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Ranshe
Blackwater Company
26
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Posted - 2012.03.26 10:46:00 -
[151] - Quote
Markius TheShed wrote:Ranshe wrote:
Oh, one extra thing though - all that talk about losing access to your ships in Arzad or wherever you Gallente/Caldari folks are located, doesn't take one thing into account - these systems (well at least Arzad, don't know nothing about Gal/Cal systems) are already under your occupancy in addition to you just basing there.
What makes you think CCP will reset the sov/occupancy state? Because if they don't, Arzad gets Minmatar sov and your ships are still accessible just as they are now.
The thing people are worried about is ATM you can flip a system in 7 hours, So you can go to bed and the next morning your system has been captured and your locked out of all your assets if the station plans go through.
Which, if you read the notes fully, would be countered by the bunker/ihub having a reinforcement timer of some kind. It works pretty well for POCOs. I'm not sure why all of you guys ommit this little, but very important detail.
Quote:
From our alliances RP perspective I like the idea of the Minmatar capturing Amarr systems fully but it's no good making it harder and harder for the Amarr to strike back as that will lead to fewer of them for us to shoot.
This is what it's all about, capturing space. I don't believe it will be harder and harder for Amarr to strike back though. We just have to notice then, that 90% of Metropolis is pretty much undefended since all of you slaves are busy in Bleak Lands. FW space isn't just the 10 systems around Auga.
Quote:For the minute the only thing I fully agree on is Zero2respects Idea to Nerf mission LP and pay LP for plexing and kills with a split of the LP per ship involved in the kill to encourage more solo fights.
It's only a rainbow colored bandaid for this little bruise the fight club has. It's not something that would make the FW mean anything. |
Markius TheShed
Murientor Tribe
Defiant Legacy
21
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 11:40:00 -
[152] - Quote
Ranshe wrote: This is what it's all about, capturing space. I don't believe it will be harder and harder for Amarr to strike back though. We just have to notice then, that 90% of Metropolis is pretty much undefended since all of you slaves are busy in Bleak Lands. FW space isn't just the 10 systems around Auga.
How's it going for you now?
You have 1 of our systems and we have 6 of yours, One of your main plexers went to Intaki after repeatedly failing to capture Arzad and hold it.
We look a 40 man fleet over to Intaki on saturday and helped resecured Intaki and Agoze, So Amarr attention was switched to the Taff triangle, Amarr negotiated mutual blue with pirate alliance SILENT but even with their help were still defeated by a Minmatar fleet that had no reships or assets in the area.
If the changes were brought in today and we retained all our captured 6 systems I think you would really struggle to compete, Which means less fights for us.
Give us more incentives to shoot each other not less. |
Ranshe
Blackwater Company
26
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 11:47:00 -
[153] - Quote
I just love how you responded only to the one sentence of my post. That's some awesome forum warrioring skill right there. How about answering the rest of the sentences? I'm pretty sure I wrote more than that one.
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Volturius Maximus-Fur
Pro Synergy
ACE WRECKING COMPANY
2
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Posted - 2012.03.26 12:03:00 -
[154] - Quote
@ Hans: It sounded quite set in stone, in the TenTonHammer interview with Soundwave. None of this effects me, but Ranshee has hit the nail on the head, it is very surprising to see folks like yourself having so much hate on for this, it doesn't make a lot of sense.
Markius TheShed wrote:...defeated by a Minmatar fleet that had no reships or assets in the area.
Seems one doesn't need access to those stations to project force afterall, do they?
Markius TheShed wrote:If the changes were brought in today and we retained all our captured 6 systems I think you would really struggle to compete, Which means less fights for us.
From the sounds of it, I'd say at least they'd try to compete, instead of just rage quitting FW like the lot of you seem to think everyone is going to do. |
Anja Talis
Mimidae Risk Solutions
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 12:11:00 -
[155] - Quote
Ranshe wrote:It amazes me that the people speaking for these changes are the ones that are *not* in the militia currently, and that most of the FW people here, including - which was rather surprising to me - "our" CSM member, would rather have a fight club than a meaningful war.
FW should not be a fight club, it's supposed to be a war between empires. It deteriorated into this kind of fight clubbish thing not so unlike RvB because it had no consequences whatsoever with the occupancy being pretty meaningless apart from satisfaction and getting fights. It was all it was good for.
Now CCP wants this conflict to have real, meaningful consequences (and of course there's nothing "positive" about them and neither should there be, because tell me why losing a system in a war should have any "positive" consequences to you?) and suddenly all the people that got used to the fight club are rebelling against it.
It's just amazing.
Just look at the numbers involved.
Hans did an awesome job in his running for CSM. He canvassed well, united the militias, got everyone fired up in FW (and a bunch of low and high sec dwellers too) to vote for him with one of his principle concepts being around FW.
However, he only got 2,439 votes. I think we can be reasonably confident that a good percentage of the FW guys who care around FW united behind him and voted. I think it's fair to assume that a good chunk of these votes will be multiple accounts as well.
I'm totally not knocking Hans or his effort. He did a great job and well done for getting where he did, and I think we can be fairly comfortable of a high turn out from the FW pilots.
2,439 is not a lot of players out the 40,000 concurrent online players at peak out on TQ. FW in its current state is not generating anywhere near enough interest from the player base.
CCP had promised to invest some development time in FW. They need to be mixing it up to attract q lot more players to make it worthwhile. Tweaking what is there to make the current pilots happy isn't going to solve that. THey need to make it exciting and interesting. Basically making it like living in low sec with special plexes and aggression rules isn't going to improve that.
You guys should try and grab this with both hands, work with them to try and get FW into something amazing, but at the same time keep it fun for the small gang kill-fest it currently is. This isn't about small tweaks anymore really.
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Anja Talis
Mimidae Risk Solutions
64
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 12:14:00 -
[156] - Quote
Volturius Maximus-Fur wrote:Markius TheShed wrote:If the changes were brought in today and we retained all our captured 6 systems I think you would really struggle to compete, Which means less fights for us. From the sounds of it, I'd say at least they'd try to compete, instead of just rage quitting FW like the lot of you seem to think everyone is going to do.
I think what is important and being highlighted here is that players will need some sort of incentives on the losing side to prevent all out collapse. Perhaps payout rewards are higher for players on the losing side, showing that their small victories are worth so much more? |
Volturius Maximus-Fur
Pro Synergy
ACE WRECKING COMPANY
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 12:29:00 -
[157] - Quote
Can someone please explain to me what these so-called incentives are that you must somehow be losing as a result of this change? It seems to me that theres LP farming? Good fights?
So recapturing a system and fighting people like you have to deny the enemy access to its assets/agents, or to give yourself access to its assets/agents isn't an incentive?
Killing eachother to gain LPs and to get good fights isn't an incentive? Show me one other form of PVP in EVE where you get rewarded in this way. I'd say you've been handed a pretty fat and juicy carrot there if you gain LP's for going out and doing something you already do - that up until this suggested change, had no other reward besides a killmail and bragging rights.
I'm lost, and am looking forward to someone shedding some light here. |
Damar Rocarion
Nasranite Watch
Caldari State Capturing
156
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 12:46:00 -
[158] - Quote
Markius TheShed wrote:We look a 40 man fleet over to Intaki on saturday and helped resecured Intaki and Agoze.
Lots of caldari militia were away on fanfest or weekend fun, you had 80 guys vs 8-10 defenders in 5 different adjancent system for hours at your prime time and usual "Plexing sucks" froggies pushing hours over their usual sleeping patterns and you took two systems. And Intaki only barely as bunker fell two minutes before it would have become invulnerable when you cynoed in dreads and borrowed them to froggies.
In light of how mechanics work with system occupancy these days, I would not really brag that as great achievement.
But that just highlights the problem of system ping-pong. Intaki is a system where Caldari actively live and reside but it can still be taken during one cycle of natural sleep. |
Damar Rocarion
Nasranite Watch
Caldari State Capturing
156
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 12:57:00 -
[159] - Quote
Anja Talis wrote:I think what is important and being highlighted here is that players will need some sort of incentives on the losing side to prevent all out collapse. Perhaps payout rewards are higher for players on the losing side, showing that their small victories are worth so much more?
Why? Wasn't that CCP talker member of gallente miltiia so he just wants to make sure Caldari (And Amarr now with inclusion of all matar lolplayers) will bleed away the numbers so his side can farm isk at their leisure. It would be detrimental to CCP's objectives to have members in those two militias.
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The Snowman
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
44
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 13:00:00 -
[160] - Quote
Volturius Maximus-Fur wrote:I'm lost, and am looking forward to someone shedding some light here.
This is an example of the only thing that really worries me about FW, Some people just dont understand
I loved the FW Presentation, it made sense to me and I was quite excited about these changes. THEN came the questions.... The bitching and full on tear-filled crying from people who only saw things effecting their own selfish routine without considering the greater long term benefits
I wonder how CCP will address this problem? If everyone has completely different opinions and there is not one single 'consensus' Will CCP just opt for what they feel will be the best solution and hope that the, 'less forward thinking' people eventually understand, or will CCP just let us keep fighting about it and delay fixing it altogether. |
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
45
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 13:10:00 -
[161] - Quote
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:I have heard nothing from CCP via fanfest, nor from the CSM I have spoken with, that says this is a done deal. I understand everyone's defaulting to cynicism, but I am holding CCP to their word that they are still open to change,,,
Guess we'll see if you are naive or if I am merely excessively bitter 
But ... if you haven't already, watch the Tentonhammer interview with Soundwave (presumably recorded in a Russian Gulag as he has yet to release the blog promised upon his return from the Russian meet last year ...).
He literally says that he would like FW to have all the intrigue/drama that is synonymous with null, because he finds it :awesome:
He says that the expansion is track and that "FW is getting to a pretty good state" (assuming development wise as he says that wardec revisions are good to go).
So while technically nothing is set in stone, it is my fear that it is far enough along that major changes are impossible unless one accepts waiting yet another expansion cycle for meaningful mechanics.
PS: Lol Damar, you are as cynical as I am .. hahahaha. The past three years have done wonders for our faith in CCP, have they not?
Ranshe wrote:This is what it's all about, capturing space. I don't believe it will be harder and harder for Amarr to strike back though. We just have to notice then, that 90% of Metropolis is pretty much undefended since all of you slaves are busy in Bleak Lands. FW space isn't just the 10 systems around Auga..
Don't get me started on the stupidly lopsided geography of the Amarr/Minmatar front .. massive/perfect bottlenecks past Dal, twice the systems, insane jump counts for Shakor's Thugs and a big old round-about for Amarr that can be traversed in 4-5 minutes flat.
At least the Caldari/Gallente front have benefited from Black Rise being added specifically for FW. |
X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Villore Accords
149
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 14:16:00 -
[162] - Quote
It sounds like:
1. Denial of access of FW agents is for the most part agreed upon.
2. Denial of access to FW stations (with ability to dock with your pod to get stuff out), is controversial.
3. Denial of access to all stations in a system is mostly opposed
4. Denial of docking rights to even pods is mostly opposed.
That's fair. Low hanging fruit is denial of access to FW agents.
Keep hammering CCP on using Victory points (and not LP) for occupancy upgrades and we're there. :) |
Fidelium Mortis
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Villore Accords
70
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 14:23:00 -
[163] - Quote
I'm not fond of the datacore idea, and would much rather have them focus on direct warfare related rewards such as additional navy frigates, destroyers, cruisers, battlecruisers, etc.
The FW missions should scale a bit better too, right now it's not even worth picking up a L1-L3 mission while they could open some interesting PvP situations (much like plexes).
ICRS - Intergalactic Certified Rocket Surgeon |
Ranshe
Blackwater Company
28
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 14:24:00 -
[164] - Quote
Veshta Yoshida wrote:
He literally says that he would like FW to have all the intrigue/drama that is synonymous with null, because he finds it :awesome:
And what's wrong with drama and intrigue? I thought this game basically is fueled by these. Or so they all told me when trying to get me hooked up on this. ;)
Quote:
So while technically nothing is set in stone, it is my fear that it is far enough along that major changes are impossible unless one accepts waiting yet another expansion cycle for meaningful mechanics.
You guys are just bitter and afraid of change.
Same thing happened before with the Alliances FW change. And did all your doom scenarios happen?
Have some faith! Which I understand is hard to do after years of FW being neglected, but still.
X Gallentius wrote:
Keep hammering CCP on using Victory points (and not LP) for occupancy upgrades and we're there. :)
I was under the impression that the Victory Points will be phased out completely and everything will be dealt with LP. If you get more of them - from kills, plexes, upgrade bonuses it shouldn't be that much of a problem. |
X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Villore Accords
149
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 14:37:00 -
[165] - Quote
Ranshe wrote:X Gallentius wrote:
Keep hammering CCP on using Victory points (and not LP) for occupancy upgrades and we're there. :)
I was under the impression that the Victory Points will be phased out completely and everything will be dealt with LP. If you get more of them - from kills, plexes, upgrade bonuses it shouldn't be that much of a problem.
I understand the proposals CCP is making. However, if you apply upgrades with VP then the guys who participate in the Occupancy Warfare portion of FW will get to make decisions on upgrades etc.. rather than the guys who don't (mission runners, guys who run fleets up and down the pipes looking for casual pvp).
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Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc.
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
45
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 14:44:00 -
[166] - Quote
Ranshe wrote:[quote=Veshta Yoshida]Same thing happened before with the Alliances FW change. And did all your doom scenarios happen?...
Mine? No, but I reckon I severely underestimated the number of mission-bomber alts already in place .. there is simply no need to actually sign the various alliances up as they already have access to the two things of worth in FW - infinite ISK and cheap navy hulls.
My doom prediction for the plexing change was right on the money though .. or rather I didn't go gloomy enough. I'd anticipated systems dropping in 16-18 hours thus making a complete mockery of the whole thing when in reality it is half that (read: even MOAR! mockery) and fighting only really escalating in hub-pipes which was bang-on.
To be honest, I have all but given up on ever seeing/experiencing anything resembling the first month of FW when fights with 1-5 people were everywhere (read: EVERYBLOODYWHERE!) and practically every fight was the now elusive Good FightGäó, we had interaction with CCP/RP events and a smattering of LP was enough to pay the bills (2-3x number of missions now to do that thanks to a crashed market).
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X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Villore Accords
149
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 15:44:00 -
[167] - Quote
Doom Prediction for FW Alliances: Allowed FW corps to more easily band together. +1 FW. One RP alliance entered FW (Electus Matari). +1 FW. No other significant RP alliances entered FW: -1. But the door is now open for them.
Doom Prediction for Plexing: Way more plex fights now than before (isn't that the point?). +1 FW. Downside? None.
In any case, the tempo of low sec has picked up quite a bit lately - more likely due to CCP improving its overall product (including FW). More pirate gangs roaming around. More corps entering FW. More fights. More everything. +1 Eve Online. |
X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Villore Accords
149
|
Posted - 2012.03.26 16:33:00 -
[168] - Quote
Fidelium Mortis wrote:The FW missions should scale a bit better too, right now it's not even worth picking up a L1-L3 mission while they could open some interesting PvP situations (much like plexes). As a younger player hopping into an ishkur it was great to be able to make 14 million isk/hour running L2/L3's (probably more now). And there's nothing stopping anybody from collecting L2/L3s and using them for pvp. The potential fights may be worth it, and if they don't come you can still make a little bit of isk/lp.
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Ranshe
Blackwater Company
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 08:24:00 -
[169] - Quote
X Gallentius wrote:
I understand the proposals CCP is making. However, if you apply upgrades with VP then the guys who participate in the Occupancy Warfare portion of FW will get to make decisions on upgrades etc.. rather than the guys who don't (mission runners, guys who run fleets up and down the pipes looking for casual pvp).
That's not a bad idea, as it promotes being active. However.
I like the initial LP idea more, because it kind of deals a bit with the abundance of the LP. We get absolutely insane amounts of them right now (only from missions) and if we get even more from kills/plexes, we have to use them for something.
It's good to have another sink for them, rather than using them exclusively to pull out insane amounts of navy ships/modules/implants out of the store and screw around with the markets.
I think the percentages of people being active in occupancy warfare/missioning/casual pvp will be changed quite a lot, because right now I feel that the occupancy is pretty meaningless, therefore I don't really bother with it as I have limited time to play. I totally would if that had good effects like the ones presented by CCP and I'm pretty sure there's a lot people thinking the same.
There's no need to punish people for not doing something you (CCP) want, it's totally better to make that thing more interesting and they will do it on their own (= mission accomplished) and not feel bad about being punished at the same time (= happy players, as weird as that sounds in Eve ;) ). |
Miranda Bowie
The Paratwa Ka
9
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 10:41:00 -
[170] - Quote
Cearain wrote:... But I see you are a new player indeed. Let me say that this is how it is sov null sec and there are numerous reasons lots of players don't want that same stuff everywhere in the game. If this is a big issue for you there are lots of null sec corps that are new player friendly. Test alliance is one Space monkey alliance is another and I am sure there are many more. Look into it.
Not the slightest bit interested. I fight for the freedom of Minmatar, not some gang or greedy corp...
Quote:If fast combat where you can quickly reship and get back into fights at several places in the war front is not for you then fw may not be a good fit.
I very much like fast combat and being able to reship quickly. Pods don't fly all that slowly, nor do ships. Having to jump a few systems out and back in a new ship does not take long.
If I wanted to be as disingenuous as you're being, I could suggest there are other games you can play that provide much more in the way of instant gratification; EVE may not be a good fit for you if you can't stand taking more than 15 seconds recovering from a loss. But I try not to be quite so condescending when talking to someone just because we disagree on a point. You might want to try that... just a thought. |
Damar Rocarion
Nasranite Watch
Caldari State Capturing
156
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 13:01:00 -
[171] - Quote
Miranda Bowie wrote:IIf I wanted to be as disingenuous as you're being, I could suggest there are other games you can play that provide much more in the way of instant gratification; EVE may not be a good fit for you if you can't stand taking more than 15 seconds recovering from a loss. But I try not to be quite so condescending when talking to someone just because we disagree on a point. You might want to try that... just a thought.
Having quickly checked battleclinic and eve-kill for your career, I find a single rifter loss to your name. So in regards to pvp, could you perhaps post with your main and we might take you a bit more seriously rather than laughing at shiteposting from an alt.
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HARD STEEL
LOW TAX HIGH GLORY
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 13:32:00 -
[172] - Quote
It was hinted at and I think the new video hints at it too... (faction warfare leaders will have cheaper medical clones, maybe access to an implant?)
but a faction winning should affect the LP cost of all other stores for everyone - that would be an incentive to get people to contribute to their factions war effort
if there are going to ui updates, it would be good to know how your faction is doing in the war even if you are in FW or not. sure it doesn't have to be all in your face if you don't care, but it would be cool to know.
ie want that navy issue ship? yea it cost 20% higher in LP because your boys aren't doing so good, get in there and fight if you want cheaper stuff |
Damar Rocarion
Nasranite Watch
Caldari State Capturing
156
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 15:01:00 -
[173] - Quote
HARD STEEL wrote:ie want that navy issue ship? yea it cost 20% higher in LP because your boys aren't doing so good, get in there and fight if you want cheaper stuff
And you can be sure that 99% of the people will simply swap militias for more lucrative farming opportunities than actually go out and fight...
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X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Villore Accords
149
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 15:36:00 -
[174] - Quote
Ranshe wrote:[quote=X Gallentius]It's good to have another sink for them, rather than using them exclusively to pull out insane amounts of navy ships/modules/implants out of the store and screw around with the markets.
. I get the feeling that you are more interested in driving up LP store prices for your farming alts than you are in proper mechanics. Is your corporation even involved in FW?
The principles are these:
1. Those who participate in the Occupancy War portion of FW should have the most influence over its outcome.
Use VP for system Upgrades.
2. Those who participate in the Occupancy War should profit most from FW missions - not mission running alts:
Use VP to increase rewards for FW missions.
The second point helps your stated cause as well since there would be fewer LP cashed in (since the proposal would be to reduce baseline FW mission payouts by X% and the add them back in by applying VP) by mission running alts. |
HARD STEEL
LOW TAX HIGH GLORY
3
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 15:42:00 -
[175] - Quote
Damar Rocarion wrote:HARD STEEL wrote:ie want that navy issue ship? yea it cost 20% higher in LP because your boys aren't doing so good, get in there and fight if you want cheaper stuff And you can be sure that 99% of the people will simply swap militias for more lucrative farming opportunities than actually go out and fight...
good point, what about locking factions to your characters race? if not to your race some sort of allegiance that can only be remapped ever so often much like our attributes |
Ranshe
Blackwater Company
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 16:42:00 -
[176] - Quote
X Gallentius wrote:I get the feeling that you are more interested in driving up LP store prices for your farming alts than you are in proper mechanics. Is your corporation even involved in FW?
I don't have farming alts. Recently I don't even bother to do missions at all, because they're too boring and I'd rather go and find someone to shoot at.
Also, of course I would like the LP store item prices on the market to be higher - after all, this means me doing even less missioning for the same isk outcome - and I'm all for doing less missioning, is that weird?
Yes, I very rarely plex as well, because right now it's *quite pointless* other than for getting someone to show up on the beacon. There's nothing saying I won't want to plex after the changes, because it will still generate pvp *and* there will finally be some real consequences.
Are you by any chance a plexer who is afraid that his hundreds/thousands/millions of VP will be deleted? I don't see any other reason to obsess over some *completely useless* points.
Quote:1. Those who participate in the Occupancy War portion of FW should have the most influence over its outcome.
Use VP for system Upgrades.
It's quite obvious that the people who are only interested in getting rich on FW will not care about throwing their precious LP points into some system upgrades, because why would they want to part with part of their profits?
I get you want to kill all the missioning alts in uncatchable stealth bombers, but the changes to the NPCs proposed by CCP (I assume this would also involve changing mission NPCs, not only plex ones, since they're mostly of the same type) would be enough for that, there's no reason to keep the attachement to VP.
And if someone still doesn't want to participate and only runs missions? Let them. Or even better, show them how to have fun pvping in thrashers.
Quote:2. Those who participate in the Occupancy War should profit most from FW missions - not mission running alts:
Use VP to increase rewards for FW missions.
Stop awarding VP as pointless "rewards", and instead reward plexes and kills with LP, so you don't even have to mission at all if you do enough of both. An extra profit from winning at PVP? Shocking.
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X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Villore Accords
149
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 16:56:00 -
[177] - Quote
I don't really care one way or the other about VP. I can easily afford as many Navy Comet, ENIs, VNIs, and throwaway Navy Domis as I want and be happy for the rest of my Eve career. Since I already participate in the Occupancy War mechanic (because it leads to great pvp) I'll make out like a bandit no matter what CCP decides to do.
Again, why is it a good idea to give people who don't participate in the occupancy mechanic (mission running alts) the ability to influence it?
Why is it a good idea to allow mission running alts to have the same rewards as the people who actually participate in FW?
Edit: And yes I do want to kill all the mission runners, and succeed quite a bit when I try. :) (However, there needs to be a way to grief them when they bail from a mission!) |
Ranshe
Blackwater Company
29
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 19:44:00 -
[178] - Quote
X Gallentius wrote:
Again, why is it a good idea to give people who don't participate in the occupancy mechanic (mission running alts) the ability to influence it?
It's not a problem, because they just won't.
By definition, the purpose of the mission running alt is obviously making a ton of isk. Why would they care?
Quote:Why is it a good idea to allow mission running alts to have the same rewards as the people who actually participate in FW?
Because to avoid it you have to either a) introduce some secondary point system which is completely unnecessary, or b) just ban them.
But yeah, if you really dislike them that much, I definitely see your point. ;) It's just I don't see the universal appeal of it. :) |
Miranda Bowie
The Paratwa Ka
11
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 20:19:00 -
[179] - Quote
Damar Rocarion wrote:Having quickly checked battleclinic and eve-kill for your career, I find a single rifter loss to your name. So in regards to pvp, could you perhaps post with your main and we might take you a bit more seriously rather than laughing at shiteposting from an alt
Uh huh. I noted that I was a new player at the very beginning of the post Cearain was responding to. Doing a bit of BattleClinic research and "calling me out" on something I already acknowledged (lack of experience) makes you very clever. Congrats. ;)
It remains a fact that FW differs from nullsec PvP in many different ways. If someone likes a dozen different things about it but thinks one change would be an improvement, saying that they'd be happier doing the one that has that one feature, while differing all the other ways they prefer, is a bad and silly argument. How experienced or inexperienced the person making it is on either side is irrelevant.
But I suppose if you're stupid enough to think such ad hominem attacks have some sort of validity, I can see the weird logic you might be employing to justify why an illogical argument put forward by an experienced player might be immune to criticism by an inexperienced one. Obviously someone who hasn't blown up enough Rifters lacks the experience to recognize a logical flaw in an argument. "Dang, still three Rifter kills away from being able to grasp modus ponens..." ;) |
X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Villore Accords
149
|
Posted - 2012.03.27 23:08:00 -
[180] - Quote
Ranshe wrote: Because to avoid it you have to either a) introduce some secondary point system which is completely unnecessary Minor quibble. The VP point system has already been introduced. Anyways, CCP will implement what they implement. The real point is to give them some options to consider.
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