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Synapse Archae
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Posted - 2004.05.14 23:53:00 -
[1]
I personally think this is a crazy and insanely bad idea. Are there any players who support this? Please at least begin your post with "Support." or "Don't support." So that we can get some idea of how the community as a whole is split on this, if we are split at all.
For the record: Don't Support.
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[/IMG]http://millerfam.org/eve/synapse_logo.jpg[/IMG]
Everyone deserves a chance to live.
My job is to make sure they get it. |
Meridius
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Posted - 2004.05.15 00:06:00 -
[2]
Someone compared this to diablo II in space. I agree. I hate games like diablo and WOW. EVE is the only MOORPG i would ever play.
This immunity thing among other changes that are coming are completely retarded and not well thought out at all.
I respect CCP as a developer but these changes are becoming ridiculous.
Small changes are required, tweaks. CCP is changing the gameplay we have grown to love far too much.
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Amin
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Posted - 2004.05.15 00:12:00 -
[3]
Damage Immunity - For what? Have i missed something?
Drink StarsiÖ Relation Co-ordinator
Caldari State Citizen
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Nebuli
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Posted - 2004.05.15 00:17:00 -
[4]
Yeah some of the new NPCs have 100% resistance to certain damage types, this imo is crazy, hang on its crazy with a capital C, so its actualy Crazy, all these changes are just gonna ruin the game, end of.
Learn to adapt they say, I am I say, why do you think my Megathron has mining lazers on it now? |
Shorin
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Posted - 2004.05.15 00:28:00 -
[5]
Don't Support.
It makes absolutely no sense.
I can accept that asteroids magically respawn each night because it is needed for gameplay.
I can accept that stargates and npc stations are 100% invulnerable to all damage because it is needed for gameplay.
I cannot accept that a ship the players are allowed to fight would ever be 100% invulnerable to a given type of damage. I would like to think that the laws of physics are alive and well. Asking me to suspend my disbelief for something not needed for gameplay is as you say:
 Quote:
I personally think this is a crazy and insanely bad idea.
That being said, sign me up for SSIFSMBHTÖ armor.
Woohoo! 
P.S. SSIFSMBHTÖ (Strap Some Invulnerability Frigates to the Side of My Battleship Hull Technology)
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Drutort
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Posted - 2004.05.15 03:24:00 -
[6]
there was already a thread like this... and 98% of the people i would say think its stupid, and as others said this isnt some magic fantasy game... its a futuristic type of game but not some stupid magic game... with that said... there are some form of physics or laws... and would be that even if you were to make up some form of shield or armor or whatever and had some way to make it resist some forms of dmg that it would be impossible for you to create immunity... that goes against all things :P its like free energy... something like that might exist in some magical/fantasy came but not in a game like EVE
support Idea: QuickInfo an alternative to ShowInfo
my MoBlog |
Synapse Archae
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Posted - 2004.05.15 03:50:00 -
[7]
Drutort and Nebuli forgot to say: Don't Support.
out of 6 thats 5 that dont want to see it 1 who didn't know. Who else?
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[/IMG]http://millerfam.org/eve/synapse_logo.jpg[/IMG]
Everyone deserves a chance to live.
My job is to make sure they get it. |
Iece Quaan
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Posted - 2004.05.15 03:52:00 -
[8]
Veto!
It's a very bad idea when certain types of weapons are only capable of dealing a few types of damage. It also dosen't make sense in the continuity, for example, why dont all the pirate races compare notes and make ships that are 100% immune to everything? =P
Making NPCs tougher simply by making them more uber is a cop-out.. sorry, but it is. Work on their AI instead. The mobs in EQ were sometimes almost preternaturally smart, making it important to have a group that was balanced, with capable players behind the screen.. are you trying to tell us that the EQ designers are better than you?
<3
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Aldelphius
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Posted - 2004.05.15 04:24:00 -
[9]
dont support
as a former d2 player, immunities suck. people will just figure out what ships are not invunerable to their lasers, and that part of space will be packed with people killing those typer of rats, and the rest of space will be ignored. NPC's should have a max of 75%, and pc ships should have no more than 60% resistance, and shields and armor should never have the same max resistance.
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ClawHammer III
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Posted - 2004.05.15 06:37:00 -
[10]
Don't support!
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Kalki Nibiru
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Posted - 2004.05.15 06:49:00 -
[11]
I wouldnt care if the amarr and gallente had more ammunition choices. As it stands, if an enemy has an immunity to thermal or kenetic damage, that does a lot of damage to the Gallente, and if its immunity is to thermal or EM, the amarr get hurt quite alot. The minmatar arent hurt by this since they can just change out their ammunition, neither the Amarr nor Gallente can do that, however the minmatar are hurt by the ammunition range penalties, so even if we all could switch to different ammo, we would still have to deal with changes in damage output and range changes.
All in all, its not good.
Taken from the May 29th 2003 Devchat at EveGate
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<Muaddid> Q: When will sentry gun and station and similar construction pods be introduced on the market?
<Hellmar> we have various player owned entities already implemented. Sentry guns, power/shield generators, field repair mini-stations, mobile refineries. We are still working out the last tidbits of how they can be over taken, what is the penalty of having a sentry gun kill a n00b etc. and we have been a bit busy with plugging the holes that people have found.I would say that you'd start to see these items on the market in about 2-3 weeks, very expensive to begin with |
Sphalerite
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Posted - 2004.05.15 08:22:00 -
[12]
don't support
I've been trying to think of any positive outcome of this, and I just can't. Whatever lucky bastards get thermal immunity are going to have a party, considering lasers and hybrids are half thermal damage, PP is one of the most common projectile ammos, and with the silly missile change, caldari will be using more thermal missiles as well.
Why add something that nobody likes that will require more work to balance when there is no positive aspect to the change?
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Luc Boye
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Posted - 2004.05.15 11:00:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Luc Boye on 15/05/2004 11:00:55
Worst idea ever! I mean it is bad as it is with this rock-scissors-paper, now we need immunity as well
--
2004.12.29 23:33:40combatMining Pollution Cloud hits you, doing 140.0 damage. |
Shia Dai
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Posted - 2004.05.15 11:15:00 -
[14]
DONT SUPPORT.
Insanely bad idea, I can accept a higher-than-normal resistance, but immunity? Give me a break, LETS NOT TURN THIS INTO DIABLO.
Shia
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Tyr Guann
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Posted - 2004.05.15 12:02:00 -
[15]
Don't support. Galls and Amarr are already limited in their firepower. Unless you count drones, but their effectiveness is going to be reduced.
The is an arese backwards idea, and if it comes into effect, I'll...I'll...cry!
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2004.05.15 12:06:00 -
[16]
I don't support it at all.
I think it's wrong and I've never liked the way CCP make NPC's "tougher" by giving them unlimited cap, insane MWD speeds etc etc.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Xailia
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Posted - 2004.05.15 20:24:00 -
[17]
I don't support it in part...
I still think it's not a good idea, and 75% resistance is a good limit.
However, with certain damage types, I think 100% resistance is acceptable, but only for either armor or shield.
If you think about it, a ship should be able to increase it's shield intensity and block all kinetic damage. As well as you could change the shield so that it absorbs all EM damage, maybe even recharges it slightly.
EM damage shouldn't really damage any armor unless it's nano-based armor.
But in terms of gameplay, it's not a very good idea. 100% resistance would probably be pretty fun as long as you knew which NPCs had it, and were planning to meet them, such as in missions or dungeons.
However, I think that everybody should be able to do some amount of damage, even if their setup is a bad match. Limit it to a 75% max, and it should be acceptable.
"The sky above the port was the color of a television, tuned to a dead channel." |
Shevar
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Posted - 2004.05.15 21:19:00 -
[18]
I support it, escort ships for normal players will have the same things... Just fit the right smartbombs/missles if you go hunting no big deal, since 1 rat type can only fully resist 1 dmg type (the same with escort frigs).
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-The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs
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Mikelangelo
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Posted - 2004.05.15 21:48:00 -
[19]
I would not hold my breath over it NOT going thru.
Lots of MMORPG mobs, monsters, gods, what have you have built-in immunities to certain spells, powers, damage types etc....CCP is just going with the times. They'll do whatever they please regardless of what we say anyway.
Just adapt and carry multiple ammo types, missile types, etc.
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Darkwolf
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Posted - 2004.05.16 01:45:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Mikelangelo
Just adapt and carry multiple ammo types, missile types, etc.
The point is that some ships do not have that luxury.
In something like Diablo, sure you might bump across something that is immune to your primary means of damage, but you have alternatives, eg;
Barbarian. Coming against someone with Physical Immunity. Use Berserk, or weapons with elemental damage.
Paladin. Coming against someone with Physical Immunity. Whoop him with Vengeance.
Necromancer. Umm... Iron maiden your beasties and wait for the immune to kill himself.
Amazon. Coming against Physical Immunity. Use lightning javelins or something.
Sorceror. Coming against a elemental immune. Use one of the other elements on him.
Druid. Coming against a physical immune. Bust out a weapon with elemental damage.
The point here is that in games like Diablo, you can adjust your damage ability on the fly, regardless of your character type. Even if you're a pure ice mage and come against a cold immune creature, you can still wallop it with your staff if worst comes to worst.
But in EVE, what are you gonna do? "Damnit, these guys are immune to my Tachyons! Umm... Umm... Hang on guys, I gotta run 9 jumps back to the station to refit my ship. Back in an hour!"
Immunities = bloody stupid idea.
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vecdran
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Posted - 2004.05.16 02:21:00 -
[21]
I hate the idea.
So far we have 100% agreement on the subject.
The Civilized Civire |
Ronyo Dae'Loki
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Posted - 2004.05.16 02:23:00 -
[22]
This is so bad it makes the missile change almost look intelligent.
The NPCs already don't obey the rules we do. Why give them more bonuses?
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My salsa makes all the pretty girls want to dance and take off their underpants.
I <3 ( . Y . ) |
Mustafa Ken'Yova
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Posted - 2004.05.16 04:42:00 -
[23]
Damage immunity is plain stupid imo. Resistence is fine, but to not be able to dmg will make certain races worthless against rats.
...... |
Darkwolf
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Posted - 2004.05.16 06:06:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Mustafa Ken'Yova
Damage immunity is plain stupid imo. Resistence is fine, but to not be able to dmg will make certain races worthless against rats.
Yep. I'm all for giving rats high shield resistances to one damage type - to simulate the use of shield hardeners, but giving them a flat out immunity is just insanity.
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Levin Cavil
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Posted - 2004.05.16 08:44:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Levin Cavil on 16/05/2004 08:51:31
Did someone drop a retard bomb on CCP HQ?
In the last 2 weeks I havn't seen a single thing come from CCP that made even an ounce of sense. 100% resistance? Honestly the frst one of these I saw on Chaos I thought was a bug, like that missiles were broken or something.
Also in addition to the 100% resistance they have what seems to be a large shield booster running indefinately, equally bad idea. Also they have webbers AND scramblers AND spam defenders faster than a Raven shoots cruise AND have guns?! How many slots do these things have? I know they are drones but its like fighting a Tempion (Tempest+Scorpion). The whole concept of elite frigs in npc spawns is bad, you can't use a mixed lfeet on npcs, they cheat too much, your interceptors will die, especially with proposed changes, you HAVE to use a massive firepower approach to NPCs. Nothing is wrong with the massive firepower approach. NPC hunting is NOT PVP, it shouldn't even resemble PVP because its NPC hunting.
I'd say worst idea ever but that fits the description of ALL the proposed changes so I'm just going to say BAD IDEA.
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<Hammerhead> we can't do anything that requires programming
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Lao Tzu
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Posted - 2004.05.16 10:42:00 -
[26]
Quote:
with that said... there are some form of physics or laws... and would be that even if you were to make up some form of shield or armor or whatever and had some way to make it resist some forms of dmg that it would be impossible for you to create immunity... that goes against all things :P its like free energy... something like that might exist in some magical/fantasy came but not in a game like EVE
For the stupidity of theses the arguments saying it's aginst physics (Eve and physics  ) I'd be tempted to support the idea, but I think It'd be bad for game play as it would make projectile weapons even more popular than they already are.
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Shorin
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Posted - 2004.05.17 09:10:00 -
[27]
Quote:
For the stupidity of theses the arguments saying it's aginst physics (Eve and physics) I'd be tempted to support the idea, but I think It'd be bad for game play as it would make projectile weapons even more popular than they already are.
So you'd be tempted to support the idea simply because people argue that it goes against physics? Did physics step on your dog's tail or something? 
100% damage resistance is merely the flip side of infinite damage. In my opinion, neither belongs in a "science" fiction game without a good reason. It picks away at my suspension of disbelief and replaces it with the disbelief (and shock) that it actually might end up in the game.
That's not to say that all game design decisions should be based on physics. I'm merely saying that unless there is some gain to be made by breaking physics, why do it?
So does anyone know what the gain will be? Anyone? Bueller? 
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Shevar
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Posted - 2004.05.17 11:01:00 -
[28]
Quote:
The point here is that in games like Diablo, you can adjust your damage ability on the fly, regardless of your character type. Even if you're a pure ice mage and come against a cold immune creature, you can still wallop it with your staff if worst comes to worst.
But in EVE, what are you gonna do? "Damnit, these guys are immune to my Tachyons! Umm... Umm... Hang on guys, I gotta run 9 jumps back to the station to refit my ship. Back in an hour!"
Immunities = bloody stupid idea.
Ehm I totally fail to see your point, no gun in eve is limited to 1 dmg type (except smartbombs, and since you know what npcs you gonna hunt before you set out you can check up what 100% resistance they have, ie. there will be a sansha with 100% explosive resistance so dont use explosive smartbombs but a thermal one).
So really dont you think you're overreacting a little?
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-The only real drug problem is scoring real good drugs
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Estios
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Posted - 2004.05.17 12:44:00 -
[29]
Id like to see immunity, for me only.
Failing that the idea is a big pile of steaming feaces
So HMV consider Andy Williams and Dean Martin to be "easy listening" do they? Tell that to my mate Dave, he's been deaf for 20 years.
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Juan Andalusian
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Posted - 2004.05.17 12:56:00 -
[30]
Immunities..... Dungeons....
/emote starts shivering uncontrollably.
WTB: Turret of the blistering Fireball.
You have 97 skills, GM in 30 skills.
/emote pukes.
**Pain is meant to be felt** |
Artean
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Posted - 2004.05.17 13:10:00 -
[31]
Don't support
Sounds very "un-EVEish", and definitely brings up games like SWG, EQ etc to thought. Nothing else than unworthy for EVE.
........
There is a fine line between gate camping and just standing by a gate, looking like an idiot... |
Synapse Archae
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Posted - 2004.05.17 21:30:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Synapse Archae on 17/05/2004 21:32:22
So far out of 30 replies (and one post originator, minus my posts, we have
1 Support
27 Dont support
1 "Immunity for me only"
ermmm... ^^ not an option.
---------------------------------------------
[/IMG]http://millerfam.org/eve/synapse_logo.jpg[/IMG]
Everyone deserves a chance to live.
My job is to make sure they get it. |
RUNYOUFOOLS
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Posted - 2004.05.17 21:54:00 -
[33]
Dont support. Damn silly idea, ccp pls dont do this, npcs with 100% resits is silly, players with it is even more silly
Everyone crying for a change of rule confesses: I trained the wrong thing, now change the rules because i'm a dumbass.Thats true |
ShadowHawk
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Posted - 2004.05.18 14:13:00 -
[34]
Don't support
I fully agree with all the others in this thread, VERY bad idea, immunities was the worst feature in Diablo II and there is not reason why it should work any better in Eve especially if the same immunity is used on both shields AND armor... it just doesn't makes ANY sense at all.
Your 280mm 'Scout' Artillery I perfectly strikes Sansha's Scavenger, wrecking for 264.3 damage.
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Franz Ferdinand
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Posted - 2004.05.18 14:33:00 -
[35]
Don't Support.
CCP originally said they would make the NPC's follow the strengths and weaknesses of the ships they flew, i.e. Guristas would have great shields but poor amour and Sanshas vice versa. That sounds like a good idea, but invulnerability is very odd, unless I get to loot an Invulnerability Field II that does what it says on the tin :)
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Never eat anything bigger than your head |
Earthan
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Posted - 2004.05.18 16:43:00 -
[36]
yea invulerablilty to certain form of damage seems a very odd idea mybe make it 80 % resisstance but no 100 %
Stars, stars like dust, all around me.... |
Gats
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Posted - 2004.05.18 18:16:00 -
[37]
Dont support
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DarkStar251
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Posted - 2004.05.18 20:44:00 -
[38]
Dont Support, but know CCP will ignore us so we may as well bend over and take it...
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Redwolf
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Posted - 2004.05.18 21:47:00 -
[39]
DONT SUPPORT
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Thomdril Merrilin
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Posted - 2004.05.18 22:40:00 -
[40]
DONT SUPPORT.
IMMUNITY, lol wtf?!?!
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Sun Sliver
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Posted - 2004.05.19 03:54:00 -
[41]
dont support it
increased dmg resistance would be 1 thing but total immunity = bad idea.
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Worlocke
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Posted - 2004.05.19 06:10:00 -
[42]
Don't support it, don't care for it and somehow seems illogical that an NPC can somehow attain 100% immunity, yet it is impossible for a player to do the same in game and still run on infinite cap, missles, MWD , ammo and whatever else CCP is deciding to arm NPC's with this time around.
Just a plain old dumb idea no matter how you look at it.
"No beast so fierce knows but some touch of pity. But I know none and therefore am no beast." |
Scorpyn
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Posted - 2004.05.19 08:29:00 -
[43]
Edited by: Scorpyn on 19/05/2004 09:52:09
I support it and don't support it at the same time. No, that's not impossible. Keep reading :
I don't support it because it's silly. EVE is not some fantasy mmog, it's a scifi mmog. There is no such thing as 100% resistance unless you're warping (or using a mirror to reflect laser or something).
I partially support it if it's only on special spawns at NPC headquarters and similar, ie NOT in belts/gates. The reason why I support it in those places is because you know what you're up against in those occations. Also, it should be a time-limited 100% resistance so that there isn't 100% resistance all the time. The 100% resistance should also use cap a lot - something the NPC:s have an unlimited amount of thus the time limit proposal.
I hate to get offtopic, but I also don't like the fact that the mobile warp disruptors are impossible to defeat, no matter how many warp core stabs you use. This is basically the same thing.
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Taumenka
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Posted - 2004.05.20 11:20:00 -
[44]
Edited by: Taumenka on 21/05/2004 18:36:17
Support.
Strangly enough i think it's just egoistical thinking that just the escort frigats will be the ones with 100% immunity ever tried taking on a 95% EM res tanked BS? Why should this be any diffrent?
Isn't it just as with everything ? Just adapt ?
Drink StarsiÖ
Are you Caldari enough?
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ClawHammer III
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Posted - 2004.05.20 11:33:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Taumenka
Support.
Strangly enough i think it's just egoistical thinking that just the escort frigats will be the ones with 100% immunity ever tried taking on a 95% EM res tanked BS? Why should this be any diffrent?
There is a big difference between high resistance and outright immunity. The NPC elite frigs also have insanly high shield recharge. They can practicaly regenerate it in like 10 sec so I don't think they need damage immunitys as well.
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Jade Constantine
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Posted - 2004.05.20 13:38:00 -
[46]
Don't Support.
I think damage immunity is a terrible idea that is out of kilter with the game dynamics at the moment. % damage reduction for particular defenses is hard written into the system, and breaking that with flat immunities is awful, its god/divine level magic in AD&D or something.
Eve is a psuedo realistic space combat game, lets keep it that way.
JF Public Forum |
wamingo
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Posted - 2004.05.20 15:01:00 -
[47]
Don't Support.
reasons already mention several times.
-- I won't not promise to avoid refraining from harming you! .... What? |
london
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Posted - 2004.05.21 04:14:00 -
[48]
TERRIBLE idea CCP. 
And ive always been a fan...
london:jericho |
Bobby Wilson
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Posted - 2004.05.21 19:04:00 -
[49]
Don't support it.
I would support VARIED shield and armour resistances between ships, or even between races though. That would make loadouts ever more intersting and would avoid "one ship ganks all" uuber situations.
BW
Originally by: Selim
Cool, congrats.
Oh, stupid idea by the way.
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