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Kalintos Tyl
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Posted - 2008.07.26 15:16:00 -
[1]
Drake passive shield tank is way too powerfull 750dps tanked forever and 400 dps given. If only it got incresed dps and give 1 more medium slot and some cpu, i would call it best bs in game. Doomsday proof, recharges so fast.
Sollution is to narf passive recharging of shield. Remove 2 low slots add power grid and +1 med slot in order to effectivly fit shield booster, cap booster and heavy assault missiles.
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Dendo Ordoss
Personal Vendetta
Vendetta Alliance.
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Posted - 2008.07.26 15:21:00 -
[2]
best way would be to remove passive recharge all the way if u ask me.
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Dzajic
Federal Defence Union
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Posted - 2008.07.26 16:11:00 -
[3]
CCP tried something but ended nerfing BC shield recharge time only slightly. Just hit it with the nerf sledgehammer like you love so much CCP.
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Jeirth
Minmatar
Republic Military School
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Posted - 2008.07.26 17:23:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Jeirth on 26/07/2008 17:25:06
Okay drake, has a great SHIELD tank, if you use all the mids and most of the lows for it, and then really only if its got rigs too.
This means its not going to run around with web and scram or web and disruptor without nerfing its tank, something that doesnt happen to armour tankers.
This also means means the aggressor to the drake gets to dictate range and when to de-agress, drake isnt known for its handling or speediness is it.
Being a shield tank its got a great big hole in its resists right from the start.
PC's do a lot more damage than npc's and it only gets to use cruiser size weaponry.
No support
Edit: Oh and the drake is a battlecruiser not a battleship.
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Eternal Error
Exitus Acta Probant
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Posted - 2008.07.26 17:38:00 -
[5]
It's gotta use all its slots to do that. Yes, it is annoyingly hard to kill, but it can't do jack to the aggressor so it doesn't matter.
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Anaalys Fluuterby
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.07.26 18:16:00 -
[6]
Hint to the OP:
Ferox, Myrmi and Hurricane can all mount passive tanks almost as strong as the drake. And by almost as strong its within a couple of %.
Guess what? They can't kill anything either when setup that way......
-------------------------------------------------
 Originally by: CCP Wrangler
Not it isn't, people should be encouraged to get out in low sec space, but never forced to do so.
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Kazuma Saruwatari
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.07.26 18:43:00 -
[7]
What's a drake going to do with a super-passive tank setup? Nothing but blow spitwads at you.
Its the perfect bait-tank. In fact, it isnt a good bait-tank to begin with because everyone knows the Drake is going to be a tough nut to bust open to get to the pod, so why bother with it?
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Nexus Kinnon
SniggWaffe
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Posted - 2008.07.26 19:42:00 -
[8]
the drake is fine
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LetsDoThis
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Posted - 2008.07.26 20:07:00 -
[9]
Drake tank usually uses all midslots, lowslots, and rigslots.
I imagine if you did the same thing with other BC you'd have similar results. Like the prophecy.
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Kransthow
Victory Not Vengeance
Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2008.07.26 22:31:00 -
[10]
It's Balanced cos the drake can't do shit
My alt is "Is Forporn" |
Tobias Sjodin
Ore Mongers
Black Hand.
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Posted - 2008.07.27 02:42:00 -
[11]
Drake is fine.
Black Hand.
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Silence Duegood
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Posted - 2008.07.27 03:08:00 -
[12]
Drake is fine. The op, however, is not.
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Sir Substance
Minmatar
Sunspot Requisitions
Worlds End Consortium
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Posted - 2008.07.27 03:11:00 -
[13]
the drake is overrated. i tried it once. good tank, to be sure. but i could have done more damage to the enemy by getting out and widdling in their fuel tank. i don't know where you pulled 400DPS from.
Originally by: Ekrid
because trying to fit medium beam lasers is like trying to shove a cow in your mailbox. doable, but it gets messy.
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ranna sleeper
Dragon's Rage
Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2008.07.27 03:15:00 -
[14]
god go figure, a minmatar player who's so far cried about drakes, missile vs gunnery train times, and pretty much any other caldari aspect of the game... cry more little girl cry more.
oh noez guys, a drake that's not screwed over by a neut barrage, a ship that can actually halfway tank like a bs at the cost of dps output, oh noez that's op.
being someone who started caldari and went with minmatar later on, i can see the strength of the drake, but i can also see the weekness
-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*
(thanks to fragito for the sig)
please note my comments and thoughts are my own and |
Sir Substance
Minmatar
Sunspot Requisitions
Worlds End Consortium
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Posted - 2008.07.27 03:33:00 -
[15]
Originally by: ranna sleeper
god go figure, a minmatar player who's so far cried about drakes, missile vs gunnery train times, and pretty much any other caldari aspect of the game... cry more little girl cry more.
oh noez guys, a drake that's not screwed over by a neut barrage, a ship that can actually halfway tank like a bs at the cost of dps output, oh noez that's op.
being someone who started caldari and went with minmatar later on, i can see the strength of the drake, but i can also see the weekness
the scathingness is there, but you need to work on the delivery. your current method makes you look petulant ;)
Originally by: Ekrid
because trying to fit medium beam lasers is like trying to shove a cow in your mailbox. doable, but it gets messy.
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Lt Angus
Caldari
Lt Angus Corp
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Posted - 2008.07.27 04:31:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Sir Substance
the drake is overrated. i tried it once. good tank, to be sure. but i could have done more damage to the enemy by getting out and widdling in their fuel tank. i don't know where you pulled 400DPS from.
2 dmg mods and heavy missiles and drones is 450
600dps with HAMs and 3 dmg mods
Shhhh, Im hunting Badgers |
Tobias Sjodin
Ore Mongers
Black Hand.
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Posted - 2008.07.27 05:02:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Lt Angus
Originally by: Sir Substance
the drake is overrated. i tried it once. good tank, to be sure. but i could have done more damage to the enemy by getting out and widdling in their fuel tank. i don't know where you pulled 400DPS from.
2 dmg mods and heavy missiles and drones is 450
600dps with HAMs and 3 dmg mods
Show me a fitting with a tank that perma-sustains 750dps while doing 600dps and has the ability to stay in range to deal that dps and you have an argument. Otherwise, no.
Black Hand.
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Lt Angus
Caldari
Lt Angus Corp
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Posted - 2008.07.27 05:15:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Lt Angus on 27/07/2008 05:19:03
Edited by: Lt Angus on 27/07/2008 05:17:38
Edited by: Lt Angus on 27/07/2008 05:15:12
Originally by: Tobias Sjodin
Originally by: Lt Angus
Originally by: Sir Substance
the drake is overrated. i tried it once. good tank, to be sure. but i could have done more damage to the enemy by getting out and widdling in their fuel tank. i don't know where you pulled 400DPS from.
2 dmg mods and heavy missiles and drones is 450
600dps with HAMs and 3 dmg mods
Show me a fitting with a tank that perma-sustains 750dps while doing 600dps and has the ability to stay in range to deal that dps and you have an argument. Otherwise, no.
why would i want to perma sustain 750dps and i presented no argument appart from drake can and does do 450 dps
but since you bring it up,
1 dmg mod, 3 SPR II, 3 large extender IIs, 2 invuln 1 photon 7 hml II and 3 purger rigs tanks 750 while doing 400dps
of course useless and thats why the drake is ballenced
Shhhh, Im hunting Badgers |
GrandDad Trotter
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Posted - 2008.07.27 07:03:00 -
[19]
.
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Khamal Jolstien
Caldari
The Monkey Sanctuary
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Posted - 2008.07.27 07:06:00 -
[20]
Welcome to a few nerfs ago. Ever try and do DPS in a passive tank drake? It's just like ubertanking a dominix, only not as dangerous.
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Valuv
NightHawk Phantom Fleet
The Threshold
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Posted - 2008.07.27 14:18:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Valuv on 27/07/2008 14:24:17
Originally by: Kalintos Tyl
Drake passive shield tank is way too powerfull 750dps tanked forever and 400 dps given. If only it got incresed dps and give 1 more medium slot and some cpu, i would call it best bs in game. Doomsday proof, recharges so fast.
Sollution is to narf passive recharging of shield. Remove 2 low slots add power grid and +1 med slot in order to effectivly fit shield booster, cap booster and heavy assault missiles.
You are full of fail.
Show me a 750DPS tank passive drake with 400DPS. If you happen to post a setup, please dont show me setups without mwd or only tanking highest inherent shield resists and ignoring others.
Drake is fine.
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ZhouXi
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Posted - 2008.07.27 18:18:00 -
[22]
Wow, this post must have ignored every other post in existence about how terrible passive tanking is for pvp.
A Drake that is using a full-out passive tank has the following problems that balance it by making it embarrassing to bring to pvp:
A) It moves as slow and handles as well as some type of space snail, because all of its lows are filled with SPRs and possibly a BCU if they are willing to skimp on the tank, allowing enemies to fly circles around it. (Rig slots are also devoted to tanking.)
B) It is completely unable to stop enemies from warping away from it, web them, disrupt their tracking, jam them, or do anything else remotely useful, because it has devoted all of its mid slots to tanking. This means any enemy can freely disengage, while the drake pilot cries and wonders why he stinks at pvp.
c) It is so crappy, in fact, that it usually SURVIVES fleet pvp, because the enemy fleet commander knows that it has no means of hindering their fleet in any way, and its dps is relatively mediocre due to using low slots for tanking. Who calls a drake primary if it is obviously using a passive tanking setup? Might as well kill the useful ships first!
D) I'm sure there are many other facets I am overlooking about how this is completely balanced, as a passive setup basically makes a ship worthless in pvp, except as bait which was previously mentioned.
I vote not to 'narf' it.
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Shadowsword
COLSUP
Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2008.07.27 18:30:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Kalintos Tyl
Drake passive shield tank is way too powerfull 750dps tanked forever and 400 dps given. If only it got incresed dps and give 1 more medium slot and some cpu, i would call it best bs in game. Doomsday proof, recharges so fast.
Sollution is to narf passive recharging of shield. Remove 2 low slots add power grid and +1 med slot in order to effectivly fit shield booster, cap booster and heavy assault missiles.
You're grossly exagerating. Either you passive tank 750 dps, or you do 400 dps, but you don't do both at the same time. Unless you have a drake with 7 low slots?
What need a nerf is Large Shield Extenders. Something like 350 pg (to be reduced to 262.5 pg with skills), and sig radius penalty replaced by a speed penalty, would do the trick.
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Mr Friendly
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Posted - 2008.07.27 19:34:00 -
[24]
I was flying around in my passive shield tanked exploration-Drake the other day and got jumped by 3 guys. I almost got a Deimos kill, but he warped off... I almost got a Jag kill, but he warped off. Meanwhile, I couldn't kill the Myrm who had me locked down as my dps is awful in a passive set up... the Deimos pilot came back in an Ishtar and killed me with Praetors (lol).
The most I could do was harass them and make it expensive to kill me by shooting their t2 drones (which is what I did). I couldn't kill them or get away. They could and did kill me.
The Drake is fine as is. Obviously the problem is YOU. Learn to play Eve.
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Junkie Beverage
GoonFleet
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2008.07.27 19:41:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Nexus Kinnon
the drake is fine
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Marlona Sky
D00M.
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.07.27 19:42:00 -
[26]
They should nerf the shield recharge time again. Compared to other T3 battlecruisers the Drake by far is way overpowered. Its passive shield tank is way overpowerd.
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ZhouXi
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Posted - 2008.07.27 21:05:00 -
[27]
Originally by: Marlona Sky
They should nerf the shield recharge time again. Compared to other T3 battlecruisers the Drake by far is way overpowered. Its passive shield tank is way overpowerd.
Overpowered for what? PVE?
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James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2008.07.27 21:58:00 -
[28]
A passive tanked drake is essentially worthless in PvP, which is the only place that 'balance' actually matters.
Oh, and a Myrm can actually run a better passive tank. And do more DPS.
--
Crane needs more grid
249km locking? |
Jim Raynor
Caldari
Shinra
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Posted - 2008.07.28 07:02:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Kalintos Tyl
Drake passive shield tank is way too powerfull 750dps tanked forever and 400 dps given. If only it got incresed dps and give 1 more medium slot and some cpu, i would call it best bs in game. Doomsday proof, recharges so fast.
Sollution is to narf passive recharging of shield. Remove 2 low slots add power grid and +1 med slot in order to effectivly fit shield booster, cap booster and heavy assault missiles.
narf.
thumbs down.
there's only 2 types of drake setups and one is worthless for pvp
you just called for its narfing.
narf
drakes fine when fitted for actual pvp, uber passive drakes are just drakes that are hard to kill, they have no firepower and couldn't blast a whole through a wet paper bag so, who cares? uber bait ship? maybe, but i don't think uber bait ships do much to upset the pvp balance in eve.
narf
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I'll make a sig later. |
J'Mkarr Soban
Amarr
Proxenetae Invicti
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Posted - 2008.07.28 07:52:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Kalintos Tyl
Drake passive shield tank is way too powerfull 750dps tanked forever OR 400 dps given.
Note the change there. Or.
Not supported. Seems perfectly balanced to me.
--
These are my personal views and in no way represent the views of Proxenetae Invicti, which maintains a neutral stance stemming from the strong ethics demanded of its work. |
Kalintos Tyl
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.07.28 08:02:00 -
[31]
Edited by: Kalintos Tyl on 28/07/2008 08:08:03
Originally by: J'Mkarr Soban
Originally by: Kalintos Tyl
Drake passive shield tank is way too powerfull 750dps tanked forever AND 400 dps given.
Note the change there. Or.
Not supported. Seems perfectly balanced to me.
i forgot that noobs dont know about heat
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destinationZERO
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Posted - 2008.07.28 08:07:00 -
[32]
nurf it.
and the myrmidon (again) while youre at it, it can passive shield tank even better than the drake.
you know what, just make all ships in eve the same, so that fkin noobs can play.
op : die
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Kalintos Tyl
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.07.28 08:08:00 -
[33]
ow i made wrong staempent with forever :D
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Bad Borris
20th Legion
Digital Renegades
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Posted - 2008.07.28 11:04:00 -
[34]
Nobody who flys a decently fitted drake will give a crap if u nerf passive tanking or not.
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Shadowsword
COLSUP
Tau Ceti Federation
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Posted - 2008.07.28 11:26:00 -
[35]
Drakes are useless without at least MWD and disruptor and one or two BCS. How big of a passive tank does that leave? Nothing overpowered, imho.
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Kebabski
coracao ardente
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.07.28 11:53:00 -
[36]
Just lolling at all the bears shitting their pants coz they might have their ratting boat nerfed
'Peachy Lil Babe'
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Dana Serenity
Caldari
Guerillaz
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Posted - 2008.07.28 11:56:00 -
[37]
Not supported!
Yes the drake has an amazing tank but it does nothing else.. Its not a damage dealer (400dps... yeah with all level V skills, drones and implants and gang bonuses but only with heavy assault missiles... gl getting that into range of your target without the mwd cause you fitted your passive tank or aint got the capacitor to run it) leave the drake alone... its fine!!!
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MirrorGod
Heretic Militia
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Posted - 2008.07.28 15:12:00 -
[38]
Edited by: MirrorGod on 28/07/2008 15:12:59
Passive Drakes are horrible. Very strong and without cap, one of the best tanks in the game. They contribute nothing to the fleet, usually not so much as a point, and my destroyer can muster more DPS. They're obnoxious and I cringe when I see them.
But I'm not supporting this thread. I'm not supporting it because it's valid. Because like a nano-pilot dishing out 4 bil for a snake set, the drake pays for his tank. It sacrifices it's mids, that would go to tackle and a speed mod, and lows that would go to damage mod. Then it drops over 40 mil into it's rig slots. When it finally gets locked down, it dies, becuse it has little in the way of escape if it doesn't bring ECM drones.
No reason to whine about it, now lets hope the good karma comes around and one drake pilot looks at the sitution that any race of BS -can- be a nanokiller with the right skills, and that there's no reason to whine because when you finally do get that vaga popped and his pod, he's out 7 bil and you scoop 200mil+ worth of loot from that wreck.
STOP WHINING, POST LESS!
Save Small Gang Warfare |
James Lyrus
Lyrus Associates
The Star Fraction
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Posted - 2008.07.28 16:14:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Kebabski
Just lolling at all the bears shitting their pants coz they might have their ratting boat nerfed
Hey, I use my Drake as a PvP ship. There's not a _long_ list of good Caldari solo ships, but the Drake's on there.
--
Crane needs more grid
249km locking? |
procurement specialist
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Posted - 2008.07.28 16:36:00 -
[40]
passive shield tank a domi. it does pretty damn well too. all those low slots. Better than a raven which i find funny.
no support. The price is extreme to tank that much in pvp.
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General Spaz
Minmatar
Minmatar Mafia
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Posted - 2008.07.28 17:07:00 -
[41]
Ok, ill bite...
firstly the OP is an obvious troll.
The Drake is fine, like all Passive shield tankers, it has no speed, DPS, or tackle. ALSO, 750 DPS sustainable with no cap? I beg to see your fit. If using active hardners... maybe, but passive hardners don't cut it, unless you're talking officer or pithi.
Ever neuted a drake and shut it's resists off? They die... fast.
OP, you obviously don't know how to play Minmatar. Name a Drake fitting, and i'll show you a Cane that can smoke it 1v1.
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Ryoji Tanakama
Caldari
Firestar Drive Yards
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Posted - 2008.07.28 18:37:00 -
[42]
Yes a full passive tanked drake has a defense of 750+ hp per second, and an effective HP of 83,000+...
It also has a dps of approximately 200... not 400... 200. With a full rack of heavy launcher 2s (not HALs as they need too much PG and not enough range for you to ever hit anything). So 7 t2 launchers filled with the tech 1 ammo of your choice, no damage mods, maxed skills - achieves approximately 200 dps.
This is so overpowered.
/facepalm
/wrists
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Marcus Gideon
Gallente
Excessive Force
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Posted - 2008.07.28 19:05:00 -
[43]
Just my 0.02 ISK here...
When I started looking into a Myrm for missions, Battleclinic's highest rated build was a passive shield tank too.
I considered it... for about 1.5 seconds, before I changed my mind and closed the window.
There is NO WAY you can call a build like those "useful". When every single Mid, Low, and Rig slot is filled with shield buffs. Sure... your shields are awesome, and you have plenty of power for whatever guns you fit.
BUT... Warp Scrambler + Webber + Nos/Neut = You sitting in place while I find out how long before your uber leet shields finally do fail.
---
Don't take my ranting personally. I may just be arguing the topic, unless you're saying something stupid, and then I mean every word.
"Players don't want Variety. They want THE BEST" |
General Spaz
Minmatar
Minmatar Mafia
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Posted - 2008.07.28 21:15:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Ryoji Tanakama
Yes a full passive tanked drake has a defense of 750+ hp per second, and an effective HP of 83,000+...
I realize that agree the Drake is not overpowered, but I must ask...
what damagetype is that 750+ against? Also, how are you fitting that? T2? Faction? In gang with maxxed Vulture pilot? I've fit plenty of Drakes and that seems a little much for anything more than a fairy-tale full passive fit, I can easily see that with active hardeners.
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Tobias Sjodin
Ore Mongers
Black Hand.
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Posted - 2008.08.04 03:44:00 -
[45]
"perma-sustains 750dps while doing 600dps and has the ability to stay in range to deal that dps "
Originally by: Lt Angus
but since you bring it up,
1 dmg mod, 3 SPR II, 3 large extender IIs, 2 invuln 1 photon 7 hml II and 3 purger rigs tanks 750 while doing 400dps
1 small neut kills you, you have no speed so you can't stay in range, and you're dead without support. I'd call that a useless sitting duck of a ship.
Black Hand.
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Dav Varan
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Posted - 2008.08.04 12:23:00 -
[46]
Not supported
Drake has already recived a nerf in the tank department and has the weakest firepower of all the BC.
Personally I think the Drake deserves a firepower increase that it did not revieve last time it was nerfed , 8th launcher slot gets my vote.
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Cyberus
Caldari
Dissident Aggressors
Mordus Angels
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Posted - 2008.08.04 12:50:00 -
[47]
Only ppl who do not fly drakes complaine about them, simply because they dont know how it is to fly drake. Yes it awesome tanker if it fitted for killing NPC's in belts. You complaine about ships what you was after in belts probebly in your nano vaga and was not able to kill it.
Now i ask you something:
If it so powerfull ship was it able to kill you?
I guess i know the answere tbh...
[/url] |
Malcanis
We are Legend
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Posted - 2008.08.04 15:24:00 -
[48]
Originally by: Kalintos Tyl
Drake passive shield tank is way too powerfull 750dps tanked forever and 400 dps given. If only it got incresed dps and give 1 more medium slot and some cpu, i would call it best bs in game. Doomsday proof, recharges so fast.
Sollution is to narf passive recharging of shield. Remove 2 low slots add power grid and +1 med slot in order to effectivly fit shield booster, cap booster and heavy assault missiles.
Myrmidon can passive-tank better than the drake. And do more damage.
CONCORD provide consequences, not safety; only you can do that. |
Grainjer
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Posted - 2008.08.04 15:43:00 -
[49]
Do not agree. Drake currently well balanced.
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Matrixcvd
Caldari
Rionnag Alba
Triumvirate.
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Posted - 2008.08.04 15:45:00 -
[50]
why god wont people just shut up. drake is fine, all its got is tank its useless otherwise... they die just fine, train up your freakin skillz and they go boom. usuck c/d?
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darkmancer
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Posted - 2008.08.04 17:03:00 -
[51]
Yes the drakes tank is far to good.
We demand the shield resist bonus be turn into a ROF bonus this instant!!! - Yarr
---------------------------------
There's a simple solution to every problem. It is always invariably wrong |
Aiko Intaki
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Posted - 2008.08.04 17:31:00 -
[52]
Drake is fine as is, as others have mentioned.
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