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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 6 post(s)
Jel Ting	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:41:00 - [1831] Originally by: Lag This change is complete crap. Why should I pay for a months time that my character will not be able to do anything? WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHEN DOES TRAINING A LONG SKILL MAKE YOUR CHARACTER UNABLE TO UNDOCK? Everyone acts like OMG what do I do while BS 5 is training? Fracking play the mother fracking game you morons!!! Jesus!! Oh no I can't go run a mission I don't have my BS 5 trained, my mining lasers don't work either! Why can't I undock while I have a skill training? Curse you CCP! Oh wait, no everything sems to be working just fine.
Annaphera Minmatar Super Green Industries	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:41:00 - [1832] Originally by: Gael Itrus It was my plan to open a second account to train for caps. I'm afraid that isn't going to happen with these changes. Also, don't call something a bug when you've previously framed it as a feature. Quote: Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill training, though). As a result, it is a good idea to train short skills while you are playing and longer ones when you log off. How to train skills, 3rd paragraph. [http://www.eve-online.com/guide/en/g615.asp] Wow. 59 pages in, and there are still people assuming that documentation=intent, or even that a single line buried in the players' guide means it was used as a "selling point" (I know you didn't Gael, but others are). Guess what, like jetcan mining, this just kind of happened. Like jetcan mining, they decided to let it go because it was a minor issue, and could be seen as a rare positive "bug". It got documented as "how the software functions". Now it causes them trouble, as it is now systematically abused, so they are getting rid of it.
Virgo I'Platonicus Ex Eventus Corpi	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:41:00 - [1833] Originally by: Jel Ting I don't understand the referals to this ghost training as a selling point? I never saw it in an ad. I know that training a skill while you are logged off is a selling point. This is a Balance issue too. People are power leveling, I say this even though eve has no real equivalance, but for arguments sake let's assume the normal char progression is to train frigates, then go to interceptors or assault frigates, then train for cov ops, recons, hacs, command ships, BS 5, and finally Capital ships and beyond, well that's like 2-3 years in training but you have a pilot that can fly most of a races ships and has support skills across the board. Now if a character is made and simply a course plotted for capital ships you could get there in less than a year and do it by only paying lets say 6 months. So what we have is lots of people creating alts training them to dreads only paying 50% and distorting the balance of characters on the server. I'm not a big alt fan myself, I think Eve should only allow one client to run on a system myself, but if one wants to create an alt and train him anyway he see's fit fine, but pay for it. Money limits things, so if people are spending less on alts then they can create more, this drives down the price of characters and floods the game with "cheap" and plentiful cap pilots and hulks, this is not good for the balance IMHO. I want people to care what they train and train what they play, not train for caps because it's the best way to train long skills for free or reduced cost. For those of you that can't wait 2-4 weeks for a skill to train, put down the caffeine, for the longer skills like 60-80 days, why not wait until your character has other stuff trained before going right for Capitals 5? oh wait you can't play the toon when you train for that because your character has crap skills and can only fly the prerequisites to capitals, tough ***, train an inty they are a blast, stop whining and start playing the game. Don't *** cause you started in 07 and some guy from 04 has a titan and you don't, and you don't get to catch up to him by hardly paying. Play the game Why? What's the point in playing a char that can't do shit ( and the first 45 days in skill training are a complete waste of time in EVE-sense of gameplay). You don't get more skill points by playing like u used to back in 2003. So why play? It'd be ok if you could get faster SP by activelly doing the thing you're skilling (like gettin sp for firing specific gun and so on) - you don't. This gimps new players and old players who will more or less stop looking forward to finding something new in eve. You never saw it in an add? Let me help u there: link - 4th paragraph. ah well. V. <3
Adam Slysphere	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:42:00 - [1834] Originally by: Triksterism Originally by: Adam Slysphere Originally by: Lag This change is complete crap. Why should I pay for a months time that my character will not be able to do anything? it is doing something. It's learning a new skill ... Which is basically just a clock ticking while you take a break from the game. No bandwidth use and anyone is free to do it. As someone stated earlier: Why should a character gain in value when there's no money being spent on said character? What other service in the world allows you to use it without being paid for in a consistent manor? Does the phone company not bill you on the days you don't make any phone calls? Does your ISP not charge your for the days you don't serf the web? You're receiving a service and your character is progressing. You should have to pay for said service.
Patric Riegns Minmatar Lazy Twats Inc	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:42:00 - [1835] The posters who write off the threats of players quitting you do understand your in a symbiotic relationship with the other players right? Real or imagined the perception that CCP is lying and treating the customers with contempt is right in front of your eyes. The fact that a 100 pages and counting have already been generated with 90% disapproval rating cannot be dismissed as easily as you seem to imagine. New players will be put off by the negative publicity, many established players will no longer recommend the game to friends, family and colleagues. Add in the discontent with the proposed speed nerf and the perception that it lacks any finesse, strategic foresight, balance or even the nucleus of good programming practice will not be going away either. This means Eve Online is on the cusp of a potentially major decline which may well result in the game disappearing altogether. As 0.0 alliances have proved bad decisions cumulatively taken can have a cascade effect that result in total collapse. Eve Online may be about to learn the same lesson. Then we all lose.
Jel Ting	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:42:00 - [1836] Originally by: Mask Fedor Well, EvE is sucking more and more every day anyway.. http://www.eve-online.com/guide/en/g615.asp Yes, worked as intended before, but now is haxxx Anyway, goodbye 2 alts (cap pilots). My main was already cancelled before. Bye Bye, don't let the jumpgate hit your ass on the way out.
Adam Reed Black Thorne Corporation Black Thorne Alliance	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:42:00 - [1837] What utter nonsense, how can people be so blinkered as to think that there's any commercial benefit in CCP allowing people to train skills like this? They are a company trying to make a profit, and as much as I'm in favour of smashing capitalism if you're going to have it you have to accept that companies will do what they can to maximse profits. Frankly I didn't know that this 'ghost training' existed and was surprised to hear that it did, and has lasted so long. To the people moaning about this change, shut up and pay like the rest of us, or sod off and play Guild Wars. Fair play to CCP I say. ------------- "I don't mean to sound cruel or harsh, but I am, so that's how it comes out."
Gedhay	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:43:00 - [1838] Originally by: JanSVK I understand your resons. I am not happy but understand. Now give us skill queue. I already lost weeks of training time due to unexpected server bugs and errors in game and such things and the only way to get that lost time back was to put up a longer skill when I was taking a break from the game. If it is such a problem that a skill could be finished on an inactive account, the same priority should go to prevent skills not being trained on active accounts. I subscribe to that!!! And to be able to train on the other 2 char that an payed account offers u
ATARI BABY Lords Of Guile	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:43:00 - [1839] Originally by: Gajowy http://www.eve-online.com/guide/en/g615.asp "Skills continue training even if you are logged off or if your account is inactive (in the second scenario you can't change skill training, though)." CCP THERE IS A BUG IN PLAYER GUIDE FROM OVER 5 YEARS hope they can hear me and fix this fast enough before people will feel that they are treated like idiots too late for total cleanup. LIE
IR Scoutar Caldari State War Academy	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:43:00 - [1840] Originally by: Koyama Ise CCP before you go bankrupt and lose your servers... release the source code... why the hell would you want the source code what you want is the IP or a free license to the eve universe
Triksterism Gallente Frozen Corpse Inspection Services United Federation of Capsuleers	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:43:00 - [1841] Originally by: Jel Ting Originally by: Lag This change is complete crap. Why should I pay for a months time that my character will not be able to do anything? WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHEN DOES TRAINING A LONG SKILL MAKE YOUR CHARACTER UNABLE TO UNDOCK? Everyone acts like OMG what do I do while BS 5 is training? Fracking play the mother fracking game you morons!!! Jesus!! Oh no I can't go run a mission I don't have my BS 5 trained, my mining lasers don't work either! Why can't I undock while I have a skill training? Curse you CCP! Oh wait, no everything sems to be working just fine. You're missing the point. Not everyone ghost trains their level 5's. However, it is a popular thing to do when people want to take a break from eve. People should have the option. It is what CCP promoted and it is what has attracted many people to the game. - Ghost Train & Snowflake
Todoshi Caldari Caldari Logistics and Supplies	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:43:00 - [1842] although it probably won't effect ccp to much, lets face it there will still be 30k+ players logged in tonight and tommorow and the day after that
Adam Slysphere	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:44:00 - [1843] Originally by: Jel Ting Originally by: Lag This change is complete crap. Why should I pay for a months time that my character will not be able to do anything? WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHEN DOES TRAINING A LONG SKILL MAKE YOUR CHARACTER UNABLE TO UNDOCK? Everyone acts like OMG what do I do while BS 5 is training? Fracking play the mother fracking game you morons!!! Jesus!! Oh no I can't go run a mission I don't have my BS 5 trained, my mining lasers don't work either! Why can't I undock while I have a skill training? Curse you CCP! Oh wait, no everything sems to be working just fine. QFT
Ratio Legis Slacker Industries	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:45:00 - [1844] Edited by: Ratio Legis on 14/10/2008 14:45:14 Originally by: Adam Slysphere Originally by: Ratio Legis Originally by: Adam Slysphere If you're that strapped for cash, perhaps EVE should be way down on the priorities list? And you are arguing that it's a good change that would prompt a person to reevaluate his RL priorities and realize he's actually too poor to support his hoby, while a week ago he was not? I fail to see how this is impacting him ... If he was just running one account it's still going to be the same for him. And seriously, if he's that strapped for cash is running two accounts really that good of an idea? I'm not trolling and I'm all for people having a hobby and what not. All I'm saying is that if someone is that strapped for cash than perhaps he should focus less on an internet spaceship game and put his money elsewhere. Am I wrong in suggesting that people spend their money on important things in life instead of a video game? lol You mean you fail to see how upping the price of the service might affect a poor person to stop using the service? Because that's what just happened - CCP have announced how people need to pay more for getting the same thing. With the same justification you could argue that it's ok to double the subscription fee for everyone and the poor people can start paying for each second month, missing half the time. That's not how things work. And yes, you are wrong suggesting that you know better than people how and where they should spend their time and money.
KingBobs Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:45:00 - [1845] paying 35 dollar every 2 months is too much for skilltraining or better an boring look on your skills an see how many weeks remains....
Virgo I'Platonicus Ex Eventus Corpi	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:45:00 - [1846] Perhaps allow ghost training for 25 - 30% the monthly fee? V. <3
Dlightfull e-PWN	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:45:00 - [1847] Originally by: Adam Slysphere I'm not trolling and I'm all for people having a hobby and what not. All I'm saying is that if someone is that strapped for cash than perhaps he should focus less on an internet spaceship game and put his money elsewhere. Am I wrong in suggesting that people spend their money on important things in life instead of a video game? lol I never payd irl money for eve, always isk, and i was able to keep 1 account active always, while 2 others were active 7-8months/year, rest of time on ghost training. The first account is the 1 i make isk on and the other 2 are pvp characters-the cahracters i have fun with. Now, with these changes, i can't keep even 2 accounts active and what's the point in keeping the money making 1 if i don't have fun on it?
Moon Kitten GoonFleet	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:46:00 - [1848] Originally by: Adam Reed What utter nonsense, how can people be so blinkered as to think that there's any commercial benefit in CCP allowing people to train skills like this? They are a company trying to make a profit, and as much as I'm in favour of smashing capitalism if you're going to have it you have to accept that companies will do what they can to maximse profits. Frankly I didn't know that this 'ghost training' existed and was surprised to hear that it did, and has lasted so long. To the people moaning about this change, shut up and pay like the rest of us, or sod off and play Guild Wars. Fair play to CCP I say. Stop thinking about the quarterly financial report and start thinking more long term. Perhaps in terms of years.
ATARI BABY Lords Of Guile	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:46:00 - [1849] Originally by: IR Scoutar Originally by: Koyama Ise CCP before you go bankrupt and lose your servers... release the source code... why the hell would you want the source code what you want is the IP or a free license to the eve universe source code mean private servers. private servers mean free play. LIE
Wygg Minmatar Hadean Drive Yards Archaean Cooperative	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:47:00 - [1850] Originally by: Triksterism You're missing the point. Not everyone ghost trains their level 5's. However, it is a popular thing to do when people want to take a break from eve. People should have the option. It is what CCP promoted and it is what has attracted many people to the game. The converse is Why should you get Carrier V without paying for it?
Virgo I'Platonicus Ex Eventus Corpi	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:47:00 - [1851] Originally by: Moon Kitten Stop thinking about the quarterly financial report and start thinking more long term. Perhaps in terms of years. Ok. Eve becomes a sad idea, lower than wow, cause all old players leave, alts stop training, newbs quit before 2 months game time? This goes for 2 years? :)) <3
KingBobs Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:47:00 - [1852] Originally by: Virgo I'Platonicus Perhaps allow ghost training for 25 - 30% the monthly fee? V. with managment yes this can be nice
Triksterism Gallente Frozen Corpse Inspection Services United Federation of Capsuleers	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:47:00 - [1853] Originally by: Virgo I'Platonicus Perhaps allow ghost training for 25 - 30% the monthly fee? V. Or at least give us skill queues or training for multiple characters per account. - Ghost Train & Snowflake
chotaire Caldari The Rising Stars Cosmic Anomalies	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:48:00 - [1854] Originally by: IR Scoutar Originally by: Koyama Ise CCP before you go bankrupt and lose your servers... release the source code... why the hell would you want the source code what you want is the IP or a free license to the eve universe Most useless and nonsense post of this thread, congratulations ;)
KingBobs Dawn	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:48:00 - [1855] Edited by: KingBobs Dawn on 14/10/2008 14:51:08 Edited by: KingBobs Dawn on 14/10/2008 14:48:27 Originally by: KingBobs Dawn Originally by: Virgo I'Platonicus Perhaps allow ghost training for 25 - 30% the monthly fee? V. with managment yes this can be nice >>>>or enable all chars on an account can train a skill at the same time or is this no bug CCP?
Aenemah Gallente	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:48:00 - [1856] Originally by: Triksterism Not everyone ghost trains their level 5's. However, it is a popular thing to do when people want to take a break from eve. People should have the option. It is what CCP promoted and it is what has attracted many people to the game. This. _ Veni, Vidi, Warpi. I came, I saw, I warped the hell out...
Adam Slysphere	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:49:00 - [1857] Originally by: Ratio Legis Edited by: Ratio Legis on 14/10/2008 14:45:14 Originally by: Adam Slysphere Originally by: Ratio Legis Originally by: Adam Slysphere If you're that strapped for cash, perhaps EVE should be way down on the priorities list? And you are arguing that it's a good change that would prompt a person to reevaluate his RL priorities and realize he's actually too poor to support his hoby, while a week ago he was not? I fail to see how this is impacting him ... If he was just running one account it's still going to be the same for him. And seriously, if he's that strapped for cash is running two accounts really that good of an idea? I'm not trolling and I'm all for people having a hobby and what not. All I'm saying is that if someone is that strapped for cash than perhaps he should focus less on an internet spaceship game and put his money elsewhere. Am I wrong in suggesting that people spend their money on important things in life instead of a video game? lol You mean you fail to see how upping the price of the service might affect a poor person to stop using the service? Because that's what just happened - CCP have announced how people need to pay more for getting the same thing. With the same justification you could argue that it's ok to double the subscription fee for everyone and the poor people can start paying for each second month, missing half the time. That's not how things work. And yes, you are wrong suggesting that you know better than people how and where they should spend their time and money. They're not upping the subscription fee, they're just closing a loop hole that players have been using to improve their characters without paying for the game. Which probably has gotten to be more of a problem since they started allowing characters to be bought and sold. Hey you're right, I shouldn't be telling the guy what to do with his money. It's best not to try and help people by making a suggestion and let them be idiots and hurt themselves. I say remove the safety warning from all products and let Darwinism take over.
Triksterism Gallente Frozen Corpse Inspection Services United Federation of Capsuleers	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:50:00 - [1858] Edited by: Triksterism on 14/10/2008 14:50:16 Originally by: Wygg Originally by: Triksterism You're missing the point. Not everyone ghost trains their level 5's. However, it is a popular thing to do when people want to take a break from eve. People should have the option. It is what CCP promoted and it is what has attracted many people to the game. The converse is Why should you get Carrier V without paying for it? $30 for Carrier V, don't think many people would train it if they had to pay for it. Those cap skills are quite lengthy at level 5. - Ghost Train & Snowflake
Jel Ting	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:50:00 - [1859] Originally by: Virgo I'Platonicus Originally by: Jel Ting Play the game Why? What's the point in playing a char that can't do shit ( and the first 45 days in skill training are a complete waste of time in EVE-sense of gameplay). You don't get more skill points by playing like u used to back in 2003. So why play? It'd be ok if you could get faster SP by activelly doing the thing you're skilling (like gettin sp for firing specific gun and so on) - you don't. This gimps new players and old players who will more or less stop looking forward to finding something new in eve. You never saw it in an add? Let me help u there: link - 4th paragraph. ah well. V. That is a guide, it tells you what to expect, not what is intent. It's not a mission statement or add stating we made it this way for you. We can get lawyered up for a semantic debate, but nah. So new players shouldn't play the game and figure things out? They shouldn't start with a frigate and lvl 1 missions? I started with 15k sp, now people start with 800-900k so your point is invalide withing 2 weeks of a new char now you can be in a t2 frigate with t2 weapons, so cry me a river, as for older players they have older chars they can wait for hulks to train or whatever and play their old account. I still think the character farming is a big aspect we are overlooking, why train one dread pilot when for the same cost I can train 2 and sell one to finance the hardware? So once again play the game, dont power level without paying. If you want to train and do whatever fine, just now you have to pay like the rest of us.
Virgo I'Platonicus Ex Eventus Corpi	Posted - 2008.10.14 14:50:00 - [1860] nice carrier pic :) <3

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