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Why the claw desperately needs a boost

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Kuzya Morozov L8L8L8	Posted - 2008.05.31 00:08:00 - [1] Claw has a lock range of 21km with max skills, and only 2 mids, thus MWD and scram. Targeting range at 21 is just stupid, it's almost impossible to lock anything without overshooting and crashing into web range. Can it at least be boosted to 24, so it can use the full scram range?
Kuzya Morozov L8L8L8	Posted - 2008.05.31 00:08:00 - [2] Claw has a lock range of 21km with max skills, and only 2 mids, thus MWD and scram. Targeting range at 21 is just stupid, it's almost impossible to lock anything without overshooting and crashing into web range. Can it at least be boosted to 24, so it can use the full scram range?
Hanneshannes	Posted - 2008.05.31 00:37:00 - [3] Edited by: Hanneshannes on 31/05/2008 00:37:23 Wow, that's a small lock range oO Do all minmatar ships have a somewhat smaller locking range?
Kuzya Morozov L8L8L8	Posted - 2008.05.31 00:44:00 - [4] Nah, the other minnie inty has 31km range. Which is why the Claw is totally bogus.
Jennae Unity of Honor	Posted - 2008.05.31 01:12:00 - [5] I think the Stiletto should get a boost to lock range too. IT's made for long range tackling. only inty with 4 mids... It should have its lock range increased maybe 20%
Tsanse Kinske WeMeanYouKnowHarm	Posted - 2008.05.31 01:22:00 - [6] Yes, please to Claw targeting buff. Stiletto otoh? Haha. * * * In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move. -Douglas Adams, writing about EVE
Liang Nuren Perkone	Posted - 2008.05.31 01:54:00 - [7] Actually, I'm a big fan of boosting the lock range on all frigs and destroyers. -Liang -- It was an honor to participate in the Insurgency campaign in Branch. o7 to all involved.
Kuzya Morozov L8L8L8	Posted - 2008.05.31 01:54:00 - [8] Well, the stiletto not so much. You see, I was trying to put together an inty for killing other inties, and Claw is the damage sceptor. However, because of the lack of mids and lock range (since the moment someone turns around you will lose lock), this is very hard to do with a Claw (cue whines about overpowered Crow). The stiletto is a beatiful sceptor, though a bit slower, and I'm pretty sure with maxed out nav and cap skills you can sustain t2 mwd/t2 disrup/web/sensor booster. Compared to the Claw it has one less low slow and a little less speed, but 2 more mids and greater lock range, making it a much better scepter. The one time I was ganged with a claymore with ganglink, disruptor on stiletto went to 40km, but lock range was only 31 :P
stoats Alcatraz Inc. Tactical Narcotics Team	Posted - 2008.05.31 02:26:00 - [9] Uhm and theres nothing wrong wit ur 4 low slots and fitting a sig amp Besides the claw is a close range monster......
Gustav Seriya Celestial Apocalypse Insurgency	Posted - 2008.05.31 04:10:00 - [10] Edited by: Gustav Seriya on 31/05/2008 04:12:33 The interceptors with 2 mids have a serious issue in that they cannot fit web/scram/MWD to do their job properly. Drop the web and they're sucky against other interceptors, drop the point and they can't even tackle. Drop the MWD and be totally useless and die to everything. Lock range is a pain too. You have an extra low slot at the expense of a much more valuable midslot. Fit a Signal Amp to fix your terrible lock range and you've got a rather poor ship.

Subedai	Posted - 2008.05.31 08:01:00 - [11] Originally by: Hanneshannes Edited by: Hanneshannes on 31/05/2008 00:37:23 Wow, that's a small lock range oO Do all minmatar ships have a somewhat smaller locking range? ALL minmatar ships have a SOMEWHAT smaller locking range - Its not just the claw.
Uncle Smokey	Posted - 2008.05.31 08:09:00 - [12] Edited by: Uncle Smokey on 31/05/2008 08:23:53 Yeah all ceptors could use locking range boost, because maneuvering inside 13-21km range @5km/s+ is easier said than done, when all your commands take 3sec+ for that mysterious "kosmik anomaly". Especially if your opponent runs at high speeds too. Claw could be a bit more ninja to live up to its race, but its not necessarily "desperate". I do have to say i find it rather disturbing that the crusader is more agile (and so, faster) with a third more of EHPs. E: I mean: why the hell is a paper airplane so much tougher than a flying brick? Lemme guess. Because it is THE LORE? cool. .:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:. \o/ EVERYBODY SAY HELL YEAH! \o/
Bloody Puppy Onorata Societa	Posted - 2008.05.31 08:27:00 - [13] allways liked it's rusty fly shape..... but i was in several troubles doing the tackler in gang so allways gone for the stiletto..... 100% agreed. sorry about whining but claw whit 20 km loking range (can't even get profit from a disruptor II btw ) is completly useless in the ceptor role..... me ask for stiletto, ares malediction goes to 31km loking claw, crusader, and taranis goes to 25km loking exception is the crow-iwin-button whit 30km loking what do you think? -discuss- ------------------------------------------------- The puppy -- yarr WHY EVERYONE LOVES ME BUT NOONE UNDERSTAND ME? Albert Heinstein
Seetesh Pixels Docks	Posted - 2008.05.31 08:37:00 - [14] Id agree its got a pitiful lock range.
Uncle Smokey	Posted - 2008.05.31 09:10:00 - [15] Now that i think about it, claw really has some strange "features" for a so called "kombatceptor": First of all it has to choose from web/disruptor, where atleast in dogfighting the warp disruptor bonus is forfeit. This is somewhat of an issue with crusader too, but claw is way more dependend of range. -While being the most fragile flying brick with worst dps and locking range and capacitor and sensor strength and what not... Except for signature resolution, which makes a little difference when the participants are MWDing. I still like it. Dont know why, though. .:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:. \o/ EVERYBODY SAY HELL YEAH! \o/
Scots Crusader Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.05.31 09:27:00 - [16] Due to its poor lock range, I have ended up using locking range rigs, gets me to 31km roughly. Standard arty/launcher and MWD/point in mids with OD's and nano in low. ----------------------------------------------- O wad some power, the giftie gie us, To see oursels as ithers see
Kuzya Morozov L8L8L8	Posted - 2008.05.31 14:25:00 - [17] Putting rigs on a 8mil expendable ship in order to make it work is stupid and unacceptable (not on your part, but on the design of the ship, you do whatever you want with your isk). Glad some people agree with me though, if you fit a signal amp, well, it sorta solves the problem, cept now you have 3 lows like the stiletto, 2 less mids, and STILL less locking range..plus you're not that much faster anymore if you don't use the 4th low for a speed mod.
Ruciza The Feminists	Posted - 2008.05.31 14:47:00 - [18] Skill leadership skills. Voila 24km lock range.
MrRookie Interstellar Planetary KIA Alliance	Posted - 2008.05.31 16:16:00 - [19] Originally by: Ruciza Skill leadership skills. Voila 24km lock range. My god....! what a brilliant "ship fix" Sig removed. Please email us at [email protected] if you would like to know why. -Conuion Meow May I have pink next time plz?
brainwhacker Interstellar Snake Foundation	Posted - 2008.05.31 16:28:00 - [20] surely you would only need a lockrange in excess of 21km when tackling larger ships, which naturally you use a stiletto for in regard to the so-called problems that claw has at interceptor on interceptor dogfighting, you're probably doing it wrong. consider the crusader; a ship with only 2 mids (the same problem some people in this thread seem to be complaining about in regard to the claw) and only 2-3km more lockrange at max skills than the claw has. it does absolutely fine at interceptor vs interceptor dogfighting. end of the day, 2 or 3 km lockrange will not make a world of difference in fighting other interceptors, and claw can be used to great effect in that field. as for finding it a problem during tackling, i repeat; use the stiletto. or if you insist on using the claw, drop a speed mod for a signal amplifier in order to take advantage of a 24km disruptor. 3 speed mods is absolutely fine for tackling large ships, as the stiletto and the malediction etc., prove. and as for signal amplifiers or other alternatives being unacceptable to you - sometimes you have to make compromises to get the effect you want. boo hoo.

Scots Crusader Jericho Fraction The Star Fraction	Posted - 2008.05.31 17:07:00 - [21] Originally by: Kuzya Morozov Putting rigs on a 8mil expendable ship in order to make it work is stupid and unacceptable (not on your part, but on the design of the ship, you do whatever you want with your isk). Glad some people agree with me though, if you fit a signal amp, well, it sorta solves the problem, cept now you have 3 lows like the stiletto, 2 less mids, and STILL less locking range..plus you're not that much faster anymore if you don't use the 4th low for a speed mod. I know what you are saying, but surely that is what rigs are for, solving ships problems or enhancing specific areas and locking rigs do it. Guys fit polys on intys all the time I see the 9 mil to get lock range as a viable option to a problem, but do not get me wrong, a boost to its base would be awesome. ----------------------------------------------- O wad some power, the giftie gie us, To see oursels as ithers see
Luyshin	Posted - 2008.05.31 18:21:00 - [22] Originally by: brainwhacker surely you would only need a lockrange in excess of 21km when tackling larger ships, which naturally you use a stiletto for in regard to the so-called problems that claw has at interceptor on interceptor dogfighting, you're probably doing it wrong. consider the crusader; a ship with only 2 mids (the same problem some people in this thread seem to be complaining about in regard to the claw) and only 2-3km more lockrange at max skills than the claw has. it does absolutely fine at interceptor vs interceptor dogfighting. end of the day, 2 or 3 km lockrange will not make a world of difference in fighting other interceptors, and claw can be used to great effect in that field. as for finding it a problem during tackling, i repeat; use the stiletto. or if you insist on using the claw, drop a speed mod for a signal amplifier in order to take advantage of a 24km disruptor. 3 speed mods is absolutely fine for tackling large ships, as the stiletto and the malediction etc., prove. and as for signal amplifiers or other alternatives being unacceptable to you - sometimes you have to make compromises to get the effect you want. boo hoo. This.
Rastigan Ars ex Discordia GoonSwarm	Posted - 2008.05.31 19:42:00 - [23] It could be worse, you could have a raptor..
Word	Posted - 2008.05.31 23:36:00 - [24] I use my Claw as a ninja salvager and scout. Setup for speed (12k/s) carries a cloak and single 200 AC for little stuff. At one time I had the Domination disrupter, but as the subject of the topic states, the targeting range is too low. In the old days, you could put 280mm artys on the claw and actually do some standoff damage. The most fun I had tackling was with the stiletto
AstroPhobic	Posted - 2008.05.31 23:43:00 - [25] Yes, please dear god more lock range. My claw tops 10km/s easy - with no plants, faction, or even polys. Just a claymore. 24km (Long range targeting 5) doesn't really help out the claw's case when dealing with extreme speeds and occasional manual maneuvering.
Ruciza The Feminists	Posted - 2008.06.01 00:48:00 - [26] Originally by: MrRookie Originally by: Ruciza Skill leadership skills. Voila 24km lock range. My god....! what a brilliant "ship fix" No fix needed then. Demands cam be met with skills. Problem solved.
AstroPhobic	Posted - 2008.06.01 00:52:00 - [27] Originally by: Ruciza Originally by: MrRookie Originally by: Ruciza Skill leadership skills. Voila 24km lock range. My god....! what a brilliant "ship fix" No fix needed then. Demands cam be met with skills. Problem solved. 24km lock range is hardly demands met. Perfect skills negates the value of any faction disruptors or gang links. There's no reason that the claw shouldn't have a longer lock range. What does it imbalance? What's wrong with minmatar having a decent interceptor?
Grahv Exitus Noob Mercs	Posted - 2008.06.01 03:02:00 - [28] Originally by: brainwhacker as for finding it a problem during tackling, i repeat; use the stiletto. or if you insist on using the claw, drop a speed mod for a signal amplifier in order to take advantage of a 24km disruptor. 3 speed mods is absolutely fine for tackling large ships, as the stiletto and the malediction etc., prove. While being relatively new to the whole Inty scene, it seems to me that each race has a dedicated "tackling" inty and a dedicated "dogfighting" inty. I ,personally, love the malediction and have had great success tackling all sorts of ships from the 19-23km range that my current skills and ship fit allow. Granted, while this ship isn't even worth mentioning when talking about interceptors from a damage perspective, it still allows me to add some damage here and there and I've managed to take out a Crow in it (mostly due to his overconfidence). What I'm getting at it this; If you're trying to perform a role in a ship that isn't really designed for it and then cry when it doesn't work as well as another ship, maybe you should sit back and actually wonder why that is, or if it really bugs you, use a ship that is good at said role.
Uncle Smokey	Posted - 2008.06.01 03:06:00 - [29] Originally by: brainwhacker in regard to the so-called problems that claw has at interceptor on interceptor dogfighting, you're probably doing it wrong. consider the crusader; a ship with only 2 mids (the same problem some people in this thread seem to be complaining about in regard to the claw) and only 2-3km more lockrange at max skills than the claw has. it does absolutely fine at interceptor vs interceptor dogfighting. end of the day, 2 or 3 km lockrange will not make a world of difference in fighting other interceptors, and claw can be used to great effect in that field. While crusader, having two mid slots too is true, i would still like to point out that crusader IS the fastest interceptor; with 1/3 more, as in MOST EHP of ceptors, double the cap, DPS, lock range... Where claw is inferior in everything but signiature radius and scan resolution. I have both of these ceptors specialized, and i do say those attributes affect quite f*ing heavy on your performance. No matter how you do it. .:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:.:. \o/ EVERYBODY SAY HELL YEAH! \o/
Brucette	Posted - 2008.06.01 06:49:00 - [30] Originally by: AstroPhobic Yes, please dear god more lock range. My claw tops 10km/s easy - with no plants, faction, or even polys. Just a claymore. 24km (Long range targeting 5) doesn't really help out the claw's case when dealing with extreme speeds and occasional manual maneuvering. I'm sorry. Not being able to do _everything_ at top speed seems quite balanced to me.

Shaemell Buttleson Darwin With Attitude oooh Shiny	Posted - 2008.06.01 08:33:00 - [31] The Claw does have a **** poor locking range. It can't even make use of a T2 disruptor FFS. Anyone who says it's OK needs to fly them and take their head out of their butt!
Stefan F Enrave Ethereal Dawn	Posted - 2008.06.01 09:58:00 - [32] If you find another inty better, train the damn thing as it only takes you the races' frigate skill. Don't waste your time on such pitiful whines, just accept there are different ships and different races, each with advantages and disadvantages.
Lord Widman THE LEGION OF STEEL WARRIORS.... R0ADKILL	Posted - 2008.06.01 10:52:00 - [33] What I do when I'm feeling rich is instead of fitting 2 aux thrusters like I do with my stilettos I fit instead 1 aux thruster and 1 ionic projector (the 20% increased lock range one). When I do this I fit gistii b's cause if you're gonna rig might as well use a nice mwd
Kuzya Morozov L8L8L8	Posted - 2008.06.01 12:05:00 - [34] Originally by: Stefan F If you find another inty better, train the damn thing as it only takes you the races' frigate skill. Don't waste your time on such pitiful whines, just accept there are different ships and different races, each with advantages and disadvantages. Another great ship fix, and constructive post.
The Bandid Quam Singulari Warp to Desktop	Posted - 2008.06.01 21:09:00 - [35] To the op, Learn to kit a claw and u will find 21km to be enough as locking range. A mwd/scram is enough, ( mwd,web is sometimes even better ) If the claw is fitted correctly there isnt another inty killing u period !
AstroPhobic	Posted - 2008.06.01 21:18:00 - [36] Originally by: Stefan F If you find another inty better, train the damn thing as it only takes you the races' frigate skill. Don't waste your time on such pitiful whines, just accept there are different ships and different races, each with advantages and disadvantages. Excellent. THIS is the kind of constructive posting we need. Your ship sucks, just forget about it.
Maeltstome Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.06.01 21:36:00 - [37] Originally by: stoats Uhm and theres nothing wrong wit ur 4 low slots and fitting a sig amp Besides the claw is a close range monster...... Cept if you find a taranis, 9/10 you'll die since you have to get close. Jaegerbomb is about the only way to kill another close range ceptor. Also, 250's are nice on a claw, but you MUST be faster than the target, meaning stack the low's with speed mods. It will rip crow's, but again short lock range makes it hard to use. I never fly the claw anymore. Taranis, crusader or malediction for me. Can't fly the crow and don't intend to. ------- [12:07] w33Daz: a trained 1 skill fur 24 mins n it took 2 days aff drones lvl 5 [12:07] w33Daz: A WIS LIKE WTF
Kuzya Morozov L8L8L8	Posted - 2008.06.01 23:03:00 - [38] Originally by: The Bandid To the op, Learn to kit a claw and u will find 21km to be enough as locking range. A mwd/scram is enough, ( mwd,web is sometimes even better ) If the claw is fitted correctly there isnt another inty killing u period ! This is even better. Please share your godlike set-up with me, so that I may become the master of all interceptors.
Solid Res Haven Front	Posted - 2008.06.02 06:45:00 - [39] Claw fails in roaming gangs because of the 2 mid slots. You need to be able to web, scram, and mwd if you are going to be a tackler. I still like the Claw just for the speed. The thing is freakin fast. It also works as a great forward scout as it is hard to catch the sucker.
brainwhacker Interstellar Snake Foundation	Posted - 2008.06.02 10:29:00 - [40] Originally by: Maeltstome Cept if you find a taranis, 9/10 you'll die since you have to get close. so will any other closerange interceptor (malediction, rocket crow, most pulsesaders, etc.) protip: stay away from taranis if you're piloting an interceptor that operates below 10km. Originally by: Maeltstome Jaegerbomb is about the only way to kill another close range ceptor. you phrased that as if it's some kind of complaint. you have a valid way to kill other closerange ceptors, so use it. Originally by: Maeltstome Also, 250's are nice on a claw, but you MUST be faster than the target, meaning stack the low's with speed mods. It will rip crow's, but again short lock range makes it hard to use. it is not at all difficult to be faster than the majority of other interceptors when piloting a claw. also protip #2: you generally TRY not to engage other interceptors that are faster than you are (applies to piloting any interceptor, except maybe taranis)

Maeltstome Sebiestor tribe	Posted - 2008.06.02 14:58:00 - [41] Originally by: brainwhacker Originally by: Maeltstome Cept if you find a taranis, 9/10 you'll die since you have to get close. so will any other closerange interceptor (malediction, rocket crow, most pulsesaders, etc.) protip: stay away from taranis if you're piloting an interceptor that operates below 10km. Malediction isn't a combat ceptor, so it will loose ofc. But both the Crow and Crusader can easily fight outside of 13km when fitted for closerange combat. The Claw cannot. Most time, in these cases they will kite teh taranis til shields and armor are gone and well into sctructure - THEN they will go closer to ensure the kill before teh taranis runs. Also the Crusader has 750 struct (and armor), the taranis has 850 - so it's not really much easier to kill, unlike the claw which has a 400-600 split and only 100hp more shields. P.s. - Rocket crow only does about 10%-15% more DPS than lights, but the burst damage of lights means it's technically higher, since you will fly in and out of lock range in most inty fights. Plus the speed of the ceptor means the effective range of a rocket is much lower, since it chases the target for longer. I used to like rocket crow's... but standard crow's are much better for a margin for error. Originally by: brainwhacker Originally by: Maeltstome Jaegerbomb is about the only way to kill another close range ceptor. you phrased that as if it's some kind of complaint. you have a valid way to kill other closerange ceptors, so use it. It is a complaint, because fitting out an interceptor without and MWD is a joke to simply make it combat effective. Originally by: brainwhacker Originally by: Maeltstome Also, 250's are nice on a claw, but you MUST be faster than the target, meaning stack the low's with speed mods. It will rip crow's, but again short lock range makes it hard to use. it is not at all difficult to be faster than the majority of other interceptors when piloting a claw. also protip #2: you generally TRY not to engage other interceptors that are faster than you are (applies to piloting any interceptor, except maybe taranis) Faster ceptor generally = better loot or snakes. Other ceptors have higher survivability than the claw, so spending more money on them is not a bad idea - i wouldnt spit on a claw with a poly though, total waist of cash compared a crow with one. The taranis can be slow and then whip round to web it's target once they get straight line speed. With the claw the no-web means that you can get under 10km a dousen times in a fight and still be in no better position than being 30km from them.
DeathsEmbrace The Renegades Asylum	Posted - 2008.06.02 18:37:00 - [42] 1)The Claw is the Fast cepter out there, you put any fit equally on it or on any other cepter and the claw is faster, it also does twice the dps of any other cepter. 2)Tackling is pointing a point on, web is a bonus not something essential. A cepter slapping a web on any other ship is a dead cepter in secs, which for a gang is usless as though secs aren't enough usually for a larger more powerful ship to lock down the target. However, being able to perma point at range and survive (Death points to the tackling cepters i.e. stiletto) is very usuful to a gang. Because the target can never get away if caught of gates stations. The downside to having no web only comes when the target is a nano****/nano fit as even though point is only the fight can still move huge distances very quickly. In steps the roles of the huginn/rapier and hyena who solve this problem. The claw and other cepters likeit are more combat that tackle oirentated, and are more focused on an anti cepter role that anything else. Personally I think it would be nice to gain some targeting range on the claw, would make eating other cepters up much easier, but its not necessary. To live is to die, and to die is to give life. Thus pain is a form of euphoria.
David Devant Solarflare Heavy Industries Pure.	Posted - 2008.06.02 18:53:00 - [43] Claw's target up to 20km!?! Really? Seriously people, ACs + plate + accepting the possibility that something might be faster than you. This isn't the high orbit tackler you are looking for... snip - signature removed, email us with a link to the signature if you want to know why. -Ivan K ([email protected])
Drek Grapper	Posted - 2008.06.02 23:52:00 - [44] Originally by: Kuzya Morozov Originally by: The Bandid To the op, Learn to kit a claw and u will find 21km to be enough as locking range. A mwd/scram is enough, ( mwd,web is sometimes even better ) If the claw is fitted correctly there isnt another inty killing u period ! This is even better. Please share your godlike set-up with me, so that I may become the master of all interceptors. I too would like to feast on these heavenly delights... Please oh mighty one...tell us more. --------- If the Thorax was a car it would look like this
Termopan	Posted - 2008.06.04 20:40:00 - [45] i fly a claw :) a 10k /sec one to be precise i got atm 18 km lock range ...since i didnt max out long range targeting ....and if they make the claw lock from 24km would be the most coolest inty to fly my opinion ..like all minmatar ships claw has the gtfo factor :P


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