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Hardin
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Posted - 2004.02.25 17:10:00 -
[1]
I have amassed +16,000 RP points for Carthum Conglomerate in Amarrian Starship Engineering.
I also know someone who trained ASEngineering to Lvl 5 and has now ammassed +30,000 RP points with a Carthum agent.
I put the effort in in the hope of getting hold of a BP for the Crusader the Amarrian Interceptor produced by Carthum. However, I now find out the BP is already out and about...
As a result I have a few questions...
1)Will we ever get to see a list of Tech 2 BP's that have actually been released into the game? Surely this is not to hard to do CCP? If this is already in then please could someone direct me to it?
2)Is there any point continuing my ASEngineering research with Carthum now the BP that I wanted has been released? Will more copies be released? What other BP's can we expect from ASEngineering? Is that it now - have I 'lost' and may as well give up doing my agent's reserach missions every night?
3) On EVE-DB the Crusader was the only Amarr elite-frig listed as Carthum produced... Did this mean that only those doing research with Carthum Research agents were entered into the lottery or were Viziam agent runners also included? If this is the case then do the Carthum agent runners still have a chance of getting the 'Viziam' produced interceptor BPs and are there any BP's for them which have not been released yet?
It would really help if this whole process was a lot more transparent (and I apologise if I have missed something). How many BP's have been released - how many copies of these BP's have been released - will there be future releases of the same blueprints to people in the same field - is there a guide to which module BP's have not been released yet and in which field so people can decide if they want to swap research fields?
Basically I want to know if there is still a point or should I just abandon my research agent now?
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Nikodaemonicus
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Posted - 2004.02.25 17:27:00 -
[2]
Hello Hardin.
I think I can reply to your #1 question: not 100% sure, you can check all availible items on market. If the item is on the market, there should be a BP released for it. |
Skillz
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Posted - 2004.02.25 17:36:00 -
[3]
Hardin, don't you think that they will eventually cough up some cruiser, industrial and battleship blueprints too?
Keep on flaming, lamers.
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Hardin
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Posted - 2004.02.25 17:46:00 -
[4]
Skillz - your guess is as good as mine!
We have never been told so how do we know?
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Wraeththu
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Posted - 2004.02.25 17:50:00 -
[5]
 Quote:
Did this mean that only those doing research with Carthum Research agents were entered into the lottery or were Viziam agent runners also included? If this is the case then do the Carthum agent runners still have a chance of getting the 'Viziam' produced interceptor BPs and are there any BP's for them which have not been released yet?
Good question. I've always thought that your agent's corp had nothing to do with the research, as Papa never mentioned it, but it's worth of a test. Why don't some of the people who actually got the interceptor bp's post whether you worked for that corp or not?
I mean, if all 8 of them came from the correct corp, that pretty much proves it, if one didn't, then that pretty much disproves it.
--
TomB: End the speed-race. 1 propulsion mod allowed, make turrets affect ship attributes like +speed/+ab speed +agil for progressivly smaller/lighter turrets, -speed/-ab speed -agil for long-range. |
Foomanshoe
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Posted - 2004.02.25 18:05:00 -
[6]
Im pretty sure they'll introduce more bps as time goes by.
_______________________________________________
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Shevar
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Posted - 2004.02.25 20:02:00 -
[7]
Corp has nothing to do with what bp you get, just the research field (I know of someone getting an ares from a duvolle agent and another getting the claw from core complex).
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-The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs
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Harisdrop
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Posted - 2004.02.25 20:04:00 -
[8]
My medium armor repairer requires the Viziam RdB and I did not get it from that corp.
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Garsh ma it soo cool killing people in there space thingies |
IZON
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Posted - 2004.02.25 20:18:00 -
[9]
Quote:
I have amassed +16,000 RP points for Carthum Conglomerate in Amarrian Starship Engineering.
 My agent took 240 RP's before dropping a prized Warp Disruptor 1 BP. Location might be a factor. I'm theorising but it seems reasonable the more pilots researching with the same agent(s), in that same system, the lower your chances of you getting that BP. If you'd amassed that many RP's in a remote locale you might be sitting pretty now. As per storyline, some of the best labs are located off the beaten track. And remember there's always the possibility that you've already lost the lottery more tham once and not realised it. 
"...master! there's a guy in the south village called IZON, he is a Ninja!" |
Asharee Intrefer
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Posted - 2004.02.26 03:49:00 -
[10]
I think the upcoming BPs are more interesting. Three more classes of elite frigate, and then cruiser classes like interdictor and destroyer. I think they are worth waiting for. 
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Elithiomel
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Posted - 2004.02.26 07:52:00 -
[11]
Guardiano, Auguror based suport cruiser is also Carthum developed. Not too much info on this at the moment though. All the data for the elite cruisers seems to be placeholder data.
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Engineers motto; If it doesn't fit, force it. If it breaks it needed replacing anyway. |
Papa Smurf
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Posted - 2004.02.27 08:28:00 -
[12]
Quote:
Corp has nothing to do with what bp you get, just the research field (I know of someone getting an ares from a duvolle agent and another getting the claw from core complex).
Correct. Corp has nothing to do with it, even though that doesn't always make sense.
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Papa Smurf
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Posted - 2004.02.27 08:31:00 -
[13]
Quote:
Quote:
I have amassed +16,000 RP points for Carthum Conglomerate in Amarrian Starship Engineering.
My agent took 240 RP's before dropping a prized Warp Disruptor 1 BP. Location might be a factor. I'm theorising but it seems reasonable the more pilots researching with the same agent(s), in that same system, the lower your chances of you getting that BP. If you'd amassed that many RP's in a remote locale you might be sitting pretty now. As per storyline, some of the best labs are located off the beaten track. And remember there's always the possibility that you've already lost the lottery more tham once and not realised it.
Location is not a factor, whether or not it makes sense.
Every RP has an equal chance at the BP, so somebody with 240 RP still has a chance against somebody with 24000 RP. Only 1% of the big guy's chance, but still a chance.
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Papa Smurf
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Posted - 2004.02.27 08:41:00 -
[14]
Quote:
I have amassed +16,000 RP points for Carthum Conglomerate in Amarrian Starship Engineering.
I also know someone who trained ASEngineering to Lvl 5 and has now ammassed +30,000 RP points with a Carthum agent.
I put the effort in in the hope of getting hold of a BP for the Crusader the Amarrian Interceptor produced by Carthum. However, I now find out the BP is already out and about...
As a result I have a few questions...
1)Will we ever get to see a list of Tech 2 BP's that have actually been released into the game? Surely this is not to hard to do CCP? If this is already in then please could someone direct me to it?
Probably you'll not see such a list from us.
Quote:
2)Is there any point continuing my ASEngineering research with Carthum now the BP that I wanted has been released? Will more copies be released? What other BP's can we expect from ASEngineering? Is that it now - have I 'lost' and may as well give up doing my agent's reserach missions every night?
We drop multiple copies of each BP. They're usually dropped at a few days interval. The interval and count varies between BPs. (And no, we won't tell you what it is.)
Quote:
3) On EVE-DB the Crusader was the only Amarr elite-frig listed as Carthum produced... Did this mean that only those doing research with Carthum Research agents were entered into the lottery or were Viziam agent runners also included? If this is the case then do the Carthum agent runners still have a chance of getting the 'Viziam' produced interceptor BPs and are there any BP's for them which have not been released yet?
Not only Carthum Research agents were entered. Carthum agent runners still have a chance at the Viziam interceptor. Perhaps when we come to Tech III we'll be more specific.
Quote:
It would really help if this whole process was a lot more transparent (and I apologise if I have missed something). How many BP's have been released - how many copies of these BP's have been released - will there be future releases of the same blueprints to people in the same field - is there a guide to which module BP's have not been released yet and in which field so people can decide if they want to swap research fields?
More info is always helpful. Perhaps some day.
Quote:
Basically I want to know if there is still a point or should I just abandon my research agent now?
There's as much point now as there was before. Also, given that usually a high-RP person gets the BP, the total number of RPs in the lottery for the BP you desire has been reduced so your chances for the next BP improves.
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Fausto
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Posted - 2004.02.27 08:57:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Fausto on 27/02/2004 08:58:15
Omg Papa you are acting as you are our customer and not the other way around All this 'WE TELLING YOU NOTHING' strategy is not a good way to do bussines People just want to know if what they are doing makes sense and since we are the ones putting the bread on your table we have a right to know WE not YOU
If my company was to ignore a request for info from ALL (in case you haven't noticed ALL EVE players would like to have more accurate info on research) customers it would be out if bussiness in 3 days.
Or maybe this lack of information from your side is just a sign that you don't have a clue of what you are doing with research strategy 
______
<brainpodder> |
Nikodaemonicus
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Posted - 2004.02.27 10:38:00 -
[16]
Hey Papa, I never ask you anything, so I hope you will grant me one chance :)
Do Nefantar agents drop anything? I have been asking everybody around nefantar stations and nada, and currently I have more than 10k RP for a 2x project. And not RdB for Nefantar (I can understand they do not build ships, but why there is no RdB for Nefantar? that's 2 questions ops...) |
Scalor Valentis
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Posted - 2004.02.27 13:57:00 -
[17]
May I add to this conversation that I used to feel
just like Hardin, and was getting desperate about
receiving a BP.
But once I finally got offered a decent BP from having
over 7000 RP in Mechanical Engineering, it all started
to feel so much better. Now I'm happily researching
another field and I'm quite confident I'll receive a 2nd
BP some day.
So all you who feel like luck has deserted you, keep doing
those halting missions. You're turn will come, maybe
sooner than you think. And Hardin, 16000 RPs is alot.
Relax. 16000 is alot.
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Sanjuro
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Posted - 2004.02.27 15:25:00 -
[18]
Quote:
Quote:
Corp has nothing to do with what bp you get, just the research field (I know of someone getting an ares from a duvolle agent and another getting the claw from core complex).
Correct. Corp has nothing to do with it, even though that doesn't always make sense.
Well isn't that a nice little kick in the head. Stupid me thought that when it said 'Developer: Roden Shipyards', that meant it was developed by Roden Shipyards. And since I was interested in a 'Roden' ship, I started working for a Roden agent, even though the highest quality level 3 agent is a base 0. Turns out that if I want a 'Roden' ship, my chances will be better working for a Duvolle or Creodron agent, since both have multiple agents of higher quality. Guess my problem was trying to use some logic where none exists. Oh well, only cost me 2600 rp. 
In a related matter, will we be able to transfer rp to another agent soon?
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Lord Kermit
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Posted - 2004.02.27 17:46:00 -
[19]
Quote:
Edited by: Fausto on 27/02/2004 08:58:15
Omg Papa you are acting as you are our customer and not the other way around All this 'WE TELLING YOU NOTHING' strategy is not a good way to do bussines People just want to know if what they are doing makes sense and since we are the ones putting the bread on your table we have a right to know WE not YOU
If my company was to ignore a request for info from ALL (in case you haven't noticed ALL EVE players would like to have more accurate info on research) customers it would be out if bussiness in 3 days.
Or maybe this lack of information from your side is just a sign that you don't have a clue of what you are doing with research strategy
I wouldn't be so quick to judge... the game is the property of CCP including the rules and laws governing the game (much in the same way D&D rules are the property of TSR or now WotC).. now while I agree that D&D rules are widly published.. it is the owners sole right whether such information is released.. after all this issue does involve copyrights (which I know more about than I ever cared to). So my point is that Papa answered what questions he was allowed or felt ok in answering...
as for the question of doing whether its worth it to continue in a certain field of research... thats up to you, but it would be very sad to see someone quit a research field just because they thought only one print for that field would be released... C'MON FOLKS!!! use the ol grey matter a bit.
Besides is it really that bad? I mean, are things really so bad that you cant stand to have game aspect remain slighty "vague or mysterious"? Don't get me wrong I would love to have more research information too... but I dont go berating the devs and GM's just because they refuse to give it out.
Just my 2 cents...
LK
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Ariana Fiedala
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Posted - 2004.03.01 17:43:00 -
[20]
I cannot agree more. I have been supremely disappointed with the T2 research system. The halt missions are CONSTANT and often involve alot of travel. Furthermore I trained up an alt to the point of doing T2 research as well since I didn't seem to be getting anywhere with my main. So hours and days and even a month later, I have invested countless ISK and time and have nothing to show for it....
I was excited about this when Castor came out but now the fun has ended- it's a drudge without a reward. Guess I'll go do my 77th halt mission now. 
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Cremytos
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Posted - 2004.03.01 18:33:00 -
[21]
CCP has an obligation to make the game as good as possible, not serving out strategic gamekeys to players. I know that the youth of today often use "cheats" to play things like Diablo etc. As an older man with his roots in AD&D roleplaying I praise CCP for not descending to this lower level with full knowledge of the game and its exploits.
I love the research with R&D agents because of its feeling and mysticism, Im not seeing it like [insert xisk and xtime=145mil worth of BPO] but as a relly creative way for us soloplayers to play this game for fun. Dont bash the devs, this is their best work yet!
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Macumba
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Posted - 2004.03.02 01:25:00 -
[22]
If something is based on a luck, why bother with researching at all? Even if somebody with 100 (or other piddly sum) points only has a 1% chance then that is, frankly, 1% too much.
EVE has to be the only game where something with such a potential for a huge impact on the game has been left entirely to chance.
Nobody knows who drops what. Nobody knows when they drop it. Nobody knows if all the time they've put in was worth the effort. To paraphrase one of my fellow alliance members "I've got a Micro Capacitor II BP, form an orderly queue".
I can't see the logic behind CCP's fetish with having a level playing field with every aspect of the game. If somebody hasn't taken the time to find an agent, worked up their faction to be able to work for that agent, and then invest the time with that agent, then they should not just receive a BP by chance. Giving noobs a chance is one thing, kicking agent runners when they're already down is another. I'm just glad I gave up on the whole mission thing long ago. Let some other fool have a wild goose chase, I'll just buy or loot the results thanks.
(For anyone who is going to comment about wanting things on a plate, I went from -9.9 Serpentis faction, before my corp made the move to Curse, to having three level 3 Serpentis agents in Curse when I cancelled my subscription shortly before Castor. I had to follow the Minmatar>Thukker>Serpentis chain, it was a total ballache. I've done more than my fair share of agent based tedium.)
"PVP = griefing" Papa Smurf |
Grim
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Posted - 2004.03.02 02:43:00 -
[23]
isn't it luck based on skill points. i thought the way it worked is that people with loads of RP's got offered BP's first. if they rejected it the bp is offered to the next highest etc. Its more just luck in terms of which corp gets them and who rejects them i s'pose
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Tanner Mirabel
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Posted - 2004.03.02 13:03:00 -
[24]
I really don't see why CCP should give out too much information. I think the differences come from how you percieve the situation. I think a lot of people are looking at this in terms of lines of code and complex equations and rules. To me, Im a researcher and Im researching. I don't think Ive ever heard of a researcher being provided with lists of what his competitors are doing and what they have achieved, nor have I ever heard of a researcher being given timetables and deadlines for when he will be given results or being given a guarentee that the person who puts in the most research time will be the one to get results first. If you take out any thought of programming code and equations I find this quite similar to RL (what ever that is)
Hardin, I wouldn't give up but just don't worry too much about getting anything. Do other things, don't stress about getting to the agent for his messages. Your points are still there and each one represents a chance of getting a BP everytime one is released.
One question I would like to ask. If you tell your agent you want to take your research elsewhere do the points you have accumulated with him remain in the lottery or do they get put on hold? So if you have, in Hardin's case 16000+ RP points, and you think you would be better doing Nuclear physics do you still have 16000+ chances in each relevant ship BP draw as well as what you have in your current research field?
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Aelius
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Posted - 2004.03.02 14:16:00 -
[25]
I like it as it is now. Scientists don't say: "Hey let¦s work for 4 years and in the end we will have the cure for Aids"
Science is also a little bit of luck.
Ps: I wasn't offered any BP yet and im not complaining, i like the thrill of it. People that want imediate results are not scientists, are crying babys.
"BUUAAA!!! I WANT MY BP NOW!!! BUUAAAA!!!"
By me you can all give up! Better chances for me
Selling Raven BPC ME20 3M at Yulai 1st Station |
Mimo
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Posted - 2004.03.02 14:50:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Mimo on 02/03/2004 15:20:20
Sorry, over 20k RP's x 3 in corp, 3 months doing agent missions like a *****, and still nothing :(
So then stick with your ***** system. I am dissapointed about it. All fun and motivation spoiled utterly.
If i have to live with the system, you have to live with a few very dissappointed and unhappy customers.
But like it's wonderfully said..both sides have to live with it.
And i am terrible ****** with the peeps, who got there prints after 2 days of research with 115 points...roflmao.
The system is far from beeing fair. Anyone who calls luck fair has a strange definition of fairness. At least in my oppinion.
After 3 and a half months of doing Research missions, the limit has been reached. Fun gone for those ****** agents, who are only there to destroy isk, and illusionate some gaming time to keep peeps online.
In my oppinion, the system is as random, as the Miner2 Print System was random, or Implants are Random. So please, everyone with 300 or more RP's and expecting a BP or the hard work compensated is wrong. Me included. I am maybe one of the greatest idiots playing the game, by having done that many missions since 3 months and longer.
Now i am dissapointed in the system, frsutrated, fun gone, and very angry about me, you and whatever
What if when ~ 1000 Researches see the truth, that all isk invested in R&D agents, including time is utterly waste of time, when you can buy a print for a lower price, then the R&D agent demands for his missions on commods.
Tell me where the sense is to spend millions of isk, when you can buy a print from someone else, who has done never a mission, and resets his project every three days...tell me plz
[Edit: Removed bad language myself]
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Aelius
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Posted - 2004.03.02 15:40:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Aelius on 02/03/2004 15:45:22
Yes. Yes .Yes... MUHAHAHAHA.
Give up! All of you... Go back to mining.
Miners never were good scientists.
Science needs patient people... Only the true scientists will prevail.
If you don't like it, go do something else.
BTW science isn't all about isk.
Just because you dumb nuts found out science gives good money, that doesn't make you a scientist.
Ps: This char was created to be a scientist in May last year. Only now the tools are becoming avaiable to follow that path, and im sure i will still make a great discovery that will honor the Caldari people. 
BTW: Can i have your stuff? (RPs)
Selling Raven BPC ME20 3M at Yulai 1st Station |
Asharee Intrefer
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Posted - 2004.03.02 15:49:00 -
[28]
Quote:
CCP has an obligation to make the game as good as possible, not serving out strategic gamekeys to players. I know that the youth of today often use "cheats" to play things like Diablo etc. As an older man with his roots in AD&D roleplaying I praise CCP for not descending to this lower level with full knowledge of the game and its exploits.
I don't have exactly the same roots, but I still agree wholeheartedly. If someone wants to know the exact workings of a game, I suggest they visit their local game retailer and find an "Ultimate Official Guidebook", and the game to match it, because a MMO game might not be what they are looking for.
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j0sephine
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Posted - 2004.03.02 15:53:00 -
[29]
"I put the effort in in the hope of getting hold of a BP for the Crusader the Amarrian Interceptor produced by Carthum. However, I now find out the BP is already out and about..."
I think there's more than one copy of each BP that's released through agents, so you still have your chance, probably -.^
"2)Is there any point continuing my ASEngineering research with Carthum now the BP that I wanted has been released? Will more copies be released? What other BP's can we expect from ASEngineering? Is that it now - have I 'lost' and may as well give up doing my agent's reserach missions every night?"
Well, there's at least a number of other elite frigate types which were confirmed to come... that including those --now legendary-- recon frigates which people hope will have the ability to warp to objects in safe spots... i figure ship like that would sell quite well. ;s
Then there's destroyers mentioned by TomB in one interview... and who knows what else. People found traces of 'elite cruisers' in eve-db i.e. at least three new, specialized cruiser classes... plus a number of new ship skills -- carriers, flagships, bombers... list goes on. o.o;
"3) On EVE-DB the Crusader was the only Amarr elite-frig listed as Carthum produced... Did this mean that only those doing research with Carthum Research agents were entered into the lottery or were Viziam agent runners also included?"
Dunno, but wouldn't rely on that info really. Most of those new ships in the eve-db has their descriptions clearly unfinished, so what corporation they actually come from will probably change in the end. o.o;
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Albar Gray
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Posted - 2004.03.02 23:11:00 -
[30]
Well I'm just shy of 35k RP in Amarrian Starship Engineering, and I'm really glad to hear Papa Smurf mention that they release several copies of a BP over a period.
I don't need to know what the period is, just that more will be coming. It makes the second Amarrian Starship Engineering project I just started a little less insane 
-----------------------------------------------
IÆm not schizophrenic...
ThatÆs my alt
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