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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 22 post(s) |
Blaze D'fire
Black-Label
GREATER ITAMO MAFIA
0
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Posted - 2012.04.03 06:23:00 -
[1921] - Quote
Alright well i spent about 4 hours reading the thread and i am thuroughly confused at this point.
I have a couple concerns that everyone has already voiced 11,634 times so i'll say it once more.
I trained all factions ship skills, but i didnt have to for BCS's i can fly any T1 frigate, destroyer, cruiser, BCS will i still be able to?
BCS are not mainstream they are throw away ships for the most part, the T2 cruisers are usually significantly better then a BCS
The BCS's are a great way to introduce new players into other factions ships and weapon platforms, which in turn may cause a player to cross train into other faction ships and weapons to use them on frigs, cruisers, BS's, that what happened to me.
I was all caldari till i flew an Amarr BCS and decided i was gonna train Amarr ships and lasers.
This seems more like a fix for individuals who have been complaining about other issues that are indirectly related to this.
More specific to me i have 5 accounts, guess how many i'll have if i am faced with 3-6 months of training added to my current plans.
If we get to the root of the issue let the whining players buy a month's worth of SP's for 1 plex
Seriously its the only reason 4 of my accounts exist, i train them till they are functional which typically is nearly a year worth of training to get offense/defense/core fitting/ewar to 4's accross the board then i actually play them
People can flame war me all they want i dont surf the forums except when someone tells me theres a huge change coming, but the game is a PAY to WIN, if you want the best equipement you have to buy tons of plexes, so why not just buy SP's?
That way the Whiners can create an account drop $500 down and fly a capital
Without the sarcasm i would say buying SP's is the ony way you will ever have balance, because a player with 10mil SP will loose 99% of the time to the guy with 120mil SPs unless he's AFK in lowsec/nulsec.
I remember when i started playing 2 years ago and it took me forever to kill a tutorial rat
Then i went back to get some standing and i was alpha'ing every tutorial rat without even grouping my weapons
It takes time to be effective in this game, thats how CCP makes their money, apparently the economic tumoils are affecting CCP to the point they need to extend all of our training times by a few extra months so they can make an extra $50-$100 per account
Pirate faction Ships are the best example of insentivizing Cross faction training. I think CCP did a great job with them
Put more Pirate faction ship in then people will want to cross train instead of them having to train just to fly what they already can fly
Please dont turn this game into WOW its why i started playing EVE because WOW was so babyfied that i stoped playing after 6 years. |
None ofthe Above
161
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Posted - 2012.04.03 06:57:00 -
[1922] - Quote
Sarah Schneider wrote:None ofthe Above wrote:They've gone back and forth on the "need to" "will" and "would like to" on these changes. Hmm, interesting, mind pointing me out on where these switches of stance occurred?
I seem to recall it most strikingly in the beginning of the fanfest session on the subject with CCP Ytterbium. In the DevBlog the OP links to it starts out with "glimpse of things to come" and then changes to "we want to". I get the impression of the reality being "this is what we are going to do.... oh right I am supposed to be giving you guys the impression you have a say in the matter." Maybe that's just my premature bitter vet showing.
Sarah Schneider wrote:The idea and reasoning behind the changes are valid imo, whether ccp will mess this up or not when the time comes is a whole different thing.
While true, I would feel a whole lot more comfortable with this all if I understood and agreed with the basic philosophy they are using to drive the process.
Its true that it doesn't extend training time for new players until they start cross-training. Not really seeing how this contradicts my position though.
You don't understand how anything could harm both new and old players? I didn't go in to the converses, such as the older players not having to worry about the youngins getting those nice pirate hulls for quite so long. But still you should be aware that some changes harm all players, but not necessarily in the same ways.
(Note: I had to cut this down since the forums don't allow enough quotes for me to address the points directly. Grrrr)
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Noztra Ernaga
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.04.03 17:36:00 -
[1923] - Quote
Ok, I am new to this game but not to the MMO genre.
So basically, if I train all racial Frigate skills to IV, all racial Cruiser skills to III, Battlecruisers and Destroyers to V it should pay off in the near future. I hope so because this is going to postone the start of Raven L4 missioning by many weeks in my case. To be ready for May 22th (if this change goes live that day) I need to start now 
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Rimase
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Sanctuary Pact
12
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Posted - 2012.04.03 17:51:00 -
[1924] - Quote
(SUGGESTION)
One slight change: 'Bombardment' to 'Bombard' (2 syllables).
'Why?'
Don't know. Obsessive-compulsive, maybe, or pedantic.
Com-bat (2)
At-tack (2)
Sup-port (2)
Bom-bard (2)
'Ok?'
Well, I dunno...
'Anything else, noob?'
Well... Yes. 
DESTRUCTION PARADE: Combat, Attack, Bombard, Support, newCovert.
HARVEST PARADE: Industrial, newCovert.
CRAFT PARADE: Industrial.
What's going on here? Destruction still taking the lead? Nothing new yet? |
Rimase
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
Sanctuary Pact
12
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Posted - 2012.04.03 18:19:00 -
[1925] - Quote
Question @ Fanfest Keynote
Players who like deviate setups on Specialised ships. Won't happen imo  . |
Vanessa Vansen
Cybermana
18
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Posted - 2012.04.03 19:18:00 -
[1926] - Quote
So, one thing to keep in mind ...
With all the ship lines ... what's going to happen when you introduce them?
e.g. consider a maxed out (in other words "perfect")hulk pilot ... (not taking leadership bonus into account)
What's going to happen when you introduce ship lines?
Will that pilot be still be "perfect" or will there be new skills to train to be "perfect" again?
At the moment I would say that the idea behind ship lines is good BUT you'll have to keep in mind that people will be very sad/angry when they are not "perfect" in their way anymore.
Hence,
* you'll be able to fly the same ships after the "change" as you are before the change
and
* you'll be able to fly those ships after the "change" as before the change
I.e. a perfect hulk pilot will remain a perfect hulk pilot, and accordingly for "combat" ships and so on
And a 2nd input ...
T3 and generalization ... once you let us change sub-systems at a POS or a ship main bay of a orca/rorqual/carrier that may be true, until then it does only hold for systems with stations/outposts |
Allen Ramses
Zombicidal Mania
Penumbra Alliance
1
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Posted - 2012.04.03 19:24:00 -
[1927] - Quote
I think the people who are talking about skills in and of themselves are missing the point.
The way it is now, destroyers are not superior to frigates, they are just different. Their lack of speed and tanking ability make them prime targets for cruisers and roaming frigate gangs. They lack the maneuverability to bug out of a fight, and their hulls would not survive a head on attack. Treating them as an evolutionary superior class would not make very much sense. Their role is to pick off frigates from a distance, not front line combat.
The way skills are being proposed to change is like putting a piece of tape on a leaky pipe. The drip may be gone, but another problem will arrive elsewhere. This is a delicate issue which needs to be carefully dealt with. And due to the present state of BCs, the situation needs to be handled with extreme care. Declaring destroyers and BCs evolutionary racial skills and then saying "voila!" is not the way to go
CCP, please tell us if you are still watching this thread! The way you handle this mess is of utmost priority. |
Sephiroth CloneIIV
Vitriol Ventures
BLACK-MARK
89
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Posted - 2012.04.04 05:30:00 -
[1928] - Quote
Teircide is a good thing, I don't see changing skill progression as bad but huge amounts of raging about skill changing is creating a ruckus about any amount of change, the one I want.
So... maybe keep it separate, one improvement/change not dependent on the other. Roll out teircide asap, but hold back on any major changes to skill tree until a solution is found that is agree able without so much rage.
|
Kayla Khan
Maverick Fleet Systems
AAA Citizens
0
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Posted - 2012.04.04 05:54:00 -
[1929] - Quote
Soooooooo if i have a toon that i had to train for amarr and caldari freighters can I have the sp i needed for industrial 5 back please? also do i now need freighter 5 for jump freighter?
additionally i have a capital toon that cross trained from amarr caps to gallente caps can i have the battleship 5 sps reimbursed aswell?
and just to clarify if i have battlecruiser 5 and all racial cruisers to 3? is that sufficent to recive these racial battleship 5's ?
you had better make a second blog confiming and denying people fears cause this thread is difficult to navigate and your communication with the public is vital to this very difficult change working properly while causing the least bit of unrest
please layout the skill requirements to recive this all race level 5
battlecruiser 5 cruiser 3 (or 4?)
Destroyer 5, Frigate 5 (shouldn't this be 4? following your statements regarding command ship skill trees)
Also IMO make this simple if you have BC 3 you get all race BC3 reguardless of whether you can fly the ship or not. same thing for destroyers destroyers 4 gets you all race destroyer 4 reguardless of any other skills
PLEASE READ THIS |
Noztra Ernaga
Motion Czechoslovakia
0
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Posted - 2012.04.04 06:28:00 -
[1930] - Quote
My assumption is that you need Frigate III to fly a Destroyer. You also need Frigate IV and Cruiser III to fly a Battlecruiser.
They have said you maintain the ability to fly everything you are able to after the change goes live.
I have decided to skill for racial Frigates IV, racial Cruiser III, BCs and Destroyers V postponing my current skill plan.
Hope this is a good decission that is going to pay off in the future and I get my Battlecruiser and Destroyer V for all races :)
This should work if they choose the second approach. Should they select the first one, you will be fine with BCs and Destroyers V without your racial Frigate and Cruiser skills taken into account. |
Pietr Serras
Point of No Return
Waterboard
5
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Posted - 2012.04.04 07:37:00 -
[1931] - Quote
Wow, it just feels like everything ccp announces as of late makes me want to leave. I haven't heard one good idea besides the titan nerf. Quit dumbing down eve. If I want a simple super easy pve game, then I'd just go play SWTOR not this. Inferno may be the end of eve for the hardcore player. |
Korbin Dallaz
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
7
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Posted - 2012.04.04 18:29:00 -
[1932] - Quote
Andski wrote:
Stick to missions, thanks!
I do, I have and I am. Thanks.
|
Justice Comes
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
1
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Posted - 2012.04.04 18:33:00 -
[1933] - Quote
Blaze D'fire wrote:Alright well i spent about 4 hours reading the thread and i am thuroughly confused at this point.
I have a couple concerns that everyone has already voiced 11,634 times so i'll say it once more.
It's the release of some but not all information that has everyone so confused. I imagine thousands of people have adjusted their entire queue plan for this, but we have really no idea whether we actually should. Holy lemming-rush.
This webpage is not available
Google Chrome could not load the webpage because forums.eveonline.com took too long to respond. The website may be down, or you may be experiencing issues with your Internet connection. |
Publius Valerius
East Khanid Trading
Khanid Trade Syndicate
47
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Posted - 2012.04.05 02:58:00 -
[1934] - Quote
First I havent read all the pages... it is just to much.... is their any new infos what the status quo is?
P.S. My thoughts on rebalancing |
Daeva Teresa
Viziam
Amarr Empire
54
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Posted - 2012.04.05 12:48:00 -
[1935] - Quote
Easy way, how to implement this:
1.
Seed the 4 new battlecruiser books.
Write in the description of old book, new books, skills and battlecruiser ships, that there will be switch in 2 months.
Also state the change will be comming in the launcher.
This way everyone will know whats comming and can easily prepare.
2. 2 months later:
Remove all the old battlecruiser books and skill from the game, reimbust the isk and skill points.
Switch all the battlecruiser to use the new skills.
Same with destroyers but maybe not in the same time.
I think this would be easy to implement and fair to everyone.
P.S. If you (CCP) will use this idea, give me credit, isk and a lot of PLEX . Just kidding :-)
CCP really please dont use Upgraded, Limited, Experimental-áand Prototype in item names. It sounds like the item is actually worse than basic meta 1 item. Use Calibrated, Enhanced, Optimized and Upgraded. Its really easy to understand that the item is better than meta 1 and its also in alphabetic order. |
Zyress
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
48
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Posted - 2012.04.06 16:57:00 -
[1936] - Quote
Geez this is a long thread, and there's no way I'll read 97 pages of it so I'll just ask. Does anyone know if they plan to extend this to the generic T2 ship command skills? All the T2 ship skills are generic like the Destroyer and Battlecruiser. I have them all at a minimum of 4. To take them to 5 will I have to train a race specific version for 1 more level each race? While we are on the subject of reimbursement, is My skill point total going to bloom dramatically when this goes into effect or are you downsizing the skills to be equivalent to the generic skillpoints for the skill covering all races? If the skillpoint total blooms will you be upgrading our clones for us when this takes place? |
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
347
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Posted - 2012.04.06 17:27:00 -
[1937] - Quote
If it opens up a new hull, it'll be factional. If it's just modified hulls, it'll be generic.
The T2 skills don't open up new hulls, therefore, generic.
FuzzWork Enterprises
http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/
Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities. |
Allen Ramses
Zombicidal Mania
Penumbra Alliance
1
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Posted - 2012.04.06 19:07:00 -
[1938] - Quote
Steve Ronuken wrote:If it opens up a new hull size, it'll be factional. FYP, EA.
Destroyers are frigate sized vessels. BCs are horrendously overpowered cruiser sized vessels. Fix the BCs to be what they are supposed to be, and the need for racial skill modifications is gone. |
Hena Muri
Rubicon Extraction Services
1
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Posted - 2012.04.06 20:56:00 -
[1939] - Quote
Zyress wrote:Geez this is a long thread, and there's no way I'll read 97 pages of it so I'll just ask. Does anyone know if they plan to extend this to the generic T2 ship command skills? All the T2 ship skills are generic like the Destroyer and Battlecruiser. I have them all at a minimum of 4. To take them to 5 will I have to train a race specific version for 1 more level each race? While we are on the subject of reimbursement, is My skill point total going to bloom dramatically when this goes into effect or are you downsizing the skills to be equivalent to the generic skillpoints for the skill covering all races? If the skillpoint total blooms will you be upgrading our clones for us when this takes place?
This is to fix the confusion in having to train something like Minmatar Cruiser 3 to fly a Hurricane which is a battle cruiser.
There should be less confusion that flying a Cruiser Tech 2 Hull is going to require that factions Cruiser Skill to 5 as all Tech 2 ships work that way. Though, It does mean that you'll only need Minmatar BC skill to 5 to fly a command ship, instead of BC 5 and Minmatar Cruiser 5 which is potentially confusing and makes it take significantly longer to get into these vessels than a Tech 3 hull.
This also makes it possible to add Pirate Faction Destroyers, and Pirate Faction BC's to the game, and I'm looking forward to that as it means more Gurista's stuff (Missile/Drone boats) A destroyer that could field 10 light drones would be epic (just saying)!
Hopefully it means more Destroyer hulls as well as training to level 5 destroyers and only getting one hull the entire time is very "meh"
_WAter_
|
Qvar Dar'Zanar
EVE University
Ivy League
29
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Posted - 2012.04.07 01:26:00 -
[1940] - Quote
Pietr Serras wrote:Wow, it just feels like everything ccp announces as of late makes me want to leave. I haven't heard one good idea besides the titan nerf. Quit dumbing down eve. If I want a simple super easy pve game, then I'd just go play SWTOR not this. Inferno may be the end of eve for the hardcore player.
Oh please. Go. Quit. I bet you can't even tell why is this going to make eve a super easy game. What a drama queen. |
Dr Prometheus
Gears of Construction
Gears Confederation
57
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Posted - 2012.04.07 23:18:00 -
[1941] - Quote
Can i suggest a new tree (just the ship skills dont have the secondary or anything added.) for the ORE ships?
This tree shows also an idea for getting slowly into the mining profession by adding a ORE Frigate, ORE Cuiser, a Battlecruiser sized one. (Noctis/Primea hull with another role?). And then an (in my eyes.) better way to skill for certain sides.
So here is the link to my little schematic;
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/1204/oreindustrialchart.png
Dude, where is my Charon? |
Sarah Schneider
PonyWaffe
Test Alliance Please Ignore
50
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Posted - 2012.04.08 22:16:00 -
[1942] - Quote
Qvar Dar'Zanar wrote:Pietr Serras wrote:Wow, it just feels like everything ccp announces as of late makes me want to leave. I haven't heard one good idea besides the titan nerf. Quit dumbing down eve. If I want a simple super easy pve game, then I'd just go play SWTOR not this. Inferno may be the end of eve for the hardcore player. Oh please. Go. Quit. I bet you can't even tell why is this going to make eve a super easy game. What a drama queen.
+1
Some people just don't get that making things easier to learn <> dumbing down things. |
Dreker71
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.04.08 23:41:00 -
[1943] - Quote
I'd like to start by saying well done with most of the changes and improvements over the last year, but this is an absolute joke!!!!
I have dedicated my character to flying the different races.........so dedicated it has taken me 4 years to get there, including paying for the account to remain active when I have not been able to play to rack up the skills I needed and now you want to introduce this, how many more years of training is it going to take me to get back to where I am now?
it's going to make most of my skill points useless and I'm not willing to start again from the bottom.
|
None ofthe Above
164
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Posted - 2012.04.09 02:12:00 -
[1944] - Quote
Dreker71 wrote:I'd like to start by saying well done with most of the changes and improvements over the last year, but this is an absolute joke!!!!
I have dedicated my character to flying the different races.........so dedicated it has taken me 4 years to get there, including paying for the account to remain active when I have not been able to play to rack up the skills I needed and now you want to introduce this, how many more years of training is it going to take me to get back to where I am now?
it's going to make most of my skill points useless and I'm not willing to start again from the bottom.
I'm all up for changes that make EVE more accessible to newer players, after all more players is a good thing imo.
Don't overlook the old/loyal players tho, if I log in one day and can't use half my ships it'll be the last time I log in and I'm sure a lot of others share my opinion, of course there's always going to be the odd forum troll who can only fly one race who thinks this is great and it's to these people I extend my favourite finger.
Bring on the hate mail.............
Oi... there are reasons to be upset about these proposals, but they have committed to making sure you won't be locked out of any ships you can already fly.
As they've said ad infinitum now.
|
Sarah Schneider
PonyWaffe
Test Alliance Please Ignore
52
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Posted - 2012.04.09 05:24:00 -
[1945] - Quote
Dreker71 wrote:I'd like to start by saying well done with most of the changes and improvements over the last year, but this is an absolute joke!!!!
I have dedicated my character to flying the different races.........so dedicated it has taken me 4 years to get there, including paying for the account to remain active when I have not been able to play to rack up the skills I needed and now you want to introduce this, how many more years of training is it going to take me to get back to where I am now?
it's going to make most of my skill points useless and I'm not willing to start again from the bottom.
I'm all up for changes that make EVE more accessible to newer players, after all more players is a good thing imo.
Don't overlook the old/loyal players tho, if I log in one day and can't use half my ships it'll be the last time I log in and I'm sure a lot of others share my opinion, of course there's always going to be the odd forum troll who can only fly one race who thinks this is great and it's to these people I extend my favourite finger.
Bring on the hate mail.............
have you even read what the changes will be? what is wrong with people  |
Dreker71
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.09 07:04:00 -
[1946] - Quote
Bring on the hate mail.............[/quote]
have you even read what the changes will be? what is wrong with people [/quote]
Yes but not all 90 something pages |
Dreker71
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.09 07:11:00 -
[1947] - Quote
Oi... there are reasons to be upset about these proposals, but they have committed to making sure you won't be locked out of any ships you can already fly.
As they've said ad infinitum now.[/quote]
and what about the ones I was due to fly soon....?
|
Justin Ackaris
Order of the Shadow
The Revenant Order
6
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Posted - 2012.04.09 09:43:00 -
[1948] - Quote
I've tried to find the dates the destroyer and battlecruiser skills will change to racial skills but can't find anything. Does anyone know? |
AstarothPrime
Eternal Profiteers
Persona Non Gratis
6
|
Posted - 2012.04.09 12:28:00 -
[1949] - Quote
mhm
Make racial BC skill 1x then and reimburse the original... problem solved...
I. |
bornaa
GRiD.
203
|
Posted - 2012.04.09 12:51:00 -
[1950] - Quote
Please CCP,
Look at your, like one guy says, aluminium foil ORE ship design.
Why the hell are that expensive ships that weak???
You throw a rock on them and they shatter.
3 mill worth isk fitted destroyer can kill allmost 400mill worth, fitted, hulk???
90 mill worth isk fitted tornado can kill few exumers that worth close to 1 Billion???
And all that before Concord comes???
So you basically want that one ganker can kill 100 times more expensive mining gear then their whip is worth and that all before Concord comes? 
That's really ****** design.
Severian Carnifex wrote:Rengerel en Distel wrote:Shouldn't you all like new miner ships so you can just suicide gank them with 1 light drone? If they continue the paper thin hulls on mining barges scaling downward, they should have about 38 EHP. You'll have to fight off the other gangs of real pvpers extracting 'tears' of the 3 hour old players though, so maybe that's why you're upset?
I hope CCP is not that blind. If they were before, i hope they gave a visit to a good opthamologist in the mean time. @ CCP: Your design of ORE ships is garbage. Aluminum foil can can not fly in space.
That Ain't Right |
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