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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 4 post(s) |
Anthar Thebess
1425
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Posted - 2016.02.08 20:41:17 -
[91] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:
There'll be a dev-blog going into more details about our transition plans for Carriers, Force Auxiliaries and a bunch of other stuff, coming out later this week.
Sorry. You ask us to make a very costly decision that will affect up to year of our gameplay without giving us nothing we can make this decision.
To chose proper FAX, we need information : - exact stats of FAX - exact stats of capital modules used by FAX - exact build cost of FAX
To chose proper Combat Carrier we need : - exact stats of each carrier - exact information about new fighters - exact information what modules will be used by new Combat Carriers
Additionally for both: - information about citadels, and structures combat carriers will be fighting, and Fax will need to survive. - information about supers they will kill and save - information about dreds getting fleet hangars and ship bays.
Capital ships did not show in eve instantly, and you want to introduce FAX in this way. To many questions, and no answers. Capital ships are end game skills, and decision what to skill is based on multiple conditions, and all of them are currently unknown.
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Baki Yuku
Hoover Inc. Pandemic Legion
45
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Posted - 2016.02.08 20:41:56 -
[92] - Quote
Honstly this is a rather poor solution and can not even be called a "solution". The abilities of the orginal skill a rank 16 skill are getting cut in half and the half that got cut away gets a new skill rank 16 as well. Why?
It would have been more sound to just reduce the rank of Fax skill and Carrier skill to rank 6 and everyone who already has the carrier skills at whatever level just gets half the SP back and can then decide on whatever or not to invest them into FAX. |
Tiberian Deci
Unholy Knights of Cthulhu Test Alliance Please Ignore
144
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Posted - 2016.02.08 20:47:22 -
[93] - Quote
Celeste Benal wrote:If you aren't going to use those fighter skills anymore, grab some extractors and pull those SP for sale to recoup your FAX skillbook cost.
I refused to spend real money on those things before, and I refuse to do so now as well. I shouldn't be forced to spend real money because the fundamental roles of carriers are changing. |
Talixia
Void.Tech Get Off My Lawn
5
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Posted - 2016.02.08 20:52:18 -
[94] - Quote
So am I reading this right....I need the hulls as well?
You haven't addressed those of us that have all racial carriers to 5, so now we also need to have the hulls, so what's going to happen to the hulls? are they going to magically turn into the racial force aux? or will we be stuck with hulls to sell now too?
Not to mention investing ANOTHER 2b into books that should really have just been split off the existing skill (simplicity guys, why do you avoid it?) |
Anthar Thebess
1427
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Posted - 2016.02.08 21:11:06 -
[95] - Quote
Transition will be probably also on similar rules. So you will lose rigs, or maybe get them back, but if you have Large rigs on carrier you will probably get large rigs back. Perfect solution will be moving EVERY Carrier to redeeming quene, including rigs and fitting. Then allow player to choose what ship they want to back. Yes some capitals will be moved - but ignore this , give 14 day expiry timer, and after it expire hull lands back in the station.
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Marcus Tedric
Zebra Corp Goonswarm Federation
56
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Posted - 2016.02.08 21:14:44 -
[96] - Quote
Rowells wrote:Seconding questions on the fighter skills. We have existing fighters/fighter bombers, what is happening in regards to those?
Whilst it would be nice to know - and perhaps we will find out in 3-4 days.....
If you look in your Overview Settings - there is a new folder for 'Fighters' which has one entry 'Support Fighters'. So it rather looks like our Fighters -> Light Fighters & Fighter Bombers -> Heavy Fighters.
Now - as to numbers, however, I'll guess 1 -> 5 or 6.
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Marcus Tedric
Zebra Corp Goonswarm Federation
56
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Posted - 2016.02.08 21:17:46 -
[97] - Quote
LYFE SUCKS wrote:what if you trained 2 carriers to V but didnt train tactical logi reconfig yet, but still want the sp refunded as you were training for triage???
Buy the TLR skill and train it to 1 SP......
Buy the FAx skill(s) and train to 1 SP......
On patch day spend as you wish - with 2 Carrier skills you can be an instant FAx pilot.
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Mai Ling Ravencroft
Duragon Pioneer Group Goonswarm Federation
35
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Posted - 2016.02.08 21:45:12 -
[98] - Quote
http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/back-to-the-balancing-future/ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=174410 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2145814#post2145814
It is a repeated mantra of CCP...
"If you could fly it before, you will be able to do so after the change."
tl;dr- Will CCP break our trst for an extra buck? or will they be true to their word and be faithful to the players?
How is this any different? You are taking my Chimera, Thanatos, Archon, and Nid; splitting then in half and giving us a new hull that we already could use. I didn't train for a Thanatos and Chimera just to be a Triage pilot. Nor did I train them just to be fighter jockies. I trained carriers, rather than dreads because I wanted to be able to do logistics and to participate in the aggressive side of combat.
I can fly Caldari logistic capital hull, I can fly Caldari capital drone ship, it is what I spent over 120+ days training for, it is what I should still be able to fly after the changes. Anything less than that is a breach of trust between the players and CCP, point blank. We the players have always known that any time invested in training for a type of ship would always be of use once we finished the training. Until now.
CCP is violating the one sacred rule, one that we the player base has always felt safe with, and that was the simple knowledge that even if you changed the way things worked later down the road, our training time wouldn't be wasted. Taking that away from us, while tossing in a real currency item that will let us remove those unusable skills, due to the changes, is a money grab.
So I ask you, which is more important, our trust in CCP: that we will always be able to fly what we had before, or a fast buck and completely destroying any faith that CCP will honor any traditions and pledges it has made with the players.
Before you tell us it is a new hull, and that means we never flew it, so it doesn't count. Take a second to recall how you have been contemplating changing current carriers fitted with triage into the new hulls. Basically stating, that thes are the same thing, with a new look and name, but cut in half, no longer having both roles of logistics and combat, but rather each having only part of what it was before. Thus even if I don't move into a FAX, I still won't be flying what I could before, as it is only half the ship it was. |
Kallor Eidermann Tes'thesula
Future Corps Sleeper Social Club
3
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Posted - 2016.02.08 21:50:36 -
[99] - Quote
Just let everyone with at least 1 carrier skill injected turn ALL the skill points on the entire character into unallocated points, so we can reevaluate our life choices when that patch comes out.
At least when other ship skills split (and let's be honest, they are not adding a NEW ship, just splitting an existing one), there at least was some incentive to get more skill points, which people generally felt pretty happy about. Now all we get is an opportunity to waste tons of time training skills that have been added for no good reason, without knowing if it will be worth it until it is too late.
Give people who have "Racial Carrier to X" an equal amount of skill points towards "Racial Force Auxiliary X". That way we don't lose anything. Make the fighters either Fighter = something and Fighter Bombers = something else, or be sensible and split them in the same way that light and medium drones were. I currently enjoy being able to fly all types of carriers, and I am not incredibly happy about the absolute ton of skill books I have to buy and training I have to do for no benefit over the current system.
I'm pretty confident carriers will be really cool - but your improving your game is the reason I pay a subscription - I am not going to pay a subscription to play the game AND another one for your doing some much needed improvements. |
Traiori
Risk Breakers Bad Intention
236
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Posted - 2016.02.08 21:52:59 -
[100] - Quote
14x skill is 30-50 days to V right? So that's... 120-200 days of training CCP would like me to add to all of my carrier pilots so that they can continue to fulfil the same niche roles, along with dropping 2b per character on skillbooks.
What about my unsubbed characters? Am I expected to resub all of my carrier sitting toons just to be able to have this flexibility? What are the stats of the new carriers? How are the new fighters working? Am I going to be adding on another month of training there?
This is badly thought through. Dedicated multiracial triage alts are looking at 4-6 months of additional training to be able to fly the ships that they've been flying previously. Add on fighters / bombers and if the changes are anything like this set of changes then we're looking at 6-9 months of training.
I'm sure that for the people that don't have dedicated triage alts, this is less of an issue. But I do fly triage, I do have dedicated triage alts, and I have dedicated delivery/sitter pilots too. I fail to see how CCP's mantra of "fly it before, fly it now" is being maintained in any form by this announcement.
Especially annoying as it seems that I'm expected to pay -ú40-60 per pilot to get them back to where they are at present (ignoring ISK costs) in terms of being able to log in and immediately drop in a capital fleet of any kind in whatever role is required. |
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Tiberian Deci
Unholy Knights of Cthulhu Test Alliance Please Ignore
147
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Posted - 2016.02.08 22:02:33 -
[101] - Quote
Kallor Eidermann Tes'thesula wrote:Give people who have "Racial Carrier to X" an equal amount of skill points towards "Racial Force Auxiliary X".
CCPls |
KuroVolt
The Legion of Spoon Curatores Veritatis Alliance
2261
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Posted - 2016.02.08 22:05:09 -
[102] - Quote
Would be nice if we could get some more info about what new bonusses the 4 carriers will actually have now, and what bonusses the FAX's will have.
You are kinda asking us to choose blindly here, CCP.
BoBwins Law: As a discussion/war between two large nullsec entities grows longer, the probability of one comparing the other to BoB aproaches near certainty.
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Minty Aroma
Eternity INC. Goonswarm Federation
65
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Posted - 2016.02.08 22:12:41 -
[103] - Quote
I would like to know what is happening with the fighter skills come the citadel patch - is fighters just going to turn to heavy fighters, fighter bombers having its SP returned and the light + support fighters to whatever you have managed to train them to beforehand? |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
17437
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Posted - 2016.02.08 22:14:42 -
[104] - Quote
CCP Larrikin wrote:Hi Mates,
We're seeding the 4 Racial Force Auxiliary skills in February, along with skills for Light Fighter Squadrons and Support Fighter Squadrons. Any character with Tactical Logistics Reconfiguration, a Carrier and Force Auxiliary skill (of the same race) injected when the citadels expansion launches, will have the racial carrier skillpoints refunded as unallocated skillpoints. These skillpoints can be reallocated instantly as the player desires.
If you start training the Force Auxiliary skill after the patch tomorrow, you can reallocate your refunded skillpoints right back into your racial carrier skill so you can fly both ships. Or spend them on anything you like!
There'll be a dev-blog going into more details about our transition plans for Carriers, Force Auxiliaries and a bunch of other stuff, coming out later this week.
Cheers, CCP Larrikin
Yeah thanks a bunch for giving me a 7 month train to get back to where I am now.
Hey listen, I've decided to split the skill for receiving my subscription money going forward. You can reallocate half the amount it cost to subscribe my two accounts to maintain one of them. Let me know which.
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his ISK/hr depends upon his not understanding it!"
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Bellona Rikan
Minion Revolution SpaceMonkey's Alliance
9
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Posted - 2016.02.08 22:21:05 -
[105] - Quote
Minty Aroma wrote:I would like to know what is happening with the fighter skills come the citadel patch - is fighters just going to turn to heavy fighters, fighter bombers having its SP returned and the light + support fighters to whatever you have managed to train them to beforehand?
This, please! |
commander aze
74
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Posted - 2016.02.08 22:43:14 -
[106] - Quote
For those with Fighters and fighter bombers trained what does this mean for us? do we gain levels transferred to these new skills?
Commander Aze For CSM XI
Support the Community #Broadcast4Reps
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Pohbis
Neo T.E.C.H.
474
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Posted - 2016.02.08 22:51:07 -
[107] - Quote
commander aze wrote:For those with Fighters and fighter bombers trained what does this mean for us? do we gain levels transferred to these new skills? Yeah, wondering if I should start training Fighter Bombers even though I don't have a use for them, to make sure I wont have to start training for Fighters from scratch, again. |
Rosal Milag
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
30
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Posted - 2016.02.08 22:52:14 -
[108] - Quote
Malcanis wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote:Hi Mates,
We're seeding the 4 Racial Force Auxiliary skills in February, along with skills for Light Fighter Squadrons and Support Fighter Squadrons. Any character with Tactical Logistics Reconfiguration, a Carrier and Force Auxiliary skill (of the same race) injected when the citadels expansion launches, will have the racial carrier skillpoints refunded as unallocated skillpoints. These skillpoints can be reallocated instantly as the player desires.
If you start training the Force Auxiliary skill after the patch tomorrow, you can reallocate your refunded skillpoints right back into your racial carrier skill so you can fly both ships. Or spend them on anything you like!
There'll be a dev-blog going into more details about our transition plans for Carriers, Force Auxiliaries and a bunch of other stuff, coming out later this week.
Cheers, CCP Larrikin Yeah thanks a bunch for giving me a 7 month train to get back to where I am now. Hey listen, I've decided to split the skill for receiving my subscription money going forward. You can reallocate half the amount it cost to subscribe my two accounts to maintain one of them. Let me know which.
And CCP should give 7 months of training to all carrier pilots for free?
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his ISK/hr depends upon his not understanding it!"
Ironic that you can't understand that CCP is not going to drop 12 million skill points on anyone, regardless of how long you've played, how many subscriptions you have. |
Lucas Quaan
Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion
115
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Posted - 2016.02.08 22:57:16 -
[109] - Quote
Decent compromise, but you should probably tell us what you plan with the skill path for fighters too. |
Tiberian Deci
Unholy Knights of Cthulhu Test Alliance Please Ignore
148
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Posted - 2016.02.08 22:57:44 -
[110] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:It's you can fly what you could fly, not you can do what you could.
You will still be able to fly a carrier unless you decide not to. There are 0 ship that you could fly that you will no longer be able to unless you decide to switch your SP via refund to something else and at that point, YOU made the decision to change so CCP's rule of "If you can fly it before you will after" is not broken.
I feel like you haven't yet made the distinction between being able to fly* something and being able to fly something. Sure, anyone with Gallente Battleship I can fly a Megathron, but without a core of engineering, armor, and gunnery skills they can't really fly it.
Same thing for carriers. I have spent two years training a toon from scratch who can do almost everything perfectly in a carrier. Now in order to fulfill the same roles I am almost perfect at I need to drop 2b isk on skillbooks and add another 8+ months of training time to my skill queue, oh, and I can't do it whenever I want because of the shitass attribute system? That's a raw deal and anyone can see it, except you I guess. |
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
17439
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Posted - 2016.02.08 22:58:13 -
[111] - Quote
Rosal Milag wrote:Malcanis wrote:CCP Larrikin wrote:Hi Mates,
We're seeding the 4 Racial Force Auxiliary skills in February, along with skills for Light Fighter Squadrons and Support Fighter Squadrons. Any character with Tactical Logistics Reconfiguration, a Carrier and Force Auxiliary skill (of the same race) injected when the citadels expansion launches, will have the racial carrier skillpoints refunded as unallocated skillpoints. These skillpoints can be reallocated instantly as the player desires.
If you start training the Force Auxiliary skill after the patch tomorrow, you can reallocate your refunded skillpoints right back into your racial carrier skill so you can fly both ships. Or spend them on anything you like!
There'll be a dev-blog going into more details about our transition plans for Carriers, Force Auxiliaries and a bunch of other stuff, coming out later this week.
Cheers, CCP Larrikin Yeah thanks a bunch for giving me a 7 month train to get back to where I am now. Hey listen, I've decided to split the skill for receiving my subscription money going forward. You can reallocate half the amount it cost to subscribe my two accounts to maintain one of them. Let me know which. And CCP should give 7 months of training to all carrier pilots for free? "It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his ISK/hr depends upon his not understanding it!" Ironic that you can't understand that CCP is not going to drop 12 million skill points on anyone, regardless of how long you've played, how many subscriptions you have.
There was no difficulty in giving 4.5m sp to battlecruiser pilots.
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his ISK/hr depends upon his not understanding it!"
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Tawaif
Ministry of War Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2016.02.08 23:01:14 -
[112] - Quote
Since I now have to do more training just to be able to do stuff that I already can, would you consider giving me back the sp from the unneeded 2 levels of amarr battleships that I have trained rather than making me pay for one of those new sp remover tools you're bringing in. Many thanks. |
Hound Halfhand
Repo Industries
24
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Posted - 2016.02.08 23:01:16 -
[113] - Quote
How about a free remap so we can work with this mess? Come on CCP, don't be stingy. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
17439
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Posted - 2016.02.08 23:02:28 -
[114] - Quote
Of course, there wasn't the opportunity to take $70 from us to inject those 4.5m sp when that happened.
"It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his ISK/hr depends upon his not understanding it!"
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Rosal Milag
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
30
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Posted - 2016.02.08 23:03:32 -
[115] - Quote
Malcanis wrote: There was no difficulty in giving 4.5m sp to battlecruiser pilots.
Yes because adding 4.5 million sp and adding 12 million sp is an equivalent event.
Oh and did they have injectors in game when the 4.5 million sp was added? Man, everyone but you totally missed them.
This is the best case scenario for CCP to keep the SP of the most advanced players from inflating more while keeping total value of the game null.
Admit to the truth, you want free SP for no other reason than CCP has given SP in one circumstance similar in the past. The rest of us are happy that triage pilots are not screwed up the ass with training times.
Stop thinking that you deserve free SP. You don't. You don't deserve a damn thing in this game. Everyone gets the same treatment.
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ApolloF117 HUN
Angels and Demons Inc. Mordus Angels
23
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Posted - 2016.02.08 23:09:15 -
[116] - Quote
Rosal Milag wrote:Malcanis wrote: There was no difficulty in giving 4.5m sp to battlecruiser pilots.
Yes because adding 4.5 million sp and adding 12 million sp is an equivalent event. Oh and did they have injectors in game when the 4.5 million sp was added? Man, everyone but you totally missed them. This is the best case scenario for CCP to keep the SP of the most advanced players from inflating more while keeping total value of the game null. Admit to the truth, you want free SP for no other reason than CCP has given SP in one circumstance similar in the past. The rest of us are happy that triage pilots are not screwed up the ass with training times. Stop thinking that you deserve free SP. You don't. You don't deserve a damn thing in this game. Everyone gets the same treatment.
Admit little forum alt, you don't have a carrier and now you are just a tryhard :D
and what i heard, pilot like me who has over 100m sp, those extractor/injector junks are mostly usless |
Rosal Milag
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
30
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Posted - 2016.02.08 23:10:58 -
[117] - Quote
ApolloF117 HUN wrote:Rosal Milag wrote:Malcanis wrote: There was no difficulty in giving 4.5m sp to battlecruiser pilots.
Yes because adding 4.5 million sp and adding 12 million sp is an equivalent event. Oh and did they have injectors in game when the 4.5 million sp was added? Man, everyone but you totally missed them. This is the best case scenario for CCP to keep the SP of the most advanced players from inflating more while keeping total value of the game null. Admit to the truth, you want free SP for no other reason than CCP has given SP in one circumstance similar in the past. The rest of us are happy that triage pilots are not screwed up the ass with training times. Stop thinking that you deserve free SP. You don't. You don't deserve a damn thing in this game. Everyone gets the same treatment. Admit little forum alt, you don't have a carrier and now you are just a tryhard :D and what i heard, pilot like me who has over 100m sp, those extractor/injector junks are mostly usless
I do have a carrier, two actually. I'm looking to pick up the minmatar FAX skill and keep my gallente carrier where it is. |
Rosal Milag
Republic Military School Minmatar Republic
30
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Posted - 2016.02.08 23:12:04 -
[118] - Quote
ApolloF117 HUN wrote:
and what i heard, pilot like me who has over 100m sp, those extractor/injector junks are mostly usless
So, you can't siphon off 500k SP like the rest of us? Huh, I totally missed that in the patch notes. |
D3m0n sam
Shadow Incursion The Banished
52
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Posted - 2016.02.08 23:14:47 -
[119] - Quote
"if you could fly it before the patch you can fly it after the patch"
All i have to say |
Forlorn Wongraven
Habitual Euthanasia Pandemic Legion
165
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Posted - 2016.02.08 23:14:47 -
[120] - Quote
Rosal Milag wrote:ApolloF117 HUN wrote:
and what i heard, pilot like me who has over 100m sp, those extractor/injector junks are mostly usless
So, you can't siphon off 500k SP like the rest of us? Huh, I totally missed that in the patch notes. Its more like getting only 150k SP out of those 500k raw SP. But apparently you missed that in the patch notes.
Quote:> 80 million skillpoints = 150k skillpoints per injector
Winner ATXI , 3rd place ATXII, winner ATXIII - follow me on twitter: @ForlornW
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