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Who are the rebels fighting for freedom in EvE.

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Shirokko Papshimar Gallente SwEaTy ArMpIT RaIDeRs Rare Faction	Posted - 2007.12.10 18:49:00 - [31] Originally by: Fader Bane Originally by: SunglassesInSpace actually eve is a lot more like WW2 No its definitely like WW1. I mean it was called The Great War and surely it will end all other wars. lol no way . there was less lag in WW1
Erotic Irony 0bsession	Posted - 2007.12.10 18:58:00 - [32] Originally by: Martin VanBuren Originally by: Ange1 A pirates life has the most freedom to it Yarr Harr fiddle-dee-dee Being a pirate is alright to be Do what you want cuz a pirate is free You are a pirate do you remember when people spammed this so much that they had a sticky banning its use I asked him with my eyes to ask again yes and then he asked me would I yes to say yes my mountain flower and first I put my arms around him yes and drew him down to me so he could feel my ******* all perfume yes and his heart was going like mad and yes I said yes I will Yes ___ Eve Players are not very smart. Support Killmail Overhaul
Monkeytester	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:00:00 - [33] Edited by: Monkeytester on 10/12/2007 19:00:26
Monkeytester	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:02:00 - [34] Edited by: Monkeytester on 10/12/2007 19:02:00
Galgarak Gallente Malus Spiritus	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:03:00 - [35] I would say bob are the rebel alliance to be honest, and goons/RA are the guys who when the jedi's were vanquished and sent into hiding the first time, turns on their ally's and reform to form the galactic empire, like what happened through episode 1-3 We all know how that story ends;) Wonder how mittani will scream when his second in command throws him down a long tunnel ;) anyone in bob have a father in goons?
Dr Paithos Minmatar Republic Deep Space Institute	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:04:00 - [36] Originally by: Erotic Irony I asked him with my eyes to ask again yes and then he asked me would I yes to say yes my mountain flower and first I put my arms around him yes and drew him down to me so he could feel my ***** all perfume yes and his heart was going like mad and yes I said yes I will Yes ... ... wait, what? Quote:** Thank you for kittens, glitter, for warm nights in fuzzy blankets... Thank you for dolphins, whales... Thank you for cartoons, for birthdays, for candy and cookies. Thank you CCP!
Martin VanBuren GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:07:00 - [37] Originally by: Galgarak I would say bob are the rebel alliance to be honest, and goons/RA are the guys who when the jedi's were vanquished and sent into hiding the first time, turns on their ally's and reform to form the galactic empire, like what happened through episode 1-3 We all know how that story ends;) Wonder how mittani will scream when his second in command throws him down a long tunnel ;) anyone in bob have a father in goons? Can I be chewbacca
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:43:00 - [38] Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 10/12/2007 19:44:48 Who are the true "freedom fighters" of Eve? Well to answer the question you need to understand what the status quo is and how exactly you go about "fighting it". To clarify, the status quo in 0.0 is to claim, dominate, enclose and restrict space with control towers, sovereignty tools, limited docking at stations and use of military force. In essence CCP provide the tools for people to populate the "sandbox" with barbed-wire, machine gun nests and road blocks, and 99% of all alliances go ahead and use this stuff to elect themselves tyrants on a regional level and dominate through use of military power. They aren't doing anything new or "revolutionary" they're just jumping through the hoops that CCP give them to play at "space empires". This therefore is the status quo and backdrop to the struggle you are looking at. By this virtue there isn't much difference between the big powers in 0.0. Its mainly a matter of style and personality and background and reputation. BOB and the Goons are separated not by what they do in-game so much as the personality of the players behind the characters. Its more about the external organizations behind the eve-alliances there. They are both a bit like the "evil empires" from star wars in terms of in-game paradigm, its like darth vadar vs the emperor, there is no "rebel alliance" at that scale. To find a rebel power you have to find an actual rebellion against the status quo. Given that: Territorial Claiming (Sovereignty spam) NBSI (Not Blue Shoot It) Standings Enclosurism (Adopt our standings or be Red to us) Are the elements of alliance ideology that are the status quo - it naturally follows that any "rebels" need to oppose these things and offer an alternative to actually have distinct identity and your "third choice". CVA have been mentioned here as "good guys" in that they don't practise NBSI - but that isn't enough. They do practise standings enclosurism and they can certainly set whoever they wish Red and force their client states and "pets" to set similar Reds due to their military dominance. That is not the action of a "rebel" power, its just the attitude of a would-be second-string tyranical power that has its sights of becoming more powerful as time develops. To find a true "rebel" power in Eve you need a meaningful rebellion and eschewing of the game mechanics that dominate alliance ideology: 1. Roving "pvp" forces who reject territorialism and don't play POS wars are "rebelling" against CCP "social engineering" through the obvious deployment of huge benefits for territorial entities. 2. Any organization that practices NRDS (Not Red Don't Shoot) is "rebelling" against the conventional wisdom that only NBSI can "defend" and organization's interests in 0.0. 3. Any organization that conducts individual rather than collective negotiation on diplomatic issues is opposing the apparent power of Standings Enclosurism and making a stand for individual sovereignty and independence over herd mentality collective bargaining. Therefore some organizations might be a bit "rebellious" (against the status quo) by embodying one of the 3 points above: Outbreak, Pandemic, Evoke, (and "rovign" pvp force that don't play the POS game defensively), Or maybe by practicing actual or apparent NRDS (old ISS, allegedly CVA, maybe some other empire dwellers). Or even actual standings independence (like most pirate corps, who will set individual +10s regardless of group collective bargaining dependent on pure self interest). But really to be truly rebellious you need to embody all three points above AND be worth a damn in pvp. Quite a challenge, and you are setting yourselves against a huge slice of the development effort that CCP absolutely adore (ie POS warfare and territorial empires) - you are throwing away the "conventional wisdom" that NBSI is the "only way", and you are consciously rejecting the safety of the herd that standings enclosurism brings. Where do you find such a thing? War Diary : Operation Terminus Est
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:49:00 - [39] Here is a good place to start :) War Diary : Operation Terminus Est
The Mittani GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:49:00 - [40] that post has so many words that you cant even quote it without hitting the character limit
The Mittani GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:50:00 - [41] brevity is the soul of wit
Dr Paithos Minmatar Republic Deep Space Institute	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:53:00 - [42] Originally by: The Mittani brevity is the soul of wit Brevity is beauty. tl;dr version of Jasmine's poast: Join Star Fraction Quote: Thank you for kittens, glitter, for warm nights in fuzzy blankets... Thank you for dolphins, whales... Thank you for cartoons, for birthdays, for candy and cookies. Thank you CCP!
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.12.10 19:55:00 - [43] Originally by: The Mittani that post has so many words that you cant even quote it without hitting the character limit Submit to my forum powers old man! War Diary : Operation Terminus Est
Erotic Irony 0bsession	Posted - 2007.12.10 20:00:00 - [44] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 10/12/2007 19:44:48 Who are the true "freedom fighters" of Eve? Well to answer the question you need to understand what the status quo is and how exactly you go about "fighting it". To clarify, the status quo in 0.0 is to claim, dominate, enclose and restrict space with control towers, sovereignty tools, limited docking at stations and use of military force. In essence CCP provide the tools for people to populate the "sandbox" with barbed-wire, machine gun nests and road blocks, and 99% of all alliances go ahead and use this stuff to elect themselves tyrants on a regional level and dominate through use of military power. They aren't doing anything new or "revolutionary" they're just jumping through the hoops that CCP give them to play at "space empires". This therefore is the status quo and backdrop to the struggle you are looking at. By this virtue there isn't much difference between the big powers in 0.0. Its mainly a matter of style and personality and background and reputation. BOB and the Goons are separated not by what they do in-game so much as the personality of the players behind the characters. Its more about the external organizations behind the eve-alliances there. They are both a bit like the "evil empires" from star wars in terms of in-game paradigm, its like darth vadar vs the emperor, there is no "rebel alliance" at that scale. To find a rebel power you have to find an actual rebellion against the status quo. Given that: Territorial Claiming (Sovereignty spam) NBSI (Not Blue Shoot It) Standings Enclosurism (Adopt our standings or be Red to us) Are the elements of alliance ideology that are the status quo - it naturally follows that any "rebels" need to oppose these things and offer an alternative to actually have distinct identity and your "third choice". CVA have been mentioned here as "good guys" in that they don't practise NBSI - but that isn't enough. They do practise standings enclosurism and they can certainly set whoever they wish Red and force their client states and "pets" to set similar Reds due to their military dominance. That is not the action of a "rebel" power, its just the attitude of a would-be second-string tyranical power that has its sights of becoming more powerful as time develops. To find a true "rebel" power in Eve you need a meaningful rebellion and eschewing of the game mechanics that dominate alliance ideology: 1. Roving "pvp" forces who reject territorialism and don't play POS wars are "rebelling" against CCP "social engineering" through the obvious deployment of huge benefits for territorial entities. 2. Any organization that practices NRDS (Not Red Don't Shoot) is "rebelling" against the conventional wisdom that only NBSI can "defend" and organization's interests in 0.0. 3. Any organization that conducts individual rather than collective negotiation on diplomatic issues is opposing the apparent power of Standings Enclosurism and making a stand for individual sovereignty and independence over herd mentality collective bargaining. Therefore some organizations might be a bit "rebellious" (against the status quo) by embodying one of the 3 points above: Outbreak, Pandemic, Evoke, (and "rovign" pvp force that don't play the POS game defensively), Or maybe by practicing actual or apparent NRDS (old ISS, allegedly CVA, maybe some other empire dwellers). Or even actual standings independence (like most pirate corps, who will set individual +10s regardless of group collective bargaining dependent on pure self interest)... this is important guys: so JF is space marxism? ___ Eve Players are not very smart. Support Killmail Overhaul
Graalum Foundation R0ADKILL	Posted - 2007.12.10 20:20:00 - [45] Originally by: Erotic Irony Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Edited by: Jasmine Constantine on 10/12/2007 19:44:48 Who are the true "freedom fighters" of Eve? Well to answer the question you need to understand what the status quo is and how exactly you go about "fighting it". To clarify, the status quo in 0.0 is to claim, dominate, enclose and restrict space with control towers, sovereignty tools, limited docking at stations and use of military force. In essence CCP provide the tools for people to populate the "sandbox" with barbed-wire, machine gun nests and road blocks, and 99% of all alliances go ahead and use this stuff to elect themselves tyrants on a regional level and dominate through use of military power. They aren't doing anything new or "revolutionary" they're just jumping through the hoops that CCP give them to play at "space empires". This therefore is the status quo and backdrop to the struggle you are looking at. By this virtue there isn't much difference between the big powers in 0.0. Its mainly a matter of style and personality and background and reputation. BOB and the Goons are separated not by what they do in-game so much as the personality of the players behind the characters. Its more about the external organizations behind the eve-alliances there. They are both a bit like the "evil empires" from star wars in terms of in-game paradigm, its like darth vadar vs the emperor, there is no "rebel alliance" at that scale. To find a rebel power you have to find an actual rebellion against the status quo. Given that: Territorial Claiming (Sovereignty spam) NBSI (Not Blue Shoot It) Standings Enclosurism (Adopt our standings or be Red to us) Are the elements of alliance ideology that are the status quo - it naturally follows that any "rebels" need to oppose these things and offer an alternative to actually have distinct identity and your "third choice". CVA have been mentioned here as "good guys" in that they don't practise NBSI - but that isn't enough. They do practise standings enclosurism and they can certainly set whoever they wish Red and force their client states and "pets" to set similar Reds due to their military dominance. That is not the action of a "rebel" power, its just the attitude of a would-be second-string tyranical power that has its sights of becoming more powerful as time develops. To find a true "rebel" power in Eve you need a meaningful rebellion and eschewing of the game mechanics that dominate alliance ideology: 1. Roving "pvp" forces who reject territorialism and don't play POS wars are "rebelling" against CCP "social engineering" through the obvious deployment of huge benefits for territorial entities. 2. Any organization that practices NRDS (Not Red Don't Shoot) is "rebelling" against the conventional wisdom that only NBSI can "defend" and organization's interests in 0.0. 3. Any organization that conducts individual rather than collective negotiation on diplomatic issues is opposing the apparent power of Standings Enclosurism and making a stand for individual sovereignty and independence over herd mentality collective bargaining. Therefore some organizations might be a bit "rebellious" (against the status quo) by embodying one of the 3 points above: Outbreak, Pandemic, Evoke, (and "rovign" pvp force that don't play the POS game defensively), Or maybe by practicing actual or apparent NRDS (old ISS, allegedly CVA, maybe some other empire dwellers). Or even actual standings independence (like most pirate corps, who will set individual +10s regardless of group collective bargaining dependent on pure self interest)... this is important guys: so JF is space marxism? More like libertarianism or a sort of anarchism by my look at it. Almost has a hunter/gatherer feel to it. Your signature graphic must reflect your ingame persona as per The Forum rules - Kreul Intentions ([email protected])
The Mittani GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.10 20:22:00 - [46] you see, jf is :words: :words: :words: :words: its pretty impressive how much they write actually though i can't be bothered to read it all, they occasionally totally take over a thread and my god
Wednesday Sheffield Amarr GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.10 20:22:00 - [47] Well to be the rebels they would have to 1. Fight to restore the Senate to power. 2. Have blown up at least two Death Stars (with a little help.) 3. Have gotten backstabbed by a few very important people that they had considered friends but come back to rule the galaxy in the end. 4. Have Jedi "Knights" within their ranks. 5. Have sacrificed many Bothans to find the secret enemy plans. 6. Be not nearly as cool as the Empire. (would that be BoB or goons in this case?) In other words it KOS. KOS are the rebels.
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.12.10 20:37:00 - [48] Originally by: The Mittani you see, jf is :words: :words: :words: :words: its pretty impressive how much they write actually though i can't be bothered to read it all, they occasionally totally take over a thread and my god We pick our threads Mittani. Like hunters in the undergrowth waiting for the optimum time to strike ... War Diary : Operation Terminus Est
Erotic Irony 0bsession	Posted - 2007.12.10 20:57:00 - [49] I dunno Graalum, if the pvp with the pretense that theyre this anticolonial, anti-imperial platform, and try to distance themselves from that context, toward genuine freedom/happiness they make a fundamental misstep. They try to distance themselves from alliance culture by avoiding the usual language of k:d and pos war but in its place they use posthumanism, enclosurism and other rhetoric. In reality they are no different from the people they purport to offer an alternative to, their strategy is still in revolutionary language, in neologism and a negative utopianism that is as untenable as being a wealthy and fulfilled member of an 0.0 alliance. ___ Eve Players are not very smart. Support Killmail Overhaul
Danari Amarr Viper Squad Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.12.10 21:16:00 - [50] There will never be in-game freedom fighters because there will never be in-game oppression to fight against. Residents simply pack up and leave moving to the next soft area of space rather than fight their oppressors. Create barriers to mobility, then you'd see... a lot of people quitting eve lol. You'll never get freedom fighters out of gamers.
Petter Sandstad Taggart Transdimensional Kinetic Maelstrom Alliance	Posted - 2007.12.10 21:18:00 - [51] How about entities such as the Trade Federation, Commerce Guild, Techno Union, and the Intergalactic Banking Clan? You are forgetting who represents these in the world of EVE. Champions of Capitalism, and seekers of profit, simply wanting to make money without interference from entities like The Galactic Senate. Then betrayed by their appearant ally. One corporation that represents these entities is TTI, and it is the true champion of Capitalism and freedom.
Mithfindel Gallente St. Julian Social Club	Posted - 2007.12.10 21:29:00 - [52] Originally by: Galgarak anyone in bob have a father in goons? Assuming that FIX stays with BoB to the end, I hear that Dark Shikari is actually a goon.
Gamesguy Amarr D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2007.12.10 21:33:00 - [53] Originally by: Oli4Oli4 Tri ^^ We're more like the Hutts tbh.
Murtala Mushin Market	Posted - 2007.12.10 21:50:00 - [54] Edited by: Murtala on 10/12/2007 21:52:21 Lets be honest, one side might win the war and I am not liking either side. While CCP adds more 0.0 space, hi-sec space has remained the same and is getting crowed. Would be nice if there was a superpower able to keep open a region of 0.0 free to carebears without the NBSI and killmail whorage attitude. I think ISS tried but failed. Meh, but what do I know? I am only an alt troll and you GBC, Goons and pet/allies are much more smarter than me and have invested a lot more time in game than me. EDIT: If you want to create a true legacy, create Jita in 0.0 and maintain it. Goons - Real Goons - Goons Titans
crudhunch Templars of Space Terra Incognita.	Posted - 2007.12.10 22:11:00 - [55] Fla was
Hasham Abbas	Posted - 2007.12.10 22:22:00 - [56] fyi BoB is a lot like Queen Amidala they have an unhealthy interest in young boys
Sebroth Coordination Incorporated	Posted - 2007.12.10 22:39:00 - [57] I would call all the rp alliances rebels since they do stand and fight for something totaly different then all the other alliances do. So both CVA and Unity do stand under the same rebel banner in my view, even if they stand on diffrerent sides of the pole now what the OP should ask is, who is the dude dancing at the pole? ----- Never knock on Death's door; ring the doorbell and run (he hates that)
Hermia Steel Daggers	Posted - 2007.12.10 22:49:00 - [58] Originally by: Jasmine Constantine Here is a good place to start :) heh, that vid never gets old
Hannobaal Gallente Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2007.12.10 22:49:00 - [59] Edited by: Hannobaal on 10/12/2007 22:50:18 Originally by: Erotic Irony this is important guys: so JF is space marxism? Sounds more like the exact opposite to me: Originally by: Jasmine Constantine making a stand for individual sovereignty and independence over herd mentality
Jasmine Constantine Gallente Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2007.12.10 23:09:00 - [60] Originally by: Hannobaal Edited by: Hannobaal on 10/12/2007 22:50:18 Originally by: Erotic Irony this is important guys: so JF is space marxism? Sounds more like the exact opposite to me: Originally by: Jasmine Constantine making a stand for individual sovereignty and independence over herd mentality True there. The JF = space Marxism slur is something which ill-informed people have thrown around for years now. The truth is we're more anarcho-capitalist libertarians (with guns). Each free captain is responsible for their own finances and equipment and we have very little in the way of shared capital or assets. People join SF to fight in a revolutionary movement not to "get rich", but its often the case that good fighters with vision and endurance never seem to find it too difficult to make money either. We're pretty much permanently at war against NBSI territorial/enclosurist entities who have previously committed acts of aggression against our members and represent an opportunity for people to actively pvp 24/7 against people that actually deserve to be shot. War Diary : Operation Terminus Est

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