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The Last Pattern Clarc Thread Before Trinity.

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Destr0math The Illuminati. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.11.02 20:00:00 - [31] Originally by: Alz Shado Edited by: Alz Shado on 02/11/2007 16:20:23 At the risk of sounding out of touch, I'm gonna go with a big Duhhhh, and a little "finger and thumb in the shape of an L on the forehead" action. We already have environments. Not ones that drastically alter ships, but ones that do change play styles. It's called Security, and by golly they have had effect on play styles. Fly a faction-fitted ratting ship through lowsec? Hells no. Fly a Dreadnaught through high sec? BZZT. Interdictor camp? Not anywhere +.1. Basically what you seem to be saying is that you didn't understand anything that Pattern said. Ships that work in lowsec work in 0.0, highsec, you name it. No, you can't take a Dread into highsec, but no one uses the dreadnoughts as solopwnmobiles in lowsec/0.0 either, and if they try, please, PLEASE tell me, I'll be along to remove it as fast as possible. However, the same ships are effective in lowsec, 0.0 and highsec - the nanoships, the drone ships. It's not like you EVER are like "man, this niche is PERFECT for an Omen! Some ships are just not as good as their competitors in any part of EVE. The t2 cruisers are for the most part balanced out, but looking at ships like the Ferox, which is outperformed by the drake or eagle at any range should make you realize that some ships are just flat out pointless. The eris doesn't have a "niche" except that it's cheap - it's outperformed in every way by all other interdictors due to its complete lack of midslots. Then again, there is the Vagabond, a ship that is widely used for any of your so-called niches to great effect. The introduction of something like a nebula, where all ships acted as if they were under a low-efficiency web could get rid of the ubiquitous nano-gangs, or the presence of electromagnetic radiation where locking ranges were effectively reduced thanks to static, or any number of RP-friendly reasons that aren't simple "this is a PVP arena" would make certain classes of ships - the nano-ship(sup tri), the sniper gang('lo snigg), the EW/recon/cloakfaggot packed gangs all could be easily made to be more or less effective depending on the type of sun, the average particle amount in space, the electromagnetism of the sun....ugh, i have to go, but these environments would make it so that no, nano/hac/csgangs were not the end-all. love ---- Today is CATURDAY
Pattern Clarc Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2007.11.02 23:39:00 - [32] when I return, expect a list of all the different types of enviroments, how they would be implementated and how they would fix pvp in eve! "Now follow this link to enlightenment"
Masempa	Posted - 2007.11.03 04:09:00 - [33] Looks like the CCP gave up on enviroments back in 2005 :(
Mr Friendly That it Should Come to This Derek Knows Us	Posted - 2007.11.03 04:28:00 - [34] Originally by: Pattern Clarc As for the lore, yeah, EvE is one of the few games that needs it. Imagine lucas arts nerfing the light sabre? They just couldn't do it, EvE needs that value on the content within the game - it promotes growthand respect in the community, instead of contempt when groups don't get there way. Star Wars Galaxies drew on the socially embedded lore of the Star Wars movies that had been integrated into common culture over the previous 20+ years. What you're proposing for Eve is extremely burdensome for both Eve's developers and for Eve's non-roleplaying players because there isn't any greater Eve experience shared outside of game. Accordingly, to make your idea have any impact on the common Eve player, the Lore would need to be mandatory to understand and operate your ship effectively. Otherwise, the Lore becomes tertiary to most players (like it is now) but nonetheless wastes a tremendous amount of Dev budget on a small portion of Eve's population. It's hardly fair for the bulk of the players to have their needs have less attention paid to because of Lore-ho's. In my personal opinion as a non-roleplayer, I vomit every time I see some RPer trying to make me care about Lore. It's a game I play to relax, not a way to build a better future... if I wanted to care about the backstory, I'd choose to do so. I don't so I would strongly resent it if I had to care in order to play. I have no problems with Lore being explored both by players and Devs, but spending RL isk (dev time=money) disproportionate to the players that care about it is not the way to go about the game. That said, more content should be made for the RPer, since they have gotten the shaft for quite a while. I doubt it will change the orientation of players and their call for nerfs etc, though. __________________________________________________ Originally by: Rells This place is sewer. Full of people that use internet anonymity to do things that would earn them two knocked out teeth in real life.[/
BUCU	Posted - 2007.11.04 10:51:00 - [35] I think is shoud be reduced to this: if it aint broke ...dont fix it. One of the quickest ways to break something is to fix it when it aint broken. Why make more players unhappy when u can make more people happy by fixing ships/modules that underperform ? Lots of people specialize for one or two ships (and i mean heavy specializatin witch take a lot of time to train...and is take much time to fully specialize for a ship than just be able to fly 10 other ships with mediocre skils) Most ships players tend to specialize for...guess what ... are the so called overpowerd ones ... and now guess why ... because those ships worth flying them. I know that lots of times relatively new players are at disadvantage when fighting an older player fully specialized for the ship he fly... but i dont think this is wrong. A new player have enough time to "see the light" till he have enough basic skils to start specializing on something. So the relatively new players (who usualy dictate the nerfs) that start specialising on bad ships or nor specializing at all will always be at disadvantage when fighting a good older player even specialized on a nerfed ship. That doesent mean that is right to nerf the good ships .... players fly them because are good...players perform better with those ships because are good ships...no fix needed here. No fix needed to "balance" the new players / old players because is a time based training...older player ...better skils. Maybe we shoud be able to relocate our SP when the ships we trained for months/years get nerfed so bad that become useless. It seems that CCP didn`t learned anything all those years. If u broke something people stop using it. If u fix something people start using it. How can u call a ship/module fixed when his price drop from sky high to production price because none use them anymore ?
Samurai XII	Posted - 2007.11.05 02:35:00 - [36] Very nice, very right. Trolls **** off. ______________________ Just another cool alt.
Atama Cardel GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.05 03:29:00 - [37] Originally by: Samurai XII Very nice, very right. Trolls ** off. Originally by:** Samurai XII Considering goons can't even fly the current ships correctly, they shouldn't even be allowed to propose new ships. Oh the irony? Originally by: Odda hey im a gonnie and i like to sue CCP to gett the game to my favor
Stakhanov The Good Fellas	Posted - 2007.11.05 04:56:00 - [38] Agreed on all points with the OP. It would have been a challenge for me to post such things without at least a few veiled flames... CCP should rethink and update the role bonus for a lot of ships and modules. Also adjust older ships when new ships compete with their niche (see : tier 2 BCs , electronic attack frigates) I don't know why speed keeps being nerfed , when there is a prototype of graviton beam ewar module that would be an effective (but not overpowered) counter to speedtanking. Such additions would be better welcomed than dodgy nerfing features like scripts. Originally by: F'nog One does not simply log into Jita.
Reticenti The Antilles Legion Quantum Star Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.06 00:08:00 - [39] Quote: Faceless, undocumented, unscripted, lore-defying nerfing is ruining your game. It isnÆt the balance you try to achieve with your nerfs, itÆs the fashion you do it in. this
Faydelm Caldari Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2007.11.07 07:56:00 - [40] Edited by: Faydelm on 07/11/2007 07:57:39 One of the rare write ups on balancing that's almost inspirational. I agree, the roles of specialized ships are being absorbed by a nerfbat that is neither forward thinking or practical.
MasterDecoy Gallente The Grifters	Posted - 2007.11.08 07:15:00 - [41] Originally by: Faydelm Edited by: Faydelm on 07/11/2007 07:57:39 One of the rare write ups on balancing that's almost inspirational. I agree, the roles of specialized ships are being absorbed by a nerfbat that is neither forward thinking or practical. if anyone remembers, the type of thrusters found on ship would finally have a use (they're gone now, must have missed a patch note). I.E., this type of nebular interferes with ion thrusters and such. that gate in fountain where d2 was raped was an anomaly, a bug, but a damn cool one. more please. it basically boils down to a more varied environment in which to blow each other in. Originally by: Evilempire1 good, im pentitioning you for slandering.
Pattern Clarc Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2007.11.08 23:37:00 - [42] Originally by: Mr Friendly Star Wars Galaxies drew on the socially embedded lore of the Star Wars movies that had been integrated into common culture over the previous 20+ years. What you're proposing for Eve is extremely burdensome for both Eve's developers and for Eve's non-roleplaying players because there isn't any greater Eve experience shared outside of game. Accordingly, to make your idea have any impact on the common Eve player, the Lore would need to be mandatory to understand and operate your ship effectively. Otherwise, the Lore becomes tertiary to most players (like it is now) but nonetheless wastes a tremendous amount of Dev budget on a small portion of Eve's population. It's hardly fair for the bulk of the players to have their needs have less attention paid to because of Lore-ho's. In my personal opinion as a non-roleplayer, I vomit every time I see some RPer trying to make me care about Lore. It's a game I play to relax, not a way to build a better future... if I wanted to care about the backstory, I'd choose to do so. I don't so I would strongly resent it if I had to care in order to play. I have no problems with Lore being explored both by players and Devs, but spending RL isk (dev time=money) disproportionate to the players that care about it is not the way to go about the game. Originally by: fan fest Eve is more than just an mmo today... but eve has now grown out of the boundaries of a simple video game, it's more than 200 thousand people online, it's a real entity, it's a nation that lives in this virtual universe so the idea for renovating eve is not only to make it look good but it is to bring even more crediblity to the game. The game it's self is credible because of what is happening in this universe, the way it works and all the interactions. By having increadible graphics, we all so provide an immersion factor for the exisiting players and all the new players that will join eve now and in the future. Burden? This type of immersion seems to be the drving force behind eve. My comment about the light sabres was not about how the players are bound into following paths or choosing sides, this isnt what this thread is about. This was about immersion, and how that kind of immersion would improve the community. Just because your immersed in the game, it desn't mean your bound to the developers lore, quite the opposite infact - it means that your actions, however slight have real impact on the course of the game. EvE strength more than any other MMO out there is this, however, in relation to technology, the standard in immersion is serverly lacking. "Now follow this link to enlightenment"
Easla	Posted - 2007.11.09 08:13:00 - [43] I agree with your comments on the nerfing and balancing rut these forums and possibly CCP themselves are currently in. The environments thing seems a bit too far out there for various reasons others will not doubt state.
Pattern Clarc Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2007.11.29 09:06:00 - [44] I approve of the recent attitude the CCP has taken in the manor of which patch notes have been writen and daily player news has been published "Now follow this link to enlightenment"

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