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No Nerf in 1.1? Is CCP serious?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 4 post(s)

CCP Casqade	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:28:00 - [31] I'm not trying to tell you that the patch only affected you positively, neither did the Dev blogs. What I'm trying to say is simply: Quote: If this balancing is positive or negative is a question about mindset. If you change the balance anywhere in the game it will have a negative effect on something and a positive effect on something else. Think about a scale, to have one side of the scale go up the other side has to go down. This is the art of balancing.

Reem Fairchild	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:28:00 - [32] Edited by: Reem Fairchild on 13/03/2008 21:29:30 There is no such thing as "nerf" or "boost". Only change. Every nerf is an indirect boost and every boost is an indirect nerf. People just react emotionally when their stuff gets changed. CCP trying to play on that, after all the whining about Trinity, by calling this patch "boost patch" was pretty cringe inducing, if you ask me. (And my beloved damp ships weren't boosted, so screw you all. )
Aprudena Gist	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:29:00 - [33] Originally by: CCP Casqade I'm not trying to tell you that the patch only affected you positively, neither did the Dev blogs. What I'm trying to say is simply: Quote: If this balancing is positive or negative is a question about mindset. If you change the balance anywhere in the game it will have a negative effect on something and a positive effect on something else. Think about a scale, to have one side of the scale go up the other side has to go down. This is the art of balancing. a nerf is a nerf is a nerf. you can try to candy coat it all you want its still a nerf. So why did you come out ant blatently say that yes there were no nerfs here. The Raptor thing is a stupid ass nerf btw.
Tarminic	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:30:00 - [34] Originally by: Aprudena Gist Originally by: Tarminic Originally by: Aprudena Gist i'm talking more like these sniping torpedo rats and such the weapon systems should be the same. Aside from consistency, is there any real reason to do this? its kinda dumb to have a ship shoot torpedoes at you from 100km away when you get like 25-30 km with em. And because its still on the same damage scale so it would be nice to be consittant. Actually, wouldn't they need to increase the damage of the torpedos by at least 30% to compensate? Considering that mission runners can't outrun NPCs with standard raven setups, wouldn't mission running against torpedo-wielding NPCs instantly become significantly harder? ---------------- Tarminic - 33 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.79.2
Karina Bellac	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:30:00 - [35] Edited by: Karina Bellac on 13/03/2008 21:31:06 Originally by: CCP Casqade Personally I think that 4x 75mm Railgun II with Iridium charge S is a pretty good choice. Hi. Welcome to EVE Online. Feel free to browse the Ships and Modules forum to help you gain understanding of the various ships in the game, and how to fit them. Because, seriously. (Edit: wow, how did I miss that. 4 railguns on a 3 turret hull. Amazing.)
Rex Hargrove	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:32:00 - [36] Edited by: Rex Hargrove on 13/03/2008 21:32:19 Originally by: CCP Casqade Personally I think that 4x 75mm Railgun II with Iridium charge S is a pretty good choice. this quote is unbelievably embarrassing

CCP Casqade	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:32:00 - [37] Sorry about that, I wrote a bit too fast. My point with that particular ship is that you can now fit 3x 75mm railguns, giving you a greater range at a less less CPU and Powergrid cost. This gives you the ability to stay out of web range and deal more damage than before at the cost of less CPU and Powergrid. This depends on your fitting, of course but this is why I like the change of the Raptor.

Karina Bellac	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:36:00 - [38] Originally by: CCP Casqade Sorry about that, I wrote a bit too fast. No need to apologise. Now, can we get someone more qualified to defend the viewpoint that the Raptor change is not a nerf?
Zorlag	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:38:00 - [39] Originally by: CCP Casqade Sorry about that, I wrote a bit too fast. My point with that particular ship is that you can now fit 3x 75mm railguns, giving you a greater range at a less less CPU and Powergrid cost. This gives you the ability to stay out of web range and deal more damage than before at the cost of less CPU and Powergrid. This depends on your fitting, of course but this is why I like the change of the Raptor. You have clearly never played this game.
Kagura Nikon	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:47:00 - [40] Originally by: CCP Casqade Originally by: Treelox well a UNIVERSAL negative effect to ALL resist, sure seems like a nerf [...] That is one side of the scale, the other is an increase to damage. so why didnt you simply increased damage? NO ONE would see that as a nerf! No matter how much you try to spin it, its a nerf, most players feel agressed by this so its a nerf, and no fancy words will change that. ------------------------------------------------- If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
Dramund	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:48:00 - [41] Wow this thread really plummeted. Casqade, bail out now, you might actually think these hopeless pessimists represent the majority of the EvE population.
Aprudena Gist	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:49:00 - [42] Originally by: CCP Casqade Sorry about that, I wrote a bit too fast. My point with that particular ship is that you can now fit 3x 75mm railguns, giving you a greater range at a less less CPU and Powergrid cost. This gives you the ability to stay out of web range and deal more damage than before at the cost of less CPU and Powergrid. This depends on your fitting, of course but this is why I like the change of the Raptor. Either way, the OP started the thread to discuss balancing its affects, positive and negative. That is what I would like to contribute to in the continuing of this thread. i dont see how the the hell a raptor will stay in range to use those guns.
Karina Bellac	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:50:00 - [43] Originally by: Dramund Wow this thread really plummeted. Casqade, bail out now, you might actually think these hopeless pessimists represent the majority of the EvE population. Thank you for volunteering. So, how is the raptor change not a nerf?
Reem Fairchild	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:52:00 - [44] Originally by: Aprudena Gist Originally by: CCP Casqade Sorry about that, I wrote a bit too fast. My point with that particular ship is that you can now fit 3x 75mm railguns, giving you a greater range at a less less CPU and Powergrid cost. This gives you the ability to stay out of web range and deal more damage than before at the cost of less CPU and Powergrid. This depends on your fitting, of course but this is why I like the change of the Raptor. Either way, the OP started the thread to discuss balancing its affects, positive and negative. That is what I would like to contribute to in the continuing of this thread. i dont see how the the hell a raptor will stay in range to use those guns. He said with Iridium ammo, and you have a 10% per level optimal range bonus on top of that.
Dramund	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:54:00 - [45] Originally by: Karina Bellac Originally by: Dramund Wow this thread really plummeted. Casqade, bail out now, you might actually think these hopeless pessimists represent the majority of the EvE population. Thank you for volunteering. So, how is the raptor change not a nerf? Because it got an extra turret slot. I wouldn't volunteer, I only bathe in the tears of butt-hurt gamers.
Aprudena Gist	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:56:00 - [46] Edited by: Aprudena Gist on 13/03/2008 21:56:00 Originally by: Reem Fairchild Originally by: Aprudena Gist Originally by: CCP Casqade Sorry about that, I wrote a bit too fast. My point with that particular ship is that you can now fit 3x 75mm railguns, giving you a greater range at a less less CPU and Powergrid cost. This gives you the ability to stay out of web range and deal more damage than before at the cost of less CPU and Powergrid. This depends on your fitting, of course but this is why I like the change of the Raptor. Either way, the OP started the thread to discuss balancing its affects, positive and negative. That is what I would like to contribute to in the continuing of this thread. i dont see how the the hell a raptor will stay in range to use those guns. ah that puts the optimal at 16km with about 40 dps at best in a tackling inty setup? yea that's going to do tons of good. He said with Iridium ammo, and you have a 10% per level optimal range bonus on top of that.
Karina Bellac	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:57:00 - [47] Originally by: Dramund Because it got an extra turret slot. Ah, the Mindset thing, right?
Dramund	Posted - 2008.03.13 21:58:00 - [48] Originally by: Karina Bellac Originally by: Dramund Because it got an extra turret slot. Ah, the Mindset thing, right? Yep. Perspective.
Treelox	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:00:00 - [49] Originally by: Dramund Originally by: Karina Bellac Originally by: Dramund Because it got an extra turret slot. Ah, the Mindset thing, right? Yep. Perspective. so self deception is the key to happiness? -- Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Dramund	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:01:00 - [50] Originally by: Treelox so self deception is the key to happiness? Well rewording that phrase would be the first step to realizing it.
Reem Fairchild	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:02:00 - [51] Originally by: Aprudena Gist ah that puts the optimal at 16km with about 40 dps at best in a tackling inty setup? yea that's going to do tons of good. Makes it better than the Ares... (well, except for the speed)
Ivor Gunn	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:09:00 - [52] Originally by: CCP Casqade If this balancing is positive or negative is a question about mindset. So, you're saying there are no nerfs? Only negative boosts?
Elmicker	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:15:00 - [53] Originally by: CCP Casqade I'm not trying to tell you that the patch only affected you positively, neither did the Dev blogs. To quote the news post: Quote: not a single 'nerf' So, either you're lying, or the news post is lying. Pick one.
Tarminic	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:17:00 - [54] Originally by: Elmicker So, either you're lying, or the news post is lying. Pick one. Sorry, but this is a logically flawed argument. Any change affects some people positively and other people negatively, so therefore every chane is a nerf by your definition, regardless of what it actually is or does. ---------------- Tarminic - 33 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.79.2
Dramund	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:19:00 - [55] Originally by: Tarminic Sorry, but this is a logically flawed argument. Any change affects some people positively and other people negatively, so therefore every chane is a nerf by your definition, regardless of what it actually is or does. They won't understand that, join me in showering happiness over their tears instead. I can only hope that CCP doesn't actually poll the forums. I'd hate to feel obligated to post to do their jobs for them.
here'n'there	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:20:00 - [56] Edited by: here''n''there on 13/03/2008 22:21:20 Originally by: CCP Casqade Originally by: Treelox well a UNIVERSAL negative effect to ALL resist, sure seems like a nerf [...] That is one side of the scale, the other is an increase to damage. i fly astarte, where is my increase to my damage? oh, wait, you mean boost to damage dealt to me, right? sure, it's a boost Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Tarron Sarek	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:21:00 - [57] Oh man.. Geez, cry some more. Get over it or quit, please. In case nobody noticed: Quote: a change to a game that downgrades the power, effectiveness or influence of a particular game element Tell me what's the particular game element. Your ship? Yeah, I guessed so. Sorry, it's all ships. That's nothing particular. ___________________________________ - Balance is power, guard it well - Please stop using the word 'nerf' Nothing spells 'incompetence' or 'don't take me serious' like those four letters
Araxmas	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:23:00 - [58] Its not a nerf when EVERYONE get's the same reduction. If only certain people or ships get it than yes it is a nerf, otherwise it is not a nerf. -------- Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. derek
Kagura Nikon	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:23:00 - [59] Originally by: Tarminic Originally by: Elmicker So, either you're lying, or the news post is lying. Pick one. Sorry, but this is a logically flawed argument. Any change affects some people positively and other people negatively, so therefore every chane is a nerf by your definition, regardless of what it actually is or does. no his logic is not flawed. THe presence of buff dont correspond to the absence of nerfs. So if every buff is also a nerf then THIS PATHC HAS NERFS Then CCP IS LYING when they say its a nerf free patch. Simple. ------------------------------------------------- If brute force doesn't solve your problem... you are not using enough
Tarminic	Posted - 2008.03.13 22:24:00 - [60] Edited by: Tarminic on 13/03/2008 22:25:33 Does everyone in this thread realize that they are arguing over the definition of a nerf in an internet spaceship game? I think you should go out and get some fresh air, maybe feel some boobs, and chill out a little. Originally by: Kagura Nikon Then CCP IS LYING when they say its a nerf free patch. Simple. Okay, fine. Yes, this patch has things you consider nerfs. Now what? ---------------- Tarminic - 33 Million SP in Forum Warfare Play EVE: Downtime Madness v0.79.2

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