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What do Incursioners add to the EVE universe?

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Cipher Jones 350	Posted - 2012.03.10 04:37:00 - [61] - Quote Quote: 2) NEWFLASH... see that solo miner in the Bantam mining veldspar with 2 lasers? Guess what... hes a paying customer too, should CCP give him billions also... based on what you say everyone who can't do incursions should/would leave EVE (More CCP doomsday threats if the IWIN button is removed) The miner has the iwin button too. The choice to press it is his. 04:25:37 Notify Cipher Jones, criminals are not welcome here. Leave now or be destroyed.
Nambr1 Super Cr3w 0	Posted - 2012.03.10 05:34:00 - [62] - Quote Xyla Vulchanus wrote: What do Incursioners add to the EVE universe? Inflation True ... but they r not reason of main inflation. Moons r main reason (0.0 space) and incursions r way to make balance between 0.0 and hi sec. There is less risk in hi sec, but u cant force ppl to play any game style. Everyone is paying same price for eve so ccp must make every1 happy. Before moon fever gtc 90 days was 240 mil, then gtc 60 days was 500-600 mil and when inc came price jumped to 1 bil. So if ccp nerf inc and moons for 40%, get better tracking on anomalies bots (dotlan map is good way for that to see in every 0.0 region) everything will be in nice place.
Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 224	Posted - 2012.03.10 06:51:00 - [63] - Quote Hm, as someone pointed out moon mining doesn't make CONCORD print isk. Now ratting, missions and incursions do, not sure what else. Do NPCs buy things? Take all the tech Build all the titans Drop all the POSes Bees incoming, nerf ERRYTHING ERRYDAY
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 5401	Posted - 2012.03.10 06:54:00 - [64] - Quote Alavaria Fera wrote: Hm, as someone pointed out moon mining doesn't make CONCORD print isk. Now ratting, missions and incursions do, not sure what else. Do NPCs buy things? Faucets: NPC bounties NPC buy orders Mission rewards Insurance payout GM actions: Reimbursement for lost pods Character creation Sinks: Market taxes & fees: Broker fees, Sales tax NPC sell orders NPC station services: Repairs, Jump clone installation, Medical clone installation/upgrade/station change, Science and industry slot rental, Ship insurance NPC station office fees: Rent, Impound penalties Wardecs Sovereignty fees PI fees: Building PI structures, Import/export tax (from NPC-owned customs offices) Corp & alliance fees: Corp creation, Alliance creation, Alliance upkeep, Creating/awarding medals, Corp registry ads Agent fees: (Certain) LP store items, Locator agent services, Courier missions w/ deposits CSPA Charges Smuggling fines GM Actions: Removal of bought ISK, Removal of insurance after ship reimbursement Character deletion GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants.
Alavaria Fera GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 224	Posted - 2012.03.10 06:56:00 - [65] - Quote Ah quite a list. Good work on the research. Take all the tech Build all the titans Drop all the POSes Bees incoming, nerf ERRYTHING ERRYDAY
Xorv Questionable Acquisitions 153	Posted - 2012.03.10 07:56:00 - [66] - Quote DarthNefarius wrote: Xorv wrote: High Sec Incursions doesn't add anything good to EVE, CCP should either remove them or radically change the mechanics. Having fun in lets in hi sec I guess adds nothing good to Eve for you so we should just make all HI sec into lo sec problem settled huh? Eve would DIE in 6 month Yes how foolish of me, EVE has lasted all these years by catering to PvE raiders that mistook this game for space WoW.
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 2341	Posted - 2012.03.10 07:59:00 - [67] - Quote Nambr1 wrote: Xyla Vulchanus wrote: What do Incursioners add to the EVE universe? Inflation True ... but they r not reason of main inflation. Moons r main reason (0.0 space) and incursions r way to make balance between 0.0 and hi sec. There is less risk in hi sec, but u cant force ppl to play any game style. Everyone is paying same price for eve so ccp must make every1 happy. Before moon fever gtc 90 days was 240 mil, then gtc 60 days was 500-600 mil and when inc came price jumped to 1 bil. So if ccp nerf inc and moons for 40%, get better tracking on anomalies bots (dotlan map is good way for that to see in every 0.0 region) everything will be in nice place. Tell us how moons work Nambr1 of Super Cr3w corporation also ahahahaha holy pubbies you think moons had anything to do with the GTC spike "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012
M1k3y Koontz Taxes Suck Inc. 16	Posted - 2012.03.10 14:39:00 - [68] - Quote The problem with the Vanguard isk faucet is that that money stays in highsec. Most of the moon goo goes back into the alliance who is creating supercapitals online down in null. I still say both need a nerf.
Farang Lo State War Academy Caldari State 8	Posted - 2012.03.10 15:08:00 - [69] - Quote M1k3y Koontz wrote: The problem with the Vanguard isk faucet is that that money stays in highsec. Most of the moon goo goes back into the alliance who is creating supercapitals online down in null. I still say both need a nerf. another clueless
Cosmic Fart Hedion University Amarr Empire 3	Posted - 2012.03.10 17:52:00 - [70] - Quote They contribute $14.95 a month to a game they like to play and how they like to play it. Not your decision how others prefer to play a game. Want to pay my subscrioptions? I'll play your way if so.
Patient 2428190 DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School 104	Posted - 2012.03.10 18:14:00 - [71] - Quote What it added? Easily the only group PvE content you can easily find pickup groups for. In an MMO, that's a pretty big deal.
Jack Carrigan Order of the Shadow The Revenant Order 569	Posted - 2012.03.10 19:17:00 - [72] - Quote Incursioners add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist *holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a *ing thing. "War is not measured in terms of who wins or loses, who is right or wrong.-á It is measured in terms of who survives."*
Eternus8lux8lucis Whack-A-Mole 80	Posted - 2012.03.10 19:59:00 - [73] - Quote Jack Carrigan wrote: Incursioners add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist *holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a ing thing. Nullbears add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a *ing thing. Carebears add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a *ing thing. CCP add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a ***ing thing. Look look look it applies to EVERYONE!! Strength isnt measured in numbers but in force of will. For if one motived willful individual stands many will fall around him that are weak. http://tinyurl.com/YarrFace
Cambarus Baros Reloaded 141	Posted - 2012.03.10 22:10:00 - [74] - Quote Xorv wrote: DarthNefarius wrote: Xorv wrote: High Sec Incursions doesn't add anything good to EVE, CCP should either remove them or radically change the mechanics. Having fun in lets in hi sec I guess adds nothing good to Eve for you so we should just make all HI sec into lo sec problem settled huh? Eve would DIE in 6 month Yes how foolish of me, EVE has lasted all these years by catering to PvE raiders that mistook this game for space WoW. While I'd be the first to agree that eve is mainly a pvp focused game, you can't deny that without highsec carebears, CCP wouldn't be getting the subs it needs to stay active.
Blatant Forum Alt Federal Navy Academy Gallente Federation 10	Posted - 2012.03.10 22:27:00 - [75] - Quote Patient 2428190 wrote: What it added? Easily the only group PvE content you can easily find pickup groups for. In an MMO, that's a pretty big deal. Incursions gave us a seemingly endless supply of butthurt and rage tears, and for that, it was worth the effort. CCP = lord of the trolls.
MatrixSkye Mk2 Republic University Minmatar Republic 137	Posted - 2012.03.10 22:40:00 - [76] - Quote Rico Minali wrote: They add a massive isk fountain, which increases the price of everythign as there is more isk than anyone sane would ever need to play spaceships with. And I suppse they might be tempted to RMT with it, I mean Misanth says he made 21 billion isk in a month, that would be a nice little earner on the side wouldnt it? Am I missing something? I thought there were no isk payouts from incursions (as in isk out of thin air). Has that changed?
KrakizBad Eve Defence Force Fatal Ascension 430	Posted - 2012.03.10 22:44:00 - [77] - Quote MatrixSkye Mk2 wrote: Rico Minali wrote: They add a massive isk fountain, which increases the price of everythign as there is more isk than anyone sane would ever need to play spaceships with. And I suppse they might be tempted to RMT with it, I mean Misanth says he made 21 billion isk in a month, that would be a nice little earner on the side wouldnt it? Am I missing something? I thought there were no isk payouts from incursions (as in isk out of thin air). Has that changed? Yes you missed something huge, in the form of a gigantic ISK fountain from incursions. http://blog.beyondreality.se/Incursion-hose Remove all incursions from hisec
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 2349	Posted - 2012.03.11 01:43:00 - [78] - Quote Eternus8lux8lucis wrote: Jack Carrigan wrote: Incursioners add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist *holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a ing thing. Nullbears add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a *ing thing. Carebears add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a *ing thing. CCP add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a ***ing thing. Look look look it applies to EVERYONE!! fyi there isn't concord in null "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012
Anastasia Shimaya Viziam Amarr Empire 14	Posted - 2012.03.11 03:11:00 - [79] - Quote Highsec Incursion farming basically turns EVE into WOW and every other mmo that has a "hold my hand" approach, and they get amply rewarded for playing that way, so much so that staying to do other things isn't rewarding at all... and those that are doing it the hard way are thinking "WTF is the point of doing ________ if incursions make way more for basically blob PVE farming" Basically CCP is telling the people who had to work a little to get isk, lived in dangerous space, or even needed Microsoft Excel to turn a profit to "Be good sports" and let the people who don't have half the talent/dedication you have and make tons more money then you effortlessl SERIOUS QUESTION: Imagine in incursions were in EVE day one.... how many people would still be playing eve after making trillions effortlessly many years later How many corps would be formed if everyone had enough isk to not need to join anyone How many people would have the drive to go into other indy/manufacturing fields if they were already multi-billionaires How many people would honestly waste time missioning/salvaging What made EVE interesting is that you had to find a way to "make it", with incursions its doing away with what made it different from all other MMOs
Farang Lo State War Academy Caldari State 8	Posted - 2012.03.11 07:54:00 - [80] - Quote Eternus8lux8lucis wrote: Jack Carrigan wrote: Incursioners add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist *holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a ing thing. Nullbears add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a *ing thing. Carebears add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a *ing thing. CCP add an ISK faucet, unstable market environment, a plethora of shiny ships, elitist holes, and... yeah, that's about it. What do they add that's productive? Not a ***ing thing. Look look look it applies to EVERYONE!! Nullbears add moon goo, deadspace mods, pirate ships, high end ore Mission runners add faction mods, implant, faction ammo into market. CCP, well, I give up on this
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 5412	Posted - 2012.03.11 08:02:00 - [81] - Quote MatrixSkye Mk2 wrote: Am I missing something? I thought there were no isk payouts from incursions (as in isk out of thin air). Has that changed? Nothing has changed GÇö they were always like that. Some of the ISK gets sunk right back into the LP stores (the other large reward mechanism for incursions), but that's probably only about 5bn ISK a day compared to the 300bn they inject. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Find more rants over at Tippis' Rants.
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 2349	Posted - 2012.03.11 08:04:00 - [82] - Quote Tippia wrote: MatrixSkye Mk2 wrote: Am I missing something? I thought there were no isk payouts from incursions (as in isk out of thin air). Has that changed? Nothing has changed GÇö they were always like that. Some of the ISK gets sunk right back into the LP stores (the other large reward mechanism for incursions), but that's probably only about 5bn ISK a day compared to the 300bn they inject. but :siren: TECH MOONS :siren: "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012
Psychotic Monk The Skunkworks 101	Posted - 2012.03.11 08:12:00 - [83] - Quote And is playing clueless pubbie even though he knows better, but I'll bite anyways, because I feel this part of the issue doesn't get as much attention as it deserves: Tech moons can be attacked. This income generation can be disrupted. Incursions are essentially impossible to deny income generation from. It took epic levels of organization to get those moons. Even if the current owners of those moons are sitting on top of a sea of blue, it's still theoretically possible to ** that up for them. Battles are being fought over these things. I mean, nullsec is boring as ** politically, and really static, but never let it be said that they (or someone, at least) didn't work their asses off to put that whole thing together.
Xorv Questionable Acquisitions 158	Posted - 2012.03.11 09:53:00 - [84] - Quote Cambarus wrote: While I'd be the first to agree that eve is mainly a pvp focused game, you can't deny that without highsec carebears, CCP wouldn't be getting the subs it needs to stay active. I do deny it, especially when it comes to High Sec Incursion runners. A good portion of them are likely alts of Null Sec, Low Sec and WH players who would happily adapt back to making their ISK in their main areas of play were the game not so out of balance in terms of risk vs reward. Those that are players that want PvP free high reward PvE raids should be shown the door, and the long term health of EVE will be better for their passing.
Seleia O'Sinnor Drop of Honey 181	Posted - 2012.03.11 11:39:00 - [85] - Quote I totally agree. Remove: * Missions * Incursions * Mining * Hisec * PI * WH-Space * R&D Agents * Concord And do the follwoing changes: * Every system becomes nullsec * Maybe some lowsec sytems to relax * Every noob should be thrown into PvP combat after logging in the first time * Add certificates and medals to reflect professions: Scammer, can flipper, uicide ganker, gate camper, double crosser, corp thief, merc, moon goo rich b..., cap hot dropper, supercap hot dropper, hulkageddon champion, indy murderer, adorable role model. * Add civilian laser to the pod The result: Only cool threads in EGD and cool people in Eve Online, highly regarded for their cunning skillz at fighting everyone at sight. Fearless to ship loss and mineral prices. In the end we may have cool pod wars. Eve community: An angry mob of bright people hunting witches, more torches, more hay forks, growing and growing.
Doc Severide Caldari Provisions Caldari State 43	Posted - 2012.03.11 12:38:00 - [86] - Quote DarthNefarius wrote: Xorv wrote: High Sec Incursions doesn't add anything good to EVE, CCP should either remove them or radically change the mechanics. Having fun in lets in hi sec I guess adds nothing good to Eve for you so we should just make all HI sec into lo sec problem settled huh? Eve would DIE in 6 month Xorv is an idiot...
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 2350	Posted - 2012.03.11 14:37:00 - [87] - Quote Psychotic Monk wrote: And is playing clueless pubbie even though he knows better, but I'll bite anyways, because I feel this part of the issue doesn't get as much attention as it deserves Tech moons can be attacked. This income generation can be disrupted. Incursions are essentially impossible to deny income generation from. It took epic levels of organization to get those moons. Even if the current owners of those moons are sitting on top of a sea of blue, it's still theoretically possible to ** that up for them. Battles are being fought over these things I mean, nullsec is boring as ** politically, and really static, but never let it be said that they (or someone, at least) didn't work their asses off to put that whole thing together. I'm pointing towards the fact that a lot of these people don't understand that tech moons are alliance assets. Logistics teams devote a lot of hours into emptying silos, fueling towers and adjusting stront levels. They have to be defended, and it is not uncommon to lose more ISK in ships (especially triage carriers) than the ISK value of a month's output from that moon. But even with that, an alliance that holds a small handful of these moons would have income similar to an alliance that holds numerous R64s. Tech moons need to be nerfed, but not for the same reason as high-sec incursions. "WeGÇÖre a professional Merc Alliance, like PL" ~ snot shot, 2012
Arbiter Reformed Saiph Industries SRS. 46	Posted - 2012.03.11 15:48:00 - [88] - Quote i remember moaning about lvl4s being too profitable without risk. now we have whole wormhole alliances who live in low class holes leave for incursions and belt ratting and anoms in nullsec just laughable. before the sactum nerf i was making mebbeh 150 an hour dual boxing a thanatos and a nighthawk, now people are making that in highsec ! wtf! highsec incursions make prices completely out of whack with any other form of making isk
Cambarus Baros Reloaded 141	Posted - 2012.03.11 16:17:00 - [89] - Quote Xorv wrote: Cambarus wrote: While I'd be the first to agree that eve is mainly a pvp focused game, you can't deny that without highsec carebears, CCP wouldn't be getting the subs it needs to stay active. I do deny it, especially when it comes to High Sec Incursion runners. A good portion of them are likely alts of Null Sec, Low Sec and WH players who would happily adapt back to making their ISK in their main areas of play were the game not so out of balance in terms of risk vs reward. Those that are players that want PvP free high reward PvE raids should be shown the door, and the long term health of EVE will be better for their passing. "A good portion"? Most of the people I've run incursions with were pure carebears who just wanted some group pve. What's more is that incursions don't pay out nearly what people like to claim they do, especially when compared to level 4s. If you're pulling 100mil an hour in incursions, odds are you were pulling 60-70 in lvl 4s, with fewer delays, no reliance on fleets etc. For every fleet that breaks the 100mil/hour mark, there are 2-3 that struggle to hit 60, and so what if they pay more than level 4s? They SHOULD. Incursions are competitive, and they're a form of income that CAN be attacked, most people just don't care enough to muster up the 60 guys to down the mom site. Mind you I'm not against nerfing vanguards, which do pay too much for the challenge they provide, but a rather modest fix of a couple cruisers in NCOs, maybe a BS in an NMC and forcing fleets to clear the sites 100% to get the payout would be plenty to fix that issue. People who seem to think that the isk/hour should be cut in half are insane. Assaults and HQs on the other hand are in need of a buff, as they don't really surpass missions in terms of the isk they can generate even when run without interruptions. If you REALLY want to see something done about the balance issues between high and nullsec, then your best bet is to push CCP to undo those terrible nullsec changes that went through because they seem to think that people fighting over a handful of systems is more important than getting people out into null in the first place. Undo the changes that made 90% of null worse than highsec level 4 grinding, which is the REAL reason there's no reason for most people to farm in null.
Cipher Jones 353	Posted - 2012.03.11 17:03:00 - [90] - Quote Quote: Incursions are essentially impossible to deny income generation from. Another legendary example of not understanding incursions at all and posting about them. 04:25:37 Notify Cipher Jones, criminals are not welcome here. Leave now or be destroyed.

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