the sorting of the overview will lock when you hover over it

The devblog's comments button links to itself and not here.

Edit:

Whoop, it does now, or my web browser was broken. Maybe both?

the sorting of the overview will lock when you hover over it.

I wonder about secondary side effects from this. Don't get me wrong, it's great that the overview and brackets are getting some performance upgrades. But what they said about upping the hertz on the refresh of the data... I wonder if that will result in more load on the servers, and if the optimization thus far on the server side has been enough to accommodate (what appears to be) a simple timer change. Or is it the same data rate it had before, you just SEE the data 2.5x faster?

I wonder if that will result in more load on the servers, and if the optimization thus far on the server side has been enough to accommodate (what appears to be) a simple timer change. Or is it the same data rate it had before, you just SEE the data 2.5x faster?

Yeah, it's the stuff at the end there. The protocol from client to server didn't change, just how fast the client updates the overview specifically.

With the increased update rate, we made one super tiny functional change which youGÇÖll probably notice and hopefully like GÇô the sorting of the overview will lock when you hover over it. Previously it would freeze if you held your lock button, but with things moving around quicker it felt better to lock sooner than that.

Does that mean, a new Target does not appear in the overview if I hover over it?

Imagine a Gate you are on one side and a nother player is jumping through. Does he appear on that overview after decloaking when I hover over the overview or not?

New objects show up at the bottom of the list and objects that leave get greyed out while sorting is locked. Same behavior as exists on TQ today if you hold down your lock key (ctrl by default).

New objects show up at the bottom of the list and objects that leave get greyed out while sorting is locked. Same behavior as exists on TQ today if you hold down your lock key (ctrl by default).

Just so long as 'lock' doesn't mean 'freeze'. Keeping targets in position for the duration your mouse is over it is good. Not updating the overview to show new targets is bad. Add new targets to the bottom of the list if possible so at least you know they're there without affecting the rest of the list.

Holding the mouse over the overview while holding ctrl is standard practice for instalocking a target after it decloaks to warp so the overview not refreshing in that situation could be bad.

New objects show up at the bottom of the list and objects that leave get greyed out while sorting is locked. Same behavior as exists on TQ today if you hold down your lock key (ctrl by default).

Whats the issue with FPS drop and feeze when warping away from mining belts and fleet fights. Its up to twice per warp now.

New objects show up at the bottom of the list and objects that leave get greyed out while sorting is locked. Same behavior as exists on TQ today if you hold down your lock key (ctrl by default).

New objects show up at the bottom of the list and objects that leave get greyed out while sorting is locked. Same behavior as exists on TQ today if you hold down your lock key (ctrl by default).

One more question as I can't test on Sisi right now - while the Overview is hover-locked, do the distance and various velocity columns still update every second?

Btw: We are running a mass test on our test-server Singularity today evening at 20:00 UTC (=evetime) with these improvements (including the change to the locking behavior). Feel free to join in if you want to try them out or want to help us with making sure, that we don't introduce new bugs. More information about the mass test can be found in this thread.

I wonder about secondary side effects from this. Don't get me wrong, it's great that the overview and brackets are getting some performance upgrades. But what they said about upping the hertz on the refresh of the data... I wonder if that will result in more load on the servers, and if the optimization thus far on the server side has been enough to accommodate (what appears to be) a simple timer change. Or is it the same data rate it had before, you just SEE the data 2.5x faster?

Thank you CCP Veritas!

Question - in the course of working on these fixes, have you fixed the bug where the overview occasionally fails to get or process a pilot's Alliance tag, therefore not applying the appropriate color tag and any filtering to his entry in the overview and ship bracket in space?

You mean when I open a gazillion windows, Estamel will spawn endlessly for me, too?!

Deal!

Client size/ memery usage up or down?

Probably going to result in more cloaking ships getting ganked. 2.5 second refresh + 2 second human lag = MWD + Cloak trick works. Not sure it will anymore.

Client size/ memery usage up or down?

Honestly, what I would REALLY like is the ability to split off overview tabs - so you can have 2 overviews to look at and keep certain information separate.


I'll keep dreaming though.

That is actually a good idea in theory but I'm thinking the client would have to be changed a LOT to handle it, like putting two engines into a motorcycle, if the frame isn't designed specifically for it there's no way to make it work.

I just know someone will produce a wikipedia link of a dual-engined motorbike now.

I'm not sold on the overview locking on mouse-over. I think it will end up getting in the way more than it comes in handy, especially when FC's are broadcasting targets, which normally will jump to the top, but now won't change as your mouse is already hovering over the overview (waiting for the broadcast to come up, of course).

It might be a good idea to make this a setting that can be disabled.

You can target broadcasted targets from broadcast history.... It is rather important that with improved refresh speed overview does lock before hitting the button to prevent miss-clicks and make browsing the target easier.

I do however agree that lock while hovering over with mouse has some disadvantages - but after the update - it is still better than not locking at all and definitely still faster than with old overview's refresh speed.

Win!

BONUS GOODNESS:

Since the overview and brackets share a lot of code, we made them a bit faster by accident.

Hell yes.

How much is 'a bit'? Is there more to come on bracket lag? Having to sacrifice massive amounts of situational awareness to get a playable framerate at present is supremely irritating.

New objects show up at the bottom of the list and objects that leave get greyed out while sorting is locked. Same behavior as exists on TQ today if you hold down your lock key (ctrl by default).

I'm well aware you can lock directly from the broadcast window, however the broadcast window often lags in heavy fighting, sometimes broadcasts even get lost if the FC is calling too fast (donno if this is a bug or intentional throttling), at times it's a lot faster to search the overview as the name is called over comms than it is to wait for the broadcast to come through.

Probably not. I'm aware of that one and have it in my head while I'm going through code. Hopefully at some point I stumble upon something that could cause that. Without a reliable reproduction (as you say, it's rare), that's all I can really do

Only major downside I see here is that you can't keep your mouse cursor on top of the overview all the time any more.

This is my point exactly, you now can't hold your mouse over the overview and expect it to update, where as before you could quickly toggle the lock button on and off and force the overview to pause when you wanted, and update normally when you wanted.

This is my point exactly, you now can't hold your mouse over the overview and expect it to update, where as before you could quickly toggle the lock button on and off and force the overview to pause when you wanted, and update normally when you wanted.

This is my point exactly, you now can't hold your mouse over the overview and expect it to update, where as before you could quickly toggle the lock button on and off and force the overview to pause when you wanted, and update normally when you wanted.

I don't think this is going to be a big issue.

Gate Camping: Keep your mouse at the bottom of what is listed on the overview. Your target will appear there as soon as he uncloaks, and sooner than he did before.

Broadcasts: This behavior could easily be made to work the same way, or better yet simply jump to the top of the overview as it does now. If it isn't like this yet, I doubt it would take much to make is so.

Other than those two situations your mouse goes constantly over to select your specific locked target, or activate modules, or any number of things anyway.

I'd like to see a text only client, a low-memory client for the chatty geeks hehe

I'd like to see a text only client, a low-memory client for the chatty geeks hehe

There's already a text only client, but it's a hack you have to enable in the registry, here's a screenshot

http://i894.photobucket.com/albums/ac145/GarySqueak/26455760nn2.jpg

With the increased update rate, we made one super tiny functional change which youGÇÖll probably notice and hopefully like GÇô the sorting of the overview will lock when you hover over it. Previously it would freeze if you held your lock button, but with things moving around quicker it felt better to lock sooner than that.

Probably going to result in more cloaking ships getting ganked. 2.5 second refresh + 2 second human lag = MWD + Cloak trick works. Not sure it will anymore.

I've heard all kinds of stories from other pilots about how network latency is involved, and how sitting on a good connection in the UK a tackler is much more effective.

I'd be all for that as long as it uses vi instead of emacs key bindings.

:wq!

/T

I would love more elaboration of :

"Since the overview and brackets share a lot of code, we made them a bit faster by accident."

The word "accident" does make me a tad bit nervous. /me backups boot.ini file

Regardless, great job. Keep it coming!

In this screenshot in the devblog:

http://cdn1.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/3122/3417/your_client_made_gooder_windowsset_5.png

What happens if you minimise all those windows with this patch? Will the Neocom have an aneurysm?

Because currently having everything minimise to the Neocom can be a pain...

When the overview locks on mouse-over does that mean it doesn't update or that it doesn't resort? The important difference is that if it doesn't refresh, tactics such as priming weapons to insta-lock and point a decloaking ship will be slightly more difficult if the overview doesn't add the ship to the overview. If it only doesn't resort, then it merely appears at the bottom of the list until the cursor moves.

New objects show up at the bottom of the list and objects that leave get greyed out while sorting is locked. Same behavior as exists on TQ today if you hold down your lock key (ctrl by default).

http://cdn1.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/3122/3417/your_client_made_gooder_windowsset_5.png

First

And Roll on CCP! <3

In this screenshot in the devblog:

http://cdn1.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/3122/3417/your_client_made_gooder_windowsset_5.png

What happens if you minimise all those windows with this patch? Will the Neocom have an aneurysm?

Because currently having everything minimise to the Neocom can be a pain...

This may not be in your area to look at, but I know a lot of people who would cry tears of joy for a simplified mechanic to correctly set up one's overview.

Obviously people eventually figure out (or are shown) one that works for sorting hostiles, etc in a manner that works well for what they are trying to do and where they are flying... but it's a pain if you ever have to set them up again (or learn how to do it to begin with).

Some may say this isn't necessary, but I believe a surprisingly large number of people turn away from PVP simply because they are embarrassed that they can't figure it out.

Agreed. Muchly. I've thought for a long time that it would be great to have individual filters xml loadable. For example, have a directory into which [name].xml files could be dropped, and they appear in your "Load overview settings" list. Optionally these files could contain column info, bracket settings and/or tab name. Such files could easiliy be distributed, and used without screwing up all your existing tabs.

The file/directory paradigm is well understood, and would be far easier to understand than the existing arcane way of doing things.

Oh, and... Awsome Update! Much love to OP.

[And what clown thought that deleting all my input with a helpful "html not allowed" error just because I put a greater-than character in it was good plan? Converting to to ampersand gt colon too hard???]

There's a lot of setup and tear-down when new items enter/exit the grid. It's on the list to hammer at.

Good work on the overview, but to make it even better you could make us pirates and outlaws flashy red again.Everyone still calls us flashy red anyway, even people that weren't around before you nerfed us. I don't even know why we were nerfed in the first place.

Baby seal walked into a club

The freeze-on-hover overview thing is going to be terribly annoying. The way it works right now is perfect - why change it? You still need to press ctrl (and click) to actually lock a target, so it doesn't make locking the target easier. Will CCP ever hire a competent UI designer? Mouse-over should never trigger any significant actions (the mouse-over drop-down menus on the website are terrible too, by the way).

It will only confuse people who don't know about this "feature" and force people who do to always remember to move their mouse away from the overview if they want the most-current sorting (which is often by distance, when it's extremely important to know quickly that targets are landing/approaching close to you).

Because you are supposed to be black. Maybe with a skull 'n bones if you feel glamorous, not red.

yeah, ive mentioned this to ccp in the ideas and features forum; i told them to make it act like windows7 taskbar and to fix the lame groups feature. You can create groups but you cant put anything you want in the groups. I have yet to right click on a neocom entry to get "move to group" as an option.

Good work on the overview, but to make it even better you could make us pirates and outlaws flashy red again.Everyone still calls us flashy red anyway, even people that weren't around before you nerfed us. I don't even know why we were nerfed in the first place.

we made one super tiny functional change which youGÇÖll probably notice and hopefully like GÇô the sorting of the overview will lock when you hover over it.

BONUS GOODNESS:

Since the overview and brackets share a lot of code, we made them a bit faster by accident. I hope you donGÇÖt mind.

The overview is much more sluggish now if you have your mouse over it. It's ridiculous for me, when I need to select a lot of wrecks quickly and cant because I have to mouse off the frakking overview each time to get an update of what is closest and what has been removed.

By the way Eve devs, when a wreck is salvaged, it is GONE not grey. It serves no useful purpose to leave it in the overview greyed out. This stuff pisses me off because it makes playing harder, and this game is already hard enough to play.

If you read the dev blog, it's not sluggish. It's locked.

huge performance regression for me. got this with Crudible 1.0, then got my pef back with Crucible 1.1 ... now I am back to Crucible 1.0 crawl ....

also the mouseover locking is terrible.

one Q: why does ctrl activate locking on overview selected item ? I mean I click on somebody, then press CTRL and locking starts. THIS IS ******** !!!! I can lock people by accident this way ...

no its not locked, its lag/delay. My mouse pointer is nowhere near the overview and any wrecks i salvage turn grey then after between 1 and 2 seconds, disappear. Its the biggest step backwards CCP have done in ages.

Since the patch with the new Overview performance enhancements, I've been getting a number of system crashes on my Q6600 / AMD 6970HD 2Gb system.