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Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 19:14:00 - [1] It's been a few weeks now since a more unified effort was created by UCAM members and community figures and some numbers are coming in. Not exactly complete picture, but an idea of what's been happening. I don't have everyone elses, so this is just what I'm seeing. They are as honest as I can represent them- I'm afraid I didn't log it in a fashion that I thought would be represented in any way: Number of farmers and or macro users added to the list: 40-50 Amount of ISK stolen from farmers in terms of loot, salvage, invaded missions: 1.3 billion+ Amount of ISK in damages incurred: Can't determine an exact number. It's high for hisec. We've taken some navy issue ships out recently. Those are what, 600-800 mil a piece? Add in the countless numbers of ravens, mackinaws, and popped haulers, and you've got yourself upwards of 6 billion +. Personal gains: Around 600 million. Personal losses: 1 Raven, 1 Abaddon(rigged), 1 uninsured drake (wtfbbq), 1 Megathron, 2 Hawks, various frigates, haulers and shuttles. Number of probes burned off: ~560 fathom, ~60 Ferret, 200 or so Snoop, and countless racials. Number of missions invaded: Didn't count, but it's usually 3 a night or so. Chinese learned: Lot's of swearing. Spanish taught to Chinese isk farmers: Rough translations of what they are saying to me. I'll keep better track of stats and put them up on the forum in like a month or so So that's what we do--- imagine if we had 100 more people.... Join Macrointel!
Malcanis High4Life SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.20 19:17:00 - [2] Originally by: Snake Doctor It's been a few weeks now since a more unified effort was created by UCAM members and community figures and some numbers are coming in. Not exactly complete picture, but an idea of what's been happening. I don't have everyone elses, so this is just what I'm seeing. They are as honest as I can represent them- I'm afraid I didn't log it in a fashion that I thought would be represented in any way: Number of farmers and or macro users added to the list: 40-50 Amount of ISK stolen from farmers in terms of loot, salvage, invaded missions: 1.3 billion+ Amount of ISK in damages incurred: Can't determine an exact number. It's high for hisec. We've taken some navy issue ships out recently. Those are what, 600-800 mil a piece? Add in the countless numbers of ravens, mackinaws, and popped haulers, and you've got yourself upwards of 6 billion +. Personal gains: Around 600 million. Personal losses: 1 Raven, 1 Abaddon(rigged), 1 uninsured drake (wtfbbq), 1 Megathron, 2 Hawks, various frigates, haulers and shuttles. Number of probes burned off: ~560 fathom, ~60 Ferret, 200 or so Snoop, and countless racials. Number of missions invaded: Didn't count, but it's usually 3 a night or so. Chinese learned: Lot's of swearing. Spanish taught to Chinese isk farmers: Rough translations of what they are saying to me. I'll keep better track of stats and put them up on the forum in like a month or so So that's what we do--- imagine if we had 100 more people.... Nice. Keep up the good work man. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Terail Zoqial	Posted - 2007.11.20 19:37:00 - [3] Nice to hear someones doing the good work. Good job
Ferreus Malukar The X-Trading Company	Posted - 2007.11.20 19:43:00 - [4] I like you. --- This is my main. There are many like it but this one is mine. I must master it as I must master my life. Without me, my main is useless. Without my main I am useless.
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 20:34:00 - [5] /me waits for UCAM guys to update this with their stats. Silent Killa and WCPistolPete kill a lot more farmers than I do... Join Macrointel!
Paulo Damarr	Posted - 2007.11.20 20:39:00 - [6] Now we know the reason behind the increases in mission salvage theft whines.... Cloaks!!
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:01:00 - [7] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Now we know the reason behind the increases in mission salvage theft whines.... Oh, you bet your ass. We don't steal from legits though. Not unless we're bored. Join Macrointel!
Shakuul Caldari O RLY corp YTMND.	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:08:00 - [8] I'm glad you derive pleasure from making it more difficult for people to do their jobs and feed their families.
Paulo Damarr	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:15:00 - [9] Edited by: Paulo Damarr on 20/11/2007 21:19:06 Personally I think you should be investigated by the GMs for harassment as your motives for "griefing" are not for game play reasons and your accusations of "macroing" are not proven, Your making public allegations claiming people are in breech of the EVE EULA and CCPs terms of service with no proof and by repeatedly killing and stealing from players outside of the bounds of reasonable game play as part of your "crusade" is definitely harassment definable as greif play. Cloaks!!
Shadow Joy	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:18:00 - [10] Originally by: Shakuul I'm glad you derive pleasure from making it more difficult for people to do their jobs and feed their families. Do you say the same thing to police officers?
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:19:00 - [11] Originally by: Shakuul I'm glad you derive pleasure from making it more difficult for people to do their jobs and feed their families. I surely do. Join Macrointel!
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:24:00 - [12] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Edited by: Paulo Damarr on 20/11/2007 21:19:06 Personally I think you should be investigated by the GMs for harassment as your motives for "griefing" are not for game play reasons and your accusations of "macroing" are not proven, Your making public allegations claiming people are in breech of the EVE EULA and CCPs terms of service with no proof and by repeatedly killing and stealing from players outside of the bounds of reasonable game play as part of your "crusade" is definitely harassment definable as greif play. Investigate away. We're doing nothing against EULA or TOS. As for verifying someone's a macro or farmer, we have our methods. Nothing in a videogame can be proven, but if there's any doubt, we simply move on to another target. There are certain cues that actual players pick up on that farmers do not. If I flip a can and the owner complains, I either leave or simply don't shoot if they take it back. I invite anyone to come fly with me and my group if they think we're being unfair, and petition us if they think we're breaking any of the rules. Join Macrointel!
Devian 666 Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:25:00 - [13] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Edited by: Paulo Damarr on 20/11/2007 21:19:06 Personally I think you should be investigated by the GMs for harassment as your motives for "griefing" are not for game play reasons and your accusations of "macroing" are not proven, Your making public allegations claiming people are in breech of the EVE EULA and CCPs terms of service with no proof and by repeatedly killing and stealing from players outside of the bounds of reasonable game play as part of your "crusade" is definitely harassment definable as greif play. I think we have identified a Macro Troll. Or someone that shouldn't be playing a pvp game. We almost won. [ 2007.11.17 08:26:19 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your 150mm Railgun II places an excellent hit on Shrike [EVOL]<BOB>(Avatar), inflicting 41.4 damage.
Paulo Damarr	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:34:00 - [14] Originally by: Devian 666 Originally by: Paulo Damarr Edited by: Paulo Damarr on 20/11/2007 21:19:06 Personally I think you should be investigated by the GMs for harassment as your motives for "griefing" are not for game play reasons and your accusations of "macroing" are not proven, Your making public allegations claiming people are in breech of the EVE EULA and CCPs terms of service with no proof and by repeatedly killing and stealing from players outside of the bounds of reasonable game play as part of your "crusade" is definitely harassment definable as greif play. I think we have identified a Macro Troll. Or someone that shouldn't be playing a pvp game. Its nothing to do with pvp and as for me being a macro troll well lol, This guy is making unsubstantiated accusations about what basically amounts to cheating. Using macros is a bannable offense and is a serious breech of CCPs terms of service and is purely a matter for CCPs GMs to deal with. This "Macro Intel" are accusing people with no proof and then following them around disrupting their game play by invading their missions or attempting to flag them by flipping cans. That's harassment, not pvp Cloaks!!
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:45:00 - [15] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Its nothing to do with pvp and as for me being a macro troll well lol, This guy is making unsubstantiated accusations about what basically amounts to cheating. Using macros is a bannable offense and is a serious breech of CCPs terms of service and is purely a matter for CCPs GMs to deal with. This "Macro Intel" are accusing people with no proof and then following them around disrupting their game play by invading their missions or attempting to flag them by flipping cans. That's harassment, not pvp Please join us on an op. "No proof" is a rather uninformed claim. We have lists of people we watch for months before we make any sort of action. Besides-- The only thing it would come close to is hi sec piracy. I invite anyone who would like to come with us to see for themselves or join us ingame in the macrointel channel. Join Macrointel!
Iota Belisarius Ion Corp. Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:46:00 - [16] Originally by: Paulo Damarr ...disrupting their game play by invading their missions or attempting to flag them by flipping cans. Both of which are completely legitimate tactics. However lame you may think they are, it's not illegal. --------------------- Your sig is inappropriate. Please read the forum rules before reposting. -Tirg Sig jacked and nerfed in one day, just my luck.
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:50:00 - [17] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Harassment is a breech of the EULA and TOS, And yes accusing someone of cheating and the following them around causing them problems is harassment. Grief play involves stalking one person repeatedly until they quit the game- While we all wish we were that good at stalking farmers, they just don't quit. The only effective way is to interrupt random groups and surprise them. This amounts to nothing more than hisec piracy, which, as defined by TOS, it totally legal. We have very strict policies about targeting legitimate players and methods of identifying them. Usually, all you have to do is open a chat with someone and ask them. If someone says "no. I'm not a farmer, please don't steal my ****" I'm not going to sit there and tell him he's lying and continue to mess with him. None of the UCAM people are allowed to do that. Again. I'd invite you to come along before throwing out accusations of grief play. Join Macrointel!
Chenoa Gallente	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:51:00 - [18] Originally by: Paulo Damarr This "Macro Intel" are accusing people with no proof and then following them around disrupting their game play by invading their missions or attempting to flag them by flipping cans. That's harassment, not pvp No, it's piracy or griefing, both of which are within the rules. Welcome to EVE.
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:54:00 - [19] Edited by: Snake Doctor on 20/11/2007 21:55:45 Originally by: Paulo Damarr This "Macro Intel" For reference: We wish the proper form of "Macro Intel" as a corporate entity to be "MacroIntel", "MI", or "Those bastards" (even if Goons have it trademarked) . The public chat channel that preceded the corporation is simply "macrointel" and the group as a whole would be "macrointel guys", "UCAM" or "those bastards". Thank you, Snake Dizzle Join Macrointel!
Paulo Damarr	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:56:00 - [20] Originally by: Iota Belisarius Originally by: Paulo Damarr ...disrupting their game play by invading their missions or attempting to flag them by flipping cans. Both of which are completely legitimate tactics. However lame you may think they are, it's not illegal. Thats what the Racketeers do and they do it as part of EVEs gameplay, they steal and kill players and act as High sec street thugs. Claiming people are breaking EVEs EULA and accusing them of cheating whilst carrying out tactics like this to disrupt their gameplay is not legitimate. Originally by: Snake Doctor Besides-- The only thing it would come close to is hi sec piracy. I invite anyone who would like to come with us to see for themselves or join us ingame in the macrointel channel. This is not piracy, piracy is a valid game style where killing and stealing is part of the game. Your making serious allegations and harassing them on that basis. Cloaks!!
Golan Cinquanteneuf	Posted - 2007.11.20 21:59:00 - [21] Originally by: Shakuul I'm glad you derive pleasure from making it more difficult for people to do their jobs and feed their families. Chinese ISK farmers are not an endangered species. Although they should be.
Icarus Starkiller Minmatar	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:01:00 - [22] I fully endorse, condone, and would sponsor these guys if I had an ISK to my name. Keep it up. Keep 'em broke. And guess what, folks, these people could 'grief' (as you say) the same pilot(s) for months on end and you want to know what? THEY WON'T LEAVE! Why won't they? They're macros. They have no sense of loss or pain or anger at being 'griefed' (sic). The primary targets for MI are just bait, left out there purposefully to keep MI busy while their real macro activities take place in some of the biggest game alliances in 0.0 Or single-person/NPC corp twinks in 0.0 cloak-BS. I vote: Remove NPC war immunity. That'll fix the game in about 1 month. - Life is pain...anyone who says differently is selling something.
Devian 666 Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:08:00 - [23] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Stuff. Ignorance is bliss. Funnily enough I go to systems with hundreds of obvious macroers. If the GMs were taking significant action against macros there would be hundreds of macro accounts shut down with great ease. However, I believe GM efforts are dealing with isk sellers and buyers rather than struggling to kill off isk at the source. Ranting some rubbish at us without investigating the problem yourself is just chosing to remain ignorant. If you've put in a petition in relation to this thread then you need a good slapping. We almost won. [ 2007.11.17 08:26:19 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your 150mm Railgun II places an excellent hit on Shrike [EVOL]<BOB>(Avatar), inflicting 41.4 damage.
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:11:00 - [24] Originally by: Icarus Starkiller I vote: Remove NPC war immunity. That'll fix the game in about 1 month. Some of us really like that suggestion, but for the new player experience, it would ruin the game. It opens up some serious holes in the new player experience, as well as actual grief play. Actual grief play is picking on someone. We're not picking on anyone-- Our style of play is to disrupt the flow of isk into the wallets of characters owned by people who share accounts for the purpose of selling isk for real world currency. Please understand that we aren't "MacroGriefers," we're "MacroIntel." We collect intel before we make action and petition suspected farmers. Please tell me what is wrong with this picture: Look Also try to find the article written by Voogru, as we subscribe to many of his philosophies and the tactics he's devised. Join Macrointel!
Paulo Damarr	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:18:00 - [25] Originally by: Devian 666 Originally by: Paulo Damarr Stuff. Ignorance is bliss. Funnily enough I go to systems with hundreds of obvious macroers. If the GMs were taking significant action against macros there would be hundreds of macro accounts shut down with great ease. However, I believe GM efforts are dealing with isk sellers and buyers rather than struggling to kill off isk at the source. Ranting some rubbish at us without investigating the problem yourself is just chosing to remain ignorant. If you've put in a petition in relation to this thread then you need a good slapping. Im not ignorant to the fact that Macro users and ISK farmers are a problem and I agree that it needs dealing with but look at at it this way if CCP or any other MMO provider started a campaign of systematic cycle of unfounded and unproven accusations and acted against large amounts of legitimate players there would be uproar and a PR disaster. MacroIntel are conducting exactly such a campaign without any authority to do, They have no proof that someone is in breech of CCPs EULA but they act on these accusations regardless and bully and harass the players that they deem to be "macroers" Cloaks!!
Devian 666 Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:19:00 - [26] Originally by: Snake Doctor Please tell me what is wrong with this picture: Look It's a bargain I tell you. On a more serious note their has been major inflation in rockets lately. We almost won. [ 2007.11.17 08:26:19 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your 150mm Railgun II places an excellent hit on Shrike [EVOL]<BOB>(Avatar), inflicting 41.4 damage.
Earthan Gallente The Absolutely Amazing Fire Eaters Breidablik	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:21:00 - [27] Originally by: Shakuul I'm glad you derive pleasure from making it more difficult for people to do their jobs and feed their families. Sorry man but for me its liek an argument a policeman shouldnt catch a thief cause the thief got a fammily to feed. Yes its less serious but it still ruins the game for all of us. Good job, tough personally i woudl never spend my little tiem for eve on this , i admire:) - Killing Eve bullies all over the galaxy hunting stories
Devian 666 Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:24:00 - [28] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Originally by: Devian 666 Originally by: Paulo Damarr Stuff. Ignorance is bliss. Funnily enough I go to systems with hundreds of obvious macroers. If the GMs were taking significant action against macros there would be hundreds of macro accounts shut down with great ease. However, I believe GM efforts are dealing with isk sellers and buyers rather than struggling to kill off isk at the source. Ranting some rubbish at us without investigating the problem yourself is just chosing to remain ignorant. If you've put in a petition in relation to this thread then you need a good slapping. Im not ignorant to the fact that Macro users and ISK farmers are a problem and I agree that it needs dealing with but look at at it this way if CCP or any other MMO provider started a campaign of systematic cycle of unfounded and unproven accusations and acted against large amounts of legitimate players there would be uproar and a PR disaster. MacroIntel are conducting exactly such a campaign without any authority to do, They have no proof that someone is in breech of CCPs EULA but they act on these accusations regardless and bully and harass the players that they deem to be "macroers" You have confirmed my theory. You claim that MacroIntel have no authority to attack macroers. Eve is a pvp game and they can attack anyone that they believe, on reasonable grounds, to be a macroer. Myself and many of the pilots I fly with do not operate under such guidelines. We will gun down any pod pilot we see fit to attack. Stick that in your grief play pipe. We almost won. [ 2007.11.17 08:26:19 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your 150mm Railgun II places an excellent hit on Shrike [EVOL]<BOB>(Avatar), inflicting 41.4 damage.
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:24:00 - [29] Edited by: Snake Doctor on 20/11/2007 22:25:41 Originally by: Paulo Damarr ...PR disaster. MacroIntel are conducting exactly such a campaign without any authority to do, They have no proof that someone is in breech of CCPs EULA but they act on these accusations regardless and bully and harass the players that they deem to be "macroers" 1. Not really. It's a game. No one takes it that seriously after a week or so. 2. This point is already moot - I've given you the tools you need to see for yourself. I've invited you 3 or 4, maybe 5 times to come on an op and or sit in the channel. You just keep making the accusation even after I've given you an alternative. This simply says you're not willing to listen to another point of view. I could very well, at this point, make the accusation that you're trolling/trying to start a flame war, but you won't get one out of me. Again, we know how you feel- I invite you or anyone else to see me ingame, join an op, join the macrointel channel, the kill macros mailing list, check out the macrointel killboards, UCAM killboards, watch Silent Killa's videos, or anything else we can offer you to change your mind. This isn't closed source. It's not a secret of any kind. Please remember instead that we're here to demonstrate that the players won't accept non-players farming our game. If they were to all leave tomorrow, I'd simply find something else to do. Edit: Cleaned a quote tag. Join Macrointel!
Paulo Damarr	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:31:00 - [30] Originally by: Devian 666 You have confirmed my theory. You claim that MacroIntel have no authority to attack macroers. Eve is a pvp game and they can attack anyone that they believe, on reasonable grounds, to be a macroer. Myself and many of the pilots I fly with do not operate under such guidelines. We will gun down any pod pilot we see fit to attack. Stick that in your grief play pipe. So a Player is within his rights as a EVE player to conduct acts of harassment in game in an attempt to enforce CCPs EULA? If someone started a Corp "account sharing Intel" and flew around accusing people off sharing accounts with no proof and killed them and followed them around and posting accusations would this be considered acceptable? Cloaks!!
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:36:00 - [31] Originally by: Mazupty Interesting to see Makinaws mentionned. Got me wondering what % of the ice is mined by actual players, because let's face it: it's probably the most drudging carrer of EvE. As a side effect, if (extremely unlikely) you were able to drive away those macro miners, how many alliances would collapse from lack of fuel to maintain their (over) extended sovereignty? Maybe you should be more careful as you are indirectly declaring war on all the mega alliances Actually, I see many, many real players mining Ice. That's the good news. The bad news is that there are alliances that are supported either directly (you know who you are) or indirectly by ice macros and isk farmers. We perfectly understand how this chain works. While we hope to have the luxury of being a non-political entity, we understand the risk involved. We'd love to go out to 0.0 and help kill the farmers, but it's really hard to be effective when every roving gang coming through the system wants to send you 50 jumps in the other direction. Look- If you want to start a war with me because you lost your sov because your fleet of macros can't operate anymore or you can't spend $$ to buy ISK, go right ahead. If I'm your biggest concern once you've lost sov due to an ice shortage, I'm beyond flattered. Join Macrointel!
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:39:00 - [32] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Originally by: Devian 666 You have confirmed my theory. You claim that MacroIntel have no authority to attack macroers. Eve is a pvp game and they can attack anyone that they believe, on reasonable grounds, to be a macroer. Myself and many of the pilots I fly with do not operate under such guidelines. We will gun down any pod pilot we see fit to attack. Stick that in your grief play pipe. So a Player is within his rights as a EVE player to conduct acts of harassment in game in an attempt to enforce CCPs EULA? If someone started a Corp "account sharing Intel" and flew around accusing people off sharing accounts with no proof and killed them and followed them around and posting accusations would this be considered acceptable? As long as they didn't use cheats to identify such players, yes. While account sharing isn't the biggest item on the list, lots of farmers are guilty of it as well. You keep mentioning "what's acceptable" and likening it to some moral equivalent in real life, but EVE doesn't work that way. Join Macrointel!
Paulo Damarr	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:46:00 - [33] Originally by: Snake Doctor As long as they didn't use cheats to identify such players, yes. While account sharing isn't the biggest item on the list, lots of farmers are guilty of it as well. You keep mentioning "what's acceptable" and likening it to some moral equivalent in real life, but EVE doesn't work that way. Ok dude its nothing personal I just think your out of order and carrying out a witch hunt and im sure in the witch finder generals time the people strapping old ladys to a burning stake thought themselves justified to. What your doing is vigilantism at best, Dress it all down and its simple you are accusing people of a bannable offense and then acting on those accusations. Its the GM teams role to punish people in breech of the EULA and not yours. Cloaks!!
Iota Belisarius Ion Corp. Hydra Alliance	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:48:00 - [34] Edited by: Iota Belisarius on 20/11/2007 22:51:42 CCP gives all players to kill whoever they want for whatever reason. Enforcing the EULA is not illegal as long as MacroIntel does not falsify character information or impersonate a GM or CCP employee. --------------------- Your sig is inappropriate. Please read the forum rules before reposting. -Tirg Sig jacked and nerfed in one day, just my luck.
Mazupty	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:49:00 - [35] Originally by: Snake Doctor Actually, I see many, many real players mining Ice. That's the good news. It is indeed nice to read. Sorry for the misconception, I haven't gone to an ice belt in over a year. It was quite bad then and I didn't see any reason for the situation to improve.
Devian 666 Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.20 22:52:00 - [36] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Originally by: Devian 666 You have confirmed my theory. You claim that MacroIntel have no authority to attack macroers. Eve is a pvp game and they can attack anyone that they believe, on reasonable grounds, to be a macroer. Myself and many of the pilots I fly with do not operate under such guidelines. We will gun down any pod pilot we see fit to attack. Stick that in your grief play pipe. So a Player is within his rights as a EVE player to conduct acts of harassment in game in an attempt to enforce CCPs EULA? If someone started a Corp "account sharing Intel" and flew around accusing people off sharing accounts with no proof and killed them and followed them around and posting accusations would this be considered acceptable? You don't get it. I don't try to enforce the EULA I just shoot down pilots. I like your idea for "account sharing intel" as it provides an excuse to shoot anyone. My previous corp Sectoid Technolgies was used to war dec arrogant carebears who ranted on the forums or who generally made idiots of themselves like Savvon or Mtber Trading's Zonda ***e. You seem to have an issue thinking that pvp in in pvp game is harrassment or grief play. If you have a problem with pvp existing in eve you can sign up for the Hello Kitty Beta. We almost won. [ 2007.11.17 08:26:19 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your 150mm Railgun II places an excellent hit on Shrike [EVOL]<BOB>(Avatar), inflicting 41.4 damage.
Paulo Damarr	Posted - 2007.11.20 23:06:00 - [37] Originally by: Devian 666 You don't get it. I don't try to enforce the EULA I just shoot down pilots. I like your idea for "account sharing intel" as it provides an excuse to shoot anyone. My previous corp Sectoid Technolgies was used to war dec arrogant carebears who ranted on the forums or who generally made idiots of themselves like Savvon or Mtber Trading's Zonda ***e. You seem to have an issue thinking that pvp in in pvp game is harrassment or grief play. If you have a problem with pvp existing in eve you can sign up for the Hello Kitty Beta. Your the one not getting it, All your doing now is chest thumping and saying "Me PvPer you carebear, you go to Hello kitty now!!" your posts are usually more intelligent than that. The issue is not PvP or the reasons for it the issue is about unfounded accusations vigilantism and people carrying out fumbling attempts to enforce the EULA when they have no rights to do so. I dont have a problem with PvP at all never have and never will, what I do have a problem with is how a group of players can claim themselves to be some sort of unofficial EULA police and make accusations and bullying and harassing players over those accusations. Cloaks!!
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 23:07:00 - [38] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Originally by: Snake Doctor As long as they didn't use cheats to identify such players, yes. While account sharing isn't the biggest item on the list, lots of farmers are guilty of it as well. You keep mentioning "what's acceptable" and likening it to some moral equivalent in real life, but EVE doesn't work that way. Ok dude its nothing personal I just think your out of order and carrying out a witch hunt and im sure in the witch finder generals time the people strapping old ladys to a burning stake thought themselves justified to. What your doing is vigilantism at best, Dress it all down and its simple you are accusing people of a bannable offense and then acting on those accusations. Its the GM teams role to punish people in breech of the EULA and not yours. Again, this is not some misdirected witch hunt, as you put it. It takes months to make an accusation. You're right. It's the GM's role to punish those in breach of Eula, not us. I don't think GM's do anything in the breech, but I'd love to see them stick a farmer into the breech of a 1400mm. It is vigilantism. It is. You know what? CCP loves vigilantes. It was and is advertised as a career path, and it's not against the rules. Please, if you're unwilling to see things from another point of view, stop dragging down a thread that was supposed to be aimed at the positives. I don't want to repost something that's been locked because it became quickly nonconstructive. Please stay objective instead of wildly throwing out "what is and is not appropriate" according to your personal beliefs or play style. Join Macrointel!
An Anarchyyt Gallente Sublime.	Posted - 2007.11.20 23:08:00 - [39] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Originally by: Devian 666 You don't get it. I don't try to enforce the EULA I just shoot down pilots. I like your idea for "account sharing intel" as it provides an excuse to shoot anyone. My previous corp Sectoid Technolgies was used to war dec arrogant carebears who ranted on the forums or who generally made idiots of themselves like Savvon or Mtber Trading's Zonda *e. You seem to have an issue thinking that pvp in in pvp game is harrassment or grief play. If you have a problem with pvp existing in eve you can sign up for the Hello Kitty Beta. Your the one not getting it, All your doing now is chest thumping and saying "Me PvPer you carebear, you go to Hello kitty now!!" your posts are usually more intelligent than that. The issue is not PvP or the reasons for it the issue is about unfounded accusations vigilantism and people carrying out fumbling attempts to enforce the EULA when they have no rights to do so. I dont have a problem with PvP at all never have and never will, what I do have a problem with is how a group of players can claim themselves to be some sort of unofficial EULA police and make accusations and bullying and harassing players over those accusations. Does that mean you get to police the police? Or are the vigilante of the vigilantes? Originally by:** CCP Wrangler Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
Kazuo Ishiguro House of Marbles Zzz	Posted - 2007.11.20 23:12:00 - [40] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Ok dude its nothing personal I just think your out of order and carrying out a witch hunt and im sure in the witch finder generals time the people strapping old ladys to a burning stake thought themselves justified to. What your doing is vigilantism at best, Dress it all down and its simple you are accusing people of a bannable offense and then acting on those accusations. Its the GM teams role to punish people in breech of the EULA and not yours. Snake Doctor & co. are going after suspected macro users & farmers, and you say it's not their job. But who said it was your job to denounce people you perceive as causing harassment? Also, if you'd rather leave things to the GMs, consider this. Real farmers & macro users are highly unlikely to petition macrointel for harassment - even if they were successful, there's a good chance that they'd be banned as well on the strength of evidence collected by macrointel (especially contracts, which can easily be verified independently by CCP). A non-farmer/macro user, on the other hand, would probably petition and see justice done. I've heard of people using this vulnerability to their advantage by paying gullible farmers to join shell corps in 0.0 alliances. They then raise the corp tax to punitive levels and trap the farmers by repeatedly giving them roles My research services Spreadsheets: Top speed calculation - Halo Implant stats
Paulo Damarr	Posted - 2007.11.20 23:14:00 - [41] Originally by: Snake Doctor It is vigilantism. It is. You know what? CCP loves vigilantes. It was and is advertised as a career path, and it's not against the rules. Really? I missed the bit where it advertises EVE saying "Join the worlds largest single server and fastest growing community of Unofficial and illegitimate EULA police" Cloaks!!
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 23:20:00 - [42] Originally by: Paulo Damarr The issue is not PvP or the reasons for it the issue is about unfounded accusations vigilantism and people carrying out fumbling attempts to enforce the EULA when they have no rights to do so. This is not the issue and never has been. You've no grounds to claim that we make unfounded accusations. I don't recall ever xing you into a gang or including you in a petition. I would make my petitions and notes available, but the former is against TOS and the latter would expose certain tactics that the "bad guys" haven't identified yet. I'm really stuck between a rock and a hard place with this matter- I can't prove to you that we make unfounded claims, but you won't come with us to see for yourself. I don't think you want to believe that there is a months-long process involved in this. Much of my time is spent doing "boring administrative tasks" (as I said in another thread somewhere). These tasks include keeping up on intel and distilling the information I have. It's very time consuming and almost like a second job- but for some reason, I mostly enjoy it. Even if we were to simply start stealing from anyone, any time, that too would be within terms of service. You don't have to throw out your moral compass to play eve, but you should note that the ethical direction on said compass points a different way in New Eden. I'd suggest reading The Science of Good and Evil, (Michael Shermer) and The art of war (Sun Tzu and Machiavelli versions) for further insight. Join Macrointel!
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 23:32:00 - [43] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Really? I missed the bit where it advertises EVE saying "Join the worlds largest single server and fastest growing community of Unofficial and illegitimate EULA police" That's not in CCP's ad, it's in MacroIntel's. I was referring to the open ended game play eve provides. Also; I know I'm windy, but please read the entire response before posting. (only gold so most people notice this. I don't like breaking up responses with quotes) Quote: Its not my Job and If i started a Corporation and carried out a campaign of in game harassment and posting accusations I would expect to be dealt with myself. If you chose to do that, no one would petition you for it, because it's a valid play style. Please keep posts constructive in one way or another. Originally by: Paulo Damarr Join the worlds largest single server and fastest grow
Paulo Damarr	Posted - 2007.11.20 23:34:00 - [44] Originally by: Snake Doctor This is not the issue and never has been. You've no grounds to claim that we make unfounded accusations. I would make my petitions and notes available, I can't prove to you that we make unfounded claims, but you won't come with us to see for yourself. I don't think you want to believe that there is a months-long process involved in this Until you can prove your claims they are unfounded and about evidence and "notes" I could sit and write a bunch of notes about almost anything and tout them as proof so your inability to produce them is no great loss. And finally your corp is only around a month old so how has this been a process of "months" you are claiming billions worth of damage 600 mill profits and you did this while gathering Intel in around 4 weeks in a corp with 7 members? Cloaks!!
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.20 23:46:00 - [45] Edited by: Snake Doctor on 20/11/2007 23:50:53 Originally by: Paulo Damarr Until you can prove your claims they are unfounded and about evidence and "notes" I could sit and write a bunch of notes about almost anything and tout them as proof so your inability to produce them is no great loss. And finally your corp is only around a month old so how has this been a process of "months" you are claiming billions worth of damage 600 mill profits and you did this while gathering Intel in around 4 weeks in a corp with 7 members? Don't back peddle I accused you of being a "Unoffical EULA police Vigilante" and you said CCP advertised it is a profession. Again, please keep posts constructive-- I no longer feel the need to prove anything to you; I've invited you along on an op and you didn't even respond. You're the one denying any proof being presented by turning a blind eye to it. You can't just say "I wasn't looking! Doesn't count!" MacroIntel is an organized effort that came about as a need to be in line with mechanics of warfare. While the corp has been active about a month and only has 7 members, macrointel (the channel and "support group" if you will) has been around a long time. I've been hunting macros a lot longer than 1 month and there are many, many more than 7 people who help. I'm sure anyone in macrointel at any time would clear that up. While your wording isn't what CCP says exactly, they've always advertised that vigilantism is a valid play style. Originally by:* Paulo Damarr Join the worlds largest single server and fastest growing community of Unofficial and illegitimate EULA police! Join Macrointel!
Devian 666 Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.11.20 23:47:00 - [46] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Your the one not getting it, All your doing now is chest thumping and saying "Me PvPer you carebear, you go to Hello kitty now!!" your posts are usually more intelligent than that. The issue is not PvP or the reasons for it the issue is about unfounded accusations vigilantism and people carrying out fumbling attempts to enforce the EULA when they have no rights to do so. I dont have a problem with PvP at all never have and never will, what I do have a problem with is how a group of players can claim themselves to be some sort of unofficial EULA police and make accusations and bullying and harassing players over those accusations. Player enforcement is encouraged. Look at the outlaw system players are encouraged to attack flashy red pilots to help enforce the in-game "law". If these suspected macroers feel like they have been bullied or harassed then they can put in a petition. If MacroIntel are killing off so many genuine players then surely they would have been petitioned successfully for their activities. If you have such a big compliant about MacroIntel then start Anti-MacroIntel and enforce it yourself as moaning on the forums won't get you anywhere. Hello Kitty Online beta test is still an option for you. We almost won. [ 2007.11.17 08:26:19 ] (combat) <color=0xffbbbb00>Your 150mm Railgun II places an excellent hit on Shrike [EVOL]<BOB>(Avatar), inflicting 41.4 damage.
Rooker Lysian Enterprises	Posted - 2007.11.21 00:36:00 - [47] Looks like we've found one of karlemagne's alts... Who cares about the reasoning behind it? CCP has designed this game so that it encourages and aids those want to cause grief to others, then conveniently redefines the word "grief" to suit their license. If they didn't want mining barges to explode in suicide attacks, weapons would not fire in high sec. If they didn't want salvage to be stolen out from under a mission runner's nose, probes wouldn't work at all for objects in deadspace. If they didn't want ore to be stolen, no one but the owner would be able to remove something from a jetcan. This sort of economic disruption is exactly what they intended for people to do. We just choose not to direct our attention to people who seem to be following the rules. Somebody with a name instead of a random string of keyboard mashing, in a real corporation and who have actually named their ship are left alone. gagkkeasd, in School of Applied Knowledge, flying gagkkeasd's Raven, on the other hand... Well, he's gonna have a bad day. -- Let Us Avoid Systems Via Autopilot
JForce The Arrow Project Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:00:00 - [48] You guys do a great job, and I'm sure for your pilots the satisfaction of a job well done is a wonderful feeling. You have managed to find a reason to PvP without the issue of engaging in POS-wars, something many players dream of. I salute you and look forward to more reports of your successes
WCPistolPete Gallente MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:06:00 - [49] Originally by: Rooker gagkkeasd, in School of Applied Knowledge, flying gagkkeasd's Raven, on the other hand... Well, he's gonna have a bad day. He's not the only one, though. /me adds Paulo Damarr to his -10 list WCPistolPete
VicturusTeSaluto	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:06:00 - [50] Edited by: VicturusTeSaluto on 21/11/2007 01:06:41 Originally by: Paulo Damarr Edited by: Paulo Damarr on 20/11/2007 21:19:06 Personally I think you should be investigated by the GMs for harassment as your motives for "griefing" are not for game play reasons and your accusations of "macroing" are not proven, Your making public allegations claiming people are in breech of the EVE EULA and CCPs terms of service with no proof and by repeatedly killing and stealing from players outside of the bounds of reasonable game play as part of your "crusade" is definitely harassment definable as greif play. God damn! You are truly as dumb as a brick. Chinese macro'ers are unmistakable. Let's see, they use nonsense names, they are on 23/7, 7 days a week and oh... THEY SPEAK CHINESE! How dumb can one be? Also, how much isk have you brought from the Chinese this week? Hope it is enough to compensate.
Shalia Ripper Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:09:00 - [51] Paulo kills me. In EVE, it is acceptable to camp a gate and kill everything that goes through it. It is acceptable for pirate gangs in low sec to attack mission runners. It is acceptable for group A to attack group B for any reason at all. But when a corp choses macroers as a target it is griefing? What a joke. I approve of what Macrointel is doing and support them fully. Hey Snake, looking for recruits?
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:13:00 - [52] Originally by: VicturusTeSaluto Edited by: VicturusTeSaluto on 21/11/2007 01:06:41 Originally by: Paulo Damarr Edited by: Paulo Damarr on 20/11/2007 21:19:06 Personally I think you should be investigated by the GMs for harassment as your motives for "griefing" are not for game play reasons and your accusations of "macroing" are not proven, Your making public allegations claiming people are in breech of the EVE EULA and CCPs terms of service with no proof and by repeatedly killing and stealing from players outside of the bounds of reasonable game play as part of your "crusade" is definitely harassment definable as greif play. God damn! You are truly as dumb as a brick. Chinese macro'ers are unmistakable. Let's see, they use nonsense names, they are on 23/7, 7 days a week and oh... THEY SPEAK CHINESE! How dumb can one be? Also, how much isk have you brought from the Chinese this week? Hope it is enough to compensate. Vic, while I appreciate your support and understanding, please refrain from attacking Paulo. Even if he may be wrong in his thought process, it's unfair to call him dumb Please be constructive Originally by: Paulo Damarr Join the worlds largest single server and fastest growing community of Unofficial and illegitimate EULA police! Join Macrointel!
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:14:00 - [53] Originally by: Shalia Ripper Hey Snake, looking for recruits? Always- Office at the Wiyrkomi Station in Oichiya. It's a busy place for farmers. Originally by: Paulo Damarr Join the worlds largest single server and fastest growing community of Unofficial and illegitimate EULA police! Join Macrointel!
Lithalnas Amarr Headcrabs	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:14:00 - [54] Paulo Damarr: POST WITH YOUR MAIN, if you feel so strongly about it, come out and say it with your MAIN. (COAD rules for this thread plz) Well that made me feel better, as a resurrected macro intel member all i have to say is that usually if we find a Raven with a corp (not one named ljyffj) we usually leave it alone, If we ask something in local and get a response we usually leave them alone (F%^* YOU is not a valid response). If they fly the farmer quartet 2 ravens, domi with remote reps and Armageddon to take agro or salvage. And our efforts are effecting isk sales, with such public threads like this one, we can preventing people from crossing the line and purchaseing isk. IF you really REALLY have a problem with what we are doing please, wardec me. -Lithalnas - Head Headcrab - [CRABS] ------------- fixed for greater eve content
Shalia Ripper Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:17:00 - [55] Originally by: Snake Doctor Originally by: Shalia Ripper Hey Snake, looking for recruits? Always- Office at the Wiyrkomi Station in Oichiya. It's a busy place for farmers. After my new build is done (UPGRADE TIME!), I will look you folks up.
VicturusTeSaluto	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:19:00 - [56] Edited by: VicturusTeSaluto on 21/11/2007 01:19:43 Originally by: Snake Doctor Originally by: VicturusTeSaluto Edited by: VicturusTeSaluto on 21/11/2007 01:06:41 Originally by: Paulo Damarr Edited by: Paulo Damarr on 20/11/2007 21:19:06 Personally I think you should be investigated by the GMs for harassment as your motives for "griefing" are not for game play reasons and your accusations of "macroing" are not proven, Your making public allegations claiming people are in breech of the EVE EULA and CCPs terms of service with no proof and by repeatedly killing and stealing from players outside of the bounds of reasonable game play as part of your "crusade" is definitely harassment definable as greif play. God damn! You are truly as dumb as a brick. Chinese macro'ers are unmistakable. Let's see, they use nonsense names, they are on 23/7, 7 days a week and oh... THEY SPEAK CHINESE! How dumb can one be? Also, how much isk have you brought from the Chinese this week? Hope it is enough to compensate. Vic, while I appreciate your support and understanding, please refrain from attacking Paulo. Even if he may be wrong in his thought process, it's unfair to call him dumb Please be constructive Constructive? I just like 'splosions. That includes macros(must have killed about two dozen chinese raven/drake/scorp in the past 2 weeks), but I am in no way affiliated with macrointel.
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:21:00 - [57] Originally by: VicturusTeSaluto Constructive? I just like 'splosions. That includes macros(must have killed about two dozen chinese raven/drake/scorp in the past 2 weeks), but I am in no way affiliated with macrointel. It's cool man- I just worry that it's a pretty hot topic and is already close-to-locked. Anyway- Explosions are cool, and doubly awesome if it causes an isk farmer an hour of his time! Originally by: Paulo Damarr Join the worlds largest single server and fastest growing community of Unofficial and illegitimate EULA police! Join Macrointel!
Tenebrion Darkness Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:26:00 - [58] I'm just a little confused. Everyone seems to be using farmer/macro as if they're the same thing, which they aren't.... and only one of them is against the EULA. Now MI has stated they have some roundabout means of tracking isk flow from such chars, which could point to them breaking the EULA in other ways. In any event, keep up the good work, and hope no one undeserving of your "company" gets it.
VicturusTeSaluto	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:30:00 - [59] Originally by: Tenebrion Darkness I'm just a little confused. Everyone seems to be using farmer/macro as if they're the same thing, which they aren't.... and only one of them is against the EULA. Now MI has stated they have some roundabout means of tracking isk flow from such chars, which could point to them breaking the EULA in other ways. In any event, keep up the good work, and hope no one undeserving of your "company" gets it. Not that is matters since they are CCP's most loyal and valued customers that will continue playing long after we're all gone... But, farmers are going against the EULA whether they use macro programs or not. They are all account sharing. No single person could be playing EVE 23/7 for years on end. Not to mention that they are all producing and selling dirty isk.
Silent Killa Caldari Macrominer Waste Management United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:32:00 - [60] I stopped petitioning them, I enjoy their loot far too much /me hides http://macrointel.kicks-ass.org/
VicturusTeSaluto	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:34:00 - [61] Originally by: Silent Killa I stopped petitioning them, I enjoy their loot far too much /me hides petitioning is a waste of time, ccp wants their business.
Tenebrion Darkness Amarr Viziam	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:46:00 - [62] Originally by: VicturusTeSaluto Not that is matters since they are CCP's most loyal and valued customers that will continue playing long after we're all gone... But, farmers are going against the EULA whether they use macro programs or not. They are all account sharing. No single person could be playing EVE 23/7 for years on end. Not to mention that they are all producing and selling dirty isk. Thats infering quite a bit and a huge generalization. It would be like me saying all pirates in eve are *******s in RL.
VicturusTeSaluto	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:53:00 - [63] Originally by: Tenebrion Darkness Originally by: VicturusTeSaluto Not that is matters since they are CCP's most loyal and valued customers that will continue playing long after we're all gone... But, farmers are going against the EULA whether they use macro programs or not. They are all account sharing. No single person could be playing EVE 23/7 for years on end. Not to mention that they are all producing and selling dirty isk. Thats infering quite a bit and a huge generalization. It would be like me saying all pirates in eve are *******s in RL. Okay. Prove me wrong by solo playing EVE 23/7 for an entire year without exception.
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.21 01:55:00 - [64] Originally by: VicturusTeSaluto Originally by: Silent Killa I stopped petitioning them, I enjoy their loot far too much /me hides petitioning is a waste of time, ccp wants their business. You know- I often wonder if anyone at CCP reads my threads, but they'd never make an appearance to correct you, because you're wrong. The petition system is there for a reason, and as much as you think it doesn't work, it does. Imagine you work at an internet helpdesk, because that's what they are. An internet help desk that is tasked with reimbursing some clown who just lost 3 million isk in a ship that he'll never fly again after next week anyway. Originally by: Paulo Damarr Join the worlds largest single server and fastest growing community of Unofficial and illegitimate EULA police! Join Macrointel!
VicturusTeSaluto	Posted - 2007.11.21 02:01:00 - [65] Originally by: Snake Doctor Originally by: VicturusTeSaluto Originally by: Silent Killa I stopped petitioning them, I enjoy their loot far too much /me hides petitioning is a waste of time, ccp wants their business. You know- I often wonder if anyone at CCP reads my threads, but they'd never make an appearance to correct you, because you're wrong. The petition system is there for a reason, and as much as you think it doesn't work, it does. Imagine you work at an internet helpdesk, because that's what they are. An internet help desk that is tasked with reimbursing some clown who just lost 3 million isk in a ship that he'll never fly again after next week anyway. Hrrrm. I have to disagree. 90% of the farmers could be perma-banned tomorrow if they wanted to do anything about it. They don't want to do anything; they simply want to profit from a group that is actually an obscenely large amount of the server population.
Ulitio	Posted - 2007.11.21 02:29:00 - [66] I think that CCP does not want to ban macroers, but they don't want macroers to macro. I know that is contradictory, but what I mean is that CCP doesn't really want macroers macroing. However, they do not want to spend the time, effort and expense to get rid of them. It is expensive both in a person hour standpoint and a lost revenue standpoint. That being said, I love the vigilante justice MI is doing. Keep up the good work folks.
IlluminatedOne Amarr Tycho Brahe Fan Club	Posted - 2007.11.21 04:47:00 - [67] Glad to hear someone is doing CCP's job By the way, can I join you? I'm an inty pilot.
Taedrin Gallente Magellan Exploration and Survey Rare Faction	Posted - 2007.11.21 05:01:00 - [68] I fully support this product and/or service. Keep up the good work Snake Doctor!
Seriphos Omega Mining Industrials	Posted - 2007.11.21 05:24:00 - [69] Macrointel does a good job. i have flown with snake and she's good at what she does.
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2007.11.21 05:50:00 - [70] Originally by: Snake Doctor Number of farmers and or macro users added to the list: 40-50 Even though you claim it takes several months identify macro-farmers you still can't post the exact number of macroers added to the list. Why? Originally by: Snake Doctor Amount of ISK stolen from farmers in terms of loot, salvage, invaded missions: 1.3 billion+ Do you trash those assets that you steal from suspected farmers?
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.21 06:06:00 - [71] Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Snake Doctor Number of farmers and or macro users added to the list: 40-50 Even though you claim it takes several months identify macro-farmers you still can't post the exact number of macroers added to the list. Why? Originally by: Snake Doctor Amount of ISK stolen from farmers in terms of loot, salvage, invaded missions: 1.3 billion+ Do you trash those assets that you steal from suspected farmers? I'm sorry- I don't make my lists public. Some of the others do, but I do not. Originally by: Paulo Damarr Join the worlds largest single server and fastest growing community of Unofficial and illegitimate EULA police! Join Macrointel!
Joss Sparq Caldari Agony Unleashed Agony Empire	Posted - 2007.11.21 06:17:00 - [72] Edited by: Joss Sparq on 21/11/2007 06:18:31 Originally by: Snake Doctor Actually, I see many, many real players mining Ice. That's the good news. Indeed. I was bitterly disappointed recently when I warped into an ice field all ready to "liberate" myself some dirty ice, when I noticed everyone there looked legitimate. (Then I slapped some sense into myself and was happy!) EDIT: So hurrah for Macro Intel. The dissent can go blow itself ... up. Chips of plutonium are twinkling in every lung
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2007.11.21 06:24:00 - [73] Originally by: Snake Doctor Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Snake Doctor Number of farmers and or macro users added to the list: 40-50 Even though you claim it takes several months identify macro-farmers you still can't post the exact number of macroers added to the list. Why? Originally by: Snake Doctor Amount of ISK stolen from farmers in terms of loot, salvage, invaded missions: 1.3 billion+ Do you trash those assets that you steal from suspected farmers? I'm sorry- I don't make my lists public. Some of the others do, but I do not. So you don't give us much insight of whom and why you are saying that some players are macroers/farmers. Got it. And would you mind answering my second question?
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.21 06:33:00 - [74] Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Snake Doctor Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Snake Doctor Number of farmers and or macro users added to the list: 40-50 Even though you claim it takes several months identify macro-farmers you still can't post the exact number of macroers added to the list. Why? Originally by: Snake Doctor Amount of ISK stolen from farmers in terms of loot, salvage, invaded missions: 1.3 billion+ Do you trash those assets that you steal from suspected farmers? I'm sorry- I don't make my lists public. Some of the others do, but I do not. So you don't give us much insight of whom and why you are saying that some players are macroers/farmers. Got it. And would you mind answering my second question? Sorry- I missed your second question. HAve to get funding somehow--- if the isk isnt being sold or laundered, the assets are still viable game assets. Macro'd ice really isn't, but farmed loot is. The money is staying in the comunity because of a valid mechanic. As for making lists public- There are some names on it ill release, others no. If you ask about a name, I can say yes or no, but I won't publish the list in it's entirety. There is a project moving forward that will aggregate lists and integrate those lists in game. Originally by: Paulo Damarr Join the worlds largest single server and fastest growing community of Unofficial and illegitimate EULA police! Join Macrointel!
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2007.11.21 06:48:00 - [75] Edited by: Cpt Fina on 21/11/2007 06:49:21 Originally by: Snake Doctor HAve to get funding somehow--- if the isk isnt being sold or laundered, the assets are still viable game assets. So you trash all loot after you have covered all your expenses for running your business? Quote: Macro'd ice really isn't, but farmed loot is. The money is staying in the comunity because of a valid mechanic. Not saying that you are breaking any rules (although I donÆt approve of your way of running the organization). IÆm simply trying to recall if you ever complained about iskfarmer-activities having a negative impact on the Eve economy. Quote: As for making lists public- There are some names on it ill release, others no. If you ask about a name, I can say yes or no, but I won't publish the list in it's entirety. I too have a long list of confirmed ISK-farmers. All of them are active in your alliance. I won't share the names in the list but I can assure you that they took several months to identify and that I, as you do, got very reliable methods to recognize them.
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.21 06:51:00 - [76] Edited by: Snake Doctor on 21/11/2007 06:51:49 Originally by: Cpt Fina So you trash all loot after you have covered all your expenses for running your business? Not saying that you are breaking any rules (although I donÆt approve of your way of running the organization). IÆm simply trying to recall if you ever complained about iskfarmer-activities having a negative impact on the Eve economy. I too have a long list of confirmed ISK-farmers. All of them are active in your alliance. I won't share the names in the list but I can assure you that they took several months to identyfy and that I, as you do, got very reliable methods to recognize them. Sorry. I was going to reply to this until I got to the end. There are no isk farmers in my alliance. We do not sell ISK for real world currency, nor do we share accounts or condone using macro programs. Thank you and do fly safe. Originally by: Paulo Damarr Join the worlds largest single server and fastest growing community of Unofficial and illegitimate EULA police! Join Macrointel!
Kulande Luke	Posted - 2007.11.21 06:54:00 - [77] Originally by: Paulo Damarr Harassment is a breech of the EULA and TOS, And yes accusing someone of cheating and the following them around causing them problems is harassment. Don't be so ridiculous. How is it any different to a wardec? Or is that griefing too, as they are only shooting at one particular corp?
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2007.11.21 07:07:00 - [78] Edited by: Cpt Fina on 21/11/2007 07:07:52 Originally by: Snake Doctor There are no isk farmers in my alliance. We do not sell ISK for real world currency, nor do we share accounts or condone using macro programs. According to my proof you are clearly lying. Your reply to my post is in essence "No, it's not true". It's hard to effectively defend yourself against accusations based on evidence thatÆs not fully presented, eh? Originally by: Snake Doctor Sorry. I was going to reply to this until I got to the end. Judging from your previous posts it seems that you're in fact making a profit from doing this. Since you don't want to deny or verify this I'll assume that my assumption is correct. I'll remember that if you ever use the argument of isk-farmers having a negative impact on the economy.
KaptnSparrow Caldari R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out	Posted - 2007.11.21 09:17:00 - [79] keep it up guys I do my best to help you in lowsec :) campaign all farmers need to die... --- we are open for applications convo me ---
Terminus adacai Caldari	Posted - 2007.11.21 10:20:00 - [80] I find it hilarious the number of players in this forum that question anybody that hunts macro miners or mission runners. I can understand questioning their methods, but their character? Give it a break.... Just tonight I ran across a convoy of toons with numerical names like a325609871 that were all 23 days old and flying the exact same ship and path. I saw over 40 of them within 3 jumps..... WAKE UP!!!!!!!! TRIALS ARE 14 DAYS MAX!!!! THIS IS BUT ONE EXAMPLE OF HEADS TURNING IN THE OTHER DIRECTION AND IGNORING A PROBLEM. These are now paying accounts...... INCOME When you log on and see 30k pilots online, how many do you think are macros, spammers, EULA vialators? My guess is 30-40% They run scripts, macros, and who knows what else. I am curious how many trial accounts are created each day from similar IP addresses? This will do nothing but alienate the honest playing members and encourage them to go elsewhere. It is but a matter of time... Opinions reflected on my posts are just that, my opinions. They do not reflect views held by my corp or alliance.
KaptnSparrow Caldari R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out	Posted - 2007.11.21 10:36:00 - [81] yip and I am happy whenever i stop them, i would not suicide anybody in empire, cause we all know how boring mining is, but farming of agents in low sec, means a lot of dead haulers. Funny thing is if you keep killing them in front of station they undock with 3 month old ravens 5 - 6, sadly i lacked a tank to tank them all, but i got one into deep shield with my cyclone :P campaign all farmers need to die... --- we are open for applications convo me ---
Gallente Citizen 20070720 Gallente Little Brown FK Machines United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.21 10:37:00 - [82] hey snake.. here is an update from the Black Cartel and LFBM. Bombonata Cantoman aanglis sireas sistzer boyids niubo voius BRKHL this is a short list of the people that i have been hunting down in the ice belts. I have taken out three of their macks so far and field testing a vexor set up to keep working. LBFM is recruiting as well. Looking for alts and mains. When we are in the belt they stop mining. Since CCP thought that smart bombing is always bad i tested it out on a group of 10 macks...it would have been funny if i could have got them out of the ships but only got down to about 33 structure. LB.
Shakuul Caldari O RLY corp YTMND.	Posted - 2007.11.21 10:53:00 - [83] Originally by: Shadow Joy Originally by: Shakuul I'm glad you derive pleasure from making it more difficult for people to do their jobs and feed their families. Do you say the same thing to police officers? No, because laws are very different from game rules (the EULA).
Ash Solar	Posted - 2007.11.21 10:55:00 - [84] farmings going really well thanks, a few nubs trying to gank and flip me, but no worries, i am working 23/7 and it's barely a dent in the net profits. <3 game time cards, keep buying them plx <3
Snake Doctor MacroIntel United Corporations Against Macros	Posted - 2007.11.21 16:07:00 - [85] Originally by: Ash Solar farmings going really well thanks, a few nubs trying to gank and flip me, but no worries, i am working 23/7 and it's barely a dent in the net profits. <3 game time cards, keep buying them plx <3 Good to know Originally by: Paulo Damarr Join the worlds largest single server and fastest growing community of Unofficial and illegitimate EULA police! Join Macrointel!

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