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Cyshade
Cruoris Seraphim
Project Alice.
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Posted - 2008.05.31 15:52:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Cyshade on 31/05/2008 15:55:54
Cruoris Seraphim will defend the people of Skarkon from this insidious threat. The Angel Cartel is nothing but a collection of assorted degenerate filth that neither deserve nor warrant any territorial claim in this area.
The Cartel is collecting tribute for one service they cannot provide û protection and security. To assist the peoples of Skarkon to reconsider their position, we will be recommencing the formerly abandoned practise of blooding minors.
Any cartel podpilots seen in the areaà
well, they will only have themselves to blame.
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IzzyChan
Naqam
Project Alice.
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Posted - 2008.05.31 15:57:00 -
[2]
The Cartel have stepped over the line, it's time to push them right back.
--------------------
Naqam
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Lordus Mark
RDK Trusting Holders
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Posted - 2008.05.31 16:02:00 -
[3]
hehehe!!!
Bloods and Sanshas uniting against Cartel?
hahaha!!!
**********************************
RDK Trusting Holders
Need a job done? Quietly? Have a word with us.
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Nomakai Delateriel
Shadow Company
Souls of Vengeance
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Posted - 2008.05.31 16:54:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: Lordus Mark
hehehe!!!
Bloods and Sanshas uniting against Cartel?
hahaha!!!
That isn't news really.
The Guristas, Sansha and Blooders have always had pact of sorts that they unite against Angel incursions and threats.
______________________________________________
-You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary. |
Evanda Char
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Electus Matari
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Posted - 2008.05.31 17:21:00 -
[5]
Whatever the Cartel claim, Skarkon is still part of the Minmatar Republic and under its protection.
Even were it true, to hold children to blame for the sins of their parents? Even Cardinal Sarikusa turned away from this.
-Eva-
Electus Matari - taking it one bad guy at a time |
Avena
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.05.31 17:49:00 -
[6]
Veto Corp offer our best wishes to [CR-SE] and [NQM] and would like to convey our hopes that the operation in Skarkon proves to be a complete success.
To Naqam, we also offer our unfortunate regrets regarding our current lack of fire support.
Due to events in Ishomilken yesterday, Veto Corp finds itself in a situation that would make it both unprofitable and unwise to launch an offensive on such a scale until our investagatory, rescue and salvage operations are complete.
Sincerely,
Avena Gariushi
Acting Chief Executive
Veto Corp
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Kyoko Sakoda
Ghost Festival
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Posted - 2008.05.31 19:05:00 -
[7]
You will defend the people of Skarkon by blooding them? If that's not twisted logic I'm not sure what is. Oppressive Blooder and Sansha activity over the skies of Skarkon II must be one of the many reasons why the populace turned to the Angel Cartel for protection.
As for you, Ms. Char, I find it quite unfortunate that you have befriended this threat rather than realized the implications of doing nothing about it. How could you totally ignore these Blooders and Slavers squatting in a single system anyway? Perhaps none of this would have happened to your poor, miserable Republic had you stepped up.
And of course, Ms. Gariushi, I am quite dispirited by the Gurista cartel's open support of a faction that has no goal but to enslave the universe. I find it most counter-productive to ally with a nefarious organization that desires to eat humanity whole. That's not very profitable, is it? I do think, deep in his heart somewhere, Mr. Verone knows better, and you do too.
Issuing shadowy threats against my organization will not work, Cyshade. We will deal with yours when time allows. Until then, I trust the Archangels will be able to take steps to ensure the population is more secure planetside.
Ghost Festival is recruiting. |
Mebrithiel Ju'wien
Veto.
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.05.31 19:38:00 -
[8]
Delightful news.
Personal Library |
Evanda Char
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Electus Matari
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Posted - 2008.05.31 21:27:00 -
[9]
You might want to check your intel, Ms Sakoda. Cruoris Seraphim have been kill on sight to Electus Matari since their first visit to Molden Heath. Naqam weren't, because Naqam weren't pirating, or slaving.
Now the two are allied, however, we can't make distinctions between them anymore, because what benefits the one, benefits the other.
Events in Skarkon are a matter between the Republic and the Cartel. That's all there is to it.
-Eva-
Electus Matari - taking it one bad guy at a time |
Kyoko Sakoda
Ghost Festival
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Posted - 2008.05.31 22:14:00 -
[10]
Ms. Char, the fact remains that the Sansha are a threat to the entirety of humanity. They don't need to be pirating or slaving to manipulate. You should have known this from the beginning.
You say Skarkon is simply a matter between us. Yet there are other factions willing to make it their business. The Republican government and their Fleet as it stands has failed here, allowing for this. As a defender of the Republic, that's something you should keep in mind.
Ghost Festival is recruiting. |
Evanda Char
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Electus Matari
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Posted - 2008.05.31 22:37:00 -
[11]
The Sansha are a threat merely because of their existence? Even if they don't do anything? That's a point I'm going to have to dispute.
And you can claim that Fleet failed all you like... just as the Cartel claims it has 10 million signatures on a petition to cede to Cartel sovereignty.
Have you seen Skarkon II?
-Eva-
Electus Matari - taking it one bad guy at a time |
Kyoko Sakoda
Ghost Festival
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Posted - 2008.05.31 22:58:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Evanda Char
The Sansha are a threat merely because of their existence? Even if they don't do anything? That's a point I'm going to have to dispute.
You believe they are not doing anything, Ms. Char, but in fact they wish for you to believe they are harmless. Read some of the archives here, in particular Naqam's announcement that they would provide their "Ultra Happy Chips" to Malkalen victims for free. If that's not manipulation of the will I don't know what is.
And please don't whine about those signatures. The news reports that they are authentic, and you have no reason to doubt otherwise except out of perhaps a state of shock and denial.
As I pointed out in another thread, legitimacy is merely a construct you have created.
Ghost Festival is recruiting. |
3ll3
Tranquillity Nation
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Posted - 2008.06.01 01:01:00 -
[13]
Miss Sakoda,
Forgive my interuption but I feel you should look fully at all angles before jumping the gun some thing I fear many inderviduals my self included tend to do.
Try asking why Evanda Char thinks and says this, try to see all the diffrent angles first as there may be things you can not see in just one angle alone.
Has Miss Chan's group gone out of their way to force people to take any chips?
Have they Done any thing to attack the republic?
They have defended the Republic from Enemies of the Republic and those who would do harm by the Matari People, true it does not excuse the actions of those they emulate.
But then that's just my opnion and it's not worth that much.
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Ravin Abai
Cruoris Seraphim
Project Alice.
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Posted - 2008.06.01 03:38:00 -
[14]
Look kids! It's everyone's favorite outlaw with a heart of gold! Self-righteous Cartel baglady Kyoko Sakoda!
Tell me, Caldari, how many kredits a month do you pay the Cartel to let you paint their insignia on your ships?
I'm looking forward to exsanguinating you along with the rest of your wretched little band.
See you in space.
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Kai Zion
The Zion Accounts
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Posted - 2008.06.01 04:02:00 -
[15]
Hilarious. All of it.
Particularly you though, dear Ravin.
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Kyoko Sakoda
Ghost Festival
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Posted - 2008.06.01 04:15:00 -
[16]
Mr. Elle, there is no need for Naqam to force people to implant themselves. Deception proves useful enough, particularly in the midst of an emotional event. You may not see it, but that is all a part of the plan.
As for you Abai, well, you're just hilarious. I fly the Angel flag out of my own volition, though admittedly there is something I seek from the Dominations and hope to gain their trust through loyal service. However, I am quite content using the organization as a vessel through which I can fight the Sansha menace.
As for the self-righteousness bit, there's a common phrase among us: "perfection ain't all it's *****ed up to be." Perhaps it is you and your Sansha friends trying to find perfection through your rituals and mindslaving, and perhaps that is why you should be destroyed.
Ghost Festival is recruiting. |
Kudon Astraisx
17th Minmatar Tactical Wing
Electus Matari
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Posted - 2008.06.01 04:23:00 -
[17]
I support the right to self-determination of the people of Skarkon. If they truly do not wish to be part of the Republic, then any action to force them to remain would be immoral and counter-productive.
That said, Executor Char has indeed sown serious doubt in my mind as to the legitimacy of the petition and the secession. I believe that the Republic, possibly the Justice Department or Security Services, should investigate appropriately.
--
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Rawr Cristina
Naqam
Project Alice.
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Posted - 2008.06.01 04:24:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Kyoko Sakoda
... open support of a faction that has no goal but to enslave the universe.
...just like the Cartel has no goal but to turn it into their personal playground and cash cow?
please. 
Just to clarify, Naqam does not enslave or partake in slave-trading in any form. We do not pirate, although may open fire on vessels percieved to be a threat to us; particually those afilliated with entities in bad standing.
Various other, more centered Nation affiliates such as True Creations have been known to purchase Slaves within the boundries of Stain, however this is completely passive in nature and you'll find that their quality of life is significantly higher within the Nation than with their previous Amarr owners.
As hard it may be for you to believe, since Kuvakei's demise, nobody that has joined the Nation with a free will has left without it.
...
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Avena
Veto Corp
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Posted - 2008.06.01 06:16:00 -
[19]
People seem to forget that slavery exists in more than just one way, and the personification of a slave should never be limited to a man, woman or child in shackles.
I look out onto the station platform a thousand times a day and see millions of slaves. Slaves to the system, those without the will, funding or better knowledge to break free.
Contrary to popular belief, slavery is not a ball and chain, or a neural implant.
Slavery is a state of mind. A defeated, conformist state of mind that imposes a metaphorical set of shackles on an individual and forces them to submit to the system.
True freedom is breaking loose from those invisible chains.
I know, because I feel it.
I was once like those people on the station platform.
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Silver Night
Naqam
Project Alice.
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Posted - 2008.06.01 07:15:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Silver Night on 01/06/2008 07:17:18
Originally by: Kyoko Sakoda
Originally by: Evanda Char
The Sansha are a threat merely because of their existence? Even if they don't do anything? That's a point I'm going to have to dispute.
You believe they are not doing anything, Ms. Char, but in fact they wish for you to believe they are harmless. Read some of the archives here, in particular Naqam's announcement that they would provide their "Ultra Happy Chips" to Malkalen victims for free. If that's not manipulation of the will I don't know what is.
Ms Sakoda, first, the NHB Ultra Happy ChipÖ does nothing to free will, nor people's beliefs. If someone hated the Nation, and got the chip, they would still hate the Nation, for example.
Second, those unfortunates in Malkalen do indeed have the option of getting the NHB Ultra Happy ChipÖ installed at no charge. However there is a mandatory waiting period to make sure that they really want to get the NHB Ultra Happy ChipÖ and ensure that they are in as stable a mental state as possible. At some point you do have to let people make decisions for themselves. (And to those unfamiliar with the true faces of the Nation and the Cartel that might seem ironic, me having to tell her this).
If you have any further concerns regarding our Safe Harbor Program, please don't hesitate to contact me.
Your humble servant, as always,
Silver Night
Edit: I have included here links to all announcements regarding the NHB Ultra Happy ChipÖ and the Safe harbor program announcement, for convenience.
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
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Karanth
Eve's Brothers of Destiny
FOUNDATI0N
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Posted - 2008.06.01 07:23:00 -
[21]
I have to say, this is probably one of the more ridiculous things I've read here in days. Why don't we all lead a crusade against people mining the moons there, and after that we can have a giant tea party?
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Nomakai Delateriel
Shadow Company
Souls of Vengeance
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Posted - 2008.06.01 11:58:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Avena
People seem to forget that slavery exists in more than just one way, and the personification of a slave should never be limited to a man, woman or child in shackles.
I look out onto the station platform a thousand times a day and see millions of slaves. Slaves to the system, those without the will, funding or better knowledge to break free.
Contrary to popular belief, slavery is not a ball and chain, or a neural implant.
Slavery is a state of mind. A defeated, conformist state of mind that imposes a metaphorical set of shackles on an individual and forces them to submit to the system.
True freedom is breaking loose from those invisible chains.
Submitting to the system is slavery? Well, you could call it that. I call it civilization.
The part where we, of our free will, choose to bind ourself to follow laws and regulations in exchange for the ability to co-operate and share with our fellow man with the certainty that if I'm betrayed society will take my side instead of cheering at the "ingenuity" of the thief.
To live without the constant fear that everything you've ever worked for is going to be taken away just because someone felt like it.
As pod-pilots many of us chose to leave that system. Some because they did not want to live in it (an option that is open to most people, just don't expect society in general to be tolerant if you chose to prey on it) and some because they wanted to defend it.
I'm rich, educated and, lets face it, a trained killer. As such I have the ability to defend my life and what is mine. I have chosen a life where I have to be a killer to defend what is mine, and to protect my rights.
The majority of the people in this universe don't have that kind of wealth and most likely don't have and do not want that kind of training. If there is a single cause that I'd be willing to give my life for it's to defend the right of the general population in this galaxy to not be forced to be killers to defend what is theirs. Their life, their property and their family.
Some will always have to step into that breach to defend civilization from savagery, but in a civilized society it's our choice.
______________________________________________
-You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary. |
Kyoko Sakoda
Ghost Festival
|
Posted - 2008.06.01 16:30:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Rawr Cristina
...just like the Cartel has no goal but to turn it into their personal playground and cash cow?
Don't the Gurista pirates do this? Do you have some moral objection to ISK? If the world isn't your playground, you aren't truly living.
Originally by: Rawr Cristina
Just to clarify, Naqam does not enslave or partake in slave-trading in any form.
Incorrect. Please once again ask Mr. Mort how he came to be affiliated with Naqam.
Originally by: Rawr Cristina
We do not pirate, although may open fire on vessels percieved to be a threat to us; particularly those affiliated with entities in bad standing.
Your rules of engagement are of your own concern, but it doesn't give you a leg up when you associate heavily with a faction that does. It's like the CVA and their Not Red, Don't Shoot ROE, and their stance against piracy, and subsequently their turning around to befriend pirate corporations, which is very real. I can cite at least two examples off the top of my head.
Originally by: Rawr Cristina
As hard it may be for you to believe, since Kuvakei's demise, nobody that has joined the Nation with a free will has left without it.
Because no one has left at all. They are slaves to a system, but a much more perceivable and physical system than Ms. Gariushi described.
As for you Mr. Night, I'll let people make their own judgments. It is insurmountably difficult for me to counter a well-constructed PR sham on my own. Perhaps the Sansha should be allowed to spread their influence, just so that the universe would once again see how dangerous they are. Human beings hardly ever learn from history, after all, hmm?
Ghost Festival is recruiting. |
Andre Ricard
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.06.01 17:04:00 -
[24]
I've probably visited Skarkon more than most of the people commenting in this topic, and frankly the addition of a few Blooders and other assorted ne'er-do-wells would be essentially par for the course. As the system that serves as the border between the Republic and the independent RSF, that area's been a hotbed for piracy and lawlessness for over a year.
If the Republic wishes to exert control, they may want to consider a stronger presence in the area.
All this being said. I'm curious as to the authenticity of this petition the Cartel has produced.
-----
Character back under original management. |
Avena
Veto Corp
|
Posted - 2008.06.01 19:23:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel
I'm rich, educated and, lets face it, a trained killer.
Avena smirks as she reads...
Sure you are tiger, and modest too.
Be careful with all that exertion while training to kill, at your age you might dislocate something, old man.
|
Nomakai Delateriel
Shadow Company
Souls of Vengeance
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Posted - 2008.06.01 21:36:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Nomakai Delateriel on 01/06/2008 21:38:25
Originally by: Avena
Originally by: Nomakai Delateriel
I'm rich, educated and, lets face it, a trained killer.
Avena smirks as she reads...
Sure you are tiger, and modest too.
Be careful with all that exertion while training to kill, at your age you might dislocate something, old man.
Compared to the average citizen in the Empire, yes I am. I've served with the Amarr navy and I've been a pod pilot for quite a while now. By human standards pretty much any pod-pilot with 0.0 experience is a walking natural disaster.
______________________________________________
-You can never earn my respect, only lose it. It's given freely, and only grudgingly retracted when necessary. |
Daelin Blackleaf
Naqam
Project Alice.
|
Posted - 2008.06.01 22:05:00 -
[27]
We're working with the Blooders to keep the Cartel out of the area, Cruoris Seraphim's methods may seem cruel, but if the Republic wanted this job done cleanly they should have done it themselves.
No surprise however to see the Angels focusing primarily on the Nation as the root of all evil in the midst of this Cruoris Seraphim announcement. We're not enslaving people here, we're not trying to claim the system, and we're certainly not idly standing by allowing an entire world to fall into the hands of a depraved and profit motivated Cartel with no vision or purpose beyond satisfying their wallets and their perversions.
----------------------------
Originally by: CCP Subscription
I'm sorry Sir your European I'll have to charge you 58% extra
|
Demon Nuzzle
Aegis Militia
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Posted - 2008.06.01 23:12:00 -
[28]
A lot of rhetoric from all sides, Any one going to declare a war or something?
It would be pleasing to see which was the more powerful, and who could stomach the most loss.
24000 bytes max please ... -Capsicum
A little bit of this, a little bit of that |
Gaven Lok'ri
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
|
Posted - 2008.06.01 23:27:00 -
[29]
Quote:
because Naqam weren't pirating, or slaving
Hilarious.
Deus Vult!
PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public' |
Silver Night
Naqam
Project Alice.
|
Posted - 2008.06.01 23:29:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Silver Night on 01/06/2008 23:30:55
Originally by: Demon Nuzzle
It would be pleasing to see which was the more powerful, and who could stomach the most loss.
Especially pleasing, I'm sure, for those such as yourself who view anyone who disagrees with CONCORD as undeserving of life. If it comes to that I'm confident that we will stand up for the people of this system. Why aren't we seeing more Amarr loyalists here though? This is a prime opportunity, after all. You can 'save' these people from not just the Cartel, but the Blooders and us Sansha as well. Come to Skarkon and start enlightening people. Please.
Edit:
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri
Quote:
because Naqam weren't pirating, or slaving
Hilarious.
These delightful, if contentless, one liners are always a pleasure from the august shepherds of the PIE cattle. Naqam doesn't enslave anyone. And why you would be commenting on it if we did is beyond me.
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
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Demon Nuzzle
Aegis Militia
|
Posted - 2008.06.01 23:52:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Demon Nuzzle on 01/06/2008 23:52:22
Originally by: Silver Night
Edited by: Silver Night on 01/06/2008 23:30:55
Originally by: Demon Nuzzle
It would be pleasing to see which was the more powerful, and who could stomach the most loss.
Especially pleasing, I'm sure, for those such as yourself who view anyone who disagrees with CONCORD as undeserving of life. If it comes to that I'm confident that we will stand up for the people of this system. Why aren't we seeing more Amarr loyalists here though? This is a prime opportunity, after all. You can 'save' these people from not just the Cartel, but the Blooders and us Sansha as well. Come to Skarkon and start enlightening people. Please.
My views on concord are not very positive, but those are my views and I assume you are making a statement about the empire loyalists?
besides I think it a lot more interesting to see the two pirate groups feud.
regardless I'm sure the minmatar can handle you if they make you a priority. But if they decide they need help I'm sure they know who to ask.
24000 bytes max please ... -Capsicum
A little bit of this, a little bit of that |
Veron Daerth
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 00:00:00 -
[32]
I find it interesting that here we have representatives of some of the groups that support and spread the agenda's of, lets face it, criminal organizations, fighting to oust another criminal organization and its supporters from a system they have "taken" from a recognized governmental entity. I believe that I am not alone in thinking that this will be an alarming precedent if the Republic should let it pass, or if they respond ineffectually to it.
Let me be clear, Blood Raiders killed my little sister and brother, killed my father when he, inevitably perhaps, spent the next 6 years of his life in pursuit of some kind of mad vengeance, and killed my mother, indirectly, when she just gave up on life when word came of his death. To say that I hate the Blood Raiders and their heretical ideals is ... an understatement. I also despise the Sansha's Nation for their corruptive influences on people's mind and will.
The idea that any criminal organization can "take" legitimacy from a vote that, in all reality, cannot be truly considered even-handed and fair (Did the media oversee the gathering of these votes or signatures, was it a free and fair "election" or was it a gathering of a select few, pre-determined names. What percentage of the total population does the list of names represent?) is ludicrous. Let an election council from the empires conduct an "election" and then see what we see. Some may cry foul on that idea, saying that the established empires have all the reasons to not "legitimize" a bully, but really if they do not, all the "bullies" (aka criminal organizations) will follow suit, snipping off systems here and there while the empires are focused elsewhere.
Some have said that the Raiders and Sansha's that have so nobly offered to ride to the rescue here pose no threat to humanity in general, only a select few that currently are fighting them. Do the victims of the Sansha's Nation and Blood Raider Covenant raids on unprotected convoys and frontier worlds somehow pose a threat to them? Did the slaves and villagers living near my Family's Hold? Perhaps my 8 year old sister? No, these groups pursue their own sinister agenda's, and the less that we, the law-abiding peoples of the galaxy, resist them now, the stronger they will become later. I know most of the supposedly enlightened peoples of the galaxy laugh at Amarrians and our "silly religion". I even forgive you for your ignorance and am content to let you deal with the Almighty yourself, ( Be assured He will teach you all you need to know when you meet Him.) so I wont waste time giving you a full sermon. But believe me when I tell you, the smartest thing the Evil One has EVER MANAGED TO DO, was to convince most of you he doesn't exist. I leave it to you to decide if the Raiders and Sansha's aren't a threat, now or later. I have made my decision.
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Gaven Lok'ri
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 00:11:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Silver Night
These delightful, if contentless, one liners are always a pleasure from the august shepherds of the PIE cattle. Naqam doesn't enslave anyone. And why you would be commenting on it if we did is beyond me.
A Sansha group that does not enslave anyone? Good joke that. Not that there is anything wrong with enslaving people, just amusing to see you pretend that you do not to try and fool the weak minded.
As for the comment, it was not really aimed at you, but more at our lovely terrorist friend living in the republic.
Deus Vult!
PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public' |
Babel
NEPHILIM Wing
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 00:34:00 -
[34]
A few points for consideration Mstr. Daerth ...
"lets face it, criminal organizations"
Ultimately the definition of a criminal is by a second party that believes it's own morals are Right enough to judge all others .. know thyself.
""take" legitimacy from a vote"
I think you will find the Cartel were invited to Skarkon.
"saying that the established empires have all the reasons to not "legitimize" a bully"
Again, know thyself .. and that's no bad thing.
"most of the supposedly enlightened peoples of the galaxy laugh at Amarrians and our "silly religion""
Unwisely ...
"the smartest thing the Evil One has EVER MANAGED TO DO, was to convince most of you he doesn't exist"
Would it not be even smarter to convince most to believe that the Evil One exists in opposition to your God, when He in fact IS your God ... a 'fall guy' as it were :)
Perhaps your God is not all He seems ?
Call me a lunatic drug addled heretic if you wish, or start to look at the clues from Cartel and also Jovian history, maybe certain groups within the cluster were named with very good reasons.
.
URIEL Recruitish Threaddery |
Daelin Blackleaf
Naqam
Project Alice.
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 01:52:00 -
[35]
Gaven. I wasn't aware every Amarrian institution spent it's time slaving.
Not personally taking slaves is neither a support or rejection of slavery, being an Amarrian I'd have thought you would be well versed in such issues.
----------------------------
Originally by: CCP Subscription
I'm sorry Sir your European I'll have to charge you 58% extra
|
Evanda Char
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Electus Matari
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 01:52:00 -
[36]
Edited by: Evanda Char on 02/06/2008 01:52:53
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri
...
As for the comment, it was not really aimed at you, but more at our lovely terrorist friend living in the republic.
 That's so sweet.
But no matter what we think people might one day do, we don't punish anyone until a crime has actually been committed.
-Eva-
Electus Matari - taking it one bad guy at a time |
Silver Night
Naqam
Project Alice.
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 02:00:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Silver Night on 02/06/2008 02:06:11
I would like to point out that Naqam was in Skarkon well before this debacle. We are, in fact, defending our current home from the perversions of lowly slavers, drug runners, and other degenerate Angel scum. Nothing less than what the citizens of the system would want had they but the power to resist.
As for the legitimacy of the petition, well...
I'll believe it when it is supervised by a non-interested party, the SOE for example. Even the Scope would be acceptable to many I would imagine.
Allowing the Angels to run it is rather like letting the wolf keep tabs on the wishes of the flock. I look forward to seeing those strenuously objecting to either our or Angel involvement do something about it. Or are you all just going to talk and leave these people in the hands of those you believe are ultimately evil?
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
|
Gaven Lok'ri
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 03:05:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Evanda Char
That's so sweet.
But no matter what we think people might one day do, we don't punish anyone until a crime has actually been committed.
The only reason you were not shooting Naqam was that you were enjoying the fact that they targeted us. An enemy of my enemy, and all that. You knew very well that they were a collection of slavers and the supporters thereof from the second they were formed.
And Mr. Blackleaf, I find those individuals who say that they are loyal Amarrians who do not support slavery at all equally amusing.
Show some dignity and actually defend your beliefs.
Deus Vult!
PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public' |
Evanda Char
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Electus Matari
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 03:18:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri
The only reason you were not shooting Naqam was that you were enjoying the fact that they targeted us. An enemy of my enemy, and all that. You knew very well that they were a collection of slavers and the supporters thereof from the second they were formed.
Actually, Naqam's intent as I understood it was to test a new way, using voluntary pilots - no forced implants, no slavery. Unfortunately, so many people were so busy screaming "Argh, zombies" that I guess they turned back to the only allies who were open to them.
We've never subscribed to "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." That's why you never saw us flying with Heretic Army.
The enemy of my enemy is my enemy's enemy. Nothing more. I pick my friends on their own merits, not your failings.
-Eva-
Electus Matari - taking it one bad guy at a time |
Gaven Lok'ri
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 03:43:00 -
[40]
And you actually believed their propaganda? Somehow I doubt that. You do not strike me as that naive, and Elsebeth certainly is not.
It was in your interests to pretend to believe it, however, so I can understand why you did not make a fuss about it till their actions gave you no choice. Just try not to insult your own intelligence by pretending that there was any true belief that Naqam represented some new sort of reformed Sansha.
Have fun watching pirates kill each other in Skarkon. Maybe a few terrorists will be killed while they are at it. I look forward to continued amusement from that system.
Deus Vult!
PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public' |
Evanda Char
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Electus Matari
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 04:03:00 -
[41]
Any old terrorists? Or do the lovely ones get an exemption?
-Eva-
Electus Matari - taking it one bad guy at a time |
Demon Nuzzle
Aegis Militia
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 05:20:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri
A Sansha group that does not enslave anyone
Sansha-Lite, hilarious
24000 bytes max please ... -Capsicum
A little bit of this, a little bit of that |
Demon Nuzzle
Aegis Militia
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 05:33:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Evanda Char
I pick my friends on their own merits
good words.
24000 bytes max please ... -Capsicum
A little bit of this, a little bit of that |
Gaven Lok'ri
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 06:46:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Evanda Char
Any old terrorists? Or do the lovely ones get an exemption?
Is this finally an admission that what you do qualifies as terrorism?
Deus Vult!
PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public' |
Rolvaag
Cruoris Seraphim
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 13:06:00 -
[45]
"In light of the citizens of Skarkons' continued defiance of the rule of law, our methods are nothing but fair. For every ISK Skarkon families give to the Cartel, we will take a pint of blood."
Rolvaag
|
Ryn0
Cruoris Seraphim
Project Alice.
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 15:35:00 -
[46]
They see me rollin
They hatin
Patrolling they tryin to catch me ridin dirty..
|
Darina Rea
Naqam
Project Alice.
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 18:37:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri
The only reason you were not shooting Naqam was that you were enjoying the fact that they targeted us. An enemy of my enemy, and all that.
Our relations with EM existed quite some time before there was the Retirement program for old PIE pilots. A fun program all involved had to say. Now, to the other matter, what Naqam in particular is trying to do is reviving the Nation in it's from before it's destruction. But this time with a large enough navy so you Empire ******* can't destroy it again. The matter of True Slaves is up to the individual, some choose this particular path out of zealousy, quite similar to your priests, because they belief in the Dream of the Nation and are willing to play a role in it many others do back out of.
For you, the unaware I will however say that at this point in time the Angel Cartel has a much greater influence in Empire space then CONCORD and the Empires themselves are even willing to admit. I will have to point out the SCC scandal with some Caldari corporation and the Angel Cartel a while ago.
A secret and hidden influence can be tolerated however, as nearly all parties that want to have some influence and exact some change lobby through various methods, and I'll leave the used methods in the middle as none are particularly kind or friendly one any side, but an open challenge as Skarkon is cannot be tolerated.
That said PIE has nothing to do with Skarkon at all, so the reason you're whining here is simply propaganda purposes, another thing you Amarr aren't that proficient in.
_________
Time is on our side. |
Kyoko Sakoda
Ghost Festival
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 18:45:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Rolvaag
For every ISK Skarkon families give to the Cartel, we will take a pint of blood.
That's fair market trade, but it'll get you nowhere with the hearts and minds of the residents.
Even so, have you all got your answer from the IC today? Is this all legitimate enough for you yet? There are many, many residents of Skarkon who are pleased the Cartel has moved to start keeping some peace and offer work opportunities. I don't know how much more proof you people need. Mr. Night said himself that he'd accept word from The Scope. Isn't IC even more reliable?
I know what you and yours are trying to do Cyshade, and it won't work. You cannot intimidate us. We will deal with your organization when the time is right. Until then, please enjoy Ms. Char's company. Maybe she'll actually be able to prove that Republic security forces aren't so worthless after all.
Ghost Festival is recruiting. |
Evanda Char
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Electus Matari
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 19:04:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri
Is this finally an admission that what you do qualifies as terrorism?
Is this an admission that you're terrified?
-Eva-
Electus Matari - taking it one bad guy at a time |
Dairya
Naqam
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 19:10:00 -
[50]
Edited by: Dairya on 02/06/2008 19:11:48
Originally by: Kyoko Sakoda
I know what you and yours are trying to do Cyshade, and it won't work. You cannot intimidate us.
Does this mean, Miss Sakoda, that the long-awaited confrontation between Naqam and Ghost Festival forces will finally come in Skarkon? Does the "us" here mean that you will be standing shoulder-to-shoulder with your Cartel brethren while they round up the loyal inhabitants of Skarkon II to take to your brothels and drug factories? Will you be joining them under the fire of the so-called "pirate" nations that, in spite of being vocally reviled by the more conventional dwellers of the cluster, hold you in contempt.
In that case, I suggest you bring the best you have. Like a Thanatos.
Or maybe a Nyx.
|
Gaven Lok'ri
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 21:48:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Evanda Char
Is this an admission that you're terrified?
Absolutely petrified, no really, I am! My ship only is moving 100m/s. It is in fright, I swear! Its perfectly safe to come within web range.
Deus Vult!
PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public' |
Cyal
Imperial Academy
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 22:15:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri
Originally by: Evanda Char
Is this an admission that you're terrified?
Absolutely petrified, no really, I am! My ship only is moving 100m/s. It is in fright, I swear! Its perfectly safe to come within web range.
Heh. Isn't there some religious mandate or PIE regulation forbidding flirtation with Minmatar insurgents that you're violating?
|
Silver Night
Naqam
Project Alice.
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 22:59:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Kyoko Sakoda
Even so, have you all got your answer from the IC today?
No, not really
Originally by: Kyoko Sakoda
Is this all legitimate enough for you yet?
Yes, 3 people cherry picked by the Cartel to talk to the reporter - at least it shows that the Cartel takes their PR seriously. However it doesn't say anything about the legitimacy of the petition. It is anecdotal - emotionally effective but statistically irrelevant. I guarantee you that I could go down to Skarkon II right now and find three people who would heartily endorse being taken over by the Amarr Empire. That doesn't mean it is what the population as a whole wants.
What I said was, if the petition were administered by an unbiased third party I would think it was legitimate. This is nothing but a show for the media and the gullible.
At best it shows discontent with the handling the Republic has given these people. So some few think that the Cartel can't be any worse. They are wrong of course, since the Republic doesn't, for example, actively enslave people for illegal sale to the Amarr. I fear these poor people will find out how wrong they are soon enough.
Is living in poverty that much worse than living in poverty and having your children sold, your world contaminated with the production of horrible chemicals, and your 'government' facilitating it all?
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
|
Evanda Char
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Electus Matari
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 23:06:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Cyal
Heh. Isn't there some religious mandate or PIE regulation forbidding flirtation with Minmatar insurgents that you're violating?
He has never violated me.
-Eva-
Electus Matari - taking it one bad guy at a time |
Kyoko Sakoda
Ghost Festival
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 23:07:00 -
[55]
Originally by: Dairya
with your Cartel brethren while they round up the loyal inhabitants of Skarkon II to take to your brothels and drug factories?
Haha, funny. Trying to paint us the Cartel as the ultimate evil in human trafficking even though it is fact that the Nation implants its citizens and makes them no more than machines. I see what you did there ma'am, but I admire the attempt at spin.
Originally by: Dairya
I suggest you bring the best you have. Like a Thanatos.
Or maybe a Nyx.
If I brought a Nidhouggur or a Hel would that just confuse you more?
Ghost Festival is recruiting. |
Silver Night
Naqam
Project Alice.
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 23:19:00 -
[56]
Edited by: Silver Night on 02/06/2008 23:20:54
Originally by: Kyoko Sakoda
Haha, funny. Trying to paint us the Cartel as the ultimate evil in human trafficking even though it is fact that the Nation implants its citizens and makes them no more than machines. I see what you did there ma'am, but I admire the attempt at spin.
Except, of course, that that is nothing but propaganda, while I personally stumbled across a Cartel Slave Mine in Skarkon just yesterday.
Part of the ideal of the Nation is improvement via voluntary technological modification. The True Slave program - which I believe was an unfortunate mistake - involves solely non-Citizens. In fact, it initially was Slaves purchased legally from the Amarr.
As I said though. The TS program, which only involved the Navy of the Nation, was I think a mistake and I believe we can render it obsolete if only the Nation can get back on its feet. The Nation never used citizens in such exercises. The only consequence of being a citizen of the Nation is a better quality of life and access to very advanced technological self improvement.
Well, if I am entirely honest, then as a citizen of the Nation you would also face the blind hatred of the various entities and people who are afraid of whats different, fail to understand, and don't want to - because it threatens their own power structures with a world where things can be better.
I think we have already covered the potential consequences of being under the 'protection' of the Angel Cartel. It is like the extortion of a shop keeper writ large - and the consequences of not dancing hard enough to the Angel tune will be nothing but enslavement, death, and the skies of their world blackened by the vomit of illicit Angel Cartel factories.
Edit: Actually, I apologize, having their world turned into a toxic husk that can barely support life would be the happy consequence if they do work as hard as they can for the Cartel.
--------------
The Clown Man.
GLS Mr. State
Caldari Patriot.
Sansha's Nation Supporter
|
Kyoko Sakoda
Ghost Festival
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 23:23:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Silver Night
Yes, 3 people cherry picked by the Cartel to talk to the reporter - at least it shows that the Cartel takes their PR seriously. However it doesn't say anything about the legitimacy of the petition. It is anecdotal - emotionally effective but statistically irrelevant. I guarantee you that I could go down to Skarkon II right now and find three people who would heartily endorse being taken over by the Amarr Empire. That doesn't mean it is what the population as a whole wants.
You're right, you could most certainly find three Minmatar on that planet that believe so. You could probably find three Sansha sympathizers. But emotions are just as important as statistics Mr. Night, unless you really are the cold, calculating Sansha type always portrayed in holoreels. The gathering of these people's perceptions counts just as much toward my argument as sheer statistics. History is defined by experiences, not simply numbers.
Unless you think the reporter talked to only three people, picked up, and took off, which would be pretty bad as far as journalistic integrity is measured, you have no argument.
The population as a whole is not what matters, because then it is impossible for government to work. Just try to make everyone happy. I have no illusions that some will be displeased. That is their own position. But a majority must be pleased.
Originally by: Silver Night
What I said was, if the petition were administered by an unbiased third party I would think it was legitimate. This is nothing but a show for the media and the gullible.
No, you'd just find something else that upset you.
Originally by: Silver Night
At best it shows discontent with the handling the Republic has given these people. So some few think that the Cartel can't be any worse. They are wrong of course, since the Republic doesn't, for example, actively enslave people for illegal sale to the Amarr. I fear these poor people will find out how wrong they are soon enough.
Who said we enslave and sell to the Amarr? The Cartel has business dealings cluster-wide and doesn't rely on slaves at all as a staple trade. That'd be a bad way to conduct business and secure liquid assets over the long term.
Again I'm very impressed with your spinning of the situation Mr. Night, but trying to deny any connections to the slave trade yourself just makes you look like a tool.
Ghost Festival is recruiting. |
Kyoko Sakoda
Ghost Festival
|
Posted - 2008.06.02 23:32:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Silver Night
Except, of course, that that is nothing but propaganda, while I personally stumbled across a Cartel Slave Mine in Skarkon just yesterday.
Funny that you should care, considering your organization's background and dealings, Mr. Night. I'm disinclined to believe you on your word alone, anyway.
Originally by: Silver Night
Well, if I am entirely honest, then as a citizen of the Nation you would also face the blind hatred of the various entities and people who are afraid of whats different, fail to understand, and don't want to - because it threatens their own power structures with a world where things can be better.
Not all of what is written in the history books is wrong, Mr. Night. Don't try to play that card.
Ghost Festival is recruiting. |
Gaven Lok'ri
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
|
Posted - 2008.06.03 05:26:00 -
[59]
Edited by: Gaven Lok''ri on 03/06/2008 05:33:21
Originally by: Evanda Char
He has never violated me.
This, however, might very well be because you run away far too quickly. You might try sticking around sometime. It could be interesting.
Deus Vult!
PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public' |
Evanda Char
Re-Awakened Technologies Inc
Electus Matari
|
Posted - 2008.06.03 05:35:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri
Originally by: Evanda Char
He has never violated me.
This, however, might very well be because you run away far too quickly.
Well, your Geddon is a bit too big for me to take without help. Hull damage is difficult to fix.
-Eva-
Electus Matari - taking it one bad guy at a time |
Becq Starforged
Minmatar Ship Construction Services
Ushra'Khan
|
Posted - 2008.06.03 05:36:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Gaven Lok'ri
Not that there is anything wrong with enslaving people, just amusing to see you pretend that you do not to try and fool the weak minded.
Spoken by friends of the SPCS, who are merely 'innitiating' Gallente into the mysteries of the benevolent Amarrian faith...
--
Becq Starforged
proprietor of Starforge Industries, a subsidiary of Minmatar Ship Construction Services
At Starforge Industries, the world of tomorrow is being blown apart today! |
Gaven Lok'ri
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
|
Posted - 2008.06.03 06:47:00 -
[62]
Originally by: Evanda Char
Well, your Geddon is a bit too big for me to take without help. Hull damage is difficult to fix.
You could always bring friends.
Deus Vult!
PIE Website Public Channel: 'PIE Public' |
Nausea
Ghost Festival
|
Posted - 2008.06.03 17:13:00 -
[63]
*blinks*
Let me get this straight...supporters of the Nation and the Blood Raiders claiming the moral high ground against the Angels over the Skarkon system?
Really?
You have the pretty standard rhetoric from Naqam which, while masterful, is starting to get old, with cries of 'no, we're not slaving, we're just offering people the chance to put these chips in their heads which affect certain cognitive functions'. As much as I doubt the veracity of their claims it does nothing more, they atleast try to employ some subtlty to their words.
Then you have Cruoris Seraphim, and their promise to blood minors, and a sliding scale for additional blooding...and all people can debate in here is how wrong the Cartel is? Really? Active blood-raider threats on the table to terrorise innocents and the general feeling is that this is no where near as bad as the cartel's actions are the response?
The cluster gets stranger by the day...
|
Daelin Blackleaf
Naqam
|
Posted - 2008.06.03 20:10:00 -
[64]
It is easy to take the moral high ground when you and your allies have morals, purpose, and vision while those who are verbally opposed support an organization that appears to lack them.
Simply because our morals differ from others does not mean they do not exist. Both faiths and nations are, in part, defined by their morality. Exactly what would you claim the over-arching Cartel morality is? What is your vision, your purpose, your goal for a better tomorrow, your contribution to humanity?
Then if you find such tell me how, should it exist, is yours the higher ground when factions and the people within them have such varying views on even the most fundamental matters.
----------------------------
Originally by: CCP Subscription
I'm sorry Sir your European I'll have to charge you 58% extra
|
Babel
NEPHILIM Wing
|
Posted - 2008.06.04 11:14:00 -
[65]
Edited by: Babel on 04/06/2008 11:14:54
"Exactly what would you claim the over-arching Cartel morality is?"
In my book - Absolute freedom of action, and of opinion. Thus often even those associated with the Cartel will disagree on what the Cartel actually 'is' .. which to some extent is the point.
Perhaps the only consistent definition of the Cartel is 'criminal', which as I have mentioned elsewhere is a term applied by other entities who simply believe their own moral regime is 'lawful' - nothing more.
.
URIEL Recruitish Threaddery |
Ravin Abai
Cruoris Seraphim
|
Posted - 2008.06.05 03:01:00 -
[66]
Edited by: Ravin Abai on 05/06/2008 03:01:33
Originally by: Nausea
*blinks*
Let me get this straight...supporters of the Nation and the Blood Raiders claiming the moral high ground against the Angels over the Skarkon system?
Really?
Maybe you should stick to snatching purses and selling vials of drop on the street corner, you dolt.
Leave the thinking to your boss, Sakoda, who in spite of her whiny impudence at least appears to be somewhat competent.
The only thing we're engaging in in Skarkon is teaching the local cattle a lesson for submitting to the venal influence of the Cartel while we were away on other business.
Perhaps you'd like to fulfill your new obligations to them and come riding to the rescue?
|
Kyoko Sakoda
Ghost Festival
|
Posted - 2008.06.05 03:49:00 -
[67]
Mr. Abai, as a corporation, we have no obligations to the people of Skarkon unless directly ordered otherwise, as we are not the Archangels. However, if you're looking to pick a fight, I will not ultimately deny you one.
Ghost Festival is recruiting. |
Ravin Abai
Cruoris Seraphim
|
Posted - 2008.06.05 05:05:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Kyoko Sakoda
However, if you're looking to pick a fight, I will not ultimately deny you one.
Now you're speaking my language, Sakoda!
Pay us a visit and we can have some fun. 
The boys are looking forward to it.
|
Emrod
Legion Du Lys
GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2008.06.05 19:03:00 -
[69]
Ldlq have figth angel cartel in V-I long time ago.
Dont trust any pirate cartel...they all need to be purge tbh.
COAD is for morons.......hey...wait a minute 0o !!! |
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