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Martin VanBuren
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.06.17 03:54:00 -
[511]
 Originally by: Zaran Darkstar
Originally by: Goumindong
...
I think this vendeta has gone a bit too far.
It seemed to me that Jade was unfamiliar with the controls of muting/unmuting, perhaps the next meeting should be done using another way. IRC etc...
As for the issues he proposed.
Maybe these are not the most popular matters but most of them are valid ideas. There is so much space for small and big improvments to this game that no matter where you start its for the best or mostly for the best .
Perhaps Jade is not puting the stuff you would like but eventually his time will be over and then some other will take over. In the meantime i say it again i don't think the issues he puts for voting are so bad. Maybe not the most popular but they do aim to improve things.
As for his behavior i can't be certain if he overeacted. The logs can tell you only so much... Discipline is needed to a discussion... In any case i would say let him be judged in the end or at least after some more council assemblings.
Hopefully he will get the hang of it and become better. Bottom line is "Let's give the guy a chance to get better"
Hey guys I'm not going to read the thread or try to understand the situation at all but you should take my criticisms seriously
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Zaran Darkstar
Brutor tribe
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Posted - 2008.06.17 05:15:00 -
[512]
Edited by: Zaran Darkstar on 17/06/2008 05:22:06
I read the topic. Strange how you show so much care about this and not for example about that other thing with the guy that was banned because he made the mistake to try to make the game a little more fair for everybody.
Seems that for Jade behavior you are sooo sensitive but for the guy that was banned you don;t say a word. |
Avon
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.06.17 07:43:00 -
[513]
Edited by: Avon on 17/06/2008 07:46:06
Originally by: Goumindong
Malfeasance by a single member is not a conspiracy.
I'm saving that for the next devhax thread.
Oh, content:
Jade won the popular vote, Jade gets the chair.
If you hate that, get more votes next time.
Stop crying because you/your candindate has less popular support, and get out there and put together a positive campaign.
Seriously, a thread full of people voting against democracy is all to odd for me to grasp.
Eve-Online: The Text Adventure |
fuze
InfoMorph Services Ltd
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Posted - 2008.06.17 08:30:00 -
[514]
Originally by: Avon
Seriously, a thread full of people voting against democracy is all to odd for me to grasp.
Seriously, did you read any of those meeting reports? #3 is a real stunner ya know.
If you think this is about in game politics you're missing the point.
I do agree on the democracy part but Jade didn't get voted to bloat his ego some more. He got voted to be a CSM chairman and failing to fulfill that role badly. Especially at the failing to acknowledge your own mistakes part. If you're not willing to be reasonable its impossible to work together as a team.
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Avon
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.06.17 11:14:00 -
[515]
Originally by: fuze
I do agree on the democracy part but Jade didn't get voted to bloat his ego some more. He got voted to be a CSM chairman and failing to fulfill that role badly.
Well, that is the other-side of democracy, innit?
You can't un-vote people just because they don't turn out how you wanted.
To be fair, he is the best chairman the CSM has ever had.
Eve-Online: The Text Adventure |
Miner Nine
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Posted - 2008.06.17 12:02:00 -
[516]
Originally by: Atama Cardel
Jade, just out of curiosity, whatever happened to you stepping down from chair and letting the CSM vote someone in, like you said you would do at the very start?
And don't try to feign ignorance when you "accidentally" miss this post like you are bound to do
Did this get answer? c/d
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Katyayani Koriau
Auto De Fe
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Posted - 2008.06.17 12:06:00 -
[517]
Ipeach Jade  She wants to nerd Pulse lasor wtf!
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Anton Marvik
AnTi.
Atrocitas
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Posted - 2008.06.17 12:08:00 -
[518]
Originally by: Katyayani Koriau
Ipeach Jade She wants to nerd
QFT
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Rouque Vanderbuilt
Nuts and Bolts
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Posted - 2008.06.17 12:28:00 -
[519]
/signed
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fuze
InfoMorph Services Ltd
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Posted - 2008.06.17 13:39:00 -
[520]
Originally by: Avon
Originally by: fuze
I do agree on the democracy part but Jade didn't get voted to bloat his ego some more. He got voted to be a CSM chairman and failing to fulfill that role badly.
Well, that is the other-side of democracy, innit?
You can't un-vote people just because they don't turn out how you wanted.
Yes you can. CSM are still subjected to rules and regulations.
And CSM with 8 votees still can put up legitimate issues to CCP.
Besides the rule of who will be chairman isn't set in stone.
It could be rotated or be elected by the quorum itself. |
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Jade Constantine
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Posted - 2008.06.17 14:02:00 -
[521]
The role of chair would be better handled by some kind of non-voting ccp-employee in my opinion. Since all the CSM reps (myself included) have our own votes and interest and aspirations for the game then it sits poorly to have the chair combined with a voting position. Still, I've tried to address this concern in meetings 4/5 by calling the other reps to do the introduction, debate moderation, call to vote on their own Issues and I've only stepped in when asked to by the leading involved rep.
I'd invite your to compare and contrast the stormy meeting 3
With the far smoother and less arguementative meeting 4 and meeting 5
And while speaking of "constructive outcomes" I'd remind you that over the 3 weeks of pre-Iceland talks we have successfully tabled from community discussions the following issues for face to face conference with CCP:
1. Removal of 30/90 day time cards
2. Jump Bridges and Cyno-jammers fix
3. Log Server exploitation/BACON.
4. Skill Queue Functionality?
5. 5% rule is too strict.
6. Kill Rights should be transferable.
7. Alliances in Faction Warfare.
8. Funky POS alterations.
9. Improve Black Ops.
10. Make suicide ganking more difficult
11. General Eve Forums improvement/fixing
12. CSM should vote for its own chairman
13. Evaluation of empire war dec mechanics
14. Feasibility of Outposts going boom
15. Replace double-click in a chat channel
16. Cargo hold size of ships in hanger but not in use
17. Re-examination of 0.0 Sovereignty
18. Reload all Ammo
19. Small Freighters
20. Drone Implants
21. Rigged Ships and Cargo
22. Aggression timer is too short/variable hull fix
23. Improve Bombs
24. Chat Channel Pilot listing
25. EW Icons
26. HUD minimum sizes
27. Personal Assets HUD
28. Skills Page Improvement
29. Assembly Arrays
30. Experimental Industry Issues
31. Science POS improvements
32. Sell Order tweaks
33. Shares Stock Market
34. Contracts Improvements
35. Completion of unfinished Story Arcs in Eve
36. Roleplay Interests in EVE / dynamic consquence
37. Moon Mining Improvement / dynamic seeding
38. PVP Ownership of Wrecks
39. Corporation Standings Slots
40. Corporations automatical get Alliance standings
41. Buff Large Autocannons
42. Colorblind UI
43. Account Security
44. Mac/Linux Client
45. Multi Monitor Support
46. Evemail Spam from corp events.
Each of these issues stood for the mandated 7 days of public discussion. Each was brought up in a formal quorate CSM meeting and received a passing vote. Each has been ruled an Issue of importance and general community interest and has been documented in the form of a submission template and provided in advance to CCP to form the agenda for the conference in Iceland.
Now if anybody still holds that a few sparks and arguments in the debating chamber and some froth on the forums invalidates the good work done by CSM representatives who have worked pretty damn hard to get this thing on the road to a ridiculously short timescale then there's not much I can say to that besides - run next time and show us you can do better.
Because I happen to think this inaugural CSM has done a damn fine job. And anybody continuing to snipe from the sidelines in the face of very clear evidence of accomplishment is being petty, disingenuous and mindlessly vindictive.
CSM Manifesto 2008 | Destroy Outposts! |
Seetesh
Pixels Docks
Fang Alliance
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Posted - 2008.06.17 14:19:00 -
[522]
Supported ive heard of her antics.
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Tecam Hund
The Buggers
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Posted - 2008.06.17 16:36:00 -
[523]
No support.
I mean no offense to CSM representatives, but judging from the chat logs it is my opinion that without Jade CSM would stall on take off.
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Kelsin
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2008.06.17 16:43:00 -
[524]
Originally by: Tecam Hund
No support.
I mean no offense to CSM representatives, but judging from the chat logs it is my opinion that without Jade CSM would stall on take off.
Yup, would have been a mess without someone keeping it moving structured and goal-oriented.
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Atama Cardel
Even-Flow
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Posted - 2008.06.17 21:57:00 -
[525]
Originally by: Avon
You can't un-vote people just because they don't turn out how you wanted.
I beg to differ, in my country we have this funny thing called impeachment, when the president that got voted in screws up we can kick him out
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Lady Starfire
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Posted - 2008.06.17 22:06:00 -
[526]
Originally by: Seetesh
Supported ive heard of it's antics.
Fixed.
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Hastur DragonTooth
coracao ardente
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Posted - 2008.06.17 23:41:00 -
[527]
Originally by: Goumindong
Because Jade Constantine overstepped his authority, denigrated the other members of the council, used the chair as a bully pulpit, and accepts no fault or responsibility for what happened.
Seriously, read the thread.
Thumbs down.
And you're not using this thread as a bully pulpit, to denigrate the council chair? Out of the 520+ replies in this thread, probably a hundred are from you personally. You want Jade to fail and are taking every opportunity to try and make that happen. You sir, are just as bad as jade.
Judging from the number of times something akin to, "BUT I WUZ VOTED IN I ARE MOAR IMPORTANT!", has appeared in this thread, the CSM seem to care more about some virtual brownie points than the job they're supposed to do for us. A pox on the lot of them, worthless scrubs. Arguing about minutia and taking every opportunity to disrupt the process is not what you were elected to do.
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Zancera
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Posted - 2008.06.18 10:56:00 -
[528]
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Goumindong
Merch Industrial
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.06.18 11:19:00 -
[529]
Originally by: Hastur DragonTooth
Originally by: Goumindong
Because Jade Constantine overstepped his authority, denigrated the other members of the council, used the chair as a bully pulpit, and accepts no fault or responsibility for what happened.
Seriously, read the thread.
Thumbs down.
And you're not using this thread as a bully pulpit, to denigrate the council chair? Out of the 520+ replies in this thread, probably a hundred are from you personally. You want Jade to fail and are taking every opportunity to try and make that happen. You sir, are just as bad as jade.
Ad hominem tu quoque. Its also false. I am just a prolific forum *****. Get the evidence and make a decision based upon it, its not my fault the only reasonable conclusion you can come to is unfavorable to Jade.
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Akiba Penrose
PAK
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Posted - 2008.06.18 14:48:00 -
[530]
signed
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Falcons |
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Greyhair
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Posted - 2008.06.18 19:01:00 -
[531]
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Temulin
The Avalon Foundation
Delta.Green
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Posted - 2008.06.19 02:41:00 -
[532]
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Synapse Archae
Demonic Retribution
Un-Natural Selection
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Posted - 2008.06.19 02:54:00 -
[533]
Originally by: Avon
Seriously, a thread full of people voting against democracy is all to odd for me to grasp.
This. Thread is tl/dr but funny ironies abound!
- - - Originally by: CCP Garthagk
While these forums may not give you everything that you want, they will usually let you post.
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Dolomite Starks
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Posted - 2008.06.19 05:23:00 -
[534]
Edited by: Dolomite Starks on 19/06/2008 05:23:27
supportin' dis
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Digital Solaris
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Posted - 2008.06.19 07:39:00 -
[535]
Jade is a case, his brain releases large quantities of serotonin, making him think that the universe resolve him. 
~No, you are not special. I insult everyone. |
Inquisitor Berthez
the oNe Academy
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Posted - 2008.06.19 09:58:00 -
[536]
Ankhesentawhatshername for president!! \o/
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Colonel Rykef
Animus Exuro
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Posted - 2008.06.19 11:56:00 -
[537]
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Niraco79
Black Nova Corp
Band of Brothers
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Posted - 2008.06.19 15:33:00 -
[538]
NOT supported
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Princess Gally
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Posted - 2008.06.19 16:14:00 -
[539]
OP, pick one:
- work as intended
- Eve is a harsh place
- Obvious whine is obvious
- go back to wow
- can I have your stuff?
Jade has been elected and there's nothing you or anyone else can do about it. You don't like it? then pick one of the bull***t above these forums are full of. Or live with it, move on and let's talk about the game, its future.
But I've read the chat log and if ALL CSM's (except Ankhe tbqh) could focus on the game instead of these powertrip conflicts, maybe we could get something out of this CSM thing...
-------------ONCOMING REVOLUTION------------
Miners united. Set your Trit prices to 8.00!
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Fitz VonHeise
The New Order.
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Posted - 2008.06.19 20:04:00 -
[540]
Originally by: Avon
Well, that is the other-side of democracy, innit?
You can't un-vote people just because they don't turn out how you wanted.
Actually you can... it is call... "Re-Call".
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