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Crystal set...unfair Advantage for Shield Tanks?

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Zeba Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2008.01.12 06:09:00 - [31] The vast majority of people are not pvping with crystals they are killing the endless npc hoards in missions. Originally by: Richard Phallus Come live with the common idiot, it's more fun down here. I did and got banned.
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue Sex Panthers	Posted - 2008.01.12 06:19:00 - [32] Originally by: ReePeR McAllem Lets just impliment some new sets then. One that grants shield tankers + percent amount. And a set that does what the crystal does but for armour tankers. Problem solved \o/ Great, that's all I need: ppl to start armor tanking with another +55% peak HP/sec rep amount. No thanks lol. Bellum Eternus [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y I I
Meichou Fnord Works Caldari Deep Space Industral	Posted - 2008.01.12 06:56:00 - [33] Watch THIS and than tell me which ship with shieldtank and the new implant set could do the same.... kkthx for sharing
ZerKar Caldari Zen'Tar	Posted - 2008.01.12 07:18:00 - [34] Originally by: Edelhonk Edited by: Edelhonk on 11/01/2008 14:03:10 Edited by: Edelhonk on 11/01/2008 14:01:06 Originally by: Malcanis Sure. Give me a web and scram that can fit in a high slot and you can have your implants. Contract at Jita 4-4 pls. ok...lets have a look on a gank-PvP (i would fit it this way) fitting for the Marus for example Kronos Large Armor Repairer II Large Armor Repairer II Armor Explosive Hardener II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Conjunctive Magnetometric ECCM Scanning Array I Warp Scrambler II Stasis Webifier II Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L Neutron Blaster Cannon II, Void L Medium Nosferatu II Medium Nosferatu II Medium Nosferatu II Ancillary Current Router I Auxiliary Nano Pump I Ogre II x3 Hammerhead II x5 it can Web, it can scram and with my skills i have a tank from 863 DPS by 14k HP (with a Slave set) and can do around 1070 DPS with Drones and it run stabil on cap for a long time ok, fine ship now the Golem Gravimetric Backup Array II Co-Processor II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II X-Large Shield Booster II Photon Scattering Field II Invulnerability Field II Shield Boost Amplifier II Invulnerability Field II Warp Scrambler II Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800 Siege Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Torpedo Siege Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Rage Torpedo Medium Nosferatu II Medium Nosferatu II Medium Nosferatu II Ancillary Current Router I Ancillary Current Router I Breserker SW-900 x3 or Ogre II x3 It can scram and web (with the drones) (imo a web ist needed ont his ship because its a missle boat and has 3 times the attackrange of the Kronos as example and missles have no tracking speed), and does it has nearly the same tank and damage output (tank 853/Damage 1070 with the ogres) and run stabil on cap the same time. Now give this thing a Crystal set and wush..you have a 1300 dpsTank...wtf? Webbing here IS needed because you forgot your MWD and even WITH it you stand next to no chance of getting ANYTHING to stay in range of your weapons aside from your Drones for a time. +++++++++++++++ I saw the Sign...! O.o
F90OEX	Posted - 2008.01.12 07:40:00 - [35] I'll take some of what the OP smoken ...
DroneBay Diva The Fated Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2008.01.12 07:55:00 - [36] Originally by: Jonny JoJo Originally by: Paulo Damarr Originally by: Jonny JoJo Edited by: Jonny JoJo on 12/01/2008 03:54:22 Ships using Crystal sets damage the fabric of the sub space foam at the Planck distance boundary which causes Amarr lasers to malfunction! More nerfs ffs! The JoJo has spoken! Fixed that for you bringing it more in line with your usual posts. Actually - All of my posts are pretty much spot on - its people like you that make stuff up and pretend I wrote it. For example, the bit you quoted Nope, pretty sure you're an idiot [/troll] _____________________________________________________________________________ Proud to be a Nano-f*g
marketmonkey	Posted - 2008.01.12 10:54:00 - [37] All it takes is one NOS Domi and its game over for any active shield tanker out there. I dont care if you got crystals or not. I think this rant may be more directed at mission runners and not PVPers
Cadiz Caldari No Quarter. Vae Victis.	Posted - 2008.01.12 11:02:00 - [38] Originally by: marketmonkey All it takes is one NOS Domi and its game over for any active shield tanker out there. I dont care if you got crystals or not. I think this rant may be more directed at mission runners and not PVPers People still fly those? I haven't seen one in ages... ------ Director, No Quarter "There is no problem that cannot be solved by the judicious application of violence."
Ghan Tylous The Graduates Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2008.01.12 11:14:00 - [39] Originally by: marketmonkey All it takes is one NOS Domi and its game over for any active shield tanker out there. I dont care if you got crystals or not. I think this rant may be more directed at mission runners and not PVPers NOS ain't that good anymore. Use Neutralizer instead. --- It have always fallen to a few to sacrifice for the good of many Originally by: CCP Sharkbait we are screwed.
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol The Fifth Race	Posted - 2008.01.12 11:27:00 - [40] Hi. Let's analyze realistically the difference between an armor tank and a shield tank. (I've always wanted to do this). Your Tech 2 X-Large Shield Booster uses: Cap Usage: 400 Shield Boost: 600 Activation Time: 5.00 sec Okay, now how about a Tech 2 Large Armor Rep? Cap Usage: 400 Armor Rep: 800 Activation Time: 15.00 sec Wait, did that say FIFTEEN SECONDS? OMGZ MATH TIEM Over one minute: Shields: 4800 cap, 7200 shield boosted. Armor: 1600 cap, 3200 armor repped. Cap usage is a 3:1 ratio while amount boosted/repped is 2.25:1. What's more efficient everyone? THE SOLO FACTOR: Finally I'm going to throw in the whole active shield tanking removes your ability use electronic warfare mods (due to midslot congestion), while passive shield tanking removes your ability to use your mods after any certain amount of time (due to capacitor penalties). Have fun :P _________________ Burn.
Karann Minmatar Locus Solus	Posted - 2008.01.12 11:37:00 - [41] its probably altready been said, but if everything was the same for all races/module fits it would be boring. slaves do a damn fine job also
Estephania Independent Political Analysts	Posted - 2008.01.12 12:13:00 - [42] In my opinion all pirate implants are kind of unfair as they give too much bang for the ISK. PvP play field should be more evenly organized ISK-wise. But that is the natural evolution of any MMORPG - to have rich and veterans happy and interested, cooler and more expensive toys have to be introduced. Pirate implants and other leet items achieve just that, but they also open a huge rift among the players. Originally, I suspect, cap warfare was supposed to be the playground of uber rich and powerful, but as fun factor of sovereignty wars went out of the window with lag and POS game-mechanics this is simply not happening.
Edelhonk Gallente The Alpha Connection	Posted - 2008.01.12 12:56:00 - [43] Edited by: Edelhonk on 12/01/2008 13:01:52 Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Hi. Let's analyze realistically the difference between an armor tank and a shield tank. (I've always wanted to do this). Your Tech 2 X-Large Shield Booster uses: Cap Usage: 400 Shield Boost: 600 Activation Time: 5.00 sec Okay, now how about a Tech 2 Large Armor Rep? Cap Usage: 400 Armor Rep: 800 Activation Time: 15.00 sec Wait, did that say FIFTEEN SECONDS? OMGZ MATH TIEM Over one minute: Shields: 4800 cap, 7200 shield boosted. Armor: 1600 cap, 3200 armor repped. Cap usage is a 3:1 ratio while amount boosted/repped is 2.25:1. What's more efficient everyone? THE SOLO FACTOR: Finally I'm going to throw in the whole active shield tanking removes your ability use electronic warfare mods (due to midslot congestion), while passive shield tanking removes your ability to use your mods after any certain amount of time (due to capacitor penalties). Have fun :P Lol...what a noob...read the whole config braindead 2 Large Tech 2 Armor Reppers vs 1 XLargeShield Booster II + BoostAmplifier lets check the Ratio NOW 2 Large ARep II Cap used 800 Armor Rep 1600 Time 12 sec 2 Low Slots used XLarge+ BoostAmp Cap used 400 Shield Boost 816 Time 5 sec 2 med Slots cap ratio Armor: 1 cap for 2 armorpoints Shield: 1 cap for 2,04 shieldpoints Winner: Shield (without using Crystal set) Time Armor: 106,6 armorpoints every sec Shield: 163,2 Shielpoints every sec Winner: uppps...shield again (and again without using crystal) so who is now more efficient and for for all the "bahh, you noob, you forgot the MWD and you cant web etc.", play a little less fleetbattles maybe when did you saw a solo BS class ship camp a gate, i saw it last time 2005 normaly other, faster ships camp the gate, web and scram you and then the reinforcement is rolling in with warping to 0 and being upclose to you in no time so normaly i can remove the web/scram, same for the MWD for a gate ganking the Slave set is great for Fleet Battles (if you call FleetBattles PvP, i call them boring ship ploping, they are the same fascinating then watching gras growing)) and for Capitolships, yes but when you need a active tank to stay longer in fight or tank damage from more then 1 enemy (and thats normal in small fights or 1vs1) a shield tank + crystal set is so much better.
Malcanis 5 finger discounteers	Posted - 2008.01.12 13:24:00 - [44] Originally by: Edelhonk Edited by: Edelhonk on 12/01/2008 13:01:52 Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Hi. Let's analyze realistically the difference between an armor tank and a shield tank. (I've always wanted to do this). Your Tech 2 X-Large Shield Booster uses: Cap Usage: 400 Shield Boost: 600 Activation Time: 5.00 sec Okay, now how about a Tech 2 Large Armor Rep? Cap Usage: 400 Armor Rep: 800 Activation Time: 15.00 sec Wait, did that say FIFTEEN SECONDS? OMGZ MATH TIEM Over one minute: Shields: 4800 cap, 7200 shield boosted. Armor: 1600 cap, 3200 armor repped. Cap usage is a 3:1 ratio while amount boosted/repped is 2.25:1. What's more efficient everyone? THE SOLO FACTOR: Finally I'm going to throw in the whole active shield tanking removes your ability use electronic warfare mods (due to midslot congestion), while passive shield tanking removes your ability to use your mods after any certain amount of time (due to capacitor penalties). Have fun :P Lol...what a noob...read the whole config braindead 2 Large Tech 2 Armor Reppers vs 1 XLargeShield Booster II + BoostAmplifier lets check the Ratio NOW 2 Large ARep II Cap used 800 Armor Rep 1600 Time 12 sec 2 Low Slots used XLarge+ BoostAmp Cap used 400 Shield Boost 816 Time 5 sec 2 med Slots cap ratio Armor: 1 cap for 2 armorpoints Shield: 1 cap for 2,04 shieldpoints Winner: Shield (without using Crystal set) Time Armor: 106,6 armorpoints every sec Shield: 163,2 Shielpoints every sec Winner: uppps...shield again (and again without using crystal) so who is now more efficient and for for all the "bahh, you noob, you forgot the MWD and you cant web etc.", play a little less fleetbattles maybe when did you saw a solo BS class ship camp a gate, i saw it last time 2005 normaly other, faster ships camp the gate, web and scram you and then the reinforcement is rolling in with warping to 0 and being upclose to you in no time so normaly i can remove the web/scram, same for the MWD for a gate ganking the Slave set is great for Fleet Battles (if you call FleetBattles PvP, i call them boring ship ploping, they are the same fascinating then watching gras growing)) and for Capitolships, yes but when you need a active tank to stay longer in fight or tank damage from more then 1 enemy (and thats normal in small fights or 1vs1) a shield tank + crystal set is so much better. So switch to shield tanking then. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Jenny Spitfire Caldari SIVAKASI	Posted - 2008.01.12 13:33:00 - [45] Originally by: Malcanis Sure. Give me a scram that can fit in a high slot and you can have your implants. Contract at Jita 4-4 pls. Isn't that the heavy interdictors? --------- Technica impendi Caldari generis. Pax Caldaria! Recruitment -KB-
Jonny JoJo Amarr The Imperial Guards Darkness Rising Alliance	Posted - 2008.01.12 13:37:00 - [46] Originally by: Jenny Spitfire Originally by: Malcanis Sure. Give me a scram that can fit in a high slot and you can have your implants. Contract at Jita 4-4 pls. Isn't that the heavy interdictors? Yes. i have setup a 1billion isk contract for his to accept this high slot scram. He does not want to accept it. Refresh to see next Real Life CCP sig(21 total)
Rua Temples of Boom	Posted - 2008.01.12 13:39:00 - [47] In most cases passive armor tanking is superior to active tanking anyway (in most cases, esp at BS level) so slaves are pwn.
Edelhonk Gallente The Alpha Connection	Posted - 2008.01.12 13:51:00 - [48] Edited by: Edelhonk on 12/01/2008 13:52:07 how do you armor tanking passiv??? armor tanking is allways active, because armor doesnt regenerate by itself like a shield. What do you maybe mean is Armor HP Monsters, build to hold up a few mor salvos from the nmy and give it time to fire a few more shots befor it goes boom, but as soon your armor is gone you are dead. That is no tanking, only HP boosting. Shield tankers can be fitted as passiv tankers because the shield regenerates by itself, without using a Booster.
Kcel Chim Caldari Arcane Technologies The Five	Posted - 2008.01.12 14:07:00 - [49] Originally by: Edelhonk Edited by: Edelhonk on 12/01/2008 13:52:07 how do you armor tanking passiv??? armor tanking is allways active, because armor doesnt regenerate by itself like a shield. What do you maybe mean is Armor HP Monsters, build to hold up a few mor salvos from the nmy and give it time to fire a few more shots befor it goes boom, but as soon your armor is gone you are dead. That is no tanking, only HP boosting. Shield tankers can be fitted as passiv tankers because the shield regenerates by itself, without using a Booster. As post #18 has shown youre really comparing 2 different ships here and you made quiet a few mistakes while doing so. You cant compare two ships by treating meds like lows and adding different amount of modules. 3 Web drones will be quickly killed and then ure out of your webbing ability. On another note, none of the two ships you mentioned is designed to be a solo pvp ship (per dev comment) to compare their dps and tank is like comparing a scorpion battleship with an armageddon. While theoretically both "t1 tier 1 pvp bs" both fill different roles. Same goes with the implants too. Slaves are awesome for exspensive faction bs, marauders or capitals. Crystals only really work on faction bs and 2 of the marauders. This means a Crystal set only really works very well on: like 6-8 ships. Slaveset works on atleast 20.

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