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Flow Befort GoonFleet	Posted - 2008.02.01 08:16:00 - [31] what was the reason farscape got banned again?
arghy steelwill GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 08:24:00 - [32] I know why i was so **ed at RISE, they were dead before they ever came to RIT. I remember slugging it day in and day out with BoB after LV collapsed, i remember finally pushing them back and looking up to see all you useless pets smacking like you've actually accomplished something to deserve the best space in EVE. Without BoBs supercap umbrella you fell, mittani always brings up RISE because you were the most textbook intel fight hes ever fought. You sat in space you dident deserve while constantly smacking even when PL constantly slaughtered you- you suffered the fate that all pets eventually feel, you dident take the space you cant defend it. I remember you **ed me off so badly i had stock piled over 20 fleet ships in o-g waiting for the eye of terror so i could always have a ship to smash you back into empire. The great part was i got there only to shoot your POS's and hear mittani read your forums to us over TS while we completely pillaged your space and even stole from your refugee convoys. It seems while the foot sloggers were fighting the great war in 9-9 blackops/PL had all the fun smashing your insides so when we finally found you we found nothing but a brittle shell with rotten insides. I have no history with RISE but for some reason i hated you the most out of all the pets, the thought of crushing you kept me going through the super cap bowling of 9-9. Your signature exceeds the maximum allowed filesize of 24000 bytes -Navigator ([email protected])
Sultry Black Minmatar Black Hearts	Posted - 2008.02.01 08:32:00 - [33] Edited by: Sultry Black on 01/02/2008 08:33:28 Originally by: Gneeznow Originally by: Aeryn Davenport Never really understood the bizarre fascination PL and Goonswarm had (and apparently still have) with RISE. our fascination with RISE stems from the the fact that they petitioned us for absolutely everything they could, to the point where they got a PL member perma-banned, and then had a thread on their forums congratulating each other about it, funny thing was, we were kinda running out of steam at that point, half of us had wandered off to low sec to pirate or empire to suicide gank, after they done what they did, we had the entire alliance back on their doorstep, bubbled every station and gate in RHG, and locked them into their tomb for about 5 weeks until RSF capitals came along several weeks later to do their thing. that being said, personally i think most of the RISE guys were really nice people, its just their rotten apples annoyed us to the point where we were going to kill them no matter what the cost was. ps: most of those annoying RISE clowns are now in BNC or DICE :V I heard your animosity not only stemmed from the fact that RISE fought back, but stayed in RIT and forced your poor selves to stay there too. You wanted to do something else because it was BORING to have to sit around in nanophoons cloaked all the time so you didn't get popped before you could run away. The antics you are now up to in Pr- Additionally RISE laughed in your face the day you tried to cut a deal with them to leave RIT if they paid you 1 Billion isk. They had no respect for you. Nothing like scorn..hell hath no fury, eh? Beneficium accipere libertatem est vendere.
duckmonster GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 08:54:00 - [34] Originally by: Sultry Black Edited by: Sultry Black on 01/02/2008 08:33:28 Originally by: Gneeznow Originally by: Aeryn Davenport Never really understood the bizarre fascination PL and Goonswarm had (and apparently still have) with RISE. our fascination with RISE stems from the the fact that they petitioned us for absolutely everything they could, to the point where they got a PL member perma-banned, and then had a thread on their forums congratulating each other about it, funny thing was, we were kinda running out of steam at that point, half of us had wandered off to low sec to pirate or empire to suicide gank, after they done what they did, we had the entire alliance back on their doorstep, bubbled every station and gate in RHG, and locked them into their tomb for about 5 weeks until RSF capitals came along several weeks later to do their thing. that being said, personally i think most of the RISE guys were really nice people, its just their rotten apples annoyed us to the point where we were going to kill them no matter what the cost was. ps: most of those annoying RISE clowns are now in BNC or DICE :V I heard your animosity not only stemmed from the fact that RISE fought back, but stayed in RIT and forced your poor selves to stay there too. You wanted to do something else because it was BORING to have to sit around in nanophoons cloaked all the time so you didn't get popped before you could run away. The antics you are now up to in Pr- Additionally RISE laughed in your face the day you tried to cut a deal with them to leave RIT if they paid you 1 Billion isk. They had no respect for you. Nothing like scorn..hell hath no fury, eh? Beneficium accipere libertatem est vendere. How on earth does cowering in a station for a month with between 10-25 active PL/Goons in the entire region constitute "fighting back". Remember , unlike most of CAOD, I was there, so you can't lie to me, and you definately can't lie to yourself. And for the record, the petition was a PL member who got banned for bumping someone who WASNT in a bubble with a nano-mach. If I recall correctly the ban was promptly reversed but I may be wrong. If Im wrong there is no justice in this game. -----------
Machine HD	Posted - 2008.02.01 09:07:00 - [35] I was in Rise during the goon war.The only the majority of the smack talk was from the goons.Sturmgrenadier's policy was no talking in local.No exceptions. I dont think any alliance our size could have held the RIT cluster against the numbers that where put against us. I was always treated with respect by BoB. I'll close my account before I fly with goonswarm.
Ituralde The Illuminati. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.02.01 09:24:00 - [36] Goes to show really what happens when an alliance relies too much on a big brother. It's great to have allies, it's cool to rent space, but even if you are doing both of the above you need to be strong as an individual alliance as well. Granted, RISE was going to die most likely. Against the RSF an alliance the size of RISE really didn't have much of a chance. Reading that testimony though really does imply to me they could have - and should have - held out much longer and put up a much better fight. If this testimony is accurate then the alliance was dead long before they evacuated. Long before the BOB FC gave his speech. If anyone from an another alliance making a speech can essentially ruin you then something is seriously wrong with your organization. Anyhow, RISE is hardly the first and certainly won't be the last alliance that has let things slide due to relying on big-name allies at the expense of their own development. _____________________________ Fear is the mind-killer.
Desiderata Fabian GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 09:37:00 - [37] Here is that BoB pep-talk. http://gs.girsbrain.org/bob_peptalk_rise.html
Junkie Beverage GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 09:42:00 - [38] Originally by: Machine HD I was always treated with respect by BoB. they have nothing but scorn for you or you would be under the bob ticker right now you paid them 6b per month for the privilege of living in the rit cluster and for their protection which you never got you should have listened to roy of ca
oniplE Blue.	Posted - 2008.02.01 10:00:00 - [39] I was in rise and they died because the leadership was absolutely horrible. They gave conflicting "orders", the orders themselfs were horrible. When you confronted them with these conflicting and horrible orders, they would blame someone else. And unlike popular belief, rise wasnt killed by 25 PL, they did lock down the system though. The few times there was a counter op, due to the spy infestation a blob twice the size of our gang would drop into the system and the op was canceled before it even began. When that happened a few times, a part of the leadership ordered us out of core, another part said return to empire. Ofcourse the huge amount of carebears in rise didnt think twice and returned to empire, its pretty frustrating when people dont sign up for a gang due to "I want to fight, but im in empire doing missions right now", it doesnt get more demoralizing than that. x
Flow Befort GoonFleet	Posted - 2008.02.01 10:23:00 - [40] Does FNLN own the RISE alliance name yet?
Himo Amasacia Minmatar Fade to Black Inc Interstellar Alcohol Conglomerate	Posted - 2008.02.01 10:23:00 - [41] It wasn't Yaay that did that peptalk, it was Luckyduck.. unless there was another pep talk that BOB gave then that was even worse than that one. Is that even possible? "Constant practice devoted to one subject often outdoes both intelligence and skill." -Cicero
Le Cardinal ECP Rogues The Reckoning.	Posted - 2008.02.01 11:06:00 - [42] Interesting read for one who hasnt been involved in this part. Remember that this story is written by someone who werent involved in the decision making process and only write this from his pov. Maybe this was the general understanding of the situation from most of Rise members. Smacking this is low, it provided an interesting read on caod for once. Instead of a smackfest it would be interesting to hear the other side of the story in a respectfull manner. Everyone has their pov, from the position they are in a conflict, and usually the winner is the gloating part. Its been proven in the past, and its being proven on caod every single day.
Cippalippus Primus GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 11:18:00 - [43] Edited by: Cippalippus Primus on 01/02/2008 11:20:11 Originally by: Le Cardinal Interesting read for one who hasnt been involved in this part. Remember that this story is written by someone who werent involved in the decision making process and only write this from his pov. Maybe this was the general understanding of the situation from most of Rise members. Smacking this is low, it provided an interesting read on caod for once. Instead of a smackfest it would be interesting to hear the other side of the story in a respectfull manner. Everyone has their pov, from the position they are in a conflict, and usually the winner is the gloating part. Its been proven in the past, and its being proven on caod every single day. I will try to tell the story from a Goon point of view. RISE was attacked for several reasons; their support to BoB was the main reason, and their position of buffer alliance between us and Delve. One thing that however upped the hostility towards RISE was their status of paying renters coupled with their perceived feeling of self entitlement for the space they were holding. In other words, their side of the story simply had no factual basis. It only became worse when RISE lost what will of fight they had, and when they began talking about "10 months of heroic resistance in the RIT triangle". They did indeed hold the RIT triangle for 10 months, but lost it as soon as the POS warfare began. In the end, they became just another name in the list of alliances that didn't fight to conquer their space and didn't fight to hold it. -clp
Shadoo North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.02.01 11:29:00 - [44] Originally by: Le Cardinal Instead of a smackfest it would be interesting to hear the other side of the story in a respectfull manner. I'll resist the urge to say "this is COAD and thus it's useless to do what you suggest", but hell... It's DT so I'll give it a go. I can't say anything to the events before Pandemic's arrival, I don't know anything about the RISE attack on KW- and so forth. But I'll cover our side once we did arrive on the theatre. PL had been situated in the North with a main objective to fight the BoB friendly alliances in the region in an effort to help MM/RZR/etc to secure the region. Things started to look good in the North, thus we were requested to redeploy to the South to help demoralize the enemy in the region (all our little alliance can really do tbh besides to be a pain in the rear end). We chose to base out of south-eastern Stain as access to Feyth was easy and we could do roaming gangs all the way up to Delve if needed. First week or so was mainly dominated by small-scale fighting with Stain Empire and mainly shooting at the Stain Officers in belts (record was 3 officers in one day I believe). Once logistics were complete, our orders were to start roaming into Feyth with ISS and RISE as specific targets. We mainly roamed in the US TZ as at the time RISE could easily have a camp of 40+ with multiple capitals at gate in RIT. Busting through those camps in Command Ships was always interesting and we took some losses usually. Given the difficulty of busting through RISE camps, which they would get up by the time our gang was 13j out (their scout network was impressive) -- we decided to try a different strategy. Long range, speed fitted HACs like Muninn's now got a cloak as part of the standard fit and Recons was the most requested ship type in our gangs. Thou people nowadays associate PL with "cloaking nanogang" -- up to this point in time, we had actually never done cloaked ship ops. We did use speed to our advantage however, thou not sure how fast you can call an Astarte no matter how many polys you got on it. The first few days of deploying and remaining in the RHG proved interesting as RISE had obviously had practice before with cloaked gangs (RA+GF). We established connections with the GoonFleet BlackOps counterparts quickly and becan to work together really well. GF BO was used to recon warfare targeting ratters and straglers. We took a slightly more aggressive approach since we had HACs in our gang and started to take on small to medium gangs with recons and cloaking HACs using bait and range to our advantage. The attack on sov KOS tried couldn't have come at a worse time for PL. We were starting to spin up heavily with the Alliance Tournament, with at least one 2h practice session planned each evening during all of this on the test server. We tried our best to be there to support the attack, but resuplying after losses became difficult and people were starting to be a bit burned out with both sitting on test server for hours and shooting POSes with fleet BSes. Then of course, BoB came with a fleet and GoonFleet SpecOps came down as well. Laggy fights have never been our thing and few 200+ laggy fights in fleet ships pushed peoples will to fight in RHG further, instead going back to some low sec relaxation instead. BoB+RISE did push the offensive back at the time, GF was not ready to take a serious attempt at RHG yet. KOS posses being badly timed was an additional blow to the rushed attack on RHG and as tournament kicked off -- Pandemic withdrew from the theathre leaving only our small POS behind with an SMA full of ships. During the tournament, there were hardly any PL in the triangle. Not sure if RISE realized, but we simply did not have enough people while everyone in the tourney team was in empire with their pirate implant clones. PL concentrated on ratting, high sec piracy and tournament practice + actual matches for the week of the tournament. (continued shortly)
Ohne Minmatar Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.02.01 11:42:00 - [45] Originally by: Onchas Erivvia Originally by: Gneeznow Originally by: Aeryn Davenport Never really understood the bizarre fascination PL and Goonswarm had (and apparently still have) with RISE. our fascination with RISE stems from the the fact that they petitioned us for absolutely everything they could, to the point where they got a PL member perma-banned Yeeess...it was the petitioners who were to blame. Damn petitioners. Damn damn damn petitioners. If only they hadn't petitioned, your players would never have violated the EULA. <shakes fist at petitioners> You have no idea what the whole fuzz was about do you ?
Necro EvilZombie North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.02.01 11:46:00 - [46] Edited by: Necro EvilZombie on 01/02/2008 11:47:26 Edited by: Necro EvilZombie on 01/02/2008 11:47:15 Edited by: Necro EvilZombie on 01/02/2008 11:47:03 I remember people making cap stable Geddons and going afk for 2hours while their ship sat outside of the station hitting the services. Funny stuff. As for PLs fascination with killing RISE was the fact that we griefed an alliance out of their space without putting up POSs to over take them, that was all goon. -------------------------------------------------------------- .
Shadoo North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.02.01 11:48:00 - [47] After tourney nonsense and few days to recover, we were asked to redeploy to the area for a new offensive. RISE had bounced back obviously during our time away. They managed to gather larger fleets again on short notice on every TZ, while before the BoB intervention their numbers were starting to go down. This obviously encouraged PL people to quickly come back from where ever they were at the time. Good medium scale fights with targets roaming on every TZ was enough to get bigger than ever participation from PL to the RHG const. Our SMA tower had never been hit during our time away and had now been stocked full of fleet BS + HACs and obviously allowed people to refit easily and stage carriers for ammo/loot drops. There were few key battles I recall during the time we returned where we managed to win the engagements outnumbered, sometimes thanks to luck and usually thanks to spy network. On every major engagement our FCs had a direct convo with a person in RISE fleets. We knew when they were active, where they were going to hit and what range from the fleet they were going to come out to. I do believe on some occasion the Cov Ops they were warping to was in fact, our spy. We knew who had been called primary and thus once their fleet warped in, the primary warped off and a dictor bubbled their fleet while we caught straglers. We were ready to move to the next stage, which was to hit station services in order to force carriers out to rep them and thus give us a chance to use our Machariels to bump stuff off. I can't recall exactly where Farscape Hw's banning goes into in the timeline. I was the cov ops and FC in charge at the time. RISE was using logistics drones to rep their cynojammer POS modules by going out of the shields, assigning rep drones and going back into shields. Everytime we showed up to kill the drones, they creeped few guys out of shields to shoot cruise missiles/heavy missiles and quickly go back inside the shields while missiles were still in flight. This particular Raven pilot was being pretty careless with how he did this to the point of being predictable. We got the Mach in, it cloaked 70km off where the Raven used to pop his head out of. The one time he did this, Farscape decloaked, accelerated to about 10km/s and hit the raven just as it was 90% inside the shields. The read-end of the raven got hit, and he quickly became the Raven that did 6000m/s promptly flying from one side of Large Tower shields all the way to the other side and out where 2 rapiers decloaked to web him. He was quickly roasted and about 20 minutes after Farscape was banned due to exploiting POS shield mechanics and "POS Bowling". This event gave us a quick boost indeed, since our spy network copy&pasted EXACTLY what was said on RISE forums AND the corporation forums. It was disgusting read, I can understand people get upset by bumping, but it is a game after all and the objective of the game should not be "to get him banned whatever way you can". Luckily senior GMs rightly reversed the decision the next working day (after weekend). After that event, we went all out and started to deploy large bubbles on every gate and every station undock. We must have lost in the region on 20-30 Large Bubbles, since they kept dying everytime RISE drew enough people into gang to push us off and before we got enough people back from AFK to stop them. But for every bubble -- they lost ships. And that kept us going. With RISE numbers severely dwindling, we becan to hit station services repeatedly until eventually -- they were never repaired. At that time, it was not uncommon to see maybe 10 RISE pilots in the whole RHG constellation. The end was rather uneventful, the moment Goonfleet deployed to the area (besides BlackOps who we had now grown to work very closely with <3) -- Pandemic pulled out. GF+TCF+RA took the constellation in short order, with no real fights as far as I can recall. So there...
Necro EvilZombie North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.02.01 11:54:00 - [48] remember when the FCs told RISE not to engage with you in local Shadoo? that was gold -------------------------------------------------------------- .
Gorefacer Caldari Resurrection	Posted - 2008.02.01 12:51:00 - [49] Having only played the game for a few months when I joined RISE I was obviously not involved with any of the decision making. Interesting read and filled in some things I wasn't aware of. I can tell you for sure that towards the end the market had almost nothing to fit ships out with. I remember taking out my crappy Caracal sometimes without even all 5 launcher slots filled. Considering the fact I was mainly flying t1 Cruisers and BC with low skills for them, my inability to properly fit my ships didn't affect the war much, but I'm sure many other pilots had similar issues. Towards the end we had a few fights where 5-15 of us would group up and engage (usually PL) the enemy in mostly well fit nano or t2 ships. Most of our ships were poorly fit and couldn't do much to hurt or slow the enemy down. They'd hit us in strafing runs picking us off 1 at a time. Before X ing up we knew we would likely lose dozens of ships for every kill, but the general attitude I saw was "**** it, it's just a game, let's have fun going down shooting". We weren't going to win at that point and some already left to save what assets they still had, but I had a good time until the evac into Fountain. From my point of view there was some smack in local (most from goons) but really not much overall on either side. The best part about RISE was that I rarely heard any disrespect coming from fellow corp/alliance members even when the ship was clearly going down. Most of the pilots remained really cool about things and this made RISE the most enjoyable alliance I've flown with yet. Some play just to win. If I like the people I'm playing the game with and feel like I'm getting my money worths out of EVE each month, I'm happy. PL didn't take RISE out with 25 man gangs. They held the field after we we're broke, split up and disorganized. PL was very effective though and had a lot of competent pilots. Most of us remember the good fights we had and look forward to more in the future. Whether or not we "deserved" the space we had seems like a strange concept to me. EVE is not about entitlement, some small low "skill" alliances have friends and are in a position where they hold space. Other alliances have greater numbers, each with much more "skill" and can be in a position where they lose space. RISE held space and then lost it because they didn't have enough members, "skill", and friends in the area to help, just like every other alliance that has also lost space (including the Goons, BoB, RA and just about everyone else). We rented the space, couldn't hold it, and lost it. That's how EVE works, we could have been a much smaller alliance with worse skilled members and held the space in different circumstances. Chest beating over a numbers game is laughable, but I guess it's what makes people feel good inside, so go for it. "You can't reason someone out of a belief they haven't reasoned themselves into" - Prometheus
HatfulOfHollow GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 12:54:00 - [50] GF Black Ops <3 PL Together forever
The Mittani GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 13:34:00 - [51] rise is fascinating because: 1. cascades are fascinating 2. they really thought they were amazing elite pvp'ers holding off the hordes, rather than renters imported from outer ring who paid 6b a month to bob, so when the time came we had been watching them chestbeat for long time and obliterating them was all the more interesting 3. council governments give the best chatlogs, the infighting at the council level was amazing to watch and offered a lot of entertainment for goons 4. all that misery trapped in a one-exit constellation its like a m&m with suffering on the inside instead of chocolate :3
Antipathy GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 13:37:00 - [52] Sturmgrenadier picked the wrong side of the coin and it's a real shame. :( I am the prettiest girl in the world - Cortes /me flutters eyelashes
Factor Benz GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 13:39:00 - [53] Originally by: Machine HD I was in Rise during the goon war.The only the majority of the smack talk was from the goons.Sturmgrenadier's policy was no talking in local.No exceptions. I dont think any alliance our size could have held the RIT cluster against the numbers that where put against us. I was always treated with respect by BoB. I'll close my account before I fly with goonswarm. You wouldn't be asked to nor welcome. You continue to exhibit the self entitlement which contributed greatly to the crushing of RISE and it's hilarious.
Deros Minmatar Black Omega Security Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.02.01 13:54:00 - [54] Shadoo's summary covers it all to be honest, not much more to add. D
Divus Black Omega Security Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.02.01 13:57:00 - [55] Edited by: Divus on 01/02/2008 13:57:46 do any former-rise-now-bob pilots have RIT-DTja-vus in Pr- these days? -------------------------------------------------
SunglassesInSpace GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 14:45:00 - [56] Originally by: Sultry Black Edited by: Sultry Black on 01/02/2008 08:33:28 Originally by: Gneeznow Originally by: Aeryn Davenport Never really understood the bizarre fascination PL and Goonswarm had (and apparently still have) with RISE. our fascination with RISE stems from the the fact that they petitioned us for absolutely everything they could, to the point where they got a PL member perma-banned, and then had a thread on their forums congratulating each other about it, funny thing was, we were kinda running out of steam at that point, half of us had wandered off to low sec to pirate or empire to suicide gank, after they done what they did, we had the entire alliance back on their doorstep, bubbled every station and gate in RHG, and locked them into their tomb for about 5 weeks until RSF capitals came along several weeks later to do their thing. that being said, personally i think most of the RISE guys were really nice people, its just their rotten apples annoyed us to the point where we were going to kill them no matter what the cost was. ps: most of those annoying RISE clowns are now in BNC or DICE :V I heard your animosity not only stemmed from the fact that RISE fought back, but stayed in RIT and forced your poor selves to stay there too. You wanted to do something else because it was BORING to have to sit around in nanophoons cloaked all the time so you didn't get popped before you could run away. The antics you are now up to in Pr- Additionally RISE laughed in your face the day you tried to cut a deal with them to leave RIT if they paid you 1 Billion isk. They had no respect for you. Nothing like scorn..hell hath no fury, eh? Beneficium accipere libertatem est vendere. Are you really that stupid or just trolling?
Onchas Erivvia Black Eclipse Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.02.01 14:55:00 - [57] Originally by: SunglassesInSpace Are you really that stupid or just trolling? I have a copyright on that line --- "LOG OFF, LOG OFF, EVERYONE LOG THE F--- OFF NOW" - Suas, GoonSwarm Fleet Commander Sunday January 27, 2008 during a fleet fight with BoB in system QY6-RK, approximately 21:55 EVT
Machine HD	Posted - 2008.02.01 15:05:00 - [58] I meant no disrespect to Goonswarm or PL. PL was very effective and we didn't have taticts to deal with them.The spying part was demoralizing more than anything.I had ships stolen out of poses in KW by "corp members".Any other game I have played this would be concidered cheating.In Eve its part of the game.What are Goonswarm going to do though once BOB is crushed.One must have a enemy to fight.
K'reemy G'udness The Greater Goon GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 15:22:00 - [59] Originally by: Machine HD I meant no disrespect to Goonswarm or PL. PL was very effective and we didn't have taticts to deal with them.The spying part was demoralizing more than anything.I had ships stolen out of poses in KW by "corp members".Any other game I have played this would be concidered cheating.In Eve its part of the game.What are Goonswarm going to do though once BOB is crushed.One must have a enemy to fight. Angels! ---
Value Added GoonFleet GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.01 15:29:00 - [60] Originally by: Machine HD What are Goonswarm going to do though once BOB is crushed.One must have a enemy to fight. Reset Groon.

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