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Psych0
Gallente
MASS
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
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Posted - 2007.11.06 13:14:00 -
[61]
 Originally by: Ryoji Tanakama
Jeez...
When I started you couldn't get implants. A few people had some and the devs were threatening to remove them entirely because they were overpowered.
We didn't have advanced learning skills.
When this changed it would cost you half a billion isk for a full set of +3s, and you'd need base learning skills at 5 (FIVE) to train the advanced ones. We started with a maximum of about 95,000 SP *if* you knew how to get the most out of character creation and wanted to specialise that way.
You noobs have it REAL EASY with your 800,000 SP, pre-trained learning skills and 100m set of implants. If you really dislike skill training THAT MUCH, then you do have the wrong game perhaps?
Did you start with that much... iirc i started with 5000 sp and 1000 isk, oh and you could actualy get some +3 imps pre castor for like 5-7 mil isk :)
oh good old days or perhaps not ? killing rats with 750-1K isk bounty in my velator when i started
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Acoco Osiris
Gallente
Sublime.
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Posted - 2007.11.06 13:18:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Kimiko Kurosawa
I lol'd at the OP. Since he spent several days whining in the help channel about how he couldn't do PvP until he had T2 drones.
You know... it's funny, but I seem to recall that many very effective ships *cough* Rifter and ECM boats *cough* entirely lack drone bays or don't rely on them.
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One more soldier off to war...
And one Velator in my hangars. |
The Wounded
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Posted - 2007.11.06 13:27:00 -
[63]
Originally by: LuzArius
Man its been 3 months and I"m still a complete noob this sucks. I want to fly a battleship efficiently but I still lack the skills. I have trained my learning skills and even have +3 implants but still training takes soo long.
I wish I could grind skills to finish in a few days instead of waiting a month.
Go play WOW or counterstrike, the only reason this game does not have annoying flame kids is that it takes time to get good.
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Deneb Webb
Gallente
DEATH'S LEGION
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Posted - 2007.11.06 13:28:00 -
[64]
eve is one of those games that are "good things come to those who wait." and in 20 days, i get to fly my astarte very, very effectively. 12/22/05 chracter. off and on due to rl.
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Kastar
Memphis Technologies
Intergalactic Brotherhood
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Posted - 2007.11.06 13:30:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Sharon Mercedes
Originally by: LuzArius
Man its been 3 months and I"m still a complete noob this sucks. I want to fly a battleship efficiently but I still lack the skills. I have trained my learning skills and even have +3 implants but still training takes soo long.
I wish I could grind skills to finish in a few days instead of waiting a month.
That's right murky baller! I must agree with you on skill training, i relly sucks. The consept is good, but i would take 30 yo 40% from the training times away. I want to fly a carrier before the year ends, not after 20 years of playing (20 years because carrier is last thing i train).
Hello, I want to earn millions of $$$ a month. I do however not have the patience and will not go through college nor work hard to get my dreams realized. Instead, I want everything around me made easier so I can get there faster without breaking a sweat or having patience.
Now without sarcasm... patience is a virtue. If anything the queue is tooo short already. It should be hell to get to fly a battleship as it will solve a lot of the problems in Eve. Capitals, even bigger problem, as everyone that wants one has a carrier. That can't honestly be the purpose ?
The bigger ships need to become a rare sight. Cruisers are way more fun in battle too
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Grismar
Gallente
The Establishment
Establishment
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Posted - 2007.11.06 13:35:00 -
[66]
Edited by: Grismar on 06/11/2007 13:37:09
The thing is that EVE -does- give you instant gratification, unlike WoW. It's the other way around to what most people appear to be saying here. In games like WoW you're required to grind a character up to level 70 (is it still 70?) before being in the "end game". In EVE, you're on equal footing with 1000's of players within days of gameplay, without lifting a finger (not counting clicking a few skills, running a tuto and perhaps some missions). There is no real "end game" and whenever an end game appears to emerge, CCP does its best to nip it in the bud (see the upcoming Carrier nerf).
Granted, your options at that point are more limited than those of a seasoned player. But like Reem and others point out: flying a BS is not all that much different from flying a Rifter (or whichever frig has your preference).
Sure, a BS hits harder, can take more hits and costs a hell of a lot more, allowing you to kill other BS on equal footing. But the bottomline is that the gameplay (and required player skills) for flying a frigate are similar to that of flying a BS. And since nobody can grind to increase their skills, you can be pretty sure that characters of similar age have similar odds.
I hardly ever hear the (somewhat valid) complaint that new players don't have as many options as veterans. Whenever people do complain, it's about not having access to the powerful toys in the game. The only real reason the power of the weapon your wielding matters, is the in-game economic damage you can deal with it. Since that's not exactly what the OP was getting at, it just boils down to another (and endlessly repeated) demonstration of ignorance about what makes EVE such a great game...
Greetings,
Grismar.
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Franelika
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Posted - 2007.11.06 13:42:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Kastar
Originally by: Sharon Mercedes
Originally by: LuzArius
Man its been 3 months and I"m still a complete noob this sucks. I want to fly a battleship efficiently but I still lack the skills. I have trained my learning skills and even have +3 implants but still training takes soo long.
I wish I could grind skills to finish in a few days instead of waiting a month.
That's right murky baller! I must agree with you on skill training, i relly sucks. The consept is good, but i would take 30 yo 40% from the training times away. I want to fly a carrier before the year ends, not after 20 years of playing (20 years because carrier is last thing i train).
Hello, I want to earn millions of $$$ a month. I do however not have the patience and will not go through college nor work hard to get my dreams realized. Instead, I want everything around me made easier so I can get there faster without breaking a sweat or having patience.
Now without sarcasm... patience is a virtue. If anything the queue is tooo short already. It should be hell to get to fly a battleship as it will solve a lot of the problems in Eve. Capitals, even bigger problem, as everyone that wants one has a carrier. That can't honestly be the purpose ?
The bigger ships need to become a rare sight. Cruisers are way more fun in battle too
I soooo agree with this me and couple buddies been havin sum gankage fun in 3 firetails last few days.. Ok so the firetail is a faction frig but still is relatively cheap even fitted with all tech II is still cheap can replace it in about 5 mins without crying specially since I can buy the damm bpc's till I'm blue in the face with the amount of LP I have but at anyrate it's a stupid frigate cheap easy and fast heart pounding fun and 3 firetails can cook just about any BS when they work together as a team :)
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Kayna Eelai
Gallente
GNATHIC
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Posted - 2007.11.06 13:42:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Kastar
Hello, I want to earn millions of $$$ a month. I do however not have the patience and will not go through college nor work hard to get my dreams realized. Instead, I want everything around me made easier so I can get there faster without breaking a sweat or having patience.
stupid argument, nothing to do with what is been discussing here
Quote:
Now without sarcasm... patience is a virtue. If anything the queue is tooo short already. It should be hell to get to fly a battleship as it will solve a lot of the problems in Eve. Capitals, even bigger problem, as everyone that wants one has a carrier. That can't honestly be the purpose ?
it IS hell to fly a battleships PROPERLY already. same with capitals. if the games purpose is not to ENTERTAIN players, what is it?
Quote:
The bigger ships need to become a rare sight. Cruisers are way more fun in battle too
speak for yourself. i do not enjoy pvp in cruisers. and why should big ships be rare? so the guys who play since release are invincible?
this is a GAME. a game is supposed to be FUN. i don't see any fun in sitting in the same ship, doing the same stuff over and over while waiting for skills for a nicer ships and nicer items for several month while PAYING ccp.
for example: if i want to risk my battleship in pvp, i better get T2 guns, as the T2 ammo brings great advantages. with +4 implants and all learning and adv learning to 4 and some 5, it takes me 22 days to get large turrets to level5 (prereq for adv large turrets)
22 days for a single ******* skill and you guy say it's normal? you sound to me like those cuba ppl. who is so used to fidel castro they actually LIKE it.
while that 22 days are passing... hm, what could i do? mining? oh yeah thats SOOOO FUN! mission running? yeah, will do that till i have enough money for another pvp ship in case i lose the actual one. but that's it. afk courier missions? manufacturing?
all lame and boring options TBH so what do I (and most of ppl. i know) do? they LOG OFF. hell, there's plenty of ppl. who actually CANCEL ACCOUNT when they have a 2 week skill going on.
the only fun thing in this game is PVP. it's up to every single player to chose in what ship he wants to do that. being master of any ship takes ages... which is OK for me, if there would be something to do in meanwhile.
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The Slayer
Caldari
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2007.11.06 13:42:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Surfin's PlunderBunny
Edited by: Surfin''s PlunderBunny on 06/11/2007 04:43:29
Hehe, I been playing for over a year and I don't have large turrets trained yet... 3 months? Awwww, you poor baby 
Ok ok ok, I use cruise/torps on a Nuet + remote repping Typhoon with T2 drones and 34K armor tank. Yarrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!!!!!!!!! 
I just feel like contributing a little. 4 years and still no large T2 turrets :P
There are ships that I can't fly. There are things I can't do. And i've been playing forever. But this is what makes the game interesting, I don't want to play for 6 months and then be able to do everything.
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Franelika
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Posted - 2007.11.06 13:49:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Kayna Eelai
Originally by: Kastar
Hello, I want to earn millions of $$$ a month. I do however not have the patience and will not go through college nor work hard to get my dreams realized. Instead, I want everything around me made easier so I can get there faster without breaking a sweat or having patience.
stupid argument, nothing to do with what is been discussing here
Quote:
Now without sarcasm... patience is a virtue. If anything the queue is tooo short already. It should be hell to get to fly a battleship as it will solve a lot of the problems in Eve. Capitals, even bigger problem, as everyone that wants one has a carrier. That can't honestly be the purpose ?
it IS hell to fly a battleships PROPERLY already. same with capitals. if the games purpose is not to ENTERTAIN players, what is it?
Quote:
The bigger ships need to become a rare sight. Cruisers are way more fun in battle too
speak for yourself. i do not enjoy pvp in cruisers. and why should big ships be rare? so the guys who play since release are invincible?
this is a GAME. a game is supposed to be FUN. i don't see any fun in sitting in the same ship, doing the same stuff over and over while waiting for skills for a nicer ships and nicer items for several month while PAYING ccp.
for example: if i want to risk my battleship in pvp, i better get T2 guns, as the T2 ammo brings great advantages. with +4 implants and all learning and adv learning to 4 and some 5, it takes me 22 days to get large turrets to level5 (prereq for adv large turrets)
22 days for a single ******* skill and you guy say it's normal? you sound to me like those cuba ppl. who is so used to fidel castro they actually LIKE it.
while that 22 days are passing... hm, what could i do? mining? oh yeah thats SOOOO FUN! mission running? yeah, will do that till i have enough money for another pvp ship in case i lose the actual one. but that's it. afk courier missions? manufacturing?
all lame and boring options TBH so what do I (and most of ppl. i know) do? they LOG OFF. hell, there's plenty of ppl. who actually CANCEL ACCOUNT when they have a 2 week skill going on.
the only fun thing in this game is PVP. it's up to every single player to chose in what ship he wants to do that. being master of any ship takes ages... which is OK for me, if there would be something to do in meanwhile.
ROFL... newb I'm sorry but when a trio of frigates can pop into a system roast a BS and his Alt with zero losses whatsoever on our end of the deal and believe me many lulz were had on ts at the time (was a blast) what in the world makes you think being in a BS makes you uber??? Just makes you a bigger target and ripe for the taking. That BS unless fitted just to take on frigates will dye everytime against a pack of frigs or ceptors without ever doing any real dmg to them and if you did fit the BS for taking on nothing but frigs then I hope a tackle domi drops on your head.
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Kayna Eelai
Gallente
GNATHIC
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Posted - 2007.11.06 13:54:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Franelika
ROFL... newb I'm sorry but when a trio of frigates can pop into a system roast a BS and his Alt with zero losses whatsoever on our end of the deal and believe me many lulz were had on ts at the time (was a blast) what in the world makes you think being in a BS makes you uber??? Just makes you a bigger target and ripe for the taking. That BS unless fitted just to take on frigates will dye everytime against a pack of frigs or ceptors without ever doing any real dmg to them and if you did fit the BS for taking on nothing but frigs then I hope a tackle domi drops on your head.
L2READ. i never said i want to fly a BS because i would be UBER. i want to fly a BS because the type of ship appeals to me. the small moskitos frigatte and cruiser bull is not my type. neither did i say i would fly around alone. i don't know where u get that stupid ideas from.
u enjoy frigattes? good for you. i enjoy battleships.
you say frigattes can kill battleships? ok, fine. if that is so, that the ships are sooo balanced as you say, why am i forced to pick my nose while getting the proper skills for a battleships while you don't huh? maybe we should start to cry "nerf frigattes", huh?
better STFU, willya?
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Cailais
Amarr
W A R
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:00:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Kayna Eelai
Originally by: Franelika
ROFL... newb I'm sorry but when a trio of frigates can pop into a system roast a BS and his Alt with zero losses whatsoever on our end of the deal and believe me many lulz were had on ts at the time (was a blast) what in the world makes you think being in a BS makes you uber??? Just makes you a bigger target and ripe for the taking. That BS unless fitted just to take on frigates will dye everytime against a pack of frigs or ceptors without ever doing any real dmg to them and if you did fit the BS for taking on nothing but frigs then I hope a tackle domi drops on your head.
L2READ. i never said i want to fly a BS because i would be UBER. i want to fly a BS because the type of ship appeals to me. the small moskitos frigatte and cruiser bull is not my type. neither did i say i would fly around alone. i don't know where u get that stupid ideas from.
u enjoy frigattes? good for you. i enjoy battleships.
you say frigattes can kill battleships? ok, fine. if that is so, that the ships are sooo balanced as you say, why am i forced to pick my nose while getting the proper skills for a battleships while you don't huh? maybe we should start to cry "nerf frigattes", huh?
better STFU, willya?
Don't pick your nose, its not a nice habit.
C.
Originally by: Jenny Spitfire
Dehumanisation - griefers are cool and if you are not a griefer, you do not belong here.
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Franelika
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:01:00 -
[73]
Laugh actually I'm
Mini Frig, Cruz and BS 5
Amarr Frig, Cruz and BS 5
Caldari Frig, Cruz at 5 BS at 4
59m SP so yeah I can fly anything fairly well still get my arse handed to many on many occasions but hey there ya go. Trust me being in a BS is fun and all makes you feel strong but after playing this game for so long you have no idea just how much fun you can have in a frigate or cruzer compared to a big old bulky and slow BS. Course I'm not one to talk I just recently had my eyes opened to this fact forever I have been the snipe-o-matic fan ppl hate me at 165km out dunno why I love them send them all kinds of love anyways but blahh they dont ever seem to appreciate it none. Anyways trust me on this you will have more heart pounding fun in a frigate specially in a small group 
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Kayna Eelai
Gallente
GNATHIC
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:02:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Cailais
Don't pick your nose, its not a nice habit.
C.
i know :(
it's becoming a really bad (and ugly) habit since i play eve... u think i could sue CCP for ruining the little social live i had by making me a nose-picking adict? :S
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Kayna Eelai
Gallente
GNATHIC
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:04:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Franelika
Anyways trust me on this you will have more heart pounding fun in a frigate specially in a small group
been there, done that. not my type.
put it this way: u like to drive small fast agile gokarts... i prefer a 18wheeler truck. nothing wrong in that right? ok, then there's no need to spam with me previous arguments again. i hate repeating myself.
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Fantome
Section XIII
Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:10:00 -
[76]
I play Eve since Retail day.. and i still think i'm noob in to much parts of the game and miss to much skills.
Only one advice for the OP : be patient young padawan !
Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed dimensions of 400x120 pixels and filesize of 24000 bytes -Sahwoolo Etoophie ([email protected])
Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum. |
Reem Fairchild
Minmatar
Republic University
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:13:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Kayna Eelai
Originally by: Franelika
ROFL... newb I'm sorry but when a trio of frigates can pop into a system roast a BS and his Alt with zero losses whatsoever on our end of the deal and believe me many lulz were had on ts at the time (was a blast) what in the world makes you think being in a BS makes you uber??? Just makes you a bigger target and ripe for the taking. That BS unless fitted just to take on frigates will dye everytime against a pack of frigs or ceptors without ever doing any real dmg to them and if you did fit the BS for taking on nothing but frigs then I hope a tackle domi drops on your head.
L2READ. i never said i want to fly a BS because i would be UBER. i want to fly a BS because the type of ship appeals to me. the small moskitos frigatte and cruiser bull is not my type. neither did i say i would fly around alone. i don't know where u get that stupid ideas from.
u enjoy frigattes? good for you. i enjoy battleships.
you say frigattes can kill battleships? ok, fine. if that is so, that the ships are sooo balanced as you say, why am i forced to pick my nose while getting the proper skills for a battleships while you don't huh? maybe we should start to cry "nerf frigattes", huh?
better STFU, willya?
If you just want to specialize in battleships, that's fine and as valid as any other career choice. But, most skills that help you fly battleships well also help you fly smaller ships well. So, if you don't think you have enough sp to risk flying battleships, just fly smaller ships until you do.
It's not like it takes that long to get basic competency in them (all tech 2 equipment and all relevant support skills trained to at least 3). It takes a long time to max out all your skills, yes, but you have time if you're going to be playing the game for the long term.
By the way, if battleships is all that appeals to you, what are you going to train once you have all relevant skills for your battleship and its setup maxed out?
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Red Dot'Clicking
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:15:00 -
[78]
Quote:
this isnt WoW. if you want instant gratification, go there.
Wow at the top level is a game of analysis and min/maxing everything you do. You need a degree in maths to understand it. It isnt instant gratification its pounding against a boss for weeks. You are trying different strats, different raid make ups and then parsing the logs to see what can be done different.
You misunderstand that game. Upto 70 the game is about leveling to gain the basic spells. Then its about gear which is just as effective as more ranks of skills. The difference is you cannot get the gear by simply grinding you have to beat encounters to get it and that requires skill and dedication.
Eve you dont need to do anything to go from level 4 to level 5 skill. You get it simply because you subscibe.
Quote:
One of the negatives and positives of this game.. If ya not so active, ya are the same level as the freaks.. On the other hand, ya can never catch someone few years into the game..
That is also a bad thing. If you want to be good at something you should have to practice. To be able to get level 5 in gunnery without ever having fired a gun seems perverse.
Not being able to catch up is also bad. We do not wish to stop noobs joining simply so that the vets can stay top dogs. I have seen other MMO die. The end of eve will consist of battle hardened veterans of 1000 campaigns. Each will sit in a super deathstar in his own system. Alone with nobody to play with. They were so concerned with preserving their advantage they failed to notice new players were not joining. And like the stars going out, they will leave the game one by one until the severs close.
The noobs are the lifeblood of the game. Without them entering the future is set. We need to give them the chance to catch up. When a noob is one shot killed every time he poke his head up he stops playing. Saying you may be able to scratch my armor in a year is not an incentive. He wants to have something to do in game now.
In other mmos a level 10 cannot beat a level 100 but he is not asked to. There isnt the incentive for the level 100 to beat up the level 10 either. The level 10 will fight against other level 10. The level 40 against other level 40. Its like putting the schools big kids into a football game with the small ones.
Eve is the exception in that there is no such play. There is every incentive to pop that t1 frig that come through the gate. You may get some mudules and it relieves the boredom.
Quote:
Also you won't be long in this game when you can actually play a very meaningful role in small gang to fleet ops. The frigate tackle, no tackle no kill, is a great and very challenging role that new pilots can learn the skills for and take even longer to master.
Aye the only way is to specialise. However as a frigate pilot you still take a long time to be good. When you get there you still dont have the means to earn ISK to buy your frigs because you have no skills elsewhere.
Quote:
EVE's skill system is what separates the boys from the men.
EVE is not a game for impatience players looking just for arcade action.
The long schedules for good skills make sense due the complexity of that game.
I always come out in bartle tests as an explorer. What matters to me is not so much the kill as to getting to the kill. What I enjoy is parsing logs and picking apart every little detail of what happens in a fight. Then I like devising solutions and testing them. TBH eve is not even that complex in that respect. A configuring of modules on ships and a selection of ships each taking a role. The first thing I did was read forum posts, then i found the third part sites and read up on the theorycraft. Its popular amonst eve players to consider themselves "thinking mmo players". I find the theorycrafting in eve to be simpler, less detailed, and less mathematical than you find in wow for example
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Kayna Eelai
Gallente
GNATHIC
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:18:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Reem Fairchild
By the way, if battleships is all that appeals to you, what are you going to train once you have all relevant skills for your battleship and its setup maxed out?
probably a remote repping fleet carrier. depends on what CCP really does with them. maybe a dread. and don't even get me started on how long THAT would take. i'll probably cancel account everytime i have 14d + skill learning and play for "real" in 2-3 years... suposing the game still exists.
as said: i like it big and slow. or maybe i stick to the BS and get some industrial skills up, or what do i know... maybe i won't even be playing once i get bored of the BS. why should we make 6 month plans on a freaking game anyways? i don't even plan my RL vacations as hard as i have to plan on this frigging game.
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Kayna Eelai
Gallente
GNATHIC
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:26:00 -
[80]
@Red Dot'Clicking
very well explained. i don't know why most eve players (specially the vets) hate wow so much (when they didn't even play it or have a clue about real endgame) except probably the "kiddie generation"... but why should they bother about those, they are THERE, not HERE.
eve has some game mechanics that are absolutely awesome and also much better than wow (market, manufacturing... also SKILL SYSTEM if it wasn't for the time sink doing nothing we're complaining about here) but somehow poorly executed.
eve gives too much "love" to the vets and is too "scary" for the newbs... thus it will end up dying like you explained.
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Psych0
Gallente
MASS
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:34:00 -
[81]
Edited by: Psych0 on 06/11/2007 14:34:14
Originally by: Red Dot'Clicking
Text
Eve you dont need to do anything to go from level 4 to level 5 skill. You get it simply because you subscibe.
More Text
Acutally you can do it without subscribing  just start it just before youre account need to be renewed and then cancel the renewal and when then wait 30 days(if thats how long the skill takes) reactive youre account and volla you have trained a level while youre account has been inactive
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Kayna Eelai
Gallente
GNATHIC
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:35:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Psych0
Edited by: Psych0 on 06/11/2007 14:34:14
Originally by: Red Dot'Clicking
Text
Eve you dont need to do anything to go from level 4 to level 5 skill. You get it simply because you subscibe.
More Text
Acutally you can do it without subscribing just start it just before youre account need to be renewed and then cancel the renewal and when then wait 30 days(if thats how long the skill takes) reactive youre account and volla you have trained a level while youre account has been inactive
yeah i mentioned that a few times already. however i think CCP is gonna "fix" that.
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Psych0
Gallente
MASS
Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:40:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Kayna Eelai
Originally by: Psych0
Edited by: Psych0 on 06/11/2007 14:34:14
Originally by: Red Dot'Clicking
Text
Eve you dont need to do anything to go from level 4 to level 5 skill. You get it simply because you subscibe.
More Text
Acutally you can do it without subscribing just start it just before youre account need to be renewed and then cancel the renewal and when then wait 30 days(if thats how long the skill takes) reactive youre account and volla you have trained a level while youre account has been inactive
yeah i mentioned that a few times already. however i think CCP is gonna "fix" that.
i hope not  have used it abit myself when i didnt/couldnt play started one of those rank 10+ skills . I guess in some way it would be fair that training stopped when the char went inactive but i hope they wont fix it.
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Reem Fairchild
Minmatar
Republic University
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:48:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Red Dot'Clicking
Eve you dont need to do anything to go from level 4 to level 5 skill. You get it simply because you subscibe.
Which is far better for those who have lives outside of the game.
Quote:
Not being able to catch up is also bad.
You can catch up. First of all, you can specialize. It's possible for anyone to completely max out any relevant skills for a particular ship and become just as good at flying it as any veteran. Secondly, most sp is in that last training to level 5. Training a skill to level 4 gives you 80% of teh total bonus you can get from the skill but only takes a tiny fraction of the total training time to get to 5.
The only skills where it's really worth training to level 5 are skills where it's is a requirement for other important skills or for tech 2 equipment.
Quote:
In other mmos a level 10 cannot beat a level 100 but he is not asked to. There isnt the incentive for the level 100 to beat up the level 10 either. The level 10 will fight against other level 10. The level 40 against other level 40. Its like putting the schools big kids into a football game with the small ones.
Eve is the exception in that there is no such play. There is every incentive to pop that t1 frig that come through the gate. You may get some mudules and it relieves the boredom.
On the other hand, in Eve a group of say 10 relatively new players in tech 1 fitted tech 1 frigates with low sp can (with a little instruction) pop any lone high sp veteran in his tech 2 fitted battleship.
I've never played any other MMORPG than Eve, but from what I've heard the equivalent to that is completely impossible in WoW.
Quote:
The first thing I did was read forum posts,
Mistake.
Quote:
then i found the third part sites and read up on the theorycraft. Its popular amonst eve players to consider themselves "thinking mmo players". I find the theorycrafting in eve to be simpler, less detailed, and less mathematical than you find in wow for example
Then you don't know very much about tactics (especially gang/fleet tactics) in Eve. (And fyi, tactics is not necessarily about math.)
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Lisento Slaven
Amarr
Capitalism Amuck
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:52:00 -
[85]
You know there is stuff to do other than train skills in EVE. Don't know about you bet I spend my time doing stuff in the game and not watching the seconds go by for a skill in my character sheet.
As a prior post shows -> the only thing you gain as time goes on is versatility and the ability to use "t2" stuff (which doesn't take long in my opinion). I have loads of fun flying cheap basic t1 crap all the time. New players just get caught up in thinking they can not compete in EVE unless they fly those big command ships and battleships with complete T2 fits.
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Put in space whales!
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Rogue 2
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:53:00 -
[86]
Edited by: Rogue 2 on 06/11/2007 14:56:01
Originally by: Ilvan
Originally by: Rogue 2
Edited by: Rogue 2 on 06/11/2007 05:32:54
Originally by: Kryttos
if you want instant gratification, go there.
lol. This comment makes me laugh. They're both games.
Yes, but EVE is a game that doesn't provide instant gratification.
You apparently have never raided in WoW. Try to get a full Tier set someday and you'll know WoW isn't instant gratification either. The entire point of an MMO is to NOT give you what you want with anything that could be considered speed. Those MMO's that do, fail...
And FWIW, WoW actually makes you work. In some respects, EVE is far lazier than WoW. A player could easily play the game at the keyboard for a grand total of 2 hours for a year (skill changes and sell GTC's) and be pretty "uber".
So, in the end, I stand by my orginal response: they both games. Suggesting that one is somehow more "mature" in it's play style is laughable. The people may be more mature here, but the play style is merely "different".
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Kayna Eelai
Gallente
GNATHIC
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:55:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Reem Fairchild
I've never played any other MMORPG than Eve, but from what I've heard the equivalent to that is completely impossible in WoW.
not completely impossible.
best example is when 2-3 lvl70 epic noobs come to westfall (an lvl10-18 area) and get pwned by 20 lowbies (with the little help of a few NPC guards maybe)
a low lvl char can still do stuff to a high lvl... but the resistances get pretty high in favour of the higher lvl char, making it pretty hard to get hit when the lvl difference is so high.
however, lowbies can't get attacked by griefers in the lowlvl secure areas (and no, there is no can flipping possible) except if they attack first. and if they do that dumb and newbish error (or go into a high lvl area) at least they don't lose all their stuff due a newb mistake.
TBH, both games have many similarities, but i don't think it's a good idea to compare em all the day. and i'd really like to know what wow players have done to eve players to deserve all this hate... jelous much of a much more succesful and fun game maybe?
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Sheriff Jones
Amarr
Please Enter Password
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Posted - 2007.11.06 14:55:00 -
[88]
Actually, and i've often wondered about writing a serious "lackings of EVE" thread, one aspect is that there is no, besides the isk collection, no real "work" to be done in EVE.
You don't have something you work for, well, there is actually, LP stores, but in a similar fashion.
You could argue that mining for your own ship would count as such activity, but i think EVE could benefit from a some form of, "active advancement".
My opinions represent the opinions of my corporation completely. I'm the CEO damnit. |
Rogue 2
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.11.06 15:00:00 -
[89]
Edited by: Rogue 2 on 06/11/2007 15:10:40
I agree. I just posted above, but I'll reiterate. In a very real sense, EVE is far more simplistic and "easy" than WoW. The player base is where WoW gets its bad name imho. But when compared side-by-side, EVE is laughably easy in some very important aspects.
Originally by: Kastar
Hello, I want to earn millions of $$$ a month. I do however not have the patience and will not go through college nor work hard to get my dreams realized. Instead, I want everything around me made easier so I can get there faster without breaking a sweat or having patience.
Allow me to give you the EVE version of your comment since you seem to be implying that EVE is somehow an example of how this mindset will NOT serve a player well...
"Hello, I want to earn millions of $$$ a month but college is too hard. Wait, you mean I can can just come to class on occasion and tell the professor 'I want to learn Biology to level 3' walk out, play Frisbee with my friends, drink with the ladies, walk back in to class the next day and tell the prof "Biology 4' then walk back out. Wait, you mean I can basically get an entire college education without ever having to study? All I have to is come to class every so often and tell what skill I want next? Sign me up."
EVE = The Matrix. Just plug in an upload your skill set. In fact, I would make the argument that EVE is the only MMO where a player can reach "the top" and have no idea how to do something as simple as leave the station. In a very real sense, EVE is more instant gratification than any game ever developed. You can literally have your cake (a well-prepared MMO toon) and eat it too (enjoy RL). Of course, this isn't bad, but it's crazy for people to suggest that EVE is somehow the ultimate model of a good work ethic.
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Rogue 2
Amarr
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Posted - 2007.11.06 15:10:00 -
[90]
Edited by: Rogue 2 on 06/11/2007 15:11:03
<delete>
(combined with previous post)
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