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Tnilf Xeno Xanadu The Covenant Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.02 23:54:00 - [1] We were just war dec'd by an Amarr alliance. I dont really give a **** since we are about 70 jumps from amarr space. But the issue I have is supposedly a GM gave them the isk to do it because it is part of a "storyline". Apparently this was because a noob was doing a 1/10 complex w/ amarr rats in empire in a frigate. If some stupid rp corp wants to war dec someone for that whatever. But I take issue with CCP giving alliances the money to war dec. Removing a substantial part of the cost for aggressors. I mean why make it cost money if they are just going to make it free for thier friends?
ArmaggedonPSA Minmatar Royal Hiigaran Navy	Posted - 2008.02.02 23:57:00 - [2] The same happened when a "storyline" was issued and an amarr RP alliance wardecced by corp aswell...was way back, but I don't think GM's would pay for it...I think its just an alliance trying to find something to do with a GM's blessing, unless you have proof ofcourse HF tho! If you dont win...call us -Logistics pilots decide who lives or dies, its called "triage" -Funny, they kept calling it piracy when I did it...
Verx Interis Amarr Aurora Security The Cyrene Initiative	Posted - 2008.02.02 23:58:00 - [3] 2 mill a week is substantial? -----sig-starts-here------ ALL HAIL APOCALOOMPH!
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:00:00 - [4] Originally by: Verx Interis 2 mill a week is substantial? Everything is relative. If it's wrong it's wrong wether it's 2 billion or 5 isk.
Ademaro Imre Caldari	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:08:00 - [5] Originally by: Tnilf We were just war dec'd by an Amarr alliance. I dont really give a **** since we are about 70 jumps from amarr space. But the issue I have is supposedly a GM gave them the isk to do it because it is part of a "storyline". Apparently this was because a noob was doing a 1/10 complex w/ amarr rats in empire in a frigate. If some stupid rp corp wants to war dec someone for that whatever. But I take issue with CCP giving alliances the money to war dec. Removing a substantial part of the cost for aggressors. I mean why make it cost money if they are just going to make it free for thier friends? I have never heard of that before. They are probably just feeding you bs. The aim of politics is to keep the populace alarmed and clamorous to be saved by menacing it with imaginary hobgoblins. The urge to save humanity is a false front for the urge to rule it.
Teyrala Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:11:00 - [6] Hang on, did I read that right? CCP give roleplayers the isk to make random wars because someone ran a plex in amarr space? running a plex does not make you a roleplayer...
Pajamas Jack	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:11:00 - [7] Now is when we say Proof or STFU
Siigari Kitawa Gallente The Aduro Protocol	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:12:00 - [8] Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 03/02/2008 00:12:22 Originally by: Pajamas Jack Now is when we say Proof or STFU Wait, is this the Panama Jack from Tribes? Nevermind, pajama jack lmao _________________ Burn.
Pajamas Jack	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:18:00 - [9] Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 03/02/2008 00:12:22 Originally by: Pajamas Jack Now is when we say Proof or STFU Wait, is this the Panama Jack from Tribes? Nevermind, pajama jack lmao No
Francis Inch Amarr Lightyear Inc	Posted - 2008.02.03 00:21:00 - [10] Originally by: Tnilf We were just war dec'd by an Amarr alliance. I dont really give a **** since we are about 70 jumps from amarr space. But the issue I have is supposedly a GM gave them the isk to do it because it is part of a "storyline". Apparently this was because a noob was doing a 1/10 complex w/ amarr rats in empire in a frigate. If some stupid rp corp wants to war dec someone for that whatever. But I take issue with CCP giving alliances the money to war dec. Removing a substantial part of the cost for aggressors. I mean why make it cost money if they are just going to make it free for thier friends? You see those news articles that come up every day when you select your character? Sometimes they actually... mean something. Your pilot friend was busy interacting with a new complex that CCP made part of a roleplay event that has been playing out for weeks in those new articles and in game, for those that look for those kinds of activities. If anyone had paid attention, they would have seen the Amarr Navy attempting to engage support to protect those assets. This is just another of those events that the people that pay attention can get involved in - just as past events have netted others all sorts of items, kills, rewards or other such things. It's not anyone giving anyone else favouritism, it's just another part of EVE being a living, breathing, joined up world where CCP try to at least keep the Empires part of EVE. As a side issue, bearing in mind an alliance or even a corp costs more to set up and maintain than 1 week of war dec cost, it's hardly a significant benefit to start jumping up and down about. In addition since the offers were made publicly to all players, it can hardly be favouritism for those that actually respond and get involved - everyone had the chance to do so equally.
Laerise Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:09:00 - [11] You should ask your new aliance mate Andreus Ixiris about this, he has a lot of experience in these things.
Stakhanov Metafarmers	Posted - 2008.02.03 01:49:00 - [12] If you were attacking amarr rats in the 7th fleet things in the bleak land , you really were asking for it... Originally by: ivan draco we didnt want your post anyway
Tharrn Amarr Epitoth Fleetyards Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.02.03 02:02:00 - [13] Edited by: Tharrn on 03/02/2008 02:03:34 Dude... Linky to the IGS announcement Those that enlisted are basically part of the Navy 'Auxilliary'. And your 'noob in a 1/10' is full well knowing that or he wouldn't be 70 jumps from your space (he is a quite prolific anti-Amarr poster on the IGS). Invite RPers into your alliance and you get involved, that is how the cookie crumbles. Now recruiting!
Talla Hurzin Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2008.02.03 02:14:00 - [14] EVE Roleplayers do not get their own separate server to play on. As such they must interact with everyone else, and sometimes that means non-rpers. If you get decced by a RP corp or alliance, you or some one under your banner must have done something to earn their ire. I suggest you look into the matter on your end.
Tnilf Xeno Xanadu The Covenant Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.03 02:20:00 - [15] Like I said they can war dec us I really dont give a crap. It is the fact that CCP gives ppl money to war dec ppl is the thing I have issue with.
Micia Minmatar Thrace Inc Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.02.03 02:37:00 - [16] Originally by: Tnilf It is the fact that CCP gives ppl money to war dec ppl is the thing I have issue with. The Amarr may be (morally) bankrupt, but I highly doubt their financial ability to pay for war is. There's no way CCP is subsidising this. Are you maybe confusing this with the U'K payments made to pilots, who take on these disputed complexes? Oh... and keep up the good work, Covenant Alliance. _______ We are Ushra'Khan. We come for our people.
Tnilf Xeno Xanadu The Covenant Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.03 03:49:00 - [17] [ 2008.02.02 23:34:31 ] Tharrn > We even get the money for the war back by the Amarr Navy [ 2008.02.02 23:34:33 ] Dunbar Regan > so cut us a little slack as to understanding your motivations please [ 2008.02.02 23:34:50 ] Tnilf > what do you mean you get the war dec money back? [ 2008.02.02 23:35:01 ] Haverloth > The Imperial Navy is funding these wars. [ 2008.02.02 23:35:07 ] Haverloth > We are defending Imperial installations. [ 2008.02.02 23:35:11 ] Tharrn > basically a Navy officer (GM) contacted us asking us to defend those 7th Fleet Installations.
Darth Revanant Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.02.03 03:51:00 - [18] So... you think you can attack an organization in EVE and not have that organization get its allies to attack you back? It's about time attacking NPCs in EVE had more consequences than just -0.00000001% faction standing. Everything in EVE has consequences, including killing NPCs. In the game and NPC is another person, just like a PC. _______________ Recruitment Office
Rexthor Hammerfists Eternity INC. Mercenary Coalition	Posted - 2008.02.03 04:01:00 - [19] pretty cool if true, should happen mroe often - maybe scripted or something. bring on faction warfare cpp ;) -
Gaven Lok'ri Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.02.03 04:29:00 - [20] I expect that this is a beta for faction warfare. Just as a friendly OOC Public Service Announcement: If you shoot a 7th fleet complex and we catch you doing it, Amarrian groups will declare war on you. If you don't want this, make it utterly clear to anyone who might run plex's in the Bleak Lands that 7th fleet complexes are off limits. Deus Vult! PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public'
Benny Hill Caldari Deceased Inc	Posted - 2008.02.03 06:25:00 - [21] Originally by: Tnilf [ 2008.02.02 23:34:31 ] Tharrn > We even get the money for the war back by the Amarr Navy [ 2008.02.02 23:34:33 ] Dunbar Regan > so cut us a little slack as to understanding your motivations please [ 2008.02.02 23:34:50 ] Tnilf > what do you mean you get the war dec money back? [ 2008.02.02 23:35:01 ] Haverloth > The Imperial Navy is funding these wars. [ 2008.02.02 23:35:07 ] Haverloth > We are defending Imperial installations. [ 2008.02.02 23:35:11 ] Tharrn > basically a Navy officer (GM) contacted us asking us to defend those 7th Fleet Installations. If they are excited that CCP might refund them 2 million isk, 10 mil isk of 20 mil isk, they they are the most pathetic alliance in the game. They need ccp ask them them to role play something they are perfectly capable of doing on their own? You should be able to pwn them sinc ethey have no isk to replace ships.
Galen Darksmith Caldari Independent Navy Reserve The Fourth District	Posted - 2008.02.03 06:41:00 - [22] Originally by: Benny Hill Originally by: Tnilf [ 2008.02.02 23:34:31 ] Tharrn > We even get the money for the war back by the Amarr Navy [ 2008.02.02 23:34:33 ] Dunbar Regan > so cut us a little slack as to understanding your motivations please [ 2008.02.02 23:34:50 ] Tnilf > what do you mean you get the war dec money back? [ 2008.02.02 23:35:01 ] Haverloth > The Imperial Navy is funding these wars. [ 2008.02.02 23:35:07 ] Haverloth > We are defending Imperial installations. [ 2008.02.02 23:35:11 ] Tharrn > basically a Navy officer (GM) contacted us asking us to defend those 7th Fleet Installations. If they are excited that CCP might refund them 2 million isk, 10 mil isk of 20 mil isk, they they are the most pathetic alliance in the game. They need ccp ask them them to role play something they are perfectly capable of doing on their own? You should be able to pwn them sinc ethey have no isk to replace ships. OR....maybe they need to wardec a lot of corps who attack 7th fleet assets. I'd say it's about time real consequences were put in place for shooting at faction NPCs, but this isn't even real consequences. CCP is just paying player corps to put out the consequences for them. Factional warfare needs to hurry up and get here. And, of course, RPers cannot PvP. Just ask Tri. ;)
Synapse Archae Amarr Demonic Retribution Pure.	Posted - 2008.02.03 06:42:00 - [23] Edited by: Synapse Archae on 03/02/2008 06:43:14 Originally by: Siigari Kitawa Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 03/02/2008 00:12:22 Originally by: Pajamas Jack Now is when we say Proof or STFU Wait, is this the Panama Jack from Tribes? Nevermind, pajama jack lmao TRIBES FOREVER. My name in Tribes 2 is Dr Spock, I'm in Team Energy [NrG], used to run United Storm Guard (USG) on the latters. - - - Originally by: CCP Garthagk While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
Grr Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.02.03 06:47:00 - [24] Lets give you some facts here from the people who did the deccing: 1) Our wardec costs was 100m. 2) This is not the the 1st war the Amarr Navy has paid for and probably will not be the last saving our alliance alot of money so far. The Amarr paramilitary have probably saved close to 1.5b by now. 3) The small gang warfare we have been provided (only frigates can enter the complexes) makes our wars cheap and fun so hats off to the person who came up with the idea. 4) You are warned when entering the complexes and have been given a news story. Any corp/alliance seen attacking the complexes are given fair warning by us. 5) The "noob" in question, Andreus Ixiris is a well known wind bag on the Intergalactic Summit Forum and knew exactly what he was doing. Covenant alliance should be more ****ed off about letting him join than a few war decs. 6) We have no interest in attacking The Covenant alliance 70 jumps away and only wish to defend our forces. A wardec is the only way to achieve this when we have complexes in hisec. Epitoth Fleetyards is Recruiting
Micia Minmatar Thrace Inc Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2008.02.03 07:09:00 - [25] Originally by: Benny Hill Originally by: Tnilf [ 2008.02.02 23:34:31 ] Tharrn > We even get the money for the war back by the Amarr Navy [ 2008.02.02 23:34:33 ] Dunbar Regan > so cut us a little slack as to understanding your motivations please [ 2008.02.02 23:34:50 ] Tnilf > what do you mean you get the war dec money back? [ 2008.02.02 23:35:01 ] Haverloth > The Imperial Navy is funding these wars. [ 2008.02.02 23:35:07 ] Haverloth > We are defending Imperial installations. [ 2008.02.02 23:35:11 ] Tharrn > basically a Navy officer (GM) contacted us asking us to defend those 7th Fleet Installations. If they are excited that CCP might refund them 2 million isk, 10 mil isk of 20 mil isk, they they are the most pathetic alliance in the game. They need ccp ask them them to role play something they are perfectly capable of doing on their own? You should be able to pwn them sinc ethey have no isk to replace ships. I think there's a lot of confusion going on, here. A lot of it can be sorted out by going through some of the links that were listed earlier. Or maybe not... there's a lot of additional threads down in IGS which cover what's happening, in that "crazy RP lingo". CCP picked up (and expanded on) a storyline that had been dropped a while back (when they got rid of AURORA, the original CCP RP team). Part of this included in-character communications from NPC factions (Defiants & 7th Fleet) asking for "help", and having interested RP corporations to pick their sides. Shortly after this, random complexes started appearing (with Minmatar to destroy & Amarr to defend), and a goal of certain objects to be collected in the process. It probably is part of a test of the upcoming factional warfare, as someone mentioned earlier. When Tharrn (as quoted) states OOC'ly that a GM contacted them to defend the installations, he's bang on. Likewise, anti-Amarrian forces were asked to attack the installations, essentially. How the various RP corps & alliances choose to react to unknown parties getting involved is up to their policies. If Ushra'Khan was mid-destruction of an installation, and a random person popped in to try and save it... you'd better believe there'd be repercussions of some kind. (Exactly what... I have no idea. I'm a grunt) It's no surprise that PIE have taken an action against what they perceive to be a threat against their goal/mission. One of CA's pilots (bless his heart) has taken a shine to collecting U'K rewards for his collected pieces. VV & PIE are certainly perfectly capable of doing what they do, and always have been. In spite of our idealogical differences, I would never dismiss them out of hand as "most pathetic alliance in the game". That would be incredibly disrespectful, towards RP enemies that have put their all on the line for over three years. ...though you are welcome to blow them up, too. _______ We are Ushra'Khan. We come for our people.
Johnny Darkseid Caldari School of Applied Knowledge	Posted - 2008.02.03 07:14:00 - [26] Political metagaming on the forums. Whodathunkit?
Ironnight Caldari x13 When Fat Kids Attack	Posted - 2008.02.03 07:15:00 - [27] Sweet a free war, sign us up CCP. The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est Pro patria mori.
Jenny Spitfire Caldari SIVAKASI	Posted - 2008.02.03 08:15:00 - [28] This sounds cool. Anyone knows where can I get this mission from? I would like to taek part please. --------- Technica impendi Caldari generis. Pax Caldaria! Recruitment -KB-
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2008.02.03 08:33:00 - [29] While I think that some announcement about this in general forum or even better in the news would have been nice, it seem very interesting and positive. So there is some testing being done for faction warfare , good.
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.03 09:10:00 - [30] Edited by: Karlemgne on 03/02/2008 09:12:25 Originally by: Francis Inch Edited by: Francis Inch on 03/02/2008 00:27:43 Originally by: Tnilf We were just war dec'd by an Amarr alliance. I dont really give a **** since we are about 70 jumps from amarr space. But the issue I have is supposedly a GM gave them the isk to do it because it is part of a "storyline". Apparently this was because a noob was doing a 1/10 complex w/ amarr rats in empire in a frigate. If some stupid rp corp wants to war dec someone for that whatever. But I take issue with CCP giving alliances the money to war dec. Removing a substantial part of the cost for aggressors. I mean why make it cost money if they are just going to make it free for thier friends? You see those news articles that come up every day when you select your character? Sometimes they actually... mean something. Your pilot friend was busy interacting with a new complex that CCP made part of a roleplay event that has been playing out for weeks in those new articles and in game, for those that look for those kinds of activities. This is just another of those events that the people that pay attention can get involved in - just as past events have netted others all sorts of items, kills, rewards or other such things. It's not anyone giving anyone else favouritism, it's just another part of EVE being a living, breathing, joined up world where CCP try to at least keep the Empires part of EVE. As a side issue, bearing in mind an alliance or even a corp costs more to set up and maintain than 1 week of war dec cost, it's hardly a significant benefit to start jumping up and down about. Number one, when I read the EULA I don't see anywhere where it says I'm required to Role play. I don't mind role playing, I've been doing the pencil and paper variety for years. Personally, I don't find that it works well in video games like this. So I don't do it here period. A rping alliance/corp can dec me and my corp, however, DON'T expect me to to "Roleplay" with you when you convo me in character demanding my surrender. Its not going to happen. I digress. My point is, its a game, you can war dec whoever you want for whatever reason you want. If you want to "role play" (very little of what passes for rping in eve is worth me even looking at) that war dec, well then more power to you. I will not participate. Don't expect me too. Don't expect others to give a sh** either. Lastly, if the OP is correct, and a GM allows people to war dec other corps for free, because the aggressor is "role playing" I've got a problem with that. If you want to role play a war because some noob ran a complex, fine. You should have to pay for that war like everyone else. And you should never, ever try to impose your character interaction "style" on those who don't want to participate. Keep it in corp, or local, don't convo people who don't want to RP in character AND don't LECTURE us on the forums about how your play style is better. That's just asinine. -Karlemgne
Tnilf Xeno Xanadu The Covenant Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.03 09:14:00 - [31] Originally by: Karlemgne Lastly, if the OP is correct, and a GM allows people to war dec other corps for free, because the aggressor is "role playing" I've got a problem with that. If you want to role play a war because some noob ran a complex, fine. You should have to pay for that war like everyone else. This was my point.
Avon Caldari Black Nova Corp Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.02.03 09:22:00 - [32] If you involve yourself in a published storyline you are role playing. Make the most of it, some of the best times I've had in Eve were during such events. Eve-Online: The Text Adventure
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.03 09:35:00 - [33] Originally by: Tnilf Originally by: Karlemgne Lastly, if the OP is correct, and a GM allows people to war dec other corps for free, because the aggressor is "role playing" I've got a problem with that. If you want to role play a war because some noob ran a complex, fine. You should have to pay for that war like everyone else. This was my point. Well, since the role players think its a great idea to give out free wars to role players, I've got an excellent idea. Reform privateers, and petition for free war dec's. They're "role playing" hi-sec pirates. In fact, I've got a few wars I'd like to start. I better get to work on those petitions. -Karlemgne
Riho Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2008.02.03 09:50:00 - [34] Originally by: Tnilf Originally by: Karlemgne Lastly, if the OP is correct, and a GM allows people to war dec other corps for free, because the aggressor is "role playing" I've got a problem with that. If you want to role play a war because some noob ran a complex, fine. You should have to pay for that war like everyone else. This was my point. your alliance member involved in a ROLEPLAY event... that means your ALLIANCE involved in the roleplay event.... you where roleplaying and they got orders from the navy to defend. it doesnt matter if you roleplay or not... it matters that one of your members did and now everyone will be involved. your member represented your allinace in the event. thats the point. and i dont get why ppl allways belittle Roleplayers... thats just funny and shows theyr own stupidity. PS. im not a roleplayer and never have been, but if events get better in the future.. i might start aswell :) ---------------------------------- This is Me
Frug Zenithal Harvest	Posted - 2008.02.03 09:59:00 - [35] Edited by: Frug on 03/02/2008 10:00:03 What is all this? Didn't CCP scrap aurora because of this kind of tinfoilhattery? I'd like to know what's going on, and who's giving who how much, and why. Edit: I mean with proof from CCP - - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - If you think I'm awesome, say BOOO BOOO!! - Ductoris Neat look what I found - Kreul Hey, my marbles
Saraith Narr Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.02.03 10:00:00 - [36] Edited by: Saraith Narr on 03/02/2008 10:06:22 Edited by: Saraith Narr on 03/02/2008 10:01:50 As Riho pointed out, one of your members knew full well the background and mechanics behind the 7th Fleet ADU's, and chose to attack them whilst a member of your Alliance. One of the mechanics that he was aware of is that loyalist forces must wardec opposing alliances/corps if we are to defend the ADU's effectively, or even at all. I agree, that this is a poorly thought out and clunky system, but its what we have to play with. We can either accept its failings, or pack up our toys and go back to Amarr. We've chosen to accept it, but not without much grumbling, let me assure you. IMHO the ADU complexes should count as 0.0 space for everyone in them, or attacking the NPC's should flag you for PvP in some way. Perhaps this is a lesson CCP will learn for the future, and I certainly hope that it is. If Covenant Alliance do not want this war, you can simply tell your members not to attack the ADU's, and we will have no reason to be at war with you. But if you do attack the ADU's, we will defend them in the only manner that CCP has allowed us, and that is war. Edit To clarify, PIE are not currently at war with Covenant Alliance, and on reading my post it seems to suggest that we are.
Tnilf Xeno Xanadu The Covenant Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.03 10:10:00 - [37] Yeah you guys who keep responding that he is involving himself in rp are missing the point. I dont really give a crap if he gets involved in it. That is the way he likes to play the game like he likes to play the game. If I think it is r-tarded w/ a capital R, that is my problem. It is the fact that CCP is giving alliances 100mil to war dec people. If you want to war dec us fine. I would prefer that you not. But if you do oh well. The issue I have with it. Is if we wanted to war dec someone and kill thier noobs or whatever in empire. It would cost us isk. But it doesnt cost them anything? wtf is up with that. B/c you are rpers you get special rights? Like free war decs?
Francis Inch Amarr Lightyear Inc	Posted - 2008.02.03 10:17:00 - [38] Originally by: Tnilf Yeah you guys who keep responding that he is involving himself in rp are missing the point. I dont really give a crap if he gets involved in it. That is the way he likes to play the game like he likes to play the game. If I think it is r-tarded w/ a capital R, that is my problem. It is the fact that CCP is giving alliances 100mil to war dec people. If you want to war dec us fine. I would prefer that you not. But if you do oh well. The issue I have with it. Is if we wanted to war dec someone and kill thier noobs or whatever in empire. It would cost us isk. But it doesnt cost them anything? wtf is up with that. B/c you are rpers you get special rights? Like free war decs? So Alliance Tournaments should have no prizes? No unique ships should ever have been given out for the events CCP have done to involve players in Empire events such as the appointment of a new Amarr Emperor, Caldari sports racing and Gallente Elections? CCP shouldn't drop loot when they interact with players as pirate or navy fleets or research scientists or jovian visitors? All of these things have happened and some player or another benefits directly - should all of this be taken away just because you can't give to everyone equally - even when all events are open to all if they just choose to pursue them?
Frug Zenithal Harvest	Posted - 2008.02.03 10:19:00 - [39] Originally by: Tnilf Yeah you guys who keep responding that he is involving himself in rp are missing the point. I dont really give a crap if he gets involved in it. That is the way he likes to play the game like he likes to play the game. If I think it is r-tarded w/ a capital R, that is my problem. It is the fact that CCP is giving alliances 100mil to war dec people. If you want to war dec us fine. I would prefer that you not. But if you do oh well. The issue I have with it. Is if we wanted to war dec someone and kill thier noobs or whatever in empire. It would cost us isk. But it doesnt cost them anything? wtf is up with that. B/c you are rpers you get special rights? Like free war decs? Did you or did you not willingly provoke them into this war, knowing at the time that they are an RP alliance fulfilling a role? I'm assuming that their "free war decs" you're whining about are conditional. Not "here's a few hundred million go fight random people you feel like fighting" but "if you fulfill this role in our universe we will help you do it" In which case you need to stop whining. - - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - - If you think I'm awesome, say BOOO BOOO!! - Ductoris Neat look what I found - Kreul Hey, my marbles
Tnilf Xeno Xanadu The Covenant Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.03 10:23:00 - [40] Originally by: Francis Inch Originally by: Tnilf Yeah you guys who keep responding that he is involving himself in rp are missing the point. I dont really give a crap if he gets involved in it. That is the way he likes to play the game like he likes to play the game. If I think it is r-tarded w/ a capital R, that is my problem. It is the fact that CCP is giving alliances 100mil to war dec people. If you want to war dec us fine. I would prefer that you not. But if you do oh well. The issue I have with it. Is if we wanted to war dec someone and kill thier noobs or whatever in empire. It would cost us isk. But it doesnt cost them anything? wtf is up with that. B/c you are rpers you get special rights? Like free war decs? So Alliance Tournaments should have no prizes? I believe there is a billion isk entry fee for the alliance tournaments.
Gaven Lok'ri Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.02.03 10:26:00 - [41] When you run missions, you get isk from the Empires, no? How is this different. Service to the NPC empires gets tangible rewards in game. Deus Vult! PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public'
Grr Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.02.03 10:45:00 - [42] Frug you assume correctly we are indeed filling a role. Here are some more facts so the idiots speculating here might be silenced: 1) We are being reimbursed for our wardec costs but only if we proove that they are for the purpose of defending the bleaklands complexes (I assume CCP have some way of telling or they might just take our word for it) 2) It has been stated that only smaller corps and alliances will be given financial support. CVA for example would probably be told where to go ;) For the record I agree that the complexes should be 0.0 sec status so these wardecs are not neccersary and we can do our job without them. However since no mechanic exists CCP are doing a good job providing a temporary solution imo. Oh and Covenant alliance to make this clear we have no grudge against you OOC, we will not be sending fleets your way and picking on your noobs. Defence of The Bleaklands is our priority. Epitoth Fleetyards is Recruiting
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.02.03 10:53:00 - [43] Edited by: Rodj Blake on 03/02/2008 10:54:14 Originally by: Tnilf Originally by: Francis Inch So Alliance Tournaments should have no prizes? I believe there is a billion isk entry fee for the alliance tournaments. I believe that it gets refunded if you turn up for your fights. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Rodj Blake Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.02.03 11:09:00 - [44] Just to add to what has been said by others, most of the wars that have been paid for by the 7th have been dropped relatively quickly after some private diplomacy. This is often a better way of resolving differences than running to the forums. Additionally, when the orders came through from the 7th, PIE was left with a decision. As an independent corporation, we were limited to three simultaneous war declarations, and we had already reached our limit. Therefore we had a choice - either give up our independence by joining an alliance or spend money to create our own one. We chose the latter. The cost of creating the alliance was greater than the war fees to date, so these wars haven't been totally free for us. Dulce et decorum est pro imperium mori.
Andtha Splits	Posted - 2008.02.03 11:17:00 - [45] Originally by: Tnilf Like I said they can war dec us I really dont give a crap. It is the fact that CCP gives ppl money to war dec ppl is the thing I have issue with. CCP give you money when you go ratting. Difference?
Pohbis Neo T.E.C.H.	Posted - 2008.02.03 11:30:00 - [46] Originally by: Francis Inch No unique ships should ever have been given out for the events CCP have done to involve players in Empire events such as the appointment of a new Amarr Emperor, Caldari sports racing and Gallente Elections? CCP shouldn't drop loot when they interact with players as pirate or navy fleets or research scientists or jovian visitors? All of these things have happened and some player or another benefits directly - should all of this be taken away just because you can't give to everyone equally - even when all events are open to all if they just choose to pursue them? QFT Relax, CCP cares a little about their RPers. Everyone should be happy about that, because they are the reason that there's even a little hope for the backstory and "lore" of EVE. Everyone should be happy about this, especially PvPers because this means you can take part in the forthcoming factional warfare without having to fight them booooring NPCs you always complain about ;)
Francis Inch Amarr Lightyear Inc	Posted - 2008.02.03 11:35:00 - [47] Originally by: Karlemgne Edited by: Karlemgne on 03/02/2008 09:37:07 Number one, when I read the EULA I don't see anywhere where it says I'm required to role play. I don't mind role playing, I've been doing the pencil and paper variety for years. Personally, I don't find that it works well in video games like this. So I don't do it here period. A rping alliance/corp can dec me and my corp, however, DON'T expect me to to "role play" with you when you convo me in character demanding my surrender. Its not going to happen. I digress. My point is, its a game, you can war dec whoever you want for whatever reason you want. If you want to "role play" that war dec, well then more power to you. I will not participate. Don't expect me too. Don't expect others to give a sh either. Ahh, I see, so it's okay to be a non-consentual PvPer, and pirate people who don't want to be involved in it, because non-consentual pvp is part of EVE as a MMORPG. But don't allow anyone non-consentual roleplay, because roleplay isn't really part of a roleplay** game? EVE is roleplay, whether you like it or not. Picking and choosing to ignore that and whining about it is the same as a carebear whining that pirates shouldn't get to attack them.
Sephra Star	Posted - 2008.02.03 11:41:00 - [48] I think what CCP is doing here is admirable in terms of effort to enrich game content. I am quite certain that far more people would want to join the EVE Universe to take part in such immersions than the very few naysayers who might leave because of it. Up until this thread I was not even aware that CCP did this kind of thing. I just finished reading the linked blog by the CCP employee in charge of the G TEAM (Don't Ask) and frankly I will no longer just forget about those news articles when I log in. From now on I will read them with a renewed interest.
Vabjekf	Posted - 2008.02.03 11:41:00 - [49] Its refreshing to see a modern day MMO with things like this. Most mainstream ones are dead and static and have no player interaction with the game world ;_;
Rogue Roy Minmatar Rogue Aces	Posted - 2008.02.03 12:09:00 - [50] Edited by: Rogue Roy on 03/02/2008 12:09:48 This sounds awesome and I think it is high time that MMORPG developers take an active role in promoting the game storyline. This creates a sensation that the huge NPC space empires in EVE actually DO exist as astropolitical factions rather than map labels. I hope we will see much more of this stuff in the future. It's about the mid-level players fighting to maintain their standings, treading on those below and plotting against those above. -CCP Ginger
Khes	Posted - 2008.02.03 12:20:00 - [51] If the wardecs is all within the storyline then fine. If there are people willing to roleplay some instance in the game for the small fee of som wardecs then all power to them. It only makes the game more fun if there where more REAL people behind the ships you encounter in missions etc. i only wished that ALL NPC were played by real players and if they got a small sallery for that (like getting their wardecs paid) its all fine.
NeoTheo Caldari Species 5618 Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service	Posted - 2008.02.03 12:32:00 - [52] Edited by: NeoTheo on 03/02/2008 12:33:56 I have no problems with CCP organising events that help roleplay, BUT IF THEY ARE GIVING FUNDING FOR A WAR THAT POTENTIALLY IMPACTS OTHER PLAYERS IT HAS TO STOP. this is exactly as bad as CCP devs helping bob, its not on the same scale in terms of impact but it crosses the SAME LINE. if gm's are handing out free wardec's then they need firing. (again i say i have no issue with roleplayes, but i want them to live by the same rules as the rest of us - no cash, NO WARDEC). GRRRRRR, this is something that might push me over the edge. /Theo. PS: some blue comment ASAP, its important.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2008.02.03 12:45:00 - [53] I must admit that this thread has a positive effect. I want to send one of my alts to look what is happening. I would like to be involved (with my standing I would be exactly at home with the anti Amarr forces) but my alliance wouldn't appreciate it (bunch of Caldari lovers) . A little point, what will happen if some member of a NPC corp start running the complex? It seem that setting the complex to a 0.0 equivalent (or allowing people there to fire against characters with -5 or worse standing with the empire) would be a valid solution. (I hope no one take this a s asuggestion to do that)
Saraith Narr Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.02.03 12:50:00 - [54] Quote: BUT IF THEY ARE GIVING FUNDING FOR A WAR THAT POTENTIALLY IMPACTS OTHER PLAYERS IT HAS TO STOP. To clarify, I believe that these wardecs are only subsidised if evidence is given that the corp in question has assaulted an ADU. If your members are going to interact with a given RP event, then you have to expect us to interact with you in return. We aren't getting free reign to go to war with whomever we please. We are working within the mechanics of a system which gives us only one recourse to defend the ADU's. That recourse is to declare war. The reason why CCP has set the system up in this manner is so that a small RP corp/alliance can get involved in the event without being penalisaed financially. As other posters have said, this is not a blanket policy, we are not all getting free wars against whoever we feel like fighting. If you and your corp does not wish to enter into this RP storyline, or in fact any RP at all, you are of course free to do so. Just be aware that if you enter an ADU and start firing, you are getting involved and you are impacting on other players.
Venkul Mul Gallente	Posted - 2008.02.03 12:54:00 - [55] Originally by: NeoTheo Edited by: NeoTheo on 03/02/2008 12:33:56 I have no problems with CCP organising events that help roleplay, BUT IF THEY ARE GIVING FUNDING FOR A WAR THAT POTENTIALLY IMPACTS OTHER PLAYERS IT HAS TO STOP. this is exactly as bad as CCP devs helping bob, its not on the same scale in terms of impact but it crosses the SAME LINE. if gm's are handing out free wardec's then they need firing. (again i say i have no issue with roleplayes, but i want them to live by the same rules as the rest of us - no cash, NO WARDEC). GRRRRRR, this is something that might push me over the edge. /Theo. PS: some blue comment ASAP, its important. Sorry, but it seem to me that it is a choice by the "invading" corp, not the roleplaying corp. They have decided to enter a restricted area to play there, the rules are specific and clear, so why they should be allowed to run free a restricted dungeon because they "don't want to roleplay"? If the wardecced corp isn't interested they can ask the people running the dungeon to stop or they can expel them. If the corp don't run the dungeon the wardec should be retracted and/or CCP should stop reimbursing it. But as long as the other corp is playing in the restricted area, they should abide to the restricted area rules. You can argue that better rules to handle a area like that, but the rules are the same for all people. If you want to participate to the war there you can ask for it and get the same rule on refunding that other people get. So it is not a form of favoritism, it is a state sponsored war. If you enter it you get some advantage (0 cost war) and disavantages (you must partecipate to the war in that location).
NeoTheo Caldari Species 5618 Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service	Posted - 2008.02.03 13:05:00 - [56] Originally by: Venkul Mul Originally by: NeoTheo Edited by: NeoTheo on 03/02/2008 12:33:56 I have no problems with CCP organising events that help roleplay, BUT IF THEY ARE GIVING FUNDING FOR A WAR THAT POTENTIALLY IMPACTS OTHER PLAYERS IT HAS TO STOP. this is exactly as bad as CCP devs helping bob, its not on the same scale in terms of impact but it crosses the SAME LINE. if gm's are handing out free wardec's then they need firing. (again i say i have no issue with roleplayes, but i want them to live by the same rules as the rest of us - no cash, NO WARDEC). GRRRRRR, this is something that might push me over the edge. /Theo. PS: some blue comment ASAP, its important. Sorry, but it seem to me that it is a choice by the "invading" corp, not the roleplaying corp. They have decided to enter a restricted area to play there, the rules are specific and clear, so why they should be allowed to run free a restricted dungeon because they "don't want to roleplay"? If the wardecced corp isn't interested they can ask the people running the dungeon to stop or they can expel them. If the corp don't run the dungeon the wardec should be retracted and/or CCP should stop reimbursing it. But as long as the other corp is playing in the restricted area, they should abide to the restricted area rules. You can argue that better rules to handle a area like that, but the rules are the same for all people. If you want to participate to the war there you can ask for it and get the same rule on refunding that other people get. So it is not a form of favoritism, it is a state sponsored war. If you enter it you get some advantage (0 cost war) and disavantages (you must partecipate to the war in that location). hang on, are you telling me that there are places in game that i am not allowed to go cause i dont roleplay? and that if i go there i am automatically signing up to be wardec by a none standard mechanic? if so, just show me news item, or where this is stated and ill be happy with that. i was under impression that some dude used a plex in amarr space and then got wardeced by none standard funds, well theres a alot of amarr space man, and its there for others to use - no just the pro amaar roleplay crew. like i said just show me where its documented.
NeoTheo Caldari Species 5618 Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service	Posted - 2008.02.03 13:07:00 - [57] Edited by: NeoTheo on 03/02/2008 13:09:26 Originally by: Saraith Narr Quote: BUT IF THEY ARE GIVING FUNDING FOR A WAR THAT POTENTIALLY IMPACTS OTHER PLAYERS IT HAS TO STOP. To clarify, I believe that these wardecs are only subsidised if evidence is given that the corp in question has assaulted an ADU. If your members are going to interact with a given RP event, then you have to expect us to interact with you in return. We aren't getting free reign to go to war with whomever we please. We are working within the mechanics of a system which gives us only one recourse to defend the ADU's. That recourse is to declare war. The reason why CCP has set the system up in this manner is so that a small RP corp/alliance can get involved in the event without being penalisaed financially. As other posters have said, this is not a blanket policy, we are not all getting free wars against whoever we feel like fighting. If you and your corp does not wish to enter into this RP storyline, or in fact any RP at all, you are of course free to do so. Just be aware that if you enter an ADU and start firing, you are getting involved and you are impacting on other players. this is cleared, can you show me the doco with regards to this system please? it actully sounds like fun, its dam close to the concept of a wow battleground however and i dont like that. id be much happyer if the "War" was only valid in the systems / area's set aside for the "roleplay". maybe i misunderstood the system, my fault for not reading as much as i should i guess. still the system sounds a bit farked up to me. ohh btw dont take me as a aint roleplay person, i believe it brings some richness to eve - i just saw alliagations of crooked GMS and went off on one i think.
Laerise Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.02.03 13:38:00 - [58] Originally by: NeoTheo (snip, mods dont like pyramids, no?) hang on, are you telling me that there are places in game that i am not allowed to go cause i dont roleplay? and that if i go there i am automatically signing up to be wardec by a none standard mechanic? if so, just show me news item, or where this is stated and ill be happy with that. i was under impression that some dude used a plex in amarr space and then got wardeced by none standard funds, well theres a alot of amarr space man, and its there for others to use - no just the pro amaar roleplay crew. like i said just show me where its documented. Invading these 7th fleet "complexes", which you have to scan for first by the way, in the bleak lands region is something you choose to do freely. It is highly unlikely that you will get war'dec'ed right away without any form of warning, be that in local or via diplomatic measures. Or, to use a fitting example. If you fly into BoB/RA space and go on rampage against their miners/ratters there you have to expect repercussions too. You are of course welcome to visit the blak lands (although they are lowsec and slightly pirate infested...) and have a look around. As long as you leave the 7th fleet bases alone I assure you you will not get into troubles with amarrian paramilitaries. :Hint: If you want to have quite regular fights against rather competent enemies with frigate sized ships, get involved, I doubt neither side would mind yet another supporter of "the cause". (Only frigates and estroyers can enter the complexes.) :Hint end:
Pohbis Neo T.E.C.H.	Posted - 2008.02.03 13:59:00 - [59] Originally by: NeoTheo hang on, are you telling me that there are places in game that i am not allowed to go cause i dont roleplay? and that if i go there i am automatically signing up to be wardec by a none standard mechanic? if so, just show me news item, or where this is stated and ill be happy with that. i was under impression that some dude used a plex in amarr space and then got wardeced by none standard funds, well theres a alot of amarr space man, and its there for others to use - no just the pro amaar roleplay crew. like i said just show me where its documented. ROFL Hang on there, you're telling me there are places in game I can't go if I don't want to PvP? There's a lot of lowsec and 0.0 space, and it's there for people to use. Not just the PvPers... /sarcasm with a stint of irony Oh how I love gravity and the way it makes the pendulum swing both ways
Archbishop Amarr PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:00:00 - [60] For those upset about CCP paying for wardecs or having to engage RPers a few points to consider. - RP events are part of the long history of Eve. EVERY EVENT IS AN RP EVENT!!!!!! Sure you may not RP yourself but your participating in an RP event. Heck the whole game is RP when you think about it. Anyway these events are provided to the Eve community as a whole (not just roleplayers) to enhance the player experience. Some have been really good and some not quite so good. The key is ITS FOR US. - In this event you can either be a Defiant or Amarrian supporter. You have a CHOICE. You don't have to RP one specific way. - CCP has basically "funded" wardecs before. Anytime you participated in an event with Aurora pilots you could shoot at without concord intervention that was basically a "free war" outside game mechanics was it not? These Aurora pilots were usually in corps yet you could shoot them without declaring. Isn't that basically a "free war" too? - CCP does a good job of publicizing these events on the news when you login and on the ingame browser news. Try reading the news sometimes and you'll see stuff like this appear. In the past I've missed out on patch notes and chances to make isk due to upcoming market changes yet I've had no one to blame but myself. CCP put the news out there I was just not being proactive in reading it. It's like that. - If you jump into an RP storyline you can expect RPers to interact with you on an RP level. No you don't have to interact on an RP basis yourself but you also shouldn't whine when others do. Thats life. - CCP has long given out prizes for events and in effect wardec fees are a "prize" of sorts. The Golden and Silver Magnates for the Amarr Championships. The Mothership. Remember the Jovian Bodyparts deal and the free cloaking blueprints? How about that Admiral guy running around lowsec being shot at by everyone. Loot, mods, blueprints, prizes. All those events. Those were all RP events that EVERYONE participated in. Even if you're not a "roleplayer" per se you participated in a RP event if you took part. Now for the OP who seems upset...... A word of wisdom to those who let someone into a corp/alliance. There's a great website called EVE-SEARCH where you can search out the past posts of people. Heck you don't even need that just click their portrait here on the Eve forums and view their last posts. In this case the instigator of this wardec has a LONG history of anti-Amarr sentiment and he's posted almost exclusively on the IGS forum (where the RPers live). It's simple negligence to let someone into a corp without doing even the most rudimentary background check. I know in this case if I was the OP I'd be asking "ah what is all this stuff" in an interview not a week later after I've been wardecd. Archie PIE WEBSITE & FORUMS
Feilamya	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:08:00 - [61] Originally by: Darth Revanant Edited by: Darth Revanant on 03/02/2008 04:03:29 So... you think you can attack an organization in EVE and not have that organization get its allies to attack you back? It's about time attacking NPCs in EVE had more consequences than just -0.00000001% faction standing. Everything in EVE has consequences, including killing NPCs. In the game an NPC is another person, just like a PC. So basically you are telling us that roleplayers are NPC-rights activists?
Tamia Clant New Dawn Corp New Eden Research	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:10:00 - [62] Originally by: Karlemgne Number one, when I read the EULA I don't see anywhere where it says I'm required to role play. Hmm, who would have thought you'd have to role-play in a massively multiplayer online *role-playing* game?! If you don't RP, then that's your choice, to be honest, but as soon as someone gets involved (such as going to that 7th fleet complex) he should expect the consequences whether he cares about RP or not. Looking for queue-free research slots? Click here!
Louis DelaBlanche Cosmic Odyssey YouWhat	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:13:00 - [63] So a player (aparently with full knowledge of what theyre doing) went into a complex specificially introduced for a roleplay event, & the otherside in this event relies on subsidised war decs to ensure their safety from this player & others? I dont see the harm in that. Just tell your member to stop being involved/leave alliance if you dont like the consequences of it. It may not be a paticularly good mechanic being employed to defend these plexes, but it sounds like its the only one currently available. Its not like theyre dropping 7 dreadnaughts on ur towers
Cailais Amarr VITOC	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:20:00 - [64] Id rather get decced by an RP corp that has some motivation for declaring a war in back story terms than be decced by "OMGHAORL33T corp" thats just deccing because it can. Why not join IGS (in character) and rant against 'State sponsored' terrorism or something? Demand the Amarrian Navy cease its funding of militants against Corporate entities? C. Improved Low Sec Idea!!
Verone Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:20:00 - [65] Simple Fact : It's an RP Event. Known and vocal enemies of the Amarr Empire have attacked one of it's installations. The Amarr Navy has asked a loyalist corporation to defend it's installations from future attacks. The Amarr Navy has given the loyalist corporation the means to do so. Veto Corp have been contacted and hired as mercenaries for an RP event before, to take down a Federation Navy Convoy. We were paid for it as mercenaries would and should be. I see no issue with any of this, it's a perfectly valid RP event. If you want to be part of stuff like this and reap the rewards then you need to make a proactive effort to get involved. It's not going to be handed to you on a plate. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW - EVE FICTION <<<
SonOfAGhost Minmatar Munitions and Tactical Assets Repository Zzz	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:20:00 - [66] Whoever the RPing GM is paying wardec fees for his buddies is no different from T20 giving out T2 BPOs, both should be fired outright. Given the uproar caused previous fiasco (that is still continuing in the South at this moment) CCP should know better than to engage in this sort of clearly unethical behaviour. Originally by: CCP Explorer This is intended, to not clutter the overview with information that new players don't need in their first few hours. (on stargates not being on overview)
Verone Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:23:00 - [67] Originally by: SonOfAGhost Whoever the RPing GM is paying wardec fees for his buddies is no different from T20 giving out T2 BPOs, both should be fired outright. Given the uproar caused previous fiasco (that is still continuing in the South at this moment) CCP should know better than to engage in this sort of clearly unethical behaviour. It's a completely different kettle of fish than someone spawning BPO's... please get a clue regarding what you're talking about before shouting your mouth off. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW - EVE FICTION <<<
Elisa Day Koshaku Brutally Clever Empire	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:37:00 - [68] Why is it, when something happens that is perfectly explainable with in-game reasoning (amarr navy paying people to defend them) you immediately come crying with out-of-game complaints (OMG GM h4x!!!1)? Keep the two worlds separate, please.
Haverloth Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.02.03 14:46:00 - [69] The pilot in question was aware they were entering a 7th Fleet Automated Defence Unit. There was a warning given by the beacon prior to his entering the ADU. Our pilots gave their own warnings with clear indications of the consequences of his actions, which the aggressing pilot chose to ignore. To cry about your pilot's foolish actions on the boards is just idiocy. Get your pilot in line. As to being reimbursed for the war cost - The Imperial Navy has asked us to defend the ADUs. Part of that defence involves wardecs against aggressor parties. The Imperial Navy then reimburses us for those wardecs. There is clear accountability in all of this, the Imperial Navy does not just give us a bunch of ISK. Your pilot engaged Imperial Naval assets, as I told you. We are defending those assets, as directed by the Imperial Navy. If you don't want to get "involved" with RP, then do not engage in these activities - or better yet, keep a tighter reign on your pilots. ____________________
Hannobaal Gallente Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.02.03 15:16:00 - [70] Edited by: Hannobaal on 03/02/2008 15:16:31 I can't believe people are complaining about this.
Verone Veto. Veto Corp	Posted - 2008.02.03 15:26:00 - [71] Originally by: Hannobaal Edited by: Hannobaal on 03/02/2008 15:16:31 I can't believe people are complaining about this. Exactly of the same opinion mate. It really does go to show how pathetic some corners of the community are becoming. Fair enough, complain when there are grounds to do so but this is a joke tbh. It seems like everyone wants to jump on the bandwagon and have something to whinge about. >>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW - EVE FICTION <<<
LaVista Vista Conservative Shenanigans Party	Posted - 2008.02.03 15:56:00 - [72] I should start offering free wardecs for corporations. So lets say i pay for the wardecs instead of a GM. How is it ever gonna make a difference in your little world? It isn't.
JADE DRAG0NESS Dark Scorpions Fate Weavers	Posted - 2008.02.03 19:23:00 - [73] Originally by: LaVista Vista I should start offering free wardecs for corporations. So lets say i pay for the wardecs instead of a GM. How is it ever gonna make a difference in your little world? It isn't. That wasn't his point Numb-nuts! He said he didn't mind the war itself, he just didnt like how the Gm was paying for it. "Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Jean Rostand
LaVista Vista Conservative Shenanigans Party	Posted - 2008.02.03 19:47:00 - [74] Originally by: JADE DRAG0NESS Originally by: LaVista Vista I should start offering free wardecs for corporations. So lets say i pay for the wardecs instead of a GM. How is it ever gonna make a difference in your little world? It isn't. That wasn't his point Numb-nuts! He said he didn't mind the war itself, he just didnt like how the Gm was paying for it. You missed my point. I made the point: For you, it doesnt matter if I or the GM funded the war. If the GM has a valid reason to pay for the war, sure, why not? If you think its wrong for a GM to pay for a wardec, i wouldnt mind pay for the wardec, as its a RP event or something from what i understand.
Riho Mercenary Forces Exquisite Malevolence	Posted - 2008.02.03 19:58:00 - [75] Edited by: Riho on 03/02/2008 19:59:18 some ppl in this thread are way clueless. i dont get why ppl are complaining. the GM paying wardec fees is like a "reward" for the corp/alliance taking part of the event. now some may think that they just dec random ppl and CCP pays for the decs... no... the ppl who are part of the deccing party must first prove that they are deccing them for the right reasons (in this case.. they guy ran the plex... loyalists decced the alliance for it). if they cant prove the reason... then CCP will not refund. its simple. some people just need a brain check like this guy Originally by: SonOfAGhost Whoever the RPing GM is paying wardec fees for his buddies is no different from T20 giving out T2 BPOs, both should be fired outright. Given the uproar caused previous fiasco (that is still continuing in the South at this moment) CCP should know better than to engage in this sort of clearly unethical behaviour. you are an idiot... never post again plz ---------------------------------- This is Me
Galen Darksmith Caldari Independent Navy Reserve The Fourth District	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:01:00 - [76] This isn't a case of some rogue GM responding to a petition and handing out money for wardecs. This is a case of CCP saying "HEY GUYS! IF YOU WANT TO HELP US KEEP THESE COMPLEXES SAFE, WE'LL PAY FOR YOUR WARDEC FEES!" Essentially, CCP recognizes that the wardec system isn't up to snuff, so they made a public announcement that they would try to minimize the inconvenience by paying for the wardecs. This is not a GM exploit. This is not "h4X." This is the EVE universe coming to life around you. And it's not a nice universe.
Cassius Longinus Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:07:00 - [77] I think this is a great idea. The OP's alliance got dragged into an RP event by a member... seems to me that a little diplomacy (plus a warning to the member) would straighten everything out, assuming the alliance is not interested in participating. Or alternatively, they can make their 70 jumps and engage in some PVP on a GM's dime, which sounds like pure win to me. Either way, no harm is involved.
Bacchanalian Stimulus	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:12:00 - [78] Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri I expect that this is a beta for faction warfare. Just as a friendly OOC Public Service Announcement: If you shoot a 7th fleet complex and we catch you doing it, Amarrian groups will declare war on you. If you don't want this, make it utterly clear to anyone who might run plex's in the Bleak Lands that 7th fleet complexes are off limits. Is that a promise? ____________________ GM Sunshine > oops Neurotica > Hate to see a GM in your gang say 'oops'
Le Skunk Low Sec Liberators	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:18:00 - [79] what is this... role player, and where can i purchase one SKUNK
Grr Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:18:00 - [80] A great idea about diplomacy but has been tried. They contacted us as soon as we decced and went on to say amongst other things that RPers are "*******s" We are tempted to pay the war dec bill ourselves and make that 70 jump trip after all ;) Epitoth Fleetyards is Recruiting
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:23:00 - [81] Originally by: Riho Originally by: Tnilf Originally by: Karlemgne Lastly, if the OP is correct, and a GM allows people to war dec other corps for free, because the aggressor is "role playing" I've got a problem with that. If you want to role play a war because some noob ran a complex, fine. You should have to pay for that war like everyone else. This was my point. your alliance member involved in a ROLEPLAY event... that means your ALLIANCE involved in the roleplay event.... you where roleplaying and they got orders from the navy to defend. it doesnt matter if you roleplay or not... it matters that one of your members did and now everyone will be involved. your member represented your allinace in the event. thats the point. and i dont get why ppl allways belittle Roleplayers... thats just funny and shows theyr own stupidity. PS. im not a roleplayer and never have been, but if events get better in the future.. i might start aswell :) I'm not belittling anyone. I roleplay all the time usually WoD stuff. And sure, fine. As I said, your corp or alliance can dec whoever they want for whatever reason they want! I've got no problem with that at all. I've got a problem when CCP is handing out 50 million a week war dec's for free, because you're "roleplaying." You should have to pay like everyone else. -Karlemgne
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:27:00 - [82] Edited by: Karlemgne on 03/02/2008 20:29:41 Edited by: Karlemgne on 03/02/2008 20:28:43 Edited by: Karlemgne on 03/02/2008 20:28:09 Originally by: Tamia Clant Originally by: Karlemgne Number one, when I read the EULA I don't see anywhere where it says I'm required to role play. Hmm, who would have thought you'd have to role-play in a massively multiplayer online *role-playing* game?! If you don't RP, then that's your choice, to be honest, but as soon as someone gets involved (such as going to that 7th fleet complex) he should expect the consequences whether he cares about RP or not. Look, I work in the MMO industry. I can tell you now that there is an assumption that at least 90% of your playing population will not engage in ANY roleplaying. Usually, as a result a server (whose population is always light) dedicated specifically to roleplaying is set-up to cater to the roleplaying crowd. This is a single shard game, so the roleplayers have to deal with the general population and vise versa. So if you want to war dec me or my corp for a RP reason, please feel free. Don't, however, expect me to participate in the actual RPing. And I still fail to see how roleplaying entitles you to free war decs. -Karlemgne
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:35:00 - [83] Originally by: Grr A great idea about diplomacy but has been tried. They contacted us as soon as we decced and went on to say amongst other things that RPers are "*******s" We are tempted to pay the war dec bill ourselves and make that 70 jump trip after all ;) See I approve of this. You want to wtfpown them for roleplaying reasons, or just because they insulted you? Great! Now declare war like everyone else and pay the fees yourself. -Karlemgne
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:42:00 - [84] Originally by: Verone Simple Fact : It's an RP Event. Known and vocal enemies of the Amarr Empire have attacked one of it's installations. The Amarr Navy has asked a loyalist corporation to defend it's installations from future attacks. The Amarr Navy has given the loyalist corporation the means to do so. Veto Corp have been contacted and hired as mercenaries for an RP event before, to take down a Federation Navy Convoy. We were paid for it as mercenaries would and should be. I see no issue with any of this, it's a perfectly valid RP event. If you want to be part of stuff like this and reap the rewards then you need to make a proactive effort to get involved. It's not going to be handed to you on a plate. The great Verone has spoken, I suppose the argument should be over. Having said that, let me key in on some points you made here. VETO, which in my experience is a more smack talking than roleplaying corp (good pilots though) was given a contract to participate in a RP event. I am assuming you were contacted by a player corp to arrange a contract, and I'm assuming that you were paid by said corp. CCP didn't just hand you guys a billion isk to participate in the event. If they did, then there is something seriously wrong with the way RPing is done on this server tbfh. Similarly, people should not get free war decs--for any reason. If I had a corp and wanted to war dec an anti-pirate alliance as a method of roleplaying, I'd have to PAY for the war dec. CCP should not be giving people passes on the basic isk sinks that apply to everyone in game. Period. -Karlemgne
Kai Zion Amarr The Zion Accounts	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:45:00 - [85] Quote: Look, I work in the MMO industry. I can tell you now that there is an assumption that at least 90% of your playing population will not engage in ANY roleplaying. Usually, as a result a server (whose population is always light) dedicated specifically to roleplaying is set-up to cater to the roleplaying crowd. You're playing a game that is unlike any other in the MMO industry, so don't waste time telling how it works elsewhere. The official line at CCP is "everyone is a roleplayer". Regardless of what you say, this is what they believe, this is what a large majority of roleplayers believe, and a substantial amount of the playerbase is learning to accept, usually at the end of a 1400mm Artillery. A pirate griefing you is playing the role of a pirate. He is acting just as a real pirate would. He doesn't need to have a robe and wizard had, replete with shakespearean dialogue to be a roleplayer, he just needs to act in a believably piratical way. This makes you, Karlemagne, a roleplayer in Eve, according to many "RPers" definition, according to my definition, according to many players definition, and according to CCP's definition. Resist it all you like, but this is how Eve works. In a single-shard game like this, roleplay is unlike it is in any other game.
Kai Zion Amarr The Zion Accounts	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:47:00 - [86] Also, you keep harping on about "free" wardecs. They're not free. People had to earn them. In the future, when Factional Warfare hits, they will likely also have to pay a price for aligning with certain factions. How about you just calm down, you seem awfully riled up.
Drykor Minmatar Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:53:00 - [87] Does this mean faction warfare is coming closer? Nice!
Karra Dresden	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:54:00 - [88] Edited by: Karra Dresden on 03/02/2008 20:54:30 Originally by: Riho Originally by: Tnilf Originally by: Karlemgne Lastly, if the OP is correct, and a GM allows people to war dec other corps for free, because the aggressor is "role playing" I've got a problem with that. If you want to role play a war because some noob ran a complex, fine. You should have to pay for that war like everyone else. This was my point. your alliance member involved in a ROLEPLAY event... that means your ALLIANCE involved in the roleplay event.... you where roleplaying and they got orders from the navy to defend. it doesnt matter if you roleplay or not... it matters that one of your members did and now everyone will be involved. your member represented your allinace in the event. thats the point. and i dont get why ppl allways belittle Roleplayers... thats just funny and shows theyr own stupidity. PS. im not a roleplayer and never have been, but if events get better in the future.. i might start aswell :) This. Right, sure. It makes absolute sense that if ONE member of an alliance shows up some 70 jumps from where said alliance lives and runs a 1/10 complex that the whole alliance is signaling its willingness to participate in a roleplaying event. MAYBE if a whole corp showed up to run that complex, MAYBE. It seems perfectly obvious to me that a single guy, with no friends, running a single complex is either 1. a noob or 2. a single rouge pilot. Let me give you an analogy. A single member of the San Diego police department shows up to a party in the university area. At this party he tells everyone he's a cop, but does a bunch of drugs and asks where he can buy some more. Would you say that this signals the willingness of the entire SD police department to engage in recreational drug use? No. Don't use fuzzy logic. Its bad for you.
Spoon Thumb Caldari Paladin Imperium Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:55:00 - [89] My corp signed up to be in the 7th fleet auxiliary, and were it not for various factors, we probably would have taken up the offer, since we are a small corp often struggling for funds to replace ships etc and certainly not able to afford 50mil(?) or whatever to war dec a terrorist alliance. As it traspired, I don't think the beacons idea is great and as I've already commented in the game development forum shouldn't be the sole basis for factional warfare. The other thing is CVA already get to war-dec these things and we can't war dec just as a corp, but have to with the whole alliance. I think maybe the rules are more for small, indie RP corps rather than the usual suspects like CVA, PIE, U'K etc Khaldari khanidpublic: RP channel for Kingdom loyalists Recruiting
Grr Amarr 1st Praetorian Guard Vigilia Valeria	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:57:00 - [90] There has been no official word yet on if this is a test for faction warfare or not, just speculation. I would like to think its true tho :) Epitoth Fleetyards is Recruiting
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:58:00 - [91] Originally by: Kai Zion Also, you keep harping on about "free" wardecs. They're not free. People had to earn them. In the future, when Factional Warfare hits, they will likely also have to pay a price for aligning with certain factions. How about you just calm down, you seem awfully riled up. How does one go about "earning" a free war dec? Participating in CCP sanctioned roleplaying? That sounds an awful lot like favoritism to me. There are plenty of people who roleplay in eve and don't get jack sh, tbfh. And yeah, I'm *ed. I don't see GMs breaking game mechanics to award me for my* play style. -Karlemgne

CCP Wrangler	Posted - 2008.02.03 20:59:00 - [92] I'm sure we're not sponsoring any wars with ISK, it looks like they're just role-players. If you believe something is wrong please contact Internal Affairs to report it and they'll investigate this. Wrangler Community Manager CCP Games, EVE Online Email / Netfang "The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it."


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