| Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Erotic Irony
   |
Posted - 2008.03.30 23:57:00 -
[61]
 Originally by: Feng Schui
After Scripts (Yes, still on the same ships, but now all skills are maxed out), you now need:
ECM: Same (2 ecm's for 1 person)
Target Painters: Same (1 target painter for 1 person)
Damps: 6 Damps for 1 person (4 targeting range, 2 scan res)
Tracking Disruptors: 6 TD's for 1 person (3 Optimal+Falloff scripts, 3 tracking speed)
this is an ecm whine thread dear, you're embarrassing yourself
___
Eve Players are not very smart.
Support Killmail Overhaul
|
Le Skunk
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 00:23:00 -
[62]
Having flown both arazu and falcon - pre nerf and after. I can agree with the OP that the falcon is VASTLY overpowered.
The arazu is a hunk of junk, in its present format. CCP ballsed the nerf right up - but it takes them about a year to get that through thier heads.
"HAI GUYS - SHALL I BRING MY FALCON OR MY ARAZU"
95% of people yell falcon.
SKUNK
|
Angelic Eviaran
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 01:02:00 -
[63]
Edited by: Angelic Eviaran on 31/03/2008 01:02:49
Originally by: maralt
All other recons >>>>>>>>>> falcon in every other way.
Are you stupid or something? Compare how many amarr and gallente recons you see to amounts of falcons and rapiers. You lie and you fail.
|
maralt
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 01:25:00 -
[64]
Originally by: Angelic Eviaran
Edited by: Angelic Eviaran on 31/03/2008 01:02:49
Originally by: maralt
All other recons >>>>>>>>>> falcon in every other way.
Are you stupid or something? Compare how many amarr and gallente recons you see to amounts of falcons and rapiers. You lie and you fail.
I see plenty of all apart from the amarr ones tbqh but that just means amarr needs a boost not that the others need a nerf.
PS:I never fail and i do not lie, i suggest you try to be a bit more polite in future if you wanna join a discussion on this forum.
Reported in hopes a warning or short ban forces you to grow up and be a bit more polite in your posting when joining a forum debate
|
maralt
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 01:28:00 -
[65]
Edited by: maralt on 31/03/2008 01:28:11
double post
|
Relyen
Digital Fury Corporation
Digital Renegades
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 01:43:00 -
[66]
Here is my solution to ECM, it worked just recently.
During a Fight between AXE/DFC and BRUCE.
I was getting jammed 60-80% of the time for a short while. I said in fleet
"Getting perma jammed by soAndSo".
30-60 seconds later, I was no longer getting jammed :P
ECM is just fine.
|
Daelin Blackleaf
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 02:20:00 -
[67]
Imagine having four types of sensor dampener that work best on only one race while working very poorly on the others and a fifth that works at greatly reduced range and strength with increased cap use but works equally on all.
Now imagine ECM was just one module, you take the script out and it works as a multi-spec and you have one script for each race producing the effect of racial jammers.
ECM and Damps are different:
The former would leave Damps horrendously underpowered.
The latter would leave ECM massively overpowered.
...and that ladies and gents is why ECM doesn't have scripts. It's so effective that to balance it they broke it up into separate modules.
I'm not saying damps don't need looking at, but ECM is fine. A recon should be able to hamper multiple ships, if it can't it's typically a pilot going to waste. Give it time and keep it in the public eye (with suggestions rather than counter nerfs or whines), CCP will probably take just as long to get damps to the right place as they have taken with ECM but hopefully they will get there.
 Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. |
Feng Schui
Ghost Festival
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 03:03:00 -
[68]
Range or Strength scripts.
Want to jam from 150km range? Ok, but you get crap strength. Want to be able to run ECM's the way they are now? Ok, you need to operate within 20km range.
Project:Gank
Pilgrim Guide
|
Selnix
North Eastern Swat
Pandemic Legion
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 03:14:00 -
[69]
Somewhat overly long summary of thread to this point for the tl:dr crowd...
ECM and more specifically the Falcon is grossly overpowered. Not only is the Falcon overpowered, it is invincible.
Reasons:
1.) Falcons can jam any ship in game 100% of the time from 250km.
2.) Falcons are the only ship in game that has an offensive module which works on every ship in game equally. Take for instance, attacking an evil isk farming Raven. Arazus have to fit Caldari RSD and warp disruptors or they will only be able to damp and scram it a small percentage of the time. Rapiers must fit Caldari webs and target painters or the Raven will be able to zip around with its tiny sig radius with impunity as they fail web after web after web. Pilgrims must fit those pesky old Caldari energy neuts or that Raven will just sit there tanking forever as they watch their module sit there blinking, eating capacitor while the farmer laughs and shoots at them.
3.) Falcons put out omgwtfbbq damage per second. No other cruiser hulled ship in game can put out the raw dps of a Falcon with those 2 heavy missile launchers and 1 rail gun. No other cruiser hulled ship can do so much damage at half of its optimal operating range either while doing absolutely none at anything over half of its EW optimal.
4.) Falcons can tank like nobody's business. No other ship in game can be so dang uber while tanking so hard. Everyone knows that Falcons fit an 8 high slot epeen tank, leaving all their mids and lows open for the EW modules and EW boosting modules that are so outrageously overpowered that they need the support modules to even be moderately effective. Because of that tank they have no worries when a single sniper gets a lock and melts their shield/armor/hull before their module cycles again to try and ECM it.
5.) Deva Blackfire and Le Skunk speak an unbiased and utterly naked truth about Falcons and ECM. Their first-hand knowledge of how *easy mode* flying such an uber ship is speaks all that needs to be spoken on the topic. Deva having flown so many Caldari ships in pvp during his career that his use of Minmatar and Amarr ships is almost non-existant to the point of exclusiveness. And you can't forget Le Skunk and his love of lowsec gate camping in a ship that does so much for him in a camp of gank fitted battleships, lock time fitted lachesis and heavy interdictors, and logistics to help tank the gate guns. The Falcon's ability to just sit there tanking those guns while keeping that hostile hauler from locking anything during the 5 seconds it survives after jumping into his camp even though the Falcon with signature analysis V likely won't even target the hauler before it explodes is insane.
/Sarcasm off
Until the Falcon can do even 10 or 20 dps from its optimal operating range and can active or passive tank while being able to have an effect on more than one or two races of vessels at a time, it seems pretty well balanced. I don't want to see the Arazu, Pilgrim and Rapier lose their drones, tankability, speed or overall utility. If you look at the Falcon though, it can do none of those things while still doing what everyone is complaining about (and it can't do the things people accuse it of being capable of for the most part unless the stars are all aligned and the moons are all in the right phase and they brought exactly the perfect set of ECM and such). Any nerf to the Falcon should result in an equal nerf to the other recons in that they should be only able to have their modules affect a single race at full strength at a time, forcing them to fit solely for web/neut/damp if they want to be able to EW any ship they come across as they won't have slots open for tank/speed/gank any more either.
CCP has given us more than enough nerfs already. Bump up the bonuses on the Arazu to bring it back to pre-nerf status on RSD and things will be as they should be.
|
Methem
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 06:05:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Feng Schui
you need to operate within 20km range.
Stop trolling. This is clearly irrational thinking.
Caldari Recon survival depends on range.
If CCP would fix damps, Falcons would have a much more difficult time fulfilling their role.. Pre-damp nerf I had my Falcon shut down by a Lachesis on multiple occasions.
Boost Damps and boost the Pilgrim(range).
STOP THE NERFS
|
Carniflex
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 06:08:00 -
[71]
Ahh. You mean like having only one ECM multispec module and then 'racial' scripts ?  Yes. I do like that idea.
Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. |
Deva Blackfire
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 06:56:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Selnix
Deva having flown so many Caldari ships in pvp during his career that his use of Minmatar and Amarr ships is almost non-existant to the point of exclusiveness.
its really cool that you cheack killboard of my main who can not fly even caldari frigate. Next time check my alt results who is pure caldari. Oh wait - you dunno his name... and you prolly wont till you get jammed.
Also your "sarcasm" is badly placed anyways. "250km" while i speak about 150-200km range (and its fairly easy to get falcon to 200km - do you even know about rigs?).
And yes - in small gang combat falcon IS invincible. Happy? Never lost falcon to gang under 10 people and never was even close to losing one. I know you like flying in 50-100 man goon blobs in which yeah - its hard to ECM everything. But surprise: there is much more in eve than your crap blobs. And thats where falcons can imbalance gameplay. In SMALL gang combat.
In large scale it doesnt matter which recon you fly - they are pretty useless (only web recons are decent with removing tacklers).
Quote:
Any nerf to the Falcon should result in an equal nerf to the other recons in that they should be only able to have their modules affect a single race at full strength at a time, forcing them to fit solely for web/neut/damp if they want to be able to EW any ship they come across as they won't have slots open for tank/speed/gank any more either
Told you already - no problem with this. As long as my neuts have 80-90% of instadraining cap on any ship. "overpowered"? No - just exactly same and "fun" for target as being jammed - you become useless in one clock of module.
|
Siigari Kitawa
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 08:18:00 -
[73]
Edited by: Siigari Kitawa on 31/03/2008 08:19:38
Originally by: Mahn AlNouhm
Edited by: Mahn AlNouhm on 30/03/2008 23:17:05
You've cherry picked your arguments throughout the course of this thread losing your credibility in the process. -snip-
First of all, I am not afraid of ECM. I killed a Widow in my Arazu with my Broadsword and Hurricane corpmates. He was sitting RIGHT NEXT my friends on a gate in lowsec and had them pre-locked. We killed him, and he had a full rack of ECM (6 ecms and 2 other fittings).
He had faith in his ECM. His ECM failed. I know ECM does not ALWAYS hit so I am not arguing a lop-sided argument. I have an understanding of how it works, but I'm not into specifics; I am simply going off numbers that I am reading elsewhere and making educated guesses.
Simple fact is, ECM is so overpowered that the other recons (RECONS) should be at the same level. When one ship sticks out like a sore thumb CCP has a history of beating it into the ground with the nerfbat instead of lifting others up.
Why were damps nerfed? Because non-spec'd ships were getting away with using them all the time. Is this nerf fair? No. Why? Because it's a MODULE FOR F*CK'S SAKE, AND ANY SHIP CAN FIT ANY MODULE (with exceptions).
ECM is the all-around "neener neener" and I am calling you out as a FOTM Falcon pilot who is upset because I've hit your sweet spot, so you cover yourself with wall-of-text verbage:
Originally by: Mahn AlNouhm
Oh, and if I gank someone in low sec, I can't even dock up to switch for 15 minutes.
I don't care! You're just talking because you like to hear yourself speak, I think.
Listen to what the others in the thread have to say and have a discussion with them. I posted this thread to bring an awareness to the community that ECMs are overpowered when placed next to other recons who have no way to "enhance" their EW.
So Mahn AlNouhm, reply to others or next thread.
Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. |
Daelin Blackleaf
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 10:18:00 -
[74]
Originally by: Feng Schui
Range or Strength scripts.
Want to jam from 150km range? Ok, but you get crap strength. Want to be able to run ECM's the way they are now? Ok, you need to operate within 20km range.
Caldari being the long range race should have EW that is most effective at close range?
On ships with no tank?
A strength reduction would result in the ships being unable to hamper more than one foe, making them almost useless and a waste of a pilot. What we need is to find ways to make the Gallente recons and pilgrim more viable, not make the entire more recons pretty much unusable.
The only real problem with ECM is the Falcon's ECM strength bonus should be 15% and not 20%.
Please visit your user settings to re-enable images. |
Nemtar Nataal
Demonic Retribution
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 11:20:00 -
[75]
Originally by: Siigari Kitawa
So my complaint is what makes it fair for you to have a 100% chance (or very darn close) to jam like, 2 ships permanently while I can only keep targets down to at best a 20km targeting range? (4 t2 damps w/ Sig Sup. 4 and recon 5)
And that's ALL FOUR DAMPS. I can't multitask with an Arazu to lock down 2-3 people.
Even with a signal booster module, it would still be subject to a stacking penalty so it wouldn't buff that much.
See what I mean?
Man your ship still have DPS you dont have to fit 3 low slot modules to be able to jam ****!
When CCP changes the Arazu to be able to do ONLY damps we can talk about scripts for ECM or somthing equally stupid.
The problem is that people alwayes wants to translate one ship and its roles to another ship, thats not the way it works. ECM ships do one thing, and RSD ships do another.
I do agree that damps could use a slight boost to be able to counter ECM but nerfing ECM cause you feel left out isnt the answer. Its like when ECM got nerfed the frist time people cryed out in terror that damps should be nerfed. Now damps are being changed to be more of a dedicated ship weapon. M8 give ccp time and they will sort out the damp problem.
You also have to remember that damps do more then just 1 thing and they are 100% effective where as ECM are chance based. Nice little side node that people tend to forget.
A dedicated ECM pilote can get about 15 points from a racial jammer, most T2 cruisers have that and/or more (not counting recons as they have insain sensor strengths). If you want a bether cahance to defend against a ECM ship fit a ECCM module and drop your sensor booster after all thats the problem that people fit sensor booster and dont think abour that its the best counter for RSD.
Most ships this dayes fly with RSD counter measures, so you can drop that for a ECM counter measure. Its one thing or the other you will never be 100% invulnable to EW and have a perfect tank.
Its a rock paper scissors game if you do one thing you sacrofize another, its a choice you make as a pilote.
And i will point out once again that if RSD needs a boost they should remove the strength bonus from the ship and replace it with a optimal range bonus to have the RSD be more effective at long ranges. After all you dont need a lot of dampening at long ranges to desable a Falcon/rook as they are usually sitting at the absulut optimal range of there EW equipment.
|
maralt
The seers of truth
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 13:27:00 -
[76]
Edited by: maralt on 31/03/2008 13:31:15
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
And yes - in small gang combat falcon IS invincible. Happy? Never lost falcon to gang under 10 people and never was even close to losing one. I know you like flying in 50-100 man goon blobs in which yeah - its hard to ECM everything. But surprise: there is much more in eve than your crap blobs. And thats where falcons can imbalance gameplay. In SMALL gang combat.
EDIT:
as for ships used
around 34% are minnie recons
around 33% are caldari recons
around 17% are gal
around 16% are amarr
So if we dont include minnie ones (which as all know have little different ewar ability and are needed more often due to nanoships) caldari have MAJOR advantage in numbers over others.
There is nothing stopping both small gangs from bringing a falcon or even two and that is where the nerf minded always fall apart in there crying. The fact is that gallente need to be un-nerfed and the amarr ship needs a boost.
But then all we would see is ppl complaining that the amarr ship is to uber a solo pwn mobile and others complaining about gallente damps again. The fact is that ppl are reducing one ship then another then another because they suck too much at pvp to deal with them.
|
Stakhanov
Metafarmers
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 16:22:00 -
[77]
While I don't like the thought of nerfing ewar (RIP celestis) ECM strength and range scripts make sense. Range scripted falcons would still partly work as a get out of trouble free card , but not permajam as many targets (especially not other recons or ECCMed BS / capitals)
I think the rook can be fitted to survive medium range fights especially with good support (friends keeping threats webbed out of range , or shield transfering logistics) thanks to its high base resists. A shield extender or 2 can increase its lifespan as well. Hell , fit polycarbs to get its speed and agility up.
There's always the option to load no script - average strength (pre-trinity ?) and average range (60-80km on falcon ?) if you don't want to deal with drone aggro / FoF but can handle enemy tacklers ; makes better use of the eos gang links. Also a reason to sit at the edge of your missiles' range.
Originally by: Istvaan Shogaatsu
edit: Wow, that was unpleasant, I felt pity for someone. Won't happen again.
|
Deva Blackfire
D00M.
Triumvirate.
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 18:36:00 -
[78]
Originally by: maralt
There is nothing stopping both small gangs from bringing a falcon or even two and that is where the nerf minded always fall apart in there crying.
Aaaand here we have another moot point. "There is nothing stopping people to bring nanophoon to counter nanphoon." "There is nothing stopping people to bring 8 sink geddon to counter 8 sink geddon".
There is: ship shouldnt be a counter for itself. Its rock-paper-scissors game not rock-rock-scissors game.
Thats why 8 sink geddon was nerfed. Thats why nanophoon got hit by nerfbat. Guess whos next on the "bring it to counter itself" list.
|
maralt
The seers of truth
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 19:06:00 -
[79]
Edited by: maralt on 31/03/2008 19:09:52
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
Originally by: maralt
There is nothing stopping both small gangs from bringing a falcon or even two and that is where the nerf minded always fall apart in there crying. The fact is that gallente need to be un-nerfed and the amarr ship needs a boost.
But then all we would see is ppl complaining that the amarr ship is to uber a solo pwn mobile and others complaining about gallente damps again. The fact is that ppl are reducing one ship then another then another because they suck too much at pvp to deal with them.
Aaaand here we have another moot point. "There is nothing stopping people to bring nanophoon to counter nanphoon." "There is nothing stopping people to bring 8 sink geddon to counter 8 sink geddon".
There is: ship shouldnt be a counter for itself. Its rock-paper-scissors game not rock-rock-scissors game.
Thats why 8 sink geddon was nerfed. Thats why nanophoon got hit by nerfbat. Guess whos next on the "bring it to counter itself" list.
Your entire argument relies on the falcon pilot locking every ship in range (although a long range sniper kinda blows you argument away) and getting a jam on them all before he is either locked, damped, jammed himself or a dmg dealer gets a volley or two off and insta pops him.
Theres plenty of answers to the falcon and if you had any pvp or gang/team work skills worthy of note the falcon would not be something you think needs a nerf.
|
Karina Bellac
Republic Military School
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 19:47:00 -
[80]
A simple fix for damps is the low slot module called Signal Suppression Amplifier. For an example of a similar low slot module, have a look at Signal Distortion Amplifier.
They're the things a Falcon fills all three of its low slots with to actually get effective ECM. |
Ulstan
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 21:41:00 -
[81]
ECM's are already on scripts
You have a separate scripted version for each race, and then a non scripted multi spectral version.
This is like asking for scripts for turrets - already in game. It's called ammo.
|
Karina Bellac
Republic Military School
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 21:55:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Ulstan
ECM's are already on scripts
You have a separate scripted version for each race, and then a non scripted multi spectral version.
This is like asking for scripts for turrets - already in game. It's called ammo.
Eh?
Scripts can be changed without the use of a fitting facility.
ECM cannot. |
maralt
The seers of truth
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 22:01:00 -
[83]
Originally by: Karina Bellac
Originally by: Ulstan
ECM's are already on scripts
You have a separate scripted version for each race, and then a non scripted multi spectral version.
This is like asking for scripts for turrets - already in game. It's called ammo.
Eh?
Scripts can be changed without the use of a fitting facility.
ECM cannot.
Then its a boost not a nerf cos scripts can refit in space depending on what ship race you are fighting.
|
Tobias Sjodin
Ore Mongers
Black Hand.
|
Posted - 2008.03.31 22:05:00 -
[84]
Edited by: Tobias Sjodin on 31/03/2008 22:06:29
Just no.
All types of EWAR makes fights more versatile and less predictable.
There are plenty of counters, ECCM being one, another being drones, a third being smartbombs, a fourth being FOF's, a fifth being a dictor bubble (at least in 0.0) a sixth being a sensor boosted / ECCM scorp. Put a covops pilot near where the falcon is sitting, warp a HIC on it's position activate bubble. An Onyx could F.O.F it, etc.
Falcon is paperthin.
WTF happened to people adapting? Now it's just kids whining overpowered to any viable tactic in the game. Meh.
Black Hand.
|
Tibilo
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 00:04:00 -
[85]
its not just ecm ships like the falcon being overpowered
but also that other ewar isnt as effective, such as damps.
Recon ships role is too disadvantage an enemy ship in some way.
In this the minmater and ammar are useful in many situations as webs and nos/neut are useful in a vast number of situations. they both help to kill your target or to prevent them from defending themselves.caldari and gallente are useful for preventing the enemy from harming you for this the caldari recons are vastly superior
tracking disrupters also reduce the enemy chance at harming you but they are only usefull against certain ships and aren't really in the same class as ecm/damps
The caldari can prevent ships from jamming, using racials they
can prevent more ships from fighting than any other recon
and they can do this at a range that is well beyond ships in a small gang locking range
the gallente reduce targeting range or speed however to be of use it needs to be able to damp
a target so that its lock range is lower than the recons gang damage dealing range, to do this often every fitted damp is needed for one ship or it can reduce its targeting speed so that it cant get a lock before its lost already.
However in either case why not use ecm.
damping forces enemy ships to come closer to be able to fight which for gallente ships gives them an advantage
with their higher close range damage. however only damping 1 or 2 ships to under normal scram range
without a longer lock time isnt all that helpful especially when you could have twice as many ships near permajammed. decreasing lock time on ships is only really useful if you get a lock first and are likely to be in a winning postion before the target can lock or if they lose lock occasionally for example a falcon to jam and a arazu to reduce lock time but you would be better with 2 falcons as a greater number of ships can be more effectively disabled.
Perhaps the rook/falcon shouldn't be able to near permajam so many ships at once at long range while the
lach/arazu should to some extent be able to reduce target range and target speed for a similar number of ships as the caldari recons while at the moment it can only really do both on one ship
|
Praxis1452
The Hoodie Mafia
Cosa Nostra.
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 00:52:00 -
[86]
Edited by: Praxis1452 on 01/04/2008 00:53:53
The problem I have with ECM. It's chanced based. Nobody likes to be jammed with light ecm drones with an overloaded ECCM. I'm sure it's happened. I'm sure people have been jammed with 2x ECCM on battleships. Maybe it doesn't happen often but it makes people ****ed off. When people fit sensor boosters they know exactly how far they can lock. They know that if they are damped etc they can counter that. ECCM is all or nothing, and being able to do nothing for 20 seconds is an eternity if you do get jammed once.
Personally I would nerf the ECM ships only slightly, 5% less per level would not be too much would it? Rather the Arazu get a boost though...
A different solution would be to let jammers have a cycle of 12.5 seconds while having a jam time of 10 seconds. Perhaps a skill that reduces cycle time with base at 15 seconds. Basically this means that a person would get a slight chance to do something even getting a lock for a second is ok allowing them to use drones or hit a neut.
--------------------------------------------
ôHe who must expend his life to prolong life cannot enjoy it, and he who is still seeking for his life does not have it and can as little enjoy it" |
Vanessa Vale
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 08:49:00 -
[87]
Originally by: Jurgen Cartis
You forget, the other Recons all have a secondary form of EW they can use (even if it's usually largely ignored, like the Huginn's TP bonus).
Hahahahaha... yeah, good stuff.
"Hey guys, I'm replacing a web for a tp, just so you know"
sit back and watch the entertaining comments you get :)
Minmatar Boost Brigade |
Mahn AlNouhm
The Bastards
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 14:49:00 -
[88]
Edited by: Mahn AlNouhm on 01/04/2008 14:49:37
If you're replacing a web for tp, you're an idiot. But, say you've already brought tackle in the form of an inty;
"Hey, I'm replacing my disruptor for a tp"
Not quite as funny, huh? Now, try that in a rook:
"Hey guys, I'm replacing a jammer for a disruptor/tp/damp/ew of your choice."
You'd get punched in the c.unt and laughed out of the corp.
.
.
.
|
sliver 0xD
exiles.
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 15:35:00 -
[89]
iam sure there will be a fix for this all. ive already posed some ideas on a previous post where i sugested to boost the effect of all other ew mods and make em depended on the same chance system used by ecm based on the sensor strenght.
then make racial mods for all ew mods. and give natural resistance against a race its own ew type.
for instance.
damps get 85% damp. chance based on sensor strenght of target ship.
1 arazu can damp 1 ship with 1 damp just like the falcon can. its effect that gang members of the arazu are benefitting form the damp like the gang members of the falcon are benefitting of its effect.
the effect will be that in a gang vs gang fight the arazu is no longer pointless but presents a capable damp power that will help defend all gang members that are in 30km range and not just itself at 40km range. the falcon already has this ability becouse ecm jamms 100% range.
also with damps to 85% you only need 1 damp a target and its posible to damp more then 1 target of the enemy gang. falcon has this also it can split the ecm over targets makeing it less chance but disrupting the hole other gang
damp should ofcouse be chance bassed. and sensor strength like the ecm uses presents a good solution for this. the chance base of the ecm will be same as damp and altho a target will be damped or jammed there is still a chance it will not be jammed or damped.
next to damps the target disruptors should also get the same change.
makeing the effect higher but adding a chance basse. makeing ships like the pilgrim usefull in a gang fight.
for the painters this rule could apply but i do not feel happy about the effect a painter has on a frig when the frig gets 85% signiture and gets shot by the first type the chance based system says its active.
also frigs have a lower sensor strenght witch makes the painters effect deatly to a frig.
i think this is a fair solution brining the other ew modules back into use. and giveing the recon ships like the arazu and the pilgrim a beter use in a gang.
why choice the sensor strenght. for all ew mods.
becouse in my view this is the one thing that is
- linked to the system that locks a target
- linked to the system that decides your locking range and time.
- linked to the system that handles the gun accuracy and range.
---
Somebody needs a hug! |
Selnix
North Eastern Swat
Pandemic Legion
|
Posted - 2008.04.01 19:50:00 -
[90]
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
its really cool that you cheack killboard of my main who can not fly even caldari frigate. Next time check my alt results who is pure caldari. Oh wait - you dunno his name... and you prolly wont till you get jammed.
How very noble of you Sir, whining most emphatically about how overpowered the ship your very own top sekrit alt is supposedly specialized for is and asking for it to be reduced to a paperweight station spinner. Quite hilarious how most forum warriors when faced with the truth that the character they post with can not fly the vessel they so despise, comes up with some uberl33t alt that has dedicated several months of training to be as effective as possible with said vessel, and are more than willing to make that character they are paying to play grossly ineffective.
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
do you even know about rigs?
Of course. I have been receiving a bulk purchase discount on rolls of space-worthy duct tape for quite some time now. The tech II bubblegum for keeping wires stuck together mid-battle is regrettably more expensive.
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
I know you like flying in 50-100 man goon blobs in which yeah - its hard to ECM everything. But surprise: there is much more in eve than your crap blobs. And thats where falcons can imbalance gameplay. In SMALL gang combat.
I suppose you were happily carebearing in empire then when Triumverate and Praesidium Liberatis invaded JU-OWQ in Deklein, where I lived at the time as a member of Aftermath Alliance. Our Huge Blobs of 30 or even 40 people attempting to hold space against the 100-150 you consistently brought to the field. Granted, your roaming nano gangs in the evenings were closer to 20 or 30, but maybe it is the fact that we were fitting blackbirds with three Minmatar racial ECM as a counter to your gangs that has you so set against ECM in general.
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
as for ships used
around 34% are minnie recons
around 33% are caldari recons
around 17% are gal
around 16% are amarr
So if we dont include minnie ones (which as all know have little different ewar ability and are needed more often due to nanoships) caldari have MAJOR advantage in numbers over others.
Fixing that statement for ya.... So if we don't include the most used recons in the game, which I fly often on my main then the second most used have a major advantage over the other two races. Ever think that ECM is one of the few effective counters to nanoships, or are you too busy flying said nanoships to ponder such things.
Originally by: Deva Blackfire
ship shouldnt be a counter for itself. Its rock-paper-scissors game not rock-rock-scissors game.
Simple list of ECM/Falcon Counters:
Snipers - BS/HAC/Even the lowly Cormerant and Harpy
Speed - Intys/Vagas/Ishtars/insert ship with polys/snakes here
RSD - Only takes one or two RSD from an Arazu or Lachesis to make a Falcon 100% worthless
Ineherit Sensor Strength - Ever try jamming another Recon or even the majority of battleships and you'll see what this means
Information Warfare Gang Mods - Higher resistance for all ships in gang to being ECM'd
ECCM - Oh noes! a module that more or less doubles how much effort an EW birdy needs to use to jam you
|
| |
|
| Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |