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Snee
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Posted - 2008.01.30 09:21:00 -
[1]
Heya,
I'm not saying this screenshot is representative of most player's kits, but it does make clear the insane leverage invul fields, shield amps, and crystal implants give you over their armor tanking equivalents (as if we had them).
I don't mind lasers being terrible, or weapon disruption being relatively ineffective, but I always became an amarr to tank.
Try coming up with something similar for armor tanking in EFT I dare ya.
And yes I know someone with a setup like this .... and mine is pretty arbitrary so I'm sure it could be improved, I'm an armor tanker after all.
if the graphic doesnt work it's here on evefiles.
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0801/ravenyikes.jpg
L,
Snee
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Dristra
Amarr
Shadows of the Dead
The Dawn of Darkness
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Posted - 2008.01.30 09:28:00 -
[2]
Troll much?
It's great being Amarr isn't it.
Support the introduction of Blaze M crystals for Amarr!
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Snee
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Posted - 2008.01.30 09:36:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Dristra
Troll much?
Well, it is sort of dramatic, the differences in available synergy.
If the conversation has been had dozens of times before I apologize, I've been away for a couple of years.
Snee
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Elena Vherokia
Silent Service Limited
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Posted - 2008.01.30 09:40:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Snee
Originally by: Dristra
Troll much?
Well, it is sort of dramatic, the differences in available synergy.
If the conversation has been had dozens of times before I apologize, I've been away for a couple of years.
Snee
1. I dont like EFT warriors - but thats only me I guess.
2. If you go as EFT warrior, then give it a run on the uber-Abaddon armor tank. You will achieve similar numbers.
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Shevar
Minmatar
A.W.M
Ka-Tet
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Posted - 2008.01.30 09:49:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Shevar on 30/01/2008 09:50:05
Originally by: Elena Vherokia
Originally by: Snee
Originally by: Dristra
Troll much?
Well, it is sort of dramatic, the differences in available synergy.
If the conversation has been had dozens of times before I apologize, I've been away for a couple of years.
Snee
1. I dont like EFT warriors - but thats only me I guess.
2. If you go as EFT warrior, then give it a run on the uber-Abaddon armor tank. You will achieve similar numbers.
No you won't, you can't even come close.
That being said these theoritical setups are hardly used due to the cost of loosing such a ship. So I can't really care that much about it.
---
-The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs |
Snee
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Posted - 2008.01.30 09:53:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Elena Vherokia
1. I dont like EFT warriors - but thats only me I guess.
2. If you go as EFT warrior, then give it a run on the uber-Abaddon armor tank. You will achieve similar numbers.
It isnt even close. almost 11k at 90%?
Post it, please, because I don't know how to duplicate those numbers.
Snee
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2008.01.30 09:55:00 -
[7]
Try again, this time using CN modules tops, and overheating only one module.
Then do the same with T2 modules only, and no overheating at all.
Then remove the crystal implants.
After that, we shall talk again.
1|2|3|4|5. |
Big Al
The Aftermath
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Posted - 2008.01.30 09:57:00 -
[8]
Or you take 1 of those invulns, sell it, fit mega pulse abaddons (or geddons if you'd like some money leftover) with all the proceeds...
Lock onto the raven and 1 volley it.
News at 11: shield and armor tanking are different.
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Ancy Denaries
Caldari
Under Heavy Fire
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Posted - 2008.01.30 10:03:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Ancy Denaries on 30/01/2008 10:04:17
Are you stupid or just r*tarded?
1st: Raven State Issue.
Lol, many people own one of those for sure.
2nd:
Full faction outfit. You, I'd like to see you PvP in that. I'll be happy to blow you to bits.
3rd:
Everything overloaded, eh? How much can you tank in a minute when you've burned out every single module you have?
4th:
Cruise AND Siege launchers? Learn to fit properly and then come back.
5th:
No clear purpose. You can't PvP in it, you can't run missions (effectively) in it. So what the hell is it's use anyway?
6th:
T2 rigs? Even if you are insanely rich, this ship will ruin you. I'd love to hear the cries of agony when this thing gets close to instapopped by a couple of laserboats.
You sir, fail epically! (fear my leet spelling) Even at trolling.
Originally by: "GM Tacgnol"
Oveur descended from the heavens (also known as the second floor) and beat us all with his nerfbat.
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Snee
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Posted - 2008.01.30 10:26:00 -
[10]
I stated at the outset this is not a normative setup.
but the nested leverage is there, whether you choose to spend 100b+ on a officer loaded unique ship or not.
Even without the overloading, it kicks the other uniques all to hell.
Just thought it was interesting, that the math was so grotesque.
As I said, when last I was here, there was no state issue, so it wasn't as pronounced.
Hell I'd settle for the Gallente repairer bonus instead of weapon cap reduction on my Absolution.
If you adjust for initial race distributions, are amarr ships as popular as the other races?
Do people start out as Caldari and switch to an Amarr alt as often as the reverse?
Seems like something might need to be tweaked.
Tanking should be an amarr strength, its not like we're smart or pretty.
Snee
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Pan Crastus
Amarr
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Posted - 2008.01.30 10:32:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Snee
Heya,
I'm not saying this screenshot is representative of most player's kits, but it does make clear the insane leverage invul fields, shield amps, and crystal implants give you over their armor tanking equivalents (as if we had them).
I don't mind lasers being terrible, or weapon disruption being relatively ineffective, but I always became an amarr to tank.
Try coming up with something similar for armor tanking in EFT I dare ya.
And yes I know someone with a setup like this .... and mine is pretty arbitrary so I'm sure it could be improved, I'm an armor tanker after all.
if the graphic doesnt work it's here on evefiles.
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/0801/ravenyikes.jpg
L,
Snee
Use a Nightmare.
EVE Online: a cold, cruel world where (RL-)rich people replace their losses with GTCs sold to poor students who need to farm ISK to afford their play time ...
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates
Enuma Elish.
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Posted - 2008.01.30 10:58:00 -
[12]
Not as bad as it sounds:
http://pics.livejournal.com/sobrique/pic/00027be2
7600dps tanked on an impoc. Without a pirate set providing more active tank.
But both setups are pointless and moronic, because
a) no one has level 5 skills in everything
b) only morons PvP in office fitted unique battleships
c) even if a moron did PvP in said officer fitted battleship, all you're really doing is providing a really good day to the person who does (and they will) eventually kill you.
d) overloaded mods do not a permatank make, so comparing sustained tank duration is moronic. Compare if you will the lifespan of that (pointless) fit, including module burnout, and you'll see the DPS tanked is probably actually less than a slave implant damnation.
e) yes, crystals are good. And yet almost everyone PvPs with armour tanking ships. Why is this do you think?
--
Crane needs more grid
249km locking? |
Vyllana
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Posted - 2008.01.30 11:03:00 -
[13]
Dude it's a bunch of estamel's, chelm's, and draclira's gear. You could buy a fleet of dreadnoughts for the cost of that setup. It's completely irrelevant to anything in reality. Furthermore, for using that much gear, it's a horrible setup, as cap power relays penalize your shield boosting. Try a realistically set up raven (i.e. T2 and maybe a few faction mods, NO officer gear) and compare that with a similarly set up Abaddon, and the numbers, if anything, will come out in the Abaddon's favor.
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Sevro
Amarr
Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2008.01.30 11:50:00 -
[14]
Related to Jonny JoJo?
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Elena Vherokia
Silent Service Limited
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Posted - 2008.01.30 12:17:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Snee
Originally by: Elena Vherokia
1. I dont like EFT warriors - but thats only me I guess.
2. If you go as EFT warrior, then give it a run on the uber-Abaddon armor tank. You will achieve similar numbers.
It isnt even close. almost 11k at 90%?
Post it, please, because I don't know how to duplicate those numbers.
Snee
8K easily, 7930 tank to be exact. If you can not achieve that with EFT, then you better go back to Jonny for EFT warrior trolling school :) Whereas the Abaddon can surpass the Raven in dps, while offering a more consistant setup over range.
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Droneo Queen
Gallente
Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2008.01.30 12:54:00 -
[16]
get the **** out
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Terianna Eri
Amarr
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Posted - 2008.01.30 13:08:00 -
[17]
You do know that overloading a shield booster causes any shield boost amps you may currently be fitting to instantly burn out, right?
That's what the "heat damage penalty: 100" is on shield boost amps.
So yes, overload your modules and watch as your tank is instantly only half as strong.
__________________________________
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Grimpak
Gallente
Trinity Nova
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Posted - 2008.01.30 13:08:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Sevro
Related to Jonny JoJo?
better yet.
stop posting with alts, JoJo.
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planetary interaction idea! |
Perfect Diamond
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Posted - 2008.01.30 13:17:00 -
[19]
No mercy here. Use realistic setups.
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Frug
Zenithal Harvest
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Posted - 2008.01.30 13:31:00 -
[20]
I can't believe I wasted my time looking at that stupid setup.
Use realistic setups or go away.
- - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - -
If you think I'm awesome, say BOOO
BOOO!! - Ductoris
Neat look what I found - Kreul
Hey, my marbles |
adriaans
Amarr
Advanced Capital Ship Designs
Hephaestus Rising
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Posted - 2008.01.30 13:46:00 -
[21]
i believe an active claymore or sleipnir setup will tank a lot more...
-sig-
Support the introduction of Blaze M crystals for Amarr! (Or make Amarr the only race able to deal EM damage from turrets).
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Hydrogen
Art of War
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Posted - 2008.01.30 14:28:00 -
[22]
Originally by: adriaans
i believe an active claymore or sleipnir setup will tank a lot more...
18864 Reinforced defense efficiency on a claymore ;)
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- click here - |
Derek Sigres
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Posted - 2008.01.30 14:56:00 -
[23]
I've never even SEEN an estamael's Invulnerability field being sold through contract but with their 50% resist all, I imagine it's pretty staggeringly expensive.
And to be fair, your average shield tanker may have Invul II's (+25% resist all) or possibly faction invulnerabilities (Caldari navy Invuls are +27.5% resist all).
Can those numbers be reproduced with an armor tank? Probably not - but let's face it, those numbers won't ever be produced on anything non capital since no one would take what is almost certainly a 20+ billion isk Raven into combat.
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Red Harvest
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Posted - 2008.01.30 15:16:00 -
[24]
Last time i saw the Estamel¦s Invul on contract it sold for 10bil (was some time ago so i guess the inflation has it up to 20 bil by now).
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Riho
Mercenary Forces
Exquisite Malevolence
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Posted - 2008.01.30 15:27:00 -
[25]
1. Op is a troll
2. op is a stupid troll
3. Op is a stupid eft warrior troll
ok... my points.
almost no one in this game will ever fly this ship (state issue raven) as there are only a few of them in game.
no one whit that kind of isk to fit a ship like that, will fit such a crap fit on it.
so what you cant get that kind of a tank on a armor tank. you cant fit webs/scrams/inj/ab or mwd on a shield tanking ship also. armor tankers can do that while still having a tank.
stupid thread anyways... why im even bothering to argue whit eft warriors :P
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This is Me |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2008.01.30 15:44:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Riho
1. Op is a troll
2. op is a stupid troll
3. Op is a stupid eft warrior troll
4. Heavy energy neutralizers
1|2|3|4|5. |
Disco Flint
The Flaming Sideburn's
Hedonistic Imperative
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Posted - 2008.01.30 16:12:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Disco Flint on 30/01/2008 16:13:05
Doesn't the State Raven have 8 launcher slots? And why did you use faction ammo for the cruise launchers, but standard ammo for the siege launchers? Officer launchers really take a lot of fitting compared to faction, ... wtf, you're not capstable with all that junk without the two Nos?
Also, smartbombs on a missile ship are delicate at best, one ounce of lag and your own salvo goes poof. Worse yet, you have two different rofs on that thing, you'll routinely pop your own missiles with that... uberfit of doom.
God, this fit is so bad... I can't look away... gah
Here, have something equally silly for an armor tank. Yes, that's an Impoc. I feel dirty now :(
edit: meh, forgot mining implants and gang bonuses... whatever.
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Derek Sigres
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Posted - 2008.01.30 16:32:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Big Al
Edited by: Big Al on 30/01/2008 10:08:54
Obvious troll is obvious, but we'll go for it anyway.
Or you take 1 of those invulns, sell it, fit mega pulse abaddons (or geddons if you'd like some money leftover) with all the proceeds...
Lock onto the raven and 1 volley it.
News at 11: shield and armor tanking are different.
Even if you want to make the argument that potential tanking setups don't have parity - A completely pimped out abaddon will tank about 7k, and it costs less than 1/20th of the state issue setup.
I guess I was entirely wrong in my assessment as I didn't glance beyond the invul fields when I made my comment. At between 30 and 60 billion for the hardners alone, this ship could singlehandedly bankroll 30 incredibly well fitted faction battleships (with select pieces of faction gear to boot). Plus, as far as I know there are only a handful of State Issue Ravens in the game, so getting one is probably a multi-billion dollar prospect and I'm not sure if the lucky owners would feel like selling them for anything short of a fitted mothership price. The rest of the gear is easily in the billions of dollars if not tens of billions of dollars range.
But, for the sake of argument, let's say you DID take your full officer fitted state issue raven into battle. In a 1 V 1 no battleship in the world could punch through your tank. But we all know that when people see your fancy faction ship (much less one of the rarest ships in the game, one that most people will have only seen screenshots of if that) they are going to do one of 2 things: Run away and hide until you leave or get a half dozen friends in battleships and what have you to take you down. Yes with a tank that strong you'd probably take more than a few people with you, but hey - they could lose a thousand t1 fitted battleships and still win the war of attrition.
Such an insane fitting would ONLY be found on a ship that is monstrously expensive by default such as mother ships or titans. Lowly dreds and carriers are not worthy of a fitting that would exceed their price by many tens of billions.
As a second note, yes shield tanking caldari boats can generally take more damage than an Amarrian Armor tank, but that is simply because 1x Large shield booster and 1x boost amp out tanks 2 LAR's. Of course, when a caldari pilot sacrifices lots of mids to his super tank, you give up PvP essentials like MWD, web and every other nasty trick in the book.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2008.01.30 16:35:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Derek Sigres
as far as I know there are only a handful of State Issue Ravens in the game
8, unless some were destroyed
Quote:
so getting one is probably a multi-billion dollar prospect
80 bil, actually
Quote:
The rest of the gear is easily in the billions of dollars if not tens of billions of dollars range.
around 50-60 bil extra, yeah.
Quote:
But, for the sake of argument, let's say you DID take your full officer fitted state issue raven into battle.
First 0.0 gate, ships of a combined value under 1 bil ISK, your ship goes poof.
1|2|3|4|5. |
Kery Nysell
Caldari
Nysell Incorporated
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Posted - 2008.01.30 18:43:00 -
[30]
OW ! My eyes !
A beautiful ship like that MURDERED by Cap Power Relays ...
Seriously, EFT = bad, overloading Estamel's = bad ... that setup is sustainable for maybe a minute before you just DESTROY 150 BILLIONS of officer loot ... so very sad.
And let's forget about the insane resists EANM IIs and good Compensation skills can give without an ounce of cap , shall we ... my Dominix has a harder tank than my CNR ...
<~ sig starts here
My Skills |
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