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Boz Well
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Posted - 2008.04.28 02:23:00 -
[91]
Originally by: Joe Starbreaker
Originally by: Amateratsu The Raven pilot was a completely different char to those piloting the other ships.
The similarity of character names indicates that they're either alts or close friends. The killmails were obviously edited for reasons unknown. There is a solution to this mystery and the OP is hiding the vital clues for his own reasons.
No wai! It's definitely CCP's fault! I mean, the game's fault! Or the ganker's fault! Or.. hell, ANYONE's fault but his!
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Highwind Cid
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Posted - 2008.04.28 16:15:00 -
[92]
Doesn't this just happen everyday? I remember when I lost my first ship, my stabber. The guy said don't fly won't you can't afford to lose. I took his advice.(How sweet it will be the day I get to say that to him)
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Max Nero
Xeno Tech Corp United Corporations Against Macros
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Posted - 2008.04.28 17:27:00 -
[93]
Originally by: Amateratsu
Originally by: Max Nero Tony, to answer your question - one of the pilots you fired on has switched ships with Raven. Those guys have tried the same tactics with my corp.
Originally by: Slayed haahahahah funny ^^ i say the logistic pilot was in t3h raven
Failing to read the killmails above^^ FTL
The Raven pilot was a completely different char to those piloting the other ships.
Sure, that must be it because you saw these guys operate... I have, as I said - they have tried the same thing with me and my corpie and there was some intense pewpew with battleship losses on both sides.
Any way, failure to read OP FTL. Here is what happened, try to follow me here, let's read OP:
- My friend and I were running a lev 4 mission in -> HIGHSEC <-, A loot thief jumped in and started to loot/salvage all the wrecks.
Loot thief - UrsaeMajoris
- He began to flash red, I locked and engaged him. He was in a T1 Minmatar cruiser, I got him down to armor as his buddies jumped in. Knowing full well if his friends attacked me they would be Concorded I continued my attack.
UrsaeMajoris is in a Minmatar cruiser. OP fires on UrsaeMajoris giving him full ability to fight back for 15 minutes.
- A logistics ship, and a dominix targeted and began shield repping the loot theif. They both than began flashing red which the rules of engagement says I can engage them for 15minutes as well.
Support gang is repping UrsaeMajoris
- The T1 Cruiser (Loot thief) webbed/jammed me, my damage was not high enough to take him down and after 5 minutes of shooting, the logistics ship had repped his shield to 100%.
UrsaeMajoris is tackling Nighthawk
My only way out was to fire at the flashing red logistics ship, and than to pop the T1 Cruiser that was webbing/jamming me. I popped the Flashing red Logistics ship, and started on the T1 Cruiser again.
Logistics goes poof, OP opens up on UrsaeMajoris reseting his timer
Now here is where concord screwed up, They jumped in a raven, and commenced the ganking...
Here is where our story begins. Raven jumps in piloted by a player with a very similar name (Ursae Majoris). Ursae Majoris ejects from his raven and lets his buddy in minm cruiser (UrsaeMajoris) to board it. UrsaeMajoris still has timer against OP and begins to engage. OP does not realize the switch because names are very similar. To him it seems as Raven warped in and began to engage without Concord interference.
Hope this makes sense.
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Tony Unrau
Caldari Kraken's Teeth Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.04.28 17:53:00 -
[94]
Originally by: Joe Starbreaker The similarity of character names indicates that they're either alts or close friends. The killmails were obviously edited for reasons unknown. There is a solution to this mystery and the OP is hiding the vital clues for his own reasons.
killmails edited??? I didnt edit ****.. If you want proof I'll even take an ingame picture and post it here, plus what is it that makes you think I edited it?? I left out what modules were destroyed and which were not because it simply would make the post too large. If you like I could include it.
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Tony Unrau
Caldari Kraken's Teeth Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.04.28 18:12:00 -
[95]
Max Nero
Everything correct except for the end, sorry I havent explained the ending well enough.
The T1 cruiser was webbing/jamming me, after popping the logistics ship there was: Cruiser Domi Raven Pod (ex logistics pilot)
I continued shooting at the cruiser, noticed it was being repped by the domi and the domi was flashing red. I was unable to break the cruisers tank, (right here the raven/domi began firing on me and bumping me)
- In a mad panic as my shields were dropping not knowing where all the DPS was coming from and realizing I was not breaking the cruisers tank I: - Opened fire on the only other pilot flashing red, the Domi. - Got his shield down into armor. - They broke my tank and I went poof!
Name of the logistics pilot I popped: Canis Minoris
Name of the Raven pilot: UrsaeMajoris
As you can see once the logistics pilot was popped, he did not enter the raven. Neither did the Cruiser Pilot as that would not explain how the Raven could engage me, fly to me, bump me etc.. all within 1-2 minutes.
Proof: http://eve-files.com/dl/158156 ZZzzz
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Max Nero
Xeno Tech Corp United Corporations Against Macros
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Posted - 2008.04.28 18:22:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Tony Unrau
The T1 cruiser was webbing/jamming me, after popping the logistics ship there was: Cruiser Domi Raven Pod (ex logistics pilot)
Do me a favor - check your logs for that day and tell me what was the name of the minm cruiser pilot.
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Ki Anna
Ki Tech Industries
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Posted - 2008.04.28 20:04:00 -
[97]
Originally by: Tony Unrau Max Nero
Everything correct except for the end, sorry I havent explained the ending well enough.
The T1 cruiser was webbing/jamming me, after popping the logistics ship there was: Cruiser Domi Raven Pod (ex logistics pilot)
I continued shooting at the cruiser, noticed it was being repped by the domi and the domi was flashing red. I was unable to break the cruisers tank, (right here the raven/domi began firing on me and bumping me)
- In a mad panic as my shields were dropping not knowing where all the DPS was coming from and realizing I was not breaking the cruisers tank I: - Opened fire on the only other pilot flashing red, the Domi. - Got his shield down into armor. - They broke my tank and I went poof!
Name of the logistics pilot I popped: Canis Minoris
Name of the Raven pilot: UrsaeMajoris
As you can see once the logistics pilot was popped, he did not enter the raven. Neither did the Cruiser Pilot as that would not explain how the Raven could engage me, fly to me, bump me etc.. all within 1-2 minutes.
Proof: http://eve-files.com/dl/158156 ZZzzz
Have you pointed this out in your petition?
What explination was provided for how UrsaeMajoris gained aggro rights on you?
If the GM can provide a valid reason for how UrsaeMajoris got aggro, it was a fair kill.
If not there was are still a few more possiblities:
1) UrsaeMajoris did NOT get aggro, once your shield were low enough, he commited to a suicide gank of your ship: can you confirm or deny that UrsaeMajoris was CONCORD'ed?
2) Could the kill mail system be buggy, and UrsaeMajoris was not the pilot of the Raven at the time of the kill, but the kill mail was generated using his name because he "owned" the ship
3) Could the aggro system be bugged, such that UrsaeMajoris gained aggro through so other means?
BTW - what where your drones doing during this time? Did you use them to attack the logistics ship that you killed? If you had them set for auto-aggro, could one of them have taken a shot at the Raven after you killed the logistics ship and before you reassigned them to another target?
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Tony Unrau
Caldari Kraken's Teeth Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.04.28 20:57:00 -
[98]
Edited by: Tony Unrau on 28/04/2008 21:00:45
Originally by: Ki Anna
1) UrsaeMajoris did NOT get aggro, once your shield were low enough, he commited to a suicide gank of your ship: can you confirm or deny that UrsaeMajoris was CONCORD'ed?
BTW - what where your drones doing during this time? Did you use them to attack the logistics ship that you killed? If you had them set for auto-aggro, could one of them have taken a shot at the Raven after you killed the logistics ship and before you reassigned them to another target?
1 could be possible, I was there for roughly 3-7 or so minutes afterwards and concord had not shown up yet but they may have just as I left. It was a 0.5 system, do they usually have a slow response time?
I had one drone in my bay actually, being a 100% caldari pilot I usually don't bother with drones and the other 4 were blown up in a previous mission. I hadn't gotten around to replacing them as I hardly use drones. So ya.. my drone was docked up and not in use.
Max Nero, how do I check that? I logged in and went to the log thing, but it was empty. Is there some other way of checking it?
PS: I had updated my petition asking how the raven pilot got aggro, if they can prove he got aggro within the rules of eve and it was not a bug. I couldn't be happier, id chalk it up as a loss and let that be that. If it was a bug tho...
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Max Nero
Xeno Tech Corp United Corporations Against Macros
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Posted - 2008.04.28 22:43:00 -
[99]
Check if you have kill rights on Ursa - if you do - then he has suicided. Since you did not return fire on raven - if he has suicided you - you should have kill rights on him.
Logs - go to My Documents folder on your PC - EVE - Logs - Gamelogs - find the log around the time when you got popped. Browse around and find what was the name of the original loot thief.
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Tony Unrau
Caldari Kraken's Teeth Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.04.29 00:56:00 -
[100]
Originally by: Max Nero Check if you have kill rights on Ursa - if you do - then he has suicided. Since you did not return fire on raven - if he has suicided you - you should have kill rights on him.
Logs - go to My Documents folder on your PC - EVE - Logs - Gamelogs - find the log around the time when you got popped. Browse around and find what was the name of the original loot thief.
ok checked killrights, I currently have no killrights against anyone so he definitely didn't suicide. (If anyone out there thinks im a bold faced liar let me know so I can give you some proof!) ugh...
Ahh Haa!! Looks like the name of the guy that was the original loot thief was UrsaeMajoris. Which is the Raven pilot, so I guess somewhere in there he must have switched ships from the cruiser to the Raven, which really doesn't even make sense considering there was no gap in there where I was not being scrammed by the Cruiser.
Gonna wait back from final word of CCP on this, but it looks like thanks to you Max the case is closed! RIP lol
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Slayton Ford
STK Scientific Black-Out
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Posted - 2008.04.29 01:27:00 -
[101]
Simple solution to when thiefs come in and start looting or even ninja Salvaging....start popping wrecks. Which ever wreck they go to, pop it. This works better with guns then missiles due to travel time but what this does is fustrate them and deny them the opportunity to even try and gank you. --------------- This sig has been censored in fear of recieving the ban hammer... |
Raskor
Crossflow Enterprises
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Posted - 2008.04.29 02:14:00 -
[102]
Personally I think the biggest problem here is that other members of the gang can remote rep the aggressor.
If player A and B are ganged, and player A steals from player C, that fight should be between A and C. If player B can't open fire on C without getting CONCORD, they shouldn't be able to materially assist A either.
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Tony Unrau
Caldari Kraken's Teeth Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.04.29 05:00:00 -
[103]
Originally by: Raskor Personally I think the biggest problem here is that other members of the gang can remote rep the aggressor.
If player A and B are ganged, and player A steals from player C, that fight should be between A and C. If player B can't open fire on C without getting CONCORD, they shouldn't be able to materially assist A either.
Couldn't agree more.
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Max Nero
Xeno Tech Corp United Corporations Against Macros
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Posted - 2008.04.29 05:50:00 -
[104]
Originally by: Raskor Personally I think the biggest problem here is that other members of the gang can remote rep the aggressor.
If player A and B are ganged, and player A steals from player C, that fight should be between A and C. If player B can't open fire on C without getting CONCORD, they shouldn't be able to materially assist A either.
I strongly disagree. Mechanics works just fine the way it is right now. Yes, this time OP was outnumbered. But what stops OP from calling in his own support fleet? Moreover, it's not like you have to deal with thief all by yourself - call for help from corpmates!
Morale of the story - before you shoot loot thief - think - is he really after your mission loot? Are those tags worth dieing for?
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EnslaverOfMinmatar
Amarr Adv Asteroid Mining and RD Sobaseki Corporation
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Posted - 2008.04.29 07:48:00 -
[105]
Congratz with the loss!!! hehehe
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Ortos
Abyssus Incendia THORN Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.29 14:05:00 -
[106]
pop wrecks, what other choice is there?
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Ortos
Abyssus Incendia THORN Alliance
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Posted - 2008.04.29 14:06:00 -
[107]
Originally by: Raskor Personally I think the biggest problem here is that other members of the gang can remote rep the aggressor.
If player A and B are ganged, and player A steals from player C, that fight should be between A and C. If player B can't open fire on C without getting CONCORD, they shouldn't be able to materially assist A either.
qft.
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Pwett
Minmatar QUANT Corp. QUANT Hegemony
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Posted - 2008.04.29 14:12:00 -
[108]
That the cruiser didn't show up on the killmail is more proof that the pilot was the one that popped into the raven. If his scram cycle persisted after he ejected, I would escalate that. If it didn't persist and you just missed your opportunity, then it's something I would chalk up to a valuable, albeit costly, lesson. _______________ Pwett CEO, Founder, & Executor <Q> QUANT Hegemony
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Tony Unrau
Caldari Kraken's Teeth Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.04.29 20:43:00 -
[109]
really im still 100% confused on how the pilot with the same name was capable of flying the cruiser, jamming me, and killing me in a raven all at the same time. Never have I seen one person multi task like that lol
PS: I never popped the cruiser, wasnt able to break his tank so i switched targets to the domi.
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Eyee
Caldari Increasing Success by Lowering Expectations Star Buccaneers
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Posted - 2008.04.30 01:41:00 -
[110]
I seldom post on forums but this thread is kinda interesting for me.
Something very similar happend to a very close person of mine.
He was very proud of his faction-fitted rokh, he kinda loved it:) But a "though" player, who created a alt-corp, which he was declaring war by himselfe asked him to help him out in a mission (after he scanned his faction-fitting) and invited him to gang. Old trick. No missiongrid but a well-fitted nosdomi (warcorp) was waiting for him at the "missionspot". He went down. Well it was his last one anyway. He was so in rage, he quitted eve the next day and deleted the char 24h later. (14m SP) I tried anything but finally i couldnt convince him...
Sure u can say it was his fault, first in line to accept a gang from a unknown player, but sometimes im asking myselfe if there could be some mechaniks to avoid situations like this. But i know eve is as well as it is atm, non of us really want to change it.
But sometimes there is intelligenz next to exploit, no big difference for me... |
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Klandi
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Posted - 2008.04.30 12:07:00 -
[111]
Tony - I can relate
Here's my story ....
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=759793&page=2
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Paulo Banderez
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Posted - 2008.05.01 11:44:00 -
[112]
Edited by: Paulo Banderez on 01/05/2008 11:44:55 Dear OP,
Your mistake was to open up on the Domi. A nighthawk won't take down a [properly set-up] domi unless its completely out of cap.
I would have let the timer run down and docked up - you have to pick your fights - can't win 'em all.
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Krollin
Minmatar Ki Shoda United Corporations Against Macros
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Posted - 2008.05.01 12:13:00 -
[113]
I would 100% agree with Max Nero's explanation of events. As already suggested a ship swap was most definately the way the Raven was able to engage and destroy your ship.
Though this is the game mechanics, using 2 characters that are very closely named was a very clever ploy.
I am still at a loss of how a 900Million ISK fitted Nighthawk could not a) do enough damage to the thief and b) die so quickly to a Raven, any chance you can post what the setup was?
Kro
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Agif
UnderDog Industries Free Trade Zone.
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Posted - 2008.05.01 12:53:00 -
[114]
is this still on going?
Let it go already ---------------
EvEmissions - Level 5 Missions - Updated 22/01/08 |
Buyerr
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Posted - 2008.05.01 13:04:00 -
[115]
the point here is that he enjoys the way he played and he didn't want some one to come steal his stuff, and when he defended it they used a exploit (unintended use of mechanic) to destroy his ship, when he told the law "gm's" about it they say "go fck yourself we don't care, but we need to look like we do".. i understand that your leaving, but it is sad to see the good gamers leave while the idiots keep bouldering up..
take care ^^ I declare war on stupidity |
Jmanis Catharg
Caldari Stickler inc
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Posted - 2008.05.01 13:17:00 -
[116]
Quote: a) do enough damage to the thief and b) die so quickly to a Raven, any chance you can post what the setup was?
A) With a bit of quick recon, you can fit to tank his only damage type for that mish.
B) With that same recon, you can fit the weapons which are the anti of what they are tanking. If it wasn't EM he was tanking he was royally screwed.
Pretty simple stuff.
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Boz Well
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Posted - 2008.05.01 14:42:00 -
[117]
Originally by: Buyerr the point here is that he enjoys the way he played and he didn't want some one to come steal his stuff, and when he defended it they used a exploit (unintended use of mechanic) to destroy his ship, when he told the law "gm's" about it they say "go fck yourself we don't care, but we need to look like we do".. i understand that your leaving, but it is sad to see the good gamers leave while the idiots keep bouldering up..
take care ^^
Or he thought it was an exploit/hack/cheat/all of the above and turns out he misinterpreted the killmail. GM's were right to say 'working as intended' because, well, it's working as intended. QQ more carebear.
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Highwind Cid
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Posted - 2008.05.01 15:44:00 -
[118]
I guess I'll officially end this thread.
*Clears throat*
*Silent acoustic guitar starts to play*
I close my eyes Only for a moment, then the moment's gone All my dreams Pass before my eyes, a curiosity Dust in the wind All they are is dust in the wind Same old song Just a drop of water in an endless sea All we do Crumbles to the ground, though we refuse to see Dust in the wind All we are is dust in the wind, ohh Now, don't hang on Nothing lasts forever but the earth and sky It slips away And all your money won't another minute buy Dust in the wind All we are is dust in the wind All we are is dust in the wind Dust in the wind Everything is dust in the wind Everything is dust in the wind The wind
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Tony Unrau
Caldari Kraken's Teeth Syndicate
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Posted - 2008.05.01 15:44:00 -
[119]
Thanks Eyee and Klandi for your stories! They are similar to mine, Klandi I think if I eve did come back to eve it would as you say, because of the people i've met and not what I own.. I would downgrade all my stuff to cheaper T2 things, theres no problem with spending 100mill more than you have to so u do missions a little quicker, but 900mill as I can see now is excessive.
The GM's are being a bit lazy, giving me 1 sentence answers basically repeating what I said in a different way. Im asking how its possible the guy could be in a T1 cruiser jamming me while at the same time in the raven shooting me. No honest reply's so I will be giving up now. (me thinks they don't want to investigate and are afraid their bug is caught)
Oh well GTA4 will get a workout now lol
Thanks everyone for all your kind, and some of you repetitive unkind words. Was great playing eve, I may be back some day but to play at a less competitive level as it seems u save more money that way and have more fun.
One thing before I go.. *Sell all your faction loot mission runners! It isn't worth the risk* =P
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Jones Maloy
Minmatar Unified Naval Command
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Posted - 2008.05.03 07:22:00 -
[120]
Originally by: Veng3ance
Originally by: Tony Unrau
Take care guys, looks like it's the end of eve for me. It was fun while it lasted ;]
PS: BE VERY CAREFUL OUT THERE!! Try to warn as many ppl as possible about this so it doesnt happen to anyone else. Thanks!
So you quit EVE after one loss?
Eve wasn't for you anyways. Have fun in Hello Kitty online.
i hate *******s like you |
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