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Goumindong	Posted - 2008.04.06 03:35:00 - [151] Edited by: Goumindong on 06/04/2008 03:35:35 Originally by: Matrixcvd Edited by: Matrixcvd on 06/04/2008 02:22:23 Originally by: Goumindong Not true, any gang cannot simply run away, since doing so requires being faster than the target. NO IT DOES NOT, BEING "FASTER THAN YOUR TARGET IS NOT THE POINT YOU R3TARD this is why you are so full of garbage, and know nothing about EVE. On gate fights, Aggro determines who gets away, whoever "manages aggro" against a gate determines who lives and who dies. If you MWD and align to closest celestial you have an excellent chance of escape. Tactics and discipline is what determines who lives and who dies. BS gangs can get away from nano's Your stupidity is inescapable like lag in this game. You will do anything to show nano is no good but you are just full of crap. Nothing that you say makes sense, its so ridiculous A bs gang that gets away from nanos is doing one of two things. 1: Attempting to warp out of a bubble 2: running back to the gate So the nano's do what? some jump through to the other side while the rest try and nuke what they can, then de-aggress jump through and kill what was tackled. This works exceptionally well with two hictors. If they attempt to warp out of a bubble. you get points and kill them as they flee. If the fast gang is spreading points as it should be then you are going to catch a lot. E.G. The last time i was flying in a fast gang we had a raven and some inties jump into us. The raven aggresses[small gang], and the inties look for low hanging fruit. I, in a crusader, overload my mwd and catch the crow, waste the crow as the raven deaggresses and then jumps though. I had time to warp to the gate, jump through and tackle the raven before it was able to run. Except this time it was 15km off the gate and there was no chance of getting back. Had the raven jumped, we had a tackler jump through initially to catch him on the other side[came back when the raven aggressed]. Result: Dead raven Losses: T1 Stabber[which didn't even really need to die, had he been paying attention] http://eve-files.com/dl/154147 Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. Vote Goumindong for CSM[/url]
maralt	Posted - 2008.04.06 10:25:00 - [152] Originally by: Goumindong A bs gang that gets away from nanos is doing one of two things. 1: Attempting to warp out of a bubble 2: running back to the gate So the nano's do what? some jump through to the other side while the rest try and nuke what they can, then de-aggress jump through and kill what was tackled. This works exceptionally well with two hictors. If they attempt to warp out of a bubble. you get points and kill them as they flee. If the fast gang is spreading points as it should be then you are going to catch a lot. E.G. The last time i was flying in a fast gang we had a raven and some inties jump into us. The raven aggresses[small gang], and the inties look for low hanging fruit. I, in a crusader, overload my mwd and catch the crow, waste the crow as the raven deaggresses and then jumps though. I had time to warp to the gate, jump through and tackle the raven before it was able to run. Except this time it was 15km off the gate and there was no chance of getting back. Had the raven jumped, we had a tackler jump through initially to catch him on the other side[came back when the raven aggressed]. Result: Dead raven Losses: T1 Stabber[which didn't even really need to die, had he been paying attention] LOL your example of the raven kill could have been achieved by a plated sensor boosted BC or BS gang with a webber fitted ffs and has nothing what so ever to do with nano ships, in fact apart from you over loading your crusaders mwd no real speed was needed in that engagment at all..
Matrixcvd	Posted - 2008.04.06 14:35:00 - [153] thank you, someone else finally recognizes his useless situations, ridiculous analysis, and his "opinions" devoid of reality. Nano's are fine, they serve their purpose. Roaming games use them so they can move around quickly, when i want a bunch of heavy hitters we bring RR, when we need to take or defend a system we bring snipers + support. Logistics/EWAR are always a part of what good fleets bring, they aren't an accessory they are mandatory. People see nano's and think they are everywhere, because people use them to roam, people see them in their home systems. They aren't so much a problem when you have 2 gangs lookin for a fight, the nanowhiners don't like people flying all over their space killing their ships... too bad, nano is fine, have a fast reaction force or sit in station...
Goumindong	Posted - 2008.04.06 17:13:00 - [154] Originally by: maralt LOL your example of the raven kill could have been achieved by a plated sensor boosted BC or BS gang with a webber fitted ffs and has nothing what so ever to do with nano ships, in fact apart from you over loading your crusaders mwd no real speed was needed in that engagment at all.. Irrelevant, the question was not "could the target be killed with a larger ship" the question was "Could the target run away from the nano-gang" The answer to the question would be "no, you can't run away", and as such my assertion is true and the assertion that i was refuting[that you can just run away in larger ships] is false. http://eve-files.com/dl/154147 Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. Vote Goumindong for CSM[/url]
maralt The seers of truth	Posted - 2008.04.06 17:25:00 - [155] Edited by: maralt on 06/04/2008 17:31:57 Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: maralt LOL your example of the raven kill could have been achieved by a plated sensor boosted BC or BS gang with a webber fitted ffs and has nothing what so ever to do with nano ships, in fact apart from you over loading your crusaders mwd no real speed was needed in that engagment at all.. Irrelevant, the question was not "could the target be killed with a larger ship" the question was "Could the target run away from the nano-gang" The answer to the question would be "no, you can't run away", and as such my assertion is true and the assertion that i was refuting[that you can just run away in larger ships] is false. The raven could not have "ran away" from a sensor boosted BS with tackle let alone a interceptor, the example was a waste of a post and made no sense or proved anything what so ever. I really do not think you have any real xp at nano fighting or even good gang pvp cos your examples and thoughts are very basic in terms of gang warfare.
Goumindong Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.04.06 17:43:00 - [156] Originally by: maralt Edited by: maralt on 06/04/2008 17:31:57 Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: maralt LOL your example of the raven kill could have been achieved by a plated sensor boosted BC or BS gang with a webber fitted ffs and has nothing what so ever to do with nano ships, in fact apart from you over loading your crusaders mwd no real speed was needed in that engagment at all.. Irrelevant, the question was not "could the target be killed with a larger ship" the question was "Could the target run away from the nano-gang" The answer to the question would be "no, you can't run away", and as such my assertion is true and the assertion that i was refuting[that you can just run away in larger ships] is false. The raven could not have "ran away" from a sensor boosted BS with tackle let alone a interceptor, the example was a waste of a post and made no sense or proved anything what so ever. I really do not think you have any real xp at nano fighting or even good gang pvp cos your examples and thoughts are very basic in terms of gang warfare. O.K. ill go over this slowly for you It doesn't matter what else the raven could not have run away from[in fact the specific problem is how easy it is for the nano-ships to run away, so anything else the raven cannot run away from cements my argument]. It matters if the heavy ship could run away. If it/they can run away then you would be right there is no less risk in using a nano-ship than in using a normal ship. If they can't run away then you would be wrong in there being no less risk in using a nano-ship over a normal ship. Since it can't that means you're wrong in regards to the risk that ships take when they go and fight. Do you refute that the ships would be able to get away? If so, how do you propose they do that? Vote Goumindong for CSM
maralt	Posted - 2008.04.06 18:40:00 - [157] Edited by: maralt on 06/04/2008 18:41:31 Originally by: Goumindong O.K. ill go over this slowly for you It doesn't matter what else the raven could not have run away from[in fact the specific problem is how easy it is for the nano-ships to run away, so anything else the raven cannot run away from cements my argument]. It matters if the heavy ship could run away. If it/they can run away then you would be right there is no less risk in using a nano-ship than in using a normal ship. If they can't run away then you would be wrong in there being no less risk in using a nano-ship over a normal ship. Since it can't that means you're wrong in regards to the risk that ships take when they go and fight. Do you refute that the ships would be able to get away? If so, how do you propose they do that? So you have managed to prove that a small fast ship can get away from big slow ships and big slow ships find it hard or imposable to get away from small FAST ships?. Well duh lol. PS; getting away is easy, Jump through the gate and fragwarp its untackleable by anything apart from a dic or a hic.
Goumindong	Posted - 2008.04.06 19:17:00 - [158] Edited by: Goumindong on 06/04/2008 19:19:12 Originally by: maralt No matter how slowly you say it your still either not making much sense, stating the blindingly obvious or your English is not up to the job . But you seem to have managed to prove that a small fast ship can get away from big slow ships and big slow ships find it hard or imposable to get away from small fast ships?. Well duh!!!! lol. PS; Getting away is easy, Jump through the gate and fragwarp its untackleable by anything apart from a dic or a hic. http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=728665&page=5#148 Originally by: maralt Originally by: Goumindong Nope, the nano-gang just runs away and you don't kill them. Any gang can do that so its hardly reason for a nerf and considering the nano guys are out for kills running away = fail. So are you lying now, were you lying them, or are you going to admit you are wrong? edit: I have never head the term "fragwarp". I know how to warp fast with an MWD and cloak, but not a "fragwarp". Also note the "unless they have a dictor or hictor" stipulation] http://eve-files.com/dl/154147 Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. Vote Goumindong for CSM
maralt	Posted - 2008.04.06 19:22:00 - [159] Originally by: Goumindong Edited by: Goumindong on 06/04/2008 19:19:12 Originally by: maralt No matter how slowly you say it your still either not making much sense, stating the blindingly obvious or your English is not up to the job . But you seem to have managed to prove that a small fast ship can get away from big slow ships and big slow ships find it hard or imposable to get away from small fast ships?. Well duh!!!! lol. PS; Getting away is easy, Jump through the gate and fragwarp its untackleable by anything apart from a dic or a hic. http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=728665&page=5#148 Originally by: maralt Originally by: Goumindong Nope, the nano-gang just runs away and you don't kill them. Any gang can do that so its hardly reason for a nerf and considering the nano guys are out for kills running away = fail. So are you lying now, were you lying them, or are you going to admit you are wrong? edit: I have never head the term "fragwarp". I know how to warp fast with an MWD and cloak, but not a "fragwarp". Also note the "unless they have a dictor or hictor" stipulation] Do me and yourself a favor and tell me what you are talking about cos your English and or representation of what you want to convey is unintelligible.
Goumindong Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.04.06 19:51:00 - [160] Originally by: maralt Do me ['And yourself' is extraneous] a favor and tell me what you are talking about, because your English and/or expression of what you want to convey is unintelligible. Unacceptable, see me after class. But since this is so hard lets cover the last conversation. Me: The nano gang can run and the tanked gang cannot, this forms an imbalance in the payoff of each choice You: No, the tanked gang can run too! Me: No, it cannot, this is how you catch them, this is an example You: But a tanked gang can also catch the tanked gang Me: That is irrelevant, what matters is if the tanked gang can run, not whether or not a tanked gang can catch a tanked gang. If you have trouble following that you will need more help than i can give to get you back up to speed. Vote Goumindong for CSM
maralt	Posted - 2008.04.06 20:03:00 - [161] Id hardly call the fact that all of a slow moving gang cannot get away from a fast moving gang as reason to nerf nano's as an e-war gang could get away from a tanked gang as well. The fact is that a well balanced gang can beat any type of focused setup or at the very least stalemate them, while and fleet that lacks variety has another focus fit that can kill it easily or prevent it doing/receiving dmg.
NightmareX	Posted - 2008.04.06 20:05:00 - [162] If the bs gang have ECM and neuts, they can get away with no problems if you jam and neut in the right way. Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
Goumindong Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.04.06 20:49:00 - [163] Originally by: maralt Edited by: maralt on 06/04/2008 20:11:17 Id hardly call the fact that all of a slow moving gang cannot get away from a fast moving gang as reason to nerf nano's as an e-war gang could get away from a tanked gang as well. The fact is that a well balanced gang can beat any type of focused setup (including nano's) or at the very least stalemate them, while a fleet that lacks variety has another focus fit in game that can kill it easily or prevent it doing dmg. Then why don't you fly mixed gangs? Vote Goumindong for CSM
maralt The seers of truth	Posted - 2008.04.06 20:53:00 - [164] Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: maralt Id hardly call the fact that all of a slow moving gang cannot get away from a fast moving gang as reason to nerf nano's as an e-war gang could get away from a tanked gang as well. The fact is that a well balanced gang can beat any type of focused setup (including nano's) or at the very least stalemate them, while a fleet that lacks variety has another focus fit in game that can kill it easily or prevent it doing dmg. Then why don't you fly mixed gangs? I do ive got logistics 5 bud i rarely fly nanos since i left tri.
Goumindong Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.04.06 21:15:00 - [165] and how many nano-gangs have you killed since leaving? Losses, etc. Vote Goumindong for CSM
maralt The seers of truth	Posted - 2008.04.06 21:27:00 - [166] Originally by: Goumindong and how many nano-gangs have you killed since leaving? Losses, etc. I have no idea how many nano gangs i have fought in the last 12 months or so but we virtually always come out on top even if was just one kill and taking 0 no losses. But the same can be said about ewar fitted gangs or pure dps/tanked guys.
Goumindong Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.04.06 21:29:00 - [167] Originally by: maralt Originally by: Goumindong and how many nano-gangs have you killed since leaving? Losses, etc. I have no idea how many nano gangs i have fought in the last 12 months or so but we virtually always come out on top even if was just one kill and taking 0 no losses. But the same can be said about ewar fitted gangs or pure dps/tanked guys. And how do you kill those maybe one kills. I would kinda like a link too. Vote Goumindong for CSM
maralt The seers of truth	Posted - 2008.04.06 21:44:00 - [168] Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: maralt Originally by: Goumindong and how many nano-gangs have you killed since leaving? Losses, etc. I have no idea how many nano gangs i have fought in the last 12 months or so but we virtually always come out on top even if was just one kill and taking 0 no losses. But the same can be said about ewar fitted gangs or pure dps/tanked guys. And how do you kill those maybe one kills. I would kinda like a link too. What part of we fly mixed fleets are you missing?. Logistics, ewar, dps how many times do i need to say it or are you so inexperienced that you cannot figure out how to use a mixed fleet?.
Goumindong Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.04.06 21:49:00 - [169] Originally by: maralt Edited by: maralt on 06/04/2008 21:47:58 Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: maralt Originally by: Goumindong and how many nano-gangs have you killed since leaving? Losses, etc. I have no idea how many nano gangs i have fought in the last 12 months or so but we virtually always come out on top even if was just one kill and taking 0 no losses. But the same can be said about ewar fitted gangs or pure dps/tanked guys. And how do you kill those maybe one kills. I would kinda like a link too. What part of we fly mixed fleets are you missing?. Logistics, ewar, dps how many times do i need to say it or are you so inexperienced that you cannot figure out how to use a mixed fleet?. That is you dodging the question, not answering it. Vote Goumindong for CSM
maralt The seers of truth	Posted - 2008.04.06 21:55:00 - [170] Originally by: Goumindong That is you dodging the question, not answering it. Well logistics- rep, ewar- webs/damps/jams (depending on what we have) dps pops stuff what do you expect me to tell you?.... its pretty obvious to everybody what ship does what apart from you it seems.
Goumindong	Posted - 2008.04.06 22:01:00 - [171] Originally by: maralt Edited by: maralt on 06/04/2008 21:58:03 Originally by: Goumindong That is you dodging the question, not answering it. Well logistics- rep, ewar- webs/damps/jams (depending on what we have) dps pops stuff what do you expect me to tell you?.... its pretty obvious to everybody what ship does what, well apart from you it seems. Then talk to me like its not, because to me, it seems like the targets should be escaping and that you should have problems with larger gangs. Also, give me a link please. http://eve-files.com/dl/154147 Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. Vote Goumindong for CSM[/url]
maralt	Posted - 2008.04.06 22:07:00 - [172] Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: maralt Originally by: Goumindong That is you dodging the question, not answering it. Well logistics- rep, ewar- webs/damps/jams (depending on what we have) dps pops stuff what do you expect me to tell you?.... its pretty obvious to everybody what ship does what, well apart from you it seems. Then talk to me like its not, because to me, it seems like the targets should be escaping and that you should have problems with larger gangs. Also, give me a link please. I have rarely seen a gang fight where one side lost 100% of its ships unless it was fought by very small gangs so yes ships get away like in every fight that is eve buddy deal with it or are you gonna use it to justify nerfing nano's again. The only cure for zerging is the titan so large gangs/blobs get ignored as i got sick of laggy blob fights a long time ago although size is relative to your own gang and what you have in it.
Goumindong	Posted - 2008.04.06 22:08:00 - [173] Are you going to explain how it works and show me the evidence or are you going to continue to dodge the question? http://eve-files.com/dl/154147 Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. Vote Goumindong for CSM[/url]
maralt	Posted - 2008.04.06 22:14:00 - [174] Edited by: maralt on 06/04/2008 22:13:52 Originally by: Goumindong Are you going to explain how it works and show me the evidence or are you going to continue to dodge the question? Post 174 + teamwork.
Goumindong Merch Industrial GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.04.06 22:24:00 - [175] Originally by: maralt Edited by: maralt on 06/04/2008 22:13:52 Originally by: Goumindong Are you going to explain how it works and show me the evidence or are you going to continue to dodge the question? Post 174 + teamwork. Not an explanation. No, are you going to explain it or are you you going to show me the evidence? Or are you going keep dodging the question? Vote Goumindong for CSM
Goumindong	Posted - 2008.04.06 22:30:00 - [176] Ill critique it, that is for sure, but if its there, then its there. http://eve-files.com/dl/154147 Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. Vote Goumindong for CSM[/url]
maralt	Posted - 2008.04.06 22:33:00 - [177] Edited by: maralt on 06/04/2008 22:35:45 Originally by: Goumindong Originally by: maralt Edited by: maralt on 06/04/2008 22:13:52 Originally by: Goumindong Are you going to explain how it works and show me the evidence or are you going to continue to dodge the question? Post 174 + teamwork. Not an explanation. No, are you going to explain it or are you you going to show me the evidence? Or are you going keep dodging the question? Explain what..... a fleet fight against nano ships with a mixed fleet?, cos tbh i cannot remember exactly how the fights i had last night in my mega exactly went blow by blow. Wtf do you expect me to tell you or link that can prove a damn thing to somebody who refuses to understand what ive already explained. The logistics ships keep the ewar/tacklers and other ships alive, the ewar web /damp and jam problem ships, the tacklers hold them down, and the dps ships shoot the tackled ships until they go boom ffs. Then repeat until all are dead, or as normally happens those not dead run away. Why are you being deliberately dense or are you really so uneducated in how gang pvp works?.
NightmareX	Posted - 2008.04.06 22:41:00 - [178] Edited by: NightmareX on 06/04/2008 22:47:47 Originally by: Goumindong Not an explanation. No, are you going to explain it or are you you going to show me the evidence? Or are you going keep dodging the question? Explain what..... a fleet fight against nano ships with a mixed fleet?, cos tbh i cannot remember exactly how the fights i had last night in my mega exactly went blow by blow. Wtf do you expect me to tell you or link that can prove a damn thing to somebody who refuses to understand what ive already explained. The logistics ships keep the ewar/tacklers and other ships alive, the ewar web /damp and jam problem ships, the tacklers hold them down, and the dps ships shoot the tackled ships until they go boom ffs. Then repeat until all are dead, or as normally happens those not dead run away. Why are you being deliberately dense or are you really so uneducated in how gang pvp works?. Dude, that goon noob doesn't know ** about PVP, SERIOUSLY, because we have been trying to tell him ** loads of times how the different ships works against nano fitted ships, and how you easily can kill a nano gang with other ships than nano ships. Like 46+ pages in the first topic. And he's still don't get it. It only prooves that he can't PVP or have no experience in PVP. Waste of time to argue with a person that already have made his mind about nanos. Let him be in his dreamworld. Please visit your user settings to re-enable images.
maralt	Posted - 2008.04.06 22:51:00 - [179] Edited by: maralt on 06/04/2008 22:54:36 Originally by: NightmareX Originally by: Goumindong Not an explanation. No, are you going to explain it or are you you going to show me the evidence? Or are you going keep dodging the question? Explain what..... a fleet fight against nano ships with a mixed fleet?, cos tbh i cannot remember exactly how the fights i had last night in my mega exactly went blow by blow. Wtf do you expect me to tell you or link that can prove a damn thing to somebody who refuses to understand what ive already explained. The logistics ships keep the ewar/tacklers and other ships alive, the ewar web /damp and jam problem ships, the tacklers hold them down, and the dps ships shoot the tackled ships until they go boom ffs. Then repeat until all are dead, or as normally happens those not dead run away. Why are you being deliberately dense or are you really so uneducated in how gang pvp works?. Dude, that goon noob doesn't know ** about PVP, because we have been trying to tell him ** loads of times how the different ships works against nano fitted ships, and how you easily can kill a nano gang. Like 45+ pages in the first topic. And he's still don't get it. It only prooves that he can't PVP or have no experience in PVP. Waste of time to argue with a person that already have made his mind about nanos. Let him be in his dreamworld. M8 ive fought in tri with nano ships and we had problems and did lose ships to logistic setups, ive flown with burn eden in BS and killed nano setups with ravens and mixed ewar, now i fly anything and everything to fit in with our mixed fleets, and ive been playing since 2003 but this guys is being deliberately ignorant cos nobody can be that naturaly ignorant about pvp unless they have ran mission all there eve life or summat.
NightmareX Quam Singulari Triumvirate.	Posted - 2008.04.06 23:02:00 - [180] maralt, i know you have been in Triumvirate.

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