dreads and carriers), I decided I hated capital ships in general which put to waste a helluva lot of skill points. I especially do not like the immune to EW (at least when it comes to tackling) that MOMs have which is where the idea (and I do mean idea) is probably meant bite into the most.
Kayosoni Caldari Destructive Influence Band of Brothers	Posted - 2007.10.22 21:07:00 - [61] Edited by: Kayosoni on 22/10/2007 21:07:18 just don't allow jump drives to be used in 0.1 and up if you're in combat mode, and add capital warp scramblers to gates. ----------------------------------- btw, threatening to close 1 account really hurt my eyes. - xaioguai
Mourn Navarre Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.10.22 21:09:00 - [62] Edited by: Mourn Navarre on 22/10/2007 21:09:40 Originally by: Kayosoni .... and add capital warp scramblers to gates. Motherships would be immune to it. Not a terrible idea in general though.
Crystal Starbreeze The Ankou The Reckoning.	Posted - 2007.10.22 22:19:00 - [63] Bump this the linkage at first post has some good arguments and worthwhile reading I stole this image because it was fitting, Sorry!
Futher Bezluden Minmatar ORIGIN SYSTEMS Atlas Alliance	Posted - 2007.10.22 22:35:00 - [64] where in the blue <snip> did zulu's idea come from? Fire him out of a T1 1400mm Artillery. THUKKER -Be Paranoid
ViperVenom Labteck Corporation LTD. Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2007.10.22 22:48:00 - [65] Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel Originally by: The Fate Tell me how can they support if they are sensor damped/jammed???? They have a sensor strength of 50+ (over twice the sensor strength of battleships) so they're very resistant to jamming. ...and Damps are supposedly getting nerfed. IMHO this is a good move as it will reduce the power of the capital blob and the people flying around solo in capitals. It won't in any way reduce the power of people using assigned fighters except that it might take a few more seconds to set it up. DUDE. This is 100% Bad Bad Bad idea. 1st of all Fighters are just untanked cruisers that cost 20 mil a pop. 2nd Due to lag id rather control my flock of Fighters 3rd CCP might need to give back a year of training i spent on Cap Ships. I trained up skills to use more than 5 drones at once. And Carriers are front line ships. When u go seige a POS and u start pwning its guns I use Hvy drones not fighters. Every time they play with Cap ships they screw up. Look at that dreadful mod.. Triage!! Leave Carrier/Moms alone. a 2 bil ship pwn a 60 mil ship o wow.!. CCP leave Carrier alone. But fix the Minnie Carrier it still kinda suxs! --www.yarrburger.com-- Also www.Pwnageinc.org-- If u whine about it,then it shall be nerf batted. Lets just stop pod killing while we at it!. --J/P--
ViperVenom Labteck Corporation LTD. Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2007.10.22 22:53:00 - [66] Edited by: ViperVenom on 22/10/2007 22:53:13 Originally by: Elaina Marie Originally by: Ilya Murametz Edited by: Ilya Murametz on 22/10/2007 02:08:28 You know, i've been thinking about this while siting here and crying .... All too often when small to medium gangs engage each other, one side drops a carrier in an effort to win the battle, instead of trying to use tactics to defeat the other gang. It seems to me that people whining about the new changes to carriers are just whining because they stand to loose their "I Win" button. Im sry last time i checked.. in a med gang fight if they Cynoed in a Carrier to help win.. thats either a great idea.. Or there trying to get there Cap ships pwned. Regard less if it turns the battle for them good tactical idea. That seems like tactics 2 me. --www.yarrburger.com-- Also www.Pwnageinc.org-- If u whine about it,then it shall be nerf batted. Lets just stop pod killing while we at it!. --J/P--
Reem Fairchild Minmatar Republic University	Posted - 2007.10.22 22:55:00 - [67] Originally by: Albatron St and this wont fix the lag from fighter/drones at all it will just make it easy to gank ^solo carriers^ that is to eaasy as it is Big ships should be vulnerable when they are on their own (which is balanced by them being very, very powerful when properly supported). Frankly, I think if you're not going to be flying in fleet with it (or use it strictly for logistics), you shouldn't really have a carrier.
ITTigerClawIK Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2007.10.22 23:08:00 - [68] Originally by: Ishmael Hansen Go complain to the noobs that camp low sec in carriers, mom's and titans, cos killing cruisers and stuff with 3 capitals must surely be fun. firstly there not noobs since they fly millions (or billions) worth of ship and months worth of skill training secontly they are called pirates... pirates will do this its all part of the game... of course we all hate pirates (except the pirates themselfs of course ) but this will happen dont like it stay outta 0.0 or find a corp who has moms and carriers themselfs also the change is compleately illogical and makes no sence at all fighters are easy enough to be taken out by ships of all classes and once fighters are gone the carrier is dead int he watter mom's of course beign more expensive are ment to be alot tougher and harder to kill and we of course have the heavy dictors to come out wich are gunna be killing more super caps ..... CCP the nerf hammer needs a rest Sig space reclaimed in the name of me -courtesy of Tiggy ([email protected])
ViperVenom Labteck Corporation LTD. Libertas Fidelitas	Posted - 2007.10.23 00:43:00 - [69] I just want to say. If this does happen. Im going to sell him<--- and be come a miner screw this..lol Boo CCP!!!! --CCP is run by Bush/Cheany--

Pages: 1 2 3 :: [one page]

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.