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Valkerias
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Posted - 2008.10.04 19:12:00 -
[1]
Since there was so much ... complaining from the player pirate community concerning the new patch and fixes to CONCORD, I've come up with some skills that would make these players feel a bit less cheated.
Shoplifting
Needed skills:
Hacking V Procurement V Trading V
Description: The ability to "purchase" items without paying. 15% chance of success per level.
Warning! Using this skill and failing will cause a security decrease (like illegally attacking a player) and triggers a global criminal flag. This may also cause a loss of standing with the corporation where the sell order was placed.
Grifting
Needed skills:
Shoplifting V Contracts V
Character can make one fraudulent contract per level. Warning: Fraudulent contracts will lead to being treated like a war target by the victim except that CONCORD will still interfere if the author of the false contract attacks first.
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Valkerias
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Posted - 2008.10.04 19:12:00 -
[2]
Since there was so much ... complaining from the player pirate community concerning the new patch and fixes to CONCORD, I've come up with some skills that would make these players feel a bit less cheated.
Shoplifting
Needed skills:
Hacking V Procurement V Trading V
Description: The ability to "purchase" items without paying. 15% chance of success per level.
Warning! Using this skill and failing will cause a security decrease (like illegally attacking a player) and triggers a global criminal flag. This may also cause a loss of standing with the corporation where the sell order was placed.
Grifting
Needed skills:
Shoplifting V Contracts V
Character can make one fraudulent contract per level. Warning: Fraudulent contracts will lead to being treated like a war target by the victim except that CONCORD will still interfere if the author of the false contract attacks first.
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Jinx Barker
GFB Scientific
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Posted - 2008.10.04 19:18:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Jinx Barker on 04/10/2008 19:19:05
Originally by: Valkerias Since there was so much ... complaining from the player pirate community concerning the new patch and fixes to CONCORD, I've come up with some skills that would make these players feel a bit less cheated.
Shoplifting
Needed skills:
Hacking V Procurement V Trading V
Description: The ability to "purchase" items without paying. 15% chance of success per level.
Warning! Using this skill and failing will cause a security decrease (like illegally attacking a player) and triggers a global criminal flag. This may also cause a loss of standing with the corporation where the sell order was placed.
Grifting
Needed skills:
Shoplifting V Contracts V
Character can make one fraudulent contract per level. Warning: Fraudulent contracts will lead to being treated like a war target by the victim except that CONCORD will still interfere if the author of the false contract attacks first.
Those are not pro-pirate skills. Those are "something for nothing, I wanna freebie skills" - Security status is nothing, it easy to repair, and the benefits of "stealing" a Marauder are well worth some negative sec status that can be fixed in a day.
Now, a benefit of making a false contract for Ishtar BPO and getting 40 Bill ISK, and being treated as if at war by the buyer, again negated by the presence of ALTs, and for 40 billion of YOUR ISK in my pocket you can be at war with me all you want.
So, bullshit skills, bullshit proposal.
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Jinx Barker
GFB Scientific
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Posted - 2008.10.04 19:18:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Jinx Barker on 04/10/2008 19:19:05
Originally by: Valkerias Since there was so much ... complaining from the player pirate community concerning the new patch and fixes to CONCORD, I've come up with some skills that would make these players feel a bit less cheated.
Shoplifting
Needed skills:
Hacking V Procurement V Trading V
Description: The ability to "purchase" items without paying. 15% chance of success per level.
Warning! Using this skill and failing will cause a security decrease (like illegally attacking a player) and triggers a global criminal flag. This may also cause a loss of standing with the corporation where the sell order was placed.
Grifting
Needed skills:
Shoplifting V Contracts V
Character can make one fraudulent contract per level. Warning: Fraudulent contracts will lead to being treated like a war target by the victim except that CONCORD will still interfere if the author of the false contract attacks first.
Those are not pro-pirate skills. Those are "something for nothing, I wanna freebie skills" - Security status is nothing, it easy to repair, and the benefits of "stealing" a Marauder are well worth some negative sec status that can be fixed in a day.
Now, a benefit of making a false contract for Ishtar BPO and getting 40 Bill ISK, and being treated as if at war by the buyer, again negated by the presence of ALTs, and for 40 billion of YOUR ISK in my pocket you can be at war with me all you want.
So, bullshit skills, bullshit proposal.
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Valkerias
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Posted - 2008.10.04 19:22:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Jinx Barker Edited by: Jinx Barker on 04/10/2008 19:19:05
Originally by: Valkerias Since there was so much ... complaining from the player pirate community concerning the new patch and fixes to CONCORD, I've come up with some skills that would make these players feel a bit less cheated.
Shoplifting
Needed skills:
Hacking V Procurement V Trading V
Description: The ability to "purchase" items without paying. 15% chance of success per level.
Warning! Using this skill and failing will cause a security decrease (like illegally attacking a player) and triggers a global criminal flag. This may also cause a loss of standing with the corporation where the sell order was placed.
Grifting
Needed skills:
Shoplifting V Contracts V
Character can make one fraudulent contract per level. Warning: Fraudulent contracts will lead to being treated like a war target by the victim except that CONCORD will still interfere if the author of the false contract attacks first.
Those are not pro-pirate skills. Those are "something for nothing, I wanna freebie skills" - Security status is nothing, it easy to repair, and the benefits of "stealing" a Marauder are well worth some negative sec status that can be fixed in a day.
Now, a benefit of making a false contract for Ishtar BPO and getting 40 Bill ISK, and being treated as if at war by the buyer, again negated by the presence of ALTs, and for 40 billion of YOUR ISK in my pocket you can be at war with me all you want.
So, bullshit skills, bullshit proposal.
And that's how the "pirates" were responding to the latest patch and the removal of insurance payouts for CONCORD acts.
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Valkerias
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Posted - 2008.10.04 19:22:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Jinx Barker Edited by: Jinx Barker on 04/10/2008 19:19:05
Originally by: Valkerias Since there was so much ... complaining from the player pirate community concerning the new patch and fixes to CONCORD, I've come up with some skills that would make these players feel a bit less cheated.
Shoplifting
Needed skills:
Hacking V Procurement V Trading V
Description: The ability to "purchase" items without paying. 15% chance of success per level.
Warning! Using this skill and failing will cause a security decrease (like illegally attacking a player) and triggers a global criminal flag. This may also cause a loss of standing with the corporation where the sell order was placed.
Grifting
Needed skills:
Shoplifting V Contracts V
Character can make one fraudulent contract per level. Warning: Fraudulent contracts will lead to being treated like a war target by the victim except that CONCORD will still interfere if the author of the false contract attacks first.
Those are not pro-pirate skills. Those are "something for nothing, I wanna freebie skills" - Security status is nothing, it easy to repair, and the benefits of "stealing" a Marauder are well worth some negative sec status that can be fixed in a day.
Now, a benefit of making a false contract for Ishtar BPO and getting 40 Bill ISK, and being treated as if at war by the buyer, again negated by the presence of ALTs, and for 40 billion of YOUR ISK in my pocket you can be at war with me all you want.
So, bullshit skills, bullshit proposal.
And that's how the "pirates" were responding to the latest patch and the removal of insurance payouts for CONCORD acts. |
Jinx Barker
GFB Scientific
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Posted - 2008.10.04 19:35:00 -
[7]
Originally by: Valkerias And that's how the "pirates" were responding to the latest patch and the removal of insurance payouts for CONCORD acts.
I am not even sure what you mean by this statement. Care to clarify? It makes absolutely no sense. I presented counter-arguments to your proposals, which clearly I think have no merit - you should probably try an negate them, yes?
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Nnamuachs
Caldari Kiith Paktu Nex Eternus
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Posted - 2008.10.04 19:45:00 -
[8]
As far as i'm aware there have been only discussions, there have been no patches including insurance removal for concord involvement as of yet.. so you cant complain about something that hasnt happened. |
Valkerias
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Posted - 2008.10.04 20:09:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Jinx Barker
Originally by: Valkerias And that's how the "pirates" were responding to the latest patch and the removal of insurance payouts for CONCORD acts.
I am not even sure what you mean by this statement. Care to clarify? It makes absolutely no sense. I presented counter-arguments to your proposals, which clearly I think have no merit - you should probably try an negate them, yes?
Did you read the Patch notes and the response thread? There's about 33 pages of "that's a load of BS" from the "pirate" community when CCP officially announced the coming removal of insurance payouts from CONCORD action. These skills were posted in response to those players. (wonders if anyone understands my stab at irony yet.)
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DIABBLOSS
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Posted - 2008.10.04 20:50:00 -
[10]
well if it is true great why should u morons get insurance 4 ganking people,if u dont like it dont do it quit whinging like a baby and get a life.
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Jinx Barker
GFB Scientific
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Posted - 2008.10.04 21:08:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Valkerias Did you read the Patch notes and the response thread? There's about 33 pages of "that's a load of BS" from the "pirate" community when CCP officially announced the coming removal of insurance payouts from CONCORD action. These skills were posted in response to those players. (wonders if anyone understands my stab at irony yet.)
Ok, removal of Insurance for CONCORD sanctionable actions makes perfect sense. I have done my share of suicide ganks and I still think that there is something wrong when insurance pays for a crime.
All the ones who whined about it were "bad" suicide gankers who prey on 'small fish' instead of spending long arduous days and weeks following a particular 'big fish' for one huge score.
So, you posted a useless skill set as a "stab at irony?" Oh, well I guess your sense of humour is beyond me then.
Good luck and all that.
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Yamato Gasaraki
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.10.04 21:20:00 -
[12]
These may be Pirate Skills, but in my Eyes they are just Griefplay.
Imagine what would happen: - shoplifting --People start to steal Titans and other ultra high Prized Items. --But not once or twice a Day, it will become a common sight and crashes ---the Economy.
-grifting --simple put: 30.ooo Aoede Mining Upgrades, that aren't realy there should be ---enough to say: This is Spa...BS!!!
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Phione
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Posted - 2008.10.04 21:32:00 -
[13]
Edited by: Phione on 04/10/2008 21:34:57 Here are some better punishments, than just an impotent security decrease...
1. ISK fine's 2. If No ISK than the members player corp is fined. 3. If No Player Corp and ISK, than confiscation of a clone in stasis for each event. In addition to a restriction of available clones, outside of the infomorph skill. 4. If no clones are available in Concords domain. Then execute the one in front of you.
Pirates seem to have no issues with taking ISK, or Pod Killing. So why not deliver equal justice?
Get caught stealing, these punishments will make a pirate think twice.
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Kiki Arnolds
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.10.04 21:54:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Kiki Arnolds on 04/10/2008 21:54:40
Originally by: Phione Edited by: Phione on 04/10/2008 21:34:57 Here are some better punishments, than just an impotent security decrease...
1. ISK fine's 2. If No ISK than the members player corp is fined. 3. If No Player Corp and ISK, than confiscation of a clone in stasis for each event. In addition to a restriction of available clones, outside of the infomorph skill. 4. If no clones are available in Concords domain. Then execute the one in front of you.
Pirates seem to have no issues with taking ISK, or Pod Killing. So why not deliver equal justice?
Get caught stealing, these punishments will make a pirate think twice.
None of those issues overcomes the alt problem. The only way it could work is an expensive skill, combined with a large fine. If you have a 20% chance of sucsess, the skill costs 500M, and the fine is the value of the item. Youe try to steal a carrier from the market, cost 800M, if you try 5 times, you will get one carrier and loose 2,400M isk. If your negative you can't keep trying, and suffer regular negative isk penalties... If you delete the character you loose the 500M isk the skill cost.
Would be crazy to try it on anything but jump freightors.
With the contracts skill, all you would do is render contracts USELESS... though I'm sure Cribba could make alot of money serving as an escrow agent... How can I know if that CNR is real or not, whats the risk to you?
Both these ideas destroy market confidence, there is no way for a player to counter either... I know your upset about the insurance nerf, but this whole idea is just lame... ç¦ |
ollobrains2
Gallente New Eve Order Holdings
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Posted - 2008.10.04 22:07:00 -
[15]
The only skill i could see as viable would be one that has a 2-5% modifer that affects loot drops ie 2.5% extra chance per skill when u kill anything that zyx % of extra loot can survive. Would require a modifer to the loot tables and perhaps should only apply to those that get the final blow but is something CCP Could consider.
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Gentle Behn
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Posted - 2008.10.05 11:25:00 -
[16]
Pirates should get an insurance payout as they've taken out insurance. It's a very simple idea. Maybe we should have seperate insurance companys and an insurance historey to nerf clumsy carebears. Or Pvp boy racers how can't look after their pimped up frigs.
Space is NOT supposed to be safe. Part of this game was when you left the station you checked you were equipped to do the job and make it back to the station. And knew that that might not happen. Only the smart pirates are making big isk.
I certainly never did
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Tarron Sarek
Gallente Biotronics Inc. Alternative Realities
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Posted - 2008.10.05 14:19:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Valkerias Since there was so much ... complaining from the player wannabe pirate aka highsec gankbear community concerning the new patch and fixes to CONCORD, ...
Fixed that for you.
___________________________________
Balance is power, guard hide it well
"Ceterum censeo Polycarbonem esse delendam" |
Valkerias
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Posted - 2008.10.08 12:58:00 -
[18]
After some serious thought, I think I've got a grasp on the weakness of my submission. Players could abuse by just staying docked.
1.) I withdraw the "grifter" idea. It's admittedly stupid and far too easy to abuse.
2.) Perhaps the "shoplifting" idea can be salvaged if the player who wants to use it has to BE IN SPACE.
a.) Player has to target the station he wants to get the goods from.
b.) Player has to activate a module (codebreaker perhaps) and get the "warning, you are committing a crime" message.
c.) Activating the module would flag the pirate as hostile to the npc base, (like attacking a courier in empire)
d.) If the ship or module is destroyed, the market prices return to normal, so the pirate would have to make the "purchase" quickly before his ship goes BOOM. A battleship could tank longer but is more expensive while a rookie ship is free, but won't last long.
As a counter, players who don't want to be robbed in this manner could learn some kind of "security" skill.
Enhanced Encryption (10)
Needed skills:
Hacking Level 5 Trade Level 5
Each level of this skill reduces the chances that your sell order will be hacked by 5%. Allows you to use Code breaker module to encrypt jet cans.
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Sir Substance
Minmatar MagiTech Alliance Inc.
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Posted - 2008.10.08 14:02:00 -
[19]
let me put it to you this way. you wanna steal from the market? fine.
ill start selling all my ships on contract and all my ammo in lots of 100.
everyone else will soon follow suit. - PvPers always say "GB2WoW". the message is that EVE is hard, and people just need to deal with it. wasn't it funny how when nano's started making it hard for *them*, that all went out the window? |
Zhula Guixgrixks
Increasing Success by Lowering Expectations Vanguard.
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Posted - 2008.10.08 16:38:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Zhula Guixgrixks on 08/10/2008 16:40:48 Edited by: Zhula Guixgrixks on 08/10/2008 16:40:04 skill : "decoy techniques"
enable you to fire decoys.
Decoy: Decoys reduce sentry damage 5% per level. Takes 4000m3 (no giant secure container tanking)
Decoy launcher : able to fire decoys. Capacity: 20000m3
You can replace "sentry damage" with "general damage" but it wouldn't be a dedicated pro pirate skill then :)
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Killian Bekker
Caldari Maximum Yarrage
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Posted - 2008.10.08 18:26:00 -
[21]
Originally by: ollobrains2 The only skill i could see as viable would be one that has a 2-5% modifer that affects loot drops ie 2.5% extra chance per skill when u kill anything that zyx % of extra loot can survive. Would require a modifer to the loot tables and perhaps should only apply to those that get the final blow but is something CCP Could consider.
This is a viable idea I would think. Would have to follow the salvage tech tree (Maybe Salvage V as a pre-req) to be balanced (and logical), and enable the ability to increase the chance of more equipment dropping, or the better stuff dropping.
I don't see this as something that would unbalance the game in any way. The item is lost to the player anyway, be it being destroyed or looted off the wreck.
It would only affect PvP combat, so it benefits both parties really. The pirate gets better loot, but it doesn't affect the other player as they don't really lose much.
The skill could in theory also prevent better stuff from blowing up on your own ship as well, so you risk the target getting better loot if you don't get them first.
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