If you are a miner and want to survive a gank you need to pony up the cash. Setup a full deadspace or officer fit and you'll be immune to ganks by destroyers.

All SP in pew pew.
0 in industry.
but i have common sense.

and i am takling about tier3 BC ganks.
one BC can not kill any hulk it want in high sec.
its too big price difference for that.

If you are a miner and want to survive a gank you need to pony up the cash. Setup a full deadspace or officer fit and you'll be immune to ganks by destroyers.

I had a lot more to say, breaking down your post line by line, but then i realized i dont care that much

you exaggerate the desires of the op and the rest of the posters in this thread

basically what is wanted is a buff to the hulks defenses, not to make ganking impossible, just harder.

so far there hasnt been much in terms of constructive counter arguments
"stay aligned" is not a mining term. an active align gives the hulk one cycle on a set of asteroids before it is out of range. it will also outdistance an orca in this time. nor does this advice apply in the slightest to mackinaws, another ship which is badly in need of help

however being that this is a game, and not supposed to represent, illuminate or fully replicate real life, some {additional} balance should be added to deal with what has become a relatively cheap profession.

however being that this is a game, and not supposed to represent, illuminate or fully replicate real life, some {additional} balance should be added to deal with what has become a relatively cheap profession. since the change in insurance payouts to not include gank ships it had become not as profitable to gank hulks in hisec, however with the ship additions of the tier 3 bc and the recent buff to destroyers it may very well be.

as the recent interdiction of ice campaigns has shown it is relatively easy to kill large numbers of these uninsureable ships. adding buffer to be able to survive in what is supposed to be secured space by an attack of a ~1.2 million isk fitted ship does not seem unreasonable on a ship that costs between 225 and 230 million. this in itself is a game balance issue


it is funny that the roles are reversed in eve and real life no? the most dangerous place for a hulk is in hisec not null. armored vehicles are used where ever there is a threat to the saftey of the crew. in this case it would be hise

no, hulks in high should be very gankable, if you dont want to lose a hulk, fly a covetor,

and if you want a hulk to be safe, go into 0.0 and mine there, much much safer and easier and even more money

if hulks would be too sturdy, mineral prices would go to hell, thats what hulkageddon is for

Then use a Rokh. Easier to tank.

Honestly, this isn't very complicated.

You still wrote quite a bit for not caring that much. At least the OP actually appeared to not care about what I said, probably because it renders everything she said invalid.

Holy ****, you can't suggest anything in this game pertaining to re-balancing of anything without someone flaming the **** out of you. Is anyone that plays EvE objective, even a little bit?

If you are a miner and want to survive a gank you need to pony up the cash. Setup a full deadspace or officer fit and you'll be immune to ganks by destroyers.

[quote=Fredfredbug4]it is funny that the roles are reversed in eve and real life no? the most dangerous place for a hulk is in hisec not null. armored vehicles are used where ever there is a threat to the saftey of the crew. in this case it would be hisec

As someone who has done a lot of nullsec mining, I would argue that this is because nullsec miners are considerably more careful than hisec pilots, in general.

In nullsec you have perfect intel from local, as well as from alliance security channels so you know if someone likely to shoot you is even *close*.

No such luck in highsec, even the quietest highsec system will have people you don't know flitting through on a regular basis. If you dock everytime you see someone suspicious while mining in my old home of Nakugard you'd never undock to begin with.

nerf CONCORD, make it easier/safer to gank people in hisec.

i.e. in 0.5, CONCORD doesn't show for GCC (navies do). You can avoid the navy legally*.
Now 0.5 sec mining fleets warrant having a defence fleet.


*change aggression mechanics to prevent docking. Jumping *MAY* be OK (i.e. priates can GTFO to low... if they GTFO to hi, well hilarity will ensue when CONCORD murders them on the gate). Navies can see through cloaks and stuff to keep people from safing up and cloaking.

That's a good point. I'm not against the way that works, because I feel like game mechanics should somewhat push people toward nullsec, but I guess I can't give miners' level of caution all the credit.

You still wrote quite a bit for not caring that much. At least the OP actually appeared to not care about what I said, probably because it renders everything she said invalid.

And have you ever even tried to mine in low or null? It's suicide by yourself. Don't believe me? Take a fairly cheap ships with similar align times and speed to a hulk. A tier one racial hauler or something, then go through at least 5 jumps of lowsec and 5 jumps of nullsec during peak server times (no scouting). Then pull into an asteroid belt and wait. You'll probably be dead before you can even get to the last step.

Plus it's far from cheap, you are guaranteed to lose a ship everytime you press F1 or your preferred turret hotkey.

Ship price vs ship price has nothing to do with on this end of the spectrum. One ship is meant for combat the other ship is meant to shoot rocks. Why should a ship that is meant to be no where near the front lines be able to easily withstand attacks by cruisers?

No it's a crappy point because if mining was 'safer' in nullsec all the miners would be doing it already.
In reality the vast majority of miners will happily eat all the suicide ganks in the world in their untanked hulks rather then step into 0.0 and mine because the costs and risks of mining in nullsec are that high.

Other way around

High-sec protections should be lowered to the point where taking non-CONCORD based protection is the standard, not a competitive disadvantage for miners. Then highsec will be full of guys who can either tank ti3 bc volleys and those who either defend their mining fleets actively, or flatout lose money.

No it's a crappy point because if mining was 'safer' in nullsec all the miners would be doing it already.
In reality the vast majority of miners will happily eat all the suicide ganks in the world in their untanked hulks rather then step into 0.0 and mine because the costs and risks of mining in nullsec are that high.

It's not the costs and risks, it's the people you have to deal with that don't understand that "industrial character" means "probably useless for and definitely not inclined to burning 8 hours of their 4 hours of play time every day running around in PvP fleets chasing ghosts".

I thought you were saying that nullsec mining was easier then highsec, now it turns out that there's an significant amount of effort to ensure that there is in fact safe space to mine in.

In reality, nullsec miners tank their hulks just to be able to survive the belt rats.
Highsec miners still cram their hulks full of scanner mods, cargo rigs and expanders; despite all the 'terrible threat' that suicide gankers pose, they refuse to set their hulks up to withstand one tornado volley, and often even one thrasher volley.

Judging by the precautions players bother to take, the belt rats alone in nullsec literally pose more of a threat then suicide ganking in highsec, hth.

I thought you were saying that nullsec mining was easier then highsec, now it turns out that there's an significant amount of effort to ensure that there is in fact safe space to mine in.

In reality, nullsec miners tank their hulks just to be able to survive the belt rats.
Highsec miners still cram their hulks full of scanner mods, cargo rigs and expanders; despite all the 'terrible threat' that suicide gankers pose, they refuse to set their hulks up to withstand one tornado volley, and often even one thrasher volley.

Judging by the precautions players bother to take, the belt rats alone in nullsec literally pose more of a threat then suicide ganking in highsec, hth.

no, hulks in high should be very gankable,...