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Are all bounties fake?

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Corstaad	Posted - 2008.02.09 07:41:00 - [1] Just wondering I've pirated for abit and got nothing. I thought before some patch you got a auto bounty for poding but I might be wrong.
Ridley Tree The Black Rabbits	Posted - 2008.02.09 07:45:00 - [2] Got to annoy the right carebear who doesn't know that bounties don't mean work. Some are real, some are fake. ____ Black Rabbits Recruitment
Inertial The Python Cartel	Posted - 2008.02.09 08:02:00 - [3] I am wanted by myself!
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue Sex Panthers	Posted - 2008.02.09 08:20:00 - [4] Originally by: Corstaad Just wondering I've pirated for abit and got nothing. I thought before some patch you got a auto bounty for poding but I might be wrong. No, not all bounties are fakes. Bellum Eternus [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y I I
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.09 08:32:00 - [5] Most 50mill+ are, mine isn't, its just 1 mill though and my alt got 5k. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue Sex Panthers	Posted - 2008.02.09 09:23:00 - [6] Originally by: General Coochie Most 50mill+ are, mine isn't, its just 1 mill though and my alt got 5k. No, not really. I've had my bounty up over 250m multiple times, and I've never put a bounty on myself. ATM mine is around 67m, not self placed. Bellum Eternus [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y I I
Hakaro Ino Caldari	Posted - 2008.02.09 09:29:00 - [7] Originally by: Bellum Eternus Originally by: General Coochie Most 50mill+ are, mine isn't, its just 1 mill though and my alt got 5k. No, not really. I've had my bounty up over 250m multiple times, and I've never put a bounty on myself. ATM mine is around 67m, not self placed. well you are hardly going to admit you placed it on yourself
Bellum Eternus Gallente Death of Virtue Sex Panthers	Posted - 2008.02.09 09:31:00 - [8] Originally by: Hakaro Ino Originally by: Bellum Eternus Originally by: General Coochie Most 50mill+ are, mine isn't, its just 1 mill though and my alt got 5k. No, not really. I've had my bounty up over 250m multiple times, and I've never put a bounty on myself. ATM mine is around 67m, not self placed. well you are hardly going to admit you placed it on yourself So you're calling me a liar? Bellum Eternus [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y [Vid] L E G E N D A R Y I I
Gneeznow Minmatar North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.02.09 10:08:00 - [9] I got a genuine 5 mil bounty \o/
Culmen Caldari HeartVenom Inc. Imperial Republic Of the North	Posted - 2008.02.09 10:12:00 - [10] I had a friend a while back He sort of mentioned off hand that he was finally bountiable in alliance chat Lucky for him he was in ASCN at its peak membership Got to the top ten highest bounties in 1 million increments _____________________________________________________ Why do i even need a sig?

Grunanca BLACK-FLAG	Posted - 2008.02.09 10:28:00 - [11] Mine is real, got a friend with a real 10 mil one.
hedfunk Caldari Low Sec Liberators	Posted - 2008.02.09 10:52:00 - [12] Someone put 10mill on my head when I was still high sec ganking - an extra 3mill has been added since i've been in low sec.
Lord Zoran Caldari House of Tempers	Posted - 2008.02.09 11:31:00 - [13] doesnt take much to get high bounties if you kill the right people Yarr!?!?!?!?!
Savesti Kyrsst Minmatar White-Noise	Posted - 2008.02.09 11:36:00 - [14] My alt has a genuine 4mil bounty at the moment. Never self-placed, but I had a previous bounty that was placed by friends/corpmates without me asking for it. Not sure if they wanted me to look good or get podded, probably both
Tatsue Niko Applied Eugenics	Posted - 2008.02.09 11:46:00 - [15] I've had about 56m on my head, and it was genuine. Its mostly an epeen thing I guess, but actually ur paying to be primaried, as a FC knowing the 50m+ bounty would primary that guy quite fast, would he be in an semi-ok ship to primary.
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.09 11:50:00 - [16] Originally by: Bellum Eternus Originally by: General Coochie Most 50mill+ are, mine isn't, its just 1 mill though and my alt got 5k. No, not really. I've had my bounty up over 250m multiple times, and I've never put a bounty on myself. ATM mine is around 67m, not self placed. Just because you had one over 50m doesn't mean that most over 50m aren't fake. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
Lt Angus Caldari the united Sex Panthers	Posted - 2008.02.09 12:35:00 - [17] corp member once got a 1 bill bounty, preety sure it was real as it only lasted an hour Shhhh, Im hunting Badgers
Omarvelous Destry's Lounge	Posted - 2008.02.09 17:20:00 - [18] I like it when I get a 5000 isk bounty placed on me! __________________________________________________ Sup brosef! Destry's Lounge is looking for a few good drunks - contact me in game.
Crazy Tasty Beyond Divinity Inc	Posted - 2008.02.09 17:30:00 - [19] Originally by: Lord Zoran doesnt take much to get high bounties if you kill the right people Qft. Me and a corp mate got a cormorant belt ratting and his pod. He put 100m on both of us. Funny thing was him being in a pirate corp himself. Apparently he was ****ed about losing some good implants.
Drunken Claptrap Caldari VMF-214 Blacksheep Star Buccaneers	Posted - 2008.02.09 17:58:00 - [20] Mine is currently 165 mill. Was put there by some crazy farmer type I think, after his shiny CNR popped and dropped 2 bill worth of loot.

xyeLz	Posted - 2008.02.09 18:08:00 - [21] Sigh, bounties are so silly :p I still cant fathom people placing them. Selling Character
Ariel Dawn Beets and Gravy Syndicate	Posted - 2008.02.09 19:48:00 - [22] Oh, there are plenty of people out there who will put bounties on you if you do the right thing to them. Most people can't resist the urge for free ISK when it gets to any decent amount and collect it. I've got that area covered, so I'm seeing how high I can get before succumbing to temptation (or having it forcefully removed!).
Dimitry Kalashnikov The Black Fleet	Posted - 2008.02.09 20:11:00 - [23] I've found that the more "random" they look the faker they are. For example: 1,665,932 Isk bounty: FAKE 1,000,000 Isk bounty: REAL Now of course this isn't written in stone, its just my observation. ============================================== The thousand ships of the Black Fleet Corporation descent upon you! Our Void L will blot out the sun!
Tellenta Gallente White-Noise	Posted - 2008.02.09 21:34:00 - [24] Originally by: Savesti Kyrsst My alt has a genuine 4mil bounty at the moment. Never self-placed, but I had a previous bounty that was placed by friends/corpmates without me asking for it. Not sure if they wanted me to look good or get podded, probably both I think I did that... and yes it was for both reasons, favoring the second. I have as of yet to exceed 1 mill bounty i keep losing them to doing unintelligent things such as traveling unscouted through 0.0 into obviously camped areas. Never claimed to be smart
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.09 21:53:00 - [25] Originally by: General Coochie Originally by: Bellum Eternus Originally by: General Coochie Most 50mill+ are, mine isn't, its just 1 mill though and my alt got 5k. No, not really. I've had my bounty up over 250m multiple times, and I've never put a bounty on myself. ATM mine is around 67m, not self placed. Just because you had one over 50m doesn't mean that most over 50m aren't fake. Just because you say that most 50mil + bounties are fake doesn't mean it actually is so. For instance if I hereby claim, out of the blue, that most 50 mil bounties aren't fake then I've provided just as much fact to back it up as you have at this point in the thread.
Mr Twinkie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.09 22:19:00 - [26] Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: General Coochie Originally by: Bellum Eternus Originally by: General Coochie Most 50mill+ are, mine isn't, its just 1 mill though and my alt got 5k. No, not really. I've had my bounty up over 250m multiple times, and I've never put a bounty on myself. ATM mine is around 67m, not self placed. Just because you had one over 50m doesn't mean that most over 50m aren't fake. Just because you say that most 50mil + bounties are fake doesn't mean it actually is so. For instance if I hereby claim, out of the blue, that most 50 mil bounties aren't fake then I've provided just as much fact to back it up as you have at this point in the thread. yes but unfortunetly... by being a douche well.. u fail ----------------- The Bastards.. Come Visit
Corstaad	Posted - 2008.02.09 22:26:00 - [27] Just wondering I kill all sorts of nubs I'd almost say 50%of my kills are from nubs. That said not once have I had a bounty put on my head.
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.09 23:16:00 - [28] Originally by: Mr Twinkie Edited by: Mr Twinkie on 09/02/2008 22:34:43 Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: General Coochie Originally by: Bellum Eternus Originally by: General Coochie Most 50mill+ are, mine isn't, its just 1 mill though and my alt got 5k. No, not really. I've had my bounty up over 250m multiple times, and I've never put a bounty on myself. ATM mine is around 67m, not self placed. Just because you had one over 50m doesn't mean that most over 50m aren't fake. Just because you say that most 50mil + bounties are fake doesn't mean it actually is so. For instance if I hereby claim, out of the blue, that most 50 mil bounties aren't fake then I've provided just as much fact to back it up as you have at this point in the thread. yes but unfortunetly... by being a douche, well.. u fail Pretty easy to post in a thread to bring down someones argument by using personal attacks and not leave any argument which you have to back up, eh? May I ask if this is a sign of your pre-school intellect or your lack of balls?
techzer0 IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2008.02.10 01:55:00 - [29] I had 8mil+ but took the easy way out of 0.0... I went bubble hunting. I can claim that I have never put a bounty on myself, but I can't say the same for corpmates who might say "MWHAHA you're gonna get suicided next time you fly in highsec!" and add to it. But whatever.. Mine is lower than my alts atm, really kinda funny since I'm the -10 one ------------ Originally by: Praxis1452 you win eve
Avaricia The Accursed	Posted - 2008.02.10 02:20:00 - [30] Edited by: Avaricia on 10/02/2008 02:21:15 17,980,000.00 one 5k, one 25k, one 50k, one 500k, four 100k, two 1 mil, one 15mil additions, iirc, none from myself. people with fake bounties are teh stoopid griefmatic - wolf & stabber piracy

Pride NL Slacker Industries	Posted - 2008.02.10 03:04:00 - [31] Yes, they are all fake. Dont let anyone convince you otherwise. As it is a waste of money, noone wastes it on that anymore. Arrive. Raise Hell. Leave.
techzer0 IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2008.02.10 03:13:00 - [32] Originally by: Pride NL Yes, they are all fake. Dont let anyone convince you otherwise. As it is a waste of money, noone wastes it on that anymore. Not true... I have 165,420 isk on my head!111ONE ------------ Originally by: Praxis1452 you win eve
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.10 10:13:00 - [33] Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: General Coochie Originally by: Bellum Eternus Originally by: General Coochie Most 50mill+ are, mine isn't, its just 1 mill though and my alt got 5k. No, not really. I've had my bounty up over 250m multiple times, and I've never put a bounty on myself. ATM mine is around 67m, not self placed. Just because you had one over 50m doesn't mean that most over 50m aren't fake. Just because you say that most 50mil + bounties are fake doesn't mean it actually is so. For instance if I hereby claim, out of the blue, that most 50 mil bounties aren't fake then I've provided just as much fact to back it up as you have at this point in the thread. Well after noticing that most bounties over 50mill in low sec are as follows: 13370000 666666 777777 12345678 and so on. I concluded that most are fake. And these are the ones that are just so obviously fake it hurts. Then of course we have the players thats been pod killed only to the next day have the same bounty again, which Ive seen on numerous occasions as well. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
El Verbatim	Posted - 2008.02.10 11:03:00 - [34] I guess a lot of them are fake but not all.... I would like to be able to see who put money on my head though, even more, I'd like it a lot if everyone else could see too who put money on your head. This would for sure reduce self-placed bounties.
Gneeznow Minmatar North Eastern Swat Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.02.10 11:40:00 - [35] Originally by: El Verbatim I guess a lot of them are fake but not all.... I would like to be able to see who put money on my head though, even more, I'd like it a lot if everyone else could see too who put money on your head. This would for sure reduce self-placed bounties. this is a good idea ^
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.10 12:11:00 - [36] Originally by: General Coochie Well after noticing that most bounties over 50mill in low sec are as follows: 13370000 666666 777777 12345678 I'd have to say that most of the 50+ mil bountys aren't as the three lower examples that you've shown. The first one doesn't indicates that a bounty are fake or not. Originally by: General Coochie Then of course we have the players thats been pod killed only to the next day have the same bounty again, which Ive seen on numerous occasions as well. Not that I pod outlaws often, but when I do this case is more common then the opposite (not having bounty next day). I've podded my fare share of people and not once have I seen what you are talking about. Originally by: General Coochie Yes I'm generalizing. But I've got some observations to build my statements on. I live in low-sec and I also base my statement on observations. The data you've presented are not verifiable and counterarguments can be made just as easily from the same data that you base your arguments on. You also claim that you can see if a bounty is fake or not based solely on the amount, something that I very much doubt. Can you provide any solid proof of your accusations?
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.10 12:43:00 - [37] No more proof then you. I guess you never heard of 1337 then? 1337 = Leet = Elite. And I never said I can see/prove if a bounty is fake solely on the amount. But if you really think that 133700 bounties are a coincidence, fine. Personally with use of common sense I would assume its fake. Off course we can totally disregard common sense. but Do we really wanna start a metaphysics discussion on EvEo forums? About what kind of proof and observations thats needed to assume/prove something. You are welcome to disagree with me, but I think you are wrong. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
Inertial The Python Cartel	Posted - 2008.02.10 14:06:00 - [38] Edited by: Inertial on 10/02/2008 14:06:44 I had a 5,000 isk bounty, that I placed on myself. Mostly to see if I actually was eligeble for a bounty. Yesterday however I podded a bunch of people (went from -1.3 to -5.6 ), and now my bounty is up to 55,000 isk! Makes me happy that I annoyed someone enough to put 50,000 on my head :P
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.10 15:32:00 - [39] Edited by: Cpt Fina on 10/02/2008 15:33:56 Originally by: General Coochie No more proof then you. Exactly my point. You are unable to provide proof of your accusation that's not based on your personal perception of the situation. Originally by: General Coochie I guess you never heard of 1337 then? 1337 = Leet = Elite. Right, and space is cramped with people with 1337 in bounty? You've failed to verify that most 50mil+ bountys are of this (or the other ones you've shown) type. Originally by: General Coochie And I never said I can see/prove if a bounty is fake solely on the amount. But if you really think that 133700 bounties are a coincidence, fine. Personally with use of common sense I would assume its fake. I never said that you said that you can prove a fake bounty based on the amount. But you have clearly said that you make the conclusion that most bounties are fake based (partly or solely) on the value (1337, 666 ect). This is your personal evaluation of bounties and apparently you think that's enough to make this accusation. Your argument also depend on that the majority of bounties over 50 mil are of the character that you've described. I've shown that, given the same numbers, one can come up with a totally different conclusion. What makes you think that your is the right one? Again, please provide some more facts to back up your accusation. It clearly doesn't hold in its current state. Originally by: General Coochie Off course we can totally disregard common sense. but Do we really wanna start a metaphysics discussion on EvEo forums? About what kind of proof and observations thats needed to assume/prove something. Common sense is highly subjective. Up to this point there is as much speaking for my "counter-statement" that there is for your original accusation. If you can't support your claim with adequate facts it bear no meaning. Originally by: General Coochie You are welcome to disagree with me, but I think you are wrong. Yes, you think that IÆm wrong but you are unwilling to prove it. Your accusations are based on personal experience and reasoning, which IÆve also provided for the counter-argument. Your original statement shouldÆve been something like ôit seems to me thatà.ö
Mik kyo D00M. Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.02.10 15:58:00 - [40] I've been in ninth place on the bounty list before, I have had three corp mates and two good friends on the list at the same time as me, none of them self imposed. However the bounty system is broken, and you tend to only get significant bounties from certain types of people, generally those who have alot of isk and yet no expierience with game mechanics... whether those be isk buyers, people who don't speak english, people who casually play the game, or lifetime carebears. If you kill enough people, statistically you will kill your fair share of these types, and so get a bounty.

Furion iV Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.02.10 17:12:00 - [41] Originally by: Cpt Fina Edited by: Cpt Fina on 10/02/2008 15:33:56 Originally by: General Coochie No more proof then you. Exactly my point. You are unable to provide proof of your accusation that's not based on your personal perception of the situation. Originally by: General Coochie I guess you never heard of 1337 then? 1337 = Leet = Elite. Right, and space is cramped with people with 1337 in bounty? You've failed to verify that most 50mil+ bountys are of this (or the other ones you've shown) type. Originally by: General Coochie And I never said I can see/prove if a bounty is fake solely on the amount. But if you really think that 133700 bounties are a coincidence, fine. Personally with use of common sense I would assume its fake. I never said that you said that you can prove a fake bounty based on the amount. But you have clearly said that you make the conclusion that most bounties are fake based (partly or solely) on the value (1337, 666 ect). This is your personal evaluation of bounties and apparently you think that's enough to make this accusation. Your argument also depend on that the majority of bounties over 50 mil are of the character that you've described. I've shown that, given the same numbers, one can come up with a totally different conclusion. What makes you think that your is the right one? Again, please provide some more facts to back up your accusation. It clearly doesn't hold in its current state. Originally by: General Coochie Off course we can totally disregard common sense. but Do we really wanna start a metaphysics discussion on EvEo forums? About what kind of proof and observations thats needed to assume/prove something. Common sense is highly subjective. Up to this point there is as much speaking for my "counter-statement" that there is for your original accusation. If you can't support your claim with adequate facts it bear no meaning. Originally by: General Coochie You are welcome to disagree with me, but I think you are wrong. Yes, you think that IÆm wrong but you are unwilling to prove it. Your accusations are based on personal experience and reasoning, which IÆve also provided for the counter-argument. Your original statement shouldÆve been something like ôit seems to me thatà.ö Got much spare time on your hands? I'm sure you've got something better to do than argue on EVEo forums.
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.10 17:42:00 - [42] As I said I rather don't go so much into detail over this as to bring metaphysical theories into the picture. common sense is subjective, yes it is. So can you prove to me that you woke up this morning? No you can't. The only thing I know for sure right now is that I'm sitting here right now typing this. Every other science based fact is acquired from common sense and the belief that time is linear and that events that are repeated often will repeat themselves again. I think everyone understands that no one can be 100% right or wrong on this matter (or any matter that isn't bound to fundamental laws as true and false and 1+1). I really can't be arsed to be so semantic over my statements that I wanna take time to express myself to make my point clear, safe and 100% scientific and political correct on a online space forum. I'm just curious; do you believe the vast majority of low sec haulers to be ppl/macros farming isk to sell or actually playing this game just to enjoy it? I wanna know if you as other ppl here are arguing cause you don't like the shortcuts some of us do assuming things, or if you are just arguing for the sake of it, or if faked bounties is just a soft spot for you for any reason. So I know for possible future diskussions. And finally, even if I made it sound like I was 1000% sure I was right. I don't think I am. I might be wrong. Of course its my opinion. I don't think ppl reading this thread ever thought otherwise. If you feel you need to make it clear to others readin that I might or is wrong simply because I cannot prove my statement I think you are underestimating most ppl's "common sense". The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
SonOfAGhost Minmatar Munitions and Tactical Assets Repository Zzz	Posted - 2008.02.10 17:51:00 - [43] I keep adjusting some friends' bounties until they're 8008135. Because everyone likes 8008135. Originally by: CCP Explorer This is intended, to not clutter the overview with information that new players don't need in their first few hours. (on stargates not being on overview)
Orar Ironfist Incarnation of Evil Nocturnal Legion	Posted - 2008.02.10 18:01:00 - [44] Originally by: Cpt Fina Stuff Lol looks like weve found someone with a fake bounty Pirate for Life(no matter my sec)
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.10 18:42:00 - [45] Originally by: Furion iV Got much spare time on your hands? I'm sure you've got something better to do than argue on EVEo forums. If you got something to add to the discussion then please do so. Otherwise let people discuss whatever they like, for whatever the time they like. Originally by: General Coochie common sense is subjective, yes it is. So can you prove to me that you woke up this morning? No you can't. The only thing I know for sure right now is that I'm sitting here right now typing this. Every other science based fact is acquired from common sense and the belief that time is linear and that events that are repeated often will repeat themselves again. And there's something called burden of proof. I hope you don't fail to see how important it is to be able to back up calims you make in a discussion with sound arguments/facts, especially whe it's an accusation. And I really hope, for your own sake, that you don't believe that "it's common sense" is enough to support your argument. Originally by: General Coochie I think everyone understands that no one can be 100% right or wrong on this matter (or any matter that isn't bound to fundamental laws as true and false and 1+1). I really can't be arsed to be so semantic over my statements that I wanna take time to express myself to make my point clear, safe and 100% scientific and political correct on a online space forum. When you make a statement you should be able to atleast provide some basic arguments to back it up. I've trampled the arguments that you've provided this far. I'm not saying that you're wrong, I'm merely asking how you can be so certain of this that you make sauch of a statement. Originally by: General Coochie I'm just curious; do you believe the vast majority of low sec haulers to be ppl/macros farming isk to sell or actually playing this game just to enjoy it? I wanna know if you as other ppl here are arguing cause you don't like the shortcuts some of us do assuming things, or if you are just arguing for the sake of it, or if faked bounties is just a soft spot for you for any reason. So I know for possible future diskussions. Irrelevant. The reason why I take the time to question your argument isn't in any way relevant to if it's sound or not. If you want to discuss this with me then you can ask me after we've setteled this, ehrn you've verified your initial claim. Originally by: General Coochie And finally, even if I made it sound like I was 1000% sure I was right. I don't think I am. I might be wrong. Of course its my opinion. I don't think ppl reading this thread ever thought otherwise. If you feel you need to make it clear to others readin that I might or is wrong simply because I cannot prove my statement I think you are underestimating most ppl's "common sense". So you are saying that you can't back it up? So essentially: You made an accusation that you can't in any way back up with a strong argument and you think it's unfair when I ask you to provide some arguments from you to back it up? Originally by: Orar Ironfist Lol looks like weve found someone with a fake bounty Looks like they let homosexual communists post on this forum too. Please provide proof of me having a fake bounty or edit it out from your post. Then I'll do the same with the above sentence.
T'Renn Repo Industries R.E.P.O.	Posted - 2008.02.10 19:31:00 - [46] My bounty is real, but I haven't the foggiest where it came from. I never got much of a bounty when I was camping gates 23/7, but I guess I peeved someone off on a contract recently. Meh. Also, I hightly doubt Fina would ever self-bounty. There's no need. It takes skill to make people angry enough at you that they'll put a bounty on your head, and Fina has skill to spare. Learn a little about the people you smack in the forums next time. --
Ariel Dawn Beets and Gravy Syndicate	Posted - 2008.02.10 19:33:00 - [47] Originally by: Mik kyo However the bounty system is broken, and you tend to only get significant bounties from certain types of people, generally those who have alot of isk and yet no expierience with game mechanics... whether those be isk buyers, people who don't speak english, people who casually play the game, or lifetime carebears. Exactly true; it isn't very hard to figure out who puts the bounty on your head since those that do so usually have suffered some major loss to them and let you know it. Example (Faction-fitted Manticore) Quote: 2007.11.27 05:23 Thanks for giving me the chance to ransome my ship you ***** jerk off bastard. Oh well you save me money I just cancelled the account and wrote a complaint about you. *** worthless *****. The same day someone puts 200m on my head. A week later I catch a Navy Caracal mining in low-sec (seriously) and another huge sum appears. Carebears or ISK-buying newbies flying nice stuff are the best targets to go after if you want to get some silly bounties.
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.10 19:36:00 - [48] I'm not accusing anyone in particular so I really don't think I need to be fair or moral in my assumptions and statements. Yes I think common sense is enough when we are talking about the situation in a fictional world. Its not like the scientific community will disregard my whole publication for not bringing proper and well documented facts for my theories. And you haven't trampled my arguements so far. If most ppl with a higher bounty in fact have fake bounty and a high enough % of them got "funny" looking bountys which are directly related to the fact that they are fake, you haven't disapproved anything. Theres nothing saying that the burden of proof is on me in this scenario except you. Because what is to be proved isn't some law, or fundamental theory like why does things drop to the ground. This subject is more of the type is the pen blue or is the pen not blue, and no one actually has seen the color. However most pens of the brand tend to be blue in my opinion and not in yours. I think both of us has the burden of proof on us. It might be irrelevant for the discussion for you to reveal your motives. But its of importance to me. Sometimes I like having a good discussion but other days I can't be arsed with it. If you start picking my posts apart in the future I wanna know whether it is of importance to bring clarity to the subject or whether its just to have a discussion. If I wanna have a discussion then I might go ahead. But if not and its a subject I really don't care much about (like this one) I could just leave it alone knowing you actually don't care about the subject either. Also the only way to settle this I think is to. * Sit down in a system for couple of weeks and count number of ppl with "funny" bounties, which is indeed hard as its subjective. I should do it, as its my ability to see fake bounties that is questioned. * Do an anonymous survey where ppl with bounties higher then 50mill gets to answer if their bounties are fake or not. * Compare amount of fake bounties from survey to my "observed" ones. I rather run a marathon tbh. If we can however settle for our personal undocumented observations on the matter and just conclude that. You believe most bounties above 50m are real (if you actually think this) I don't believe most bounties above 50m are real. And since you take my words so precise, I guess I once again have to say. Its MY opinion and I really think anyone reading my first posts wouldn't think otherwise. I'm assuming (again) now and guessing that most ppl don't take my words as if I actually knew exactly how the situation in eve is. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
Stephannus Calimben mUfFiN fAcToRy Sex Panthers	Posted - 2008.02.10 19:48:00 - [49] Originally by: Mik kyo I've been in ninth place on the bounty list before, I have had three corp mates and two good friends on the list at the same time as me, none of them self imposed. However the bounty system is broken, and you tend to only get significant bounties from certain types of people, generally those who have alot of isk and yet no expierience with game mechanics... whether those be isk buyers, people who don't speak english, people who casually play the game, or lifetime carebears. If you kill enough people, statistically you will kill your fair share of these types, and so get a bounty. i think this guy hit it square on the head. i pirated in drakes/ravens for months and months and only accrued a 5m bounty. when i took to smartbombing, someone put a 40m bounty on me once (that i podded myself for when i had to move a jumpclone anyways), and recently have accrued a 58m bounty that i'm too lazy to pod myself over. i think to get bounties you have to a) be the killing blow b) be the only one on the killmail and c) kill a carebear (doesnt think about podding self for bounty) who has way too much money and lost alot to you the guy who put the bulk of the 58m on me i'm pretty sure is the guy whose helios i smartbombed with around a bill in datacores in the hold. i was the only guy on the mail, i got his pod, and cost him alot of money. gunna see how big it can get now. its pretty hard to lose a pod in lowsec, and i'm not particularily worried about 60m anyways. gunna test the idea that bigger bounties accrue more bounties faster instead
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.10 20:26:00 - [50] Originally by: General Coochie I'm not accusing anyone in particular so I really don't think I need to be fair or moral in my assumptions and statements. Yes I think common sense is enough when we are talking about the situation in a fictional world. Its not like the scientific community will disregard my whole publication for not bringing proper and well documented facts for my theories. You're not accusing anyone in particular but it's an accusation directed towards people with 50+ mil bountys nonetheless. Fact still is that you made an accusation with nothing to back it up with. Common sense isn't a good argument. What if I hereby claim that common sense will tell you the direct opposite of what you claim it does. What makes "your common sense" more trustworthy than mine? Originally by: General Coochie And you haven't trampled my arguements so far. The very few facts you've provided are very uncertain and can just as easily be used in a counter-argument. Which arguments have you provided that still hold tight? Originally by: General Coochie If most ppl with a higher bounty in fact have fake bounty and a high enough % of them got "funny" looking bountys which are directly related to the fact that they are fake, you haven't disapproved anything. If?.... if? Seem that you were pretty certain earlier in this thread. Yes, IF the majority of the higher bounties are fake (which you are yet to prove) and a high percentage of them have funny looking values (which are yet to prove) your argument hold tight. What does this mean? If the X is X my statement of X being X is true. well, yeah obviously. Originally by: General Coochie Theres nothing saying that the burden of proof is on me in this scenario except you. Because what is to be proved isn't some law, or fundamental theory like why does things drop to the ground. This subject is more of the type is the pen blue or is the pen not blue, and no one actually has seen the color. However most pens of the brand tend to be blue in my opinion and not in yours. No, this is you saying that most high bounties are faked and are unable to back it up. It'd be ok with you if I made a thread saying "The Bastards" use log-off tactics, put fake bouties on themselves and makes fun of deceased Eve-players? You would be a-ok with that even if I weren't able to back it up? Originally by: General Coochie I think both of us has the burden of proof on us. Burden of proof? How do I prove a question? Please point out any argument that youÆd like me to back up. Originally by: General Coochie It might be irrelevant for the discussion for you to reveal your motives. But its of importance to me. Sometimes I like having a good discussion but other days I can't be arsed with it. If you start picking my posts apart in the future I wanna know whether it is of importance to bring clarity to the subject or whether its just to have a discussion. If I wanna have a discussion then I might go ahead. But if not and its a subject I really don't care much about (like this one) I could just leave it alone knowing you actually don't care about the subject either. Whether your argumentation-method is sound or not has nothing to do with my motives of questioning it. The thing you should concentrate on is that I have questioned it and now itÆs time to show that your method is tight.

Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.10 20:26:00 - [51] Edited by: Cpt Fina on 10/02/2008 20:28:30 Originally by: General Coochie Also the only way to settle this I think is to. * Sit down in a system for couple of weeks and count number of ppl with "funny" bounties, which is indeed hard as its subjective. I should do it, as its my ability to see fake bounties that is questioned. * Do an anonymous survey where ppl with bounties higher then 50mill gets to answer if their bounties are fake or not. * Compare amount of fake bounties from survey to my "observed" ones. By this you mean that you no longer are certain that the majority of the 50+ mil bounties are fake? Are you saying that this is the only way to prove it and that you havenÆt done it yourself? Then how can you know that itÆs true? Maybe itÆs time to reconsider your initial accusation? Originally by: General Coochie You believe most bounties above 50m are real (if you actually think this) Please provide a link or quote me saying that I believe that most bounties over 50 million are authentic. IÆm worried about your ability to continue this discussion if you donÆt even get what weÆre discussing. Originally by: General Coochie And since you take my words so precise, I guess I once again have to say. Its MY opinion and I really think anyone reading my first posts wouldn't think otherwise. I'm assuming (again) now and guessing that most ppl don't take my words as if I actually knew exactly how the situation i ThatÆs why you didnÆt say ôI think thatö, ôto me it seems thatö, I get the impression thatö, ôI think itÆs apparent thatö, ôa lot of things point in the direction ofö or ôI suspect thatö? Again, youÆve written a judgmental statement, not a point of view, post. If you say that it is a post of your personal opinion/believe and not a statement then I suggest that you consider editing your initial post. edit: Same to you renn
Furion iV Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.02.10 21:11:00 - [52] Edited by: Furion iV on 10/02/2008 21:14:54 I will bring to this arguement common sense. If someone has a bounty that is clearly commonly used numerical slang, then by all means it is assumed that it is fake. This is not always the case, but probabilty is in the favor of it being fake. Thus, all bounty's that contain said numerical slang can be identified as fake and arguing otherwise is non-sensical. Proven.
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.10 21:20:00 - [53] Originally by: Furion iV Edited by: Furion iV on 10/02/2008 21:14:54 I will bring to this arguement common sense. If someone has a bounty that is clearly commonly used numerical slang, then by all means it is assumed that it is fake. This is not always the case, but probabilty is in the favor of it being fake. Thus, all bounty's that contain said numerical slang can be identified as fake and arguing otherwise is non-sensical. Proven. That's not the essence of our discussion. And not once have I stated that a funny bounty-value bear no relevance of the chance of it being fake.
Furion iV Minmatar Brutor tribe	Posted - 2008.02.10 21:31:00 - [54] Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Furion iV Edited by: Furion iV on 10/02/2008 21:14:54 I will bring to this arguement common sense. If someone has a bounty that is clearly commonly used numerical slang, then by all means it is assumed that it is fake. This is not always the case, but probabilty is in the favor of it being fake. Thus, all bounty's that contain said numerical slang can be identified as fake and arguing otherwise is non-sensical. Proven. That's not the essence of our discussion. And not once have I stated that a funny bounty-value bear no relevance of the chance of it being fake. Yet you are arguing that that something requires proof for it to be deemed fake. I deem probabilty to be enough proof to state that they are in the majority fake. Although there are other variables to be taken into account, this one is the most influential. It is like stating that people who are wearing the tools of a plumber, is infact an electrician. Chances are they could be, but it will be presumed that they are a plumber.
Peter Powers Master Miners	Posted - 2008.02.10 21:40:00 - [55] to get bounty you have to gank newbs!!!! experienced players dont use that feature that often, knowing as pirate you can simply "collect" your own bounty with an alt. I love CCP Morpheus<3 xXx CCP Morpheus xXx <3
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.10 21:41:00 - [56] Originally by: Furion iV Yet you are arguing that that something requires proof for it to be deemed fake. I'm requesting a poster to provide sound arguments to back up an accusation. Originally by: Furion iV I deem probabilty to be enough proof to state that they are in the majority fake. Although there are other variables to be taken into account, this one is the most influential. It is like stating that people who are wearing the tools of a plumber, is infact an electrician. Chances are they could be, but it will be presumed that they are a plumber. Good for you. But I'm not discussing this with you atm. If you still feel that you want to discuss this with me after coochie and I are done then feel free to say so and I'll consider it.
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.10 22:24:00 - [57] Edited by: General Coochie on 10/02/2008 22:33:57 Yes you are right, my common sense isn't worth more then yours, nor isn't it the "right one". We all have different ways of looking at things. If I think something is the way it is for a certain reason concluded from my common sense and you don't we are disagreeing. You are welcome to disagree with me. Quote: Which arguments have you provided that still hold tight? My personal observations of ppl that got new bounties in few hours and rate of "funny" bounties, but you don't believe my word of my observations or have different observations. The only way of settling whether I was actually sound in my accusation is by doing a scientific study on the matter that is well documented. You are welcome to, I won't do that myself, if you wanna go so far to prove that my initial statement was far from the truth you are welcome to. And if you do I will admit to being wrong. Theres not a single science in history that hasn't got discussions for and against whatever theory in focus. Its actually what makes science sound and productive. Not that I would call our subject here very sound or productive science even. Quote: Please point out any argument that youÆd like me to back up. Quote: I'd have to say that most of the 50+ mil bountys aren't as the three lower examples that you've shown. Also one could assume that the funny bounties aren't all faked bounties, as some bounties that are faked probably look like any other bounty. Of course some funny looking bounties are bound to be real as well. My personal observations and common sense is enough for me to conclude that most bounties in EvE above 50mill are fake. It might not be enough proof for you but it is for me. I consider myself to be open minded, if science tomorrow concluded that the gravitation law of physics doesn't apply once every 100 years for 2 seconds and theres some proof for it and the science community would embrace that theory so would I even if its fundamental to most ppl. Same thing here, someone could prove me wrong and I would rethink my statement and investigate how my conclusions could have gotten wrong hence the IF. And no I won't do a survey, nor will I change my initial statement. Nor do I have an obligation to prove that my method is "tight". I'm free to be judgmental. And I can be judgmental about what ever I like. I personally draw a line somewhere between slinging dirt on/accusing ppl with high fake bounties and doing it against a corp saying they make fun of deceased ppl. If you don't draw such a line sure go ahead make such a post. It will ruin your eve-o identity not our corps. Why? There is a distinct moral difference but also for some reason ppl are more inclined to believe that x amount of bounties are fake and wouldn't believe a post about our corp doing mentioned stuff. The only ones that should feel bad about it are the ones having a fake bounty. Everyone else knows I'm wrong in their case. This is a statement on a forum for an online role playing game. Not a science article. I understand what you are saying, but it doesn't matter how well you argue for your sake, I won't treat the eve forums the way you think they should be treated. Now go watch my newly releazed Caracal and Vigil PvP video. Linky is in my sig. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
techzer0 IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2008.02.10 22:28:00 - [58] Originally by: SonOfAGhost I keep adjusting some friends' bounties until they're 8008135. Because everyone likes 8008135. Yeah... i've never done that, but I've had it done to me. Although every time the test server uploads I drain the corp funds and place a few bil on my CEO's head... just for the heck of it... haven't snagged his pod after doing it yet, but the smartbombs are being primed ------------ Originally by: Praxis1452 you win eve
Ard UnjiiGo The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.10 22:51:00 - [59] I'd like to see a system installed, as mentioned above, where you could see who placed the bounty. Be a great way to learn who a lot of folks alts are.
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.10 23:27:00 - [60] Edited by: Cpt Fina on 10/02/2008 23:32:31 Originally by: General Coochie Same thing here, someone could prove me wrong and I would rethink my statement and investigate how my conclusions could have gotten wrong hence the IF. The initial post was constructed as a state of fact. NOT a statement of your personal opinion. If you say that this was your intent, then I suggest you edit your post because it doesnÆt give the impression that it was your personal conclusion based on your personal observations. Originally by: General Coochie And no I won't do a survey, nor will I change my initial statement. Nor do I have an obligation to prove that my method is "tight". I'm free to be judgmental. And I can be judgmental about what ever I like. Then one should not engage in any discussion with you since you obviously donÆt care about basic rules of argumentation. Remind me that if I forget this discussion and that it was you I spoke with, to ôStop, Fina! Reason and logic wonÆt bear any weight in this discussion because I think that I donÆt have any obligations to make sound arguments for my calimsö. Originally by: General Coochie I personally draw a line somewhere between slinging dirt on/accusing ppl with high fake bounties and doing it against a corp saying they make fun of deceased ppl. If you don't draw such a line sure go ahead make such a post. Did you fail to realize that this was an example drawn to its extreme or did you simply ignore it making it sound like IÆm actually considering it to devalue the argument? The example has the same principles as your actions: Accusations without obligation to back it up, but drawn to the extreme. You seem to think that method is fine. Which would mean that I too can make accusations (loggoffski, fake bounty and dreadful jokes) about you without having to back it up (E.g. ôNor do I have an obligation to prove that my method is "tight". I'm free to be judgmental. And I can be judgmental about what ever I like.ö), right? ItÆs hard to discuss with you when you have a hard time with keeping up in the discussion. Originally by: General Coochie This is a statement on a forum for an online role playing game. Not a science article. I understand what you are saying, but it doesn't matter how well you argue for your sake, I won't treat the eve forums the way you think they should be treated. The channel of a discussion doesnÆt change the fundamental rules one got to follow to keep it rational.

Yo Mommy Gallente	Posted - 2008.02.11 01:30:00 - [61] Mine is real. Tho not very impressive... But I'd rather have a small real one than a large fake one.
Praxis1452 The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.11 02:23:00 - [62] I got 10 million. I didn't put it on there hehe. I got an afk maelstrom at the gate and ziro'faldan and I pushed it 150km off the gate. He did most of it actually, I was just sitting afk at the gate probably doing something else and he asked if I wanted in. It was like a 2 month old noob and put 10 million bounties on both of us. I hope he didn't even insure it. I could've actually made some isk if I got somebody in my corp to pod me and split it, cause atm I've got +3's in and it's not worth it. Still, I like the wanted sign. I could have just podded myself and put 5k isk on for that wanted sign but it just felt wrong. ôHe who must expend his life to prolong life cannot enjoy it, and he who is still seeking for his life does not have it and can as little enjoy it.ö

Chribba Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire	Posted - 2008.02.11 09:07:00 - [63] Why can't us + people get donations on our heads, so if we happen to get podded by you evil ones we ourself get the donations That might make it worth dying for? lol Secure 3rd party service ■ Do you Veldspar?

General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.11 10:32:00 - [64] Edited by: General Coochie on 11/02/2008 10:34:58 If you disregard common sense and ppls personal observations as facts, you can disregard most science we have today as it all builds on common sense and the assumption that time is linear and that things that happened many times before will happen again. Science in general is founded on the assumption that things that happen often, will happen again. In the same way as you expect a pen to drop to the floor when you let it go from your hand above the floor, I can expect ppl to get new bounties shortly after being podded, having a high rate of funny looking bounties. The difference is the number of observations made. I might not have done enough observations to be scientifically correct to state what I stated. Note however that the only thing that makes my statement/argument possibly invalid is that I haven't done enough observations. So how many observations should I make? This is up to the scientific community to decide. Since our scientific community at the time consists of two ppl its kinda hard making progress. If all assumptions and statements needed to have a scientific validity and not be based on common sense and personal observations we wouldn't say much at all. Did you know that Einsteins famous theory had no "proof" (some additional years later it was proven not to be 100% accurate) until some 10-20 years later? Einstein simply "thought" out his theory. For him that was common sense. Still his theory got a huge impact on science. What if Einstein expressed him self in terms of, I think that maybe matter can't move faster then the speed of light, cause maybe the time unit isn't fixed. Do you think ppl would taken him seriously? A scientist needs to be passionate about his theories to get the scientific community's eyes on them. This is where your expectations grow to high, you expect me to have the same amount of well documented data as most science. This simply won't happen when we are talking about a MMORPG game. Now you have provided data that shows that my statement might be wrong. Fine. I can change my statement/theory to: Most bounties above 50m are fake, except the top 10(?) bounties in eve. This is called adding an ad hoc solution to my theory. In some cases these are the ones that makes science evolve. However to many ad hoc solutions degenerate the fundamental theory. And if to many a scientist can not but to reject his original theory. Yeah my theory is still: Most bounties over 50mill are fake. I still don't think anyone to actually believe I'm a master mind and take my first post statement as a law that cannot be broken. By common sense everyone reading that should understand its my theory. I don't have to go about making that clear to everyone. I and everyone else see things, assume things and conclude things without scientific data and express ourselves in terms of "He is always late for work", "they always play this song on the club" "At 12 o clock the church bell will ring" in every day life. In fact that clock might not ring at 12 o clock cause Quasimodo got sick. So by your way of viewing everyday talk and expressions one should say. "The church clock might ring at 12 o clock because it does most days however it might if something happened to Quasimodo". I don't in every day life and I shouldn't have to on a forum about an online game either. For me a forum is a place where ppl can talk about whatever and express themselves however they like not a scientific community where we must express ourselves scientifically correct. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.11 11:02:00 - [65] Edited by: General Coochie on 11/02/2008 11:03:33 Quote: Did you fail to realize that this was an example drawn to its extreme or did you simply ignore it making it sound like IÆm actually considering it to devalue the argument? The example has the same principles as your actions: Accusations without obligation to back it up, but drawn to the extreme. You seem to think that method is fine. Which would mean that I too can make accusations (loggoffski, fake bounty and dreadful jokes) about you without having to back it up (E.g. ôNor do I have an obligation to prove that my method is "tight". I'm free to be judgmental. And I can be judgmental about what ever I like.ö), right? I am free to be judgmental about whatever I like. However my morals tell me what is ok and not. You can't take a moral argument and take it to the extreme to prove something. Because morals are a personal value between extremes. I draw the line where I said I did. Also it seems its only bellum so far that might have taken it a bit offending and maybe you. No one else seems to have reacted to it, so I think I drawn the line perfectly fine. I can live with upsetting a few sensitive egos. If you think its ok to draw a moral to its extreme to prove something, make such a post. But you wont nor will I. Why? Because there is a significant moral difference in making such a post and making the statement I did. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
Grim Starwind hirr Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2008.02.11 11:09:00 - [66] Edited by: Grim Starwind on 11/02/2008 11:15:06 I think I just wet myself at the walls of text on page 2 of this thread.. Anyway, I was a pirate for a long time and I recall getting a 5k bounty once which seemed random and pointless. Apart from that no one has ever given me a bounty and I would honestly wonder why anyone ever WOULD spend alot of money on handing out a bounty. Because the person dropping the bounty will never know when the other person dies.. So who cares. They need to do something amazing with the bounty system to make it:- a) worth while to hunt people with bounties b) some form of contract to take out a hit c) let the bounty placers know that their bounty has actually been killed in their name Alot more but those are main points.. it would be good if say I put a bounty on someone, then someone accepts that bounty.. and through that they can contact agents (which they've had to do missions for to capture smaller bounties first being NPC's then being young players with smaller bounties in close range of the agents system) and the agents then give them information on details such as how often they log on, when they log on roughly, what system they spend most time in, or are currently in. That way you could setup a camp or something to kill them.. say using a team mate to watch them or even your own alt to sit in the system and watch their actions. then you swoop in and kill them. THEN, the person who placed the bounty gets a message "Grim Starwind has carried out your bounty placement on 'x' and has collected the payment." BING!! Grim Starwinds Bounty points +100! ... - which I now use to purchase certain goods from the bounty catalogue at the Bounty Guilds office in the station (Like the Loyalty Points for current agents). Erm, yeah. EDIT: To add - This would make it more fun for myself, I'd actually log on to chase a bounty or even sit for a while watching from a station etc about a bounty in the system to see when he logs on myself etc. maybe even setup a fake contract for them to collect an item then when they leave the station PEW PEW they die. You know, LOADS of stuff. Pirates might think "oh no, don't do that.. then people will actually know where I am and come looking for me." Yeah well that's a good thing, if I do recall as a pirate i was sometimes bored that people just hid in stations lol, also it might give you an even bigger E-peen to know you do have a legit bounty on your head and that no one has managed to take it regardless of how many pro bounty hunters there may be. It would also make it more worth while for people to PLACE those bounties to know that "justice" will be served.. so to speak :)
Lil'Red Ridin'Hood Snake Assault	Posted - 2008.02.11 11:29:00 - [67] The day before yesterday, my corp mate noticed a 1mil bounty on my head. Got no idea who put it there, I haven't even recently blown up anyone noobish enough to place a bounty. I'd love to know who placed it, though. I don't even consider myself a pirate but now I'm looking like one. Funny stuff.
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.11 19:25:00 - [68] Originally by: General Coochie Edited by: General Coochie on 11/02/2008 10:38:50 If you disregard common sense and ppls personal observations as facts, you can disregard most science we have today as it all builds on common sense and the assumption that time is linear and that things that happened many times before will happen again. Science in general is founded on the assumption that things that happen often, will happen again. In the same way as you expect a pen to drop to the floor when you let it go from your hand above the floor, I can expect ppl to get new bounties shortly after being podded, having a high rate of funny looking bounties. The difference is the number of observations made. I might not have done enough observations to be scientifically correct to state what I stated. Note however that the only thing that makes my statement/argument possibly invalid is that I haven't done enough observations. So how many observations should I make? This is up to the scientific community to decide. Since our scientific community at the time consists of two ppl its kinda hard making progress. To prove a theory one must prvide proof. You can't simply say "According to my experience X is Y, but I won't provide any proof of this". I can't be arsed to discuss this further with you since you simply disregard the very basic rules of a discussion. There simply is no point of any attempt of a serious debate when you clearly don't understand the importance of backing up claims with sound arguments. Discussing with you is to reason with a three year old. It seems that if you would have it your way the discussions on eve-o would come down to a "is not! is too! is not!"-fest. Fact is: You have stated something as a state of fact not as a theory or a expression of your opinion. If you now claim that this was your theory then your initial statement are built wrong and should be edited. You can decide if you want the initial claim to be a statement of fact (which then would require sound arguments to back up) or a theory (in which case you need to change the structure of the sentence).
Vrikshaka Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.11 19:51:00 - [69] Originally by: Gneeznow Originally by: El Verbatim I guess a lot of them are fake but not all.... I would like to be able to see who put money on my head though, even more, I'd like it a lot if everyone else could see too who put money on your head. This would for sure reduce self-placed bounties. this is a good idea ^ /signed. Simple and effective. I wouldn't mind if CCP got creative and took the bounty system way further than that, but it would definitely be a good beginning.
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.11 20:57:00 - [70] Edited by: General Coochie on 11/02/2008 21:01:14 Edited by: General Coochie on 11/02/2008 20:58:00 Plz define what proof is needed. No natural science or theory can EVER be proved unless its a mathematical one (and even some mathematical theories cannot be proven). It can just be regarded as a high probability not to be wrong. You don't seem to understand basic scientific procedure and Philosophy of science and what science really is. All proof in natural science is based on personal experiences (repeated observations under similar conditions) so how can you disregard mine? That is why you don't understand what I'm talking about. I'm sorry but it isn't my ability to discuss thats the problem, its your lack of knowledge about how science work. You seem to think that science is something fundamental and that a theory actually can be proven? A theory is accepted once it has been tested for a long time because common sense tells us the theory is of use to us. A theory doesn't have to be right either, as long as it serves science and humanity in a good way in can be accepted but NEVER regarded as the fundamental truth. However a scientist can still express what he believes in terms of. "Matter cannot travel faster then light" He doesn't have to every time make clear that you never can be right in science and or prove something. Everyone in the scientific community knows that it works this way. You totally disregard everything I said about my proof. You also haven't addressed my point about this being a public forum where language is closer to everyday chat and not scientific correct statements. Are you actually saying in every day life when someone asks about the train time "The train arrives at 7 because it usually does, however it might not arrive for various reasons its just my theory". No you don't you say "The train arrives at 7". and the person asking doesn't ask for proof.. In the very same way I declare my statement. You might consider eve forums to be some scientific network of "truth" but I think you are not among the majority if you do. And you might give up your crusade for proof now but fact is: You haven't proved or disproved anything. My statement stands and as far as I know I'm right. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)

VicturusTeSaluto Metafarmers	Posted - 2008.02.11 21:48:00 - [71] No, they are not all fake. People add to my bounty all the time. I was up to 141 mil before I lost a pod due to lag. Already back up to 5 mil.
Dimitry Kalashnikov The Black Fleet	Posted - 2008.02.11 23:15:00 - [72] Ok this has gotten to be one of the dumbest threads ever. #1 - You can't say that ALL bounties are fake or real because there are ALWAYS exceptions to every rule. #2 - Who gives a crap if the bounty is real or not. Theres money on his head, so POD HIM. 3# - Trying to use intelligent logic to prove a stupid point that cannot be proven or disproven creates a paradox which rips open the fabric of the spacetime continuum which will suck in not only you and all your loved ones, but your pet gerbil too... yeah, I went there. ============================================== The thousand ships of the Black Fleet Corporation descent upon you! Our Void L will blot out the sun!
Dimitry Kalashnikov The Black Fleet	Posted - 2008.02.13 06:33:00 - [73] Originally by: Dimitry Kalashnikov I've found that the more "random" they look the faker they are. For example: 1,665,932 Isk bounty: FAKE 1,000,000 Isk bounty: REAL Now of course this isn't written in stone, its just my observation. Whoever just bountied me with 1,665,932 isk, VEEEEERY funny. -_- ============================================== The thousand ships of the Black Fleet Corporation descent upon you! Our Void L will blot out the sun!
Siriyana Astrum Contract Services Group	Posted - 2008.02.13 06:48:00 - [74] One day I logged in and one of my corpmates said "Oh, look, ten million reasons why I should kill you today..." I was like "Huh?" and then they said someone put 10m on my head. I laughed, but whatever. A month later it was 18m, then 20m, then 21 something... I have no idea who keeps putting money on my head but I thank you. Hopefully by the time I retire it'll be in the hundreds of billions or something. I consider it a retirement plan. ----- CEO, Astrum Contract Services Group
Forando Interstellar Cowards	Posted - 2008.02.13 11:34:00 - [75] Oi! Oi! Girls! Please don't fight. Can't we all just get along, on the forum? And if you have to fight, do so with pillows and bras! (these forums kinda lack a way to ignore users, it could spare one a lot of pointless scrolling, if you ask me!) Bounties! Yeah, I laugh at them. Recently my crossed paths with a guy with 1337 isk on his head, I rushed to a station with a bounty office to add 1 isk to that. I found out he was so carebear that it wouldn't accept my noble donation. Now, how leet is that? Nah, I think a solution as pay-per-corpse is much more effective! Enjoy, and fly safe..
Yesh The Black Rabbits The Gurlstas Associates	Posted - 2008.02.13 11:41:00 - [76] Edited by: Yesh on 13/02/2008 11:47:33 I had a measly 650k bounty for ages, then a relative noob put a 25mil bounty on me for killing a T1 fitted myrmidon (I know this because I got a love and kisses evemail from the victim ). I know 25 mil isn't ground breaking, but every so often someone gets upset enough to place a big bounty and eventually they all add up to a huge bounty if you can avoid getting podded (pretty easy to do in low sec). At present the bounty system is all about venting anger. There should be penalties related to bounties to make them worth placing such as having to pay 2% of your bounty to dock in a station or use a star gate or something like that. As to fake bounties, I rekon the ones that show 666666 are self inflicted by people who like others to think they are the devil. I always add a few random numbers to those if I see them to mess it up. Does that turn it in to a genuine bounty tho?
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.13 13:41:00 - [77] Originally by: Forando Edited by: Forando on 13/02/2008 11:35:26 Oi! Oi! Girls! Please don't fight. Can't we all just get along, on the forum? And if you have to fight, do so with pillows and bras! (these forums kinda lack a way to ignore users, it could spare one a lot of pointless scrolling, if you ask me!) Sorry for cluttering up the thread. Felt I needed to defend myself. It was no fight just a discussion, well atleast until Fina resorted to personal attacks. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
eve warrior Minmatar Filthy Scum	Posted - 2008.02.13 17:35:00 - [78] Originally by: Corstaad Just wondering I've pirated for abit and got nothing. I thought before some patch you got a auto bounty for poding but I might be wrong. I have always found that a little smack with the kill gets bountys . I personaly have never had more than 13mill at a time but we have had corp mates with 100 to 250mill bountys place on them. Free isk is always great. eve warrior
Taedrin Gallente Royal Hiigaran Navy	Posted - 2008.02.13 17:49:00 - [79] I would like to think that Verone's bounty isn't fake, but I have no idea.
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.13 21:52:00 - [80] Edited by: Cpt Fina on 13/02/2008 21:53:13 Originally by: General Coochie Originally by: Forando Edited by: Forando on 13/02/2008 11:35:26 Oi! Oi! Girls! Please don't fight. Can't we all just get along, on the forum? And if you have to fight, do so with pillows and bras! (these forums kinda lack a way to ignore users, it could spare one a lot of pointless scrolling, if you ask me!) Sorry fo r cluttering up the thread. Felt I needed to defend myself. It was no fight just a discussion, well atleast until Fina resorted to personal attacks. And I felt I needed to make you verify your (baseless) accusation, well atlest till I realized that you actually believe the **** you were posting. For your own sake, please don't discuss anything of any importance IRL, you'd get laughed at.

Kell Braugh Caldari	Posted - 2008.02.13 22:21:00 - [81] Edited by: Kell Braugh on 13/02/2008 22:24:16 (To avoid getting someone's panties all in a bunch) its my opinion that its about a 70/30 split of fake/real. of the fake ones i think its prolly 50/50 of bounties put on by a corp mate just for kicks and bounties put on by the person's alt for pseudo-epeen. All and all though, its just the real ones you gotta watch out for, and you usually don't know if its real or fake till the fight is over and which side of the KM you are on. Then you'll know. I know i've had a bounty once but found out it came from a friend who was just playing around (was like 50k--almost nothing) I've claimed bounties twice, one for about 25mil that was paid to me [prolly real] and one 250mil that was from a single npc-corp player a little over 2 months old [prolly fake, and also prolly buying iskies] (on a sidenote he actually asked to split it with me after i podded him while smartbombing some barges in highsec ) EFT screen shots are NOT an accurate example of a ship's abilities.
techzer0 IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2008.02.13 22:24:00 - [82] Originally by: Dimitry Kalashnikov Originally by: Dimitry Kalashnikov I've found that the more "random" they look the faker they are. For example: 1,665,932 Isk bounty: FAKE 1,000,000 Isk bounty: REAL Now of course this isn't written in stone, its just my observation. Whoever just bountied me with 1,665,932 isk, VEEEEERY funny. -_- Owned. I swear mine is 165,420... dunno who trimmed the change off of their wallet ------------ Originally by: Praxis1452 you win eve
Naridos Caldari IDLE GUNS	Posted - 2008.02.13 22:39:00 - [83] My original bounty when i first got one was 1,487,677.51 ISK. Someone must have dumped their whole wallet in on my bounty and then when someone placed a second bounty on my head they were nice enough to even out the numbers for some reason... as if it mattered Now its up to 20.5 mil. Quote: You Know you play too much Eve when you get into a car crash and you run away as fast as you can so that you don't get podded.
Saint Schala Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2008.02.13 22:43:00 - [84] Most ive ever had was 24mill isk . My alt has a 500K bounty on, Ive never placed a bounty on myself and never podded myself to get the isk. I have however placed a fake 13371337 isk bounty on a corpmate for lolz.
Corstaad	Posted - 2008.02.13 22:46:00 - [85] I think really it comes down to luck and ****ing off the right person. Generally I'm usaully pretty nice and give people options if I have there pod so I think it cools them down abit. That said I've rolled a alt and got people to get concorded by telling them how to unlock secure cans in High Sec. They actually whined they couldn't put a bounty on my head because of sec status.
Donovan Killar Caldari Darkness Inc. Blood Blind	Posted - 2008.02.13 23:51:00 - [86] Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Furion iV Got much spare time on your hands? I'm sure you've got something better to do than argue on EVEo forums. If you got something to add to the discussion then please do so. Otherwise let people discuss whatever they like, for whatever the time they like. Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Furion iV I deem probabilty to be enough proof to state that they are in the majority fake. Although there are other variables to be taken into account, this one is the most influential. It is like stating that people who are wearing the tools of a plumber, is infact an electrician. Chances are they could be, but it will be presumed that they are a plumber. Good for you. But I'm not discussing this with you atm. If you still feel that you want to discuss this with me after coochie and I are done then feel free to say so and I'll consider it. This.
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.14 02:39:00 - [87] Originally by: Donovan Killar This. This what?
Donovan Killar Caldari Darkness Inc. Blood Blind	Posted - 2008.02.14 02:48:00 - [88] Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Donovan Killar This. This what?
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.14 03:35:00 - [89] Originally by: Donovan Killar If you found it contradictive then say so.
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.14 11:23:00 - [90] Edited by: General Coochie on 14/02/2008 11:27:06 Originally by: Cpt Fina For your own sake, please don't discuss anything of any importance IRL, you'd get laughed at. From personal experience I can tell you that that isn't the case. Off course you totally disregard personal experiences so I realize saying so doesn't make much difference. Since this now has turned into something quite different then a discussion I feel we can just leave it at, we having very different opinions about how one should act on a forum, express themselves and whats needed in terms of proof and to make a statement as I did (note: not what proof is needed to make the statement true scientificly) (I also did warn you about starting a discussion on the forums considering metaphysics and what proof is. You could have said "no I don't wanna do that" and we wouldn't have come to this in the first place. Cause obviously one can have very different philosophical stand points, and arguing against someone with a different one usually doesn't yield anything, if open minded maybe an understanding of what the other person is talking about, but you can never expect the other person to convert to your beliefs) The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)

Belial Tempter Amarr Twisted Inc.	Posted - 2008.02.14 12:28:00 - [91] Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Donovan Killar If you found it contradictive then say so. Nice word. For those of us who don't look up clever sounding words to use on the internet, he means inconsistent. Yes I had to look it up.
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.14 12:40:00 - [92] Edited by: Cpt Fina on 14/02/2008 12:40:17 Originally by: Belial Tempter Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Donovan Killar If you found it contradictive then say so. Nice word. For those of us who don't look up clever sounding words to use on the internet, he means inconsistent. Yes I had to look it up. Really now? English isn't even my native language... maybe says more about you than me.
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.14 12:43:00 - [93] Originally by: General Coochie we having very different opinions about how one should act on a forum, express themselves and whats needed in terms of proof and to make a statement as I did (note: not what proof is needed to make the statement true scientificly) I assumed that you understood why the usual rules of argumentation should be followed. My bad.
Belial Tempter Amarr Twisted Inc.	Posted - 2008.02.14 19:18:00 - [94] Originally by: Cpt Fina Edited by: Cpt Fina on 14/02/2008 15:29:03 Edited by: Cpt Fina on 14/02/2008 12:40:17 Originally by: Belial Tempter Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Donovan Killar If you found it contradictive then say so. Nice word. For those of us who don't look up clever sounding words to use on the internet, he means inconsistent. Yes I had to look it up. Really now? English isn't even my native language and i didn't have to look it up... maybe says more about you than me. lol. Then stop using that word, and just use "inconsistent" instead. Otherwise people will assume you're just trying to sound more cleverer () than you actually are... A bit like me saying "I popped this guy, then absquatulated with his loot", when "I popped this guy, then ran off with his loot" would have sufficed (yes, I looked that one up too, so if it doesn't fit in my point, then, well I'm not sure I ever actually had a point...I was just bored, and being argumentative, so meh.. )
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.14 20:29:00 - [95] Originally by: Belial Tempter Originally by: Cpt Fina Edited by: Cpt Fina on 14/02/2008 15:29:03 Edited by: Cpt Fina on 14/02/2008 12:40:17 Originally by: Belial Tempter Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Donovan Killar If you found it contradictive then say so. Nice word. For those of us who don't look up clever sounding words to use on the internet, he means inconsistent. Yes I had to look it up. Really now? English isn't even my native language and i didn't have to look it up... maybe says more about you than me. lol. Then stop using that word, and just use "inconsistent" instead. Otherwise people will assume you're just trying to sound more cleverer () than you actually are... "Then stop using it"? Because you don't understand it? I'm pretty certain most of the readers don't have to look it up.
kublai Art of War	Posted - 2008.02.14 20:43:00 - [96] I have plenty of friends who have gotten (and lost, in real combat) large bounties. Hell, even I have a small bounty, though why I can't imagine for the life of me, i'm such a nice, loving person :( ------ Art of War is recruiting - Think you got what it takes?
Belial Tempter Amarr Twisted Inc.	Posted - 2008.02.15 10:27:00 - [97] Edited by: Belial Tempter on 15/02/2008 10:29:31 Originally by: Cpt Fina "Then stop using it"? Because you don't understand it? I'm pretty certain most of the readers don't have to look it up. It was advice, from a native speaker of the language, to a non-native speaker. Choose to ignore my advice and carry on using an uncommon term by all means.(I read a lot and, believe it or not, have quite a large vocabulary, so if I haven't heard of it it isn't all that common, tbh). Either way, whether you meant it or not, whether you knew it or not, from a native speaker, I'm telling you now, you sounded to me like you were trying to sound clever. I couldn't care less if you actually were or not, and the fact you seem to think the appropriate way to answer me is to question my intelligence, instead of just explaining that you were a non-native speaker, speaks volumes to me. anyway, to get back OT, the biggest bounty I've ever had was around 25 mill, and I never found out who put it on me :P Maybe that's a way to get around 'fake' bounties, allow the public to know who's placed a bounty?
Sigul Siento	Posted - 2008.02.15 12:16:00 - [98] Edited by: Sigul Siento on 15/02/2008 12:17:03 Originally by: Belial Tempter Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Donovan Killar If you found it contradictive then say so. Nice word. For those of us who don't look up clever sounding words to use on the internet, he means inconsistent. Yes I had to look it up. How is "contradictive" a more clever sounding/difficult word than "inconsistent"? -Non native speaker that didn't have to look up either word (Yay, I'm clever).
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.15 13:38:00 - [99] Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: General Coochie we having very different opinions about how one should act on a forum, express themselves and whats needed in terms of proof and to make a statement as I did (note: not what proof is needed to make the statement true scientificly) I assumed that you understood why the usual rules of argumentation should be followed. My bad. What are the usual rules of argumentation then? Care to enlighten me? If I got it all right this is basicly our discussion: * You are arguing I made a statement that was an accusation towards someone without any proof. * I am arguing that I had sufficient proof to make such statement. I'm also a bit skeptical calling my statement an accusation. The discussion should come down to what sufficient proof is. We clearly have different opinions on the matter. Sufficient proof: This discussion has been going on within the scientific community and the philosophical one for hundreds of years. What makes you think you are obliged to say what sufficient proof is? You can have an opinion of course and you are welcome to argue for it. But you should respect other ppls opinions as well. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
Belial Tempter Amarr Twisted Inc.	Posted - 2008.02.15 13:38:00 - [100] Edited by: Belial Tempter on 15/02/2008 13:40:17 Goddamit it just is!! /me thinks. Er, oh.. hang on...'listens to corpmate who's pointing something out he doesn't want to hear'..contradictive, to contradict, hmm... ok, maybe you're right..not that clever-sounding actually, thinking about it.. The tense threw me, fair play, my bad. FINE! I'm a noob and stand corrected! Happy now? /me leaves vowing revenge on all those who would dispute his points.

Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.15 13:39:00 - [101] Originally by: Belial Tempter Edited by: Belial Tempter on 15/02/2008 10:29:31 It was advice, from a native speaker of the language, to a non-native speaker. Choose to ignore my advice and carry on using an uncommon term by all means.(I read a lot and, believe it or not, have quite a large vocabulary, so if I haven't heard of it it isn't all that common, tbh). lol. I am pretty ***** positive that most readers here understand the word "contradict". Instead of giving me advice in my use of english words maybe you should reevaluate your "large vocabulary". Originally by:** Belial Tempter I couldn't care less if you actually were or not, and the fact you seem to think the appropriate way to answer me is to question my intelligence, instead of just explaining that you were a non-native speaker, speaks volumes to me. How can I not when I'm certain that the word you are complaining about isn't very uncommon at all? I don't have to excuse myself to you and your patronizing post, and I'm not going to.
Belial Tempter Amarr Twisted Inc.	Posted - 2008.02.15 13:43:00 - [102] Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: Belial Tempter Edited by: Belial Tempter on 15/02/2008 10:29:31 It was advice, from a native speaker of the language, to a non-native speaker. Choose to ignore my advice and carry on using an uncommon term by all means.(I read a lot and, believe it or not, have quite a large vocabulary, so if I haven't heard of it it isn't all that common, tbh). lol. I am pretty ***** positive that most readers here understand the word "contradict". Instead of giving me advice in my use of english words maybe you should reevaluate your "large vocabulary". Originally by:** Belial Tempter I couldn't care less if you actually were or not, and the fact you seem to think the appropriate way to answer me is to question my intelligence, instead of just explaining that you were a non-native speaker, speaks volumes to me. How can I not when I'm certain that the word you are complaining about isn't very uncommon at all? I don't have to excuse myself to you and your patronizing post, and I'm not going to. OK, OK, unwind your knickers m8, if you read my last post I rethought about that term, and agreed it wasn't that complicated a word. Just me being a noob and not recognising it for some bizarre "brain freeze moment" reason. As for me sounding patronizing, pot kettle black. I wouldn't have posted at all if I hadn't had similar thoughts about you reading the thread. How about we all stop acting like little girls, myself included, and just agree to disagree today? hmm?
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.15 16:46:00 - [103] Originally by: General Coochie Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: General Coochie we having very different opinions about how one should act on a forum, express themselves and whats needed in terms of proof and to make a statement as I did (note: not what proof is needed to make the statement true scientificly) I assumed that you understood why the usual rules of argumentation should be followed. My bad. What are the usual rules of argumentation then? Care to enlighten me? If I got it all right this is basicly our discussion: * You are arguing I made a statement that was an accusation towards someone without any proof. * I am arguing that I had sufficient proof to make such statement. I'm also a bit skeptical calling my statement an accusation. Your arguments to back up your accusation (which is indeed an accusation) is: Argument: Suspicious bounty-values such as 666, 1234 ect make it very probable that a bounty is fake AND that a significant part of 50 mil+ bounties are of such character. Counterargument: Quick check of top 10 bounties shows NO bounty of such sort. I then urged you to prove me wrong with better statistics which you declined You later stated that ô I never said I can see/prove if a bounty is fake solely on the amount.ö Argument: Then of course we have the players thats been pod killed only to the next day have the same bounty again which Ive seen on numerous occasions as well. Not that I pod outlaws often This one seems to be based on you personal experience which you say isnÆt that extensive, yourself. Counterargument: I also have personal experience from this. And I claimed the opposite, that IÆve never seen such a thing. Word against word. If I were to claim that I got a buddy backing this up then IÆd have the upper hand in this argument. You are free to provide further proof of your argument. Argument: Common sense Counterargument: Common sense if subjective and up to the individual to determine. I can just as well claim that common sense says the direct opposite of what youÆre saying it does. You can of however prove me wrong by doing a survey to determine the general consensus in this matter. Conclusion: Your statement was as much of an accusation as it would be if I were to say ômost The Bastards-members use log-off tacticsö. You have provided very few and extremely weak arguments to back this up. NONE of the argument holds it own against any counterargument that I swiftly made just for the cause of making them. None of them has been backed by any facts but merely personal experience/opinions. The strongest argument, would it be true, has been deemed false with a counterargument based on in game statistics (1234-bounties). What else do you got to convince me that your initial statement is true? As it stands, more has been presented in the counteargument-side in this thread. All you got left is your opinion, and thus the reason I suggested you changed your statement to a post of personal opinionà. Or that you provide sound arguments to back up your accusation.
Lil'Red Ridin'Hood Snake Assault	Posted - 2008.02.15 16:51:00 - [104] So... do they already sell handbags with a C&P logo in the EVE shops?
Belial Tempter Amarr Twisted Inc.	Posted - 2008.02.15 17:30:00 - [105] Edited by: Belial Tempter on 15/02/2008 17:31:13 Edited by: Belial Tempter on 15/02/2008 17:30:19 I want a jolly roger on mine! Sign of someone getting wound up...highlighting and formatting your wall-of-text. (which I didn't read, and aint going to, Mr Fina..so PLEASE don't format and highlight one for me..)
Chief Tech	Posted - 2008.02.15 17:47:00 - [106] Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: General Coochie Originally by: Cpt Fina Originally by: General Coochie we having very different opinions about how one should act on a forum, express themselves and whats needed in terms of proof and to make a statement as I did (note: not what proof is needed to make the statement true scientificly) I assumed that you understood why the usual rules of argumentation should be followed. My bad. What are the usual rules of argumentation then? Care to enlighten me? If I got it all right this is basicly our discussion: * You are arguing I made a statement that was an accusation towards someone without any proof. * I am arguing that I had sufficient proof to make such statement. I'm also a bit skeptical calling my statement an accusation. Your arguments to back up your accusation (which is indeed an accusation) is: Argument: Suspicious bounty-values such as 666, 1234 ect make it very probable that a bounty is fake AND that a significant part of 50 mil+ bounties are of such character. Counterargument: Quick check of top 10 bounties shows NO bounty of such sort. I then urged you to prove me wrong with better statistics which you declined You later stated that ô I never said I can see/prove if a bounty is fake solely on the amount.ö Argument: Then of course we have the players thats been pod killed only to the next day have the same bounty again which Ive seen on numerous occasions as well. Not that I pod outlaws often This one seems to be based on you personal experience which you say isnÆt that extensive, yourself. Counterargument: I also have personal experience from this. And I claimed the opposite, that IÆve never seen such a thing. Word against word. If I were to claim that I got a buddy backing this up then IÆd have the upper hand in this argument. You are free to provide further proof of your argument. Argument: Common sense Counterargument: Common sense if subjective and up to the individual to determine. I can just as well claim that common sense says the direct opposite of what youÆre saying it does. You can of however prove me wrong by doing a survey to determine the general consensus in this matter. Conclusion: Your statement was as much of an accusation as it would be if I were to say ômost The Bastards-members use log-off tacticsö. You have provided very few and extremely weak arguments to back this up. NONE of the argument holds it own against any counterargument that I swiftly made just for the cause of making them. None of them has been backed by any facts but merely personal experience/opinions. The strongest argument, would it be true, has been deemed false with a counterargument based on in game statistics (1234-bounties). What else do you got to convince me that your initial statement is true? As it stands, more has been presented in the counteargument-side in this thread. All you got left is your opinion, and thus the reason I suggested you changed your statement to a post of personal opinionà. Or that you provide sound arguments to back up your accusation. Can you 2 get a room and discuss your arguments there maybe?! If I want to call any of you 2 an idiot and you start arguing, that you aren't, than we have a nice discussion maybe,but none of you 2 could proof, that I am wrong !! Counterargument will be, that I am the one actually. If you think so, than I am 50% right already. That means, that my argument, that you are the one has a better chance to be right also ! What was the argument ??
kublai Art of War	Posted - 2008.02.15 18:00:00 - [107] I wont quote due to the walls of texts and silly debates but, in regards to "suspicious" bounty numbers, my old corp mates yousto get a kick of putting extra isk on my bounty so that it would always end in "1337" forever ****ing me off, it was only a matter of a few thousand isk ontop of millions, but that seems to be pretty popular, so don't just assume that. I don't get the issue with bounty hunting though, there are large bounties out there, on real players, who really undock, who really are -10 and fly around fighting, bounty system works all rejoyce, we can't be blamed for bounty hunters not being good enough :D ------ Art of War is recruiting - Think you got what it takes?
General Coochie The Bastards	Posted - 2008.02.15 18:59:00 - [108] The argument isn't disproved by you supplementing documented facts of the top player bounties in eve. I can as I said ad an ad hoc solution; It doesn't apply to that high bounties. Maybe because players with that high bounties aren't fake as no one would put that much isk into their own bounty. However your arguements are good. And it makes my statement/arguements much weaker. It would be better if more ppl joined in on the discussion adding their own experiences. I doubt anyone will join in on this discussion though Adding an ad hoc solution would be silly of me when I don't have strong enough data for thinking otherwise (and your data is stronger). So maybe I was wrong. It doesn't mean I should edit my first post though, that was what I believed at the time and the data I had at hand at that point made me conclude that. Now more data and other arguements have been supplied making me think that maybe I'm wrong (your experiences are indeed as valuable as my own). Also if someone actually wanna follow our discussion its better not to edit a post. However I don't think that making a post about bastards using log off tactics is even remotely the same as the statement I did. But I guess thats another question where our opinions differ. If however you are fighting me and my computer crash and the circumstances makes you believe we use log off tactics, I wouldn't blame you for making a post about it. As long as one can say "I was wrong" when proved otherwise its all right I might have been wrong. And if someone would ask me now, maybe I would say that personally I am inclined to think most are fake based on experiences in eve, however other players think they are not. But probably Id say "I'm not sure" cause it is indeed closer to how you express yourself in every day life. Note I say might have been wrong. As I'm naturally always more inclined to believe my own observations above anyone else's (unless there are more then a few ppl disagreeing with me and I'm alone of my opinion). Would I be totally objective on the matter, like someone reading this post without any experiences of their own on the matter, I would probably consider myself being wrong. The Vigil and The Caracal (duo PvP movie)
Cpt Fina Mutually Assured Distraction	Posted - 2008.02.15 19:10:00 - [109] Originally by: Chief Tech Can you 2 get a room and discuss your arguments there maybe?! If I want to call any of you 2 an idiot and you start arguing, that you aren't, than we have a nice discussion maybe,but none of you 2 could proof, that I am wrong !! Counterargument will be, that I am the one actually. If you think so, than I am 50% right already. That means, that my argument, that you are the one has a better chance to be right also ! What was the argument ?? You don't have to read it. I personally find it more entertaining than the usual "lol, i pwnd a nub today. omfgwin!"-threads. Originally by: General Coochie So maybe I was wrong. ... And if someone would ask me now, maybe I would say that personally I am inclined to think most are fake based on experiences in eve, however other players think they are not. Fine...
Corstaad	Posted - 2008.02.15 20:26:00 - [110] I would just like to announce all bounties aren't fake, I got my first one today for being nice to someone I killed . 2008.02.15 20:18 Just wanted to say thanks, and I put the bounty on your head. ;op maybe it'll be the start on your way to the top! Take Care-******



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