I agree that it is broken compared to invention. A good solution? I could go either way. Either invention becomes more on par with the BPOs by some method or just remove the BPOs and reimburse the owners with a fair amount of isk.

A fair amount of ISK would be zero isk as that is what they were introduced as. You did not have to spend any ISK to obtain one so this would be a fair amount of ISK. As to people who bought them yes they should be reinbursed that ISK but it should be obtained by removing said ISK from the seller.

Problem solved.

A fair amount of ISK would be zero isk as that is what they were introduced as. You did not have to spend any ISK to obtain one so this would be a fair amount of ISK. As to people who bought them yes they should be reinbursed that ISK but it should be obtained by removing said ISK from the seller.

Problem solved.

Jesus Christ, why can't you people just let it go?

You don't like BPOs? Man up and buy some PLEX, convert to ISK, pay for BPOs, and Trash them. Problem solved.

But no, you have to DEMAND that people play the game YOUR way. Get the f*ck over it.

Yeah what she said!!!!!!!!!

Why should I accept that other players are getting massive advantages from CCP?

I dont get massive advantage from CCP.
I started EVE with the same amount of ISK as you did, AFTER T2 BPO were handed out.
If a player starts playing eve now he can have a T2 BPO in 1 month if he is clever, in 3 months if he is like you.
I dont see the problem here.

Jesus Christ, why can't you people just let it go?

Ehm no.... just no.... Cool can you teach me to make 100 billion Isk in 1 month in eve. Because that is how much many T2 BPO's are worth. 100 billion isk given by CCP to select players to help prop up allince warfare that is nothing but a sham and thus pointless.

OK you are all right so who do I nosh off at CCP to get my T2 BPO gift? It's unfair to just demand a T2BPO with out guzzling as much fat as all you other pets did and still do.

OK you are all right so who do I nosh off at CCP to get my T2 BPO gift? It's unfair to just demand a T2BPO with out guzzling as much fat as all you other pets did and still do.

to redeem your CCP pet t2 bpo gift you click
Contracts->Buy&Sell->Item Category:Blueprint Original->Search->sort by price->doubleclick the T2 BPO you want->click the accept button

No that's buying one for ISK from some one who gargled all ready, I want to gargle so I don't have to spend any isk.

Build time machine, goback in time to when they gave out T2 bpos, sign up for eve getT2 bpo, kick self for playing eve, you just invented a time machine.

Ehm no.... just no.... Cool can you teach me to make 100 billion Isk in 1 month in eve. Because that is how much many T2 BPO's are worth. 100 billion isk given by CCP to select players to help prop up allince warfare that is nothing but a sham and thus pointless.

Yet again who to nosh off is the question? Simply playing eve back then was not enought to behanded a BPO on the sly. By the way we'll all be needing time machines to play EVE when CCP failscades after Dust release so meh.

Seriously, dude, you don't have a friggin' clue what you're talking about. You should really stop posting now.

Your comment lacks substance enlighten me on the clue that I should be talking about.

Try this rant again when you are over a year old.

You've being playing to much eve, take a break. Knowledge in Real Life is not obtained overtime at a set given rate like skill points. It takes about 20 mins of research by new players to realise that Tech II BPO should be removed from game and that CCP was and still is propping up it's favoured corps.

So to sum up the thread thus far; "I'm too lazy to put any effort into getting something so it should be removed from people who have it already."

EvE is suposed to be a game about scarce resouces, a dog eat dog world where entities fight over the few scraps left in this world, the whole premise of the game is built around factions fighting for dominance of the few assets in this world since it was cut off from the EvE Gate.

The idea of an infinate resource in this game, one that generates such masses of ISK for absolutly no risk or effort stands against this games very core. Its just plain broken and needs to be fixed.

TLDR; Remove T2 BPO and force people to compeate with the rest of EvE like every other aspect of the game.

What is scarcer than T2 BPOs?

The effort that was required to originally obtain it.

How much effort does it take to get a T1 BPO

As much effort as it takes to earn the isk, usually? These days it's the same way you get a T2 BPO, through the effort used to earn the isk, if an opportunity is present. So yes, there is effort.

Yeah either introduce the lottery again - make industry a nice equal footing profession again or remove them.

It's simple, it requires little thought to realise how unbalanced this is and unfair to current newer playerbase.

Jesus Christ, why can't you people just let it go?

You don't like BPOs? Man up and buy some PLEX, convert to ISK, pay for BPOs, and Trash them. Problem solved.

But no, you have to DEMAND that people play the game YOUR way. Get the f*ck over it.

Using a broken mechanic (Incursion farmers income) to defend anther broken mechanic (the sloppy distributed T2 BPOs) is kinda dumb.

But since you claim to have bought 5 T2 BPOs the odds are you are not very bright or very rich from some other source, since they sell for such a high price they almost never make economic sense, unless you caught a lucky sale or just looking to invest a mountain of idle isk to get some return for it.

The investment only makes sense on the basis of passive income since a BPO is caple of much longer production runs

I think it's funny how there are never any counter arguments in these threads. These threads are always about bashing the OP and never about really discussing T2 BPOs. The funny thing is I think we all know why this is, there are no good reasons to keep them in-game. It's just people trying to protect their investments, and I guess some people just hop on the "bash the OP because he's bad at Eve"-bandwagon thinking they're cool by doing so. At least that's how I see it.

As stated it is the same old CCP pets on alt accounts who use invalid argument or just personall attacks to protect the one thing in EVE that puts them where they are. These are players who've lived off CCP hand outs in the form of gifted T2 BPO's their entire game life.

I will do my up most to keep this thread at the top of the board so that New players are quickly made aware of the existance of T2BPO and how they were given out by CCP to pet players and corps so that they could undercut new players and feel that they were some how better at industry. The BPO that allows the basic printing of ISK with zero thought or effort that allows you to miss an entire tedious step of gameplay.

Yet again if you bought the T2BPO disregard you should be compensate in full by ISK removed from the seller.

Wow, you really need to let it go. So I'm a CCP pet? I don't own a T2 BPO. Never have and never will. I've also made billions from invention. Hell I could have bought several T2 BPO's if I wanted. But instead of whining about them as some unfair advantage, I did the math and found out that *gasp* they aren't worth it!

Let it go man.

Yeah what she said!!!!!!!!!

So let see, basically T2 BPOs should be removed because not everyone has one and they cost more than some noob can afford?

Your comment lacks substance enlighten me on the clue that I should be talking about.

First clue: Not all T2 bpos are worth 100B.

Second clue: Most original T2 BPO holders worked their butts off to get them. Yes, they were randomly distributed. But each research point was like a lottery ticket, and you didn't get those RP by shaking a tree. Try to get 30 Lv5 R&D agents on two accounts, across multiple factions, whose standings you grinded for 4 months, to get a Wasp II BPO in the end (which ended resold to my corp for 750M), and come back tell me how I "unfairly got a massive 100B isk support from CCP".


Third clue: Without having any T2 BPO atm, I can easily gain more than double the isks than a holder of even the best T2 bpo over the same time period. It just require a bit more sweat. Hint: a T2 BPO can't use more than one factory line.

Thats not the problem. Was a broken mechanic and CPP changed it. And nowdays we cant compete.

Colector ships are destroyed by use but BPO t2 never expire and thats wrong.

T2 BPOs have been removed when peoples' accounts get suspended due to being caught using exploits (see below), and I've seen at least one killmail showing a destroyed T2 BPO, so that claim's a bit wide of the mark too.

Quote:

The assets removed from the game by our actions because of this exploit consist of large numbers of capital ships including some motherships and titans, over 30 Tech II BPOs and other valuable items as well as large amounts of ISK.

Yes T2 BPO's can be ganked while in ships. One of the major porblems with T2 BPO's is that they can not be stolen by corp members. This is wrong if you trust a player to use this item it should be able to be stolen. How the hell do CCP explain this. ''Here have free access to this item so you can make stuff, hey don't go near that item or steal it''. It makes zero sense a good nerf for T2 BPO would have been to make them unlockable. Although we should not comprimise and still push for a complete removal of said items.

also, I dont have a state raven, and new players cant get them, remove them too?
I dont have a freki, remove those?
i dont have a mimir, remove those?
ive never gotten an officer spawn, nerf officers?
i dont have a titan, remove those?
i dont have a technicium moon, nerf those?
i dont have a revanant, remove those?

Collector ships are destroyed if used no invalance there.
You can build new titans
you can conquest a technetium moon.


BPO T2 in a station cant be destroyed and make an invalance in the economy.
You cant compete in lots of item because it invention cost is above its selling point.

EvA

honestly, if you think t2 bpo's are so powerfull and you can make trillions from them, go buys some. like most of teh people who own them currently have.
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=90294&find=unread
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https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=87733&find=unread
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=89975&find=unread


if they are so so bad, ccp can buy many every week and remove them the fair way

Lets do some numbers :

Excl. drones/charges, the most produced T2 items from BPOs in March were: Exp. Cargohold (19%), Rocket Launcher (94%), Cap Recharger (22%).

cap recharger ii
selling 2k-4k unit / day

http://www.eve-market-guide.com/t1item.php?id=2032#

Optimal manufacturing cost171,913.16
Optimal manufacturing time42m 46s
Jita sales price712,896.00
Profit per hour758,978.27
Per day 18,215,478,48
Per month 546464160

Free money

invention cost

Totals
Invention cost216,233.64
Optimal manufacturing cost181,347.47
Optimal manufacturing time1h 46m 40s
Jita sales price712,896.00
Profit per hour177,364.62

see any diference?

yeh you forgot to x the invented number by 10, as the inventor can make at least 10 slots worth and teh bpo holder can only use that bpo once... nerf invention, buff t2bpo's dam it

With the other 9 spaces i can make invention with the money i earn i can pay another acount for free and have 30 new slots.

your point?

EvA

Yes T2 BPO's can be ganked while in ships. One of the major porblems with T2 BPO's is that they can not be stolen by corp members. This is wrong if you trust a player to use this item it should be able to be stolen. How the hell do CCP explain this. ''Here have free access to this item so you can make stuff, hey don't go near that item or steal it''. It makes zero sense a good nerf for T2 BPO would have been to make them unlockable. Although we should not comprimise and still push for a complete removal of said items.

Two things and then I'm done with this ludicrous thread:
1) You should stop now. You look like an idiot, so just move on.
2) Since you started this anorexic thread, how many T2 BPOs have you bought and trashed?

I have T2 BPO's that I have stopped manufactuing from since it takes a HUGE amount of time to actually make, move and sell those items, and the margins are slim.

Also, tell your friends about this game. Get another 50k to log in, and the T2 BPO's will not be a problem.
Also, once a Drake cost as much as a HAC, the use of HAC's will go up, and, voila, profit.

So u can guess what are the margins for the same items doing invention?

T2 will still be a problem. Only owners of BPO T2 like the free card that they have free money isnt easy to say not too.

EvA

[quote=Eva Volkova][quote=qDoctor Strangelove]

What I fail to see is WHY the investment of these industrialists should be nulled?


.

T2 will still be a problem. Only owners of BPO T2 like the free card that they have free money isnt easy to say not too.

[quote=Eva Volkova]

The stupidity of your postings made my eyes bleed.

Paying 2b-150b isk does NOT equal free

I invented and still invent an insane amount of modules (yes i used the system you claim is broken) to earn the money to pay for my "free" T2 BPO.

Everyone else can do exactly the same thing if he wants.

The first owner didnt pay that amount of money if was given by a lottery.

If you payd that is because the owner didnt whant the BPO.

And if you paid 5 isk o 5 billion dosnt make you have more reason.

The sistem is broken lets agree how to change it.

If you think BPO T2 are good then look for a sistem to reintroduce them in the game.

I have explain mi point of view.

Ships (like titans) cost a lot of money and they are being balanced all the time.

why cant we look for a way to resolve the problem?

EvA

why cant we look for a way to resolve the problem?

EvA

And winning the lottery was, in the vast majority of cases, the result of a lot of sweat and time involved.

And time = money.

I know a guy who had 3 accounts. 9 characters. 54 lv5 R&D agents. With all relevant skills maxed. Involved SP in the multiple dozens of millions.

So he got a few BPOs. If you imply again that he just was handed over those BPOs because he got lucky, I'll start calling you names.


Invention need to take into account the ME/PE of the BPC used in the process. That would reduce significantly the margin between Bpo-produced and invention-produced stuff. But that's all that's needed.

There is no need to reintroduce T2 BPOs. If you still want reasons, just think how a massive influx from those prints would obsolete Invention. Or the unnecessary economic disruption for those who invested in one.

Speaking of reasons, I have yet to see a reason for removing T2 Bpos that doesn't reek of envy.

You are entitled to pay any amount of money for anything if you think it is worth that. Dosent mean that the item real value is that.

The first owner didnt pay that amount of money if was given by a lottery.

If you payd that is because the owner didnt whant the BPO.

And if you paid 5 isk o 5 billion dosnt make you have more reason.

The sistem is broken lets agree how to change it.

If you think BPO T2 are good then look for a sistem to reintroduce them in the game.

I have explain mi point of view.

Ships (like titans) cost a lot of money and they are being balanced all the time.

why cant we look for a way to resolve the problem?

EvA

I think I said I was done with the thread, but like the Mob, it just keeps pulling me back in again.

So let me get this straight. You think that because the original owner of the BPO didn't pay the price they demand today that the "sistem" [sic] is broken? And what does selling price of a T2 BPO have to do with anything at all?

I'm trying to get your point, but your jumps in rational logic are hard to follow. It's been made clear both in threads of this nature and CCP's own numbers that items from T2 BPOs on the whole barely scratch the surface in terms of numer of T2 igtems sold. So the argument that the T2 BPOs that you guys are INSISTING were free are imbalancing the system is rediculous. It's just another take on the "free minerals" non-sense.

if you change invention to be more profitable for X item, then people will start inventing X item until there is no profit. removeing the t2 bpo's will do the same thing, people will flock to what ever is most profitable until there is no more profit!]
the only thing removing t2 bpo's will do, is cause people to do massive ammounts of speculation.

Petition to Remove T2BPO sign in thread for support.

Yes another T2 BPO Removal Thread so many of these over the years from so many players. It's as if something might be wrong and in need of correction in Eve.

T2 BPO were introduced to the game unfairly and given to selected CCP pets a massive advantage over inventors or a massive ISK dump to those who sold them, this was wrong and is in need of correction. T2 BPO's should be reinbursed to owning players in the form of Research points spent on the lottery.

So lets start off with some voices from CCP pet players who know their crappy allinces and corps will crumble without being propped up by CCP gifted ISK, God forbid that they fight other corps on even terms with out massive CCP assistance.

Just reimbursing people for taking their T2 Bpos will not be fair at all. I never won any lotteries, I had to wait years to finally buy a T2 bpo. Just giving me my isk back will be so unfair in many ways. What about all the time I spent grinding this game, saving my isk to buy my T2 bpos!?

It is way faster to make isk these days as to when I had to grind it out.

This game does not owe you anything! Stop complaining you slacker, and go and earn your worth.

Remove invention... because lets face it, f*** that clickfest.

Add T1/T2 toggle to every BPO in game.

Easy theorycrafting from here by CCP.

Great idea, let's remove whole layers of industry and make it super-easy like wow. Because what set Eve appart from other vanilla MMOs is not it's depth, not at all...


I swear, the level of stupid in this thread is reaching critical mass.

I fully support the removal of T2 BPOs. It only widens the gap between the 125+ Million SP players/corps/alliances and those who are 2-3 yrs old or less. If they have all the skills why should they not be forced to use them and have all the same chance as the rest of us to obtain them. Instead, they had trillions of ISK to blow on **** from the Tech moons that most of us will never even see no matter how long we play the game of EvE.

CCP must realize that. They have the skills, make them ******* use them.

This thread is never leaving front page, Well while I have an active account. New players beware T2BPO and CCP pets are still ruining this game for new players with there super duper ISK gifts and special items.

I'm sure new players will hopefully understand the value of working for something rather than having is given to them, which is what you and others in this thread are advocating. Hard work means nothing to you and "EvA", so you insist that CCP penalize those that put in years--- YEARS--- of hard work in favor of give-aways.

There's something you people just don't get:
1) If you don't want T2 BPOs in the game, buy them and then trash them. But you're not willing to put the money into doing that, unlike those of us that have T2 BPOs.
2) You don't understand the economics behind T2 BPO usage: it's been stated over and over in this thread, and you still goose-step on the removal bandwagon without giving a rational explanation of what is wrong having them in game. CCPs own numbers show that BPO production is a MINOR part of the market, overall, but you still seem to have the misguided notion that everything is out there because of T2 BPO production. Grow up.

For the new industrialists, I offer you the opposite side the the argument: work hard to get to a place of success, and reap the rewards. None of the black helicopter, "CCP pets" boolshite exists here, unlike what the advocates consistently fall back on. There's one truth here about the remove-T2-BPO side of this argument (and someone mentioned it earlier):

Envy.

[ /thread]

T2BPO were given for free as gifts both sanctioned and unsanctioned by ccp along with corrupt lottery. Remove them and end CCP's darkest hour once and for all.

T2BPO were given for free as gifts both sanctioned and unsanctioned by ccp along with corrupt lottery. Remove them and end CCP's darkest hour once and for all.

Look at all the T2 BPO owners crying at the thought of having to do invention like the rest of EVE players. It's so sexy.

Look at all the T2 BPO owners crying at the thought of having to do invention like the rest of EVE players. It's so sexy.

T2BPO were given for free as gifts both sanctioned and unsanctioned by ccp along with corrupt lottery. Remove them and end CCP's darkest hour once and for all.

lol do you think owners of T2 Bpos don't do inventions? Dude go play WoW, there you get lots of shinies for free. You will fit right in with all the QQ'ers there.

So T2 BPOs make the game more difficult as opposed to forcing them to use their research skills like the rest of us?? Your logic is flawed. The T2 BPOs make it easier for a small few, removing them makes it more difficult for ALL of us.

I insist that all those defending T2BPO go play wow clearly they like to be gifted items that allow a massive advantage over regular players. Item's that can be locked away in stations pumping items/isk out at zero effort 24/7. While their oppenents ahve to put a lot of effort into invention to create their items