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Cerina Natal
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Posted - 2008.06.07 20:37:00 -
[121]
 Originally by: Kusha'an
This is a nifty idea. They'll never do it because it's a good idea and they didn't think of it.
Thats really not a fair assumption.
While the idear is good and sound i would like to point out that the general problem with implants relate to learning just like learning skills and advanced skills....
Basically the entire system revolving this implants (not hardwirring but the attribute boosters) is essentially flawed - And the solution above is sort of a "quick fix".
 Quick Fix
Well yes it would fix a problem and it sounds like its quick to introduce but TBH the solution is basically a solution that would take so long to implement that CCP could basically put the same time into a new system that would fix all the current problems - A complete rewrite or rather remove learning skills and attribute booster implants.
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Esmenet
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Posted - 2008.06.07 21:14:00 -
[122]
Edited by: Esmenet on 07/06/2008 21:17:21
Originally by: Raven Timoshenko
Edited by: Raven Timoshenko on 06/06/2008 12:22:56
Edited by: Raven Timoshenko on 06/06/2008 12:13:46
Originally by: Esmenet
Lol with a 24 hour cooldown you cant control that for long and so you either choose to stay in a empty clone most of the time with severe penalties on your learning or use whatever level of implants you can afford to keep going.
So..you agree with me???
No. The current system forces you to make a choice between risk and benefits. Yours wont as you know if you think about it, but i doubt you even try to do so. CCP knows this and thats why there is a 24 hr cooldown on jumpclones.
Quote:
Originally by: Esmenet
Your op states it would encourage people to try low sec pvp.
I meant low sec in general, not just 0.0.
Low sec is 0.1-0.4 and the term generally dont include 0.0.
In 0.1-0.4 your pod is practically invulnerable if you know what you are doing like i said a couple of times already. The main threat to pods comes from bubbles.
Quote:
Yes, but they would risk a combat set, since thats what they are for ANYWAY. Who cares if they stop risking learning implants? Just means more combat implants will be blown up rather than learning implants. As you yourself why buy combat implants if you dont plan on using them for Pvp? Implants are NPC manufactured items anyway, so all your doing is shifting the emphasis from learning to combat implants.
No they wont as its the inherent value they dont want to risk. The ones that dont risk implants dont use combat implants either, they use empty clones. There is no insurance on implants and if you use combat imps or +5's their value will generally be many times the loss of a normal t2 fitted pvp ship. In other words there wont be a change in combat implant destruction. You can just keep most of the learnings safe without any disadvantages. And that is bad for the game.
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.06.09 10:56:00 -
[123]
Edited by: Raven Timoshenko on 09/06/2008 11:00:58
Originally by: Esmenet
No. The current system forces you to make a choice between risk and benefits. Yours wont as you know if you think about it, but i doubt you even try to do so. CCP knows this and thats why there is a 24 hr cooldown on jumpclones.
So basically what your saying is that if I want to PvP, I should be penalized arbitrarily for the choice of Pvp. Wonderful.
Originally by: Esmenet
Low sec is 0.1-0.4 and the term generally dont include 0.0.
In 0.1-0.4 your pod is practically invulnerable if you know what you are doing like i said a couple of times already. The main threat to pods comes from bubbles.
Ok but this is nonsense. I have been in multiple wars and have been podded multiple times due to the fact that some ships like interceptors can target and scramble a ship in as little as a few seconds, you CANT warp away because the ingame transition from you ship being destroyed to your pod cause a delay depending on what you current ping rate is, I am plus 6hrs ahead of EVE time, and that about as much as two seconds delay, not counting ingame delay caused by the transition. NO matter how many times you spam the warp button, chances are that if the opponents have a ship with strong sensor resolution your going to die. No matter what you do.
Originally by: Esmenet
No they wont as its the inherent value they dont want to risk. The ones that dont risk implants dont use combat implants either, they use empty clones. There is no insurance on implants and if you use combat imps or +5's their value will generally be many times the loss of a normal t2 fitted pvp ship. In other words there wont be a change in combat implant destruction. You can just keep most of the learnings safe without any disadvantages. And that is bad for the game.
So who says make implants invulnerable? where have I written that the SIA makes what ever implants that you fly with invulnerable? So what if learning implants DONT get destpyed in combat as long as people can then plug in their combat implants, head into battle and loose em? Its a NPC ITEM! It doesnt matter which implant you will be selling on the market from your mission grinding, it just means MORE implants will be destroyed in the process. And its truly fascinating as how you conveniently contradict your own arguments in the same breathe, on the one hand you say people DONT take risks but on the other hnd you say People DO take risks. All this talk about people having to Pvp with learning implants or choose not to pvp? That makes sense? I know die hard Pvpers who have more than once chosen not to Pvp merely because their combat implant JCs were on cool down and they had to choose between risking LEARNING implants or not pvping at all. This makes no sense because it means that Pvpers are penalized in terms of Time merely because they choose to pvp, as opposed to carebears who are always in their learning implants stacking up SP while Pvpers risk all.Essentially you get arbitarily punished merely for CHOOSING to Pvp, not for anything else.
War in EVE is like a box of chocolates. You never know which is the really nasty one with the horribly hard nougat center. |
Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.06.12 06:00:00 -
[124]
Oh what the hell, Flame on!
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Astria Tiphareth
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Posted - 2008.06.12 13:06:00 -
[125]
Originally by: Esmenet
The current system forces you to make a choice between risk and benefits.
How is this good for PvP? We've just spent a day in downtime for a system designed to reduce this exact choice, namely factional warfare. If you want the more risk-averse players into PvP, give them reduced risk for a suitable cost. You can't tell people how to play, but you can give them opportunities.
Originally by: Esmenet
CCP knows this and thats why there is a 24 hr cooldown on jumpclones.
You don't know that. They haven't said that publicly; don't put words in their mouth.
Originally by: Esmenet
In other words there wont be a change in combat implant destruction. You can just keep most of the learnings safe without any disadvantages. And that is bad for the game.
Anyone who undocks with +5s in a combat zone that they can't easily afford to replace is an idiot. There is no justifiable reason why you'd keep a set in when you can jump clone, beyond stupidity. A 24-hour loss in skillpoints, well boohoo, the only thing that suffers is PvP. Fit an inexpensive set of +2s for the duration and you have hardly any appreciable loss for a single day. In other words, this proposed system merely changes risk-averse behaviour (not risking +5s) to allow for more PvP - a Good Thing TM.
You are also alleging that the market for implants will drop - this is nonsense and counteracts your own argument. You yourself are claiming no change in combat implant expenditure therefore no effect on the market for those.
The +5 learning implant market is already high. It costs 65M plus LP to get a +5 implant. Typical prices for them are 100M. Given the number of idiots who view LP as free, this implies either a lack of demand or a lack of supply. Looking at EVE-central, there are a total of 180ish Ocular Filter - Improved for sale in the entire galaxy, and only 40 have sold in the past few months! This therefore suggests a certain lack of movement in the market as it stands anyway, so the argument that suddenly it will move to a standstill seems rather hyperbolic.
Finally - even if your entire argument is true, and I don't think it is, how is it bad for the game? What aspect? Lets' have some structured argument, rather than opinion. |
Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.06.14 02:17:00 -
[126]
/bump
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.06.17 02:58:00 -
[127]
/bump
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.06.18 11:04:00 -
[128]
/bump
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.06.22 03:28:00 -
[129]
.bump
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.06.26 14:58:00 -
[130]
/bump
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.06.29 11:41:00 -
[131]
/bump
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Gaelenus
Gallente
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.06.29 16:54:00 -
[132]
Again thats another very good idea i have to say, would be good to be able to get my learning implants out of harms way when i'm going to go fight. |
Jinx Barker
GFB Scientific
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Posted - 2008.06.29 19:03:00 -
[133]
I thought about this idea for a while, and yes, I agree would be nice, and not really exploitable since the SIA (the device that holds the implants) could not be moved from one character to another, but allow a switching for particular roles at a desired time.
I support this. |
Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.07.02 05:45:00 -
[134]
/bump
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Acidictadpole
ADVANCED Combat and Engineering
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Posted - 2008.07.02 06:09:00 -
[135]
It may create some money sinks, but it also gets rid of them. This allows players who would actually *use* their implants in some cases, to remove them for the other cases and thus prevent losing them (and having to buy another set). The people who use implants probably outweigh the people who don't and the people who use them for pvp gain also probably outweigh the people who don't.
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.07.02 06:33:00 -
[136]
Originally by: Acidictadpole
It may create some money sinks, but it also gets rid of them. This allows players who would actually *use* their implants in some cases, to remove them for the other cases and thus prevent losing them (and having to buy another set). The people who use implants probably outweigh the people who don't and the people who use them for pvp gain also probably outweigh the people who don't.
Well consider that those pilots who DONT want to loose implants jump into an empty JC anyway, it makes little difference. For those that use combat implants, they don't have to waste time with the 24hr cool down on JCs or have to jump to them in some inconvenient location which is what generally happens. since implants be they learning or combat are NPC made items, the market demand will go up simply because it becomes more convenient to use your combat implants. People who make money grinding for LP to buy implants to sell will simply begin grinding for combat implants instead of learning implants. Also since it becomes more easier for people to get into vp without the hassle of JCs or sacrificing learning implants when they can be using combat implants or no implants ( as many do now) the amount of combat INCREASES, which means more ships and modules destroyed and hence MORE demand for minerals, ships and modules.
Remember Implants cannot be manufactured to begin with, and with this system you can have multiple implants for multiple JCs, hence increasing the money sink there too.
How many times have players chosen not to pvp merely because they a) do not have access to a JC, or the JC is located too far way. b) Have learning implants and the JC is on cool down or c have combat implants which are off the wrong type at hand?
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.07.07 14:51:00 -
[137]
/bump
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kyoukoku
Gallente
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.07.07 15:54:00 -
[138]
/signage. I would definitely sink a lot of ISK into having a few sets of these puppies and would most definitely be more inclined to indulge in a lot more PvP if this were to be implemented.
I also like Destructor1792's idea of having additional skills and gear to enable you to (try to) extract SIA's & implant's from corpses.
I can't see how any of this would cause the demand for implants to fall. It would be completely the opposite as folks would buy more simply because they can swap them around, as a set, at will.
we really need CCP to have a look at this idea and comment.
Ninja Salvaging ain't stealing
from desusig.crumplecorn.com
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Mithrandere
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Posted - 2008.07.07 16:45:00 -
[139]
YES YES YES YES YES YES YES YES
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.07.09 05:41:00 -
[140]
/bump
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.07.14 05:40:00 -
[141]
/bump
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Danton Marcellus
Nebula Rasa Holdings
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Posted - 2008.07.14 07:03:00 -
[142]
I'd rather see that they release implant blueprints so we can have more of them instead of cowering behind them and using them as the 'if only' opt out excuse.
Should/would/could have, HAVE you chav!
Also Known As |
Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.07.19 02:51:00 -
[143]
/bump
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Kel Nissa
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Posted - 2008.07.19 12:14:00 -
[144]
/me votes for the idea
Alternative to the SIA trophy idea:
- SIA got a % change to be destroyed when podded (like normal fitting items)
- the SIA is still locked to the original owner
- give the winner the possibility to resell the collected SIA to the victim.
- Maybe this kind of reselling can be used to bait the victim into unsecure space again.
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.07.22 16:37:00 -
[145]
/bump
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kyoukoku
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Posted - 2008.07.23 19:49:00 -
[146]
free bumpage
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.07.25 05:44:00 -
[147]
/bump
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.07.29 11:41:00 -
[148]
/bump |
Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.08.02 10:56:00 -
[149]
/bump
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Raven Timoshenko
Flying While Intoxicated
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.08.05 07:26:00 -
[150]
/bump
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