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Minny Sky
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Posted - 2008.11.12 23:29:00 -
[31]
Told ya. Welcome to the nano nerf 'bear. loololololol
Originally by: DMF KingBob Edited by: DMF KingBob on 12/11/2008 14:06:26 since i logged in this morning i have seen not one positiv effect of this expansion... but negativs are always there
here are the list of things that makes my morning sweet an ****ing me of
1. my raven flys with an overdrive injector only 130m/s instead 160m/s very good for an worlds collide lvl4......
2.09:11:58 Combat Paradise Cruise Missile hits Blood Spy (blood wrath frigate)for 14 damage.
i need over 15 salves of my 7 cruise missile launcher to get an cheep frigate down.... before the suck expansion i needed always not more then 5 salves
more **** offs comings soon..
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Korovyov
Luminous Love Brewery
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Posted - 2008.11.13 00:02:00 -
[32]
Originally by: DMF KingBob 2.09:11:58 Combat Paradise Cruise Missile hits Blood Spy (blood wrath frigate)for 14 damage.
Imagine if God nerfed American cruise missiles so that they only dented tiny boats like this. All of the winners in the world would go to Joe's Marina and WTFPWN the entire US Navy inside of an hour.
Way to go CCP. You've buffed industry by making it the only part of the game that works at all now! You WIN! And by win, I mean suck horse manure.
--=--=-- end of post --=--=--
got booze? |
Killer Kelly
The Social Club
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Posted - 2008.11.13 00:09:00 -
[33]
Have you considered that this is not real?
If we applied real world principles than frigs would be crappy and useless and nobody would use them.
Its called balance.
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Renee Alexis
Luminous Love Brewery
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Posted - 2008.11.13 00:11:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Killer Kelly Have you considered that this is not real?
If we applied real world principles than frigs would be crappy and useless and nobody would use them.
Its called balance.
It's called FAIL. _____________________________________
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Korovyov
Luminous Love Brewery
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Posted - 2008.11.13 00:12:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Killer Kelly Its called balance.
No. It's called mining. It's time to wipe away the tears, forget our woes, and train Exhumers to 5.
--=--=-- end of post --=--=--
got booze? |
Sissy Fuzz
Amarr Sissy Fuzz Communications
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Posted - 2008.11.13 00:36:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Firkragg oh noes you cant jsut sit there and spew missiles at everything anymore. Now like a turret user you will have to deal with letting your drones kill frigs.
What a load of crap. Missiles are guided weapons allowing the user to inflict damage from a distance. That is what missiles do, per se. EVE has missiles... but you seem to be insultet by that? Or what is wrong with you? Nobody's forcing you to use turrets - by all means, use missiles yourself if the advantage is so unfair that you even have to write imbecile posts like that. Or do you have real life issues? Is that it?
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Clydar Dramos
101st Space Marine Force The Leathernecks
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Posted - 2008.11.13 01:20:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Clydar Dramos on 13/11/2008 01:20:49 Doesn't seem to have effected Javelin Torps too much, still 1 shot the cruisers, and I never wasted ammo on Frigates so...
Not seeing the 50% range bonus though, still firing the same range they always did for me...
It is bulls*** that a Nighthawk firing precision heavies only gets 40 damage per missile (EM) on a microwarping Hawk though...
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Vanthropy
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.11.13 01:32:00 -
[38]
oh noes! no more easy mode! u all fail "SPEED + GANK = SPANK... Spank that ***** up" |
Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.11.13 08:31:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Vanthropy oh noes! no more easy mode! u all fail
NANO > NOW.
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Vanthropy
Minmatar
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Posted - 2008.11.13 08:50:00 -
[40]
nano? u mean... nanos+overdrives+1 istab+2 polycarbons? you had to fit all that to be effective?
now you only have to fit 2 odi's for optimal speed, 2 nanos for optimal versatility, or 2 istabs for optimal agility... sounds like.. less module slots wasted to me. sounds like +1 for CCP and Eve online "SPEED + GANK = SPANK... Spank that ***** up" |
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Murina
The Scope
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Posted - 2008.11.13 09:02:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Vanthropy nano? u mean... nanos+overdrives+1 istab+2 polycarbons? you had to fit all that to be effective?
No but it helped and made eve fun and it also involved a lot of skill on both sides of the fight.
Originally by: Vanthropy now you only have to fit 2 odi's for optimal speed, 2 nanos for optimal versatility, or 2 istabs for optimal agility... sounds like.. less module slots wasted to me.
And how effective is that setup in and combat....hmm let me see it does have a rather intricate counter that takes skill, pilot control, teamwork and timing.....LOCK TARGET, F1.
POST NERF PVP SKILLS: "shall we engage?" "hmmm how many ships do they have?" "more than us" "lets not bother then" "WOW great job FC!!!!" "................. |
sxndy
Gallente
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Posted - 2008.11.13 13:03:00 -
[42]
I always said domis were better for missions.
Now that gallente can no longer pvp, we'll be the richest race in eve.
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DMF KingBob
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Posted - 2008.11.13 15:30:00 -
[43]
this inbalance appears not by every frig but by some and it sucks
and ich cant talk about balance by this expansion becouse a expensiv ship with expensiv weapons and moduls harder skills has to be the better one thats the simple law of physic
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Megan Maynard
Minmatar Out of Order
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Posted - 2008.11.13 15:42:00 -
[44]
Originally by: CrestoftheStars Edited by: CrestoftheStars on 12/11/2008 11:53:33
Originally by: Vengal Seyhan
Originally by: KingBobs Dawn 10:31:44 Combat Devastator Cruise Missile hits Angel Webifier for 12 damage. cool what for a gread expansion.....
Maybe this spells the end of the Raven being the nber mission king?
Use light drones. Deal with full-stage agro like the rest of us :D
Besides, I usually find that you can pop those frigates quite easily while they're MWDing towards you and their sig radius is huge. Perhaps learn to prioritise targets that way instead of leaving the frigates 'til last and they're in close orbit around you?
dude you show that you have no idea what your talking about, the problem with missiles is the exp vel not the exp sig ;) so while they are mwd towards you, your missiles are truly useless:P
ps: better say that i think the calculation changes was great, although the base dmg need around 30% increase in dmg, so that they are variable and preferreble instead of turrets for some slow targets)
If your target is smaller then your exp sig you will NEVER hit the target for full damage no matter how fast your exp velocity is.
The sig radius damage is modified by the velocity, not the other way around as you are saying.
HENCE, the nano nerf.
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Atraxerxes
Caldari 22nd Black Rise Defensive Unit
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Posted - 2008.11.13 18:20:00 -
[45]
Personally I can fly a Raven and hate it.
While I did read about changes in the dev blog, take into consideration mission running is one of the most common aspects of game play in EVE.
In numerous pod cast interviews with CCP employees, one of the points they've stressed repeatedly is that while say 10% may have issues with a game play aspect and want it changed, the trickle down effect can often effect another 50% negatively.
Choosing to go to Caldari BS as opposed to skilling up for T2 drones is a major time difference and just trolling and telling people to adapt is an answer best left off the forum.
While I understand CCP's desire to balance game play between large & small ships, in RL a cruise missile fired at a F14 jet is going to insta pop it. A tank firing at a motor cycle, is going to insta pop it. I would have much rather seen a chance to hit ratio being calculated in stead of a signature radius/damage effect.
Make a frig harder to hit, but make sure the frig pilot knows that when that cruise missile does strike him perfectly, it will deliver the full blow. And sure velocity can play into that, but 20 damage from a cruise missile on a rat that at best is moving at 800 m/s raight at you? DoesnĘt make any sense.
Basically, if you show up to a gun fight with a knife, you shouldnĘt be rewarded.
EVE Chicago meet up March 7th 2009 See forum thread |
von Mannstein
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Posted - 2008.11.13 18:48:00 -
[46]
Edited by: von Mannstein on 13/11/2008 18:50:23 Edited by: von Mannstein on 13/11/2008 18:49:23 What if you are a ninja fighting sumo wrestlers?
The problem you whiners fail to realise is that no ship in Eve was ever meant to suck. This is not WoW where bigger numbers means auto-win, this is Eve where the stupid get beaten by what they ignored or failed to anticipate. Speed nerfs have been a part of Eve since before dual MWD cruisers got pasted prior to Exodus, so if you have spent the last three years building a character to exploit the errors in the system then more fool you.
Welcome to the world of Eve, where the game changes profoundly on a six monthly basis and the unskilled exploiters get battered into their rightful place by a team of devs as brutal as New Eden. I hope you enjoy your stay.
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Musashibou Benkei
Caldari Combined Imperial Fleet
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Posted - 2008.11.13 18:56:00 -
[47]
Edited by: Musashibou Benkei on 13/11/2008 18:56:14 If you thought that missiles were overpowered, you should have used them.
If you think that this nerf is balancing things out, your opinion is biased towards turrets (face it)
Missiles are MEANT to be effective for pve but not necessarily for pvp. That was the drawback missile users had when they went to pvp against you Neutron-Blaster-wielding-plate-fit-mega pilots. If anything, these people are the whiners this time round spewing their impotent argument with no logical sense.
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Dracthera
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Posted - 2008.11.13 19:51:00 -
[48]
Originally by: XDSKIRBYKIA
ahem,
If i fired a ICBM at a flee in Iraq please do not tell me the flee will survive, WHY THE HELL SHOULD THE FRIG!
RL ---> that way. This is a game with different rules. And it's spelled 'flea' not 'flee.'
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Anig Browl
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.11.13 20:12:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Vengal Seyhan Use light drones. Deal with full-stage agro like the rest of us :D
If you get full-stage aggro just by having your drones out, you're doing it wrong.
Quote: Perhaps learn to prioritise targets that way instead of leaving the frigates 'til last and they're in close orbit around you?
Have you ever flown a Raven? Apart from web/scram frigates, missile tactics require you to take out the large targets like battleships first, because they're the ones putting the big DPS on you while you wait for missiles to reach the target, cycle, and reload (which takes a hell of a lot longer than turrets, even if 'they hit every time').
Even before the nerf, there was no hope of instapopping frigates if you were in a battleship - so unloading one or two full racks on them while ignoring the battleships was suicidally stupid (as I learned the hard way). On the other hand, a good tank will let you soak up damage from numerous frigates all day while your drones chew through them.
I have not been moaning about the nerf in a big way, though more and more I think it's deeply flawed. But I'm getting quite sick of people who don't know what they're talking about saying 'Caldari are all carebears who never did PvP but hated nano and just spam missiles all day so ha ha ha for your stupid missiles'. Go polish your turret somewhere else.
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Anig Browl
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.11.13 20:17:00 -
[50]
Originally by: von Mannstein so if you have spent the last three years building a character to exploit the errors in the system then more fool you.
'Errors' is pretty subjective. You realise that right now missile explosion velocities are slower than the speed of sound, and indeed slower than the actual missile flight?
That's right, the propellant in the missile explodes faster than the warhead. So I'm petitioning CCP to not have my missiles explode any mroe - I calculate they'll do more damage if I just steer their mass into the target ship.
Think about it.
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Daggon BIgon
Amarr 24th Imperial Crusade
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Posted - 2008.11.13 20:43:00 -
[51]
I know game mechanics have no basis in reality. But I love this: C-4 pressure front ~8km/s... |
Nekopyat
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Posted - 2008.11.13 21:02:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Killer Kelly Have you considered that this is not real?
If we applied real world principles than frigs would be crappy and useless and nobody would use them.
Its called balance.
Actually other way around. There are reasons there are no battleships left in service IRL, and even when they were they were generally little more the mobile artillery for the Marine Corps. They stopped being useful as ships of the line once you had missiles and aircraft.
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steveid
Killed In Action
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Posted - 2008.11.13 23:21:00 -
[53]
Originally by: XDSKIRBYKIA Edited by: XDSKIRBYKIA on 12/11/2008 22:59:49 Edited by: XDSKIRBYKIA on 12/11/2008 22:58:23
Originally by: San Rintu Edited by: San Rintu on 12/11/2008 12:09:40 Warrior II's
Now stop trolling
Firing a missile bigger than the ship itself at a frigate. You do the maths. Cruise missiles are an anti BC/BS weapon.
ahem,
If i fired a ICBM at a flee in Iraq please do not tell me the flee will survive, WHY THE HELL SHOULD THE FRIG!
P.s i dont give a flying about what the turret users have to say aswell because the fact is Missiles != Turrents
an ICBM is an AOE weapon much like torpedo's used to be. A closer comparison would be a cruise missile in game is like, shockingly, a cruise missile oog. And if you tried to hit a flea with a bs you'd have no chance whatsoever.
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Aysia
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Posted - 2008.11.13 23:24:00 -
[54]
Those people comparing this to real life, are ****ed if a ballistic missile is launched at an f14 which only travels at about 138 meters a second. WTF do you think is going to happen, missiles go about 300m/s IRL but dont always hit a f14 which travels at 138m/s.
THis is a game and what you guys are whinning about is called balance. ALL the people that have come on hear havn't been saying I cant do missions anymore you have been crying cos they are hard now. Run lvl 4 in a moa then talk to me about hard, also might be good experiance for carebears how to actually utilise the ship they are flying instead of just slow boating.
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Jackspanoni
Black Hats Delta
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Posted - 2008.11.14 03:30:00 -
[55]
CCP doesn't care and are hostile to paying customers!!
http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=921235
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DMF KingBob
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Posted - 2008.11.14 10:49:00 -
[56]
next fail detected..
the lvl 4 mission "Alluring Emanations"
(at my agent) mission reward under 1 million isk... lp reward under 1000 lp
it apears around 40 small drones WITHOUT loot and bounty and after an half hour auf salvaging i have rig-parts in worth of around 1 million in my cargo
this mission is an complete fail and a insult for everyone that does this crap-mission...
(semi-good response) i must say the awards for corp members are still an nice thing but to expensive for much fighters of an battle that should become a award for and good job
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Jedziah
The Bastards
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Posted - 2008.11.14 11:37:00 -
[57]
Why on Earth would you compare surface missiles to Eve. The entire physics engine has to be compared to what players would call the 'Water Tank' effect.
If something much bigger than its target collides with it in a water tank, it would merely move the target along/bump it out the way. In no terms would it turn the target into Reggae Reggae sauce.
Think of a depth charge and a submarine. Most submarines would rupture due to the hull bolts loosening through the shock, not because the depth charge nuked the submarine.
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Durzel
Caldari
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Posted - 2008.11.14 11:47:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Musashibou Benkei Missiles are MEANT to be effective for pve but not necessarily for pvp.
Says who? You?
Ultimately missiles in PvE were king just because they required zero thought and very low training. Fit one gun, use whichever ammo is best for a given target, get in range (which is huge), fire and forget. All QR has done is changed dynamics so that drones are correctly needed more heavily by missile-boats.
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Rawthorm
Gallente The Establishment Establishment
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Posted - 2008.11.14 11:55:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Firkragg oh noes you cant jsut sit there and spew missiles at everything anymore. Now like a turret user you will have to deal with letting your drones kill frigs.
Yea like my sleipnir which one vollys frigs yet my nighthawk takes several vollys to kill the same frig...so balanced now isnt it
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cragz
Caldari CaldaCorp Quantum Star Alliance
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Posted - 2008.11.14 12:15:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Atraxerxes Personally I can fly a Raven and hate it.
While I did read about changes in the dev blog, take into consideration mission running is one of the most common aspects of game play in EVE.
In numerous pod cast interviews with CCP employees, one of the points they've stressed repeatedly is that while say 10% may have issues with a game play aspect and want it changed, the trickle down effect can often effect another 50% negatively.
Choosing to go to Caldari BS as opposed to skilling up for T2 drones is a major time difference and just trolling and telling people to adapt is an answer best left off the forum.
While I understand CCP's desire to balance game play between large & small ships, in RL a cruise missile fired at a F14 jet is going to insta pop it. A tank firing at a motor cycle, is going to insta pop it. I would have much rather seen a chance to hit ratio being calculated in stead of a signature radius/damage effect.
Make a frig harder to hit, but make sure the frig pilot knows that when that cruise missile does strike him perfectly, it will deliver the full blow. And sure velocity can play into that, but 20 damage from a cruise missile on a rat that at best is moving at 800 m/s raight at you? DoesnĘt make any sense.
Basically, if you show up to a gun fight with a knife, you shouldnĘt be rewarded.
First of All I just wanna applaud the sensible and well thought response above. Nicely said m8 and I totally agree.
Secondly Ive already mentioned in another topic how CCP want things to seem as REAL as possible with aspects of the game based on Real Life dynamics giving an example with a "Allied Apache with hellfires against a AK-47 terrorist in a clapped out truck accelerating to 80 mph"
A missile launcher is a launcher not a turret so why the heck should it be nerfed to be like one... we all had the choice at char creation which line of combat we wanted and I personally chose Launchers for devastation at range rather than pew pew up close and personal.
I just want to say that I never bothered to train standard launchers up to t2 before QR becuase the Light Missiles were effective enough on my hawk in high sec combat exploration sites against frigs .. fair enough T2 light missiles for pvp against other frigs. But my point it I used to be able to after burn round the high sec plexs in my hawk taking down most frigs in 1 maybe 2 volleys and on the odd occasion against dire pithi 3-6 volleys but Right before Downtime I did a plex with those ships ( same types as usual for me and the ones that died in 1-2 volleys now take 3 -4 and those pithi dires were taking most of a full load of 4x light missiles even though Im perma boosting straight at them at 774 m/s. That is just abosutly stupid.. Those plexes normally take me a few minutes but now there more like running a lvl 4 mission.
If im using a t2 frig with light missiles and after burning at 777 m/s (enough speed to keep the rat-frig glued to my hawks ****pit) to kill t1 ****ty high sec frig rat I expect the fcker to insta-pop especailly when a faction rat (t2) spawns and I insta pop it !!!
Ok so we can adapt .. how the hell does a shield tanking caldari missile fighter adapt with the mods and ships available to us ? I dont wanna sacrifice my tanks for painters and webs and be forced to keep my nose glued to my corp m8s asses just do a bit of combat .. I wanna keep my in-game indipendance without having to rely on others !!
and to all those who say ..Train Gunnery skills ? If we wanted to use turrets we'd have picked another bloody race or skills at char creation wouldnt we.
and yeah I already use t2 drones on certain ships like my drake but my ship used to wipe out most of the rats before my t2 light drones even started to bite.
The only good thing about this patch is the lag has defonatly improved a hell of alot.. thats about it.
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