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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 7 post(s) |
Roemy Schneider
BINFORD
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Posted - 2009.02.16 12:35:00 -
[61]
seriously...? the 800k SP thing was like model trains or *******... meant for the youngest ones and the old ones played with it all the time - putting the gist back into logistics |
Perry
Amarr The X-Trading Company RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2009.02.16 12:46:00 -
[62]
hey i started out with 45k sp... 55k is a big improvement!
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Hugh Ruka
Exploratio et Industria Morispatia
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Posted - 2009.02.16 13:28:00 -
[63]
did you folks test PAST character creation ? I saw a Dev post somwhere that you start the same and you pick up skills during tutorial, so starting skills realy do not matter, it's your choices during the initial tutorial that do.
if that is true, you cannot skip the tutorial now or you have to buy the skills youreself. --- SIG --- CSM: your support is needed ! |
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CCP Gangleri
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.02.16 13:33:00 -
[64]
I actually think that the new system encourages roleplay and increases the distinction between the races. No longer will players pick their race and bloodline based on stats but rather looks or backstory preference.
Being able to arrange the stats any way you want will mean that you can make your character the way you want without sacrificing efficiency. And having more freedom to chose skills has the same effect, you can take a new character in any direction you prefer, not by choosing arbitrary bloodlines, specialties and schools but by trying out various paths and then committing to them. ------------------
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Legionos McGuiros
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Posted - 2009.02.16 13:36:00 -
[65]
Edited by: Legionos McGuiros on 16/02/2009 13:36:41 If you wnat that to be so CCP Gangleri then it would be nice if you included more backstory in the character creation. When i started eve for teh first time, watched the amazing introduction movie and then read the story on each of the races and bloodlines i knew who i was going to pick. But now if i was a new player i would not have a clue.
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Hugh Ruka
Exploratio et Industria Morispatia
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Posted - 2009.02.16 13:37:00 -
[66]
Originally by: CCP Gangleri I actually think that the new system encourages roleplay and increases the distinction between the races. No longer will players pick their race and bloodline based on stats but rather looks or backstory preference.
Being able to arrange the stats any way you want will mean that you can make your character the way you want without sacrificing efficiency. And having more freedom to chose skills has the same effect, you can take a new character in any direction you prefer, not by choosing arbitrary bloodlines, specialties and schools but by trying out various paths and then committing to them.
but then bloodline/races only modifies your appearance and starting system/corp. nothing else.
I picked my race because I liked missiles and the Caldari backstory. then I picked the bloodline that gave me best attributes for what I wanted to do.
The main issue is that no race has any strength over the other, excep Caldari/Achura being the best above all ... --- SIG --- CSM: your support is needed ! |
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CCP Gangleri
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.02.16 13:46:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Legionos McGuiros Edited by: Legionos McGuiros on 16/02/2009 13:36:41 If you wnat that to be so CCP Gangleri then it would be nice if you included more backstory in the character creation. When i started eve for teh first time, watched the amazing introduction movie and then read the story on each of the races and bloodlines i knew who i was going to pick. But now if i was a new player i would not have a clue.
There is an introduction for each race, I suppose that part of the new player experience isn't on Sisi yet. But I can assure you that there will be backstory introductions for each race. ------------------
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CCP Gangleri
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.02.16 13:51:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Hugh Ruka
Originally by: CCP Gangleri I actually think that the new system encourages roleplay and increases the distinction between the races. No longer will players pick their race and bloodline based on stats but rather looks or backstory preference.
Being able to arrange the stats any way you want will mean that you can make your character the way you want without sacrificing efficiency. And having more freedom to chose skills has the same effect, you can take a new character in any direction you prefer, not by choosing arbitrary bloodlines, specialties and schools but by trying out various paths and then committing to them.
but then bloodline/races only modifies your appearance and starting system/corp. nothing else.
I picked my race because I liked missiles and the Caldari backstory. then I picked the bloodline that gave me best attributes for what I wanted to do.
The main issue is that no race has any strength over the other, excep Caldari/Achura being the best above all ...
You shouldn't have to pick your race based on what ships or weapons you want to use. You should pick it based on the backstory and appearance, then pick skills that will bring you to what you ultimately want to be. This is what the new system facilitates, as opposed to everyone choosing Achura just for the stats.
New players will now make a character and then get to try out different types of gameplay before choosing their profession, it allows them to mold their stats and skill choices as they go instead of having to re-roll after two weeks to get a better start. ------------------
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Xailia
Unsteady Corporation
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Posted - 2009.02.16 13:59:00 -
[69]
When do we get mixed bloodlines? *nudge* *nudge*
"The sky above the port was the color of a television, tuned to a dead channel."
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Shirley Serious
Amarr Imperial Academy
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Posted - 2009.02.16 14:07:00 -
[70]
Originally by: CCP Gangleri And having more freedom to chose skills has the same effect, you can take a new character in any direction you prefer, not by choosing arbitrary bloodlines, specialties and schools but by trying out various paths and then committing to them.
Hmm, since you're here, do you have an answer to this: http://oldforums.eveonline.com/?a=topic&threadID=994748 ?
the choice of school corp is something that's useful for RP, in terms of character background, creating your life story and stuff.
Yes. Yes, I am. |
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Legionos McGuiros
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Posted - 2009.02.16 14:29:00 -
[71]
Originally by: CCP Gangleri
Originally by: Legionos McGuiros Edited by: Legionos McGuiros on 16/02/2009 13:36:41 If you wnat that to be so CCP Gangleri then it would be nice if you included more backstory in the character creation. When i started eve for teh first time, watched the amazing introduction movie and then read the story on each of the races and bloodlines i knew who i was going to pick. But now if i was a new player i would not have a clue.
There is an introduction for each race, I suppose that part of the new player experience isn't on Sisi yet. But I can assure you that there will be backstory introductions for each race.
If this is the case and they are as gd or better quality than the original character introduction you have my support :) Thanks for the reply
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Sade Onyx
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Posted - 2009.02.16 15:11:00 -
[72]
Originally by: CCP Gangleri
New players will now make a character and then get to try out different types of gameplay before choosing their profession,
See, this is a huge assumption on your part and I believe its a completely wrong and out-dated theory about new players.
They wont 'try' different gameplay types, your just kidding yourself!
MMO's gamers are not 'new players' they know their stuff! even if they are new to a game, they know the importance of making your character correct the first time! They will read, research, ask questions, do the math... everything! As I did and do and as I see every new player doing in every MMO ive ever played.
Its called min-maxing, making every character's statistics identical out of the box does not encourage diversity, it encourages completely the opposite! - how can you not understand that?
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CCP Gangleri
Minmatar
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Posted - 2009.02.16 15:18:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Sade Onyx
Originally by: CCP Gangleri
New players will now make a character and then get to try out different types of gameplay before choosing their profession,
See, this is a huge assumption on your part and I believe its a completely wrong and out-dated theory about new players.
They wont 'try' different gameplay types, your just kidding yourself!
MMO's gamers are not 'new players' they know their stuff! even if they are new to a game, they know the importance of making your character correct the first time! They will read, research, ask questions, do the math... everything! As I did and do and as I see every new player doing in every MMO ive ever played.
Its called min-maxing, making every character's statistics identical out of the box does not encourage diversity, it encourages completely the opposite! - how can you not understand that?
Yeah, now you can do your research and min maxing as you play instead of doing a trial char and then re-rolling to fit your preference like before. Or picking the race and bloodline to fit it, which is not what we want, every character should be able to do whatever it wants as long as some certain baselines are in place.
I don't really see how your scenario is in any way impeded by the new character creation process. It merely allows you to min-max any race and bloodline instead of a select few bloodlines being very common for min-maxing reasons. ------------------
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Hugh Ruka
Exploratio et Industria Morispatia
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Posted - 2009.02.16 15:23:00 -
[74]
Originally by: CCP Gangleri
...
I don't really see how your scenario is in any way impeded by the new character creation process. It merely allows you to min-max any race and bloodline instead of a select few bloodlines being very common for min-maxing reasons.
means we don't need the races for other purpose than backstory ...
--- SIG --- CSM: your support is needed ! |
Kordel Trask
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Posted - 2009.02.16 15:25:00 -
[75]
Originally by: CCP Gangleri I actually think that the new system encourages roleplay and increases the distinction between the races. No longer will players pick their race and bloodline based on stats but rather looks or backstory preference.
Sorry I just don't agree with this. If I'm a clone like in star wars with the same attributes and skills at the start as every other clone how does this encourage "distinction"?
ALMOST ALL new players won't read any of the race histories because it won't make a difference.
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Destination SkillQueue
Are We There Yet
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Posted - 2009.02.16 15:33:00 -
[76]
Edited by: Destination SkillQueue on 16/02/2009 15:34:46
Originally by: Sade Onyx
Originally by: CCP Gangleri
New players will now make a character and then get to try out different types of gameplay before choosing their profession,
See, this is a huge assumption on your part and I believe its a completely wrong and out-dated theory about new players.
They wont 'try' different gameplay types, your just kidding yourself!
MMO's gamers are not 'new players' they know their stuff! even if they are new to a game, they know the importance of making your character correct the first time! They will read, research, ask questions, do the math... everything! As I did and do and as I see every new player doing in every MMO ive ever played.
Making too much assumptions applies to you too. There are players who do the research and know what they want, but that doesn't include every player. I know a few veteran players who avoid reading all those guides exactly because they want to walk their own path and find out things for themselves. There are also a lot of people whining because they made stupid decisions in character creation long ago, so CCP has a legitimate reasons to take that into account. As long as I can skip that tutorial, when I'm making my alt, I don't see what the issue is.
Originally by: Sade Onyx Its called min-maxing, making every character's statistics identical out of the box does not encourage diversity, it encourages completely the opposite! - how can you not understand that?
Well min-maxers that do their research already go for the achura and it is partly to blame why caldari has more players than any other race. The diversity CCP is after is propably more even distribution of players between the races. You can min-max with all races, so there is no need to choose another achura alt. You have the option to look like a normal human being and still min-max your stats. I don't see a problem as long as the racial backstory is clearly displayed in the NPE.
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Suga H
Gallente Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2009.02.16 15:51:00 -
[77]
Originally by: CCP Casqade
I don't believe that skills to a new player mean much at all. I believe it makes more sense for the new player to choose what they like to do and then reward the player with skills in that field or guide them how to become better, rather than giving them a bit of everything. ...
What do you think? Can you please explain why you this is a bad idea?
The skills may not mean much to a new player, but they give them an idea of what they can do, and what each race specializes in. You're taking the ability for someone to start along a certain path away from them. They'll start with scratch, and probably end up not realizing that most gallente boats have larger drone bays and drone bonuses. Skills won't mean much to a new player whether they start with them or whether they have to buy them. In fact, skills on the market will mean even less to a person than what they start with. I'm all for having more balanced starting stats, but give each race their skills that they specialize in. Frig and guns isn't a good preview of what they can get into.
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Suga H
Gallente Federal Navy Academy
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Posted - 2009.02.16 15:53:00 -
[78]
Originally by: CCP Gangleri
You shouldn't have to pick your race based on what ships or weapons you want to use. You should pick it based on the backstory and appearance, then pick skills that will bring you to what you ultimately want to be. This is what the new system facilitates, as opposed to everyone choosing Achura just for the stats.
You're right about the second part, picking a char based on stats is stupid. But the skills that a race is good at is PART of the back story. It's part of what they are.
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Sunbird Huy
Caldari Wolf Task Force Gemini Federation
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:00:00 -
[79]
Size of drone bays oh God...and while some ships from other factions do have huge drone bays too, it's the galente ships that have the drone bays on each ship, much bigger than counterparts from other factions.
And that little galentean kid in Caldari Prime watches the night sky flaming with wrecks burning down through the atmosphere...in one of them is his father, shot down by Caldari missiles..."I will make You eat Your missiles, wretched Caldari!" ... and he decides he wants to use caldari ships, and kill caldari with missiles...
Get it?
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PAcifisti
Paisti Paisti Syndicate
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:04:00 -
[80]
Like someone pointed out already : How exactly does the current system of "roll achura or be prepare for lower sp/h gain" promote diversity? This new system if anything will bring more RP reasons to picking race and bloodline. Now you can actually select the race/bloodline that you like the most / fits you most - It wont be a horrible penalty on your attributes. Diversity doesnt mean that some options should suck balls and few others being the right choices no matter what. That's what the current New character creation system is.
For the starting skills... People tend to forget (or havent played for long enough) that we used to start with something like 45k or 90k sp years and years ago. There was a quite major whineflood when ccp raised the starting bar to 900k sp. Oh noes too easy for beginners and altchars. EVE is dieing etc.
Hilarious I dear say. Keep up the good work CCP
You can never understand the Pain |
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88788
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:05:00 -
[81]
Hi I am 88788, I am ordinary and balanced just like everyone else.
I am 88788.
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Aya Sin
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:26:00 -
[82]
Originally by: Sade Onyx See, this is a huge assumption on your part and I believe its a completely wrong and out-dated theory about new players. [...] They wont 'try' different gameplay types, your just kidding yourself!
No it's not. My first char was a Gallente miner. I thought I would like that, but really didn't. The char had 4M SP but almost no combat relevant skills and what's worse, way too much charisma (pretty much the maximum possible). I canceled that account and started a missionrunner on a trial account a few months ago. At first just to give it a try, but I kept playing that char since then.
I probably wouldn't have done that had I had the ability to "reset" my attributes.
Originally by: Sade Onyx MMO's gamers are not 'new players' they know their stuff! even if they are new to a game, they know the importance of making your character correct the first time!
That may be true for a game you purchase in a box, but not for something you download to "give it a try". At that point you don't even know if you're going to actually become a paying customer or not. So why would you spend hours reading up on the game instead of just playing it and see if you like it? At least I distinctly remember myself getting pretty tired of yet another screen during the creation of my first character (well, except for the part where you create the portrait of course).
Originally by: Sade Onyx Its called min-maxing, making every character's statistics identical out of the box does not encourage diversity, it encourages completely the opposite! - how can you not understand that?
How so? You yourself just said that people do the math. This also means that (before Apocrypha) they'd all end up with a Caldari Achura, which is exactly the opposite of "encouraging diversity".
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Nareg Maxence
Gallente
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Posted - 2009.02.16 16:42:00 -
[83]
So the only reason to pick one race or backstory for another is for RP reasons. For the other 95% of players you might as well not even have a choice since they are all the same stat-wise.
I would like to see the race and stats influence something else besides learning, even if it is just a token bonus. Otherwise I think for most people you might as well just have a create random character button, cause what the f. difference does it make?
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Sunbird Huy
Caldari Wolf Task Force Gemini Federation
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:00:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Nareg Maxence So the only reason to pick one race or backstory for another is for RP reasons. For the other 95% of players you might as well not even have a choice since they are all the same stat-wise.
I would like to see the race and stats influence something else besides learning, even if it is just a token bonus. Otherwise I think for most people you might as well just have a create random character button, cause what the f. difference does it make?
Signed.
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Emily Poast
The Whipping Post
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:32:00 -
[85]
Edited by: Emily Poast on 16/02/2009 17:32:38 Here is another reason they are doing it:
Before, you could make an "unskilled" trade alt that could put up 50+ orders and has a slight discount on broker fees. This required no training at all, and could fill up 2 slots on a main account, all while never costing the main any training time.
Now, if you want a trade (or hauler or producer or whatever) alt, you are actually going to have to spend time training him, and thus not traning your main. I suspect they hope that this means alt accounts will actually be new full, paying accounts instead of secondary and tertiary "untrained" characters on a main account.
Just a guess.
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Random Womble
Minmatar Master Miners Electric Monkey Overlords
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Posted - 2009.02.16 17:49:00 -
[86]
Edited by: Random Womble on 16/02/2009 17:49:40 I find it ammusing that the op is so ignorant of eve before when he obviously joined (post 800k starting SP boost) when max sp you could get was about 300k and included a racial frigate to 5 which was 256k of that sp and minimum was about 20-30k back then you could not get drones 5 you might have had drones 1 or 2 possibly (i cant really remember).
CCP thingy is right back then i know i chose my race because of the backstory behind them not because i wanted xyz skills and i screwed my attributes because i had no idea what they did. I wanted to RP and just never could be bothered to put in the effort the only thing i held off was training amarr skills but now even that has fallen by the wayside however now days if i wanted to make a new char i would just choose the best attributes and train from there because right now thats the only diffrence that matters.
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Lee Dalton
Privateers Privateer Alliance
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Posted - 2009.02.16 18:23:00 -
[87]
Originally by: CCP Gangleri
You shouldn't have to pick your race based on what ships or weapons you want to use. You should pick it based on the backstory and appearance, then pick skills that will bring you to what you ultimately want to be.
Yes, this is why choosing a profession lets you get straight into what you want. I can see the new system is much more flexible, but the new players will not be able to do much until they pick a career path to try and spend a few hours training it.
Originally by: CCP Gangleri This is what the new system facilitates, as opposed to everyone choosing Achura just for the stats.
There are many other good stat rolls.
Originally by: CCP Gangleri New players will now make a character and then get to try out different types of gameplay before choosing their profession, it allows them to mold their stats and skill choices as they go instead of having to re-roll after two weeks to get a better start.
Ok, this is a good thing.
My question to you so: Why allow *multiple* respecs?
I can see why you want a more flexible start for new characters, fine.
I can see why a *single* stat reroll for new toons after they have chosen their career path and know what the attributes mean is a good thing.
I can also understand giving all the other players a stat reroll to be "fair" and allow them the same change, especially with all the changes in EVE.
What I cannot understand is why a respec every 6 months it to be allowed. Furthermore, I see no good reason to allow multiple stat changes.
The argument of "flexibility" is meaningless. You can already train anything you want. This change *removes diversity*, rather than adding flexibility.
In addition to this, this will be more beneficial to older characters who have their support skills etc trained up to a reasonable standard and now need to spend long periods of time training a single skill, rather than helping new characters like I assume you intend.
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Deva Blackfire
D00M.
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Posted - 2009.02.16 18:25:00 -
[88]
So with attribs being meaningless now can we change our picture to one of other race/bloodline? Me wants khanid.
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MJ Maverick
IronPig Sev3rance
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Posted - 2009.02.16 19:06:00 -
[89]
Oh dear, role play take over...
It used to be that if you wanted to role play you could, if you didn't then you didn't. Now they are seemingly trying to make everyone play the way they want to... Role-play. Business Plan Fail.
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Arengor
Glittering Dust
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Posted - 2009.02.16 20:14:00 -
[90]
Ok. This is good to have no fixed stats. But starting skills are part of character's race. It is good for player to fly ships of his race. But if there will no be start skill points, when there will no be roleplay. Minmatars will fly amarrian ship, gallente will use ravens e.t.c.
Today that happens only after several amount of time, when player finishes to learn his racial ships and wants something new. After changes we will have a lot of mutants...
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