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New Warp Scrambler is too much.

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Marcus Druallis Quantum Industries RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2008.08.07 20:44:00 - [1] Really. While I dislike the nerf in general, I'm not here to discuss anything besides the newly proposed warp scramblers. Bluntly, they are getting way too much of a buff. To be able to point a ship (with two points especially) and be able to shut its mwd off is just overpowered. Where two slots used to be needed, now you only need one. That is a bit rediculous and imo should be looked at a little harder when looking over the patch before it is deployed. --
Arvald Caldari Ninjas N Pirates Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2008.08.07 20:46:00 - [2] Originally by: Marcus Druallis Really. While I dislike the nerf in general, I'm not here to discuss anything besides the newly proposed warp scramblers. Bluntly, they are getting way too much of a buff. To be able to point a ship (with two points especially) and be able to shut its mwd off is just overpowered. Where two slots used to be needed, now you only need one. That is a bit rediculous and imo should be looked at a little harder when looking over the patch before it is deployed. no, no its not because in order to use it you have to be well inweb range and by that time you should have the mwd off anyways (ether that or the other person is faster than you in which case you would be screwed anyways
Shadowsword COLSUP Tau Ceti Federation	Posted - 2008.08.07 20:46:00 - [3] You're looking at it with current parameters (everyone and his dog fitting MWD). If, say, half the pvp ships you tackle don't have a MWD fitted, does this module still sound ridiculous? a standard disruptor might be more usefull overall... ------------------------------------------
Elhina Novae Amarr Destruction Reborn CORPVS DELICTI	Posted - 2008.08.07 20:59:00 - [4] Yeah T2 Scrammer is 9km overpowered for sure. Webs are at 10km, now if you wanna mwd did you go into webrange before? No. Nothing will change ------------ Somebody set up us the bomb
Marcus Druallis Quantum Industries RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2008.08.07 21:04:00 - [5] Originally by: Elhina Novae Yeah T2 Scrammer is 9km overpowered for sure. Webs are at 10km, now if you wanna mwd did you go into webrange before? No. Nothing will change I didn't know webs pointed you? --
Arvald Caldari Ninjas N Pirates Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2008.08.07 21:05:00 - [6] Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Elhina Novae Yeah T2 Scrammer is 9km overpowered for sure. Webs are at 10km, now if you wanna mwd did you go into webrange before? No. Nothing will change I didn't know webs pointed you? you sir, fail and need to stop posting for the good of the forums and possibly humanity itself
Marcus Druallis Quantum Industries RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2008.08.07 21:10:00 - [7] Originally by: Arvald Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Elhina Novae Yeah T2 Scrammer is 9km overpowered for sure. Webs are at 10km, now if you wanna mwd did you go into webrange before? No. Nothing will change I didn't know webs pointed you? you sir, fail and need to stop posting for the good of the forums and possibly humanity itself Sarcasm detector off there bud? --
Arvald Caldari Ninjas N Pirates Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2008.08.07 21:11:00 - [8] Edited by: Arvald on 07/08/2008 21:11:57 Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Arvald Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Elhina Novae Yeah T2 Scrammer is 9km overpowered for sure. Webs are at 10km, now if you wanna mwd did you go into webrange before? No. Nothing will change I didn't know webs pointed you? you sir, fail and need to stop posting for the good of the forums and possibly humanity itself Sarcasm detector off there bud? never been one for sarcasm, i prefer to just come out and say it, and also yes i do relize you are being sarcastic and i ment every word of what i just said
Boz Well Minmatar	Posted - 2008.08.07 21:12:00 - [9] Originally by: Arvald Edited by: Arvald on 07/08/2008 21:11:57 Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Arvald Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Elhina Novae Yeah T2 Scrammer is 9km overpowered for sure. Webs are at 10km, now if you wanna mwd did you go into webrange before? No. Nothing will change I didn't know webs pointed you? you sir, fail and need to stop posting for the good of the forums and possibly humanity itself Sarcasm detector off there bud? never been one for sarcasm, i prefer to just come out and say it, and also yes i do relize you are being sarcastic and i ment every word of what i just said The tortoise has spoken. /thread
Atsuko Ratu Caldari VSP Corp.	Posted - 2008.08.07 21:13:00 - [10] Any ship that cares enough to not enter web range would also, ironically, not enter scramble range, effectively eliminating whine. Any ship that wanted to enter web range probably doesn't care if you turn off his MWD. Because, frankly, mwd-turn off has a much less of an impact than today's webs do.
Arvald Caldari Ninjas N Pirates Pirate Coalition	Posted - 2008.08.07 21:13:00 - [11] Originally by: Boz Well Originally by: Arvald Edited by: Arvald on 07/08/2008 21:11:57 Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Arvald Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Elhina Novae Yeah T2 Scrammer is 9km overpowered for sure. Webs are at 10km, now if you wanna mwd did you go into webrange before? No. Nothing will change I didn't know webs pointed you? you sir, fail and need to stop posting for the good of the forums and possibly humanity itself Sarcasm detector off there bud? never been one for sarcasm, i prefer to just come out and say it, and also yes i do relize you are being sarcastic and i ment every word of what i just said The tortoise has spoken. /thread ALL HAIL THE ANGRY TURTLE
Erocitnom	Posted - 2008.08.08 00:00:00 - [12] Edited by: Erocitnom on 08/08/2008 00:00:47 i agree with the op the tackle factor of the mod should be removed or their cap/fitting increased. with gate camps rampant all over in 0.0 mwd will still be needed if not still a necessity. if not its going t kill the interceptor/interdictor classes where doing flybys withing web range to drop bubble or web are part of the game.
Xtreem Gallente Knockaround Guys Inc. Exxxotic	Posted - 2008.08.08 00:30:00 - [13] although with this fitted on an arazu with a rapier buddie, a ship aint gonna go anywhere fast hehe :D fyi i like the change, just pointing out the arazu might be useful again since the damp nerf
BABARR PARABELUM-Project	Posted - 2008.08.08 00:43:00 - [14] Yes the scramble who "cut" the MWD is a bit a joke, i really wonder what is the utility. CCP say it's for tackle the "nano" but it's going to be used mainly for cut the MWD of a big ship whith smaller one (like AS, who are going to fit only a AB and a warp scrambler and no web, and a TD in the 3thrd slot) It's CCP powa, or how create new disbalance when balancing :) ... "Si vis pacem, parabellum"
Bast's Cleric Amarr 24th Imperial Reserves	Posted - 2008.08.08 01:20:00 - [15] Actually it makes sense to me. A Microwarp Drive acts to generate a Small Limited Warp Field around your ship. A Warp Scrambler acts to disrupt any engines that produce a Warp field around your ship. Logic works fine for me. I laugh at all the Mintards that depend on their speed rather than having to learn how to tank whining and *****ing about actually having to learn how to fight rather than run away. -
Cpt Branko Surge. NIght's Dawn	Posted - 2008.08.08 01:24:00 - [16] What new warp scramblers affect is the balance of smaller and bigger turret ships, which really was out of whack, really. Being able to kill webbed frigates with a BS using turrets only was quite broken. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Denuo Secus	Posted - 2008.08.08 01:51:00 - [17] Edited by: Denuo Secus on 08/08/2008 01:55:08 Originally by: BABARR Edited by: BABARR on 08/08/2008 00:47:57 Edited by: BABARR on 08/08/2008 00:46:18 Yes the scramble who "cut" the MWD is a bit a joke, i really wonder what is the utility. CCP say it's for tackle the "nano" but it's going to be used mainly for cut the MWD of a big ship whith smaller one (like AS, who are going to fit only a AB and a warp scrambler and no web, and a TD in the 3thrd slot) It's CCP powa, or how create new disbalance when balancing :), or how to kill a module like the MWD instead just nerf a bit it.(i think only 500% speed boost and the new basespeed of cruiser/BC/BC it's already enought for the nerf). Or how to create more and more blob (cause now you must have ship whith 12 med slot if you want have defence against TD, ECM, web, damp, and be able to tackle corectly) Meh...it's not just a nerf. It's kinda paradigm shift in tactics. Especially for smaller ships. Not just web + scram + dead. And "mandatory" MWDs... Because of the weaker web (a very good thing imo) there is a demand for another speed breaking / holding down module -> the new scram. But there are ways to avoid it -> the new old AB. Which again is not perfect in every situation, but also MWDs are more attractive now -> less cap penalty. This change will bring much more diversity into the game imo. Which means fun.
Elhina Novae Amarr Destruction Reborn CORPVS DELICTI	Posted - 2008.08.08 02:43:00 - [18] Originally by: Arvald Originally by: Boz Well Originally by: Arvald Edited by: Arvald on 07/08/2008 21:11:57 Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Arvald Originally by: Marcus Druallis Originally by: Elhina Novae Yeah T2 Scrammer is 9km overpowered for sure. Webs are at 10km, now if you wanna mwd did you go into webrange before? No. Nothing will change I didn't know webs pointed you? you sir, fail and need to stop posting for the good of the forums and possibly humanity itself Sarcasm detector off there bud? never been one for sarcasm, i prefer to just come out and say it, and also yes i do relize you are being sarcastic and i ment every word of what i just said The tortoise has spoken. /thread ALL HAIL THE ANGRY TURTLE Pyramid ftw. And ofcourse web doesn't point sigh, but if you are running a mwd you don't go into web range anyways. Web 10km = your speed is dead Scram 9km (next layer) = shuts down your mwd If i need to explain it further I don't know really... ------------ Somebody set up us the bomb
Adaline Gray	Posted - 2008.08.08 02:52:00 - [19] I would agree that new 2 point scram is too much. Make an all new module which shuts off the MWD.
Elhina Novae Amarr Destruction Reborn CORPVS DELICTI	Posted - 2008.08.08 03:25:00 - [20] Originally by: Adaline Gray I would agree that new 2 point scram is too much. Make an all new module which shuts off the MWD. To get in scram range you still need to be in webrange... And no arguments like overloading and faction scrammers wont work, because then i will counter with overload/faction web :) but sure have fun flying your mwd fit inside web range ------------ Somebody set up us the bomb
Aleus Stygian	Posted - 2008.08.08 03:39:00 - [21] Originally by: Shadowsword You're looking at it with current parameters (everyone and his dog fitting MWD). If, say, half the pvp ships you tackle don't have a MWD fitted, does this module still sound ridiculous? a standard disruptor might be more usefull overall... Truthism. I say, down with the MWDs!
Boz Well Minmatar	Posted - 2008.08.08 03:44:00 - [22] Originally by: Adaline Gray I would agree that new 2 point scram is too much. Make an all new module which shuts off the MWD. Script it. There's no justification for CCP to make other things scripted because they were 'too powerful', then create a 2 point + effective web module, heh, even if it's short range. Just make pilots choose either noMWD or double point, and I'd be happier with it.
Atsuko Ratu Caldari VSP Corp.	Posted - 2008.08.08 03:50:00 - [23] Have yet to hear a decent complaint
Maijugs Arhueg	Posted - 2008.08.08 07:41:00 - [24] Imho, adapt or die. I foresee setups using both MWD and an AB.
Waxau Unus - Vir Exercitus	Posted - 2008.08.08 07:44:00 - [25] Im against a variety of the new CCP changes. However, i personally like this change. The WORST case scenario, is that of an Arazu, with a 120mil warp scrambler on, having a range of about 25km. That is NOTHING to fear, when a rapier can web you at 40km. Or a curse can suck you dry in one cycle, from 40km. Heck, if you're in scramble range, then you're (as others have said) in web range. Currently, that means death. So the only difference here is 1. They need two mods to lock you down (nano boost, with webs being nerfed) and 2. It boosts Afterburners in terms of popularity, thus creating variation - Which is what Eve is all about.
RayBanJockey	Posted - 2008.08.08 07:48:00 - [26] Originally by: Maijugs Arhueg I foresee setups using both MWD and an AB. Last time I checked you could not fit both to your ship (even if one was offline). Have they changed that? And the scrambler disabling MWD's, that's a really really big change in how close combat will be conducted and how we'll choose to set our mids up in the future. Big change. I sort of like it I think.
Waxau Unus - Vir Exercitus	Posted - 2008.08.08 07:51:00 - [27] Originally by: RayBanJockey Originally by: Maijugs Arhueg I foresee setups using both MWD and an AB. Last time I checked you could not fit both to your ship (even if one was offline). Have they changed that? And the scrambler disabling MWD's, that's a really really big change in how close combat will be conducted and how we'll choose to set our mids up in the future. Big change. I sort of like it I think. You have always been able to fit both iirc (and ive been playing since 2003, when you could dual-mwd) As for it changing combat....How do you see that? The ranges combat is fought at will stay the same. The tactics will stay the same near enough. The only variation, will be two mods to lock down any speedy sods, rather than..oh wait.....you need two atm anyhow!
RayBanJockey	Posted - 2008.08.08 08:19:00 - [28] Edited by: RayBanJockey on 08/08/2008 08:20:57 Originally by: Waxau As for it changing combat....How do you see that? Well as I see it there's lots of things that change, maybe mostly in 1v1 scenarios (which is my game mostly). People will use AB a lot more now that an MWD _will_ be shut down within scramble range. Massive implications just there - you only need an AB and scrambler, and never a webber - if the other ship has a MWD he's shut down, if he has an AB they are equal (sort of). The possible extra mid slot will open up a LOT of new possibilities, not just to caldari ships or people who like shield tanking - every single ship who used to have a webber has to think twice now and maybe put something more useful in there. This is of course assuming you can't fit both an MWD and AB at once, at least not have them online simultaneously. Actually even if you can have both you will never benefit from it generally speaking, as you can use only one at a time - use MWD and you're shut down, use AB and the other guy is as fast as you anyway.... unless he's flying a minmatar ship?.. (minmatar buff ) All theorycraft of course, I haven't even been on sisi yet ^^ edit Obviously I'm not saying you wont be usign webs anymore, there's lots of times you need to get the target not just down to your own speed but to an actual stand still (camps etc)
Viryana Deep Core Mining Inc.	Posted - 2008.08.08 08:23:00 - [29] Edited by: Viryana on 08/08/2008 08:25:32 Well if EFT is anything to go by you can have both fitted, but not activated. edit At work, so I can't check in game :(
P'uck	Posted - 2008.08.08 08:25:00 - [30] at least make it scripted ffs. a shitty sensorbooster needs a script these days, but a two point scram that shuts off mwd doesnt? come on....

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