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Next best PvE BS after Torp nerf?

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Hephaesteus Gallente	Posted - 2007.11.07 08:47:00 - [31] I know it's not on Tranq yet, but I tried a Kronos for missions and it was just brilliant. I'd say probably the best ship for missions I have ever used.
Carniflex Caldari Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2007.11.07 08:53:00 - [32] Edited by: Carniflex on 07/11/2007 08:53:17 Originally by: Captain Lee Only 2 hours a day huh? Let me guess. You're still living with your parents, it's probably more like 2-4 hours a day, you have no wife or kids, and your social life is nonexistant. Some of us have a real life and can't put 14 hrs/week into a game. I can do maybe 5 hrs on a good week. Being not smart enough to make enough isk is no excuse to run around in forums smaking people. If you know what you are doing then approx 30 mil / h is reasonable from lev 4 missions. Even at low SP levels without faction fitted pwnmobiles. CNR with 'cheap' faction/T2 fit goes for approx 900 mil. Thats approx 30 manhours of 'work' to get one. With 2 hours per day its 15 days. Even if you are doing it with lower efficency (say 15 mil / h thats quite easy to get even for those missionrunners who dont like to think) you can get it in 1 month. In general you asked what will be the best ship for missions after torp change (awesome for pvp, not so for pve). If you don't like the answer you get then .. well .. tough luck. Use something that you belive to be best, but dont come whining into forums when you find out that it's not as fast in missions as some other setup.
Arrak1s	Posted - 2007.11.07 09:14:00 - [33] As a Caldari Pilot who does the odd mission and the odd bit of PvP, I'm chuffed to bits at the new torp changes. Torps suddenly become useful for PvP, agreed the Raven was never going to be a good solo PvP ship but PvE it still pwns as cruise is a better all round system then Torps. Failing that cross train. Ammar perhaps?
vanBuskirk Caldari	Posted - 2007.11.07 12:13:00 - [34] Edited by: vanBuskirk on 07/11/2007 12:13:39 Can I put a word in for the Drake? Set up a Drake with a half-decent tank and some DPS boosting, and it will handle level 4 missions. My setup doesn't include any tech 2 except the (cheap) LSE II and PDS, and I manage. Setup: High: 7x heavy launchers + whatever - I use a collection of looted launchers ranging from Malkuth to the numerical name, and a salvager. Mid: 2x LSE II, 1 named LSE, 2 passive hardeners (mission-dependent) or maybe 2 active hards. Low: PDS II x2, DCU, 2x BCS (II if you can afford it) Rigs: 2x shield purgers, last rig to be either another purger or the one that increases shields. With decent shield skills, you can fall asleep in most missions and still be OK. It will take longer than it might in a BS, possibly, for BS-heavy missions; but most missions have swarms of frigs, cruisers and BCs. I can complete the second Sansha Slaver mission in about 30 minutes in this ship, including looting afterwards. By the way, use the right missiles, or if you're not sure use the ship's bonuses and use Scourge. I have never used a Nightmare (haven't got caldari cruiser V) but I imagine that would be even better; however, it obviously costs more. My drake fully fitted costs about 100 million, even if I bought the launchers - which I didn't. And it is very unlikely that I'll lose it. The real advantage of permatank setups is that if something goes wrong (lagspike or a disconnect are most likely) then you don't lose your ship because of it. ---------------------------------------------- "Violence is the last refuge of the incompetent."
Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.11.07 12:27:00 - [35] Originally by: Hephaesteus I know it's not on Tranq yet, but I tried a Kronos for missions and it was just brilliant. I'd say probably the best ship for missions I have ever used. Better than a CNR? I plan to have both a Kronos and a Paladin for missions. much better DPS than a cruise missile boat, and good damage type coverage with those two ships. ------------------------------------------ What is Oomph? It the sound Amarr players makes when they get kicked in the ribs.
Exlegion Caldari New Light Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.07 14:25:00 - [36] Unless you don't mind aggroing whole rooms or being easy target in low sec I don't recommend you use the Domi to run missions. Use a cruise Raven. It won't be as fast as the torp Raven but it should hold the crown over any other ship/setup out there. One of us equals many of us. Disrespect one of us, you'll see plenty of us. - Guru
Borasao	Posted - 2007.11.07 14:58:00 - [37] Originally by: Captain Lee I guess one could use cruise missiles on a raven. However, that will definitely drop the DPS from the unnerfed torp setups and consequently make the missions considerably longer. Not that much longer since cruise missiles work great (better than torps) on all those smaller-than-BS-class ships... and there are usually lots more of those in missions than there are BSs.
Borasao	Posted - 2007.11.07 15:00:00 - [38] Quote: Can I put a word in for the Drake? A Drake is pretty slow (slower than Cruise Raven) even with good/great skills. However, I usually run missions with two drakes and it's quite fast and either ship can tank... doesn't matter which gets agro. Two Cruise Ravens would probably be faster, even, but I don't want to do that.
Hephaesteus Gallente	Posted - 2007.11.07 15:18:00 - [39] Originally by: Shadowsword Originally by: Hephaesteus Better than a CNR? I plan to have both a Kronos and a Paladin for missions. much better DPS than a cruise missile boat, and good damage type coverage with those two ships. I'd have to say yes it is better than a CNR. Good tank, nice gank it has it all. The best thing is being able to one volley webbed frigs with 425 T2 rails, no more need for drones. I did 2 missions in it A guristas Extravaganza and Worlds Collide, never broke a sweat the whole time, was almost too easy. Yes I won't one Kronos damage 21:46:43 Combat Your 425mm Railgun II perfectly strikes Pith Eradicator, wrecking for 2841.4 damage. Got a feeling these will start to show up in gang pvp for those that can afford them, or rich alliances.
Exlegion Caldari New Light Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.07 15:22:00 - [40] Actually, the Nightmare looks very promising when it comes to running missions. It may be worth running some tests on Sisi. One of us equals many of us. Disrespect one of us, you'll see plenty of us. - Guru
Swirler Shadows of the Dead	Posted - 2007.11.07 15:29:00 - [41] PRICELESS! Originally by: Bardi MecAuldnis Anyone have any spoons I can borrow? If I have to spoon-feed any more players, I'll have to eat my Wheaties with a fork...
Hephaesteus Gallente	Posted - 2007.11.07 15:30:00 - [42] Sisi is one of the least used aspects of the game but prolly one of the most useful.
Odium47	Posted - 2007.11.07 15:39:00 - [43] For God sake people...how much nerfing a caldari needs? Its the slowest in eve universe, it can't tank and keep the enemy engaged the same time, has low dps, it doesn't have instant dmg or great range. It's restricted to kintetic! So you can tank'em very well, easy and with low costs! Have huge signature radius, making them easy to target and hit They don't have drone bonuses... And after all,Raven is used primaryly for missions or ratting! Wtf! What more do you want?! Learn to play the damn game morons!
Jezabel2	Posted - 2007.11.07 16:30:00 - [44] Fastest mission runner there is is the MP abaddon vs sansha :P
Mastin Dragonfly Absolutely No Retreat The Red Skull	Posted - 2007.11.07 16:33:00 - [45] Originally by: Captain Lee One could buy a ton of T2 and faction fittings/ships, but for those of us who just want to play the game occasionally, don't buy ISK, don't have 10's of millions of SP, can't afford billions of ISK for a single mission ship, etc. this idea is useless. You asked for the best PvE ship, not for the best PvE ship affordable by someone with (very) limited skills and isk. Anyway, for a turretboat you may actually look towards the Amarr Abaddon, especially when running missions for amarr/khanid/ammatar agents it's a very good option. The Marauders look promising (some more than others) but it sounds like you won't have the skill/isk to fly one anytime soon.
Perfect Diamond	Posted - 2007.11.07 16:52:00 - [46] Does anyone think that caldari being the kings of pve and pvp is a little much. Well maybe their won't be the kings of pvp but with the trop change, it gives the megathron a run for it's money. Only matters if it can field a good tank after the nerf/buff.
Incantare Caldari Kernel of War Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2007.11.07 17:07:00 - [47] Originally by: Perfect Diamond Does anyone think that caldari being the kings of pve and pvp is a little much. Well maybe their won't be the kings of pvp but with the trop change, it gives the megathron a run for it's money. Only matters if it can field a good tank after the nerf/buff. They just got a big pve nerf with that pvp boost so it evens out. And no they won't be the kings of PvP , that'll still be gal or matar. It's not for one ship that's going to imrpove in performance that's going to completly change how good the race is.
Brodde Dim	Posted - 2007.11.07 17:27:00 - [48] Originally by: Odium47 For God sake people...how much nerfing a caldari needs? Its the slowest in eve universe, it can't tank and keep the enemy engaged the same time, has low dps, it doesn't have instant dmg or great range. It's restricted to kintetic! So you can tank'em very well, easy and with low costs! Have huge signature radius, making them easy to target and hit They don't have drone bonuses... And after all,Raven is used primaryly for missions or ratting! Wtf! What more do you want?! Learn to play the damn game morons! You are correct, caldari pilots are pretty bad. But the caldari ships are great though. And they will be even better after this torpedo boost.
Akyla Bears Inc	Posted - 2007.11.07 18:49:00 - [49] Hmm, I've been considering using the Maelstrom for missions. It has a very nice tank and with falloff rigs (quite cheap) you can increase falloff to 30km. The dps is twice that of a Raven (the same at 30km = 1x falloff). Take care of the smaller ships while they're still closing in and while moving away from them. For the same reason I think the Vargur (Minmatar Marauder) will be good too. 45 km falloff and a lot better tracking... sweet! ________________________________ All your honey are belong to us!
Shandling Minmatar	Posted - 2007.11.07 20:31:00 - [50] Originally by: Odium47 Its the slowest in eve universe Somebody has to be the slowest... and not all their ships are incredibly slow. Originally by: Odium47 it can't tank and keep the enemy engaged the same time Hmm... Gotta disagree. Plus, this isn't a solo PvP game. (Sure, you can, but you won't be as effective as a gang) Originally by: Odium47 has low dps Heh... hehe. Hehehehehehehehe. Originally by: Odium47 it doesn't have instant dmg or great range. Hybrids, anybody? Originally by: Odium47 It's restricted to kintetic! So you can tank'em very well, easy and with low costs! The "king" of missioning (Raven) has 5% bonus to cruise/seige ROF per level and 10% to cruise/torp velocity per level. That doesn't look like a Kinetic restriction to me. Honestly, Missiles have the easiest damage swapping choices. Just because you get +20%-+25% to kinetic on one ship doesn't mean you HAVE to use kinetic all the time. If you're not doing any damage with Kinetic.. try swapping your missiles. Originally by: Odium47 Have huge signature radius, making them easy to target and hit Well, putting five LSE II's on a cruiser sized ship will destroy its radius... Originally by: Odium47 They don't have drone bonuses... Holy crap, neither do Minmatar, or most Amarr ships! That's almost 3/4ths of the game that needs a boost! Originally by: Odium47 And after all,Raven is used primaryly for missions or ratting! With the torp changes, we'll probably see more Ravens in PvP being close-med range damage machines while still fielding a reasonable tank. (Hey, you're not restricted to a shield tank on a Raven, there's no bonus) Originally by: Odium47 Learn to play the damn game morons! I think you answered yourself nicely with this little part.
Baaldor Caldari Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.07 21:08:00 - [51] Originally by: Captain Lee Originally by: Kadoes Khan Quote: One could buy a ton of T2 and faction fittings/ships, but for those of us who just want to play the game occasionally, don't buy ISK, don't have 10's of millions of SP, can't afford billions of ISK for a single mission ship, etc. this idea is useless. Uh, I only have 5m SP, I don't buy ISK and I play maybe 2 hours a day if that... I can easily afford a faction fitted BS, maybe you should take the time to learn how to make money? Only 2 hours a day huh? Let me guess. You're still living with your parents, it's probably more like 2-4 hours a day, you have no wife or kids, and your social life is nonexistant. Some of us have a real life and can't put 14 hrs/week into a game. I can do maybe 5 hrs on a good week. Ok you come here looking for help and now are being a troll. I work my 50 hr work week, have 4 kids and a wife at home 2 kids in college and I have enough time to make a 100 mil or so in a day or two for my pew pew. Hmmm so what does that mean...huh? Dude if you are looking for help you are going about it the wrong way. I use a cruise raven. Always have. I use med t2 drones and rat specific missiles. If its taking you up to 5 minutes to take down on rat BS you have skill issues not ship and nerf issues. If you want help keep you attitude in check. We will gladly help peeps that actually want to learn. You are making it tough. THE PREVIOUS VIEWS AND STATEMENTS DO NOT REPRESENT AND OR SUPPORTED BY THE MANY VOICES IN MY HEAD.
brocksamson316	Posted - 2007.11.07 21:23:00 - [52] Edited by: brocksamson316 on 07/11/2007 21:26:20 Im chuffed for the pvp side of the game folk that like the changes to torps, as a mission runner though im pretty gutted, its so slow to kill bses with cruise even with maxed skills it takes like 6-7 volleys to kill them compared to 3 or 4 with navy torps, i use 2 pwnage painters on my cnr and its really fast at missions, i kill bcs in 1 volley and most cruisers in 1 or 2 max volleys. The thought of going back to cruise is a really depressing one as it is so much slower, those of you who are saying cruise are better than torps do not know what you are talking about, that is such a load of nonsense.
Riho Magnificent Beavers Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2007.11.07 21:25:00 - [53] Originally by: Captain Lee Originally by: Kadoes Khan Quote: One could buy a ton of T2 and faction fittings/ships, but for those of us who just want to play the game occasionally, don't buy ISK, don't have 10's of millions of SP, can't afford billions of ISK for a single mission ship, etc. this idea is useless. Uh, I only have 5m SP, I don't buy ISK and I play maybe 2 hours a day if that... I can easily afford a faction fitted BS, maybe you should take the time to learn how to make money? Only 2 hours a day huh? Let me guess. You're still living with your parents, it's probably more like 2-4 hours a day, you have no wife or kids, and your social life is nonexistant. Some of us have a real life and can't put 14 hrs/week into a game. I can do maybe 5 hrs on a good week. wtf is ur problem... that line ****ed me right off... you ask for ppls help and then start trolling and insulting people. usually its the ones that have no wife, kids, lives whit their mother that throw insults like that. if u cant behave in ur own thread where u asked for help.. dont post again
Garat Mant Minmatar Moons of Pluto	Posted - 2007.11.07 21:28:00 - [54] Originally by: Akyla Hmm, I've been considering using the Maelstrom for missions. It has a very nice tank and with falloff rigs (quite cheap) you can increase falloff to 30km. The dps is twice that of a Raven (the same at 30km = 1x falloff). Take care of the smaller ships while they're still closing in and while moving away from them. For the same reason I think the Vargur (Minmatar Marauder) will be good too. 45 km falloff and a lot better tracking... sweet! I like my Maelstrom. However it's best as a fleet ship; with friends in a level 4, my arty or autocannons chew through BSs. However anything smaller than a BC I can have trouble with, but I can put a shield/armour repper in a high slot to help out friends, and I can have 5 Hammerhead IIs + 5 medium shield/armour bots for additional flexibility. Back on topic: What's the next best PvE BS? Since I'm assuming you are shield/torp/caldari specialized, you could try the scorpion and fit 4 x torp, 2 x medium close range turrets and 2 x NOS, or add a drone control module to extend the range of your 5 hammerhead IIs (if you've got them, which you should). The Rokh looks like it would be similar, and has a shield resist bonus as well. Both BSs fit 4 missile launchers, just look at other ways to fill the rest of the high slots. Or start looking at the T2 mission BS for caldari... You're going to have to change tactics, to be sure, or change the weapon systems you use. What about fitting for speed and using cruises as long range standoff weapons? Have you tried going on Sisi and using your normal torp fit at closer range? The DPS changes could make your life easier, not harder. (plus you'd become a lot more badass at PvP, which like it or not, this game is based around). Just my .02 ISKs worth. -G -- CEO, Moons Of Pluto industrial corporation. Recruiting mature players!
Setana Manoro Gallente Firefly Inc.	Posted - 2007.11.07 21:29:00 - [55] Originally by: Captain Lee Assuming the torpedo nerf will not be altered much (reducing the Raven to useless scrap) which battleship is the best for PvE? A good ship should survive level 4 missions without losing your ship every week/month. This generally requires the following: 1. A snipping setup with a range of 70-80km stand off fire. One needs to snip to avoid death by lag. Once a spawn swarms a lagged/disconnected pilot he usually ends up in a pod. In addition, one needs the extra time to warp out if things get too hot. 2. A good tank that doesn't require cap boosters. A good tank is obvious since level 4 missions put a ton of DPS on a pilot's ship. Cap boosters aren't good since they take too much space to run a full mission with while still having room for ammo and some loot. 3. The need for firepower is obvious. One needs enough firepower to take down other battleships in a reasonable time (1-5 minutes). One needs to be able to reduce an NPC spawn's numbers fast enough to maintain their tank. One needs to be able to kill small EW ships fast too (especially webbers and scramblers). Failing in one of these catagories will result in another podding or, if you're lucky, a very long mission time. Got flamed much till this reply ? Oh yeah, Raven still. Failgeddon wrecks CCP for XXX annoyed customers !
Setana Manoro Gallente Firefly Inc.	Posted - 2007.11.07 21:35:00 - [56] Originally by: Odium47 For God sake people...how much nerfing a caldari needs? Its the slowest in eve universe, it can't tank and keep the enemy engaged the same time, has low dps, it doesn't have instant dmg or great range. It's restricted to kintetic! So you can tank'em very well, easy and with low costs! Have huge signature radius, making them easy to target and hit They don't have drone bonuses... And after all,Raven is used primaryly for missions or ratting! Wtf! What more do you want?! Learn to play the damn game morons! Most of the stuff you wrote is pure A grade bullcrap. Caldari are the slowest and most cumbersome because they don't need to get into range generally, they are always in range. Caldari can actually tank and keep the enemy engaged. Before the torp boost Raven could tank and gank with 900 dps. Now it does the same with 1050 dps but needs to be within 30-45km. Big fracking deal. Has low dps if you don't know how to use it and can't get past passive tanked drakes. Here's a hit, missiles allow to change ammo. Caldari don't have instant damage, but have great range, epic fail here. Caldari is not restricted to kinetic. Only a few of the Caldari ships are restricted to a damage type, most of them aren't. If you want to whine about that, try flying amarr ships in missions and pvp. So what if they have huge signature radious, it plays in the whole "cumbersome and slow" race thing, and if you got that sig with a passive tank, cry me a river. OMG, caldari have no drone bonuses. So what if the 75 m3 bay of the Raven can be converted to about 200 dps. DO THE FRACKING SKILLS THEN WHINE ! Why don't YOU learn to play the game ? Failgeddon wrecks CCP for XXX annoyed customers !
Battleclash	Posted - 2007.11.07 21:43:00 - [57] L4's can be pretty harsh on Bi-polar pilots. I'll also put in Navy Raven that doesn't need to warp out followed up by a salvage destroyer for looting. Originally by: Vladimir Ilych Stupidity is universal.
James Lyrus Lyrus Associates	Posted - 2007.11.07 22:19:00 - [58] Cruise raven. -- Crane needs more grid 249km locking? GMP and TNP
tornpain	Posted - 2007.11.07 22:43:00 - [59] Cruise raven.

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