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Feilamya	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:08:00 - [61] Originally by: Darth Revanant Edited by: Darth Revanant on 03/02/2008 04:03:29 So... you think you can attack an organization in EVE and not have that organization get its allies to attack you back? It's about time attacking NPCs in EVE had more consequences than just -0.00000001% faction standing. Everything in EVE has consequences, including killing NPCs. In the game an NPC is another person, just like a PC. So basically you are telling us that roleplayers are NPC-rights activists?
Tamia Clant New Dawn Corp New Eden Research	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:10:00 - [62] Originally by: Karlemgne Number one, when I read the EULA I don't see anywhere where it says I'm required to role play. Hmm, who would have thought you'd have to role-play in a massively multiplayer online *role-playing* game?! If you don't RP, then that's your choice, to be honest, but as soon as someone gets involved (such as going to that 7th fleet complex) he should expect the consequences whether he cares about RP or not. Looking for queue-free research slots? Click here!
Louis DelaBlanche Cosmic Odyssey YouWhat	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:13:00 - [63] So a player (aparently with full knowledge of what theyre doing) went into a complex specificially introduced for a roleplay event, & the otherside in this event relies on subsidised war decs to ensure their safety from this player & others? I dont see the harm in that. Just tell your member to stop being involved/leave alliance if you dont like the consequences of it. It may not be a paticularly good mechanic being employed to defend these plexes, but it sounds like its the only one currently available. Its not like theyre dropping 7 dreadnaughts on ur towers
Cailais Amarr VITOC	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:20:00 - [64] Id rather get decced by an RP corp that has some motivation for declaring a war in back story terms than be decced by "OMGHAORL33T corp" thats just deccing because it can. Why not join IGS (in character) and rant against 'State sponsored' terrorism or something? Demand the Amarrian Navy cease its funding of militants against Corporate entities? C. Improved Low Sec Idea!!
Verone Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:20:00 - [65] Simple Fact : It's an RP Event. Known and vocal enemies of the Amarr Empire have attacked one of it's installations. The Amarr Navy has asked a loyalist corporation to defend it's installations from future attacks. The Amarr Navy has given the loyalist corporation the means to do so. Veto Corp have been contacted and hired as mercenaries for an RP event before, to take down a Federation Navy Convoy. We were paid for it as mercenaries would and should be. I see no issue with any of this, it's a perfectly valid RP event. If you want to be part of stuff like this and reap the rewards then you need to make a proactive effort to get involved. It's not going to be handed to you on a plate. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW - EVE FICTION <<<
SonOfAGhost Minmatar Munitions and Tactical Assets Repository Zzz	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:20:00 - [66] Whoever the RPing GM is paying wardec fees for his buddies is no different from T20 giving out T2 BPOs, both should be fired outright. Given the uproar caused previous fiasco (that is still continuing in the South at this moment) CCP should know better than to engage in this sort of clearly unethical behaviour. Originally by: CCP Explorer This is intended, to not clutter the overview with information that new players don't need in their first few hours. (on stargates not being on overview)
Verone Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:23:00 - [67] Originally by: SonOfAGhost Whoever the RPing GM is paying wardec fees for his buddies is no different from T20 giving out T2 BPOs, both should be fired outright. Given the uproar caused previous fiasco (that is still continuing in the South at this moment) CCP should know better than to engage in this sort of clearly unethical behaviour. It's a completely different kettle of fish than someone spawning BPO's... please get a clue regarding what you're talking about before shouting your mouth off. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW - EVE FICTION <<<
Elisa Day Koshaku Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:37:00 - [68] Why is it, when something happens that is perfectly explainable with in-game reasoning (amarr navy paying people to defend them) you immediately come crying with out-of-game complaints (OMG GM h4x!!!1)? Keep the two worlds separate, please.
Haverloth Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:46:00 - [69] The pilot in question was aware they were entering a 7th Fleet Automated Defence Unit. There was a warning given by the beacon prior to his entering the ADU. Our pilots gave their own warnings with clear indications of the consequences of his actions, which the aggressing pilot chose to ignore. To cry about your pilot's foolish actions on the boards is just idiocy. Get your pilot in line. As to being reimbursed for the war cost - The Imperial Navy has asked us to defend the ADUs. Part of that defence involves wardecs against aggressor parties. The Imperial Navy then reimburses us for those wardecs. There is clear accountability in all of this, the Imperial Navy does not just give us a bunch of ISK. Your pilot engaged Imperial Naval assets, as I told you. We are defending those assets, as directed by the Imperial Navy. If you don't want to get "involved" with RP, then do not engage in these activities - or better yet, keep a tighter reign on your pilots. ____________________
Hannobaal Gallente Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.03 15:16:00 - [70] Edited by: Hannobaal on 03/02/2008 15:16:31 I can't believe people are complaining about this.
Verone Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.02.03 15:26:00 - [71] Originally by: Hannobaal Edited by: Hannobaal on 03/02/2008 15:16:31 I can't believe people are complaining about this. Exactly of the same opinion mate. It really does go to show how pathetic some corners of the community are becoming. Fair enough, complain when there are grounds to do so but this is a joke tbh. It seems like everyone wants to jump on the bandwagon and have something to whinge about. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW - EVE FICTION <<<
LaVista Vista Conservative Shenanigans Party	Posted - 2008.02.03 15:56:00 - [72] I should start offering free wardecs for corporations. So lets say i pay for the wardecs instead of a GM. How is it ever gonna make a difference in your little world? It isn't.
JADE DRAG0NESS Dark Scorpions Fate Weavers	Posted - 2008.02.03 19:23:00 - [73] Originally by: LaVista Vista I should start offering free wardecs for corporations. So lets say i pay for the wardecs instead of a GM. How is it ever gonna make a difference in your little world? It isn't. That wasn't his point Numb-nuts! He said he didn't mind the war itself, he just didnt like how the Gm was paying for it. "Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Jean Rostand
LaVista Vista Conservative Shenanigans Party	Posted - 2008.02.03 19:47:00 - [74] Originally by: JADE DRAG0NESS Originally by: LaVista Vista I should start offering free wardecs for corporations. So lets say i pay for the wardecs instead of a GM. How is it ever gonna make a difference in your little world? It isn't. That wasn't his point Numb-nuts! He said he didn't mind the war itself, he just didnt like how the Gm was paying for it. You missed my point. I made the point: For you, it doesnt matter if I or the GM funded the war. If the GM has a valid reason to pay for the war, sure, why not? If you think its wrong for a GM to pay for a wardec, i wouldnt mind pay for the wardec, as its a RP event or something from what i understand.
Riho Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2008.02.03 19:58:00 - [75] Edited by: Riho on 03/02/2008 19:59:18 some ppl in this thread are way clueless. i dont get why ppl are complaining. the GM paying wardec fees is like a "reward" for the corp/alliance taking part of the event. now some may think that they just dec random ppl and CCP pays for the decs... no... the ppl who are part of the deccing party must first prove that they are deccing them for the right reasons (in this case.. they guy ran the plex... loyalists decced the alliance for it). if they cant prove the reason... then CCP will not refund. its simple. some people just need a brain check like this guy Originally by: SonOfAGhost Whoever the RPing GM is paying wardec fees for his buddies is no different from T20 giving out T2 BPOs, both should be fired outright. Given the uproar caused previous fiasco (that is still continuing in the South at this moment) CCP should know better than to engage in this sort of clearly unethical behaviour. you are an idiot... never post again plz ---------------------------------- This is Me
Galen Darksmith Caldari Independent Navy Reserve The Fourth District	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:01:00 - [76] This isn't a case of some rogue GM responding to a petition and handing out money for wardecs. This is a case of CCP saying "HEY GUYS! IF YOU WANT TO HELP US KEEP THESE COMPLEXES SAFE, WE'LL PAY FOR YOUR WARDEC FEES!" Essentially, CCP recognizes that the wardec system isn't up to snuff, so they made a public announcement that they would try to minimize the inconvenience by paying for the wardecs. This is not a GM exploit. This is not "h4X." This is the EVE universe coming to life around you. And it's not a nice universe.
Cassius Longinus Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:07:00 - [77] I think this is a great idea. The OP's alliance got dragged into an RP event by a member... seems to me that a little diplomacy (plus a warning to the member) would straighten everything out, assuming the alliance is not interested in participating. Or alternatively, they can make their 70 jumps and engage in some PVP on a GM's dime, which sounds like pure win to me. Either way, no harm is involved.
Bacchanalian Stimulus	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:12:00 - [78] Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri I expect that this is a beta for faction warfare. Just as a friendly OOC Public Service Announcement: If you shoot a 7th fleet complex and we catch you doing it, Amarrian groups will declare war on you. If you don't want this, make it utterly clear to anyone who might run plex's in the Bleak Lands that 7th fleet complexes are off limits. Is that a promise? ____________________ GM Sunshine > oops Neurotica > Hate to see a GM in your gang say 'oops'
Le Skunk Low Sec Liberators	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:18:00 - [79] what is this... role player, and where can i purchase one SKUNK
Grr Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:18:00 - [80] A great idea about diplomacy but has been tried. They contacted us as soon as we decced and went on to say amongst other things that RPers are "*******s" We are tempted to pay the war dec bill ourselves and make that 70 jump trip after all ;) Epitoth Fleetyards is Recruiting
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:23:00 - [81] Originally by: Riho Originally by: Tnilf Originally by: Karlemgne Lastly, if the OP is correct, and a GM allows people to war dec other corps for free, because the aggressor is "role playing" I've got a problem with that. If you want to role play a war because some noob ran a complex, fine. You should have to pay for that war like everyone else. This was my point. your alliance member involved in a ROLEPLAY event... that means your ALLIANCE involved in the roleplay event.... you where roleplaying and they got orders from the navy to defend. it doesnt matter if you roleplay or not... it matters that one of your members did and now everyone will be involved. your member represented your allinace in the event. thats the point. and i dont get why ppl allways belittle Roleplayers... thats just funny and shows theyr own stupidity. PS. im not a roleplayer and never have been, but if events get better in the future.. i might start aswell :) I'm not belittling anyone. I roleplay all the time usually WoD stuff. And sure, fine. As I said, your corp or alliance can dec whoever they want for whatever reason they want! I've got no problem with that at all. I've got a problem when CCP is handing out 50 million a week war dec's for free, because you're "roleplaying." You should have to pay like everyone else. -Karlemgne
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:27:00 - [82] Edited by: Karlemgne on 03/02/2008 20:29:41 Edited by: Karlemgne on 03/02/2008 20:28:43 Edited by: Karlemgne on 03/02/2008 20:28:09 Originally by: Tamia Clant Originally by: Karlemgne Number one, when I read the EULA I don't see anywhere where it says I'm required to role play. Hmm, who would have thought you'd have to role-play in a massively multiplayer online *role-playing* game?! If you don't RP, then that's your choice, to be honest, but as soon as someone gets involved (such as going to that 7th fleet complex) he should expect the consequences whether he cares about RP or not. Look, I work in the MMO industry. I can tell you now that there is an assumption that at least 90% of your playing population will not engage in ANY roleplaying. Usually, as a result a server (whose population is always light) dedicated specifically to roleplaying is set-up to cater to the roleplaying crowd. This is a single shard game, so the roleplayers have to deal with the general population and vise versa. So if you want to war dec me or my corp for a RP reason, please feel free. Don't, however, expect me to participate in the actual RPing. And I still fail to see how roleplaying entitles you to free war decs. -Karlemgne
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:35:00 - [83] Originally by: Grr A great idea about diplomacy but has been tried. They contacted us as soon as we decced and went on to say amongst other things that RPers are "*******s" We are tempted to pay the war dec bill ourselves and make that 70 jump trip after all ;) See I approve of this. You want to wtfpown them for roleplaying reasons, or just because they insulted you? Great! Now declare war like everyone else and pay the fees yourself. -Karlemgne
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:42:00 - [84] Originally by: Verone Simple Fact : It's an RP Event. Known and vocal enemies of the Amarr Empire have attacked one of it's installations. The Amarr Navy has asked a loyalist corporation to defend it's installations from future attacks. The Amarr Navy has given the loyalist corporation the means to do so. Veto Corp have been contacted and hired as mercenaries for an RP event before, to take down a Federation Navy Convoy. We were paid for it as mercenaries would and should be. I see no issue with any of this, it's a perfectly valid RP event. If you want to be part of stuff like this and reap the rewards then you need to make a proactive effort to get involved. It's not going to be handed to you on a plate. The great Verone has spoken, I suppose the argument should be over. Having said that, let me key in on some points you made here. VETO, which in my experience is a more smack talking than roleplaying corp (good pilots though) was given a contract to participate in a RP event. I am assuming you were contacted by a player corp to arrange a contract, and I'm assuming that you were paid by said corp. CCP didn't just hand you guys a billion isk to participate in the event. If they did, then there is something seriously wrong with the way RPing is done on this server tbfh. Similarly, people should not get free war decs--for any reason. If I had a corp and wanted to war dec an anti-pirate alliance as a method of roleplaying, I'd have to PAY for the war dec. CCP should not be giving people passes on the basic isk sinks that apply to everyone in game. Period. -Karlemgne
Kai Zion Amarr The Zion Accounts	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:45:00 - [85] Quote: Look, I work in the MMO industry. I can tell you now that there is an assumption that at least 90% of your playing population will not engage in ANY roleplaying. Usually, as a result a server (whose population is always light) dedicated specifically to roleplaying is set-up to cater to the roleplaying crowd. You're playing a game that is unlike any other in the MMO industry, so don't waste time telling how it works elsewhere. The official line at CCP is "everyone is a roleplayer". Regardless of what you say, this is what they believe, this is what a large majority of roleplayers believe, and a substantial amount of the playerbase is learning to accept, usually at the end of a 1400mm Artillery. A pirate griefing you is playing the role of a pirate. He is acting just as a real pirate would. He doesn't need to have a robe and wizard had, replete with shakespearean dialogue to be a roleplayer, he just needs to act in a believably piratical way. This makes you, Karlemagne, a roleplayer in Eve, according to many "RPers" definition, according to my definition, according to many players definition, and according to CCP's definition. Resist it all you like, but this is how Eve works. In a single-shard game like this, roleplay is unlike it is in any other game.
Kai Zion Amarr The Zion Accounts	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:47:00 - [86] Also, you keep harping on about "free" wardecs. They're not free. People had to earn them. In the future, when Factional Warfare hits, they will likely also have to pay a price for aligning with certain factions. How about you just calm down, you seem awfully riled up.
Drykor Minmatar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:53:00 - [87] Does this mean faction warfare is coming closer? Nice!
Karra Dresden	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:54:00 - [88] Edited by: Karra Dresden on 03/02/2008 20:54:30 Originally by: Riho Originally by: Tnilf Originally by: Karlemgne Lastly, if the OP is correct, and a GM allows people to war dec other corps for free, because the aggressor is "role playing" I've got a problem with that. If you want to role play a war because some noob ran a complex, fine. You should have to pay for that war like everyone else. This was my point. your alliance member involved in a ROLEPLAY event... that means your ALLIANCE involved in the roleplay event.... you where roleplaying and they got orders from the navy to defend. it doesnt matter if you roleplay or not... it matters that one of your members did and now everyone will be involved. your member represented your allinace in the event. thats the point. and i dont get why ppl allways belittle Roleplayers... thats just funny and shows theyr own stupidity. PS. im not a roleplayer and never have been, but if events get better in the future.. i might start aswell :) This. Right, sure. It makes absolute sense that if ONE member of an alliance shows up some 70 jumps from where said alliance lives and runs a 1/10 complex that the whole alliance is signaling its willingness to participate in a roleplaying event. MAYBE if a whole corp showed up to run that complex, MAYBE. It seems perfectly obvious to me that a single guy, with no friends, running a single complex is either 1. a noob or 2. a single rouge pilot. Let me give you an analogy. A single member of the San Diego police department shows up to a party in the university area. At this party he tells everyone he's a cop, but does a bunch of drugs and asks where he can buy some more. Would you say that this signals the willingness of the entire SD police department to engage in recreational drug use? No. Don't use fuzzy logic. Its bad for you.
Spoon Thumb Caldari Paladin Imperium Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:55:00 - [89] My corp signed up to be in the 7th fleet auxiliary, and were it not for various factors, we probably would have taken up the offer, since we are a small corp often struggling for funds to replace ships etc and certainly not able to afford 50mil(?) or whatever to war dec a terrorist alliance. As it traspired, I don't think the beacons idea is great and as I've already commented in the game development forum shouldn't be the sole basis for factional warfare. The other thing is CVA already get to war-dec these things and we can't war dec just as a corp, but have to with the whole alliance. I think maybe the rules are more for small, indie RP corps rather than the usual suspects like CVA, PIE, U'K etc Khaldari khanidpublic: RP channel for Kingdom loyalists Recruiting
Grr Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:57:00 - [90] There has been no official word yet on if this is a test for faction warfare or not, just speculation. I would like to think its true tho :) Epitoth Fleetyards is Recruiting

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