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Darth Decon Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.30 13:20:00 - [1] Edited by: Darth Decon on 30/01/2008 13:25:16 SMALL GANG SETUP: high's: x2 Arbalist Assult Launcher's w/Caldari Navy flame burst light missles x5 250mm Railgun II's w/ Caldari Navy Antimater Med's: x1 Medium Sheild booster II's x1 Invul field II's x1 Photon Scadering Field II's x2 Large Sheild Exstender II's x1 10mn MWD Lows: x2 Power Diegnostics Systems II's x2 Magnetic Field Stabulyzers II's Drone's: x5 Hobgoblin's Rig Slots: x2 Sheild Exstender rigs SNIPER SETUP: Highs: x5 250mm Railgun II's w/ Spike ammo x2 seige warfare link mods Meds: x1 Medium Sheild Booster II's x3 Sensor Booster II's x2 Tracking Computers II's Lows: x2 Magnetic field Stabulizers II's x2 Tracking enhancer II's Drone's: x5 Hobgoblin's Rig Slots: x2 Sheild Exstender rigs FLEET SETUP: High's: x2 250mm Railgun II w/ Caldari Navy Antimatter x2 Advanced Limos Heavy Launchers w/ Caldari Navy Widow maker Heavy Missles x3 Seige Warfare Link mods Med's: x1 Medium Sheild booster II's x1 Invul field II's x1 Photon Scadering Field II's x3 Large Sheild Exstender II's Lows: x2 Power Diegnostics Systems II's x2 Magnetic Field Stabulyzers II's Drone's: x5 Hobgoblin's Rig Slots: x2 Sheild Exstender rigs *GANK SETUP:* High's: x5 Heavy Nutron Blasters II w/ Void ammo x2 Abolist assult Launchers w/ Caldari Navy Flamburst Missles Med's: x1 Medium Sheild booster II x1 Invul Feild II x1 Photon Scadering Field II x1 Warp Disruptor I x1 Stasis Web II x1 10 MN MWD Lows: x4 Magnetic Field Stabulizers II Drone's: x5 Hobgoblin's Rig Slots: x2 Sheild Exstender rigs Hope you try them:
Rathverg Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.30 19:29:00 - [2] bump
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.30 20:24:00 - [3] 1) Medium shield booster on a command ship is pointless. Use a LSB II, or drop it entirely for more resists or extenders. 2) Half of your setups are missing the MWD. Fix this. 3) 4x magstabs on the gank setup is pointless due to stacking penalties, so drop one of them for something useful. Now, then, setups: FLEET SNIPER: Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Damage Control II 10MN MicroWarpdrive II Sensor Booster II Sensor Booster II Tracking Computer II Tracking Computer II Tracking Computer II 250mm Railgun II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M 250mm Railgun II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M 250mm Railgun II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M 250mm Railgun II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M 250mm Railgun II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Improved Cloaking Device II Siege Warfare Link - Shield Harmonizing Spike M and a faction long-range ammo also in cargo, of course. SMALL-GANG TANK (Tanks 1400 dps as long as the cap lasts) Power Diagnostic System II Power Diagnostic System II Power Diagnostic System II Damage Control II 10MN Afterburner II Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I,Cap Booster 800 Large Shield Booster II Shield Boost Amplifier II Photon Scattering Field II Invulnerability Field II 200mm Railgun II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M 200mm Railgun II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M 200mm Railgun II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M 200mm Railgun II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M 200mm Railgun II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Siege Warfare Link - Shield Harmonizing Siege Warfare Link - Active Shielding Core Defence Operational Solidifier I Core Defence Operational Solidifier I Optionally, switch the rigs for shield booster cap reduction, dropping maximum tank down to 1000 dps but letting you run it longer before draining your cap. BLASTER VULTURE Power Diagnostic System II Power Diagnostic System II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II 10MN MicroWarpdrive II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Photon Scattering Field II Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II Heavy Neutron Blaster II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II,Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Missile Launcher II,Thunderbolt Heavy Missile Siege Warfare Link - Shield Harmonizing Core Defence Field Extender I Core Defence Field Extender I Drones_Active=Warrior II,5 Null M in cargo, of course. 15-20km effective range with blasters is nice.
Darth Decon Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.30 20:29:00 - [4] Edited by: Darth Decon on 30/01/2008 20:29:59 See with the Medium Sheild Booster II you can tank 366 dps with the small gang setup 456 dps with the fleet setup and still do decent ammount of damage with your rails and two missle launcher's.
Gypsio III Darkness Inc. Blood Blind	Posted - 2008.01.30 20:49:00 - [5] A fourth damage mod adds ~5% DPS. That may not be great, but it's certainly not pointless either. Whether a different mod would be a better choice is a different question.
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.30 20:50:00 - [6] Originally by: Darth Decon Edited by: Darth Decon on 30/01/2008 20:29:59 See with the Medium Sheild Booster II you can tank 366 dps with the small gang setup 456 dps with the fleet setup and still do decent ammount of damage with your rails and two missle launcher's. 350-450 dps tanked is just laughable for a Vulture. An active tank with a LSB II can tank 1400 dps. My passive buffer tanked blaster setup tanks 490 dps just as a side effect of getting 185,000 EHP. A MSB is just a complete waste of a slot, either go passive and tank slightly more dps with no cap drain, or go with a true active tank, fit a LSB II, and tank well over 1000 dps.
Darth Decon Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.30 20:54:00 - [7] Ok mabey but you and i have diffrent i deas about setup and fitting diffrent ship type's not to mention your in bob so you probly have alot more sp then me so you could probly tank it better..... How ever these setups do work so give them a try..... They work for me and they can work for you aswell
MuffinsRevenger EmpiresMod	Posted - 2008.01.30 21:08:00 - [8] Originally by: Darth Decon Ok mabey but you and i have diffrent i deas about setup and fitting diffrent ship type's not to mention your in bob so you probly have alot more sp then me so you could probly tank it better..... How ever these setups do work so give them a try..... They work for me and they can work for you aswell If you wana tank a vulture extenders and hardners is the way to go irelevant of skillpoints pretty much :p
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.30 22:48:00 - [9] Originally by: Darth Decon Ok mabey but you and i have diffrent i deas about setup and fitting diffrent ship type's not to mention your in bob so you probly have alot more sp then me so you could probly tank it better..... How ever these setups do work so give them a try..... They work for me and they can work for you aswell It's not about skills or preferences, your setups are simply wrong. A MSB and LSB give the exact same shield/cap ratio, the LSB simply gives it to you twice as fast. By fitting a LSB and activating it half as often, you get the exact same results as the MSB, but you also have the option to run it more often and get a higher (but less sustainable long-term) peak tank when you need it. The real problem is the MSB gives you the worst of both worlds. You get all of the downsides of an active tank (cap use, less HP buffer) with none of the benefits (much higher peak dps tanked). The only time you ever fit a MSB is on ships that lack the fitting for a LSB, and the Vulture is definitely not one of them. And this is true regardless of your skills. Yes, I probably have better skills than you, since I have max siege warfare skills + mindlink and almost all of my tanking skills to V, but that just means all of my setups will be better than all of yours. This doesn't change the relative merits of those setups, my Vulture with a MSB will be better than your Vulture with a MSB, but both of us will still do better with a LSB. The only reason your setups "work" is that the Vulture is just naturally so good at tanking that any halfway sane setup will do alright in a lot of situations. Unless you fit something completely stupid like 5x civilian shield boosters, it's almost impossible to make a Vulture with a truly bad tank. But that doesn't mean you can't do better than you are right now.
Darth Decon Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.30 22:58:00 - [10] look evryone fly's there ships diffrently and i have found a setup that does work for what i use it for. So if you have diffrent idea's for vulture setups then fine post them here if not then stop telling me that my fitt's are all wrong because there not.

Merin Ryskin FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.30 23:08:00 - [11] Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 30/01/2008 23:11:42 Originally by: Darth Decon look evryone fly's there ships diffrently and i have found a setup that does work for what i use it for. So if you have diffrent idea's for vulture setups then fine post them here if not then stop telling me that my fitt's are all wrong because there not. WTS: Reading Comprehension I Seriously, did you even read my post, or did you just stop at "waaaaaahh!!! the evil bob player is disagreeing with me!!! it's not FAIR!!!!"? Your setups "work" because the Vulture is so good at tanking that even a mediocre setup will do alright in a lot of situations. If you only take on easy targets, you can get away with a MSB fit. But that doesn't change the simple fact that a LSB is better in every way. I will repeat, since you didn't read it the first time: A LSB and MSB have exactly identical shield/cap ratios, the LSB just gives it to you twice as fast. By running the LSB half the time, you get the exact same effect as a MSB, but you have the option to run it full time and get twice the tank if you need it. Therefore there is absolutely no reason to fit a MSB over a LSB. A Vulture has way more than enough grid/cpu to allow a LSB, so do it. And maybe you should actually read before whining. I posted three setups already, how many more do you want?
Darth Decon Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.30 23:17:00 - [12] Im not whining i just said a LSB uses alot more cap then the MSB and your getting steamed over it. so i would like you to stop calling my setup's pointless because that is a false Acusation. They work just fine
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.30 23:28:00 - [13] Edited by: Merin Ryskin on 30/01/2008 23:31:03 Originally by: Darth Decon Im not whining i just said a LSB uses alot more cap then the MSB and your getting steamed over it. so i would like you to stop calling my setup's pointless because that is a false Acusation. They work just fine Seriously, read the damn post before trying to argue about this. The LSB uses the exact same amount of cap as a MSB. If you want to boost 1000 shield HP, it costs you exactly the same amount of cap to do it with the MSB as it does with the LSB. The only difference is with the LSB, you have two choices: 1) Boost that 1000 shield HP in half the time, with twice the cap used per second. This gives you twice the dps tanked as the MSB for short periods of time. 2) Boost that 1000 shield HP in the same amount of time, with the same cap per second used, by alternating on/off cycles with the LSB. This exactly duplicates the function of the MSB. If this is still too complicated, think about it this way: A LSB is a MSB with the option to "overload" it for an unsustainable increase in tank over short periods of time. There is no reason to fit a plain MSB, since a LSB does exactly the same thing with a bonus option the MSB lacks. And no, it's entirely a true accusation. Your setups only work "fine" because you're using an inherently good ship against less than impressive opposition. In a situation that actually challenges a command ship properly, yours will die horribly, while mine lives and gets the killmails. Seriously, just think about this for a second... I could fit a Vulture with civilian shield boosters and it would do "fine", as long as I use it for killing unarmed industrials. Would you consider this a good setup, or would you laugh at it and tell me to fix it?
Darth Decon Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.30 23:32:00 - [14] Listen i dont kill unarmed industrials with this i kill combatships so as far as this goes your way off track my setups work for fleets small gangs and sniping so dont tell me i dont know how to fit my damn ships
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.30 23:44:00 - [15] Originally by: Darth Decon Listen i dont kill unarmed industrials with this i kill combatships so as far as this goes your way off track my setups work for fleets small gangs and sniping so dont tell me i dont know how to fit my damn ships And this just once again proves how little you actually understand about the game... your setups "work" in fleets because when you have a group of ships, the individual quality of those ships matters much less. Where in a 1v1 fight if we knock off 50% of your ship's effectiveness your side loses 50% effectiveness, in a 100 man fleet, that same 50% drop on your ship only means a .5% decrease in effectiveness for the fleet as a whole. Going from 99 people to 100 provides twice as much benefit to the fleet as fixing your broken setup. Now, does this mean your setups are working as well as they could be? Hell no. It only means that your flaws are being compensated for by the rest of your gang. Now, stop getting all defensive and actually read the posts I've made explaning WHY your setups are wrong, and you will do better. Unless of course you're perfectly satisfied with mediocre performance and just barely doing the job well enough to survive. In that case, feel free to keep using broken setups. Just don't come whining to the forums when you lose your ships to an opponent who actually knows what they're doing and fits the best they possibly can.
Darth Decon Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.30 23:51:00 - [16] The only thing mediocer is your attitued tward people who dosnt have perfect skills listen I use EFT and i use those fittings in combat Small gangs it works very well..... not mediocer.. you may not think i know what im talking about but i do.... And far as tank is concernd i would not be able to tank over 1000 dps with your setup hen's the diffrence in skills to lvl 5 comes in to play and you dont seem to get that.....
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.30 23:55:00 - [17] sigh Seriously, would you please take the time to read beyond "OMG HE DOESN'T RECOGNIZE MY GENIUS, NOT FAIR!!! NOT FAIR!!!!" and actually understand the numbers I've posted? If you have the minimum skills to undock the ship, you will do better with my setups than with yours. If you have decent skills, IVs with a couple Vs, you will do better with my setups than with yours. If you have perfect level Vs in everything, you will do better with my setups than with yours. The only difference is that you might tank 400 dps with the MSB and 800 with the LSB, while I tank 700 dps with the MSB and 1400 with the LSB. But in both cases, the LSB is far better.
Calexis Atredies Quantum Industries Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2008.01.31 00:01:00 - [18] Listen to the BoBit... I fly one too, even though I use passive I can say from experience that a MSB II even with the gang boosts gives a patyhetic tank, only ship where you have no choice is a cerb. And no flaming BoBits when they post... they may be ebil but they do know how to fit ships for pvp.
ElCholo Minmatar The SMITE Brotherhood Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.01.31 00:05:00 - [19] You are wasting your breath Bobbit This one either does not understand the philosophy of toggling the shield booster or is simply too lazy to manually control it.
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.31 00:10:00 - [20] Originally by: Calexis Atredies Listen to the BoBit... I fly one too, even though I use passive I can say from experience that a MSB II even with the gang boosts gives a patyhetic tank, only ship where you have no choice is a cerb. And no flaming BoBits when they post... they may be ebil but they do know how to fit ships for pvp. Passive is good too. Arguably, it's better for larger gang fights... you lose a lot of peak tank, but you get a much higher buffer. That blaster setup I posted tanks almost 500 dps passive, with 185,000 EHP. The 1400 dps tank on the active one is nice for smaller gangs, but not so nice when 10,000 incoming dps blows right through your much smaller buffer before you can cycle your booster a second time. It's all a tradeoff, really. LSB for small fights, passive buffer for medium fights, un-tanked sniper for fleet blobs. That's why I love the ship, really, you get a lot of good options for how to use it. Now if only they'd fix the split weapon problem and give me my 7 guns...

Darth Decon Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.31 00:12:00 - [21] sorry you don't agree with me we both have diffrent setups so lets leave it at that thank you
Calexis Atredies Quantum Industries Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2008.01.31 00:16:00 - [22] Originally by: Merin Ryskin Originally by: Calexis Atredies Listen to the BoBit... I fly one too, even though I use passive I can say from experience that a MSB II even with the gang boosts gives a patyhetic tank, only ship where you have no choice is a cerb. And no flaming BoBits when they post... they may be ebil but they do know how to fit ships for pvp. Passive is good too. Arguably, it's better for larger gang fights... you lose a lot of peak tank, but you get a much higher buffer. That blaster setup I posted tanks almost 500 dps passive, with 185,000 EHP. The 1400 dps tank on the active one is nice for smaller gangs, but not so nice when 10,000 incoming dps blows right through your much smaller buffer before you can cycle your booster a second time. It's all a tradeoff, really. LSB for small fights, passive buffer for medium fights, un-tanked sniper for fleet blobs. That's why I love the ship, really, you get a lot of good options for how to use it. Now if only they'd fix the split weapon problem and give me my 7 guns... My passive can run 2 out of my 1 invul and 2 gang links... tanks over 2000 DPS if you average out its resists. Cant say I am looking forward to the 10% knock to the shield exp resist, for a ship built upon solid resists its gonna be a kick in the nuts.
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.31 00:23:00 - [23] Originally by: Calexis Atredies Edited by: Calexis Atredies on 31/01/2008 00:17:28 Originally by: Merin Ryskin Originally by: Calexis Atredies Listen to the BoBit... I fly one too, even though I use passive I can say from experience that a MSB II even with the gang boosts gives a patyhetic tank, only ship where you have no choice is a cerb. And no flaming BoBits when they post... they may be ebil but they do know how to fit ships for pvp. Passive is good too. Arguably, it's better for larger gang fights... you lose a lot of peak tank, but you get a much higher buffer. That blaster setup I posted tanks almost 500 dps passive, with 185,000 EHP. The 1400 dps tank on the active one is nice for smaller gangs, but not so nice when 10,000 incoming dps blows right through your much smaller buffer before you can cycle your booster a second time. It's all a tradeoff, really. LSB for small fights, passive buffer for medium fights, un-tanked sniper for fleet blobs. That's why I love the ship, really, you get a lot of good options for how to use it. Now if only they'd fix the split weapon problem and give me my 7 guns... My passive can run 2 out of my 1 invul and 2 gang links... tanks over 2000 DPS if you average out its resists. Cant say I am looking forward to the 10% knock to the shield exp resist, for a ship built upon solid resists its gonna be a kick in the nuts. And yes it is highly versatile as a warship... I have 3 :P I assume you're talking about a pure-tank SPR passive tank with no MWD? I don't like that one... SPRs kill your cap too much, to the point that even firing your guns is going to run you dry (and let's not talk about missile-Vultures, I hate those). And run into one of those big systems in 0.0, and warping around is going to be a nightmare with your cap regen crippled that badly. Maybe it's good for a mission-running tank, but it's pretty poor for PvP. Originally by: Darth Decon sorry you don't agree with me we both have diffrent setups so lets leave it at that thank you Fine, we'll leave it at this: our ships are different, in a fundamental way. Mine are good, yours are broken. There isn't really much more to say, anyway, I've already pointed out why you're wrong, you just refuse to actually understand it and admit that you aren't the perfect EFT god.
Calexis Atredies Quantum Industries Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2008.01.31 00:28:00 - [24] Edited by: Calexis Atredies on 31/01/2008 00:28:58 To be honest... yeah warping around kills my cap, wouldnt take a pure passive into a fleet fight, works well for combating small roaming gangs and tanking plexes. For fleet warfare its 5 t2 250's with sensor boosters and mag stabs makes a nice ceptor pawning mobile :P
Darth Decon Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.31 00:36:00 - [25] Can some of you post some other ideas that might help other people in this post thank you....
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.31 00:42:00 - [26] Originally by: Darth Decon Can some of you post some other ideas that might help other people in this post thank you.... WTS: Reading Comprehension Level I I already posted three setups (fleet sniper, small-gang active tank, blasters), and someone else posted the mandatory heavy missile uber-passive mission tank. Between those four setups, that's all you need to know about flying the Vulture. If they don't do exactly what you want, they should be a good enough base to make whatever minor changes you consider necessary to fit your specific role. Your problem is you don't want people to post good Vulture setups, you want people to agree with you. Which is not going to happen, because your setups are just broken.
Darth Decon Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.31 01:03:00 - [27] The way my skills are right now i cannot fitt a LBS on my Vulture i can only fitt it to the best of my ablility thats why your setups wont work for me but they will for others and thanks for giving me some ideas when i get my skills up there and sorry for being a hot head
Merin Ryskin FinFleet Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.01.31 02:11:00 - [28] Originally by: Darth Decon The way my skills are right now i cannot fitt a LBS on my Vulture i can only fitt it to the best of my ablility thats why your setups wont work for me but they will for others and thanks for giving me some ideas when i get my skills up there and sorry for being a hot head Those setups fit with Engineering V, Electronics V, Weapon Upgrades V and Advanced Weapon Upgrades IV. Honestly, if you don't have those skills, you have no business flying a command ship.
Eardianm Darkness Inc. Blood Blind	Posted - 2008.01.31 02:13:00 - [29] Originally by: Merin Ryskin Originally by: Darth Decon The way my skills are right now i cannot fitt a LBS on my Vulture i can only fitt it to the best of my ablility thats why your setups wont work for me but they will for others and thanks for giving me some ideas when i get my skills up there and sorry for being a hot head Those setups fit with Engineering V, Electronics V, Weapon Upgrades V and Advanced Weapon Upgrades IV. Honestly, if you don't have those skills, you have no business flying a command ship. This. How the hell are you in a Vulture and can't get a LSB on there? And the general idea when posting setups on the forum is for critique. Merin has given you good advice, and a simple change for that matter, and you've basically stuck your fingers in your ears. Or your trolling. --------------
Darth Decon Shadow Of The Light Scorched Earth Directive	Posted - 2008.01.31 03:03:00 - [30] Edited by: Darth Decon on 31/01/2008 03:04:18 hey i have engenigering to lvl 5 electornic's to lvl 5 wepon upgrads to 5 and advanced to lvl 4 and over a mill in leadership just because i cant use your fittings dosnt mean i have no buiseness in a commandship



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