EVE Search - Intrusion in missions

Check My IP Information

All Channels

Missions & Complexes

Intrusion in missions

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 :: one page

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
SencneS Amarr Spartan Industrial Manufacturing SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2008.01.12 07:38:00 - [31] Edited by: SencneS on 12/01/2008 07:40:00 I'll tell you why it's not a good idea to give agro just because someone salvages your wreak... The second you open fire on them, they can shoot back. I would bet ISK that if you opened that door you'd have pirates probe you out in missions just to salvage wreaks in the hope you will shoot at them. See, it's a win win for them, either you engage them in PVP while you're tanking the SPAWN, and you die. Or You ignore them and they get salvage. Sounds like a GREAT deal for the pirate. So sure give the mission runners the option, it'll just mean more CNR Wreaks to salvage. Amarr for Life
Wet Ferret	Posted - 2008.01.12 11:03:00 - [32] Originally by: SencneS Edited by: SencneS on 12/01/2008 07:40:00 I'll tell you why it's not a good idea to give agro just because someone salvages your wreak... The second you open fire on them, they can shoot back. I would bet ISK that if you opened that door you'd have pirates probe you out in missions just to salvage wreaks in the hope you will shoot at them. See, it's a win win for them, either you engage them in PVP while you're tanking the SPAWN, and you die. Or You ignore them and they get salvage. Sounds like a GREAT deal for the pirate. So sure give the mission runners the option, it'll just mean more CNR Wreaks to salvage. I still can't understand how this would make more people steal salvage. If anyone wants to get flagged they can already do so at anytime by taking loot from the wrecks. What is the difference?
Layla Ashley Amarr Children of Avalon Avateas Blessed	Posted - 2008.01.12 12:52:00 - [33] i have never been salvage scanned in any mission. you need the salvage? did it ever cross your mind that you can do missions with other agents, in systems where not 10000 ppl are waiting just to scan you down?
Pwett Minmatar QUANT Corp. QUANT Hegemony	Posted - 2008.01.12 14:34:00 - [34] Originally by: SencneS Edited by: SencneS on 12/01/2008 07:40:00 I'll tell you why it's not a good idea to give agro just because someone salvages your wreak... The second you open fire on them, they can shoot back. I would bet ISK that if you opened that door you'd have pirates probe you out in missions just to salvage wreaks in the hope you will shoot at them. See, it's a win win for them, either you engage them in PVP while you're tanking the SPAWN, and you die. Or You ignore them and they get salvage. Sounds like a GREAT deal for the pirate. So sure give the mission runners the option, it'll just mean more CNR Wreaks to salvage. This is EXACTLY what happened when they made jet cans flaggable. Trust me, 9/10 times you're fit for PVE, 10/10 times they're fit to kill you. Careful what you ask for. _______________ Pwett CEO, Founder, & Executor <Q> QUANT Hegemony
Matthew Banker	Posted - 2008.01.12 16:12:00 - [35] Originally by: Checkis Khan Why can he salvage my wrecks, but not loot them? The work you put in to blow up the npc's is already remunerated to you through the bounty on the NPC and the loot drop, both of which are flagged as your property. The creation of the wreck is a side-effect of that work, not part of the remuneration for it. Therefore it is flagged as public property. Originally by: Checkis Khan Why can I not pick up your research BPO/manyfacturing outpur from a lab? Because the output of that job is the remuneration for doing that work, not a side-effect of it. Originally by: Checkis Khan Why is it not "my" mission area, when I am commisioned by Caldari Navy to solve a problem there? Surely the fact that caldari navy have needed to send you in there to kill a load of rats indicates that caldari navy do not have control over that bit of space to begin with? What you suggest would imply that the NPC corporations deliberately let npc pirates into their space for no other reason than to pay you to shoot them. It would make no sense within the eve universe.
SencneS Amarr Spartan Industrial Manufacturing SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2008.01.12 16:40:00 - [36] Originally by: Wet Ferret Originally by: SencneS Edited by: SencneS on 12/01/2008 07:40:00 I'll tell you why it's not a good idea to give agro just because someone salvages your wreak... The second you open fire on them, they can shoot back. I would bet ISK that if you opened that door you'd have pirates probe you out in missions just to salvage wreaks in the hope you will shoot at them. See, it's a win win for them, either you engage them in PVP while you're tanking the SPAWN, and you die. Or You ignore them and they get salvage. Sounds like a GREAT deal for the pirate. So sure give the mission runners the option, it'll just mean more CNR Wreaks to salvage. I still can't understand how this would make more people steal salvage. If anyone wants to get flagged they can already do so at anytime by taking loot from the wrecks. What is the difference? The difference is, flagging loot has been around for years, the second they announce that you'll now get flagged for salvage this is something new, something to try. Most pirates already have scan ability to scan down low sec mission runners. Don't underestimate pirates, these are the same people that will deliberately kill a hauler in high-sec, and be concorded losing their 100mil worth of battleship for the CHANCE the expensive item in the haulers hull will NOT get destroyed. Amarr for Life
MenanceWhite Amarr	Posted - 2008.01.12 18:20:00 - [37] Edited by: MenanceWhite on 12/01/2008 18:21:49 Ship wrecks belongs to noone, or actually more to the person who owned the ship before it was destroyed so anyone is free to salvage it. Probing up missionrunners is allowed, just as gatecamping is allowed. You did'nt think that those probes used or the time that was spent probing you were completely free, did you? --- Originally by: Torfi There's alot. That can be done. With.. corpses Originally by: Oveur
Commander OTG Caldari Logistic Exposium Industries	Posted - 2008.01.12 18:50:00 - [38] I believe I am one of the salvagers that is referred to in this post. I specifically work the areas in and around Motsu as well as a couple other hubs. I have posted previously on this topic with some available solutions/suggestions to avoid unwanted salvaging in your missions. I have made salvaging my primary task in game and have focused all my skills on it for several months. I am maxxed out on all skills pertaining to probing, hacking, archeology..ect..i have spent 100's of millions on implants to perfect this job. I have treated the mission runners with respect and have only followed into missions for salvage AFTER they have left the mission. I have on occassion relinquished all that I have salvaged to a person that returned to the site with a salvager ship... For those interested, my salvaging percentage is maxxed out as well...allowing me to salvage your wrecks pretty much guarantees a higher yield then you would get on your own. If you would like me to salvage your missions and split the proceeds with you I am more then willing. This saves you time, allows you to start another mission and still get roughly the same salage count you would have by doing it yourself....drop me a line ingame. EXECUTIVE OFFICER "Finder of SafeSpots-Killer of Pods"
Veryez	Posted - 2008.01.12 19:43:00 - [39] Originally by: Checkis Khan It appears to me that CCP is aware that this is a problem, and not working as intended, and as he said in his several answers, they are looking into the problems, and will work on solving it. But neither he, or anyone else can answer my original questions : Why can he salvage my wrecks, but not loot them? Why can I not pick up your research BPO/manyfacturing outpur from a lab? Why is it not "my" mission area, when I am commisioned by Caldari Navy to solve a problem there? Perhaps a bit of history would help. I trained and started salvaging the day the skill was released. When the skill was released, you had to loot the wreck first before you could salvage it, additionally you could not tell which wrecks you had looted due to a graphics bug, salvaging was slow and people complained. The graphics bug was fixed, but people still complained about having to loot every wreck. So CCP relented and allowed people to salvage wrecks before looting them, allowing faster looting but adding the problem you have now. As CCP thinking this is a problem, you need to realize that CCP has known about this for a while and done nothing about it. One can easily conculde they don't see this as a problem. Besides what do you think they will do? Shard missions - doubtful they have long stated they are against that. Concord response - no, they want conflict in their game. Criminal flagging - possible, but it will have no real impact, people still jump in and loot missions anyway. Prevent people jumping into missions - no, this is what they want. Bottom line adapt and ignore it, or move to a quieter system. Truthfully, as you get more experienced running missions, you'll quickly realize it isn't worth your time looting and salvaging. You mission in Motsu for the LP's and payouts (as you stated), not for salvage which is the same as any other system. In the time I loot/salvage, I can easily run one to two more missions - earning far more money in that same time. Voice your frustrations on these forums if it makes you feel better, but step back and try to see it from CCP's perspective. They don't want "safe, non-PVP zones", EVE's charm is it's brutal, unrelenting nature (much like space itself). Lastly I do not ninja-salvage other people's missions. I can't be bothered wasting my time. I have salvaged other's people's wrecks in belts or complexes since I occasionally look for certain types of salvage, but I always ask in local if it's ok first.
Tribunal FIRMA	Posted - 2008.01.12 20:33:00 - [40] Bottom feeders Consider it the EvE wellfare systems. Clearly these people can not cope without being parasites, or the only way they can make it through a day is by making someone else upset. Shame that people are that needy for attention. I just ignore them unless they loot something: at which point I just gank them and loot my salvage plus their mods. "We can't all be heroes, because somebody has to sit on the curb and applaud when they go by."

Jack Freely Caldari Trading Corp	Posted - 2008.01.12 20:58:00 - [41] Originally by: Tribunal Bottom feeders Consider it the EvE wellfare systems. Clearly these people can not cope without being parasites, or the only way they can make it through a day is by making someone else upset. Wow name calling and then mocking, are you sure you aren't the bottom feeder?
Tribunal FIRMA	Posted - 2008.01.12 21:21:00 - [42] Originally by: Jack Freely Wow name calling and then mocking, are you sure you aren't the bottom feeder? If that thought helps you cope with being what you are then by all means embrace it. Got another handout wreck for you! "We can't all be heroes, because somebody has to sit on the curb and applaud when they go by."
Tsanse Kinske WeMeanYouKnowHarm	Posted - 2008.01.13 04:07:00 - [43] Originally by: Tribunal Bottom feeders Consider it the EvE wellfare systems. Clearly these people can not cope without being parasites, or the only way they can make it through a day is by making someone else upset. Shame that people are that needy for attention. I just ignore them unless they loot something: at which point I just gank them and loot my salvage plus their mods. It's funny that you use the words "welfare" and "parasites", as from a certain standpoint this seems not to describe people salvaging as their profession quite as well as it does those demanding a new entitlement do salvage as well as all of their other rewards. Which makes the following quote ironic... Quote: If that thought helps you cope with being what you are then by all means embrace it. Got another handout wreck for you! So who is actually asking for a handout here? Mission runner, heal thyself. * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -Douglas Adams, writing about EVE
Tribunal FIRMA	Posted - 2008.01.13 04:27:00 - [44] Edited by: Tribunal on 13/01/2008 04:33:43 Originally by: Tsanse Kinske It's funny that you use the words "welfare" and "parasites", as from a certain standpoint this seems not to describe people salvaging as their profession quite as well as it does those demanding a new entitlement do salvage as well as all of their other rewards. Which makes the following quote ironic... Do you know what a parasite is? It is an organism that lives off another while giving the host nothing in return. If you are salvaging a mission runner's wrecks then you are living off of the mission runner's work and returning nothing. If I let you have something that is a product of my hardwork then you are living off of my handouts. Quote: So who is actually asking for a handout here? Mission runner, heal thyself. I am "healing" myself every night by leaving salvage for the needy. It brings me a sense of joy to help those that struggle on the bottom of the food chain. "We can't all be heroes, because somebody has to sit on the curb and applaud when they go by."
Lance Fighter Amarr	Posted - 2008.01.13 07:26:00 - [45] Edited by: Lance Fighter on 13/01/2008 07:26:57 actually i think a proper parasite takes away from its host.... while it does not give anything in return, it feeds off the host somehow. Anyway, I personally have no comment - most of the time I dont salvage, and if someone wants to take the time and probe me out to salvage the wrecks, let them. disclaimer: Nothing i say, do, think, or once have said, done, nor thought about can be held against me
Kerfira	Posted - 2008.01.13 11:40:00 - [46] Originally by: Checkis Khan Why can he salvage my wrecks, but not loot them? Because that's the rules of the game! Originally by: Checkis Khan Why can I not pick up your research BPO/manyfacturing outpur from a lab? Because that's the rules of the game! Originally by: Checkis Khan Why is it not "my" mission area, when I am commisioned by Caldari Navy to solve a problem there? Because that's the rules of the game! --- Generally, your arguments point to you wanting to play EVE in single-player mode. That's never going to happen (devs have said so plenty of times). You'll ALWAYS be able to be interrupted by other players, no matter what you do in space. Oh, and...... READ MY SIG! Originally by: CCP Wrangler EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
Whineroy	Posted - 2008.01.13 11:51:00 - [47] Originally by: Kerfira Oh, and...... READ MY SIG! Read your own sig, little hypocrite. Read it again. Read it over and over until you can give a proper answer to how that "cold and harsh"- aspect applies to those salvage "thieves" and tell what kind of real risk the "thief" faces with his actions. That "cold and harsh" is nice and cool, however it has to apply to everyone equally.
Vaell'or Kurtanz Sick Cruel and Unusual Methods	Posted - 2008.01.13 11:56:00 - [48] As a salvage reclaimation officer within a currently small salvage corp all there is to say is as said before look at real salvage laws, then come back and whine. And be thankful we're not taking over your mission.
Altaree Red Frog Investments Blue Sky Consortium	Posted - 2008.01.13 13:54:00 - [49] The devs have stated two very important points towards this discussion: 1) Not owning wrecks is a feature. Live with it. 2) They want people to be able to scan down mission runners. Eve is a PVP game. Every part of the game can have some PVP in it. Sometimes it is just harder to see.
Pwett Minmatar QUANT Corp. QUANT Hegemony	Posted - 2008.01.13 17:02:00 - [50] Why don;t you mission runners complain about the people who blitz missions, as they makes them worth less for the rest of us. Otherwise, get out of Motsu. _______________ Pwett CEO, Founder, & Executor <Q> QUANT Hegemony

SheriffFruitfly Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2008.01.13 17:44:00 - [51] CCP hates mission runners, and nerfs them. The double-loot-size is also part of this.
Wet Ferret	Posted - 2008.01.13 17:53:00 - [52] Originally by: Vaell'or Kurtanz As a salvage reclaimation officer within a currently small salvage corp all there is to say is as said before look at real salvage laws, then come back and whine. And be thankful we're not taking over your mission. Who gives a damn about real laws? Seriously. This is EVE Online not Real-Life Online. If they just made wreck flagging an option, off by default, everyone would be happy. Most people don't salvage and probably wouldn't use it at all. And I personally would love to be able to turn off can flagging because it's dumb.
Tsanse Kinske WeMeanYouKnowHarm	Posted - 2008.01.13 18:10:00 - [53] Originally by: Tribunal Edited by: Tribunal on 13/01/2008 04:33:43 Originally by: Tsanse Kinske It's funny that you use the words "welfare" and "parasites", as from a certain standpoint this seems not to describe people salvaging as their profession quite as well as it does those demanding a new entitlement do salvage as well as all of their other rewards. Which makes the following quote ironic... Do you know what a parasite is? It is an organism that lives off another while giving the host nothing in return. If you are salvaging a mission runner's wrecks then you are living off of the mission runner's work and returning nothing. If I let you have something that is a product of my hardwork then you are living off of my handouts. There are two kinds of "work" here. The first is the one you're so concerned with, doing missions, killing NPCs, accomplishing mission objectives. For that, you receive what you always have, completion rewards, LP, standings, and ownership of loot. Plus in the normal course of things, a lot of bounties injected directly into your wallet. Salvage is something new, not tied specifically to missions, which requires another stage of "work". The work involves getting to the right place at the right time, and using at the minimum a salvaging module and your salvaging skill on a wreck. Whoever does so, produces, extracts, and gets legal ownership the salvage. You have no more special right to salvage you haven't extracted, either in terms of the game mechanics or in additional work you've done to earn it, than you do the bounties on mission NPCs that somebody else kills, or the minerals in mission asteroids that somebody else mines. * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -Douglas Adams, writing about EVE
SencneS Amarr Spartan Industrial Manufacturing SMASH Alliance	Posted - 2008.01.13 19:38:00 - [54] Originally by: Tsanse Kinske You have no more special right to salvage you haven't extracted, either in terms of the game mechanics or in additional work you've done to earn it. This right here is a great argument. The salvage is not "there" until you do something to the wreak. Just like the loot in the wreak. How did you get that loot? You killed the ship. So the loot belongs to you. The salvage is not there until you perform an action on the wreak. In this case "salvage the wreak" when it turns into Rig Components then it belongs to the person who actually did the salvage work. We all know the same wreak salvaged by different people will produce more or less and possibly different components. This means someone with top salvage skills and the prospector implants etc will get more salvage then someone how just has Salvaging LVL 1. So you killed the active ship and turned it into a wreak, great you have been rewarded for your actions. You got a bounty and the loot. It is a wreak and will always be a wreak until an action is performed on it. Whoever does that action to the wreak has 100% right to what salvage it has. Everything in EVE is exactly this way. Asteroids are worth nothing to anyone until you do something to it, mine it. NCPs are worth nothing to anyone until you do something to them, kill them. Wreaks are worth nothing to anyone until you do something to them, salvage it. Each of these actions has a reward associated with the action you perform on them. Why should wreaks be flaggable when you have already been rewarded TWICE for a single action. One being the BOUNTY, the second being the loot. The wreak only rewards once for an action being performed. Amarr for Life
Dr Sharp Caldari Sick Cruel and Unusual Methods	Posted - 2008.01.13 19:41:00 - [55] It's not fair! Being the CEO of a recently formed and quite successful salvaging corp. I would just like to say the following. Why cant I tractor other people wrecks? it would make salvaging other pilots missions so much quicker. I don't mind if it criminal flags me, most of the time we are cleaning up after the mission runner has left and handed the mission in. The most efficient way of salvaging missions is to book mark them when they are being run then come back later when the mission has been handed in. Also why cant I scan for wrecks? - wouldn't even need to carebear bother if we could only find all the wrecks that have been left behind. - When I think of all those lonely, unloved, abandon wrecks sitting in the cold, dark void, it upsets me Carebare mission runners get: Mission Reward ISK LP reward Rat Bounties Rat loot and 9 times out of 10 all the salvage I fail to see why they are getting so upset? __________________ SCUM Lord
Jack Freely Caldari Trading Corp	Posted - 2008.01.13 20:20:00 - [56] Originally by: Dr Sharp Also why cant I scan for wrecks? - wouldn't even need to carebear bother if we could only find all the wrecks that have been left behind. - When I think of all those lonely, unloved, abandon wrecks sitting in the cold, dark void, it upsets me I wonder how much lag there is with all these wreaks with loot sitting in them in a single system. The wreaks stay for a few hours so that has to take up a lot of space on the servers.
Manipulator Minmatar	Posted - 2008.01.14 02:16:00 - [57] They already made it harder to find you since wrecks don't show anymore, besides THEY DON'T BELONG TO ANYONE. It's floating space junk, salvaging is a profession. See my sig.
Atlanton Marcus Caldari Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.01.14 02:22:00 - [58] Think of wrecks as asteroids that appear when you destroy a ship. Problem solved.
Wet Ferret	Posted - 2008.01.14 04:09:00 - [59] Originally by: Atlanton Marcus Think of wrecks as asteroids that appear when you destroy a ship. Problem solved. Kind of like loot? Face it, players create wrecks. They don't create asteroids, or NPCs. So you can't really use that analogy when it comes to ownership. The wrecks are there only because someone else made an effort to create it.
Ulstan	Posted - 2008.01.14 16:40:00 - [60] Salvaging is a profession, and the 'bottom feeder scavengers/salvagers' archetype is a very common one in scifi. I don't understand why people get so upset over it... Salvage doesn't belong to anyone. You would think this would be obvious from the term 'salvage'. Look up the history of nautical salvage rights if you're interested. You can do a couple different things a) Don't mission in hotspots where there are lots of salvagers waiting in the wings b) Salvage as you go, using a maurader or something c) Get a second character/alt/friend to salvage as you go d) Blow up your wrecks when the intruder salvager shows up e) If you were going to come back and salvage in a dedicated salvaging ships, just skip the salvaging and run another mission instead



Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online, the EVE logo, EVE and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to EVE-Search.com to use EVE Online and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, EVE-Search.com. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.