Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Nomad Vherokic
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 03:02:00 -
[1]
Ok... I'm sure most of us have had a run in with the odd spammer/scammer in Jita or Motsu or wherever. However, after a trip to Jita this evening for some supplies, I was looking through contracts for particular items and it suddenly dawned on me that for most of the items I was looking at (PLEXs, T2 & Faction Ships, Faction Mods etc) the contracts where basically scams. I would say at least 50% of everything listed under each of these items were scams. This is a ridiculous amount!
The kind of thing I am talking about are the 'WTB Raven Navy Issue 300 Million' (where the actual contract is only for 300 isk or something similar), or the ones where they are offering say a Amarr Navy Large Armour Repairer and the item in question is actually a T1 Large Armour Rep...
Okay, so this isn't new... but I have reached my limit on how many contractors I can ignore and I am still seeing all this crap! I don't see the point of petitioning the characters as the originators are just going to create another alt and scam/spam some more once the petitioned character gets banned...
This is probably just me letting off steam as this has been going on for ages and isn't getting any better! The only thing I can think of is not allowing people on trial accounts to create contracts... any thoughts? |
KISOGOKU
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 03:11:00 -
[2]
bad news trials cant create contracts already ,all scammers you seen were on paid accounts
Originally by: Nomad Vherokic The only thing I can think of is not allowing people on trial accounts to create contracts... any thoughts?
|
Nadarius Chrome
Celestial Industrial Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 03:15:00 -
[3]
I quickly hit the 80 limit on my contracts blocklist too. Every few weeks I'll purge the list and start filling it again, assuming that a lot of the scam alts I've blocked have been biomassed in the mean time.
Usually the only people who end up on that blocklist are people (or corps) who have lowball offers for items that I'm searching for. EG I look for an item worth 800m and I'll block all the "WTB offer" contracts offering 900k, 910k, 950k pretending it's millions.
Even then, the blocklist functionality is very limited due to its tiny size. |
Breaker77
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 03:17:00 -
[4]
Originally by: Nomad Vherokic I don't see the point of petitioning the characters as the originators are just going to create another alt and scam/spam some more once the petitioned character gets banned...
They could only get banned for spamming, and usually that would be a warning for a first time offense. Scamming is perfectly legal in Eve, however bad it may seem to the rest of us. |
Nomad Vherokic
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 03:31:00 -
[5]
I've never had a trial account so just assumed you could create contracts with them... :(
I'm also aware that the reality is that what makes eve great is the reflection of real life we get and the lack of protection. For instance, if get scammed in RL, we have to go to the police, in EVE we have to go to a GM... that I can understand... However, in RL there are more and more safe-guards put in place to stop these things happening, I'm not so sure the same things are put in place in EVE atm.
A better blocking mechanism would be nice, and also a mechanism for not allowing these sorts of contracts to be created in the first place. For example, you shouldn't be able to create a contract called Amarr Navy Large Armour Repairer that links to a Large Armour Repairer with a sell price of 80 Million ISK... whatever way you look at it that's just wrong... |
Brock Nelson
Caldari Flux Technologies Inc
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 04:54:00 -
[6]
Jita is like Thailand. Full of hookers, but you don't know which ones are actually women. |
MilowFV
Echo Heavy Industries
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 05:15:00 -
[7]
Improved contract filter and larger block list is what I like to see. I dont want to have the contract system dicate price to me though. |
Thoraemond
Minmatar Far Ranger
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 06:01:00 -
[8]
As a contract trader, I found that setting in the filters a minimum price of 1 ISK (or refining the ranger further if I know what I'm looking for) and using the simple view cut out a lot of the spam. |
Steve Celeste
Caldari Paxton Industries
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 09:13:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Nadarius Chrome EG I look for an item worth 800m and I'll block all the "WTB offer" contracts offering 900k, 910k, 950k pretending it's millions.
Some people have made the bold claim that contracts have filters that you can use, an amazing thing..... |
Carniflex
Caldari StarHunt Systematic-Chaos
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 09:35:00 -
[10]
If you are looking for specific item, then use 'simple view' in contracts and search for that item. With that you will get rid of all the 'navy' stuffs that are actually not so navy. Then fill the minumum price field with something reasonable. That will filter out all the 'wtb 'stuff' for 100 isk' offers.
|
|
Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles Zzz
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 09:44:00 -
[11]
Also, use the 'legit trade' channel. It has at least as much legitimate trade as there is in Jita, and you don't even have to go to Jita! --- Can't afford that BPO? Look here. 20:1 mineral compression The EVE f@h team |
McDuke
Abnormal Experience
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 10:13:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Carniflex If you are looking for specific item, then use 'simple view' in contracts and search for that item. With that you will get rid of all the 'navy' stuffs that are actually not so navy. Then fill the minumum price field with something reasonable. That will filter out all the 'wtb 'stuff' for 100 isk' offers.
This, and contracts should have their descriptions dropped. Don't know why people actually pay attention to what says there? |
nether void
Caldari Shrapnel Industries
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 16:34:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Nomad Vherokic I'm also aware that the reality is that what makes eve great is the reflection of real life we get and the lack of protection. For instance, if get scammed in RL, we have to go to the police, in EVE we have to go to a GM... that I can understand...
But this is actually how it is unlike real life. In real life scamming is illegal; in EVE it's not, so actually it's encouraged due to the insane reward vs risk.
If almost everything was legal in the US, there would be a LOT more crime; break ins, scams, people working and never getting paid, shoplifting...well there might not be any stores at all, murders a daily occurrence over say 5 bucks or less.
In fact, it's law that even makes civilization possible, so in the absense of it I really don't think humans would have grown to the point we have now. In an environment lacking civility, technological growth would be extremely stunted. Military tech would be the most prevalent tech advances, but they would be rather crude and probably not spread much with the lack of any stable government and co-operative societies.
Big long derail, but the point is we do need this kind of crap to be illegal. Sure low sec piracy has a place as well as 0.0 warfare. Even high sec suicide ganks. There's risk with that reward. Scamming is not the same beast, and should be quelled. --------------------
|
Tasko Pal
Heron Corporation
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 16:41:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Tasko Pal on 29/01/2009 16:41:24
Originally by: nether void
Big long derail, but the point is we do need this kind of crap to be illegal.
No we don't. Scamming is just like pirating or suicide ganking.
Filters gets rid of most of the fluff (aside from the BPC/BPO mess). The contracts interface does need to be fixed in a number of serious ways. You can't go back to a previous state and you can't save your favorite searches (to give a couple of simple examples).
|
nether void
Caldari Shrapnel Industries
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 16:42:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Tasko Pal Edited by: Tasko Pal on 29/01/2009 16:41:24
Originally by: nether void
Big long derail, but the point is we do need this kind of crap to be illegal.
No we don't. Scamming is just like pirating or suicide ganking.
Filters gets rid of most of the fluff (aside from the BPC/BPO mess). The contracts interface does need to be fixed in a number of serious ways. You can't go back to a previous state and you can't save your favorite searches (to give a couple of simple examples).
Please re-read my post. They are not the same risk vs reward. Not even close. There is no way to get revenge, either. --------------------
|
Thoraemond
Minmatar Far Ranger
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 17:34:00 -
[16]
Originally by: nether void Actually there's no risk at all.
Well, there can be some risk in the loss of broker fees, but I agree that's a generally a relatively small amount. |
No Maz
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 17:46:00 -
[17]
Although I agree to some extent - people need to use the filters.
Trading, buying or selling is like pvp - you need to be careful.
One guy who I knew was a noob corp wardec guy/ gate camper bought something from me at a very inflated price - he had the cheek to email me saying he wanted the money back cos he made a mistake.
In my limited experience of EVE - a high proportion of pvp is not risk taking - but 4 or 5 players taking on some new guy that stranded close to them - no risk at all.
|
nether void
Caldari Shrapnel Industries
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 18:32:00 -
[18]
Originally by: No Maz Although I agree to some extent - people need to use the filters.
Trading, buying or selling is like pvp - you need to be careful.
One guy who I knew was a noob corp wardec guy/ gate camper bought something from me at a very inflated price - he had the cheek to email me saying he wanted the money back cos he made a mistake.
In my limited experience of EVE - a high proportion of pvp is not risk taking - but 4 or 5 players taking on some new guy that stranded close to them - no risk at all.
The one difference is you could actually get a group of peeps together to screw up that camp. People usually don't bother, because there's not much in it other than pew pew, but you can do it. Scams, on the other hand, really don't have a mechanic for fighting back. |
Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE
|
Posted - 2009.01.29 21:58:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Chainsaw Plankton on 29/01/2009 21:58:38
Originally by: Carniflex If you are looking for specific item, then use 'simple view' in contracts and search for that item. With that you will get rid of all the 'navy' stuffs that are actually not so navy. Then fill the minumum price field with something reasonable. That will filter out all the 'wtb 'stuff' for 100 isk' offers.
I prefer using the "show more options" and searching for the exact item type, the drop down select bit annoys me. then again most of my contracts are sell, and not buy.
just ignore everything in jita local, for your own health... some days it is worse than youtube comments.
or join the legit trading channel. or something. |
Draku Rykenen
Gallente Exiled. Veritas Immortalis
|
Posted - 2009.01.30 05:16:00 -
[20]
50%????
I have been amazed by the complete destruction of all ethics in EVE as well and spent a good few hours on night observing the contracts and other various offers and request being posted in the system.
That night I literally saw AT LEAST 80% of all trade offers, ect. were scams.
From faked product links to under cut prices that depended on accepting without reading... The Trade hubs are not for trade anymore, they are almost purely for crime.
Don't even waste my time with contracts anywhere NEAR Jita anymore. Heck I don't bother with anything that involves any player outside my alliance anymore if I can avoid it.
EVE sets new standards for online scum.. LOL |
|
Hel O'Ween
Biotronics Inc. Alternative Realities
|
Posted - 2009.01.30 12:01:00 -
[21]
Originally by: MilowFV Improved contract filter and larger block list is what I like to see.
(Emphasis mine)
This! Spend two days browsing the contracts in a region with a bigger trade hub and your 80 slots on the ignore list are filled up. -- EVEWalletAware - an offline wallet manager |
Amy Mouse
|
Posted - 2009.01.30 18:03:00 -
[22]
YEAH! contract scams drive me nuts too!
|
Marcus D'Eriellius
Gallente Honour Bound Sc0rched Earth
|
Posted - 2009.01.30 19:56:00 -
[23]
I've had a few drinks and in a moment of clarity wondered how it would work if CONCORD removed any contracts that were blocked by more than, say 100 people. Large alliances couldn't misuse this to prevent individual sellers having access to the contract system as it would be easy to submit a harassment claim and for the GMs to see if the contract was valid or not.
However, the above will never happen as the Devs have already said that scamming is something they permit to exist.
|
flakeys
Tier 3 Technologies Inc Lazy is our middle name
|
Posted - 2009.01.30 20:35:00 -
[24]
Originally by: nether void Scams, on the other hand, really don't have a mechanic for fighting back.
Yes you do , it's actually reading the contract and viewing content.If you invest in an ipo and loose isk too bad you knew the risk there was.If you get scammed in eve with the 'f am leaving eve , send me your isk and i'll double it' or navy ravens wich are just ravens then again it is your own fault , bad luck.The difference is here you fight them off BEFORE they get you , in pvp it's the other way around.
It's part of the game and i love it for that allthough i understand why a lot of people want it changed.
|
Nadarius Chrome
Celestial Industrial Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.01.31 00:59:00 -
[25]
Originally by: flakeys
Originally by: nether void Scams, on the other hand, really don't have a mechanic for fighting back.
Yes you do , it's actually reading the contract and viewing content.If you invest in an ipo and loose isk too bad you knew the risk there was.If you get scammed in eve with the 'f am leaving eve , send me your isk and i'll double it' or navy ravens wich are just ravens then again it is your own fault , bad luck.The difference is here you fight them off BEFORE they get you , in pvp it's the other way around.
It's part of the game and i love it for that allthough i understand why a lot of people want it changed.
I think you miss his point. You can avoid falling victim, but you can't fight back. There is no way to find out who the scam alt belongs to and make their main pay. You can't win against scammers, you can only break even. |
Nadarius Chrome
Celestial Industrial Alliance
|
Posted - 2009.01.31 01:47:00 -
[26]
Quick example. I just cleared my contract block list, then searched for the following items, blocking buyers listing for less than 10% of the "real" item price.
PLEX codes Machariel Nightmare Vindicator Bhaalgorn Kronos Vargur Paladin Raven navy issue Tempest Fleet Issue Navy Apoc Navy Mega
My blocklist is now full again. Yay. |
Veevie
|
Posted - 2009.01.31 02:12:00 -
[27]
80%? I yet have to see an non-scam contract in Jita local.
|
Stefan F
Enrave Ethereal Dawn
|
Posted - 2009.01.31 02:42:00 -
[28]
Change how the block list works. Dont block the character anymore but the account the character is on.
Char moved to another acct? (costs 20 bucks) char is unblocked. Char biomassed, new one created, or simply another char from the 3 slots: still blocked. |
Rotnac
Caldari GoonFleet GoonSwarm
|
Posted - 2009.01.31 08:04:00 -
[29]
Originally by: flakeys
Originally by: nether void Scams, on the other hand, really don't have a mechanic for fighting back.
Yes you do , it's actually reading the contract and viewing content.If you invest in an ipo and loose isk too bad you knew the risk there was.If you get scammed in eve with the 'f am leaving eve , send me your isk and i'll double it' or navy ravens wich are just ravens then again it is your own fault , bad luck.The difference is here you fight them off BEFORE they get you , in pvp it's the other way around.
It's part of the game and i love it for that allthough i understand why a lot of people want it changed.
This. Its incredibly easy to defeat a contract scammer: read the damn thing. I suppose increasing (drastically) the block list would also help. And with the filters, it really isn't that big a deal.
Its also really funny when someone does fall for one, considering how easy it is to avoid. And considering that this game condones (to a certain extent) empire ganking, piracy, and massive corporate theft, I can't see changing this without changing the underlying "wild west" nature of Eve. |
flakeys
Tier 3 Technologies Inc Lazy is our middle name
|
Posted - 2009.01.31 08:54:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Nadarius Chrome
Originally by: flakeys
Originally by: nether void Scams, on the other hand, really don't have a mechanic for fighting back.
Yes you do , it's actually reading the contract and viewing content.If you invest in an ipo and loose isk too bad you knew the risk there was.If you get scammed in eve with the 'f am leaving eve , send me your isk and i'll double it' or navy ravens wich are just ravens then again it is your own fault , bad luck.The difference is here you fight them off BEFORE they get you , in pvp it's the other way around.
It's part of the game and i love it for that allthough i understand why a lot of people want it changed.
I think you miss his point. You can avoid falling victim, but you can't fight back. There is no way to find out who the scam alt belongs to and make their main pay. You can't win against scammers, you can only break even.
I don't miss the point .Hence why i said opposite of pvp you counter this IN ADVANCE.If no one falls for it then there will be no more of these.So counter it with actually reading the contract etc like i said before.
I would hate it if scams in any form in eve would be annihilated.They can't make it so only X amount of scams can be made on contracts , so in my opinion it's part of eve as it should.Don't get me wrong i never look at local chat in jita since it drives me mad as do the contract scams when i am looking for an item.
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |