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BoboTheClown	Posted - 2008.02.04 21:54:00 - [1] is no one buying gtc's anymore ive been tying to offload like 30 all day
syphurous Gallente Center for Advanced Studies	Posted - 2008.02.04 21:56:00 - [2] 30 ? My god, couldn't you spend that sort've money on something with a bit more substance than an MMO ? A Ferrari perhaps ? ___ All Ur Salvage R Belong 2 Me !
Ephemeron Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.04 21:56:00 - [3] It's cause too many people decided that GTCs are just a CCP approved way of buying ISK with real money. Demand is limited, you can't simply buy 30 GTCs and expect to convert it all to isk.
Ursula LeGuinn Versus Gloria Omnis	Posted - 2008.02.04 21:58:00 - [4] Uh.... Well, sometimes the market dries up. Too many sellers, and all the buyers are paid up as far as they want to be. Eventually you'll be getting less and less ISK for them, too. I'd love to ask you what you're doing with 30 GTCs, but I guess that's obvious. ________________
Andrest Disch Amarr	Posted - 2008.02.04 21:59:00 - [5] Edited by: Andrest Disch on 04/02/2008 22:01:25 You could probably pay several people to play the game for you with the money you spent on 30 GTCs. o.O
Stakhanov Metafarmers	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:01:00 - [6] No GTCNR for you ! Originally by: ivan draco we didnt want your post anyway
ghost st	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:06:00 - [7] Originally by: BoboTheClown is no one buying gtc's anymore ive been tying to offload like 30 all day You must be the SOB who bought all the gtcs battleclinic, my alt runs out tomorrow, and i hope they get some in
BoboTheClown	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:16:00 - [8] Oh wyren baby
Ephemeron Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:18:00 - [9] For the record, I want people to realize that GTCs help isk farmers, the people who sell isk for real money. They farm isk, they buy GTC with isk, and use those characters to train skills, buy Ravens, farm much more isk with Ravens. All this without spending any real money. Only converting play time into real money. If they had to pay for their Raven character's time with real money, farmers would be a lot more reluctant to use them.
Lisa Seraph	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:25:00 - [10] As a broke college kid who would rather play a game than get a real job.... I love it!
Gort Storm Guard Elite	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:30:00 - [11] Edited by: Gort on 04/02/2008 22:32:34 Edited by: Gort on 04/02/2008 22:31:44 Everyone in the game farms isk to some degree or another. I do it to support my PvP habit. The technique I use is to go to belts and kill rats for the bounty. The question is not whether someone farms isk. The question is whether they sell it for RL money. GTCs are, IMO, a reasonable tool (edit: see Lisa's post above). Others, of course, don't agree. G -- When in doubt, empty the magazine.
Gort Storm Guard Elite	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:31:00 - [12] Edited by: Gort on 04/02/2008 22:34:11 Edited by: Gort on 04/02/2008 22:31:21 30? Time for a break, mate. -- When in doubt, empty the magazine.
Louis DelaBlanche Cosmic Odyssey YouWhat	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:33:00 - [13] 30 GTC? Dont think I have that much to spend in general let alone for converting into isk. I assume u got 30day ones. 30x90day GTC would just make me wanna see u sell none of them all the more
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:34:00 - [14] If the farmers would be (percentually) the main source of GTC purchases with ISK, you'd see GTC prices soaring upwards. Instead, the fact that GTC prices are starting to drop down again means much more "regular" people (again, percentually speaking) take advantage of the ISK-to-GTC method of account payment. Would the farmers quit if they had to use real-world money to pay for subscriptions ? You can bet your ass not many of them would quit... just jack up prices instead to compensate. How big is the "farming community" anyway ? Gross guesstimates puts them anywhere up to 5% of the total EVE population, give or take. However, how many LEGITIMATE players would quit ? I have no idea of the actual numbers, but by looking at the numbers of GTCs offered for sale lately, I'd have to wager an ever increasing number of people have "converted" to this method of payment, and I wouldn't be totally surprised if maybe even 20% of the subscriptions of legitimate players are being paid for with ISK rather than cash. Now, I have no idea what you hope to acheive, but I'd rather keep more normal people playing, and more GTCs sold for ISK, than have a bunch of farmers sell ISK for cash directly and GTC-for-ISK being forbidden. 1\|2\|3\|4\|5.
Ursula LeGuinn Versus Gloria Omnis	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:41:00 - [15] I sense a GTChimera in BoboTheClown's future. ________________
Adonis 4174	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:43:00 - [16] Originally by: Ephemeron For the record, I want people to realize that GTCs help isk farmers, the people who sell isk for real money. They farm isk, they buy GTC with isk, and use those characters to train skills, buy Ravens, farm much more isk with Ravens. All this without spending any real money. Only converting play time into real money. If they had to pay for their Raven character's time with real money, farmers would be a lot more reluctant to use them. Unlike the WoW goldfarmers who mostly use stolen creditcards you mean? ---- Anything less is wasted effort
Tamia Clant New Dawn Corp New Eden Research	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:52:00 - [17] Originally by: BoboTheClown is no one buying gtc's anymore ive been tying to offload like 30 all day I assume that's 30-day cards. Most people tend to go for 90-day GTCs as their price is cheaper per month. Looking for queue-free research slots? Click here!
Lisa Seraph	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:57:00 - [18] Wait a minute, 30 gtc's.... Thats like $450, ú226.7, Ç302.8, etc....
McAltyalty	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:58:00 - [19] Edited by: McAltyalty on 04/02/2008 22:58:27 Originally by: Tamia Clant Originally by: BoboTheClown is no one buying gtc's anymore ive been tying to offload like 30 all day I assume that's 30-day cards. Most people tend to go for 90-day GTCs as their price is cheaper per month. Thats true, but sellers prefer to sell 30day gtc's because they yeild a higher isk:cash ration.
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2008.02.04 22:59:00 - [20] Edited by: Akita T on 04/02/2008 23:03:22 Originally by: Ursula LeGuinn I sense a GTChimera in BoboTheClown's future. More like, past. At least his post history claims he used to fly one. But future too, probably... in case he just lost it recently. Originally by: McAltyalty Thats true, but sellers prefer to sell 30day gtc's because they yeild a higher isk:cash ration. Well, if they can't sell'em, they won't P.S. Here, O.P., what the heck. I'll buy a 30-day one for 120 mil. That's how much they used to cost a year and a half ago, before prices rose to a ridiculous high of 220 mil or around that. You know, for my alt that's in stasis right now traning a long skill, and din't plan activating it until much later. Not really want to, but if you can't seem to be able to get rid of'em, I'll cave and "just do it", do you a favour. What do you say ? 1\|2\|3\|4\|5.
BoboTheClown	Posted - 2008.02.04 23:37:00 - [21] Oh i own my own business so i make quite alot of úúú per year so every month i trade GTC's through one of my 4 alts, but i did lose a chimera last month sadly it was nasty. But ill keep in mind about the 90day gtc's in future, but right now i trade with this alt to avoid too much attention from my high profile main.
Ephemeron Cutting Edge Incorporated RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.04 23:43:00 - [22] Do you at least have the common sense to realize why it is considered dishonorable to buy massive amounts of isk with lots of GTCs? This game is setup so people have to work hard to get big reward, and when somebody works hard to get their carrier, they tend to value it a lot more. It goes against the spirit of the game to fund yourself with GTCs
Sicil Fioet Minmatar	Posted - 2008.02.04 23:48:00 - [23] Originally by: BoboTheClown is no one buying gtc's anymore ive been tying to offload like 30 all day Average price for game time codes at the beginning of last year was like 150 mil ISK for 30s and 350m ISK for 90s, and you could get them much cheaper if you knew where to look. The solution to offloading your codes quickly would be to drop price below everyone else selling. Players are buying GTCs every day, just not from you if your price isn't competitive.
BoboTheClown	Posted - 2008.02.04 23:50:00 - [24] I understand fully and i often pop macro miners and try and shop in to ccp isk buyers, but this is sanctioned by CCP and under EULA, besides im wise enough to ignore the double requests from chacters or odd stranged name chacters and after being here since 2003 i think i might just know how this game works seeing as im an industrial orientated person.
Tamia Clant New Dawn Corp New Eden Research	Posted - 2008.02.04 23:50:00 - [25] Originally by: Ephemeron Do you at least have the common sense to realize why it is considered dishonorable to buy massive amounts of isk with lots of GTCs? This game is setup so people have to work hard to get big reward, and when somebody works hard to get their carrier, they tend to value it a lot more. It goes against the spirit of the game to fund yourself with GTCs I don't know why this upsets people. If they have to invest RL money to make in-game purchases, then they are already failing at the game quite badly, aren't they? So yeah, they can buy stuff easier than you do, but each time you destroy their virtual ships, you're screwing with their RL wallet. For all you "griefers" out there that should be as satisfactory as it gets. Looking for queue-free research slots? Click here!
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2008.02.04 23:55:00 - [26] I have no problem with ISK buyers as long as it's via GTCs... the more, the merrier ! 1\|2\|3\|4\|5.
BoboTheClown	Posted - 2008.02.04 23:57:00 - [27] Aww my wallet doesn't hurt much and i consider winning or losing fun, but im into purchasing of BPO's mostly for production. I lost the carrier sadly due to a well placed camp when i was transporting items. But ive seen alot of people selling them and those are your opinions and i respect them but wouldn't force my own upon another person.
MysticNZ Solstice Systems Development Concourse The Reckoning.	Posted - 2008.02.05 00:05:00 - [28] I bought 2x90's for me and my alt, so I'm all good. I really love how I can pay for this game with isk as my alt is a trader. Otherwise I wouldn't be able to play. Thanks CPP :)
BoboTheClown	Posted - 2008.02.05 00:12:00 - [29] Yup alot of players cant afford to play so it gives them the ability to. We are just paying for others to play in exchange for their time earned isk which we use to fund large ventures, alot of alliances and corps do it.
Tressin Khiyne Minmatar Interstellar Vacation Center	Posted - 2008.02.05 00:42:00 - [30] Originally by: Ephemeron This game is setup so people have to work hard to get big reward, and when somebody works hard to get their carrier, they tend to value it a lot more. It goes against the spirit of the game to fund yourself with GTCs Not that I totally disagree with you, but isn't it a bit obtuse to assume that spending $450 of REAL MONEY on a carrier still working hard? I mean, he REALLY had to WORK for that money. Granted, he's probably begging mom for the credit card, and he'll immediately go honor tanking his new Mothership, but I think he's earned the right to suck. -- There are 10 kinds of people in this world; Those who understand binary, and those who don't.
Jas Dor Minmatar	Posted - 2008.02.05 01:10:00 - [31] Originally by: Tressin Khiyne Originally by: Ephemeron This game is setup so people have to work hard to get big reward, and when somebody works hard to get their carrier, they tend to value it a lot more. It goes against the spirit of the game to fund yourself with GTCs Not that I totally disagree with you, but isn't it a bit obtuse to assume that spending $450 of REAL MONEY on a carrier still working hard? I mean, he REALLY had to WORK for that money. Granted, he's probably begging mom for the credit card, and he'll immediately go honor tanking his new Mothership, but I think he's earned the right to suck. Well thing is the OP stated he was being paid pounds sterling, which have a favorable exchange rate to just about everything right now. If he's buying GTCs in dollars he may have a bit of a point. If you could get GTCs for around $5 USD you might be tempted to sell some to. Names, Dates, Times, Engagements, Losses, Op-Tempo or STFU!
BoboTheClown	Posted - 2008.02.05 01:13:00 - [32] begging mummy LOL I'm 42 my mother died 11 years ago. but I work hard just like anyone else I'm here to have fun and I don't have the time like all you kids do to spend ratting or mission running.
Audri Fisher Caldari VentureCorp Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2008.02.05 01:18:00 - [33] wow
Arc Anna Caldari Pacific Starfleet Command	Posted - 2008.02.05 01:25:00 - [34] Time is money and vice versa. Weighing spending real time farming ISK and paying RL money to buy gametime, the result varies per individual. For kids depending on mommy and students strapped for cash, farming ISK makes sense. For adults earning real money with little time left, sitting on the PC grinding missions all night is impossible and is just more work after a hard day's grind. I personally have ISK to buy GTCs but I choose to pay the tri-monthly fee, go figure. FYI in the MD forum, an IPO company sold 30 GTCs to recoup a loss. As a measure of faith to its investors the CEO bought and sold 30 GTCs to get back the ISK invested.
BoboTheClown	Posted - 2008.02.05 01:26:00 - [35] for those of you who whine; I'd like to see you do a hard days work once in a while and earn overú180k per year, besides most ISK is donated to players to keep them in ships I'm very generous to my alliance and alot of you would not have your t2 items if it wasn't for my úúú buying production items and producing your shinny ships
Letouk Mernel	Posted - 2008.02.05 01:34:00 - [36] Why are you answering this flame war? You have 30, that'll take a while to sell, as you're selling to players not some NPC. Either drop the place so they go faster, or wait.
ShardowRhino Caldari The Older Gamers R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.02.05 01:46:00 - [37] Originally by: Tamia Clant Originally by: Ephemeron Do you at least have the common sense to realize why it is considered dishonorable to buy massive amounts of isk with lots of GTCs? This game is setup so people have to work hard to get big reward, and when somebody works hard to get their carrier, they tend to value it a lot more. It goes against the spirit of the game to fund yourself with GTCs I don't know why this upsets people. If they have to invest RL money to make in-game purchases, then they are already failing at the game quite badly, aren't they? So yeah, they can buy stuff easier than you do, but each time you destroy their virtual ships, you're screwing with their RL wallet. For all you "griefers" out there that should be as satisfactory as it gets. ahah, Thats exactly how I see it. I used to be about ****ing people off in another MMO but knowing theres a chance I could have a stab at someone's RL wallet and in game wallet is a true high I just need to make me some more isk so i can buy ships to stay in as much pvp as possible. Its as close as you can get to punching the other guy in the face and stealing his wallet GrandTheftAuto style. Also I would have quit eve 3months ago if it wasnt for GTCs. The more SP I get the easier isk is to come by so 400mil every 3months isn't looking so bad. However I still hope prices drop. 30day gtcs need to drop in price,isk wise.90 day gtcs= 133mil a month but if you used 30day gtcs that would be 600+mil for 3 months. 50% markup is absurd and its no wonder they don't sell as fast. Set them up around 150-160 range and they would fly off the shelfs. The current markup forces a lot of impulsive buyers to look long term and forgo the 30gtcs. The question is do you want the isk NOW or are you just trying to get as much as you can? Then again if your a business man you should have thought of that on your own.
Guillame Herschel Gallente Cheers Restaurant and Bar Coalition Of Empires	Posted - 2008.02.05 01:46:00 - [38] Originally by: Ephemeron Do you at least have the common sense to realize why it is considered dishonorable to buy massive amounts of isk with lots of GTCs? In the end, this line of reasoning amounts to "It's dishonorable to use RL money to pay for other players' accounts that they use to farm datacores for you, but not dishonorable to pay RL money for your own accounts to farm your own datacores." Ya know, I just don't see the difference, except to the guy who needs datacores and hates to farm, and the guy who loves to farm and can't afford enough accounts to do it. -- Guile can always trump hardware --
Xeroxian	Posted - 2008.02.05 01:53:00 - [39] Originally by: BoboTheClown for those of you who whine; I'd like to see you do a hard days work once in a while and earn overú180k per year, besides most ISK is donated to players to keep them in ships I'm very generous to my alliance and alot of you would not have your t2 items if it wasn't for my úúú buying production items and producing your shinny ships crap like the quoted post makes me want to set up a gtc sale only to someone I know to avoid helping this guy out. I know I haven't gotten anything close to a t2 ship from my alliance nor would I accept it. So I know hes not in my alliance:) As a business man he seems to fail at attracting customers. To further add to lackluster sale of his gtcs he insults the possible customers. GG
Troye Gallente Strix Armaments and Defence	Posted - 2008.02.05 02:08:00 - [40] If your a millionaire then fair enough, if your not then go get a reality check. A game is not worth that much realife cash _______________________________________ "Arguing on the internet is like running in the Special Olympics...Even if you win, you're still ******. "
Ying PingPong	Posted - 2008.02.05 02:19:00 - [41] This thread is teh funneh. If you think the $1000 is soooo much money I think it's you who needs to stop playing games and get a real job...
Nadarius Chrome Celestial Horizon Corp.	Posted - 2008.02.05 02:31:00 - [42] Originally by: Ephemeron Do you at least have the common sense to realize why it is considered dishonorable to buy massive amounts of isk with lots of GTCs? This game is setup so people have to work hard to get big reward, and when somebody works hard to get their carrier, they tend to value it a lot more. It goes against the spirit of the game to fund yourself with GTCs Buying ISK via GTCs doesn't make them a better player, nor does it allow them any advantage you can't overcome by bringing a friend or two. Pop their faction-fitted masterpiece, take the loot for yourself, and chill. In general: Let's not let this descend into a personal flame war. This issue comes up regularly. Use your energy to submit a reasoned proposal to CCP (for or against). On another note: My wife and I just had our first child, and I'd have difficulty justifying spending money on an MMO, especially with my reduced play time. Buying GTCs for ISK lets me continue playing with a clear conscience. I do know that 90-day GTCs have gone from a little over 300m to over 400m in the last year or two, so a settling of the price is not exactly unreasonable.
C'thor Silvershadow	Posted - 2008.02.05 02:38:00 - [43] Originally by: BoboTheClown is no one buying gtc's anymore ive been tying to offload like 30 all day I'll give you 1 million isk for a 30 day one. how's that sound?
Engineer Butters	Posted - 2008.02.05 02:40:00 - [44] Everybody spends their money differently. What you think is foolish or unwise can be someone else's hobby, interest, etc. Play the game the way you want and do not worry how others play. Every one is entitled to their opinions. A question was asked and a few people gave their opinions on what they perceive to be the answer to that question. I myself, have noticed that 90 day GTCs seem to sell out faster like others have posted because of the lower cost per month amount. I use to choose the 30 day but moved to the 90 day as I can now afford to part with that much isk every 3 months.
Lindsay Fox	Posted - 2008.02.05 02:46:00 - [45] I just find all this anti-gtc stuff really weird. - There are a ton of people who have plenty of RL cash but very little time to devote to Eve. Without GTC they would not be playing for long, as they could not be bothered taking two weeks of occasional play to replace a battle ship, or six months to replace a carrier, or whatever. If they couldn't use RL cash to fund the game they would quit. - There are a ton of people who have plenty of time but not much RL cash. Without GTC they would not be playing at all. These two groups of people are pretty much excluded from other MMO's, except for the use of ebay. The fact that CCP has found a scheme that enables these people to still play while ensuring that CCP gets all the real money is, in my mind, just about the most brilliant idea CCP has ever had. I thank them for it. I think all they need to do now is halve the price of GTCs and the ISK sellers would have to go elsewhere, it would no longer be worth it. This may cause the economy to freak out for a while, but it would settle down and be a better game eventually. I am lucky, I have worked hard for the last 20 years, I am self-employed now and have plenty of spare time, so I can afford the time to build up my eve wealth in-game. I know that one hour of RL work for me would buy me a couple of billion ISK, but that would pretty much ruin my enjoyment of the game. But for others it is the only way that they can enjoy them game, so more power to them. Anyway, spending $500 of real money on a hobby that occupies so much of my time would be nothing. I used to race remote-control cars competitively and that cost me around $1000 per month, including hotels and crap. Eve is practically free in comparison. I just can't believe how so many people think their view of the value of money and the value of time, can be the only valid one. And finally, if CCP wasn't selling GTCs then the ebay market would be much worse anyway, it's not like it would stop. /rant
C'thor Silvershadow	Posted - 2008.02.05 02:51:00 - [46] Originally by: C'thor Silvershadow Originally by: BoboTheClown is no one buying gtc's anymore ive been tying to offload like 30 all day I'll give you 1 million isk for a 30 day one. how's that sound?
Ursula LeGuinn Versus Gloria Omnis	Posted - 2008.02.05 03:04:00 - [47] Originally by: C'thor Silvershadow I'll give you 1 million isk for a 30 day one. how's that sound? It sounds like you're a surly, childish troll. ________________
Gamer4liff Caldari Metalworks THE INTERSTELLAR FOUNDRY	Posted - 2008.02.05 03:11:00 - [48] As a real life Starving Student but a wealthy T2 BPO manufacturer in game I think the system works fine.
aQurio Infamous Technologies	Posted - 2008.02.05 03:12:00 - [49] Edited by: aQurio on 05/02/2008 03:13:01 This post is spot on Originally by: Lindsay Fox I just find all this anti-gtc stuff really weird. - There are a ton of people who have plenty of RL cash but very little time to devote to Eve. Without GTC they would not be playing for long, as they could not be bothered taking two weeks of occasional play to replace a battle ship, or six months to replace a carrier, or whatever. If they couldn't use RL cash to fund the game they would quit. - There are a ton of people who have plenty of time but not much RL cash. Without GTC they would not be playing at all. These two groups of people are pretty much excluded from other MMO's, except for the use of ebay. The fact that CCP has found a scheme that enables these people to still play while ensuring that CCP gets all the real money is, in my mind, just about the most brilliant idea CCP has ever had. I thank them for it. I think all they need to do now is halve the price of GTCs and the ISK sellers would have to go elsewhere, it would no longer be worth it. This may cause the economy to freak out for a while, but it would settle down and be a better game eventually. I am lucky, I have worked hard for the last 20 years, I am self-employed now and have plenty of spare time, so I can afford the time to build up my eve wealth in-game. I know that one hour of RL work for me would buy me a couple of billion ISK, but that would pretty much ruin my enjoyment of the game. But for others it is the only way that they can enjoy them game, so more power to them. Anyway, spending $500 of real money on a hobby that occupies so much of my time would be nothing. I used to race remote-control cars competitively and that cost me around $1000 per month, including hotels and crap. Eve is practically free in comparison. I just can't believe how so many people think their view of the value of money and the value of time, can be the only valid one. And finally, if CCP wasn't selling GTCs then the ebay market would be much worse anyway, it's not like it would stop. /rant Signed
aQurio Infamous Technologies	Posted - 2008.02.05 03:15:00 - [50] Time is money and some people have more money then time.
Lebowske Nosferatu Security Foundation	Posted - 2008.02.05 03:21:00 - [51] Originally by: Lindsay Fox I just find all this anti-gtc stuff really weird. - There are a ton of people who have plenty of RL cash but very little time to devote to Eve. Without GTC they would not be playing for long, as they could not be bothered taking two weeks of occasional play to replace a battle ship, or six months to replace a carrier, or whatever. If they couldn't use RL cash to fund the game they would quit. - There are a ton of people who have plenty of time but not much RL cash. Without GTC they would not be playing at all. These two groups of people are pretty much excluded from other MMO's, except for the use of ebay. The fact that CCP has found a scheme that enables these people to still play while ensuring that CCP gets all the real money is, in my mind, just about the most brilliant idea CCP has ever had. I thank them for it. I think all they need to do now is halve the price of GTCs and the ISK sellers would have to go elsewhere, it would no longer be worth it. This may cause the economy to freak out for a while, but it would settle down and be a better game eventually. I am lucky, I have worked hard for the last 20 years, I am self-employed now and have plenty of spare time, so I can afford the time to build up my eve wealth in-game. I know that one hour of RL work for me would buy me a couple of billion ISK, but that would pretty much ruin my enjoyment of the game. But for others it is the only way that they can enjoy them game, so more power to them. Anyway, spending $500 of real money on a hobby that occupies so much of my time would be nothing. I used to race remote-control cars competitively and that cost me around $1000 per month, including hotels and crap. Eve is practically free in comparison. I just can't believe how so many people think their view of the value of money and the value of time, can be the only valid one. And finally, if CCP wasn't selling GTCs then the ebay market would be much worse anyway, it's not like it would stop. /rant This one needs to be /signed CCP wouldnt have at least my characters in the database if I wasnt able to replace ingame resources by GTC because of my own casual gameplay. Eve is a "hobby" - it happens maybe twice per week down to maybe only once per month. -------------------- - It's better to keep your mouth shut and let people believe you're an idiot, rather than opening it and removing all doubt.
Fofalus III ELEMENTS	Posted - 2008.02.05 03:30:00 - [52] This kinda peeks my interest. I always figured if I won the lottery* I would do crazy things on eve. But that would take flooding the GTC market. I figure I could offload a few thousand 90days at 200mil and still make a hefty chunk of isk. *(Disclaimer I am thinking lottery as in 20+ million dollars after taxes)
Mur d'Erer	Posted - 2008.02.05 03:38:00 - [53] Got to my office at 08:45 this morning, was there all day, cept lunch and dinner, left at 22:07. Got 4 planes to deliver supplies, 19 hrs flight time each... talked to embassy personnel, rescue workers, doctors, freight managers, damn heathrow airport personnel, accountants, project managers and so on. Probably won't log on to EVE tonight. But if i did, do you really think i'd go missionrunning or beltratting?
Ursula LeGuinn Versus Gloria Omnis	Posted - 2008.02.05 03:40:00 - [54] Originally by: Mur d'Erer Got to my office at 08:45 this morning, was there all day, cept lunch and dinner, left at 22:07. Got 4 planes to deliver supplies, 19 hrs flight time each... talked to embassy personnel, rescue workers, doctors, freight managers, damn heathrow airport personnel, accountants, project managers and so on. Probably won't log on to EVE tonight. But if i did, do you really think i'd go missionrunning or beltratting? Yeah, yeah. Everyone who plays EVE and buys GTCs is a successful businessman or wealthy entrepreneur, without a doubt. ________________
Ricardo Phallus	Posted - 2008.02.05 03:42:00 - [55] Originally by: Fofalus This kinda peeks my interest. I always figured if I won the lottery* I would do crazy things on eve. But that would take flooding the GTC market. I figure I could offload a few thousand 90days at 200mil and still make a hefty chunk of isk. *(Disclaimer I am thinking lottery as in 20+ million dollars after taxes) Great idea, that would be worth it just for the whining it would generate.
Mur d'Erer	Posted - 2008.02.05 03:46:00 - [56] Edited by: Mur d''Erer on 05/02/2008 03:48:27 Originally by: Ursula LeGuinn Yeah, yeah. Everyone who plays EVE and buys GTCs is a successful businessman or wealthy entrepreneur, without a doubt. I'd say it's people who don't want to grind and have money to spend. Doesn't matter how you get your money. Edit: i know a neurosurgeon form the US who plays EVE. Alas, he likes ratting and still is in a noobcorp after almost 2 years of playing.
Fofalus III ELEMENTS	Posted - 2008.02.05 05:00:00 - [57] Originally by: Ricardo Phallus Originally by: Fofalus This kinda peeks my interest. I always figured if I won the lottery* I would do crazy things on eve. But that would take flooding the GTC market. I figure I could offload a few thousand 90days at 200mil and still make a hefty chunk of isk. (Disclaimer I am thinking lottery as in 20+ million dollars after taxes) Great idea, that would be worth it just for the whining it would generate. That was at least one reason I would do it. Just for all the QQers. The real beauty is the market would be so flooded that no one could sell them for any realistic money and CCP would either be ***ed of or well enough off to stop the whole GTC to ISK thing. One can dream right!
Rilwen	Posted - 2008.02.05 05:09:00 - [58] Originally by: Lindsay Fox lots of stuff Anyway, spending $500 of real money on a hobby that occupies so much of my time would be nothing. other stuff I agree with what you said Lindsay, but this sentance i agree with the most, $500 for a hobby is nothing i know people who play Warhammer minitures spend $1000 for an army and have 5 different armies, they also tend to pay to get them painted because they want a good paint job so that could be another $200 an army. So $6000 or so all up, and then in a couple of months time or what ever they move on and get a different army because they feel that they've gotten the hang of or mastered the ones they have. As for the whole GTC issue i actually like it, I've never bought one because getting that kinda money together is always a little tough, but i just changed jobs and getting less money means i might actually have to save and start. so what are you charging for your 30 day codes, please mail me in game about it I might be prepaired to buy 2 of them if the price is right
Triath Lon Keepers of Balance Legion of xXDEATHXx	Posted - 2008.02.05 05:23:00 - [59] Originally by: Rilwen they want a good paint job so that could be another $200 an army. Good paintjob is $50 per character for distinct characters. My DA terminator squad ran me $370 for pro paintjob. Another $120 for each bike squad... No, $500 is not a lot for a hobby. ________ Arazu - when you, eventually, lock me - you'll shoot me. Pilgrim - you can lock me, just can't hit me. Falcon - if i'm lucky...
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2008.02.05 05:36:00 - [60] Edited by: Blane Xero on 05/02/2008 05:38:10 If your so interested in selling them, if they are 30day GTC's set one up for Blaze Infernus at 150mill and i'll take one, but next time buy a smaller amount and sit in the Trade-Other channel, and post in the GTC forums. Undercut a little, after all, your loaded so it doesnt matter if you lose a little isk:ú ratio. Mind you if you do, evemail this char so i know, i cant keep be checkin every 10 mins Welcome to EvE
Seeing EyeDog	Posted - 2008.02.05 06:31:00 - [61] Edited by: Seeing EyeDog on 05/02/2008 06:55:10 Originally by: BoboTheClown is no one buying gtc's anymore ive been tying to offload like 30 all day 30 GTCs?!?!?!!? I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you... It's Right Here _____________________ Originally by: Locus Bey Intelligence isn't a prequisite for being a Goon, in fact its a deficit.
Fofalus III ELEMENTS	Posted - 2008.02.05 06:52:00 - [62] Originally by: Seeing EyeDog 30 GTCs?!?!?!!? I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you... It's Right Here Even goons are winning at that. Fofofofo
Asmosis	Posted - 2008.02.05 07:45:00 - [63] If you could get 1 billion Isk for an hours real work, would you do it? Depends how much you like Isk grinding ingame really. I probably would, but then i enjoy ratting/missioning. I also have the time to do those for a reasonable amount of time which some people dont (see first statement).
Maj Disaster	Posted - 2008.02.05 10:48:00 - [64] As the op has already stated, the isk is to be used to buy BPO's. This is the big problem with GTC, the people selling valuable items would be unable to demand such a high price for them if they did not know that someone who is wealthy in the real world will pay the price with isk purchased with RL cash regardless of its price. This means that to obtain the same item people who have regular or low incomes and cannot afford to spend RL cash on isk have to grind 10 times as much to raise the isk even though they may have the same (or maybe even less) available "play time" as the op. This is why many people are against GTC, it directly impacts the quality of thier game time !!
BoboTheClown	Posted - 2008.02.05 13:27:00 - [65] Following the recent comments by you guys i lowered my usual price's and managed to sell them all.
RedClaws Amarr Dragon's Rage Intrepid Crossing	Posted - 2008.02.05 14:03:00 - [66] Edited by: RedClaws on 05/02/2008 14:06:05 Have you managed to get your sh*t straight as well and quit spending 300+Ç on pixels? Jezus dude...theres GTC selling and theres GTC selling okay... quit messing up the game! Edit: Linkage: 300Ç nah lets make that around 500Ç. I bet you're not married right?
Mordred Wolf Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2008.02.05 14:42:00 - [67] I've never bought a GTC because I am constantly broke but I understand the importance of them for the game. Without having a mechanism for bleeding money out of the game inflation would run rampant and the price of even common goods would balloon out making it difficult for new players. If EVE gets trapped in a cycle where only the older players have realistic access to good because of price inflation it would make it harder for new people to replace the older players that tend to burn out. It comes down to how many paying subscribers do you lose via GTC vs how many you would lose by making it extremely difficult for new players to establish themselves. I am sure the numbers heavily favour the current course of action.
Cleric JohnPreston	Posted - 2008.02.05 15:22:00 - [68] Soon this game will turn into " who ever can spend the most RL money will win ". The sooner it dies the better imo.
Zaskarr Amarr Falling Stars Squadron	Posted - 2008.02.05 15:46:00 - [69] OP, you are part of the problem. Selling 30 at once IS good way to crash the market. __________________ How do I shot web?
Ricardo Phallus	Posted - 2008.02.05 15:48:00 - [70] Originally by: Zaskarr OP, you are part of the problem. Selling 30 at once IS good way to crash the market. Heck, even writing a post like this can depress the market, even if the OP didn't actually happen have 30 cards and for some reason wanted to drive the prices down, potentially even just for the lulz as the kids say these days.
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2008.02.05 15:51:00 - [71] Originally by: Lisa Seraph As a broke college kid who would rather play a game than get a real job.... I love it! QFT!!!!!
Alz Shado Ever Flow	Posted - 2008.02.05 15:56:00 - [72] Spidey sense is tingling. Meta-Market manipulation? Protip: The dollar's dropping! Quick, put all your money into GOLD.
TheEndofTheWorld	Posted - 2008.02.05 16:25:00 - [73] Originally by: Lindsay Fox I just find all this anti-gtc stuff really weird. - There are a ton of people who have plenty of RL cash but very little time to devote to Eve. Without GTC they would not be playing for long, as they could not be bothered taking two weeks of occasional play to replace a battle ship, or six months to replace a carrier, or whatever. If they couldn't use RL cash to fund the game they would quit. - There are a ton of people who have plenty of time but not much RL cash. Without GTC they would not be playing at all. These two groups of people are pretty much excluded from other MMO's, except for the use of ebay. The fact that CCP has found a scheme that enables these people to still play while ensuring that CCP gets all the real money is, in my mind, just about the most brilliant idea CCP has ever had. I thank them for it. I think all they need to do now is halve the price of GTCs and the ISK sellers would have to go elsewhere, it would no longer be worth it. This may cause the economy to freak out for a while, but it would settle down and be a better game eventually. I am lucky, I have worked hard for the last 20 years, I am self-employed now and have plenty of spare time, so I can afford the time to build up my eve wealth in-game. I know that one hour of RL work for me would buy me a couple of billion ISK, but that would pretty much ruin my enjoyment of the game. But for others it is the only way that they can enjoy them game, so more power to them. Anyway, spending $500 of real money on a hobby that occupies so much of my time would be nothing. I used to race remote-control cars competitively and that cost me around $1000 per month, including hotels and crap. Eve is practically free in comparison. I just can't believe how so many people think their view of the value of money and the value of time, can be the only valid one. And finally, if CCP wasn't selling GTCs then the ebay market would be much worse anyway, it's not like it would stop. /rant Ebay, GTC - zero difference for me, really. In-game rewards acquired thanks to RL cash? Breaks the competitive spirit of the game imo. If there was an EVE without RMT and an EVE with RMT and I would drop out from the second one immediately...
Tallann Amarr Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.02.05 17:20:00 - [74] I agree that it is a hobby and there are many other hobbies that people spend a lot less time doing but a lot more money. The problem is in my mind it breaks the competitive spirit of the game. Chess would lose its luster if the guy in the park you played against could spend an extra 50$ on a set and his queen could make moves your queen couldn't.
Arkios Odymei Incarnation of Evil Nocturnal Legion	Posted - 2008.02.05 17:48:00 - [75] First off: Poor flight school student here, basicaly squeaking buy on funds to pay the rent/utilities and training. Training costs me about $300 for an hour of helicopter flight time... Im pretty broke. (See my second comment below) So @ op... I'll be willing to buy a GTC off you for 150M. Just send me an eve mail and let me know. Secondly: Originally by: Lindsay Fox I just find all this anti-gtc stuff really weird. - There are a ton of people who have plenty of RL cash but very little time to devote to Eve. Without GTC they would not be playing for long, as they could not be bothered taking two weeks of occasional play to replace a battle ship, or six months to replace a carrier, or whatever. If they couldn't use RL cash to fund the game they would quit. - There are a ton of people who have plenty of time but not much RL cash. Without GTC they would not be playing at all. These two groups of people are pretty much excluded from other MMO's, except for the use of ebay. The fact that CCP has found a scheme that enables these people to still play while ensuring that CCP gets all the real money is, in my mind, just about the most brilliant idea CCP has ever had. I thank them for it. I think all they need to do now is halve the price of GTCs and the ISK sellers would have to go elsewhere, it would no longer be worth it. This may cause the economy to freak out for a while, but it would settle down and be a better game eventually. I am lucky, I have worked hard for the last 20 years, I am self-employed now and have plenty of spare time, so I can afford the time to build up my eve wealth in-game. I know that one hour of RL work for me would buy me a couple of billion ISK, but that would pretty much ruin my enjoyment of the game. But for others it is the only way that they can enjoy them game, so more power to them. Anyway, spending $500 of real money on a hobby that occupies so much of my time would be nothing. I used to race remote-control cars competitively and that cost me around $1000 per month, including hotels and crap. Eve is practically free in comparison. I just can't believe how so many people think their view of the value of money and the value of time, can be the only valid one. And finally, if CCP wasn't selling GTCs then the ebay market would be much worse anyway, it's not like it would stop. /rant /signed ------------------------------------------------------------------
Estephania Independent Political Analysts	Posted - 2008.02.05 17:51:00 - [76] The OP is a great example how good intentions lead to many nasty things. When ppl are ready to spend their RL cash in order to acquire something in game, which they don't deserve to have, 2 problems arise: 1) it drives the prices to insane levels and everyone who can't spend, let's say $500 on the game, can't compete. 2) the competitive spirit of the game is broken. after all, you can grind only a certain amount of ISK. If you are buying ISK with your RL cash, the sky is the limit.
000Hunter000 Gallente The Scope	Posted - 2008.02.05 17:54:00 - [77] GTC for isk selling is broken!!! CCP please nerf!!! CCP, let us pay the online shop with Direct Debit!!!
Ping Li	Posted - 2008.02.05 18:03:00 - [78] Originally by: Estephania The OP is a great example how good intentions lead to many nasty things. When ppl are ready to spend their RL cash in order to acquire something in game, which they don't deserve to have, 2 problems arise: 1) it drives the prices to insane levels and everyone who can't spend, let's say $500 on the game, can't compete. I'm a casual player and i pay my GTC's with isk because i don't want to spend a monthly $30 (2 accounts) on a game. Even though i need 150 mil each month i still can buy anything i like (e.g. i've got a freighter, a few CNR's, a Carrier), i also do a lot of PvP where i regularly loose ships which need to be replaced and still i can play this game without problems. So i don't agree with any insane prices. Quote: 2) the competitive spirit of the game is broken. after all, you can grind only a certain amount of ISK. If you are buying ISK with your RL cash, the sky is the limit. If that's the main competitive spirit of this game you see i think you are playing the wrong game. Imho the main competitive spirit of this game is in its PVP (being better in fighting/trading or whatever you like)
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2008.02.05 18:08:00 - [79] Originally by: Estephania The OP is a great example how good intentions lead to many nasty things. When ppl are ready to spend their RL cash in order to acquire something in game, which they don't deserve to have, 2 problems arise: 1) it drives the prices to insane levels and everyone who can't spend, let's say $500 on the game, can't compete. 2) the competitive spirit of the game is broken. after all, you can grind only a certain amount of ISK. If you are buying ISK with your RL cash, the sky is the limit. And both of your so-called issues are rendered null and void by the way GTC-for-ISK works. Sure, the potential ISK supply goes up as prices for GTCs (in ISK) go down, but not much. Even if a vast majority of EVE players would pay ISK for GTCs (and prices would be so low that most people would prefer to do so instead of actually paying to play the game), you would still have a limited "buyable ISK" pool, insignifiant compared to how much ISK a couple of groups of dedicated "ISK RMT" farmers would be able to provide. So, no, prices would never get to "insane levels" in the first place, and the more people buy ISK, the more expensive ISK becomes in real-life cash, the more it ends up hurting those that buy ISK to "be competitive". Also, in case you haven't noticed yet, EVE is not one of those "uberpimp stuff pwns regular stuff"... a gang of T2-fit battleship gang plus supports could and usually do blow faction-pimped capitals out of the sky. 1\|2\|3\|4\|5.
Bin Matar Fallen Angel's Blade.	Posted - 2008.02.05 18:23:00 - [80] Gotta say ive sold gtcs in the past and will again in the future. I generally work a 70/80 hour week and play this game for the PvP. If i had to spend my 2-3 hours a week playtime on ratting etc i wouldnt be here now. People may moan about me having an unfair advantage over those that cant afford it but in truth they have the greatest advange over me "TIME". I used to make most of my isk trading but wouldnt stand a chance now as its can be days between me logging on and the income im getting is so small now. The cost of gtc funded play is relative to what id save. A night out in the UK is gonna hit my wallet for 100-200 pounds depending on what i do,so that 7.50 for a gtc to get me a new BS seems pretty good to me. PPl need to chill and understand that not every one can invest the time into the game they would like to and i for one am greatfull to CCP for giving me the ability to carry on enjoying the game.
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force	Posted - 2008.02.05 18:30:00 - [81] Edited by: Akita T on 05/02/2008 18:34:38 To be quite honest, I'd LOVE to see game time becoming a non-destructible in-game item (somewhat akin to bookmarks in P&P)... but able to get sold/bought in contracts, or even the market Call it "pod licence fee" or whatnot Barring that, a single global GTC market tied into the "secure transfer" system (web-based, under "my account"), where you just fill the price you want for your GTC (or price you are willing to pay for a GTC), and the system handles the rest automatically (you can adjust prices later if you want to). P.S. Current rules would still apply, bought=applied. 1\|2\|3\|4\|5.
Alz Shado Ever Flow	Posted - 2008.02.05 18:47:00 - [82] GTCs do not add ISK into the EVE economy. GTCs do not remove ISK from the EVE economy. Therefore, GTCs do not affect the EVE economy.
Mir Net	Posted - 2008.02.05 18:49:00 - [83] Originally by: Ping Li I'm a casual player and i pay my GTC's with isk because i don't want to spend a monthly $30 (2 accounts) on a game. Quote: Ok. When you signed up to the game, it was on the understanding that a 15$ a month charge was required to keep an active account/subscription. This is NOT a free to play mmo. The 2nd point rather obviously, you don't need to have 2 account/characters, nobody forces the thirty dollars on you other than yourself, there is a 15$ a month charge to play, as a casual player im suprised you feel the need for 2 accounts? Originally by: Ping Li If that's the main competitive spirit of this game you see i think you are playing the wrong game. Imho the main competitive spirit of this game is in its PVP (being better in fighting/trading or whatever you like) Actualy (aside from the fact you failed to realise this isn't a free to play mmo) it's yourself that might be in the wrong game, as you fail totaly to understand the point of pvp/fighting over/trading ect in eve as opposed to most other mmo's It's competition allright, thats what every Commodity and resource within the game is placed for. The better at it you and your group are, the lesser the Opportunity for others, the best (money making) roids/complexes/sites/moons/regions/items be yours as the competition. Thats what the game (eve) is touted as by the developers, and by it's greatest stalwards. ofc who needs to compete for those resources when making money is as easy as paying your subscription fee's. Thats where the spirt is totaly lost, you can and have the same Opportunity to replace your losses at the same rate as your opponent who holds the greater in game resources by way of buying isk. You might as well be playing warcraft if all pvp is to you (or isk buyers) just shouting over braging rights, and not playing it to it's true nature, aka a game where loss, concequences of lack of effectiveness or actions matter to individuals or groups. Thats what Eve online was before they allowed isk buying through timecode sales.
Karlemgne Infinitus Odium The Church.	Posted - 2008.02.05 19:54:00 - [84] You spent $450 on GTCs to sell for isk? No offense, but EVE is not that important. You could have bought yourself a top of the line video card with that money. I'm reminded of the idiomatic expression "fools and their money shall soon be parted." -Karlemgne
Falcon Troy Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2008.02.05 20:17:00 - [85] Originally by: Alz Shado GTCs do not add ISK into the EVE economy. GTCs do not remove ISK from the EVE economy. Therefore, GTCs do not affect the EVE economy. .
TheEndofTheWorld	Posted - 2008.02.05 20:21:00 - [86] Edited by: TheEndofTheWorld on 05/02/2008 20:21:54 Originally by: Bin Matar Gotta say ive sold gtcs in the past and will again in the future. I generally work a 70/80 hour week and play this game for the PvP. If i had to spend my 2-3 hours a week playtime on ratting etc i wouldnt be here now. People may moan about me having an unfair advantage over those that cant afford it but in truth they have the greatest advange over me "TIME". I used to make most of my isk trading but wouldnt stand a chance now as its can be days between me logging on and the income im getting is so small now. The cost of gtc funded play is relative to what id save. A night out in the UK is gonna hit my wallet for 100-200 pounds depending on what i do,so that 7.50 for a gtc to get me a new BS seems pretty good to me. PPl need to chill and understand that not every one can invest the time into the game they would like to and i for one am greatfull to CCP for giving me the ability to carry on enjoying the game. Gee, another example, why EVE fails... Gee, I hope some new Sci-fi based mmorpg comes out, that provides similar game mechanics, but without RMT. I really thought that MMORPGs should involve all this market and self-funding part, but what is the point really? Gee, but what can I do, some people just buy isk and say lol whenever they lose their ships thus they completely ignore the "RPG" part of the game... RMT(ebay or gtcs, no difference for me) ruins the competitive spirit, RMT ruins the game (for me).
Fofalus III ELEMENTS	Posted - 2008.02.05 20:25:00 - [87] Originally by: Falcon Troy Originally by: Alz Shado GTCs do not add ISK into the EVE economy. GTCs do not remove ISK from the EVE economy. Therefore, GTCs do not affect the EVE economy. How about you prove him wrong instead of just saying he is a failure with no content. The fact is thats the same principle eve works on.
Marcus TheMartin Gallente Deadly Addiction	Posted - 2008.02.05 20:30:00 - [88] GTC trade doesn't create isk but it does make the death penalty substantially softer and that is a mockery of the spirit of eve
Ping Li	Posted - 2008.02.05 20:32:00 - [89] Originally by: Mir Net Ok. When you signed up to the game, it was on the understanding that a 15$ a month charge was required to keep an active account/subscription. This is NOT a free to play mmo. If i had to pay i would also do it, i would probably only play with 1 account but that's not my point. The part i quoted mentioned that isk was worth next to nothing and that only people with a lot of real money are able to buy anything. I merely mentioned myself as proof that even a casual player can earn enough to buy GTC's and still be able to buy anything he likes. Quote: The 2nd point rather obviously, you don't need to have 2 account/characters, nobody forces the thirty dollars on you other than yourself, there is a 15$ a month charge to play, as a casual player im suprised you feel the need for 2 accounts? I've got my main in 0.0 on my first account, and on my second account a trader, a cyno alt and a mission-runner. It's just more fun to be able to play a different style now and then. Quote: Originally by: Ping Li If that's the main competitive spirit of this game you see i think you are playing the wrong game. Imho the main competitive spirit of this game is in its PVP (being better in fighting/trading or whatever you like) Actualy (aside from the fact you failed to realise this isn't a free to play mmo) it's yourself that might be in the wrong game, as you fail totaly to understand the point of pvp/fighting over/trading ect in eve as opposed to most other mmo's ofc who needs to compete for those resources when making money is as easy as paying your subscription fee's. My trader alt's profit is a few hundred mil each week (this is logging in in the morning, set buy/sell orders. Update them in the evening and within a few days you got yourself a hundred mil extra. Even without buying isk you can still afford to buy anything you like. Furthermore i have never seen any MMO where it wasn't possible to buy ingame cash (usually illegal). Atm it's pretty regulated by CCP, if they would disallow GTC trades, those sales would move to Ebay and sites like that resulting in even a bigger abuse. The best part of Eve is that you have to replace your losses and you cannot do that with isk alone. If i loose a ship the biggest problem i have is to get new ships to the place i need them and it is not the lack of isk. Furthermore buying isk will not make you better in PvP. Quote: Thats where the spirt is totaly lost, you can and have the same Opportunity to replace your losses at the same rate as your opponent who holds the greater in game resources by way of buying isk. You might as well be playing warcraft if all pvp is to you (or isk buyers) just shouting over braging rights, and not playing it to it's true nature, aka a game where loss, concequences of lack of effectiveness or actions matter to individuals or groups. Thats what Eve online was before they allowed isk buying through timecode sales. As i said before you can have all the isk you want, if you loose a ship you still need to get a replacement. It also will not buy you any skills. Yes you are right the consequences of lossing a ship are a bit less if you buy isk, but if GTC sales were not allowed the problem would probably be a lot bigger.
Agent Li Caldari Galactic Defence Consortium BLACKHAWK FEDERATION	Posted - 2008.02.05 20:43:00 - [90] Looks like the GTC for isk thing is self-nerfing... ------------------ Let me show you around. That's my lab table, and this is my workstool. And over there is my intergalactic spaceship. And here's where I keep assorted lengths of wire.
aQurio Infamous Technologies	Posted - 2008.02.06 06:14:00 - [91] Well if they do nerf or remove GTC's for isk atleast the chinese sell there isk for cheaper Yes i know its a ban on the account for buying isk from isk farmers but if it came to no GTC's for isk alot of casual players including myself would be on the way out of EVE anyways. 60-90 hours a week work here so only get a few hours here and there to play. Also would like to say 3 accounts paid for this month and have had 4. Plus the GTC purchases i might be a good customer for CCP And for the record i have bought maybe a dozen GTC's in the time they have been available, my wife would kill me if i went crazy.

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