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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
Mioelnir
KULT Production
Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2008.03.17 16:11:00 -
[1]
 Originally by: CCP Nozh
This is how the old cpu / resistance was. You'll notice quickly how everything is pretty much random. Tobias', Gistum, Hakim's shield amplifiers are completely useless, and being dropped as high level meta loot.
Minmatar'ish shield modules (rep fleet, domination, gistii/gistum/gist, hakim/tobias/...) were low fitting, low cap usage modules that started around t1 and got better than t2 at the end. Low cap usage is of course a rather bad bonus for a passive hardener, but that simply is the racial trait.
Caldari'ish shield modules (caldari navy, dread gurista, pith*, estamel, ...) were high fitting, high cap usage, high bonus.
That is the same for all tanking modules. Angel officer LAR have less fitting and way less cap use, but rep only around the same as T2. Amarr Navy / Centus have higher fitting, higher cap use and rep a lot more.
The usefullness progression within their line of modules was correct. Also, officer modules were/are most of the time relabeled deadspace versions. Hakim = Gistum B, Tobias = Gistum A. Same as for example Tobias XL Shield Booster = Gist X-Type XL.
Now seeing Tobias being the same as Estamel makes me sad.
The values of the passive amps are only "random" if you completely rip them out of context, which btw, you did.
Now the passive resist modules have a nice totally boring "higher meta = better" progression at the cost of the racial characteristics of the faction. Bad. BAD. There really is no boardcode to express how bad it is to completely destroy the flavour of the factions just to reduce the complexity of the different module lines.
TL/DR Version: sorry, but you tried to fix something that didn't need fixing because you ignored the big picture. By doing so, you broke it.
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Mioelnir
KULT Production
Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2008.03.17 16:24:00 -
[2]
Originally by: Seishomaru
mmm Amarr navy rep has LOWER fitting than LAR 2.....
Indeed. Should have checked ingame first.
Thanks for the correction.
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Mioelnir
KULT Production
Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2008.03.17 21:29:00 -
[3]
Originally by: Agock Onie
Quickly for my own clarification...
Pith, Pithii, Pithum = DEDspace complex (exploration) loot. Correct?
Gist, Gistii, Gistum = Faction spawn loot? is this right?
Which is supposed to be the "superior" or "rarer"?
Domination = loot from angel faction spawns
Gistii = frigate sized modules from angel deadspace complexes
Gistum = cruiser sized modules from angel deadspace complexes
Gist = battleship sized modules from angel deadspace complexes
Dread Guristas = loot from gurista faction spawns
Pithii = frigate sized modules from gurista deadspace complexes
Pithum = cruiser sized modules from gurista deadspace complexes
Pith = battleship sized modules from gurista deadspace complexes
(This ofc is not entirely true for deadspace versions of modules that have no different versions for different sizes).
Basically, dread guristas and domination are in one rarity league, gist* and pith* in another.
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Mioelnir
KULT Production
Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2008.03.18 00:42:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Vaal Erit
Did all of you actually read CCP Nozhs post?
1) The shield resist amps were terribly imbalanced. I did not know this, but look at that chart, the values are all over the place.
2) "However if you take a look at normal shield hardeners and their Faction counterpartsthey follow the exact same trend. Same resistance but lower CPU." They are not balanced on other general faction/deadspace/officer module values but off of shield hardener values. I showed info on the shield hardeners and found CCP Nozh's changes to be consistent (I would boost the Domi shield amp as the domi hardener uses a ton less cap/s, but meh)
3) Some people with huge egos telling the Devs how this or that should work, need to back off, especially when talking about a few % resistance points.
4) I support looking at and possibly changing all faction/deadspace/officer modules. The whole carebear until you get a super CNR/MS is WoW/lame-MMORPG stuff that I really wish EVE would get rid of.
Please stay away until you learn to understand and comprehend what you read.
All of the constructive posts in this thread do not explicitly mind rebalancing shield resist modules, but the way a single module type was picked out and broken in regards to faction flavour.
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Mioelnir
KULT Production
Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2008.03.18 01:28:00 -
[5]
You might want to reread #76. Then call me a troll if you like.
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Mioelnir
KULT Production
Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2008.03.18 11:59:00 -
[6]
Meta level wasn't necessarily added recently, but made visible recently.
The loot tables most likely work with this number to enumerate different versions of the same module for a long time already.
I guess one simple call from game balancing to game design would have told Nozh why those modules where the way they were. It's sad.
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Mioelnir
KULT Production
Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2008.03.19 13:42:00 -
[7]
Originally by: CCP Nozh
The reason I looked into them in the first place was from defects created from numerous bug reports regarding people getting worse than T1 loot from officer spawns, which is of course unfair. Module balance does follow meta-levels, the higher the meta-level, the better.
And because of that Pith and Gith needed to be made the same? Estamel and Tobias?
Why not only one module called "Deadspace Kinetic Shield Resistance Amplifier" that everyone drops? Pirate Faction modules weren't put into the pirate faction LP stores because "we try to minimize the amount of locations where you can get the same items" (CCP Greyscale) and you increased them 
Originally by: CCP Nozh
I'll be taking a look at the shield amplifiers again. I'll post information in the "Game Development Forum" by the end of the day.
Thank you.
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Mioelnir
KULT Production
Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2008.03.19 13:54:00 -
[8]
Originally by: CCP Nozh
I'll try to deviate them a bit more, but keep in mind, with modules like these I've only got two attributes to play around with.
I know, and believe me, I didn't throw a party either when a Raid Leader NPC dropped a Republic Fleet Reflective Plating or a Gallente Navy Small Smartbomb.
But not every module from a faction line can be equally good. And if one of the factions characteristics is "low cap consumption", well, then you've simply lost if you get a passive module 
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Mioelnir
KULT Production
Atrum Tempestas Foedus
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Posted - 2008.03.19 14:39:00 -
[9]
Originally by: CCP Greyscale
I don't know exactly which thread I made that reference in so I'm not sure exactly what was said, but the thinking there was that we wanted to reduce the number of items obtainable from multiple distribution mechanics (LP store, asteroid belt drops, mission rewards, deadspace complexes etc) to prevent price distortions propagating across different professions in an adverse manner. This has no bearing on differentiation between items coming from the same distribution mechanic (deadspace drops in this case). Sorry if there was any confusion there!
That was what I meant, I just couldn't express it so nice.
I stand corrected *bows head*.
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