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Liang Nuren
The Avalon Foundation
Knights Of Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.10.30 02:54:00 -
[31]
 Originally by: Luke Lor'aul
you know a tech 2 fitted thrasher with quake can do over 1.3k damage per volley, right?
that's equivalent to insta popping two claws, atleast HP wise. sure it's not fast or long range, but hell with tremor you can still do massive damage.
it takes AWU IV though.
destroyers are very advanced ships
Erm. Yes. Quake you say? Ok, let me know how that goes.
That said, I 2v1'd a pair of claws with my auto thrasher and they ran like little girls. ;-)
Liang
--
Retired forum *****. Plz tell me to STFU.
Yarr? |
Dirk Magnum
Red Light Enterprises
Eastern Star Federation
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Posted - 2007.10.30 03:01:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Dirk Magnum on 30/10/2007 03:02:16
Nothing short of a major reduction in signature radius will make T1 destroyers good for something other than salvaging/basic PvE. I mean what can you really say about something with little tank and a giant bullseye for cruiser-class weapons?
Ironically a reduction in signature radius could unbalance them against those very cruisers. Damage output from both destroyers and dictors can be massive, so it could be argued their ease of death is the balance to this.
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Liang Nuren
The Avalon Foundation
Knights Of Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.10.30 03:43:00 -
[33]
Edited by: Liang Nuren on 30/10/2007 03:43:48
Originally by: Dirk Magnum
Edited by: Dirk Magnum on 30/10/2007 03:02:16
Nothing short of a major reduction in signature radius will make T1 destroyers good for something other than salvaging/basic PvE. I mean what can you really say about something with little tank and a giant bullseye for cruiser-class weapons?
Ironically a reduction in signature radius could unbalance them against those very cruisers. Damage output from both destroyers and dictors can be massive, so it could be argued their ease of death is the balance to this.
TBH, they need a small boost to speed and a rather significant reduction in sig radius.
Oh - and lose the stupid ROF penalty... =( =( =(
Liang
Ed: The ROF penalty comment is superfluous and not serious.. and because I have destroyers 5. ;-)
--
Retired forum *****. Plz tell me to STFU.
Yarr? |
Crazy Tasty
Beyond Divinity Inc
Terra Incognita.
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Posted - 2007.10.30 04:01:00 -
[34]
Killed a lot of of t2 frigs in my corm. Best ones are the close range fitted inty/AF or the bomber thinking he'll one volly me.
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Astorothe
Amarr
ANZAC ALLIANCE
Southern Cross Alliance
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Posted - 2007.10.30 04:14:00 -
[35]
I skipped the Dessy hull on my ascension up the ship-ladder. Just didn't find a niche for it back then (several years ago now).
However, they come into their own later on, particularly in PvP engagements and the T2 varities.
Web design, development and hosting solutions for Eve Corps |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
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Posted - 2007.10.30 04:22:00 -
[36]
yea them 75mm rail guns hitting at 6000m/s transversal really sucks and what not... oh wait that wasn't even on a destroyer :D
and the 125mm (on a harpy) putting dictors into run away mode too :D
this makes me want to get a destroyer now 
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Gamer Maximus
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Posted - 2007.10.30 06:03:00 -
[37]
Eh, im flying the Caldari destroyer as a Caldari, and loaded it with 7 tech II railguns/blasters (faction ammo) and a tech II rocket launcher.
Assumming all the guns could get in the same optimal range, theroretical DPS ~= 250-300, while still having some tanking power against most frigates.
I do agree they go obsolete quickly, but fitted right, you can skip cruisers and go stright to BC, without too many problems.
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Bellum Eternus
Gallente
Blood Corsair's
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Posted - 2007.10.30 07:01:00 -
[38]
Originally by: AntonioBanderas
Destroyers are dead end ships. noone will fly them once that heavy dictors get out. Cruisers 5 will simply open too many doors.
so.
Why wouldn't new E-war ships be destroyers instead of frigates?
Not even.
Bellum Eternus
[Vid] L E G E N D A R Y
[Vid] L E G E N D A R Y I I |
JamesTalon
Caldari
Electric Fury Corp
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Posted - 2007.10.30 07:08:00 -
[39]
I have to agree with what others are saying. My alt has a Cormorant fitted with T2 guns, with both faction and T2 ammo, and I can get almost 100km optimals out of I think it was 125mm railguns. I just need to finish the engineering and shield related skills, and then I want to take it into a fight to test it out.
"Return with your shield, or on it." |
Keorythe
Caldari
Terra Rosa Militia
Sev3rance
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Posted - 2007.10.30 07:24:00 -
[40]
T2 fitted you can get awesome range....but the dps shrinks to nothing. You could go t2 blaster and get massive alpha strike...but ROF cuts down on potential dps alot. I don't know what tank people are talking about when they mention destroyers. They get smacked for full damage from small and medium guns due to their sig radius. I dont know what people are talking about beating an AF. The AF resists cancel out alot of that damage and can actually tank something.
Destroyers have slow speed, high sig radius, bad ROF penalty, crappy cpu/grid, and few mid/low slots to add any sort of tank. Heck most frigates have better balanced mids and lows. Unless you go with really small guns you can't even fit out all turret slots nor sustain prolonged fire due to the capacitor drain.
There are several ways to boost destroyers to something worthwhile without making them too uber. Sig radius reduction is one. CPU/grid reduction for small turrets would be another. Extra mid/low slot or capacitor increase are others.
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Phelan Lore
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2007.10.30 07:34:00 -
[41]
I can't really see why they would remove the interdictor level 4 prereq from heavy dictors.
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Demje
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Posted - 2007.10.30 07:55:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Demje on 30/10/2007 07:59:14
I always felt destroyers should be the counter to all frigate sized ships, but theyre nearly as weak as frigates themselves as well as being slower and larger sig radius.
How about each level also reduces signiture radius by 5% and increases speed by 2%. that will give them a little needed boost in speed to be able to chase those frigs around, and make them slightly harder for cruisers to hit. theyre so easy to get killed by cruisers.
or, medium weapons signature resolution could be increased to make them shoot slightly more inaccurately.
I love destroyers its just a shame they're outclassed by their inherent tanking problems against either frigate masses or a cruiser, particularly with a webber.
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Sensemann
eXceed Inc.
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Posted - 2007.10.30 08:20:00 -
[43]
a little love for Destroyers would be nice, but CCP is to eager to implement shiny new T2 stuff...
and small packs of Destroyers are a good protection for Fleets, since they are so underrated by nearl everyone (as mentioned, no one Primaries you  )
only problem is, by the time you fly a Destroyer good, you probably can fly something better and have no isk-Problem
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AntonioBanderas
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Posted - 2007.10.30 09:26:00 -
[44]
Edited by: AntonioBanderas on 30/10/2007 09:27:31
Originally by: Demje
Edited by: Demje on 30/10/2007 07:59:14
I always felt destroyers should be the counter to all frigate sized ships, but theyre nearly as weak as frigates themselves as well as being slower and larger sig radius.
How about each level also reduces signiture radius by 5% and increases speed by 2%. that will give them a little needed boost in speed to be able to chase those frigs around, and make them slightly harder for cruisers to hit. theyre so easy to get killed by cruisers.
this. and additional low or mid slot. that woudl make them actually useful.
A destroyer should be something between a frig and a cruiser, he should eat frigs and be food for cruisers. But at this point theyre useless ships, fun to fly in rather big gangs of experienced pilots just for laughs, but otherwise, they're salvageing beatches. And they have souch a huge potential...
And it's sad, 'cause i love my dessy.
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NateX
Singularity.
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Posted - 2007.10.30 09:31:00 -
[45]
people that love the destroyer playstyle, fly a interdictor imo... maybe its not the reality but its the natural thing to do if you love flying a destroyer but think it lakes' something ;)
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr
Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2007.10.30 09:32:00 -
[46]
Plnety of uses for destroyers, like the old saying goes that i just made up:
"If you fit them, they will own."
Though 1 midslot in the amarr dessy is a bit, iffy
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Reem Fairchild
Minmatar
Republic University
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Posted - 2007.10.30 09:56:00 -
[47]
Don't try to tank them up (not for pvp combat), and don't fly alone, and they are great. Do either or both of the above and you will find them useless. Use them as the fleet ships they're meant to be and use your slots to the fullest, and you won't.
Think of the amount of electronic warfare you can fit on a group of 10 or more destroyers (no Coercers  ). The best defense is when they can't fire at you in the first place.
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AntonioBanderas
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Posted - 2007.10.30 10:06:00 -
[48]
Edited by: AntonioBanderas on 30/10/2007 10:15:08
Edited by: AntonioBanderas on 30/10/2007 10:07:30
Originally by: Reem Fairchild
Think of the amount of electronic warfare you can fit on a group of 10 or more destroyers (no Coercers ). The best defense is when they can't fire at you in the first place.
yes. that. now read my first post.
We'll have to many frigates, EW dessys woudl be so much cooler.
To continue on that idea:
instead of anti tackling intys, make anty tackling dessys. so web range/ECM/damp/tracking disruptor bonus anyone?
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr
Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2007.10.30 11:19:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Reem Fairchild
Think of the amount of electronic warfare you can fit on a group of 10 or more destroyers (no Coercers ). The best defense is when they can't fire at you in the first place.
Exactly! 
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Daan Sai
HAZCON Inc
Knights Of Syndicate
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Posted - 2007.10.30 11:35:00 -
[50]
I love flying my destroyer (Caty) but the destroyer class is just soo easy to pop it has been relegated to be the "Janitor of Eve", cleaning up after the mission mess. Sad for such a fun ship to fly.
The sig radius/HP range they sit in makes them so vulnerable they are just not practical in combat with a range of ships as opposition.
Halve their sig radius and you'd get the super frigate you'd expect them to be. Still stopable, but able to gang up on BSs in actual comat.
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Nian Banks
Minmatar
Berserkers of Aesir
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Posted - 2007.10.30 12:42:00 -
[51]
Originally by: NateX
people that love the destroyer playstyle, fly a interdictor imo... maybe its not the reality but its the natural thing to do if you love flying a destroyer but think it lakes' something ;)
Nope thats an incorrect statement, think of it this way. Interdictors are oversized interceptors that use destroyer hulls. Basically, they have close range weapons with close range weapon bonuses with a fair amount of dps they also go at high speeds and spit out bubbles.
Destroyers on the other hand are slowish, have long range weapons with long range bonuses that have incredible alpha strikes but a reduced dps, they also have little to no ewar.
The nearest comparable ship to a Destroyer is the Battlecruiser, I still believe that destroyer 4 should be part of the skill reqs to get into a battlecruiser. They are a similar concept, lots of highs, using the same modules as the ship class below it.
Anyway off track.
What I would like to suggest is two things.
1: A Tier2 destroyer with the same bonuses as the tier1 battlecruisers, Basically a tank bonus and a weapon bonus.
2: A Tech2 version of the Tier1 destroyer, with the emphasis on long range and the capacity to fit one gang warfare module. They should also have a T2 tank and the ROF bonus should be cancelled out by a 5%/lvl rof bonus with the Tech2 skill.
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AntonioBanderas
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Posted - 2007.10.30 12:59:00 -
[52]
Edited by: AntonioBanderas on 30/10/2007 12:59:21
Originally by: Nian Banks
What I would like to suggest is two things.
1: A Tier2 destroyer with the same bonuses as the tier1 battlecruisers, Basically a tank bonus and a weapon bonus.
2: A Tech2 version of the Tier1 destroyer, with the emphasis on long range and the capacity to fit one gang warfare module. They should also have a T2 tank and the ROF bonus should be cancelled out by a 5%/lvl rof bonus with the Tech2 skill.
Another excellent idea. Make destroyers do for frigs what battlecruisers do for cruisers. !!!
Omg so much good ideas, devs will never ever EVER show up here.
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Valan
Genco
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2007.10.30 13:10:00 -
[53]
Edited by: Valan on 30/10/2007 13:13:12
I had a nice Thrasher set up with T2 280s a jammer, a webber as well as a launcher with defenders for those pesky missile flinging Kestrels.
It screws with small ships within jamming range. If you slip into web range in anything small kiss your arse goodbye. Its like hitting*****roaches with a spade.
What the destroyer needs is a lower sig radius to give them a chance against larger ships.
/start sig
I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game four years' when I know their account has been sold on.
/end sig |
AntonioBanderas
Empirius Enigmus Navy
Dark Matter Coalition
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Posted - 2007.10.30 13:23:00 -
[54]
care to share your setup? I'm really trying to find a viable (and cheap) anti nano setup... And this is supposed to be dessys role...
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Tarminic
Forsaken Resistance
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Posted - 2007.10.30 13:48:00 -
[55]
Originally by: AntonioBanderas
Destroyers are dead end ships. noone will fly them once that heavy dictors get out. Cruisers 5 will simply open too many doors.
so.
Why wouldn't new E-war ships be destroyers instead of frigates?
Something like this?
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Tarminic - 29 Million SP in Forum Warfare
Wrangler on Whining |
Sheriff Jones
Amarr
Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2007.10.30 14:02:00 -
[56]
Don't forget, by fitting 2xnos and 6x small smartbombs, cap booster, cap rechargers etc, even some plating to get the armor up to 2000 or so...you get a really nice boomboom ship
My favorite "small ratting" ship ever.
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Maxpie
Cross Roads
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Posted - 2007.10.30 14:10:00 -
[57]
I love my Thrasher:
High:
5 Small Tractor Beams
3 Salvagers
Mid:
T2 MWD (Swap with 10MN ABII if you must salvage in deadspace)
Cap Rechargers
Low:
Cargo Expanders
And, oh yeah, I tried using destroyers for combat a while ago, found them quite lacking, so yes, destroyers are desperately in need of a little love!
He put... creatures... in our bodies... to control our minds. He made us... say lies... do things. |
Hobo Roughsleeper
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Posted - 2007.10.30 14:23:00 -
[58]
Edited by: Hobo Roughsleeper on 30/10/2007 14:24:53
I Love my Coercer
High 8x dual light beams II
Med sensboost II
Low 3 heatsink II 1 tracking II
Alternative (more dps less tracking)
High 5 med beams II 3 dual light II
Med 1 sensboost II
Low 3 Heatsinks II, 1 cpu
Please do not try to tank or it will become useless.. Shoot inty's until they all left then start shooting primary/Secondary ;)
Make sure u got dmg implant for small energy turrets as well, 3% only 500k or so.
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Nicholas Barker
MASS
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
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Posted - 2007.10.30 14:25:00 -
[59]
i've had a thrasher using artys 3 volley my old 12kms crow, well, he only volley'd me twice and then i ran away in low structure.
they're pretty evil, it was the only ship there, now imagen if one of them is sitting in the middle of a small to medium gang and you don't notice it, kaplowy!
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Joss Sparq
Caldari
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
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Posted - 2007.10.30 15:52:00 -
[60]
The Destroyer still has a place in EVE, I think.
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