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Tinu Moorhsum
Royal Scientific Research Enterprise
49
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Posted - 2012.02.27 11:09:00 -
[91] - Quote
Trinkets friend wrote:Wow, Tinu, what you aren't telling everyone is you read the whole thread, including my poast, and regurgitated it in a slightly different manner and told everyone the bleeding obvious that not every fight ends in victory. You, sir, are a legend.
I don't know what function it serves to insult other people on forums while hiding behind a fictive avatar. Mate, it's not necessary. Be a good sport and get your PVP in game please.
You're right about one thing. I don't recall reading your post but if you were saying the same thing, it's not too surprising. I can't be the only one that saw the obvious.
T- |
Daphny Naarma
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
2
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Posted - 2012.02.27 17:11:00 -
[92] - Quote
There is one thing about this discussion that makes it... funny'ish. Post after post, we see (at least in a clear majority) how people - through empirical facts, theorycrafting and what not - try to 'proove' that the Tengu isn't OP and what's 'really' wrong/right/whatever.
What people do 'wrong' in here (incl. OP) is trying to measure inbalance and a disproprotionally skewed demand for a certain ship by it's actual performance. From a game perspective - something rather irrelevant.
Let's put it this way: In fact, the Tengu is easily beaten by two Punishers (one tackles and one... oh well, one tackles). It sometimes self-combust on undocking - destroying it or severely damaging it, for some strange and yet unexplained reason. Price in Jita is about 20b, which seems a bit much for a ship that you risk losing on undock, or being on the red, flashy side of two T1 frigs. Right? Right?
Considering the above being true. At the same time, it is clear that long time vets, (some literally harboring an EVE-life long hate toward missiles), as well as a disproportionally large part of newer/young players in the middle of deciding on race/career/training, decide they really need to train into Tengu to be competitive.
Which of the two arguments above mattters to the game and the great diversity (in a relative sense) CCP has accomplished with EVE? That the Tengu really isn't OP - I SWEAR - my Punisher have 16 KMs solo on Tengus (actually only 13 'true' kills, 3 were into structure from the undocking 'discomfort') - or that a disproportionally large part of the community (especially thinking here of new players who ask "WAT IS GOD SHIP??+") that does indeed populate those skill point branches as we type this?
To me, the second argument beats the first - no contest, even if I made very clear that Tengu is a horrible ship. I am concerned with every jack to diversity because it brings EVE closer to a lot of other MMOs minimizing the differences which are the reasons I do play EVE, and not... one of the other.
Do I want Tengu nerfed? It is not up to me. It doesn't really concern me whether it outputs 600dps at 100km or 5000dps and 1000km because I am not competing for turf or KMs with them atm. However - there is something about the Tengu (regardless of whatever dozens of "proof" of non-OPness listed in here) that is extremely attractive and that DOES influence the coolness of EVE: that there is no "legendary sword". That concerns me.
In practice: Regardless of figures and proof, the aim should be that no ship has such a clear advantage when it comes to attracting players that in the end, a disproportional part of the playerbase fly it. If this is done by nerfing the Tengu, or buffing the other T3s slightly - whatever. Hopefully CCP does something before painting themselves too far into the corner. |
Outz Xacto
Echelon Munitions
17
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Posted - 2012.02.27 17:58:00 -
[93] - Quote
I would hope that CCP wouldn't just change something because people like it, even when there are a number of other ships that do what it does just as well if not better. |
James Amril-Kesh
Interstellar Faction 21
37
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Posted - 2012.02.27 21:48:00 -
[94] - Quote
You never hear people say "Legion is the best t3" or "Proteus is the best t3". You might occasionally hear people say that the Loki is the best, but by far if you ask people which t3 is the best, they'll tell you it's the Tengu.
I didn't give in to the hype, and so being an Amarr player who trains primarily Amarr ships I went for the Legion. And while yeah the Legion is a nice ship, it doesn't have the DPS, the tank, or the range of the Tengu.
Support showing T2 and faction frequency crystal damage in the info window! |
Joyelle
State War Academy
Caldari State
6
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Posted - 2012.03.24 17:15:00 -
[95] - Quote
Kingzolo wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rn_c2Q2W09U
Too OP really.
I'll tell you why 100MN HAM legion also needs a nerf as well as a lot of other ships.
linky
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Darvaleth Sigma
Draconis Coalition
0
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Posted - 2012.03.24 19:32:00 -
[96] - Quote
Who's willing to bet the OP was one of the people who got floored by the Tengu in that video...
You shouldn't just nerf ships because they beat you. Don't get mad, get even. |
Rindon Callsar
Viziam
Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2012.03.25 04:37:00 -
[97] - Quote
Gempei wrote:Vimsy Vortis wrote:Or just buff the other T3s. this, others T3s need some love 
I agree completely. Nerfing is usually never the answer. Buffing the other ships in the same class to be on par is the best thing for everyone. As it stands now the Tengu is the "I can do just about everything in the game well" ship, while the other t3 are semi-good to decent in one or two aspects.
That being said, it is going to be very interesting to see what changes are going to be brought to all ships in general with the Inferno expansion. I am excited and scared at the same time since it could entirely change the way some ships are designed to work.
Too bad all ships aren't like t3's in the area of being able to "build" what you want with the subsystems. How awesome would that be to pick and choose for every class of ship. Would bottle the mind! |
Tobiaz
Spacerats
61
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Posted - 2012.03.25 13:23:00 -
[98] - Quote
Trinkets friend wrote:This whole thread should be retitled "why I hate T3 booster alts".
Faction dissy + T2 warfare links in a booster loki + skirmish mindlink = 50km point. Easy. 22km faction webs.
You get another 40% to AB and MWD speed.
Plus a 35% reduction in sig radius if you go that third link. Or, you can take the siege link and get 27.5% to shield stuff. Depends what he wants.
Toss in a blue pill and implants, and yeah, you can see how this guy achieves it. Plus, of course, having a clear game plan.
- web ships die first
- neut ships die second
- ceptors next
- then you go for the prize
If you are fighting a guy named XBOPOHx in a 100MN Tengu and there's a Captain BOPOH in local, and you have a Loki on scan named "not a booster" and you don't do the maths, yeah, prepare to lose your Machariel.
You will also notice he did not do so well vs fleets with ECM. Pencil that in your play books, ladies.
The real issue with the 100MN Tengu is the sig radius. With the speed he is getting from overheated 100MN, and a 35% reduction in sig radius, he is a) traveling faster than missile explosion velocity b) faster than most missiles anyway c) his sig radius is so low that if they do hit, it does SFA.
I don't know you need to nerf these ships. You need to buff people's situational awareness.
Nerfing off-grid boosters would solve a lot of this booster-alt sillyness. It made dual-boxing 'solo' fighting pretty much the norm.
http://go-dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Tobiaz/sig_complaints.gif
How about fixing image-linking on the forums, CCP? I want to see signatures! |
Kat Bandeis
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
4
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Posted - 2012.03.25 14:42:00 -
[99] - Quote
I don't see a problem here. Was OP one of those spanked mercilessly? 
Lrn2Fly Tengu and you can start succeeding like those in the video. Don't whine about a ship being overpowered with it's the player behind the keyboard that's got the issues. |
Qui Shon
Capital Construction Research
Pioneer Alliance
0
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Posted - 2012.03.25 18:07:00 -
[100] - Quote
Kingzolo wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rn_c2Q2W09U
Too OP really.
Best Eve vid I've seen in ages.
Great music, and 1(player, if not ship) vs many which is always a great subject.
Mad props to this boppo guy for the vid ;) |
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