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JitaCitizen 72395
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Posted - 2008.01.10 11:37:00 -
[1]
Edited by: JitaCitizen 72395 on 10/01/2008 11:37:47
Last night I accidently managed to get a character trapped inside a station, unable to do anything but lose skillpoints.
I had set the characters clone to a 0.0 NPC station my corp had an office at. At the time I didn't realise this station lacked a medical service, but the next time I was podded I respawned there. Unable to update my clone or change its location, I undocked into a heavy interdictor camp covering the station. To make matters worse, the undock point dumps you 4km outside docking range, making it impossible to re-dock or warp off. After dying and losing skillpoints, I respawned back inside the same station. The dictor pilot was obviously still in local, but checking if the camp would result in being 4km from the station and podded again.
After petitioning as stuck and explaining the situation three times, a GM said that CCP policy prevented the character being moved anywhere, and insisted that I travel to another station to upgrade my clone.
I have to ask a few questions of CCP:
a) Why is it possible to get a character near-permanently stuck in this manner? My playing time is limited now, and I can't be around hoping to catch a time when the dictor camp is gone. This character is now both broken and useless to me.
b) Why are there still station models that dump you well outside docking range? In 0.0 this means certain death when interdictors are involved, and all but shuttles have bad odds anywhere else. The station in question is a Gallente Refinery.
c) Why is there no warning when you set a clone location to somewhere with no medical services? We get warnings when accepting contracts we may not be able to collect, but there's no warning for a very easy way to lose skillpoints.
d) Why is it CCP policy to enforce characters remaining in one station against their will indefinitely? I can understand why skillpoints won't be replaced, but players with characters unable to do anything again are simply going to cancel their subscriptions. I don't see how that makes sense to them or CCP.
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Tar om
Minmatar
Octavian Vanguard
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2008.01.10 11:39:00 -
[2]
You're stuck, and you're staying there until the players who want to shoot you move off.
The fact that you're losing skill points is your fault (harsh, I know but ultimately fair).
I think you'll just have to suck this one up and learn from it.
Best of luck.
--
DEVS get multiple CPUs/Cores per system and all will be forgiven.
www.octavianvanguard.net |
EvilSyKOSkitzo
Caldari Navy Runners
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Posted - 2008.01.10 11:53:00 -
[3]
Umm,
1. Create Alt.
2. Drive him upto the system that your in.
3. Scout outside.
4. Profit??
uhh, hang on. Is that how it goes? 
- Evil
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Zaphod Jones
Minmatar
Infinitus Odium
The Church.
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Posted - 2008.01.10 12:17:00 -
[4]
incompetancy isn't petitionable
Save EvE TV |
Lazuran
Gallente
Time And ISK Sink Corporation
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Posted - 2008.01.10 12:26:00 -
[5]
Yeah, this particular part of the game mechanics is badly designed. Your best bet is to explain the situation to the people in local and ask them not to pod you.
Nowdays you can get around such situations by having a jump clone somewhere else (but I know, it doesn't help you at this point).
Ignore the ******** people who will gleefully flame you, they suck, otherwise they wouldn't need to act like this.
Disclaimer: I do not speak for the fanbois. |
Malcanis
Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2008.01.10 12:27:00 -
[6]
 Originally by: JitaCitizen 72395
Edited by: JitaCitizen 72395 on 10/01/2008 11:37:47
Last night I accidently managed to get a character trapped inside a station, unable to do anything but lose skillpoints.
I had set the characters clone to a 0.0 NPC station my corp had an office at. At the time I didn't realise this station lacked a medical service, but the next time I was podded I respawned there. Unable to update my clone or change its location, I undocked into a heavy interdictor camp covering the station. To make matters worse, the undock point dumps you 4km outside docking range, making it impossible to re-dock or warp off. After dying and losing skillpoints, I respawned back inside the same station. The dictor pilot was obviously still in local, but checking if the camp would result in being 4km from the station and podded again.
After petitioning as stuck and explaining the situation three times, a GM said that CCP policy prevented the character being moved anywhere, and insisted that I travel to another station to upgrade my clone.
I have to ask a few questions of CCP:
a) Why is it possible to get a character near-permanently stuck in this manner? My playing time is limited now, and I can't be around hoping to catch a time when the dictor camp is gone. This character is now both broken and useless to me.
b) Why are there still station models that dump you well outside docking range? In 0.0 this means certain death when interdictors are involved, and all but shuttles have bad odds anywhere else. The station in question is a Gallente Refinery.
c) Why is there no warning when you set a clone location to somewhere with no medical services? We get warnings when accepting contracts we may not be able to collect, but there's no warning for a very easy way to lose skillpoints.
d) Why is it CCP policy to enforce characters remaining in one station against their will indefinitely? I can understand why skillpoints won't be replaced, but players with characters unable to do anything again are simply going to cancel their subscriptions. I don't see how that makes sense to them or CCP.
Possible solutions:
(1) Alt scout, as suggested above
(2) Patience
(3) Pay a ransom
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Valan
The Fated
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.01.10 12:31:00 -
[7]
tbh I thought that was petitionable. I've known people be moved because they're stuck in a station without cloning.
Escalate the petition. The first GM may be correct but recent decisions and comments in channels lead me to believe some GMs are more enthusiastic than knowlegeable.
Lets face not everyone is correct all of the time. If the first GM is correct see above lol.
/start sig
I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game four years' when I know their account has been sold on.
/end sig |
Venkul Mul
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.01.10 12:36:00 -
[8]
Other possible solutions:
get your corporation to help;
try to escape just before DT or just after DT.
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Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr
Do Or Die And Live Or Try
The Kano Organisation
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Posted - 2008.01.10 12:43:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Valan
tbh I thought that was petitionable. I've known people be moved because they're stuck in a station without cloning.
Escalate the petition. The first GM may be correct but recent decisions and comments in channels lead me to believe some GMs are more enthusiastic than knowlegeable.
Lets face not everyone is correct all of the time. If the first GM is correct see above lol.
Christ I hope not. Camping a station is just as valid as camping a gate.
That the guy doesn't realize his predicament before it's to late, is not the GM's responsibility, nor the campers fault.
Yes, he is paying to play the game, but getting trapped within a station or system, is a part of the game. Getting killed is also a part of the game.
I would suggest you log off and do something else for an hour or 2. Then log back on and fly away.
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hamishoo7
Gallente
M'8'S
Frontal Impact
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Posted - 2008.01.10 13:17:00 -
[10]
Edited by: hamishoo7 on 10/01/2008 13:18:25
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
That the guy doesn't realize his predicament before it's to late, is not the GM's responsibility, nor the campers fault.
Can you remove yourself from your high-horse - guys got himself into trouble and is simply posting about the problems associated with that. Getting killed is not part of the game when you're in a pod and it takes a few rounds of antimatter to take a few days training off your skillsheet.
I'm pretty sure if someone's perma-camped into a station for whatever reason a GM will assist as it will ultimately be deemed to be griefing so I'd try and escalate it on the same lines (although as long as the campers aren't specifically tring to stop him from playing it's not really their fault either.)
It's an unfortunate situation but the points he raised are valid around:
a) undock points screwy
b) not receiving warnings about the station not having medical facility
Answers to these I think are pretty simple
a) fix the undock point for said station
b) provide warnings or my preferred solution - don't allow death clones to be set to stations that don't have medical facilities
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Valan
The Fated
Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate
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Posted - 2008.01.10 13:18:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
Originally by: Valan
tbh I thought that was petitionable. I've known people be moved because they're stuck in a station without cloning.
Escalate the petition. The first GM may be correct but recent decisions and comments in channels lead me to believe some GMs are more enthusiastic than knowlegeable.
Lets face not everyone is correct all of the time. If the first GM is correct see above lol.
Christ I hope not. Camping a station is just as valid as camping a gate.
That the guy doesn't realize his predicament before it's to late, is not the GM's responsibility, nor the campers fault.
Yes, he is paying to play the game, but getting trapped within a station or system, is a part of the game. Getting killed is also a part of the game.
I would suggest you log off and do something else for an hour or 2. Then log back on and fly away.
I think it only applies in certain situations. I'm kind of with you but...I can see why in some situations it would be. If you're stuck in an outpost that people can camp pretty much 24/7 what are you supposed to do?
/start sig
I love old characters that post 'I've beeen playing the game four years' when I know their account has been sold on.
/end sig |
Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr
Do Or Die And Live Or Try
The Kano Organisation
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Posted - 2008.01.10 13:32:00 -
[12]
Originally by: hamishoo7
Edited by: hamishoo7 on 10/01/2008 13:18:25
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
Getting killed is not part of the game when you're in a pod and it takes a few rounds of antimatter to take a few days training off your skillsheet.
Sorry, but that is a part of the game. Loss of defeat has always been a big part of the game. OP only brought this upon him self and wants the GM to take his hand and move him to safety. That is not playing the game.
If he is being camped for a week and the campers are refusing to let him go, then perhaps. But as I can read from the post, he hasn't been camped for very long. Not even a day. He has not communicated with the campers to arrange free transport, he just turns to the GM's for liberation. What about those that camp him, they are playing the game. Why should they be cheated of their prize (isk, revenge, salvage, fun, corpses)?
I have been camped in a system for a week. I chose not to communicate with my "captors" and I played a bit of cat and mouse before I got to safety. I might not have lost a close, but I couldn't "play the game the usual way" for that week.
I don't think my horse is that high.
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Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr
Do Or Die And Live Or Try
The Kano Organisation
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Posted - 2008.01.10 13:46:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Valan
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
Originally by: Valan
tbh I thought that was petitionable. I've known people be moved because they're stuck in a station without cloning.
Escalate the petition. The first GM may be correct but recent decisions and comments in channels lead me to believe some GMs are more enthusiastic than knowlegeable.
Lets face not everyone is correct all of the time. If the first GM is correct see above lol.
Christ I hope not. Camping a station is just as valid as camping a gate.
That the guy doesn't realize his predicament before it's to late, is not the GM's responsibility, nor the campers fault.
Yes, he is paying to play the game, but getting trapped within a station or system, is a part of the game. Getting killed is also a part of the game.
I would suggest you log off and do something else for an hour or 2. Then log back on and fly away.
I think it only applies in certain situations. I'm kind of with you but...I can see why in some situations it would be. If you're stuck in an outpost that people can camp pretty much 24/7 what are you supposed to do?
If the captors refuse to let him go, he should file it harrasment petition. But that is last resort.
First you try to sneak out.
Then you try to get your corp to rescue you.
Then you log on at odd hours to sneak out.
Then you try to communicate with the campers.
Then you file a harrasment petition.
The OP pretty much skipped from point 1 to calling the GN's on a valid tactic.
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ry ry
StateCorp
Veritas Immortalis
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Posted - 2008.01.10 14:01:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
If the captors refuse to let him go, he should file it harrasment petition.
why? it's not harassment.
if your character really is completely stuck, file a 'stuck' petition and see if a benevolent GM will move you. i wouldn't count on it though.
log in as soon as the server comes back up after DT. if you're ready and waiting there is a good chance you'll be able to undock and warp in a shuttle/pod.
*again. |
Auron Shadowbane
Pelennor Swarm
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Posted - 2008.01.10 14:08:00 -
[15]
as fair as it is that the campers get the one kill from the OP beeing dumb and setting clone to wrong station they shouldnt get infinet kills.
imo you should be able to re-default your medic clone to your corps HQ from EVERY station in game.
stupidity would still hurt if you get camped but at least there would be chance to escape from such situations.
and tbh if a GM would react to a Harrasment petition THAT would be stupid. cause I'm allowed to kill everyone wherever I like as often as I do if it's their own fault.
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Jonny JoJo
Amarr
The Imperial Guards
Darkness Rising Alliance
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Posted - 2008.01.10 14:11:00 -
[16]
Edited by: Jonny JoJo on 10/01/2008 14:11:24
use jumpclone if you have one. If you dont, then pettition to senor gm if you resubscribed recently. If neither of these apply to you, then make a trial alt account and move him up to scout for you.
Refresh to see next Real Life CCP sig(16 total) |
Jaketh Ivanes
Amarr
Do Or Die And Live Or Try
The Kano Organisation
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Posted - 2008.01.10 14:25:00 -
[17]
Originally by: ry ry
Originally by: Jaketh Ivanes
If the captors refuse to let him go, he should file it harrasment petition.
why? it's not harassment.
if your character really is completely stuck, file a 'stuck' petition and see if a benevolent GM will move you. i wouldn't count on it though.
log in as soon as the server comes back up after DT. if you're ready and waiting there is a good chance you'll be able to undock and warp in a shuttle/pod.
But he is not stuck. There is nothing in the game that prevents him from leaving the station or system.
I'm not completely into the harrasment rules, but since the campers have refused to accept ransom or any other kind of compensation for leaving the station, it is personal and harrasment in my book. GM's might see otherwise ofcourse  .
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Kirjava
Lothian Quay Industries
Zzz
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Posted - 2008.01.10 14:30:00 -
[18]
He cannot get out due to camp.
Presumably he has tried a few times on differnt days, if not then do that.
If he can't get out then file petition, admit defeat and ask for help, what else can a player do, many of us are sharp and inteligent but we can't know every intricacy of the game.
~Nyron
Originally by: Minerva Vulcan
But poor victimized Ulf...I weep lavender scented tears for you.
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An Anarchyyt
Gallente
Battlestars
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.01.10 15:01:00 -
[19]
Camps in 0.0? I've never heard of such a thing!
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
Second, a gentile is a non jewish person
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nether void
Caldari
Caldari Provisions
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Posted - 2008.01.10 15:18:00 -
[20]
Not sure if people have figured it out yet or not, but you will never get sympathy from the killers in this game. It's not in their nature. Why even try? Waste of time.
Two reasons CCP will never care about this topic:
- You will not cancel you account over it
- It doesn't happen often enough to care about
It doesn't surprise me anymore. I actually would be surprised by the opposite. lol It sucks, but can I change it? No. Will I give in, and just be like everyone else? No. Integrity of character is dead. It's actually cool to be an asshat now, and if you aren't an asshat, you're weak. lol I mean even a company you pay to play this game won't even take a sympathy second to jump you to a station to make a clone and jump your ass back (still in your pod). How hard would that be? lol
Make the game fun for everyone. That's my motto. Personally, I would have let you undock and get a clone, but that's because I would hate to be in that situation, so I'm not going to put another person there. Guess I'm old school.
Sorry, bro.
---------------------------
nethervoid - since '97 [UO|EQ|SB|SWG|PS|EVE|HZ|NWN|VG|WoW] |
Shinori
GoonFleet
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Posted - 2008.01.10 15:33:00 -
[21]
Ask one of the kind souls that sympathize with your situation to scout the station undock for you.
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Shenko Minara
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Posted - 2008.01.10 16:10:00 -
[22]
Originally by: nether void
Two reasons CCP will never care about this topic:
- You will not cancel you account over it
And if you found yourself in this situation, unable to move and every time you undocked you got podded and lost skillpoints? Say you start with 20mil skillpoints and after the Nth time of getting podded you're down to 10mil skillpoints, can't fly half the ships you have or use the T2 equipment you trained for? That is *exactly* the kind of thing to make people quit.
GMs are there to right the wrongs, and not having a warning dialog that your target station has no cloning facilities? That's clearly wrong. Yeah, you have to be slightly dumb to not check beforehand, but it's still not in keeping with the rest of the warning dialogs.
--
99% of Eve-o posters should stop posting. This probably includes me, but definitely includes you. |
Melor Rend
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Posted - 2008.01.10 16:18:00 -
[23]
Your character isn't "stuck" since you still can undock, move and die etc. The fact that the station is camped is not the GMs or CCPs problem... I also can't petition when I'm stuck in a system at a safe spot with bubbles on all gates...
Also why do you think that you are "stuck indefinitely"? As soon as the camp is gone you are free to leave and go update your clone somewhere. I doubt that the station is camped 23/7 and even if... just get a shuttle and undock right after downtime and use an alt-scout to make perfectly sure you're not undocking into a deathtrap.
I don't think CCP should help people if they get themselves in a bad situation... It would have been easy to prevent the loss of skills.. I don't wanna make fun of you or anything (i'm sorry for your loss) but it's still not CCPs job to help you if you get caught in a station by not planning in advance.
I do agree however, that CCP should give you a warning pop-up if you move your clone to a station without medical. Would be prudent.
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Dromidas Shadowmoon
Minmatar
54th Knights Templar
Dark Matter Coalition
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Posted - 2008.01.10 16:25:00 -
[24]
I'm surprised you haven't set your clone-base to somewhere else by now. After the first podding and realizing that you're stuck, I mean.
You can always move where you'll end up after a podding, fyi.
_______________________________________________
Minmatar will always go faster than you, get over it. |
Shenko Minara
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Posted - 2008.01.10 16:34:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Melor Rend
I don't think CCP should help people if they get themselves in a bad situation...
I do agree however, that CCP should give you a warning pop-up if you move your clone to a station without medical. Would be prudent.
CCP presents it's game and UI and gets you used to a certain type of interactivity with the game. By not providing a warning dialog for such a serious situation, when it provides them elsewhere, it's like taking the chair out from under you as you sit down.
Originally by: Dromidas Shadowmoon
You can always move where you'll end up after a podding, fyi.
o rly? Do tell.
--
99% of Eve-o posters should stop posting. This probably includes me, but definitely includes you. |
Kirjava
Lothian Quay Industries
Zzz
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Posted - 2008.01.10 16:34:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Dromidas Shadowmoon
I'm surprised you haven't set your clone-base to somewhere else by now. After the first podding and realizing that you're stuck, I mean.
You can always move where you'll end up after a podding, fyi.
The problem is that you cant move yourself after a podding, whenever he respawns he will appear in that station without a med faclility and trigger happy campers outside.
~Nyron
Originally by: Minerva Vulcan
But poor victimized Ulf...I weep lavender scented tears for you.
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Avery Fatwallet
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Posted - 2008.01.10 16:37:00 -
[27]
Originally by: nether void
Not sure if people have figured it out yet or not, but you will never get sympathy from the killers in this game. It's not in their nature. Why even try? Waste of time.
Two reasons CCP will never care about this topic:
- You will not cancel you account over it
- It doesn't happen often enough to care about
It doesn't surprise me anymore. I actually would be surprised by the opposite. lol It sucks, but can I change it? No. Will I give in, and just be like everyone else? No. Integrity of character is dead. It's actually cool to be an asshat now, and if you aren't an asshat, you're weak. lol I mean even a company you pay to play this game won't even take a sympathy second to jump you to a station to make a clone and jump your ass back (still in your pod). How hard would that be? lol
Make the game fun for everyone. That's my motto. Personally, I would have let you undock and get a clone, but that's because I would hate to be in that situation, so I'm not going to put another person there. Guess I'm old school.
Sorry, bro.
oh man i love this post. spot on.
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Yakoff
Star Scream Inc.
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Posted - 2008.01.10 17:26:00 -
[28]
One of his biggest problems is that he is currently in a station that CCP has not fixed yet (they screwed it up with Trinity). If he undocks to see if he can make a run - he will undock 3k+ from the station.
Hence - exactly the reason said dictors are camping that station as they know there is a glitch with said undock point. They know that once he undocks he is screwed. He can not warp off due to the dictor, and sure the hell can't not dock back up as he is 3k away from the station.
His invulnerability will not matter because once he tries to run to the station (during or even after invulnerability time period), he will be webbed and killed again.
A fast fitted interceptor might be able to make the getaway - but maybe he does not have the skills for that or there is no ship available for him.
You do have my sympathy - however - you are in 0.0 and you need to live with the consequences of your decisions. Not to troll or flame you, but it was your fault for not looking out for yourself.
CCP can not fix the mistakes you have made to get into this situation.
The only thing CCP would be responsible to help your situation - is to fix the undock point - though I doubt it will help you that much other than being able to take a peek outside to see if they are still there.
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Rainoer
Amarr
Esoteria Liberation Front
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Posted - 2008.01.10 17:44:00 -
[29]
Why can't you wait for the end of the next downtime and then just try logging in over again and over again until you get on.
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Lyn Z
Minmatar
The Nexus Foundation
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Posted - 2008.01.10 17:53:00 -
[30]
Research your station next time.
Oh... and get some corpmates to clear out hostiles outside your station.
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