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How misleading is this article on the BBC

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Taua Roqa Minmatar Eve University Ivy League	Posted - 2008.02.21 16:34:00 - [31] Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Taua Roqa Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Taua Roqa the BBC, especially in its news reporting, is a painfully leftist wishy washy thing that seldom gives a clear picture of what it is that's being reported, and it only reports that which fits into its highly PC agenda (heaven forbid they report on people blowing each others pixels up, the entire reason for eve's economy to exist!). And to think in the UK it's compulsory to fund this Labour propaganda machine, in a democracy, oh dear god. So you disagree that ever since the BBC got their arses handed to them over that incident their reporting has become increasingly irrelevant and selective? I certainly disagree that it's compulsory to fund it. I have a TV in my house, i guess i better get rid of it so i can free myself of the tv license. I kinda like the TV though, very useful thing for the sports and all that i get from sky. protip: i'm talking about RL so pleeease don't try and be eve-clever on me, k. -------------------------------------------- [IMAGE REMOVED] Threads are stacking-nerfed; the more posts you add the less effective those posts are. My I/Q Ration!!!11
Scilent Enigma Minmatar Vae Victis Inc.	Posted - 2008.02.21 16:36:00 - [32] There is already a thread about this: Linkage
Brainless Bimbo	Posted - 2008.02.21 16:40:00 - [33] The BBC (aka auntie) is probally the most unbiased new site you can get in the english language. It has no agenda, its a Common Good organisation, it has no corporate masters that hide or promote or aid its corporations agenda, look at Fox News (aka Faux Noise) or any main stream US new organ. Those above who said the article doesn't mention pew-pew are quite frankly unable to understand well written english, "Players battle to win territories" is the opening of the 3rd paragraph, and just 2 para's later again talks about war. Well if war isn't pew-pew to the above gainslayers of the article they really need to either get an education or go see some real war so they may be enlightened.
Lindsay Fox	Posted - 2008.02.21 16:41:00 - [34] I thought it was a horrible article. You can easily focus on the economic side of things and still give a balanced view of the game. If all the PvP players were replaced with NPCs, and the only human interaction was trade and manufacturing, Eve would not exist. If it did, it would just be a spreadsheet game played by a handful of anoraks. If you replaced all the carebears with NPCs, and the only human interaction was PvP combat, Eve would still exist. It wouldn't be as interesting, but it might be a lot more fun. What I do find interesting in this discussion is the way that carebears leap on any opportunity to have a go at PvPers...I guess there's not a lot of respect going the other way either a lot of the time, and 'carebear' is generally used in a perjorative sense...but they certainly do seem very defensive. I guess I'm lucky and I enjoy both sides...but I play it like it's two different games...my trade/building alt never really interacts with my combat character except to give him money... Anyway, it was a **** article.
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out	Posted - 2008.02.21 16:50:00 - [35] Originally by: Taua Roqa Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Taua Roqa Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Taua Roqa the BBC, especially in its news reporting, is a painfully leftist wishy washy thing that seldom gives a clear picture of what it is that's being reported, and it only reports that which fits into its highly PC agenda (heaven forbid they report on people blowing each others pixels up, the entire reason for eve's economy to exist!). And to think in the UK it's compulsory to fund this Labour propaganda machine, in a democracy, oh dear god. So you disagree that ever since the BBC got their arses handed to them over that incident their reporting has become increasingly irrelevant and selective? I certainly disagree that it's compulsory to fund it. I have a TV in my house, i guess i better get rid of it so i can free myself of the tv license. I kinda like the TV though, very useful thing for the sports and all that i get from sky. protip: i'm talking about RL so pleeease don't try and be eve-clever on me, k. I have a nice big screen I can watch DvDs on, quite a few of which I bought from the BBC. Even if you don't watch BBC programs ever, which I doubt if you regularly watch sport, then you get benefit from them in that more than 60% of your viewing time is program, not adverts. Have you ever seen, for example, US TV? 90 seconds of adverts, 210 seconds of program, 90 seconds of adverts.... If you do believe that the BBC is being forced to kowtow to Labour's wishes, then surely you should be angry with the oppressors rather than the oppressed. But in fact the BBC has a very good record for being cordially disliked by whichever government is in power. Anyway, this really belongs in OOPE rather than genreal discussion. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Lena Kanto	Posted - 2008.02.21 16:54:00 - [36] There's another topic on this, and I'll just repeat my thoughts... You are misinterpreting the article, it's not about EVE online, it's about virtual economics and it just takes the virtual market in EVE as an example. It doesn't adress combat, nor does it intend to nor does it claim that there's no combat, the article is just not about EVE as a whole.
Montague Zooma Imperial Dreams Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2008.02.21 16:54:00 - [37] No bucks, no Buck Rogers.
benzss Twisted Inc.	Posted - 2008.02.21 17:43:00 - [38] Edited by: benzss on 21/02/2008 17:44:24 This is a decent article considering most news agencies' inability to understand 'things from the internet'. And like many people have said, it's accurate because it is concentrating on the economic aspect of Eve; the PvP and PvE aspects are not 'new' even if the former is excellent. And to the people moaning about the BBC being leftist or whatever... come on. It's probably the most neutral news reporting agency out there, at least in its basic news reports (not comments and editorials). This is just something I notice since I read several news websites and read probably two newspapers per day, some of which are more lefty and some of which are more righty than the BBC which appears, to me at least, to be the most moderate and neutral of them all. Not that I'm claiming the BBC is always neutral. Nothing will ever be 'neutral' and never has been.
Orgos Khenn Minmatar	Posted - 2008.02.21 18:33:00 - [39] So this article that indicates that unlike every other MMO on the market, EVE actually caters to people that use their brains...this article, because it doesn't talk about "pewpewpew lolz yarr" is somehow misselling the game? There's a fair share of gankers and idiots in every game. The article just shows that EVE is also fit for people with braincells to spare. Trolls, go home. ---- One day...one day General will be worth reading.
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out	Posted - 2008.02.21 18:43:00 - [40] Originally by: Orgos Khenn So this article that indicates that unlike every other MMO on the market, EVE actually caters to people that use their brains...this article, because it doesn't talk about "pewpewpew lolz yarr" is somehow misselling the game? There's a fair share of gankers and idiots in every game. The article just shows that EVE is also fit for people with braincells to spare. Agreed. Overall, it's a very positive article. I just wish they'd slipped in something about not being 100% safe anywhere... CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Andrue Amarr Federation Of Space Loonies Culture Shock Initiative	Posted - 2008.02.21 22:02:00 - [41] Originally by: Lindsay Fox I thought it was a horrible article. You can easily focus on the economic side of things and still give a balanced view of the game. Some of you people should be embarrassed at your reading skills. Either that or you need to learn how to think before reacting. It is an article about the economy of Eve and how it compares to the real world. It is not supposed to mention PvP in any great depth because that is not the subject of the article. There are whole swathes of Eve that it quite rightly ignores because they are not the subject of the article. If you want a general review of Eve then go to a review site. There is a section of the BBC site that reviews computer games but that seems to be determined to ignore it. -- (Sarcastic mission running veteran) [Brackley, UK] My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned.
Lindsay Fox	Posted - 2008.02.22 00:10:00 - [42] Originally by: Andrue Some of you people should be embarrassed at your reading skills. Either that or you need to learn how to think before reacting. You seem to have difficulty with the concept of opinions, and the possibility that some people may have some that differ from your own. If I were you, I'd be more embarassed at being such a git.
Zardock Reikoku Band of Brothers	Posted - 2008.02.22 00:20:00 - [43] Originally by: Kyoto Luyi BBC report/post crap and someone is surprised? Bindun... Modern media reporting erroneous information? Say it isn't so!
Dr Slaughter Rabies Inc.	Posted - 2008.02.22 00:43:00 - [44] Originally by: Talon SilverHawk Your Thoughts They (the press) have always been horribly misinformed about so many things, or have had their own agendas. Until you become a subject matter expert for the first time you don't really realize it. The BBC is no better than the rest, as you can see from the article. CCP this is not the nerf you are looking for... [a image was here once but it went away]
Bohoba Caldari dragons nest imPure.	Posted - 2008.02.22 02:03:00 - [45] "Dr Eyjo Gudmundsson is the lead economist, a virtual Alan Greenspan, who works to make sense of all the data." he is a Economist all he sees is $$$$ thats his life you don't even count in his eyes your not $$$$ Windows VistaÖ Ultimate x64-based PC Gigabyte X38-DQ6 Processor Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Extreme CPU Q6850 Memory 4,093.69 MB 2X Crossfire ASUS EAH3870/G/HTDI/512M Radeon HD 3870 512MB
The Socialworker Minmatar The Socialworkers	Posted - 2008.02.22 02:31:00 - [46] Originally by: Taua Roqa Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Taua Roqa Originally by: Malcanis Originally by: Taua Roqa the BBC, especially in its news reporting, is a painfully leftist wishy washy thing that seldom gives a clear picture of what it is that's being reported, and it only reports that which fits into its highly PC agenda (heaven forbid they report on people blowing each others pixels up, the entire reason for eve's economy to exist!). And to think in the UK it's compulsory to fund this Labour propaganda machine, in a democracy, oh dear god. So you disagree that ever since the BBC got their arses handed to them over that incident their reporting has become increasingly irrelevant and selective? I certainly disagree that it's compulsory to fund it. I have a TV in my house, i guess i better get rid of it so i can free myself of the tv license. I kinda like the TV though, very useful thing for the sports and all that i get from sky. protip: i'm talking about RL so pleeease don't try and be eve-clever on me, k. This is not the place to spout bitter political viewpoints. Go to bed and sleep it off, and that is a ... pr proti.. no I can't do it.
PaddyPaddy Nihildarnik Gallente MASS Ministry Of Amarrian Secret Service	Posted - 2008.02.22 02:37:00 - [47] Originally by: Cypher V Originally by: Doonoo Boonoo Edited by: Doonoo Boonoo on 21/02/2008 14:07:04 They already spoke to the BBC about Fleet combat. Check the Vid-'Space Community Game displayed' and listen to what is said at 1.38 secs in. http://search.bbc.co.uk/cgi-bin/search/results.pl?tab=av&q=eve+online&edition=d&scope=all Edit-I'm pretty sure he is talking about 'Operation Coathangar' when LV had their Titan destroyed in production. f'n good interview. Wonder how many people actualyl saw it though. It was prob broadcast at like, 4.30am or something stupid. I thought he had nailed it with no possible innuendo right up until the "its an alternative way of 'entertaining' yourself (on the internet)" That made me chuckle. Peace WithinSo if the theory of relativity is true, shouldn't i arrive at my destination before i warped in the first place? Neon GhostYou do, but this is compensated for by lag
Hippy Dave	Posted - 2008.02.22 02:54:00 - [48] Originally by: Taua Roqa the BBC, especially in its news reporting, is a painfully leftist wishy washy thing that seldom gives a clear picture of what it is that's being reported, and it only reports that which fits into its highly PC agenda (heaven forbid they report on people blowing each others pixels up, the entire reason for eve's economy to exist!). And to think in the UK it's compulsory to fund this Labour propaganda machine, in a democracy, oh dear god. Yes of course the BBC is so biased and it loves Labour ... which just shows you obviously dont ever watch it. This article as many have said isnt a video game review its a look at advanced economic models in video games, if you fail to see the difference between that and a review on IGN then no wonder you believe that the BBC is some lapdog for the government. I saw a similar article in a London paper not so long back about Second Life, funnily enough they neglected to mention that you can have virtual sex in it and that it functions for many as a lame **** simulator for geeks. Probably cause the people reading the article didnt care.. Christ man get a grip... and for the record what country are you from, i do hope it isnt the US cause someone from the US slating the BBC news would be the height of stupidity
Kyra Felann Gallente Noir.	Posted - 2008.02.22 03:31:00 - [49] There's already a thread about this and mostly the same comments have been made. Also, learn to link properly.
Kyra Felann Gallente Noir.	Posted - 2008.02.22 03:34:00 - [50] Originally by: Cipher7 Newsie was like "What's Eve like?" PR guy was like "Well you can trade, kill NPC's, mine, build ships" Newsie played around for 2 hours, did a mission and wrote the article. He doesn't even mention missions or NPCs. If someone didn't know anything about Eve and read the article, they would probably think nothing but trading went on in Eve. If he wanted to focus on the economy, that's perfectly fine, but at least mention that other things go on, and don't call it a "trading game".
Munen	Posted - 2008.02.22 03:40:00 - [51] Originally by: Orgos Khenn So this article that indicates that unlike every other MMO on the market, EVE actually caters to people that use their brains...this article, because it doesn't talk about "pewpewpew lolz yarr" is somehow misselling the game? There's a fair share of gankers and idiots in every game. The article just shows that EVE is also fit for people with braincells to spare. Trolls, go home. Exactly. The responses in here decrying the article just show how much these people don't care for a certain playstyle being elevated in the public eye moreso than their playstyle. Get over it. Eve combat is so unpopular it can't even be promoted in venues where pewpew matters most like World Cyber Games and Cyberathletes. Maybe if CCP had the cash AND desire to push forward Eve as a psuedo-esport like Blizzard is trying to hamfist WoW into the progaming scene then you would get the recognition for your chosen playstlye that you crave.
Juedas	Posted - 2008.02.22 05:01:00 - [52] LOL BBC just called us all "BAND GEEKS" ...or IVY League caliber economists..... Not sure which is worse
Kyra Felann Gallente Noir.	Posted - 2008.02.22 06:47:00 - [53] Originally by: Munen Exactly. The responses in here decrying the article just show how much these people don't care for a certain playstyle being elevated in the public eye moreso than their playstyle. Get over it. No one is saying that. I'm saying is that they should have at least mentioned that "Oh, yeah, you can shoot at other spaceships, too. But, no, nothing. He called it a trading game and acted like all players do is join corporations and compete on the market. He didn't mention missions, PvP, exploration, etc. Someone reading the article would probably think that the game contains nothing but trading. Trading is a huge part of the game, but it's not the whole game. Neither is combat. If the author wants to focus on the economy, fine. But he should have at least mentioned that there are other things to do or said that trading is one of the many things you can do in the game. In short, you're delusional if you don't think that calling Eve a "trading game" is inaccurate.
Aeo IV Amarr	Posted - 2008.02.22 07:08:00 - [54] Eve online's combat system isn't really something that can be studied, or is of any interest to most outsiders to the game. The Market, on the other hand, IS interesting. People study MMORPGs for things like economy, or player interaction, not how 'cool the combat is'. I remember a few years back reading an article about WoW and an accidental 'outbreak' of a 'disease' (a debuff that escaped the area it was suppose to be confined to, and jumped player to player.) And people studied it because it was a semi-real world model of what would happen if, for example, the bird flu ever started jumping human from human. It's rather sad, IMO, that there are people in this game who seem to think the combat is more revolutionary then Eve's market.
Mighty Dread Minmatar	Posted - 2008.02.22 07:22:00 - [55] Essentially everything in EVE is unfortunately geared towards warfare, militarianism, the like. I feel sorry for any business student reading that article thinking that EVE is for them. Even if a newbie manages to break into the market and earn decent isk it's all for what? The only thing isk goes towards is the war machine, the combat PVP.
Malcanis R.E.C.O.N. Black-Out	Posted - 2008.02.22 07:34:00 - [56] Originally by: Mighty Dread Essentially everything in EVE is unfortunately geared towards warfare, militarianism, the like. I feel sorry for any business student reading that article thinking that EVE is for them. Even if a newbie manages to break into the market and earn decent isk it's all for what? The only thing isk goes towards is the war machine, the combat PVP. War is good for business. Most things in EvE don't wear out, so they have to be destroyed to create demand. You could say that the economy is all about fighting, but it would be equally true to say that the fighting is all about the economy. No resources? No money? No ships = you lose. CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that.
Andrue Amarr Federation Of Space Loonies Culture Shock Initiative	Posted - 2008.02.22 08:16:00 - [57] Originally by: Kyra Felann Originally by: Munen Exactly. The responses in here decrying the article just show how much these people don't care for a certain playstyle being elevated in the public eye moreso than their playstyle. Get over it. No one is saying that. I'm saying is that they should have at least mentioned that "Oh, yeah, you can shoot at other spaceships, too. But, no, nothing. He called it a trading game and acted like all players do is join corporations and compete on the market. He didn't mention missions, PvP, exploration, etc. Why should he? The article was about economics. How many more times do people have to tell you people that. That article is supposed to be read by economists, not computer geeks. Most economists don't give a stuff about combat or mission running in a silly computer game (in fact most people in general don't). They might however be mildly curious about a living and complex economy. -- (Sarcastic mission running veteran) [Brackley, UK] My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned.
Andrue Amarr Federation Of Space Loonies Culture Shock Initiative	Posted - 2008.02.22 08:22:00 - [58] Originally by: Mighty Dread Essentially everything in EVE is unfortunately geared towards warfare, militarianism, the like. I feel sorry for any business student reading that article thinking that EVE is for them. Even if a newbie manages to break into the market and earn decent isk it's all for what? The only thing isk goes towards is the war machine, the combat PVP. That article was not a game advertisment or a review so it doesn't matter. That's the point some of us are trying to get at. The idea is not to encourage people to play the game (because that's not the BBC's job). The idea was just to let other people know about one aspect of online gaming that actually is of interest to normal people (ie;those that don't fritter away their time on computer games). Nothing else that happens in the game is of any particular interest to the target audience. They've either seen it all before or just don't care. -- (Sarcastic mission running veteran) [Brackley, UK] My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned.
Kyra Felann Gallente Noir.	Posted - 2008.02.22 08:52:00 - [59] Originally by: Aeo IV Eve online's combat system isn't really something that can be studied, or is of any interest to most outsiders to the game. The Market, on the other hand, IS interesting. People study MMORPGs for things like economy, or player interaction, not how 'cool the combat is'. I remember a few years back reading an article about WoW and an accidental 'outbreak' of a 'disease' (a debuff that escaped the area it was suppose to be confined to, and jumped player to player.) And people studied it because it was a semi-real world model of what would happen if, for example, the bird flu ever started jumping human from human. It's rather sad, IMO, that there are people in this game who seem to think the combat is more revolutionary then Eve's market. That's 100% fine. The economy is a revolutionary, amazing thing and deserves to be written about. But he should have at least written "Players can also engage in combat" or something along those lines. It is bad journalism to misrepresent the game as a "trading game" and not mention any of the other things you can do.
Agil TradeAlt	Posted - 2008.02.22 08:55:00 - [60] Originally by: Kyra Felann Originally by: Aeo IV Eve online's combat system isn't really something that can be studied, or is of any interest to most outsiders to the game. The Market, on the other hand, IS interesting. People study MMORPGs for things like economy, or player interaction, not how 'cool the combat is'. I remember a few years back reading an article about WoW and an accidental 'outbreak' of a 'disease' (a debuff that escaped the area it was suppose to be confined to, and jumped player to player.) And people studied it because it was a semi-real world model of what would happen if, for example, the bird flu ever started jumping human from human. It's rather sad, IMO, that there are people in this game who seem to think the combat is more revolutionary then Eve's market. That's 100% fine. The economy is a revolutionary, amazing thing and deserves to be written about. But he should have at least written "Players can also engage in combat" or something along those lines. It is bad journalism to misrepresent the game as a "trading game" and not mention any of the other things you can do. Joe public could not care less. This is a niche mmo, remember. Originally by: CCP kieron ISK buying is a major contributor to the inflation in EVE's economy.

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