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Silver Nightmare
NightSong Entertainment
NightSong Directorate
0
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Posted - 2012.04.13 21:17:00 -
[31] - Quote
Touche good WT touche |
roboto212
Hull Breach Inc.
Double Tap.
17
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 21:38:00 -
[32] - Quote
Silver Nightmare wrote:Touche good WT touche
I must say you are the nicest WT's ever I mean giveing me a large tower after useing that big bad moros on my poor defenseless mega. You guys have class i don't care what those other low sec people say. |
Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
149
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 22:42:00 -
[33] - Quote
It's mostly the attitude. Just calling someone who plays EVE a "PvP'er" is ridiculous, This is EVE. Everyone is a PvPer, it is a PvP based game. That and you got your attitude from playing any other MMORPG in which PvP combat is shunned because the goal of those games is to band together to kill some big dragon. That is not EVE. EVE is a dog eat dog world centered around competing with other players for limited resources.
Somehow you seem to think you are the white knight good guy Keanu Reeves and PvPers are the bad guy out to ruin everyone's fun. It is the other way around, we are supposed to attack, swindle, steal, scam, ransom, and kill everything and everyone in order to get more power and riches. That is the whole point of EVE. Telling us that PvPers should only fight against themselves is just completely backwards to how the game is designed. We hunt defenseless targets *solely* because they chose to be defenseless targets with high value cargo and do not properly defend themselves.
Now I don't care if you don't want to PvP, but you have not given it a fair shake. You have brought your own opinion of how PvP is somehow inherently evil even though this could not be more further from the truth. I'd say a good 90% of the super carebears I know who try PvP combat find that they really enjoy it. If someone attacks you or messes with you, the correct response is to get some bigger guns and blow them out of space for daring to mess with you, not cower and whine like a 4 year old.
Instead of being paralyzed in fear of someone interacting with you or attacking you in a video game, you need to:
Be a man
We must be swift as the coursing river
Be a man
With all the force of a great typhoon
Be a man
With all the strength of a raging fire
Mysterious as the dark side of the moon |
Katja Faith
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
31
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 23:05:00 -
[34] - Quote
Five Thirty wrote:
My question is:
Why does this bother some of you?
It bothers people because you're playing YOUR game, and not theirs. |
Lady Ayeipsia
Morskoj Industries
73
|
Posted - 2012.04.13 23:36:00 -
[35] - Quote
I too like missioning. I like inventing and manufacturing. I hate the numbers part, but I like being a dealer in space ships. I enjoy popping rats, salvaging, and selling the rigs I make in out of the way places at high prices. So I can sympathize with the op in this regard.
However, no rat, no mission, no successful invention, and not even selling at 500% jita markup has ever gotten my heart pounding as fast or as loud as stalking a gate camping blackbird with a stealthbomber. The success of our fight depend on me killing or chasing that blackbir d from the field.
Try pvp... You may find something new that sparks a little fire in your belly. |
Psychic Sue
The Executives
Executive Outcomes
0
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Posted - 2012.04.14 01:06:00 -
[36] - Quote
tl;dr I know you are a fast poster and a vocal one too, but at least have the courtesy to check your facts before you claim something to be true and build your chain of arguments on top of it. CONCORD was there from the beginning, it was not added due to what you claim was a forum whine and it was constantly updated to keep highsec PVP at bay from at least the 3rd patch onwards, being less than 30 days from the game's conception in 2003.
masternerdguy wrote:Five Thirty wrote:masternerdguy wrote:I don't care if you want to PVP! This is EVE, and you signed up for a game which is one big giant open pvp arena. Then why does CONCORD shoot you when you agress me in highsec? Because people like you cried on the forums back in 2003 enough to make CCP introduce concord. Besides, I can still gank you or get you to aggress me in lots of ways.
For the sake of arguing with a forum warrior, not in the interest of pvp vs. pve and meant in the nicest sense really, I dare to question the validity your argument.
First: you were not there, your character was created in March 2011 and yet you use historical events and patchnotes in a way that suggest your were there at the time they were written.
Second: If you had been there and checked your records, you should not have ommitted that CONCORD as such was part of the storyline and eve from at least 2001 as seen in the Chronicle's picture timestamp here, two full years prior to what you have stated being their conception.
Third: Now you may state that you in fact were present at that time and have the knowledge of that time too on a different character and/or account but chose not to use this original character but instead this 03/2011 newcomer of yours to educate us on eve history; then your argument would of course be that the patchnotes obviously enforce your claim.
Fourth: The first mention of a CONCORD change was in the EVE patch to v.1054, which as you of course know was issued as early as the 30th of May 2003, being the third EVE patch at all, less than one month after the game's release and way before it's first expansion. Out of personal experience I will contest you in that fact that "whining on the forums" as you claim it to be was not present at that time and as the patch notes will tell you, this constructive criticism was not to conceive CONCORD but to change it.
PS: this is in no way a favour for PVE or PVP, merely a call for truth in arguments.
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Silver Nightmare
NightSong Entertainment
NightSong Directorate
0
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Posted - 2012.04.14 05:03:00 -
[37] - Quote
While we are on the subject you may want to take a look at MNGs toon, its not a 2011, granted from what I looked at its 2007 but still lets keep facts straight when we are talking about keeping facts straight. Hey I think i'll make a meme of that!
=P |
Roime
Shiva Furnace
476
|
Posted - 2012.04.14 05:58:00 -
[38] - Quote
OP,
I guess your terms "PVE" and "PVP" are relevant in some other games, in EVE they don't exist. There is only one server, with "PVP rules" if you want to keep using that game lingo.
|
Zeb Rain
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2012.04.14 09:48:00 -
[39] - Quote
Bother us? not at all. You may not wish to PvP and that is your prerogative. You may wish to avoid pvp again your choice. However it is our choice to ignore your desire not to pvp. You dont want to fight? fine, battle is over sooner and we move on to someone else. It is called agreeing to disagree.
GL |
Mark Androcius
17
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Posted - 2012.04.14 10:16:00 -
[40] - Quote
This reminds me of a Southpark episode about toilet seats.
Women are nagging that men should put the toilet seat down and men are nagging that women could just as well put it down themselves.
Why don't women put the toilet seat up for me huh?
Yes i am dutch, no i don't do drugs. |
Ildryn
The Inf1dels
GIANTSBANE.
44
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Posted - 2012.04.14 10:19:00 -
[41] - Quote
Five Thirty wrote:
It's really not about helping corpmates. We cannot win a war with PvP combat, none in my alliance are trained or prepared to fight people who PvP on a daily basis. Instead, we win the war by wasting their time so much that they go away. As I mentioned in the OP, you cannot force someone into PvP.
How does a npc corp go to war? How do you have an alliance?
|
Salicaz
Wolfsbrigade
Lost Obsession
7
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Posted - 2012.04.14 10:26:00 -
[42] - Quote
Op reminds me of the people on other games who roll on a pvp server and cry like a ***** when they get attacked.
This is Eve
There is only one server
IT'S ALL PVP!!! |
Ludi Burek
The Player Haters Corp
42
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Posted - 2012.04.14 10:37:00 -
[43] - Quote
There is one key part of the equation, the market. If you were selling to NPCs and buying from NPCs then who cares if you just like to pve. That's your thing, that's how the game was designed. In that case claims that forced pvp is griefing may even hold some merit.
Eve is different though. You sell to other players, buy from other players. Claiming that you are a "PVEer" and everyone else is forcing you to pvp simply doesn't apply.
Eve is built around competition. The tools are in game to make yourself as safe as possible within game mechanics. It's people that demand artificial safety and those that rage if someone interferes with their game that are clueless and too selfish to see the imbalance of their demands.
As long as you actually get what's going on but you prefer to avoid direct conflict, who really cares if some internet person doesn't like your play style. But when you start demanding that pvp is wrong and you should be safe and protected, then you're crossing into moron territory. Observing these forums, you will notice, it is densely populated. |
Dutarro
Matari Munitions
The Fendahlian Collective
66
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Posted - 2012.04.14 11:22:00 -
[44] - Quote
OP raises a valid point. If you attack an industrial corp for economic reasons that's one thing, but forum rhetoric comes off as more of an ideological crusade against "carebearism". Case in point, that long, deranged anti-carebear manifesto someone posted recently. Reminds me of how puritanism is sometimes described as "the fear that somewhere, someone is having fun". This idea that players hiding in every nook and cranny of EVE must be rooted out and engaged in combat is a bit fanatical. |
Mark Androcius
17
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Posted - 2012.04.14 12:20:00 -
[45] - Quote
Ildryn wrote:How does a npc corp go to war? How do you have an alliance?
While your question is not actually that weird, i have to ask, how long have you been playing EVE?
You think most people would post things like this with their main char?
Yes i am dutch, no i don't do drugs. |
Jackie Ozuwara
The roid broke mah lazors
0
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Posted - 2012.04.14 12:52:00 -
[46] - Quote
What I wonder is why someone who is not interested in PVP at all would pay monthly fees for a PVP-oriented game. You might as well play a singleplayer game like X-¦ and have no other players at all. As Ludi said, even on the market you're entirely interacting with other player, essentially non-combat PVP as well. If you can call it that. The thing is, unless you play a classic MMO like WOW on a PVE server, you can't escape other players, no matter how much you want to. |
Mark Androcius
17
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Posted - 2012.04.14 13:06:00 -
[47] - Quote
Jackie Ozuwara wrote:What I wonder is why someone who is not interested in PVP at all would pay monthly fees for a PVP-oriented game. You might as well play a singleplayer game like X-¦ and have no other players at all. As Ludi said, even on the market you're entirely interacting with other player, essentially non-combat PVP as well. If you can call it that. The thing is, unless you play a classic MMO like WOW on a PVE server, you can't escape other players, no matter how much you want to.
Fair point there, but on the other hand, not fair at all.
When CCP started to make EVE, their intention was to make a sandbox and see what happens ( well sort of at least ).
When Goonswarm came up, CCP actually took the time to think about, if they should do something about it, which to me, indicates that this was not intended.
The fact that CCP decided not to act on it, has nothing at all to do with what EVE was actually meant for.
When large scale scams and theft came to play, CCP actually took the time to think about what to do about it.
The fact that CCP decided not to act on that either, has nothing at all to do with what EVE was actually meant for.
My point here is this:
Why do people claim EVE was meant to be played in a certain way, when all it was meant for, was to play it however the hell you wanted?
So in other words, as EVE is and always will be a sandbox, you avoid PVP if you don't want PVP and you pursue PVP if you do.
You avoid mining if you hate mining and you do mining if you don't.
You avoid PVE if you don't want PVE and you do PVE if you do want PVE.
EVE is a sandbox, how many times does that have to be repeated?
O one other thing.
When i was a little kid, playing in a sandbox at school, i used to love destroying other people's sandcastle's, but others used to love making them.
Yes i am dutch, no i don't do drugs. |
Jackie Ozuwara
The roid broke mah lazors
0
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Posted - 2012.04.14 13:14:00 -
[48] - Quote
Mark Androcius wrote:Jackie Ozuwara wrote:What I wonder is why someone who is not interested in PVP at all would pay monthly fees for a PVP-oriented game. You might as well play a singleplayer game like X-¦ and have no other players at all. As Ludi said, even on the market you're entirely interacting with other player, essentially non-combat PVP as well. If you can call it that. The thing is, unless you play a classic MMO like WOW on a PVE server, you can't escape other players, no matter how much you want to. When Goonswarm came up, CCP actually took the time to think about, if they should do something about it, which to me, indicates that this was not intended. The fact that CCP decided not to act on it, has nothing at all to do with what EVE was actually meant for. When large scale scams and theft came to play, CCP actually took the time to think about what to do about it. The fact that CCP decided not to act on that either, has nothing at all to do with what EVE was actually meant for.
You can't deny that EVE is and simply has more PVP than most other MMOs. Whether or not that was what EVE was "actually meant for" is not relevant. The fact is, PVP happens in EVE, it happens a lot, EVE is a lot less controlled and policed than most other MMOs, and that's the environment you have to accept when you sign up for EVE.
Sitting there in HiSec and claiming that mean players, pirates and people who PVP are either bad or playing wrong is just inappropriate. As you said, there's no "right" way to play EVE, but following that, there's no "wrong" way either. |
Mark Androcius
17
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Posted - 2012.04.14 13:27:00 -
[49] - Quote
Jackie Ozuwara wrote:You can't deny that EVE is and simply has more PVP than most other MMOs. Whether or not that was what EVE was "actually meant for" is not relevant. The fact is, PVP happens in EVE, it happens a lot, EVE is a lot less controlled and policed than most other MMOs, and that's the environment you have to accept when you sign up for EVE.
Sitting there in HiSec and claiming that mean players, pirates and people who PVP are either bad or playing wrong is just inappropriate. As you said, there's no "right" way to play EVE, but following that, there's no "wrong" way either.
I happen to think the exact same way you do, i was just trying to get some nuance into the mix.
However, saying that one could better play the X series of games, solely for this reason, is a little bit ( yes a little ) far fetched, EVE is way more than just a PVP oriented game.
It has unmatched awesomeness in it's graphics, market dynamics, life-like industrial chains and man managed politics.
EVE attracts people for a million reasons, otherwise, you could just as well play Warhammer or Guild Wars 2.
Yes i am dutch, no i don't do drugs. |
Jackie Ozuwara
The roid broke mah lazors
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.14 13:45:00 -
[50] - Quote
I think it's just a little pretentious and ignorant to claim that pirates and "mean" players are bad at the game because they prey on weak targets. As if they're bound to assign to some code of honor or sportsmanship to prove their ability. I bet most of those players could handle any given ship better than the miner they just blew up, because they didn't spend half their days sitting in an asteroid field in HiSec clicking a button every 2 minutes and watching cash roll in. |
Mark Androcius
17
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Posted - 2012.04.14 13:53:00 -
[51] - Quote
Jackie Ozuwara wrote:I think it's just a little pretentious and ignorant to claim that pirates and "mean" players are bad at the game because they prey on weak targets. As if they're bound to assign to some code of honor or sportsmanship to prove their ability. I bet most of those players could handle any given ship better than the miner they just blew up, because they didn't spend half their days sitting in an asteroid field in HiSec clicking a button every 2 minutes and watching cash roll in.
True.
I mine a lot too though, when I'm at work.
I can't pay attention to the game the whole time, so this allows me to make isk semi afk.
I however, have been smart enough to find a system nobody ever really pays attention too, so maybe that's a good tip for the moaning miners.
Yes i am dutch, no i don't do drugs. |
Ildryn
The Inf1dels
GIANTSBANE.
44
|
Posted - 2012.04.14 16:05:00 -
[52] - Quote
Mark Androcius wrote:Ildryn wrote:How does a npc corp go to war? How do you have an alliance?
While your question is not actually that weird, i have to ask, how long have you been playing EVE? You think most people would post things like this with their main char?
I would...
|
Ardashir Sarum
Rage Against The Evil Minmatar
0
|
Posted - 2012.04.14 16:13:00 -
[53] - Quote
Five Thirty wrote:
...
Why does this bother some of you?
...
It does not bother us. We just don't stop trying to shoot you.
|
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
257
|
Posted - 2012.04.14 16:34:00 -
[54] - Quote
The OP and 90 percent of this thread misses the point of EVE.
OP is PvPing. Her goal in PvP is not to make the other guy's ship to explode, but to stay alive herself and deny the other guy the kill, but nevertheless, when you fly smart so that you can evac from a mission site before you get scrammed by someone showing up, you are in fact engaging in PvP play.
EVE PvP is not about an arena where you go and see who wins a duel. EVE PvP is about doing your stuff and stopping other people from stopping you. Just because your ship does not have guns on it does not mean you are not PvPing.
And why it bothers some people that the OP does this - why, it's because the OP is winning. She achieves her goals while denying the opposition theirs. |
Astroniomix
EliteTroll
48
|
Posted - 2012.04.14 16:40:00 -
[55] - Quote
Five Thirty wrote:masternerdguy wrote:I don't care if you want to PVP! This is EVE, and you signed up for a game which is one big giant open pvp arena. Then why does CONCORD shoot you when you agress me in highsec?
Because if all of eve was nullsec nothing would happen. |
Propmod
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
32
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Posted - 2012.04.14 17:19:00 -
[56] - Quote
Five Thirty wrote:masternerdguy wrote:To that question, it bothers me they want to change game mechanics to make themselves safer to avoid any unwanted pvp, thus ruining the game I love. You still haven't answered my question. Why do you insist on PVPING people who aren't interested in, or cannot, fight back? Because they're carebears just like you. Ignore high sec "pvpers" For the most part they're just scrubs who cant hack it else where.
|
Astroniomix
EliteTroll
48
|
Posted - 2012.04.14 20:00:00 -
[57] - Quote
Propmod wrote:Five Thirty wrote:masternerdguy wrote:To that question, it bothers me they want to change game mechanics to make themselves safer to avoid any unwanted pvp, thus ruining the game I love. You still haven't answered my question. Why do you insist on PVPING people who aren't interested in, or cannot, fight back? Because they're carebears just like you. Ignore high sec "pvpers" For the most part they're just scrubs who cant hack it else where.
This is true in many cases. There are exceptions, but a fair portion of the griefdecking crowd will run from anything that mounts a sensor booster. |
Eryn Velasquez
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
11
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Posted - 2012.04.14 21:16:00 -
[58] - Quote
Mark Androcius wrote:
O one other thing.
When i was a little kid, playing in a sandbox at school, i used to love destroying other people's sandcastle's, but others used to love making them.
Well, some people grow up, some stay kids all their life ...
Suicide gankers - Silly griefing kiddies, annoying like dog poop under my shoes |
BearJews
Android Arms And Industrial Corporation
Tenth Legion
32
|
Posted - 2012.04.14 22:36:00 -
[59] - Quote
some people love to bully people that want nothing to do with them. Even though this is just a game, people's personalities will always cross the lines between reality and virtual reality.
I hate bullys therefore dont understand greifing or hi-sec war deccing or any of that ****. DOes it bother me to the point where i question people's game morals??? GOD NO.
But i love bully tears. THere is nothing greater in this game then hearing bullies whine when things do not go their way.
Like the introduction of concord is a great tear. Or the boomerang technique, another great tear. Or how hi-sec greifers want you to play their game. Another great tear. |
Elsebeth Rhiannon
Gradient
Electus Matari
265
|
Posted - 2012.04.15 05:31:00 -
[60] - Quote
I think it is unfair to call all high-sec random war-deccing bullying. It is a mechanic that definitely can be and is used for bullying, but it is also a mechanic that some people use to haunt weak prey not because they want the weak prey to cry but because they find the role of a high-sec industry-destroying pirate fun. There is a difference and I think if we seriously want to affect the EVE culture and diminish actual bullying, we have to separate between them.
(Though I have to agree rare thing in EVE is as funny as someone who enjoys "griefing wardecs" whining about unfairness when you dec them back.) |
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