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What if CCP removed mission scanning - and moved all lvl 4s o low sec?

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Ghoest	Posted - 2008.08.23 22:13:00 - [1] Its a big lie when players say the game would be improved by moving lvl 4s as is to low sec. It wouldnt be profitable for the majority of players so they wouldnt do the level 4s. But back before mission scanning me and lots of other people did our mission in low sec. It was fairly safe but if you didnt scout ahead you could easily get wadded in a gate camp. Would this be better than what we have now? If you think corp is different than a guild or clan you have some insecurity issues.
Jana Clant New Dawn Corp New Eden Research	Posted - 2008.08.23 22:17:00 - [2] Removing L4s from high-sec would cause way too much rabble rabble, and is a course of action CCP would not take due to the interest of keeping their subscription numbers. Increasing the rewards of L4s in low-sec however, would probably be a good thing to do. At the very least, it'll pull a few players from the crowded high-sec mission hubs, and the ones that remain, well, they wouldn't leave the safety of CONCORD anyway. New Eden Research, where science is serious business!
Zeerover Caldari DeadSpace Exploration and Investigations	Posted - 2008.08.23 22:19:00 - [3] No people would just do the lvl 5's already in place then... There is a reason why the 60000lp lvl 5 missions aren't drawing the crowds to low-sec and everyone who whines about wanting to move lvl4s there is missing the point...
Ruze Amarr No Applicable Corporation	Posted - 2008.08.23 22:20:00 - [4] A) I don't think it's realistic to remove the ability to scan players who are in missions. Reason is, all it would require is someone to keep a level 1 mission active in their system, and bam ... automatic safe spot that is untouchable. Being someone who used the old super safe spots to beat the OLD scan system, I know it's not right. B) I used to mission alot in losec. It was fun, no doubt. Being found out by pirates wasn't a real worry, but now, it seems much more prevalent. C) Maybe losec missions need a bigger adjustment. Make them a flavor of their own, especially allowing for PvP fits to be much more useful. The time spent in a mission is one weakness, but the players setup is another. And I think it's a larger one. If losec missions were a different type altogether, more small-group, always moving type ... it might be a bigger, more effective change. Quote: If you like playing EvE, but don't like to PvP ... Maybe it's time you recognize that you don't really like to play EvE.
Jana Clant New Dawn Corp New Eden Research	Posted - 2008.08.23 22:32:00 - [5] Originally by: Zeerover No people would just do the lvl 5's already in place then... There is a reason why the 60000lp lvl 5 missions aren't drawing the crowds to low-sec and everyone who whines about wanting to move lvl4s there is missing the point... Mind if I ask what 'the point' is, then? New Eden Research, where science is serious business!
Schalac Caldari Apocalypse Reign	Posted - 2008.08.23 22:35:00 - [6] Originally by: Zeerover No people would just do the lvl 5's already in place then... There is a reason why the 60000lp lvl 5 missions aren't drawing the crowds to low-sec and everyone who whines about wanting to move lvl4s there is missing the point... I would say the main reason is because those missions are actually harder than level 4. I tried one level 5 mission just to see it and I have to say the solo mission runner is not going to be able to finish it. Add in the high probability of getting scanned out and the fact that lots of things point you in them. It's just not worth while. It was fun to see my shields almost fail though until I could get a RR on me. Though if you are able to bring a few friends just have them fit gank/tackle and bring along a ECM pilot in case someone does find you. Personally I think level 5 missions are more of a corp activity than a I want to run missions and make money. Though you do get some nice bounties in them, judging by the one that I did.
Ruze Amarr No Applicable Corporation	Posted - 2008.08.23 22:40:00 - [7] Originally by: Schalac Originally by: Zeerover No people would just do the lvl 5's already in place then... There is a reason why the 60000lp lvl 5 missions aren't drawing the crowds to low-sec and everyone who whines about wanting to move lvl4s there is missing the point... I would say the main reason is because those missions are actually harder than level 4. I tried one level 5 mission just to see it and I have to say the solo mission runner is not going to be able to finish it. Add in the high probability of getting scanned out and the fact that lots of things point you in them. It's just not worth while. It was fun to see my shields almost fail though until I could get a RR on me. Though if you are able to bring a few friends just have them fit gank/tackle and bring along a ECM pilot in case someone does find you. Personally I think level 5 missions are more of a corp activity than a I want to run missions and make money. Though you do get some nice bounties in them, judging by the one that I did. Used to be level 4's were like that. Maybe not AS hard as level 5's, but there were a whole pack of level 4 missions that you would get and automatically call up your corp mates for help. It was good stuff. Quote: If you like playing EvE, but don't like to PvP ... Maybe it's time you recognize that you don't really like to play EvE.
Ushatuhkwa Kaeshe	Posted - 2008.08.24 00:17:00 - [8] Keep the existing l4 missions as they are, with the l4 payout they have, with the rat bounties they have. Create a 2x or even 3x mission payout / LP payout multiplier for ALL lowsec missions, no matter the level. In fact, I would even promote that l4 lowsec missions (not 0.0 missions) have a 2-3x payout multiplier instituted, l3's 3x to 4x multipliers and l1 missions 7x to 8x multipliers. That would significantly increase the likelyhood that people would run them in lowsec with smaller ships, and be able to justify the risk of doing so. The reason people don't mission l4s in lowsec, is the belief that their battleship will get wtfpwnd. Allow for lower level missions with higher rewards, with the higher reward ONLY being in lowsec, and you would see an increase of people running those missions. So what if that means running L2s in lowsec gives you equivalent payouts than L4s in highsec? and so what if highsec runners start going on about how they can't make isk? Keep l4's where they are, but significantly increase LPs and Payouts for (all, l1 - l4) lowsec misisons, that's really all you'd need.
Nexus Kinnon A Few Good Men.	Posted - 2008.08.24 01:33:00 - [9] I have no idea on exact figures, but I know that they are already worth seriously more than L4s, the problem is that: A. They are not soloable B. They do not have bounties, they drop tags which = :effort: C. People like to do missions in their personal downtime and as a way to make ISK, not as an exciting activity full of risk. D. Risk their ships? lolwat
PriceCheckAlt	Posted - 2008.08.24 01:56:00 - [10] Originally by: Ghoest What if CCP removed mission scanning - and moved all lvl 4s o low sec? You would still be a bad poster.
5pinDizzy Amarr Umpteenth Podding	Posted - 2008.08.24 02:37:00 - [11] NO Basic rule of Eve, as mentioned by Aura herself ingame. Noone is safe in any part of the galaxy from prying eyes, and nor should they be.
Titan Pilot Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2008.08.24 02:53:00 - [12] Doing this would end the game, plain and simple. Obviously the OP has never tried to PVP in a PVE setup, it just doesnt work. Gankers have the advantage. They can scan you, determine your tank by knowing your rats, kill your ship with simply a Blackbird and any BC. Then effectively they kill your standings by failing your mission. This would make anyone quit the game because supporting a PVP habit by running Level 3s is the most absurd thing I have heard (unless you have 8 hours of day of free time to power grind). I am not a big supporter of the current system but its there and we need to find ways to keep people playing and not logging off....
Trind2222 Amarr The Red Ring	Posted - 2008.08.24 03:18:00 - [13] Op got a big point this will make players go to a corp. Low sec is not hard place to be in if you have corp mates that can blob any pvper. I think the problem in eve is most one only think of them self and not cooperate whit other players. If you got good corp behind you you get probed and attacked you can as your corp mates to help. You shod always have a pvp ship ready to go in case your corp mate need any help. ____________ Wrangler comes back out wearing his wizard hat and robe Wrangler: Hail and well met from Blizzard, how might I assist you?
Ambien Torca	Posted - 2008.08.24 04:31:00 - [14] Edited by: Ambien Torca on 24/08/2008 04:37:39 Originally by: Trind2222 Op got a big point this will make players go to a corp. Low sec is not hard place to be in if you have corp mates that can blob any pvper. I think the problem in eve is most one only think of them self and not cooperate whit other players. If you got good corp behind you you get probed and attacked you can as your corp mates to help. You shod always have a pvp ship ready to go in case your corp mate need any help. Think about it this way: Take a pool of players and compare their incomes when: a) Everyone of them is running missions all the time in highsec b) Part of them are running missions in lowsec and part of them are in pvp ships patrolling and waiting for enemies to show up. Despite somewhat higher rewards for lowsec missions your total income will very likely actually end lower per player basis. This is actually also problem in 0.0 space, group of players have hard time to make significantly more income by cooperating, although moon mining is getting to that level. Very often you see most of the moon income go to small subset of player group though.
Artemis Rose Varion Galactic Accord Corporate Enterprise Syndicate	Posted - 2008.08.24 06:30:00 - [15] If you can't find deadspaces with a player ship in it with scan probes, how can you find exploration sites with them then? Sorry, very poor idea. __________________________________________________ Currently Playing: Trolls from Outer Space Current Equipment: VISAcard chain mail, +2 Amulet of Epic Whine. WTB Purple Nerf Bat.
Akiba Penrose The Movement	Posted - 2008.08.24 07:31:00 - [16] Originally by: Ghoest Would this be better than what we have now? Yes, i think so. Once people is settled in low sec the pvp will come of it self. The "mission busting" seems to be a huge barrier for mission runners. It is in no way fun doing missions, you do it to get isk fast. Getting your ship blown up means you have to do 3-4 more missions to cower the loss. Although i did some missions in Amamake this summer, and its really not hard to stay alive as it is.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.24 09:35:00 - [17] Originally by: Ghoest Its a big lie when players say the game would be improved by moving lvl 4s as is to low sec. It wouldnt be profitable for the majority of players so they wouldnt do the level 4s. No, it's not a lie and while it wouldn't be profitable for the majority of players, it sure as hell would be beneficial for the game as a whole, and in extension, the majority of players. You claiming it is a lie when people say they believe this would benefit the game shows how biased you truly are, and how little worth you are to this discussion. Please don't make any more threads about this, and don't participate in existing threads. Originally by: Ghoest But back before mission scanning me and lots of other people did our mission in low sec. It was fairly safe but if you didnt scout ahead you could easily get wadded in a gate camp. Now, THIS is a lie, or at least misinformed. Mission scanning has always been possible. It was harder before, but it was still possible, and it still happened on a more or less regular basis. Originally by: Ghoest Would this be better than what we have now? No, because you are suggesting instancing Eve. That's contrary to what the game is about.
Le Skunk Low Sec Liberators	Posted - 2008.08.24 09:48:00 - [18] Originally by: Schalac ]I would say the main reason is because those missions are actually harder than level 4. Lv4 Mission *****s dont want a challange. They dont want a harad mission. Hence why they are sat in empire in NO RISK and HIGH REWARD profession. NERF LEVEL 4 MISSIONS CCP BALANCE SKUNK
Viqtoria Caldari Groping Hand Social Club	Posted - 2008.08.24 09:56:00 - [19] it's called the manual labour of an mmo, all mmos have and need them. it lubricates the entire game and keeps it all pumping. Amazing how few people realise this.
Davina Braben	Posted - 2008.08.24 10:12:00 - [20] Originally by: Ghoest Its a big lie when players say the game would be improved by moving lvl 4s as is to low sec. It wouldnt be profitable for the majority of players so they wouldnt do the level 4s. But back before mission scanning me and lots of other people did our mission in low sec. It was fairly safe but if you didnt scout ahead you could easily get wadded in a gate camp. Would this be better than what we have now? Not seeing the difference tbh. Still turns peoples PvE game into a russian roulette session.
Steve Hawkings	Posted - 2008.08.24 10:37:00 - [21] Why would moving them not be profitable for the majority of players ? please explain this crap you write.
Andrue Amarr	Posted - 2008.08.24 10:57:00 - [22] Originally by: Akiba Penrose Originally by: Ghoest Would this be better than what we have now? Yes, i think so. Once people is settled in low sec the pvp will come of it self. At which point more and more mission runners leave the game. That's the problem with any suggestion that impacts existing L4 running. It's what so many people still don't get. A large number of the exsiting runners are doing so because that's the game they want to play. If that game is destroyed those people will cancel their subscription. They don't want to PvP and even more important there's nothing anyone can do to force them. -- (Sarcastic mission running veteran, 4+ years) [Brackley, UK] My budgie can say "ploppy bottom". You have been warned.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.24 11:10:00 - [23] Originally by: Andrue At which point more and more mission runners leave the game. That's the problem with any suggestion that impacts existing L4 running. It's what so many people still don't get. A large number of the exsiting runners are doing so because that's the game they want to play. If that game is destroyed those people will cancel their subscription. They don't want to PvP and even more important there's nothing anyone can do to force them. I'm getting so tired of this rubbish argument. Should we perhaps allow isk selling as well? It might get us a bit more subscriptions. How about macros? I'm sure a lot of people would love being able to generate isk while completely AFK, so it might well increase the subscriptions. At one time or another, a game company has to decide what's best for the game in the long run. In this case, balance is best. It might lose CCP a few subscriptions (although most would stay, don't let anyone fool you into thinking otherwise) in the short term, but it will increase the stability of the game and ensure it has a longer life. This is how CCP has always done things in the past. If they change it now, it's going to cost them.
Ghoest	Posted - 2008.08.24 11:10:00 - [24] Originally by: Titan Pilot Doing this would end the game, plain and simple. Obviously the OP has never tried to PVP in a PVE setup, it just doesnt work. Gankers have the advantage. They can scan you, determine your tank by knowing your rats, kill your ship with simply a Blackbird and any BC. Then effectively they kill your standings by failing your mission. This would make anyone quit the game because supporting a PVP habit by running Level 3s is the most absurd thing I have heard (unless you have 8 hours of day of free time to power grind). I am not a big supporter of the current system but its there and we need to find ways to keep people playing and not logging off.... Hey look - you cant read. If you think corp is different than a guild or clan you have some insecurity issues.
Another Forum'Alt	Posted - 2008.08.24 11:15:00 - [25] Everyone would quit/move to level 3s. Gatecamps are far too common and almost impossible to escape without a shuttle or covops.
Ghoest	Posted - 2008.08.24 11:16:00 - [26] Originally by: Maximillian Bayonette Originally by: Ghoest But back before mission scanning me and lots of other people did our mission in low sec. It was fairly safe but if you didnt scout ahead you could easily get wadded in a gate camp. Now, THIS is a lie, or at least misinformed. Mission scanning has always been possible. It was harder before, but it was still possible, and it still happened on a more or less regular basis. Your a newb I guess and werent around back before new scanning. I used to run all my level 4s in Amamake before the change. It was probably the busiest low sec mission hub. I never once was scanned out. It may have been possible but the odds were so long against it that essentially no one bothered. Gate and station camps were the only legit concerns. If you think corp is different than a guild or clan you have some insecurity issues.
Ghoest	Posted - 2008.08.24 11:18:00 - [27] Originally by: Steve Hawkings Why would moving them not be profitable for the majority of players ? please explain this crap you write. Because ship loss for most mission runners would cost more than they could make off of mission. Its almost ironic that you named your self after a smart guy isnt it? If you think corp is different than a guild or clan you have some insecurity issues.
Ghoest	Posted - 2008.08.24 11:21:00 - [28] Originally by: Another Forum'Alt Everyone would quit/move to level 3s. Gatecamps are far too common and almost impossible to escape without a shuttle or covops. You may well be right. This probably isnt a good idea. Just greatly increasing the rewards for low sec missions makes more sense. If you think corp is different than a guild or clan you have some insecurity issues.
Maximillian Bayonette White Lion Manufacture and Salvage	Posted - 2008.08.24 11:22:00 - [29] Originally by: Ghoest Youre a newb I guess and werent around back before new scanning. I used to run all my level 4s in Amamake before the change. It was probably the busiest low sec mission hub. I never once was scanned out. It may have been possible but the odds were so long against it that essentially no one bothered. Gate and station camps were the only legit concerns. I was around back then. I know it was possible. I know it happened.
Steve Hawkings	Posted - 2008.08.24 11:24:00 - [30] Originally by: Ghoest Originally by: Steve Hawkings Why would moving them not be profitable for the majority of players ? please explain this crap you write. Because ship loss for most mission runners would cost more than they could make off of mission. Its almost ironic that you named your self after a smart guy isnt it? stfu with the personal abuse, this just proves that your idea is crap. Why does evey noob that cant fly assume he is going to loose his ship in low sec ?? ive been there for months and not lost anything, seriously its time that rubbish players like yourself actually learnt how to play the game instead of sitting touching yourself in high sec.

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