| Pages: 1 2 [3] :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
sheis
   |
Posted - 2007.11.01 13:03:00 -
[61]
Ya legitimizing something you consider cheating and damaging to the game seems like the most logical choice.
|
Imperator Jora'h
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 13:21:00 -
[62]
 Originally by: sheis
Ya legitimizing something you consider cheating and damaging to the game seems like the most logical choice.
As you noted the Devs wrote a blog on the evils of buying ISK and how it hurts the game. I think it is safe to say they have given this some thought. Yet they go ahead and enable GTC sales. Has it occurred to you that CCP believes this is least of the evils presented to them or do you think they are a bunch of braindead hyprocritical tards that just did this on a whim?
|
Scorpyn
Caldari
Infinitus Odium
The Church.
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 13:36:00 -
[63]
It's not there as a countermeasure to illegitimate isk sellers, it's a way to get more subscriptions.
That said, I'm fairly certain that the person who wrote the blog is of the opinion that it shouldn't be allowed to sell gtcs for isk. I think I've actually seen such a post by whoever wrote it, but I cba trying to find it.
2007-07-19 20:26
|
sheis
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 13:41:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: sheis
Ya legitimizing something you consider cheating and damaging to the game seems like the most logical choice.
As you noted the Devs wrote a blog on the evils of buying ISK and how it hurts the game. I think it is safe to say they have given this some thought. Yet they go ahead and enable GTC sales. Has it occurred to you that CCP believes this is least of the evils presented to them or do you think they are a bunch of braindead hyprocritical tards that just did this on a whim?
I think that them allowing GTC sales has nothing to do with a reaction to "illegal" isk sellers. They dont even take a hard line stance with illegal isk sales. If caught you get the isk removed...thats it. Off the top of my head i cant think of a game were breaking the EULA for something related to RMT isnt an instant ban.
|
Imperator Jora'h
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 13:48:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Scorpyn
It's not there as a countermeasure to illegitimate isk sellers, it's a way to get more subscriptions.
And...
Originally by: sheis
I think that them allowing GTC sales has nothing to do with a reaction to "illegal" isk sellers. They dont even take a hard line stance with illegal isk sales. If caught you get the isk removed...thats it. Off the top of my head i cant think of a game were breaking the EULA for something related to RMT isnt an instant ban.
So both of your opinion is, put more bluntly, CCP are greedy bastards who will do whatever for a subscription and to hell with the game?
Just asking...
|
ry ry
StateCorp
The State
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 14:07:00 -
[66]
problem is, eve is a long game.
i'd hazard a guess that the average eve subscriber stays with the game a lot longer than the average wow subscriber. we know the new subscription rate is already lower than blizzard's baby.
by perma-banning people who may or may not have bought isk at some point ccp would be shooting themselves in the foot. i expect they do perma-ban if you keep buying isk.
and no, i've never bought any isk.
|
Lazaroth
Caldari
Ethereal Technologies
STYX.
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 14:13:00 -
[67]
Originally by: sheis
Originally by: Lazaroth
Edited by: Lazaroth on 01/11/2007 09:29:15
A Noob with 5bill ISK is still a Noob.. ISK can't buy you skill (and no I dont mean the skillbooks  ) Also I am a sig-maker from which I gain ISK, ISK which helps me pay for my subscribtion.. but using ISK for GTC means I have less coins to use on shiny new things.
And honestly who cares if someone has the billions to go get fancy modules all the time.. they can be shot (maybe not as easily) but shot none the less.
And a final note I would'nt care for any of my assets if I haven't worked for them (and yes I consider spending hours on photoshop satisfying the needs of others a kind of work). I'm guessing that someone who accually worked 8 hours at a factory/store [insert job] to make ISK would feel the same way.
Laz
Does someone being a noob somehow change something when they hire a vast and powerful alliance to work for them. And why do your examples must be a noob? You dont think established experience players use GTC/isk buying to support and gain an advantage over those who dont? Its just in the example of a noob its obvious.
my comment was ment to tell you too things about how a feel about this issue.. 1) Having alot of ISK does not make you a good player nor a successful one (unless you count the amassing of fictive wealth a goal in it self).. and as such I could'nt care less about these people.. if I **** someone off and they hire an entire alliance/corp to gank me.. they should be welcome it'll make my like more interesting for sure.
2) I might be totally of the scale on this one but I do believe there are two kinds of ISK buyers.. there are the ones with no amount of patience.. and I'll throw my neck on the line and call them little kiddies with there parents vallets (flame on! Johnny) and the other kind are grownups with not enough time ingame to get where they really want to go.
So Noob in this (negative sense) in not particularly minded on new people but more a stamp on people who bought there character on e-bay.
my appologies for insulting any Noobs out there.. god knows I can be abit noobish from time to time.
Laz
Request a sig at Eve-gfx.com |
sheis
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 14:16:00 -
[68]
Originally by: ry ry
problem is, eve is a long game.
i'd hazard a guess that the average eve subscriber stays with the game a lot longer than the average wow subscriber. we know the new subscription rate is already lower than blizzard's baby.
by perma-banning people who may or may not have bought isk at some point ccp would be shooting themselves in the foot. i expect they do perma-ban if you keep buying isk.
and no, i've never bought any isk.
I believe i have read the average EVE subscription is 6-7 months. Is that a long time? Ya losing accounts sucks. But buying isk illegally should be insta and perm ban. its pretty much a universal no no.
|
sheis
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 14:19:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: Scorpyn
It's not there as a countermeasure to illegitimate isk sellers, it's a way to get more subscriptions.
And...
Originally by: sheis
I think that them allowing GTC sales has nothing to do with a reaction to "illegal" isk sellers. They dont even take a hard line stance with illegal isk sales. If caught you get the isk removed...thats it. Off the top of my head i cant think of a game were breaking the EULA for something related to RMT isnt an instant ban.
So both of your opinion is, put more bluntly, CCP are greedy bastards who will do whatever for a subscription and to hell with the game?
Just asking...
I honestly dont know the motivation. The game is obviously doing well enough without the financial NEED to do so. So i cant see another reason to attribute the choice. I mean there could be 100 reasons behind the scenes for it but im not aware of any. Just the nature of the way EVE is designed makes purchasing isk so much more of an issue than for say in WoW. And WoW takes huge steps to curtail it. |
sheis
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 14:20:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Lazaroth
Originally by: sheis
Originally by: Lazaroth
Edited by: Lazaroth on 01/11/2007 09:29:15
A Noob with 5bill ISK is still a Noob.. ISK can't buy you skill (and no I dont mean the skillbooks ) Also I am a sig-maker from which I gain ISK, ISK which helps me pay for my subscribtion.. but using ISK for GTC means I have less coins to use on shiny new things.
And honestly who cares if someone has the billions to go get fancy modules all the time.. they can be shot (maybe not as easily) but shot none the less.
And a final note I would'nt care for any of my assets if I haven't worked for them (and yes I consider spending hours on photoshop satisfying the needs of others a kind of work). I'm guessing that someone who accually worked 8 hours at a factory/store [insert job] to make ISK would feel the same way.
Laz
Does someone being a noob somehow change something when they hire a vast and powerful alliance to work for them. And why do your examples must be a noob? You dont think established experience players use GTC/isk buying to support and gain an advantage over those who dont? Its just in the example of a noob its obvious.
my comment was ment to tell you too things about how a feel about this issue.. 1) Having alot of ISK does not make you a good player nor a successful one (unless you count the amassing of fictive wealth a goal in it self).. and as such I could'nt care less about these people.. if I **** someone off and they hire an entire alliance/corp to gank me.. they should be welcome it'll make my like more interesting for sure.
2) I might be totally of the scale on this one but I do believe there are two kinds of ISK buyers.. there are the ones with no amount of patience.. and I'll throw my neck on the line and call them little kiddies with there parents vallets (flame on! Johnny) and the other kind are grownups with not enough time ingame to get where they really want to go.
So Noob in this (negative sense) in not particularly minded on new people but more a stamp on people who bought there character on e-bay.
my appologies for insulting any Noobs out there.. god knows I can be abit noobish from time to time.
Laz
No i dont think you understand. Isk buyers are not only noob ******s. And or casual vets who dont i have time to uhhh play the game. Some people buy isk as individuals and groups to have a large impact on a given conflict. Its not just the ****** in a nightmare and an honor tanked dread.
|
Lazaroth
Caldari
Ethereal Technologies
STYX.
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 14:39:00 -
[71]
I do understand, but I'm maybe just a bit to naive
Request a sig at Eve-gfx.com |
Imperator Jora'h
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 14:48:00 -
[72]
Originally by: sheis
I honestly dont know the motivation. The game is obviously doing well enough without the financial NEED to do so. So i cant see another reason to attribute the choice. I mean there could be 100 reasons behind the scenes for it but im not aware of any. Just the nature of the way EVE is designed makes purchasing isk so much more of an issue than for say in WoW. And WoW takes huge steps to curtail it.
Just my opinion but I have more faith in the Devs. Where WOW is a corporate behemoth run by suits who do not give a rat's ass about anything except the bottom line I think CCP views EVE as a labor of love. From its inception it was about that and not so much making money.
Do not get me wrong. CCP is a business and they are ultimately there to make a profit and I think they are clear on that but I do not think they are governed by the almighty P&L spreadsheet the way WOW is. They have had a good run as is and look to go awhile yet. I think they would pull the plug before seriously compromising their vision for EVE.
|
Scorpyn
Caldari
Infinitus Odium
The Church.
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 15:52:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: Scorpyn
It's not there as a countermeasure to illegitimate isk sellers, it's a way to get more subscriptions.
And...
Originally by: sheis
I think that them allowing GTC sales has nothing to do with a reaction to "illegal" isk sellers. They dont even take a hard line stance with illegal isk sales. If caught you get the isk removed...thats it. Off the top of my head i cant think of a game were breaking the EULA for something related to RMT isnt an instant ban.
So both of your opinion is, put more bluntly, CCP are greedy bastards who will do whatever for a subscription and to hell with the game?
Just asking...
I consider that to be a possibility, but I don't have inside knowledge. They do seem to care a lot about the game, but that doesn't mean that every decision they make is a good one.
2007-07-19 20:26
|
sheis
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 15:57:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: sheis
I honestly dont know the motivation. The game is obviously doing well enough without the financial NEED to do so. So i cant see another reason to attribute the choice. I mean there could be 100 reasons behind the scenes for it but im not aware of any. Just the nature of the way EVE is designed makes purchasing isk so much more of an issue than for say in WoW. And WoW takes huge steps to curtail it.
Just my opinion but I have more faith in the Devs. Where WOW is a corporate behemoth run by suits who do not give a rat's ass about anything except the bottom line I think CCP views EVE as a labor of love. From its inception it was about that and not so much making money.
Do not get me wrong. CCP is a business and they are ultimately there to make a profit and I think they are clear on that but I do not think they are governed by the almighty P&L spreadsheet the way WOW is. They have had a good run as is and look to go awhile yet. I think they would pull the plug before seriously compromising their vision for EVE.
WoW bans gold farmers/sellers and anyone even attempting to do botting or RMTing. Blizzard has been as is known for releasing quality products without fail. To say that the success of WoW as somehow changed that corporation (one of the most respected in the industry) is a bit silly. CCP while do seem to care about the game have allowed Developers to CHEAT. And not be fired. Players to cheat be caught and not get banned. RMTers to not be banned. Do absolutely nothing to botters. And sell isk themselves. How can these be seen as smart choices is beyond me.
|
Lord Oz
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 17:00:00 -
[75]
Stupid long conversation short, CCP maximizes on ways to make revenue for lack of 50 bagillion players like wow has. Its smart and its business. So everyone who doesnt like it cry me a river.
SKILL QUEUE
It's on the "to do" list since, like, forever.
Just do it already, ffs. It's not like it's rocket science... |
Tessai Lsha
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 17:10:00 -
[76]
Any time any of you spend more hours playing EVE Online than some person buying GTCs you are being unfair to him or her. So either in the name of your strong sense of morals and fairness play exactly the same amount of hours as that person or stfu about the unfairness of someone buying ISK for money. Because you're just buying it with your rl time spent on EVE to play for more hours than that person.
|
sheis
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 17:29:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Lord Oz
Stupid long conversation short, CCP maximizes on ways to make revenue for lack of 50 bagillion players like wow has. Its smart and its business. So everyone who doesnt like it cry me a river.
Yes allowing rampant cheating has always gone over well in MMO's especially ones based on pvp.
|
sheis
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 17:30:00 -
[78]
Originally by: Tessai Lsha
Any time any of you spend more hours playing EVE Online than some person buying GTCs you are being unfair to him or her. So either in the name of your strong sense of morals and fairness play exactly the same amount of hours as that person or stfu about the unfairness of someone buying ISK for money. Because you're just buying it with your rl time spent on EVE to play for more hours than that person.
HAHAHAHA do you roleplay a ****** or something?
|
Imperator Jora'h
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 17:36:00 -
[79]
Originally by: sheis
WoW bans gold farmers/sellers and anyone even attempting to do botting or RMTing. Blizzard has been as is known for releasing quality products without fail. To say that the success of WoW as somehow changed that corporation (one of the most respected in the industry) is a bit silly. CCP while do seem to care about the game have allowed Developers to CHEAT. And not be fired. Players to cheat be caught and not get banned. RMTers to not be banned. Do absolutely nothing to botters. And sell isk themselves. How can these be seen as smart choices is beyond me.
World of Warcraft has what...8 MILLION subscribers? It is a whole other ball of wax. Not only can they afford to be hardline they cannot afford to be anything but. Compare stories of customer support from WOW with EVE. The differences are notable. For all people complain CCP is not responsive they are FAR more engaged with their userbase than Blizzard is.
Blizzard was a great game maker back in the day. I grew up on many of their games and loved them. But they have gone all corporate. CCP while doing fine financially (I would guess...they keep expanding) are not in the same league.
Everything else being equal, had I the choice, I would go to work for CCP easily before I would work for Blizzard.
And you think CCP sells ISK themselves? You are really off the deep end on that one. I hope I am just misunderstanding what you are saying.
|
Imperator Jora'h
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 17:38:00 -
[80]
Originally by: sheis
Originally by: Lord Oz
Stupid long conversation short, CCP maximizes on ways to make revenue for lack of 50 bagillion players like wow has. Its smart and its business. So everyone who doesnt like it cry me a river.
Yes allowing rampant cheating has always gone over well in MMO's especially ones based on pvp.
Define "rampant cheating".
|
sheis
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 18:17:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: sheis
WoW bans gold farmers/sellers and anyone even attempting to do botting or RMTing. Blizzard has been as is known for releasing quality products without fail. To say that the success of WoW as somehow changed that corporation (one of the most respected in the industry) is a bit silly. CCP while do seem to care about the game have allowed Developers to CHEAT. And not be fired. Players to cheat be caught and not get banned. RMTers to not be banned. Do absolutely nothing to botters. And sell isk themselves. How can these be seen as smart choices is beyond me.
World of Warcraft has what...8 MILLION subscribers? It is a whole other ball of wax. Not only can they afford to be hardline they cannot afford to be anything but. Compare stories of customer support from WOW with EVE. The differences are notable. For all people complain CCP is not responsive they are FAR more engaged with their userbase than Blizzard is.
Blizzard was a great game maker back in the day. I grew up on many of their games and loved them. But they have gone all corporate. CCP while doing fine financially (I would guess...they keep expanding) are not in the same league.
Everything else being equal, had I the choice, I would go to work for CCP easily before I would work for Blizzard.
And you think CCP sells ISK themselves? You are really off the deep end on that one. I hope I am just misunderstanding what you are saying.
No im saying blizzard enforces their policies and goes out of there way for harmful things like botting/RMT/char selling to occur. CCP a company that most certainly has a far higher ratio of staff to customers does almost nothing to do so. In fact they themselves allow selling isk. They do next to nothing to combat botting/isk selling/char selling. And they have the means to do so far more effectively. CCP is doing very well i assume. constantly expanding,developing a second MMO,merging with white wolf and constant subscription increase. I just dont understand why they are so slack on upholding their own rules. It is most certanly something that has a LARGE impact on the game.
|
sheis
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 18:18:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: sheis
Originally by: Lord Oz
Stupid long conversation short, CCP maximizes on ways to make revenue for lack of 50 bagillion players like wow has. Its smart and its business. So everyone who doesnt like it cry me a river.
Yes allowing rampant cheating has always gone over well in MMO's especially ones based on pvp.
Define "rampant cheating".
Botting/isk selling/isk buying and the devs that play doing naughty things.
|
Imperator Jora'h
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 18:22:00 -
[83]
Originally by: sheis
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Define "rampant cheating".
Botting/isk selling/isk buying and the devs that play doing naughty things.
Ok...that defines cheating.
Define "rampant" in that context.
|
sheis
|
Posted - 2007.11.01 19:33:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: sheis
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Define "rampant cheating".
Botting/isk selling/isk buying and the devs that play doing naughty things.
Ok...that defines cheating.
Define "rampant" in that context.
It being everywhere to a noticeable degree and next to nothing is done about it. nobody is punished nobody gets fired nobody gets banned. It just continues. If you ask someone who hasnt played EVE what they think about the game the cheating and corruption is almost always what they are aware of. That stuff can cripple a game. Dev misconduct and "cheating" is a game killer.
|
WhiteSavage
Gallente
|
Posted - 2007.11.02 08:06:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: WhiteSavage
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
But if you are talking about GTC sales that is a whole different matter and CCP not only allows it THEY ENABLE IT VIA THEIR OWN SERVERS! They actually spent developer time to put a system in place that THEY run to let it happen.
erhm. quote
Huh? Quote of what?
On this webpage go to:
MY ACCOUNT > ACCOUNT SERVICES > SECURELY SELL EVE TIME CODE
That is where CCP, via their own servers, provides a secure means for players to sell EVE Time Codes to other players in exchange for ISK.
lol i was agreeing with you. My point is you're putting your heart and soul into this arguement man... and in the end it doesnt matter because CCP has set it up, is supporting it, has no valid reason to stop and wont and so some guy whining in the corner should not warrant such an a debate! You guys have passed argueing facts but are throwing scare-crows at each other. People are gonna keep doing it! And it helps CCP make moneys so they arent going to stop supporting it! Tada I win.
___________________________________________
Facta Non Verba |
sheis
|
Posted - 2007.11.02 09:59:00 -
[86]
Originally by: WhiteSavage
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
Originally by: WhiteSavage
Originally by: Imperator Jora'h
But if you are talking about GTC sales that is a whole different matter and CCP not only allows it THEY ENABLE IT VIA THEIR OWN SERVERS! They actually spent developer time to put a system in place that THEY run to let it happen.
erhm. quote
Huh? Quote of what?
On this webpage go to:
MY ACCOUNT > ACCOUNT SERVICES > SECURELY SELL EVE TIME CODE
That is where CCP, via their own servers, provides a secure means for players to sell EVE Time Codes to other players in exchange for ISK.
lol i was agreeing with you. My point is you're putting your heart and soul into this arguement man... and in the end it doesnt matter because CCP has set it up, is supporting it, has no valid reason to stop and wont and so some guy whining in the corner should not warrant such an a debate! You guys have passed argueing facts but are throwing scare-crows at each other. People are gonna keep doing it! And it helps CCP make moneys so they arent going to stop supporting it! Tada I win.
Ohh i dunno ccp employees straight up saying GTC to ISK transfers is cheating. And then having that posted on the forums to the response of thousands of players agreeing seems pretty telling they are debating a change. You dont even have to fully stop GTC=isk. Just moderate the amount you can convert. Make it so you can only send or receive one GTC per time period its for. So you transfer one 90 day GTC to someone else. You cant do so again for 90 days. Same with receiving.
And i was thinking about it ccp probably endorses this because of how the character/skill system works. Almost everyone has at least 2 active accounts since having more than one skilled char on an account is a waste. So allow people to pay for game time. But stop the abuse.
|
| |
|
| Pages: 1 2 [3] :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |