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bitters much
Nekkid Inc.
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Posted - 2008.02.08 08:36:00 -
[61]
Just being here to show my sig
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BlckJck
Reaper Industries Eternal Rapture
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Posted - 2008.02.08 08:51:00 -
[62]
Originally by: bitters much Just being here to show my sig
most constructive post yet
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Plan Neun
Caldari Ganja Unlimited CORE.
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Posted - 2008.02.08 09:09:00 -
[63]
To coallition. Keep up the good work, dont let crap about k/d whatever from BuB bother you.
Only thing im worried about is that CCP will do something to help BoBsy from utter defeat. Since CCP has this dev ploy insist that dev shall play with gamers, that incident where a certain gamer cough cough.
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Phyrron
Gallente Burnout Syndrome SECUWAY.
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Posted - 2008.02.08 10:20:00 -
[64]
a killboard ist only a statistic. every statistics are more or less a mirror of reality. i think statistics are bad mirrors of reality because they underlie a lot of conditions and reduction of these reality before you can draw it. When you read a statistic you cant ignore these conditions and you cant ignore that the elements of reality wich are reduced before can never come back into your conclusion. A statistic about meet consumtion and the conclusion "we all eat 50 steaks/year" ignore the existence of vegetarians and say nothing about them.
a kill/loss ratio dosnt make a difference whether you loose a BS or a frig. And some people like their frigs very much especially Goons. The ISK statistic dosnt make a difference whether you are poor or rich.
When you draw a statistic about statistics you will see that they are very equal. For example: losspostings are more or less evenly distributed in all Allys in EVE like active playing member and memberaccount and so on.
The best way to find out who wins and who lost is to count the wracks on the gate wich you can unhurriedly loot after a fight like yesterday everning in QY6
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Captain Thunk
Captain Morgan Society
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Posted - 2008.02.08 10:24:00 -
[65]
Originally by: HEY LISTEN Virtualy every 0.0 alliance in eve is fighting them do you not read the forums at all?.
PS; obviously not cos your corp ticker is off so your gonna get your post deleted.
I believe there's something like around 4400 alliances in Eve, pretty sure virtually all of them aren't fighting BoB. Then there's people like me, I want BoB to be destroyed (no offence BoB guys) but due to some masterful puppetry I am actually usually in a war with Goons. Presumably this is to drive goons out of High Sec Empire into the waiting arms of a BoB gang. But this is no doubt all part of the plan Dianabolic set out in his after dinner speech given at the Last Supper.
Anyway, it's not like BoB are alone is it? They have the legendary fighting force known as Executive Outcomes to aid them.
Thunk
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Krystian
Caldari No Quarter. Vae Victis.
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Posted - 2008.02.08 10:34:00 -
[66]
Uncle Ruckus, a self hating Brutor from the Planet Boondocks had this to tell me about BoB:
That's it go back. See ya in empire ya sorry Bobbits. The Coalition brought in the whole of EvE to smack you Bobbits away, but go on and hide. You Bobbits aint to good at taking a hint are ya? Go on, save Delve. What they got in Delve worth saving? What Lag? I hate lag, like a long server crash involving a Dev. Hey you seen that alliance Fix? I got a documentary called 'When your pets are going to die again'. Hahahaha. IÆm going to make an alliance and call it 'Bob Failyard'; IÆm going to surrender every time I get a war dec. Hahahaha.
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LvxAeterna
The Greater Goon GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.02.08 10:34:00 -
[67]
Edited by: LvxAeterna on 08/02/2008 10:34:43 Look, if 10 T1 frigates destroyed a T2 fitted battleship, and 9 of them die in the process to drones/smartbombs, whatever, I'd consider that a win.
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Giant Diablo
Tyrell Corp INTERDICTION
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Posted - 2008.02.08 12:50:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Hannobaal (Well ok, I will ignore for a while the fact that the whole idea of chestbeating about your "k/d ratio" is for people who play "Counterstrike in space" which is silly and not what Eve is about. But anyway... )
It seems that BoB lately (perhaps in lack of any other possible in-game achievements to brag about at all) have been endlessly bringing up their vaunted "k/d ratio" to (I guess) somehow attempt to prove that they are better than the alliances that have been fighting them despite their losses to those alliances. So, I thought I should look into this a little further and see if it really is all it is *****ed up to be. Unfortunately, doing so I ran into a problem. While BoB's killboard will show isk efficiency (which really is the only reliable measure here) for individual pilots, it does NOT do so for corps and alliances. It will only show number of ships lost and number of ships killed.
But since BoB aren't the only ones to have killboards we can look at their opponents' killboards (who mostly are the normal killboard style) and get a bit of perpective at BoB's real k/d. Below are the numbers for a few of them. (I thought of using battleclinic as well, however it shows them as having a near 0% ISK efficiency, so I will be nice and charitable and refrain from doing so.) The ones listed below are first the corp I'm in and then those alliances I could think of that are actively involved in fighting BoB and have killboards that show ISK efficiency.
Anyway, BoB's ISK efficiency versus...
Igneus Auctorita: 9.82% (ouch... I'm confused. I was told BoB was better than us....)
IRON: 34.2% Tau Ceti Federation: 44.56% Razor: 47.95% Mostly Harmless: 49.81 Pure : 53.81% Morsus Mihi: 57.12%
Yepp if we count ships.....Goonswarm cant win, if we count isk i dont know. But if you check battleclinic there is a rank system and BOB is nr 2 or 3 something Goons........hmm 100 something and also behind Interdiction. But as an powerfull alliance Interdiction is nothing compare to Goonswarm or BOB.....but kill ratio and isk.....We are better then Goons but i doubt we are better then BOB.
http://interdiction.griefwatch.net/?p=campaigns&campaign=711
And last Goonswrm didn¦t event the blackops tactics
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Doddy
Omega Fleet Enterprises Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2008.02.08 13:32:00 -
[69]
Originally by: Hannobaal (Well ok, I will ignore for a while the fact that the whole idea of chestbeating about your "k/d ratio" is for people who play "Counterstrike in space" which is silly and not what Eve is about. But anyway... )
It seems that BoB lately (perhaps in lack of any other possible in-game achievements to brag about at all) have been endlessly bringing up their vaunted "k/d ratio" to (I guess) somehow attempt to prove that they are better than the alliances that have been fighting them despite their losses to those alliances. So, I thought I should look into this a little further and see if it really is all it is *****ed up to be. Unfortunately, doing so I ran into a problem. While BoB's killboard will show isk efficiency (which really is the only reliable measure here) for individual pilots, it does NOT do so for corps and alliances. It will only show number of ships lost and number of ships killed.
But since BoB aren't the only ones to have killboards we can look at their opponents' killboards (who mostly are the normal killboard style) and get a bit of perpective at BoB's real k/d. Below are the numbers for a few of them. (I thought of using battleclinic as well, however it shows them as having a near 0% ISK efficiency, so I will be nice and charitable and refrain from doing so.) The ones listed below are first the corp I'm in and then those alliances I could think of that are actively involved in fighting BoB and have killboards that show ISK efficiency.
Anyway, BoB's ISK efficiency versus...
Igneus Auctorita: 9.82% (ouch... I'm confused. I was told BoB was better than us....)
IRON: 34.2% Tau Ceti Federation: 44.56% Razor: 47.95% Mostly Harmless: 49.81 Pure : 53.81% Morsus Mihi: 57.12%
I am just going to pretend you don't really understand how killboard efficiency works. When mixed fleets are involved, the smaller entities will always get an excellent efficiency, as they will get on lots of kills while risking very few losses. Using my own "bob pet" alliance as an example, one [EXE] inty pilot riding in a bob gang can get on a huge amount of kills, while only ever risking one small loss. The northern entities you have mentioned often fly in mixed gangs, so as alliances they benefit from this, and your corp, being from such a large alliance, is the same. I think TCF's figures are quite impressive as they often wander about in their own fleets but even so for big fights they will be fighting alongside RA, GS and maybe more. Killboard efficiency is largely irrelevant in the "great war" unless somone made GBC/coallition/tortuga boards and used only the efficiencies for the factions themselves. Ofc as BoB hasn't got many allies left its board would be the most relevent, but it doesn't show efficiency so w/e If you want to look at just efficiency our board shows 95% efficiency vs tortuga, but i don't think that fools anyone
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Captain Thunk
Captain Morgan Society
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Posted - 2008.02.08 13:53:00 -
[70]
So after reading the last 2 posts, what you're saying Doddy is that Interdiction isn't as good as Giant Diablo thinks it is?
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Cvuos
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.02.08 13:59:00 -
[71]
killboard online is an ok game as long as you play with friends on private servers, the pubbies are terrible
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7sunami
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.02.08 14:05:00 -
[72]
Originally by: LvxAeterna Edited by: LvxAeterna on 08/02/2008 10:34:43 Look, if 10 T1 frigates destroyed a T2 fitted battleship, and 9 of them die in the process to drones/smartbombs, whatever, I'd consider that a win.
Look at the day to day link on the Bob killboard. It shows the isk kill/lost. Given that its npc prices and not real jita prices. The prices are applied to kill/lost the same way, so its fair, even though prices are wrong. You can look at it as a mimimum isk damage
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Capt Willard
Repo Industries R.E.P.O.
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Posted - 2008.02.08 14:39:00 -
[73]
This all seems like pulling your trousers down in a pub toilet to compare manhood sizes, then spending a couple of hours arguing over whether it should be measured in imperial or metric...
As with the above scenario and the war against BoB, neither measurement matters, it's all about how much fun you've been having with it. The Horror...... |
Pastora
Russian SOBR Red Alliance
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Posted - 2008.02.08 14:41:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Capt Willard This all seems like pulling your trousers down in a pub toilet to compare manhood sizes, then spending a couple of hours arguing over whether it should be measured in imperial or metric...
I say, in metric! 'cause numbers are larger then _______________________________________________ If ifs and ands were pots and pans, I would grow mushrooms in my pants. |
DRAREG
Star Blood Industry
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Posted - 2008.02.08 14:46:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Cvuos killboard online is an ok game as long as you play with friends on private servers, the pubbies are terrible
agree ,i prefer pos online like u
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Hannobaal
Gallente Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.02.08 15:13:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Capt Willard This all seems like pulling your trousers down in a pub toilet to compare manhood sizes, then spending a couple of hours arguing over whether it should be measured in imperial or metric...
And the real lesson to take from that would be that bragging about the dimensions of something so irrelevant is kind of stupid and meaningless regardless, right?
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Hannobaal
Gallente Igneus Auctorita GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.02.08 15:15:00 -
[77]
Originally by: DRAREG
Originally by: Cvuos killboard online is an ok game as long as you play with friends on private servers, the pubbies are terrible
agree ,i prefer pos online like u
It's the game BoB has been playing. Territorial warfare. It's only when they started losing at it that they started claiming otherwise.
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Veng3ance
Prophets Of a Damned Universe
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Posted - 2008.02.08 15:47:00 -
[78]
While I do agree BOB's territorial decisions and defense have been significantly less effective lately; you really can't argue their efficiency K/D wise. Realize, as many have already said; multiple alliances are always fighting their mostly BOB fleets. So as many as 4-5 alliances will get on a single BOB kill, and it will be given credit on every alliances killboard.
Indeed!
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HEY LISTEN
i swear this is true
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Posted - 2008.02.08 20:21:00 -
[79]
Originally by: Hannobaal
Originally by: DRAREG
Originally by: Cvuos killboard online is an ok game as long as you play with friends on private servers, the pubbies are terrible
agree ,i prefer pos online like u
It's the game BoB has been playing. Territorial warfare. It's only when they started losing at it that they started claiming otherwise.
Thats not entirly true tbqh they did go on and on about terratory but they always prefered quality over quantity the stats they have for their campaigns have 3 times less losses than goons and they did not have half the help to do it.
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Akov Stohs
FinFleet Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.02.08 20:40:00 -
[80]
Isk Efficiency Is show on a per day basis, unfortunately not for the per fleet battle basis. I'll note the suggestion to the maintainer though. If you want to see daily isk ratio just go to the bob killboard, click the date, labeled something like "Saturday 02 February 2008". On the summary page is gives k/d in Isk amounts. You can even scroll backwards and forwards through the days by clicking the next and previous days links at the top of that page.
I do how ever recommend looking at last week when fighting was at its peak. Its considerably more impressive in terms of quantities destroyed for both parties. Granted this does not take into account being in fleets with our allies, and there for by default not an entirely accurate picture, but this is probably the best that you are going to get.
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Gloomy Gus
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.02.08 20:54:00 -
[81]
Originally by: Cvuos killboard online is an ok game as long as you play with friends on private servers, the pubbies are terrible
'sup Weapons Factory buddy
Originally by: JakeNoble well id just like to say kilz is an epic****got plz
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Lief Siddhe
University of Caille
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Posted - 2008.02.08 20:56:00 -
[82]
BoB wanted a huge fight with everybody. Everybody wanted a huge fight with BoB. I think that's all that matters, in that perspective nobody lost, all sides "won" a lot of fun time. (I am not an alt, I am a UC carebear that looks at this from simply a gamer's perspective) --- Beneath all of our differences there's a single bond between every living Gallentean that makes us hard as diamond: a love of freedom. |
Moon Kitten
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.02.08 22:06:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Lief Siddhe all sides "won" a lot of fun time.
Rationalization
to invent plausible explanations for acts, opinions, etc., that are actually based on other causes.
We've lulled our opponents into a false sense of confidence. Oh, yes. Everything is going according to plan. Those fools, they think they can win... by winning. |
enderzone
Lai Dai Applied Technology
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Posted - 2008.02.09 00:45:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Hannobaal
Originally by: TWD If there is a gang of 20 people from 20 different alliances and they lose 10 ships and all participated in 2 kills against 1 alliance, its pretty easy to get a pretty good K/D ratio per alliance as they lost 1 ship max and still got in on 2 kills.
In this case the K/D ratio is useless!
However!
If you look at a fight in general and include all the kills and losses of all alliances involved it is useful to see what the result was and the numbers involved.
And with that in mind, if your killboard would show isk efficiency we could get a clearer picture, but it don't...
the majority of kb seem inacurate at best in regards to isk value
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enderzone
Lai Dai Applied Technology
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Posted - 2008.02.09 00:46:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Lief Siddhe BoB wanted a huge fight with everybody. Everybody wanted a huge fight with BoB. I think that's all that matters, in that perspective nobody lost, all sides "won" a lot of fun time. (I am not an alt, I am a UC carebear that looks at this from simply a gamer's perspective)
indeed its true (i think), however goon after goon chestbeat threads seem to be the way to go. victory to the chestbeat!
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Cvuos
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.02.09 18:26:00 -
[86]
Originally by: HEY LISTEN
Thats not entirly true tbqh they did go on and on about terratory but they always prefered quality over quantity the stats they have for their campaigns have 3 times less losses than goons and they did not have half the help to do it.
quantity=0 has a quality all of its own tbqh
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Junkie Beverage
GoonFleet GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.02.09 20:36:00 -
[87]
Edited by: Junkie Beverage on 09/02/2008 20:37:19
Originally by: Giant Diablo
Yepp if we count ships.....Goonswarm cant win, if we count isk i dont know. But if you check battleclinic there is a rank system and BOB is nr 2 or 3 something Goons........hmm 100 something and also behind Interdiction. But as an powerfull alliance Interdiction is nothing compare to Goonswarm or BOB.....but kill ratio and isk.....We are better then Goons but i doubt we are better then BOB.
http://interdiction.griefwatch.net/?p=campaigns&campaign=711
And last Goonswrm didn¦t event the blackops tactics
thanks for the information i just checked battleclinic and marvel at bob's #4 place on the alliance kills list
as it turns out lotka volterra has the #3 position so maybe after bob is dead we could track those guys down and try to get them to teach us a bit about honourable pvp anyone know where i might find these legendary warrior poets
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General StarScream
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Posted - 2008.02.10 11:03:00 -
[88]
anyone saying a K/D matters is a Rtard.
Fun time and reaching your goals is what eve is about.
not Laming your way to 1337 stats, sounds like some ***** Cs players trying to make him self all high and mighty for doing his headshots. Please resize signature to a maximum of 400 x 120, not exceeding 24000 bytes. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint |
TWD
Evolution Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.02.10 11:08:00 -
[89]
Originally by: General StarScream anyone saying a K/D matters is a Rtard.
Fun time and reaching your goals is what eve is about.
not Laming your way to 1337 stats, sounds like some ***** Cs players trying to make him self all high and mighty for doing his headshots.
What if one of my goals is to have a good K/D ratio?
EH? |
HEY LISTEN
i swear this is true
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Posted - 2008.02.10 11:58:00 -
[90]
Edited by: HEY LISTEN on 10/02/2008 11:58:40
Originally by: General StarScream anyone saying a K/D matters is a Rtard.
Fun time and reaching your goals is what eve is about.
not Laming your way to 1337 stats, sounds like some ***** Cs players trying to make him self all high and mighty for doing his headshots.
What if your goal is to become a skillful pilot and part of a well balanced and skillful team that can out fight 2 or 3 or even more times its number?. A good K/D ratio against more numerical foes is a good reflection of how your skills and team work is progressing. The ******s are those that ignore piloting skills and watch a laggy or frozen screen for hours on end for space they will never use.
Although id be interested in what goals you consider to be worthy of non****** status and what you do to have so much fun doing them.
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