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Raedon	Posted - 2004.07.29 07:30:00 - [1] What is the deal with interceptor insurance? Interceptors can still be shot down very easily yet the insurance payout is effectively 0.0%. Unless the insurance is fixed on these ships, I will not be flying an interceptor any longer as having now lost 3 of them, it's more expensive than losing a BS and much easier. I have read that the reason why the insurance is so low is because of the market value may fluctuate, blah, blah, blah. If anything, the market value has only increased since their arrival. I have a number of thoughts on alternatives: 1) Option to buy-out a replacement at cheapest station in Eveverse (e.g. taranis is available for 7.5 mil at luminaire, your insurance covers 100% so replacement is bought) 2) Option to obtain insurance % of minerals, delivered by NPC corp to 0.9 or 1.0 system + BP I don't propose that any of these would work and I don't know whether CCP could implement them any time soon(tm) but I think a better solution is needed as I imagine that this problem will only escalate as the more advanced ships appear in-game. This definately needs to be fixed as I believe people will start to shy away from these ships. What do you think?
Raedon	Posted - 2004.07.29 07:30:00 - [2] What is the deal with interceptor insurance? Interceptors can still be shot down very easily yet the insurance payout is effectively 0.0%. Unless the insurance is fixed on these ships, I will not be flying an interceptor any longer as having now lost 3 of them, it's more expensive than losing a BS and much easier. I have read that the reason why the insurance is so low is because of the market value may fluctuate, blah, blah, blah. If anything, the market value has only increased since their arrival. I have a number of thoughts on alternatives: 1) Option to buy-out a replacement at cheapest station in Eveverse (e.g. taranis is available for 7.5 mil at luminaire, your insurance covers 100% so replacement is bought) 2) Option to obtain insurance % of minerals, delivered by NPC corp to 0.9 or 1.0 system + BP I don't propose that any of these would work and I don't know whether CCP could implement them any time soon(tm) but I think a better solution is needed as I imagine that this problem will only escalate as the more advanced ships appear in-game. This definately needs to be fixed as I believe people will start to shy away from these ships. What do you think?
DJTheBaron	Posted - 2004.07.29 07:39:00 - [3] i can do more in cruisers than my crow anyway but the crow is fun, but i loose 5-7mil building them wheras i only loose 3mil inc mod & insurance on a cruisrer __________________________________________________ Scum, your all scum.
DJTheBaron	Posted - 2004.07.29 07:39:00 - [4] i can do more in cruisers than my crow anyway but the crow is fun, but i loose 5-7mil building them wheras i only loose 3mil inc mod & insurance on a cruisrer __________________________________________________ Scum, your all scum.
FuPhal	Posted - 2004.07.29 08:23:00 - [5] Aye, CCP need to wake up and maybe improve the availability of the advanced components needed for producing interceptors :/ prices are stupid atm
FuPhal	Posted - 2004.07.29 08:23:00 - [6] Aye, CCP need to wake up and maybe improve the availability of the advanced components needed for producing interceptors :/ prices are stupid atm
Selim	Posted - 2004.07.29 08:40:00 - [7] Its a player driven market. Insurance is based on mineral cost. If you cant afford to lose it than dont buy them, simple!
Selim	Posted - 2004.07.29 08:40:00 - [8] Its a player driven market. Insurance is based on mineral cost. If you cant afford to lose it than dont buy them, simple!
Moadeep	Posted - 2004.07.29 09:19:00 - [9] It's good as it is. We need moneysinks!
Moadeep	Posted - 2004.07.29 09:19:00 - [10] It's good as it is. We need moneysinks!
Meridius	Posted - 2004.07.29 09:30:00 - [11] Originally by: Raedon it's more expensive than losing a BS and much easier. Please, you cannot possibly compare the loss of a tier 2 bs with named equip to the loss of a ceptor. Sure you can get 100% insurance on a bs, but you have to spend around 30mil on it. That like buying 5 ceptors just for the insurance... That said, i do think that ceptor prices need a lot of trimming. The prices would be fine if they were new and hot, that simply isnt the case anymore ________________________________________________________
Meridius	Posted - 2004.07.29 09:30:00 - [12] Originally by: Raedon it's more expensive than losing a BS and much easier. Please, you cannot possibly compare the loss of a tier 2 bs with named equip to the loss of a ceptor. Sure you can get 100% insurance on a bs, but you have to spend around 30mil on it. That like buying 5 ceptors just for the insurance... That said, i do think that ceptor prices need a lot of trimming. The prices would be fine if they were new and hot, that simply isnt the case anymore ________________________________________________________
Julien Derida	Posted - 2004.07.29 09:57:00 - [13] The problem right now is that inty insurance is bugged. It used to pay out around 2mil, which was quite low, but now it only pays out 300k! This is just silly IMO. ---------------------------------------- Artistic Director & Chief Diplomat - FRICK
Julien Derida	Posted - 2004.07.29 09:57:00 - [14] The problem right now is that inty insurance is bugged. It used to pay out around 2mil, which was quite low, but now it only pays out 300k! This is just silly IMO. ---------------------------------------- Artistic Director & Chief Diplomat - FRICK
Meridius	Posted - 2004.07.29 10:20:00 - [15] Originally by: Julien Derida The problem right now is that inty insurance is bugged. It used to pay out around 2mil, which was quite low, but now it only pays out 300k! This is just silly IMO. AFAIK it's because ceptors cost less then 2mil to create and therefore is exploitable. IE. Build a ceptor> Insure > Blow up > Repeat ________________________________________________________
Meridius	Posted - 2004.07.29 10:20:00 - [16] Originally by: Julien Derida The problem right now is that inty insurance is bugged. It used to pay out around 2mil, which was quite low, but now it only pays out 300k! This is just silly IMO. AFAIK it's because ceptors cost less then 2mil to create and therefore is exploitable. IE. Build a ceptor> Insure > Blow up > Repeat ________________________________________________________
KingsGambit	Posted - 2004.07.29 10:22:00 - [17] I've posted on the forums before regarding this though not from an insurance pay out perspective. Tech II is player controlled in every way...the blueprints are only available to limited players, and the parts only available as mission rewards. THe problem is two fold...one, ship insurance in this example covers the base value of the minerals/mineral content of Tech II parts only, not the actual buy cost. Two, players want/need to make isk. As a producer, there needs to be a profit margin (especially considering the 3 lvl 5 skills needed to build them), and fair enough to make some money on parts too. Getting the parts though, at some of the prices players ask on the market, is simply crazy. Caldari elite frigs use Graviton Reactors for example, which base value is about 20k (3 zyd, 1 meg each). Your insurance payout is based on the NPCs prices of this, not what you paid. If players want 100k for their parts worth 20k, then the 600k of the build cost becomes 3mill...from just one part. So Interceptor manufacturers either buy them high and sell higher, or in my case, I won't buy them, and can't build anything as a result. Player's who want to sell their Tech II parts at ludicrous mark ups lose the right to complain about Tech II prices. ------------- BYOC Crow Interceptor Deals
KingsGambit	Posted - 2004.07.29 10:22:00 - [18] I've posted on the forums before regarding this though not from an insurance pay out perspective. Tech II is player controlled in every way...the blueprints are only available to limited players, and the parts only available as mission rewards. THe problem is two fold...one, ship insurance in this example covers the base value of the minerals/mineral content of Tech II parts only, not the actual buy cost. Two, players want/need to make isk. As a producer, there needs to be a profit margin (especially considering the 3 lvl 5 skills needed to build them), and fair enough to make some money on parts too. Getting the parts though, at some of the prices players ask on the market, is simply crazy. Caldari elite frigs use Graviton Reactors for example, which base value is about 20k (3 zyd, 1 meg each). Your insurance payout is based on the NPCs prices of this, not what you paid. If players want 100k for their parts worth 20k, then the 600k of the build cost becomes 3mill...from just one part. So Interceptor manufacturers either buy them high and sell higher, or in my case, I won't buy them, and can't build anything as a result. Player's who want to sell their Tech II parts at ludicrous mark ups lose the right to complain about Tech II prices. ------------- BYOC Crow Interceptor Deals
Nick Parker	Posted - 2004.07.29 11:18:00 - [19] I got a ? on the Insurance on Interceptors. From What it sounds like, if they (the insurance NPC's) Are only paying out 300k, It sounds like the Insurance is between a High end Merlin and a Low end Osprey. Do you think The Devs might have set the Prices to reflect that?
Nick Parker	Posted - 2004.07.29 11:18:00 - [20] I got a ? on the Insurance on Interceptors. From What it sounds like, if they (the insurance NPC's) Are only paying out 300k, It sounds like the Insurance is between a High end Merlin and a Low end Osprey. Do you think The Devs might have set the Prices to reflect that?
Raedon	Posted - 2004.07.29 13:13:00 - [21] Originally by: Meridius Originally by: Raedon it's more expensive than losing a BS and much easier. Please, you cannot possibly compare the loss of a tier 2 bs with named equip to the loss of a ceptor. Sure you can get 100% insurance on a bs, but you have to spend around 30mil on it. That like buying 5 ceptors just for the insurance... That said, i do think that ceptor prices need a lot of trimming. The prices would be fine if they were new and hot, that simply isnt the case anymore This is taken out of context, I originally said: Originally by: Raedon ...as having now lost 3 of them, it's more expensive than losing a BS and much easier. I have now lost 3 interceptors in 3 weeks. 1 was a stupid mistake and 2 were caused by lag which I could not do anything about. I paid about 24 million in total and had all named modules totalling about 30 million. In comparison, I've had a battleship for about 3 months and I still have not lost it. Although I really enjoy flying the interceptor, I still think that something needs to be done to fix the insurance as I said unless something is done about insurance, I will stop flying interceptors and revert to frigates. I can see that other people will do the same.
Raedon	Posted - 2004.07.29 13:13:00 - [22] Originally by: Meridius Originally by: Raedon it's more expensive than losing a BS and much easier. Please, you cannot possibly compare the loss of a tier 2 bs with named equip to the loss of a ceptor. Sure you can get 100% insurance on a bs, but you have to spend around 30mil on it. That like buying 5 ceptors just for the insurance... That said, i do think that ceptor prices need a lot of trimming. The prices would be fine if they were new and hot, that simply isnt the case anymore This is taken out of context, I originally said: Originally by: Raedon ...as having now lost 3 of them, it's more expensive than losing a BS and much easier. I have now lost 3 interceptors in 3 weeks. 1 was a stupid mistake and 2 were caused by lag which I could not do anything about. I paid about 24 million in total and had all named modules totalling about 30 million. In comparison, I've had a battleship for about 3 months and I still have not lost it. Although I really enjoy flying the interceptor, I still think that something needs to be done to fix the insurance as I said unless something is done about insurance, I will stop flying interceptors and revert to frigates. I can see that other people will do the same.
Hauler007	Posted - 2004.07.29 13:49:00 - [23] Then by all means don't use interceptor when you are low on money. Like someone said already, WE NEED MONEY SINKS. 100% insurance doesn't really help the market with all the money inflow and very little ways to take it away from the game.
Hauler007	Posted - 2004.07.29 13:49:00 - [24] Then by all means don't use interceptor when you are low on money. Like someone said already, WE NEED MONEY SINKS. 100% insurance doesn't really help the market with all the money inflow and very little ways to take it away from the game.
Barth3zzzNL	Posted - 2004.07.29 14:01:00 - [25] Edited by: Barth3zzzNL on 29/07/2004 14:03:25 Originally by: Meridius Originally by: Julien Derida The problem right now is that inty insurance is bugged. It used to pay out around 2mil, which was quite low, but now it only pays out 300k! This is just silly IMO. AFAIK it's because ceptors cost less then 2mil to create and therefore is exploitable. IE. Build a ceptor> Insure > Blow up > Repeat LEts say you can insure it at 7 mill (plati) and it would cost 2 mill to insure. You spend 2 mill building it and 2 mill insuring it. You then pop iy and make 3 mill profit. Wont selling it for 7 mill be more usefull? Youll make the exact amount of profit and people actually get to use it... Or perhaps im just not seeing the exploit... As for market sinks; Yes. Limiting the sinks to inty pilots? No... --------------------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Barth3zzzNL	Posted - 2004.07.29 14:01:00 - [26] Edited by: Barth3zzzNL on 29/07/2004 14:03:25 Originally by: Meridius Originally by: Julien Derida The problem right now is that inty insurance is bugged. It used to pay out around 2mil, which was quite low, but now it only pays out 300k! This is just silly IMO. AFAIK it's because ceptors cost less then 2mil to create and therefore is exploitable. IE. Build a ceptor> Insure > Blow up > Repeat LEts say you can insure it at 7 mill (plati) and it would cost 2 mill to insure. You spend 2 mill building it and 2 mill insuring it. You then pop iy and make 3 mill profit. Wont selling it for 7 mill be more usefull? Youll make the exact amount of profit and people actually get to use it... Or perhaps im just not seeing the exploit... As for market sinks; Yes. Limiting the sinks to inty pilots? No... --------------------------- [Coreli Corporation Mainframe]
Alex Harumichi	Posted - 2004.07.29 14:04:00 - [27] Edited by: Alex Harumichi on 29/07/2004 14:10:26 This probably won't be a popular opinion but: keep inty insurance where it is, lower the insurance payouts for all other ships. Losing a battleship should also mean you lose a pile of money. There's too much money floating around in this game, and too many people with N battleships. More money sinks, not less ;)
Alex Harumichi	Posted - 2004.07.29 14:04:00 - [28] Edited by: Alex Harumichi on 29/07/2004 14:10:26 This probably won't be a popular opinion but: keep inty insurance where it is, lower the insurance payouts for all other ships. Losing a battleship should also mean you lose a pile of money. There's too much money floating around in this game, and too many people with N battleships. More money sinks, not less ;)
FuPhal	Posted - 2004.07.29 14:10:00 - [29] Its been said time and time again, Interceptors arent worth 7 million, let alone 12 mil which seems to be the average price for a crow these days. If ccp made all the components / blueprints alot more available then all the greedy mofos who sell them for stupid prices would have to lower their prices too. Its bad enough waiting 2-3 weeks to train all the skills, but to find out that after uve trained all these skills that the ship u wanna use now costs 12 mil is kinda ***
FuPhal	Posted - 2004.07.29 14:10:00 - [30] Its been said time and time again, Interceptors arent worth 7 million, let alone 12 mil which seems to be the average price for a crow these days. If ccp made all the components / blueprints alot more available then all the greedy mofos who sell them for stupid prices would have to lower their prices too. Its bad enough waiting 2-3 weeks to train all the skills, but to find out that after uve trained all these skills that the ship u wanna use now costs 12 mil is kinda ***

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