So WoW basically, only in Eve. -_-

Instancing and the absence of pvp are possible the most anti-eve ideas in existence.

So yeah, nice going there.

Maybe that's why WoW has 10 million subs and EVE has 400k? (Owned)

Clearly, crappy half-finished, pve incarna trash is just what we need to keep eve from dying! Your genius has saved everyone!

Maybe that's why WoW has 10 million subs and EVE has 400k? (Owned)

If I wanted to play a game with crappy, pointless sci-fi based pve involving avatars. I would go play this game some idiots made called star trek online. It's basically what you described in your first post OP.

Maybe that's why WoW has 10 million subs and EVE has 400k? (Owned)

It's also F2P now since nobody really seems to want to pay for it

Shows you how good the game is. I still refuse to soil my computer with it.

I'd rather shoot some frakking mercenaries and robots instead with the hope to shoot at other players in the future.

It's much easier to implement a non-PVP feature (see Incarna) then a full blown feature.

It's a half-feature, beacause there's no Player-player interaction involved.

I really do not want to force anyone to using their money in the way they would noy want to do that.

Reality is, there is a devblog which suggests that plans on any type of WiS were all thrown away and they are now starting to figure out what exactly needs to be done.

I think, that creating a medium graphics-quality PVE-only gameplay loaded with action and taking place in the interiors of EVE stations would be a win-win: presenting the world, easy access for new players, another feature for those who eagerly await one, lots of exploding robots and dying mercenaries, new type of interesting missions and the perspective of using the same framework for player-player interactions, be it coop or PvE .

It was not me saying things about themepark or planning an instance only feature.

Well, I'd wish for WiS to have the ultra great graphics Incarna now has, only with better animation, and the instanced interiors to be a battlegrounds for housands of players to battle for their corporations accompanied by droids and mercenaries.

They've been working on this, it's called Dust.

It's a "half-feature" because CCP didn't fully know what they actually wanted to accomplish in terms of engaging, meaningful game-play, and because they coded themselves down some dead ends more then once and had to start over. Then the money and patience of the subscribers dried-up soon after.

Next, I suppose you will be advocating "arena-based PVP" like some of the other people around here that seem to want to turn EVE into WoW.

even if you wanted to, I'm still pretty sure Aura wouldn't let you install it.

A friend of mine, who is a big Trek fan, played it in beta. He only lasted a few weeks before he'd reached max level in it and was bored stupid, he was soon back to eve with a vengeance.

Maybe that's why WoW has 10 million subs and EVE has 400k? (Owned)

Your idea is as welcome here as cat shite in a bread bun.

Presenting the world, as you put it, should be done in space. You know, where the world is.

(...) Pure numbers mean very little when you're talking about a game(...)

It is true that CCp is developing a game called DUST514 that is a battleground for thousands of players. The only problem is it does not take place in station interiors nor can you play on any PC.

Well that sounds like a personal problem. You ask for avatar action and CCP delivers it in the form of Dust. This is a space ship game. Our action is in space. What you are asking for is a way to hide and play Eve single player to your hearts content. 0 risk and still profit without even having to leave the confines of a station.

Pure numbers = amount of funding/features/servers/network/infrastructure and on and so on...

Sure, as long as you remove the GÇ£instancingGÇ¥ idea, because instances don't belong in the EVE universe and I'm not even sure the game itself supports it; as long as the PvE you're suggesting is subject to PvP so it can be disrupted; and as long as the protection provided is done by the players themselves and not by NPCs.

Oh, and the rewards will need to be quite paltry, since there is no cost or risk involved. Think L1s and turorial missions, or somewhere slightly below that level.

Well, you might think I am asking for this, but when you read OP again, you'll notice, that the feature I describe is only a step to get all sorts of PVP going on inside the stations.

Now as I recall, and somebody correct me on this if I'm wrong, but CCP never had any intention of including pvp into WIS. The purpose of Eve is supposed to be epic space battles, not getting shanked while you're sitting on the crapper.

And why wouldn't players be able to scan one such individual down? Personally I find the station to be much smaller than the solar system it's in. Not exactly like you've got unlimited places to hide.

Also, given the option to re-arm and rem-mod your ship between missions, jump between 0-4 systems, warp to a mission and have a chance of being scanned out, complete and warp back, finish and warp out to clean up (if you didn't do this already)

OR

Open your door, which would you rather choose?

And as I said - CQ are instanced, so they've put instancing into the code at some point.

I've seen EVE for a couple of years and I see the subsciber numbers changing. Avatar based combat would, in my opinion, be a great boost to subscription numbers, so the faster CCP gets there the better - hence my 'PVE-only' plan.

Maybe that's why WoW has 10 million subs and EVE has 400k? (Owned)

Maybe that's why WoW has 10 million subs and EVE has 400k? (Owned)

You are 100% correct. The most recent devblog however says, that their dumping every plan they had for WiS and begin brainstorming to get completely new plans. It's actually the reason I started writing the OP.

Absolutely. mission runners have to be scannable. How else could you ninja salvage them?
Please note, that I have absolutely nothing against an assault of a corp on another's corp hangar being intercepted b a third corp. Or a solo player being found in the cloning bay during his mission and gunned down. it's just the fact, that if we want that, we'll wait for it for ages. And I want those avatars shooting things in a year, so I can see subscriptions rise to seven digits at last.

To be fair, there's nothing to sugest that the CQ even exists on the server GÇö it could all be client-side since nothing goes on there that the server needs to know about.

More importantly, though, any kind of activity like the one you describe can't be instanced simply due to game design considerations. It's just not that kind of game. Non-instanced, disruptable, and subject to PvP are kind of the fundamental premises that any kind of addition to the game needs to adhere to. That, or it can't really be allowed to GÇ£doGÇ¥ anything.

and what you're envisioning and the kind of players it would bring in, would not be a good addition to EVE. You want a completely different game. They tried that; they couldn't quite make it happen; it has been put on the back-burner (and to be fair, chances are that it was going to be viciously PvP as well GÇö it's kind of what CCP does).

What you are opting for then is a half finished product in the hopes that it will artificially inflate subscription numbers to an absurd number. So, you add a handful of levels, single player, non scan-able, and risk free.

Now lets say it takes 6 months - 1 year to be ready to implement multi-player threat assessment, How do you think all those risk free players are going to take it?
Also, I see this is severely restricted to one play style. Sounds to me like Miners, industrialists, entrepreneurs, explorers, and pirates are getting quite shafted in the deal.

And you keep bringing up CQ, but honestly, what do you do in there besides sit on the couch?

I can't understand how letting newcomers in can affect us in a negative way?

You will never see them or hear from them.

So your idea is to be able to operate in perfect safety with no risk of being bothered by everyone else in the game?

There are hundreds of single player and co-op games out there. Go play those.

Also, I am not explicitly forbidding PvP anywhere, so please stop trolling. PvP in WiS is a must. I am prioritizing PvE, beacause, like it or not, it would bring some new subscribers to EVE, and that would increase CCPs income and thus allowed them to finance the development of Incarna PVP iterations.

Well, what I think pretty much everyone would be happy about would be a PVE environment in-station.

That's quite the presumption on your part.

Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people.

wow has 10million subscribers because it is aimed at appealing to the AVERAGE PERSON, and the average person is PANTS ON HEAD ********.
eve has 400k because its aimed at a more tactical and mindful approach to gaming akin to tabletop-on-computer, not everyone can play, and no one wants it made so that everyone can.
so... that means that eve is the upper 4% of the gaming community 400/1000 is .04, so yeah. we smart, they dumb.

Easy, I'll take the useless ship. Or better still a snowball launcher and snowballs.

Edit: If you use an unfinished station just because you're curious and not patient to wait for a finished product, you will just get people moaning about that unfinished product.

Well, what I think pretty much everyone would be happy about would be a PVE environment in-station.

Maybe that's why WoW has 10 million subs and EVE has 400k? (Owned)

You must be new here, let me welcome you to the wonderful world of Eve by saying... GTFO back to WoW.

.... we'll get less boiling motherboards ....

Boiling motherboards come from wannbees who buy a "super store Sunday special" computer then stick a big graphics card in it with no cooling and wonder why it runs hot.

Casino With gambling mechanics where you actually can lose your ship, shoes and shirt to other players

EDIT : or just sit back at the bar swigging mindflood and watching one of those 3 breasted stripper things from star wars..

The majority of characters in this thread posting opposition to your idea are less than 3 years old. Most are probably alt characters that probably don't do anything in-game.

As I said before, your idea has merit and should be re-posted in one or all of the thread links I had previously posted. CCP has the last say on what they want to do with Avatars, not what these few Anti-WiS players and their alts say.

You make a lot of assumptions without, perhaps, realising they could equally apply to what you say.

Anyway, I see your character was created on 2011.01.12, thanks for proving my point.

Let me be clearer for you then.

You are attempting to discredit players who fall beyond some arbitrary character age limit you selected. You infer that "Most are probably alt characters that probably don't do anything in-game." What does that have to do with anything? So I have been playing for a little over a year. This is my main and I enjoy the game. I am also in favour of WiS, but I am against primarily PvE content for EVE Online to attract subscribers who are not part of the target demographic. That is an opinion; one of the things that a discussion forum revolves around.

Then, this claim "they don't represent the majority of the player base could equally apply to the players that are pro-WiS. Nobody knows how the demographics break down except CCP.

It seems to me as if you are trying to, not shut down discussion, but at least pretend as if anyone that doesn't agree with you is somehow deficient or invalid in their opinions.

I do agree, CCP is the best source of knowledge and they will be making decisions (Hopefully with player feedback). I agree as well that ideas such as this, which to my mind has some merit for the EVE Universe concept, needs to go in Features and Ideas. There is far less trolling there and ideas can generally be discussed and analysed.

You said "instanced" with a strait face.
3/10 for the sheer ballsyness.

Its going to be instanced anyways, so you can stop flaming him for that at least.

Unless you somehow think CCP is going to go from being unable to render more than a handful avatars in real time to rendering hundreds of avatars.

Do you think the graphic engine displaying multiple animated players/NPCs is a priority? Should CCP implement LOD models and lower the quality (or allow tweaking the quality) to achieve that?

Well, what I think pretty much everyone would be happy about would be a PVE environment in-station.

Well, you might think I am asking for this, but when you read OP again, you'll notice, that the feature I describe is only a step to get all sorts of PVP going on inside the stations.
But you have a point - during the time this feature is only accessed by a single player, it can create imbalance. My perception is, that it would cause the same amount of damage to the economy as missions that another player cannot interrupt.
My proposal is not "YOU MUST MAKE INSTANCED AVATAR COMBAT' - it's rather 'If avatars, then make low polycount PVE as soon as possible, and then go to PVP and highres models".


That is one of the major reasons I raised my voice. If CCP islooking to attract a ot of new players with their avataqr system, I bielieve that tthis is a way to go. And then fwith sufficient funding they'll go wherever they want.

You are the epitome of all that come to break our EvE. Frankly I pity you.[/qoute]
And I pity you haven't read the whole thread. During the discussion it was established, that a pure PvE does not fit EVE at all.


There is no factual data that would allow such a pasimistic assumption. The change proposed is unprecedensed in EVE, so any assumption at all is prone to error, including my assumption that 'almost everyone would be happy' about it.

Can I please ask you to explain to me, what are the common denominators of the Real Money/PLEX Serivces in EvE and the introduction of an PvE feature that would very much resemble current missions? Other, than the mass player riots you assume will happen. Please explain this to me, as you really lost me there.

Stfu stfu no one wants incarna, and if you do your playing the wrong game. Sad but true.

And I pity you haven't read the whole thread. During the discussion it was established, that a pure PvE does not fit EVE at all. So that you are absolutely right and in no need to be angry :)


There is no factual data that would allow such a pesimistic assumption. The change proposed is unprecedensed in EVE, so any assumption at all is prone to error, including my assumption that 'almost everyone would be happy' about it.

Can I please ask you to explain to me, what are the common denominators of the Real Money/PLEX Serivces in EvE and the introduction of an PvE feature that would very much resemble current missions? Other, than the mass player riots you assume will happen. Please explain this to me, as you really lost me there.


I don't want to ignore your post, but I also don't want to break it to you sir. You should read the devblog from Team Avatar and some forum threads, like this one, in their entirety.

And I pity you haven't read the whole thread. During the discussion it was established, that a pure PvE does not fit EVE at all. So that you are absolutely right and in no need to be angry :) Still, I do not agree with your suposition that I am an epitome of anything at all. Live with it.

m going to guess it says "Barbie barbie Barbie".

So many people quit when they made incarna, but strangely enough no one quit when crucible came out. I'm not surprised their bringing incarna back, their trying to make eve more widely playable so dust will work imo. However, that is not the game the majority of us want to play, and I'm confident about that.

Maybe that's why WoW has 10 million subs and EVE has 400k? (Owned)

Now it does.

Lets assume you are right, and majority of the players do not want Incarna. Please read the devblog about team Avatar. CCP is putting their avatar in no matter what the majority wants.

I don't really care if there are avatar in the game or not. You assume that if one starts a thread with the words 'avatar' or 'incarna' in the subject, he must be someone drooling at the sight of them. Not the case here sir.

I read a devblog, and hey - it seems there will be avatars in the game, case closed. And guess what - CCP wants to scratch whatever ideas they had before and listen to the players for ideas of avatar-based gameplay. So I figure, that if there's ever a good time to write about Avatar gameplay ideas, it's now. And here you have a thread by yours truly.

Now please focus on the topic. Avatars are coming, and CCP will make them bad unless you can figure out a way for them not to be that.

stop posting, no gameplay shall be instanced in eve, your idea is shitstupid. the end.

we are aware that unfortunately wis is coming to eve eventually.
there are 2 possible outcomes.
1. it actually has meaningful gameplay.
2. it ends up as nothing more than a few types of different rooms for a bunch of lisping dudes to /emote each other and compare pants.

according to the devblog, after all the time they've spent on it they have zero clue on how they going to make meaningful gameplay, so i am betting the outcome of wis will be #2.
i mean they literally built a goddamn engine (a crappy one) and forgot to put wheels and seats in it like they forgot what it was for.
therefore wis should still be shitcanned.

Logic dictates that there are more retards than geniuses in the internetz.

WoW vs EVE proves it.

You do understand that these are my thought exactly?
It's just the fact that if they make shitcanned WiS, they'll be freaking broke. And they sell EVE to some Japaneese dudes who will turn it into f2p and shard it , and so will die EVE.

I really want to figure out if there's a way to add meaningful gameplay to Avatars. It seems like only combat fits. Does anything else fit at all?

yes. read about it or listen to audio or watch video about it. There were quite a few from fanfest and a recent audio interview. Especially the parts about smuggling require avatars but not guns. Its hard to believe you really looked into it TBH, because the information is so readily available.

I'm going to guess it says "Barbie barbie Barbie". So many people quit when they made incarna, but strangely enough no one quit when crucible came out. I'm not surprised their bringing incarna back, their trying to make eve more widely playable so dust will work imo. However, that is not the game the majority of us want to play, and I'm confident about that.

i agree with topic title. Eve should be more like WOW

don't care about old promises and videos using a discarded engine made years ago, i am only looking at the latest devblog.